It's like two super villains engaging in a fist fight. Let's hope they tear each other down.
EPIC doesn't stand a chance. They know they are going to lose. Just don't know what got into Sweeny's head. He must be on drugs or something.
EPIC signed the terms and conditions of the Apple and Google's developer agreements, enjoyed massive success and huge profits on their platforms and suddenly decided he wanted to take all profits for himself and willfully breach their terms.
The fact is. Apple and Google don't need EPIC. EPIC needs them. If he likes it or not.
When it comes to Google and Android. At least Apple cares about your privacy and doesn't have to sell your data for profit like Google does on all their Android devices.
I am just wondering if this is all indirect advertising on Epics end, could cost them a pretty penny but it is generating a lot of buzz. No way they don’t know that they are doing something wrong, all of this was planned though.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Anyone who thinks Epic is the good buy in this story is a doofus anyways. Apple is in the right.
There are no "good guys" in this fight. Both sides are bad, it's just a matter of degree. Apple and Google charging 30% is too high and Epic's behavior is horrible. I say put their CEOs and the CEO of EA in a cage with some pipe wrenches and tell them the two survivors win.
Then put the "negotiations" on PPV with the profits going towards the people in those companies who do the actual work instead of the executives.
God, I wish there was a scenario in which Epic, Apple, and Google all just tore eachother apart.
If this scenario ever happens - it means we have much bigger problems in the world
Careful what you wish for, you might regret it
Once huge companies start going for the jugular against eachother - that means the global economy is majorly destabilized and the giants are fighting for survival.
I hope we don't see that, as that would be very bad news for us normal peons that are just trying to keep our head above water - as we all would be drowning collectively in your scenario
I feel like it's worth mentioning as well that these monopolies going down doesn't mean that t he free market wins, it just opens up a spot for the next titan to rise up and take control of that market.
I still want to see both of these companies knock each other down a peg or two but it's crazy to me that some posters don't realize that it'll have negative repercussions as well.
Why are people rooting for Epic's downfall? Sure, you don't like Fortnite, so hope for its demise all you want. Though there has never and may never be a game that releases as much content. But as far as I know Epic Games is really good for the gaming community. Without Epic Games we wouldn't have crossplay as we know it now, do you really want to roll that back? Their app store takes less of a cut from developers to try and drive that cost down on other platforms like steam, which seems quite nice to me. And of course they have done wonders for content creators, especially younger ones. Did I miss something where Epic Games is corrupt?
I'm not saying they're in the right here, just that I don't know where the desire for them to die comes from. Lose this legal issue, sure. But guys, things would be very different and I believe in a worse state for us gamers without Epic Games doing what they did the last few years. Do people not agree with this?
Yes, you did miss when Epic games was corrupt. Remember how they paid developers to go Epic exclusive after promising their Kickstarter backers a Steam-key? Remember when they hacked your Steam friends list? Did you miss how they deliberately broke their agreement with Apple with a marketing campaign prepared and a "hey kids, upset Fortnight doesn't work on Apple, go blame them - not us!" propaganda? Those are things corrupt companies do.
Anyone who thinks Epic is the good buy in this story is a doofus anyways. Apple is in the right.
There are no "good guys" in this fight. Both sides are bad, it's just a matter of degree. Apple and Google charging 30% is too high and Epic's behavior is horrible. I say put their CEOs and the CEO of EA in a cage with some pipe wrenches and tell them the two survivors win.
Then put the "negotiations" on PPV with the profits going towards the people in those companies who do the actual work instead of the executives.
30% the first year, after that it goes down to 15%. EPIC was no longer paying 30% cut, but a 15% cut for Fortnite.
When it comes to Google and Android. At least Apple cares about your privacy and doesn't have to sell your data for profit like Google does on all their Android devices.
Apple makes money on its hardware and services. It doesn't make money on tracking you and selling your data.
Unlike Google and Facebook, which have their entire business model revolving around exactly that. Tracking your every move and selling your data.
