Yes I do have some evidence and I download and archive forums and then use some pearl scripts and text analysis software to convert this data into sets of tables/matrices, from which I can use furter software to graph and animate networks...indeed this is what I am studying at university for my research degree.
Ok, so first you downloaded the forum, parsed and analyzed all the text, found patterns in the text that you have managed to determine are part of a 'flame-swarm-attack' and have put these into some sort of analysis package.
Originally posted by Zippy The only coordinated attacks here have been coordinated by Farlan. Farlan has raised and armed a kiddie army to spread their lies and deception on many game forums and silence any legitimate discussion of the game. People that talk realistically about the game are insulted, called names and told to leave whatever forum they are on by Farlan's gestapo kiddie squad. Is it not suprising that people hate DnL and want to express thioer anger, outrage and let people know the truth about Farlan. Lets look at the reasons people post negatively about DnL. DnL is simply the worst MMO ever released. It is the most unstable game ever released and has the least content and poorest design of any game we have ever seen. But being bad in itself does not generate the amount of hate people have for DnL. What has generated the hate is the deceptive practices of Farlan. Farlan overhyped this game, outright lied to people, hired and organized fanboys to lie and insult people. Because Farlan lied and overpromised people are much more upset than if it was just a bad game like Irth Online or Mourning. But more so they way farlan has treated its customer base and the way AD and Farlan run the offical forums. The mods and fanboys insult anyone there that posts the truth about the game. They lock, ban and cleanse the forums so people can't see the truth. Its not just one thing that stirs peopels passion against Farlan its the whole package. The bad game, the overhype, the blatant lies, the obnoxious troll fanboys and moderators, the forum cleansing and farlan being the most unethical development company anyone has ever seen. Look at how much passion there is over SOE's unethical practices. Farlan makes SOE look like choir boys. All this and they have the nerve to charge the most expensive price in the history of MMO's. Again its just not one thing that makes peoiple hate and fight against Farlan. Its the whole package. They could not make a worse game, they could not have more unethical business practices, and they could not in anyway even if they tried make people hate them more. I doubt we will ever find a game compnay that is so easy to hate as Farlan. No one is coordianting efforts here except Farlan. People are simply rebelling agaionst Farlan's deceptive practices and lies. Simply make a bad game and people will move on. Continually lie to someone, attempt to steal their money and then call them names and you will obviously have some very upset people.
Originally posted by Quintilian Zippy while i dont agree that the only coordinated attacks are by Farlan et al, I do agree they they have been guilty of instigating a few through choice words to die hard fans. I have also stated to members of AD, that I find some of the 'techniques' used in the dnl profit making venture to be ethically dubious, so again i think we agree.
Let me ask this. If there are coordinated attacks against DnL who is doing it? Who would want to do it? the Darkfall devs, the Vanguard devs, SOE, Bin Laden? Who and why would anyone waste their time attacking DnL? Its a dead game. No one plays it except about 50 kiddies. I find it hard to believe anyone would want to waste their time attacking a dying game that threatens no one. Rather I stick with my orginal post that the reason people feel so passionatley about DnL and want people to hear the truth is because of the whole packagae. People dislike Farlan, are angry, want to vent their anger and want people to see the truth because its a bad game, the overhype, the blatant lies, the obnoxious troll fanboys and moderators, the forum cleansing, farlan being the most unethical development company anyone has ever seen and because they feel like they have been victimized. Just a bad game and people would walk away but make a bad game, attempt to steal peoples money, lie to them and then insult them by calling them names and you will have a lot of angry people who will want to vent that anger and hurt Farlan by making sure they cannot do the same to otehr people.
Rather this coordinated attack idea is just part of Farlan's propganda and lies. It fits in perfectly with what they have been feeding to the fanboys all along. They tell the fanboys they are martyrs for playing the game and spreading the holy word of DnL, that the fanboys are the truly dedicated and loyal players, that the fanboys they are the special chosen ones who posssess wisdom, skill and maturity that all other gamers do not have, that evil and jealous people are engaged in a conspiracy to fight against them, and that eventually they will win against these evil people and everyone will recognize these fanboys for their efforts and courage. This fear mongering is similar to what evil dictators or religous cults do all the time to incite passion, patrioism, loyalty and mindless devotion.
Well there is a little more to it than that. The first process I've done is to download most of the forums associated with dnl, including mmorpg .com and graph the threaded contact structure of the posters. By this if a given set of users have taken part in a thread i draw a line between them. I could go on and talk to you about qualifying the relations between users (that is qualifying the line between two dots) but I dont think this is the place to do it.
My email is Quintilian@hotmail.co.uk if you would like to strike up a conversation on these themes. If we strike up a raport i will be more than happy to apss on my RL email addy if you have not been able to track me down so you can verrify some of me claims.