It's Apple's key selling point. Due to the closed eco-system their devices are secure. That's why the iPhone is the preferred phone to use within many companies and government institutions for a reason.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
Apple can only block unreal engine for apple products, not anything else.
Also judge has already ruled that Apple can only block Fortnite and not unreal engine on ios and apple store.
But even if apple blocked unreal, it would have zero effect on PC, and all other non-apple platforms which make up 90% of unreal engine use.
So this was never gonna be a big deal anyway
I hate to say this but it will affect PC, UnReal Engines iOS/MacOS code building is integrated and therefore without rewriting a new Engine UnReal can not be developed/updated for PC, Android or any other platform use causing major issues for developers.
Also it's time to break the Apple Monopoly, break Apple and Google will follow suit.
I hate to say this but it will affect PC, UnReal Engines iOS/MacOS code building is integrated and therefore without rewriting a new Engine UnReal can not be developed/updated for PC, Android or any other platform use causing major issues for developers.
Also it's time to break the Apple Monopoly, break Apple and Google will follow suit.
What monopoly does Apple actually have? Google sure. Apple? Come on now.
Google is the one dominating the phone market with Android, because its free to use. Microsoft is dominating the PC market.
But of course nothing is free, since Google's main business model is reaching as many people as possible with Android, so they can collect as much user data as possible and sell it to Advertisers. Same with their search engine and browser.
Apple has a roughly 20-25% market share in the mobile market, even less in the PC market. The difference here is that Apple own's its entire chain, from the hardware to the software for maximum profit. So even though they have a small market share in the world, they make the most profit per sold device, including accessories, services, etc.
Google doesn't make money with Android OS itself. It makes money with the Google Play store plus tracking, collecting and selling user data to advertisers. Their hardware partners like Samsung, etc make money on the actual mobile hardware.
Same with PC's. Microsoft makes money with their Software and services. Their hardware partners ( HP, Dell, Lenovo, Asus, Acer, etc, etc) make money on the hardware. Though last some years both Google and Microsoft have been double dipping with their own hardware as well.
Riot did nothing wrong. Apple wants to kill the competition so kids flock to their game and their products ofc.
And this is what happens when you run out of creativity and rely on legal copy pasta.
But, really, in the end, you are to blame. Without you, they both would be forced to be relevant and interesting. But once the consumer goes lucid, its off to kill the competition
Riot did nothing wrong. Apple wants to kill the competition so kids flock to their game and their products ofc.
And this is what happens when you run out of creativity and rely on legal copy pasta.
But, really, in the end, you are to blame. Without you, they both would be forced to be relevant and interesting. But once the consumer goes lucid, its off to kill the competition
I think you need to lay off the grass my friend. lol.
Riot did nothing wrong. Apple wants to kill the competition so kids flock to their game and their products ofc.
And this is what happens when you run out of creativity and rely on legal copy pasta.
But, really, in the end, you are to blame. Without you, they both would be forced to be relevant and interesting. But once the consumer goes lucid, its off to kill the competition
Riot attempted to violate the terms of their contract and then sent out mass emails encouraging people to take sides against Apple when they faced the repercussions of their actions. I mega-loathe Apple but Riot most definitely did something wrong here.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
I think the term to describe your stance is 'eyes wide shut'. You are fully ready to accept that Apple is in the right when they have a monopoly even though it's against your interests as a consumer, that you consider yourself educated on the entire topic and are ready to defend Apple for no other reason other than, "lol Epic agreed to the contract".
The point is the contract was flawed to give Apple an edge from the very beginning - hence, monopoly.
While Epic DID start it, Apple is COMPLETELY in the wrong and are screwing over anyone who uses their platform.
I really don't understand this mentality. Are people so, so broken that they just accept any ass-pounding they receive from corporations now? It's almost sad on a level.
That, or you're just so shilled, so blind to the situation that you just accept anything spoon fed to you from red-pill TheQuartering (or similar) nonsense.