P.S
Zippy, yes i see how what I have said can be used by Farlan and AD. For that I am sorry for providing them amunition, that was not my intent in my original post though i do stand by what I have observed.
p.p.s
MITSoxFan, as i have not completed the networks/graphs for the dnl data set i can post a static picture of a network i made from discussion boards associated with far right groups if you want?
Originally posted by Quintilian Chloyana, in your thread you say that my observation of a flame swarm attack is being used by AD to justify the bad moderation FFS! This is just not true!!!!!!!!!!!!! I actually critique the moderation and just point out how one can understand it and their choices!!!!!!!!
Read it again. The title of the thread states that the Devs/AD allow for this sort of a statement made by a poster on thier board but will ban others. Allowing for the erroneous and misleading statement that you made is what was the original intent. That and no other. "Understanding" their unprofessionalism based on a senseless statement of an "coordinated attack" is all I stated. YOU took it over and above the actual original intent. Your statement is false, misleading and irresponsible yet it appeals to the AD/Dev type of thot so it is allowed while others with the painful truth or a serious base question that the Devs or AD can only answer in such a way as to make themselves look like unprofessional idiots get banned.
Read into my words all you want. It doesnt change what you posted. It doesnt change your "understanding" of the mod fiasco. It does show simply a baseless, ridiculous and utterly irresponsible statement allowed by the mods at the DNL boards. Period.
**I already see an error in your "research" ---- most if not all of the posters here at one time had high hopes and praise for DNL. Research my own threads at the DNL boards before the SOG fiasco. By parsing out anyone who took part in a flame thread -- did you also parse the intent of the threads? Did you also separate the ideas behind the "flames"? Were they flames? Were they just frustration? Already your "project" has flaws.
Well,as you may have noted Cholayna, in my last reply to Zippy i do acknowledge that waht I said can be used by AD and Farlan. But really the post is critical of AD and Farlan and asks the readers to consider other bad practices, such as the use of fans for other things. Given that I am critical and that what I am refering too, as i have stated, is different from AD and Farlan's past remarks I dont see it is too irresponsible.
I am willing to except my use of that term as slightly irresponsible, but by the same token only if you accept that your use of my words do exagerate the issue, as well as failing to see that I am being critical of AD in that post rather than justifying their actions through the use of the terms that has got everyones backs up....!?
p.s.
read the title of the thread? 'DNL/AD spread excuses', that is my mentioning of a swarm as an excuse? If so sureley my earlier points stand?
p.p.s
regarding possible errors in my research, yes you do well to cite some of them and what i plan to do after releasing my initial analysis (which has many blanks) will be to take such criticisms on board and take comments so that i can change filters etc. and make it more accurate. Hopefully I will contact people regarding other events so that I can judge intent, and I had planned this from the satrt when i submitted my research proposal to the university i study at.
Originally posted by Quintilian Well,as you may have noted Cholayna, in my last reply to Zippy i do acknowledge that waht I said can be used by AD and Farlan. But really the post is critical of AD and Farlan and asks the readers to consider other bad practices, such as the use of fans for other things. Given that I am critical and that what I am refering too, as i have stated, is different from AD and Farlan's past remarks I dont see it is too irresponsible.
....:This board has been subject to coordinated attacks", "flame swarms..." then in subsequent reply posts you state that is the reason why you "understand" why they do what they do. That is indeed an irresponsible and baseless statement which can be fitted into the realm of the DNL/AD zeal. Irreponsible.
I am willing to except my use of that term as slightly irresponsible, but by the same token only if you accept that your use of my words do exagerate the issue, as well as failing to see that I am being critical of AD in that post rather than justifying their actions through the ues of the terms that has got everyones backs up....!?
The thread wasnt about you? Can you comprehend that? It was about the statement you made. Get off it BS.
And that thing you have about being "slightly" irresponsible? Thats like saying you are only slightly pregnant. You either are or you are not.
regarding possible errors in my research, yes you do well to cite some of them and what i plan to do after releasing my initial analysis (which has many blanks) will be to take such criticisms on board and take comments so that i can change filters etc. and make it more accurate. Hopefully I will contact people regarding other events so that I can judge intent, and I had planned this from the satrt when i submitted my research proposal to the university i study at.
pfft typical DNL. Release something not thoroughly researched, with many things missing. Whats the pt? Except to once again, spread an irresponsible flavor using the complete failure of AD/DNL to do what they were supposed to? And this approved by a university professor? You have GOT to be kidding me?!!?
As I wrote that statement I have every right to respond to mis-interpretations and mis-representations of it, and so really it is about me--how was it you phrased it in ur last post...ahhh yes the issue of INTENT!...what I am making plain to you now.