Good on Epic for fighting back against Apple AND Steam for that matter. They both have this crazy monopoly in their respective fields, and from what I can tell, Epic is one of the only ones standing for for smaller developers.
But as far as I know Epic Games is really good for the gaming community. Without Epic Games we wouldn't have crossplay as we know it now, do you really want to roll that back? Their app store takes less of a cut from developers to try and drive that cost down on other platforms like steam, which seems quite nice to me. And of course they have done wonders for content creators, especially younger ones. Did I miss something where Epic Games is corrupt?
It indeed seems you've been missing a few things when it's down to EGS narrative.
1. Cross play existed way before Epic Games Store. Unless you mean cross play between EGS and other platforms, which every non-EGS user can't care less about. If a game exists on multiple stores/platforms and is designed (the game!) to be cross play, "it just works" and not because of Epic had anything to do with it;
2. their app takes "less cut" is just a marketing move to grab more market share by throwing free stuff at people, and having exclusives (pissing the customer base off).
How's that good for the gaming community?
3. Wonders for content creators? Have you ever read their Eula/Tos? A creator automatically waves every right to their own creation over there, Epic can rip off everything and re-package/re-sell/re-monetize the way they see fit, potentially make millions and the creator is not entitled to a dime.
And let's not forget the initial snafu with EGS client bypassing legit way of accessing userprofile info, harvesting data from steam profiles specifically made private when EGS client and steam client were running on the same machine - which they admitted doing.
Thanks for the response, very interesting. I've been gaming a long time and Sony (and other companies) have generally avoided crossplay like the plague. I promise you, Epic Games pushed the issue and now way more games come out on playstation with crossplay than before. It really doesn't seem refutable from my position as I saw it play out, experienced it personally, and I've seen how crossplay went before that for over 20 years. I guess, to really make it non-refutable, I'd have to list how many crossplay games came out on PS4 over the years vs after Fortnite came out. I could be wrong.
As for the rest, I can't refute what you say for I either haven't heard of it or don't know enough. However, I did a little research and of course have my own opinions on the situations you've described.
Having exclusives is a normal part of the biz for now, and you could look at their smaller cut either way. To me, taking less from developers is good for the market (as I think creators of any art getting a bigger cut is always good) as long as it's sustainable. It proves the other companies taking larger cuts wrong. Even if there's other benefits to what they're doing.
I don't know where I stand on the content creator's eula/tos as I don't know the standard or what is viable. My guess is that is standard for almost any situation where the content creators are solely using the business's assets. It also ensures viability by creating a feedback loop: the devs make a good enough game for content, content creators make good enough content to fuel the game. Otherwise, someone might make good enough content and the devs don't get enough resources from it and the game fails, even though content creators got paid. I'd say I'd have to look at it only from their practices, not just the tos. If they still honor and respect content creators enough (which they must do or people wouldn't make content for them), then I can't fault them erring on the side of caution.
As for the last snafu, looking it up now, it seems totally kosher. It doesn't seem like they're stealing any info without permission - it's standard practice to gather insane amounts of data, and a lot of even the worst stuff is totally legal info to grab, it's just about where it goes and how it's used. Like my SSN, totally accessible, but illegal to use wrong. They said it follows the rules and doesn't even send sensitive information anywhere, and there was no action taken against them it looks like. These kind of topics seem to get out of hand with accusations before the response, at which point the response is downplayed or not even read. It seems there was a small accident that looked bad but was unintentional. Accidents happen. It's the way it's handled that matters. I don't see any wrong doing.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
I think the term to describe your stance is 'eyes wide shut'. You are fully ready to accept that Apple is in the right when they have a monopoly even though it's against your interests as a consumer, that you consider yourself educated on the entire topic and are ready to defend Apple for no other reason other than, "lol Epic agreed to the contract".
The point is the contract was flawed to give Apple an edge from the very beginning - hence, monopoly.
While Epic DID start it, Apple is COMPLETELY in the wrong and are screwing over anyone who uses their platform.
I really don't understand this mentality. Are people so, so broken that they just accept any ass-pounding they receive from corporations now? It's almost sad on a level.
That, or you're just so shilled, so blind to the situation that you just accept anything spoon fed to you from red-pill TheQuartering (or similar) nonsense.
Good on Epic for fighting back against Apple AND Steam for that matter. They both have this crazy monopoly in their respective fields, and from what I can tell, Epic is one of the only ones standing for for smaller developers.
LOL!!! Are you serious? I hope you’re being sarcastic?!
EPIC has just become greedy! They launched their own EPIC game store trying to compete with Steam.
Give me a break! They just want to keep all their profits to themselves, but still want to make full use of Google, Apple and Steam’s platforms. Right!
EPIC caring about small developers?? LMAO! Have you seen the terms and conditions of the Unreal Engine for small developers? You think it’s free to publish a game on EPIC’s game store and them not taking any profit cuts? The hypocrisy from EPIC is strong on this one.
I hate Apple, but I think Epic is boxing in the wrong weight class. Eitherway it will be glorious to watch them fight.
Thats the beauty of it, Apple from their 1984 ad has become exactly what they were "fighting against", they became microsoft and surpassed IBM and though their products are popular the company itself is pretty shitty. Epic games, of which Im not a fan of, has played this out brilliantly.
Also in terms of money to throw at lawyers for legal battles they are even because both can afford whats necessary and there becomes a point where throwing even more money at legal teams is moot because theres nothing more that can be done.
Then you have potential losses, the damages Apple stand to "gain" though this petulant lawsuit is minimal and makes them look even worse but they stand to lose BIG even if they "win" through negative publicity and what will invariably be anti trust measures in the future.
Everything that grows to big will inevitably collapse in on itself.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
You lack logical thinking. Just because you signed a contract it doesnt make it fair or legal. Things will change, i hope for the better for game industry.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
While what EPIC did with the ..alternative payment method on Fortnite is..kinky, the problem lays right here :
But Apple has also moved to restrict Epic’s ability to work on the Unreal Engine, which is widely used by third-party game developers. A Microsoft executive submitted testimony on Sunday that revoking Epic’s ability to maintain the Unreal Engine would cause significant problems for iOS versions of games using the engine, including Microsoft’s Forza.
That's where the real problem starts. Ok, ban Fortnite if they really tried to .. "rip" Apple off, but restrict EPIC's ability to work and maintain Unreal Engine, which A LOT of companies are using it?
And most of you still think that "Apple is right" ?
I'm no Apple fan, but Yes. Cause and Effect. Epic started the whole ball rolling. They agreed to the terms, they decided to break them. It's that simple. Everything that has or will happen because of that choice THEY made. Is on them. Don't think Apple's 30% cut is fair? Cool. Don't agree to follow it. Start a petition, start negotiations, just don't put your product on their store. It's like people arguing that Steam had a monopoly.
You lack logical thinking. Just because you signed a contract it doesnt make it fair or legal. Things will change, i hope for the better for game industry.
EPIC does the same effing thing with Unreal Engine and EPIC game store lol!
I think it’s rather you who lacks logical thinkng.
It’s all about EPIC advancing their own agenda. Nothing more, nothing less. Sweeny just wants to release his own EPIC store on iOS and Android.
I'm mainly interested in seeing the Anti-Trust implications. I'm not sure where Epic has a leg to stand on there though. I guess the only opening is that maybe a court will say that Apple can't prevent companies from setting up their own store fronts on the OS. In which case, Apple could probably only charge devs a flat fee to publish games on their OS. But then, Apple will fight long and hard at trying to maintain the "integrity", really profits, of products on their platform.
The fact that both Google and Apple take flat 30% chunks could possibly lead to collusion charges. But I think that's up to the government to decide. And frankly, Steam sort of established that rate.
It’s all about EPIC advancing their own agenda. Nothing more, nothing less. Sweeny just wants to release his own EPIC store on iOS and Android.