To say I understand why there is poor, specifically quick-fire moderation, and give a reason, is not to say that I am justifying it and is not a baseless statement.
p.s.
Why are you equating my research project with AD/Farlan again? They have nothing to do with it. And your comment regrding releasing unfinished projects or early findings just shows an ignorance of the research process. To throw results out there and get good critical comments, such as yours, is part of the process of completing said project, which will be when I submit my thesis in two years time.
As I wrote that statement I have every right to respond to mis-interpretations and mis-representations of it, and so really it is about me--how was it you phrased it in ur last post...ahhh yes the issue of INTENT!...what I am making plain to you now.
To say I understand why there is poor, specifically quick-fire moderation, and give a reason, is not to say that I am justifying it and is not a baseless statement.
The intent , once again, was not a personal attack but to show what is the ultimate in denial of professionalism in the DNL/AD boards. Your "understanding" of is, as you stated, is "coordinated attacks" which dont exist and you are only furthering this lie by making this "slightly irresponsible" statement.
REad this thread again, please. Comprehend the stated word. Leave your ego out of it and you will see what not only I but most of the posters here see and agree with. Very simple really. This isnt a thread about you. This isnt a thread about a wacky "research paper'. This isnt a thread about a personal attack.
This is a thread ONCE AGAIN about the woefully horribly run game as well as a trigger happy moderation. Statements made like this one only further the crap they both try to flavor their own boards with. Your own statement of trying to get this thread closed is again, and indeed, a great example of that self same thing.
It was an irresponsible, misleading and untrue statement. You dont have any proof that any of the bad mouthing posts were made with a coordinated effort simply because the posters are unknown. Get names, dates and proof of the cohesion of these perpetrators THEN carry on with the misleading and incomplete parsing of threads/posts made by each AS WELL as the intent of each post and you MAY have somethign worthy of university level acceptance. However, unless and until you identify and establish a definite link between these co-conspirators of a "coordinated attack" your statement thus is rendered irresponsible and baseless.
Thats all there is to it dude. You made the statement. You later agreed that it was 'slightly irresponsible' . You are arguing your own words now. You should have quit long ago.
As I wrote that statement I have every right to respond to mis-interpretations and mis-representations of it, and so really it is about me--how was it you phrased it in ur last post...ahhh yes the issue of INTENT!...what I am making plain to you now.
To say I understand why there is poor, specifically quick-fire moderation, and give a reason, is not to say that I am justifying it and is not a baseless statement.
p.s.
Why are you equating my research project with AD/Farlan again? They have nothing to do with it. And your comment regrding releasing unfinished projects or early findings just shows an ignorance of the research process. To throw results out there and get good critical comments, such as yours, is part of the process of completing said project, which will be when I submit my thesis in two years time.
I am equating the same train of thought used in releasing DNL as you are using in releasing your "research". Allowing for an incomplete release with the "input" not made by you but by others as to the idea that a 'coordinated attack" has occured -- and thinking you will get a "good critical comments" is NOT part of a bonafide research. Simply releasing a half baked idea (that only furthers AD/DNL misleading conceptions/perceptions) and basing this on an unfinished core is ridiculous.
I would really love to talk to your professor if he accepts this type of thing. Would be much more interesting convo
Well this is going no-where fast, and i think we will have to agree to disagree or until a third neutral party arbitrates, as i don't view my initial comments amd words as perpetuating an illusion or misleading anyone as you imply.
I will be leaving this thread alone though those who want to impress their side of the argument to me, please feel free to PM or email me. If I can be shown I am wrong through this medium then I will post stating that on MMORPG and recieve the public flogging that you desire.
Originally posted by Quintilian Well this is going no-where fast, and i think we will have to agree to disagree or until a third neutral party arbitrates, as i don't view my initial comments amd words as perpetuating an illusion or misleading anyone as you imply.
I will be leaving this thread alone though those who want to impress their side of the argument to me, please feel free to PM or email me. If I can be shown I am wrong through this medium then I will post stating that on MMORPG and recieve the public flogging that you desire.
Quintilian signing out
okk Black, we agree to disagree. My thread will still stand.
Wait wait wait, let me get this right... are you saying you have parsed all topics on this and other forums that are related to D&L, then you gonna parse them for patterns and .... thats where I dont understand what you gonna looking for (which patterns?) and what you gonna do with it. And what is flaming-swarm-attack?
I'm compiling a data-chart comparing the flam-swarm attack with the number of sea pirates over time. I need to know the following.
1) How many flame swarm attacks you have participated in. 2) Do you have a peg leg. 3) What is your favorite movie rating. 4) Do you like rum?
I'll then chart this with all the variables and permutations and compute this (A process that is very hard to explain, but trust me is accurate to the Z factor) and have it posted for you all.