It is possible to circumvent the google play store on Android right? Although Sweeney wants an actual supported shop and Google could probably create an update that prevents specific unauthorized apps.
Epic knew they were going to get booted. It was all planned out. Now we just wait and see how it plays out. I’m rooting for a more open App store, but regardless it’s phone upgrade time for me so I’m moving back to Android this time around.
Comments
EPIC signed the terms and conditions of the Apple and Google's developer agreements, enjoyed massive success and huge profits on their platforms and suddenly decided he wanted to take all profits for himself and willfully breach their terms.
The fact is. Apple and Google don't need EPIC. EPIC needs them. If he likes it or not.
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
There are no "good guys" in this fight. Both sides are bad, it's just a matter of degree. Apple and Google charging 30% is too high and Epic's behavior is horrible. I say put their CEOs and the CEO of EA in a cage with some pipe wrenches and tell them the two survivors win.
Then put the "negotiations" on PPV with the profits going towards the people in those companies who do the actual work instead of the executives.
I still want to see both of these companies knock each other down a peg or two but it's crazy to me that some posters don't realize that it'll have negative repercussions as well.
Yes, you did miss when Epic games was corrupt. Remember how they paid developers to go Epic exclusive after promising their Kickstarter backers a Steam-key? Remember when they hacked your Steam friends list? Did you miss how they deliberately broke their agreement with Apple with a marketing campaign prepared and a "hey kids, upset Fortnight doesn't work on Apple, go blame them - not us!" propaganda? Those are things corrupt companies do.
Unlike Google and Facebook, which have their entire business model revolving around exactly that. Tracking your every move and selling your data.
It's Apple's key selling point. Due to the closed eco-system their devices are secure. That's why the iPhone is the preferred phone to use within many companies and government institutions for a reason.
I hate to say this but it will affect PC, UnReal Engines iOS/MacOS code building is integrated and therefore without rewriting a new Engine UnReal can not be developed/updated for PC, Android or any other platform use causing major issues for developers.
Also it's time to break the Apple Monopoly, break Apple and Google will follow suit.
How much % of the world's phones is running iOS? How much % of the worlds laptop/PC's is running MacOS?
https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/worldwide
Google is the one dominating the phone market with Android, because its free to use.
Microsoft is dominating the PC market.
But of course nothing is free, since Google's main business model is reaching as many people as possible with Android, so they can collect as much user data as possible and sell it to Advertisers. Same with their search engine and browser.
Apple has a roughly 20-25% market share in the mobile market, even less in the PC market.
The difference here is that Apple own's its entire chain, from the hardware to the software for maximum profit.
So even though they have a small market share in the world, they make the most profit per sold device, including accessories, services, etc.
Google doesn't make money with Android OS itself. It makes money with the Google Play store plus tracking, collecting and selling user data to advertisers.
Their hardware partners like Samsung, etc make money on the actual mobile hardware.
Same with PC's. Microsoft makes money with their Software and services. Their hardware partners ( HP, Dell, Lenovo, Asus, Acer, etc, etc) make money on the hardware.
Though last some years both Google and Microsoft have been double dipping with their own hardware as well.
And this is what happens when you run out of creativity and rely on legal copy pasta.
But, really, in the end, you are to blame. Without you, they both would be forced to be relevant and interesting. But once the consumer goes lucid, its off to kill the competition
I think the term to describe your stance is 'eyes wide shut'. You are fully ready to accept that Apple is in the right when they have a monopoly even though it's against your interests as a consumer, that you consider yourself educated on the entire topic and are ready to defend Apple for no other reason other than, "lol Epic agreed to the contract".
The point is the contract was flawed to give Apple an edge from the very beginning - hence, monopoly.
While Epic DID start it, Apple is COMPLETELY in the wrong and are screwing over anyone who uses their platform.
I really don't understand this mentality. Are people so, so broken that they just accept any ass-pounding they receive from corporations now? It's almost sad on a level.
That, or you're just so shilled, so blind to the situation that you just accept anything spoon fed to you from red-pill TheQuartering (or similar) nonsense.
Good on Epic for fighting back against Apple AND Steam for that matter. They both have this crazy monopoly in their respective fields, and from what I can tell, Epic is one of the only ones standing for for smaller developers.
Thanks for the response, very interesting. I've been gaming a long time and Sony (and other companies) have generally avoided crossplay like the plague. I promise you, Epic Games pushed the issue and now way more games come out on playstation with crossplay than before. It really doesn't seem refutable from my position as I saw it play out, experienced it personally, and I've seen how crossplay went before that for over 20 years. I guess, to really make it non-refutable, I'd have to list how many crossplay games came out on PS4 over the years vs after Fortnite came out. I could be wrong.
As for the rest, I can't refute what you say for I either haven't heard of it or don't know enough. However, I did a little research and of course have my own opinions on the situations you've described.
Having exclusives is a normal part of the biz for now, and you could look at their smaller cut either way. To me, taking less from developers is good for the market (as I think creators of any art getting a bigger cut is always good) as long as it's sustainable. It proves the other companies taking larger cuts wrong. Even if there's other benefits to what they're doing.
I don't know where I stand on the content creator's eula/tos as I don't know the standard or what is viable. My guess is that is standard for almost any situation where the content creators are solely using the business's assets. It also ensures viability by creating a feedback loop: the devs make a good enough game for content, content creators make good enough content to fuel the game. Otherwise, someone might make good enough content and the devs don't get enough resources from it and the game fails, even though content creators got paid. I'd say I'd have to look at it only from their practices, not just the tos. If they still honor and respect content creators enough (which they must do or people wouldn't make content for them), then I can't fault them erring on the side of caution.
As for the last snafu, looking it up now, it seems totally kosher. It doesn't seem like they're stealing any info without permission - it's standard practice to gather insane amounts of data, and a lot of even the worst stuff is totally legal info to grab, it's just about where it goes and how it's used. Like my SSN, totally accessible, but illegal to use wrong. They said it follows the rules and doesn't even send sensitive information anywhere, and there was no action taken against them it looks like. These kind of topics seem to get out of hand with accusations before the response, at which point the response is downplayed or not even read. It seems there was a small accident that looked bad but was unintentional. Accidents happen. It's the way it's handled that matters. I don't see any wrong doing.
EPIC has just become greedy! They launched their own EPIC game store trying to compete with Steam.
Give me a break! They just want to keep all their profits to themselves, but still want to make full use of Google, Apple and Steam’s platforms. Right!
EPIC caring about small developers?? LMAO! Have you seen the terms and conditions of the Unreal Engine for small developers? You think it’s free to publish a game on EPIC’s game store and them not taking any profit cuts?
The hypocrisy from EPIC is strong on this one.
Thats the beauty of it, Apple from their 1984 ad has become exactly what they were "fighting against", they became microsoft and surpassed IBM and though their products are popular the company itself is pretty shitty. Epic games, of which Im not a fan of, has played this out brilliantly.
Also in terms of money to throw at lawyers for legal battles they are even because both can afford whats necessary and there becomes a point where throwing even more money at legal teams is moot because theres nothing more that can be done.
Then you have potential losses, the damages Apple stand to "gain" though this petulant lawsuit is minimal and makes them look even worse but they stand to lose BIG even if they "win" through negative publicity and what will invariably be anti trust measures in the future.
Everything that grows to big will inevitably collapse in on itself.
You lack logical thinking. Just because you signed a contract it doesnt make it fair or legal. Things will change, i hope for the better for game industry.
EPIC does the same effing thing with Unreal Engine and EPIC game store lol!
I think it’s rather you who lacks logical thinkng.
It’s all about EPIC advancing their own agenda. Nothing more, nothing less.
Sweeny just wants to release his own EPIC store on iOS and Android.