I'm compiling a data-chart comparing the flam-swarm attack with the number of sea pirates over time. I need to know the following.
1) How many flame swarm attacks you have participated in. 2) Do you have a peg leg. 3) What is your favorite movie rating. 4) Do you like rum?
I'll then chart this with all the variables and permutations and compute this (A process that is very hard to explain, but trust me is accurate to the Z factor) and have it posted for you all.
Are you taking into consideration the downfall of the windfall of the third binary spectrum cluster with (and without) gyroscopic hydrogenated static occult clownza? Becuase if u dont, your calculations are incorrect to the 0^1 level, youwould have to make an adjustment of 0001011010011 binary floserator formula and perhaps add a XOR shift to a byte 00110121
Originally posted by jimmyman99 Are you taking into consideration the downfall of the windfall of the third binary spectrum cluster with (and without) gyroscopic hydrogenated static occult clownza? Becuase if u dont, your calculations are incorrect to the 0^1 level, youwould have to make an adjustment of 0001011010011 binary floserator formula and perhaps add a XOR shift to a byte 00110121
Exactly!!! See??? This is flawed in sooo many ways!
Comments
Riiight...
Ok, Cho, you win.
Let me ask this. If there are coordinated attacks against DnL who is doing it? Who would want to do it? the Darkfall devs, the Vanguard devs, SOE, Bin Laden? Who and why would anyone waste their time attacking DnL? Its a dead game. No one plays it except about 50 kiddies. I find it hard to believe anyone would want to waste their time attacking a dying game that threatens no one. Rather I stick with my orginal post that the reason people feel so passionatley about DnL and want people to hear the truth is because of the whole packagae. People dislike Farlan, are angry, want to vent their anger and want people to see the truth because its a bad game, the overhype, the blatant lies, the obnoxious troll fanboys and moderators, the forum cleansing, farlan being the most unethical development company anyone has ever seen and because they feel like they have been victimized. Just a bad game and people would walk away but make a bad game, attempt to steal peoples money, lie to them and then insult them by calling them names and you will have a lot of angry people who will want to vent that anger and hurt Farlan by making sure they cannot do the same to otehr people.
Rather this coordinated attack idea is just part of Farlan's propganda and lies. It fits in perfectly with what they have been feeding to the fanboys all along. They tell the fanboys they are martyrs for playing the game and spreading the holy word of DnL, that the fanboys are the truly dedicated and loyal players, that the fanboys they are the special chosen ones who posssess wisdom, skill and maturity that all other gamers do not have, that evil and jealous people are engaged in a conspiracy to fight against them, and that eventually they will win against these evil people and everyone will recognize these fanboys for their efforts and courage. This fear mongering is similar to what evil dictators or religous cults do all the time to incite passion, patrioism, loyalty and mindless devotion.
In the end, Quint will end up being SB, and the 'animation' will end up being a clip from 'Family Guy'. And we'll all have a good laugh.
MITSoxFan,
Well there is a little more to it than that. The first process I've done is to download most of the forums associated with dnl, including mmorpg .com and graph the threaded contact structure of the posters. By this if a given set of users have taken part in a thread i draw a line between them. I could go on and talk to you about qualifying the relations between users (that is qualifying the line between two dots) but I dont think this is the place to do it.
My email is Quintilian@hotmail.co.uk if you would like to strike up a conversation on these themes. If we strike up a raport i will be more than happy to apss on my RL email addy if you have not been able to track me down so you can verrify some of me claims.
P.S
Zippy, yes i see how what I have said can be used by Farlan and AD. For that I am sorry for providing them amunition, that was not my intent in my original post though i do stand by what I have observed.
p.p.s
MITSoxFan, as i have not completed the networks/graphs for the dnl data set i can post a static picture of a network i made from discussion boards associated with far right groups if you want?
Read it again. The title of the thread states that the Devs/AD allow for this sort of a statement made by a poster on thier board but will ban others. Allowing for the erroneous and misleading statement that you made is what was the original intent. That and no other. "Understanding" their unprofessionalism based on a senseless statement of an "coordinated attack" is all I stated. YOU took it over and above the actual original intent. Your statement is false, misleading and irresponsible yet it appeals to the AD/Dev type of thot so it is allowed while others with the painful truth or a serious base question that the Devs or AD can only answer in such a way as to make themselves look like unprofessional idiots get banned.
Read into my words all you want. It doesnt change what you posted. It doesnt change your "understanding" of the mod fiasco. It does show simply a baseless, ridiculous and utterly irresponsible statement allowed by the mods at the DNL boards. Period.
**I already see an error in your "research" ---- most if not all of the posters here at one time had high hopes and praise for DNL. Research my own threads at the DNL boards before the SOG fiasco. By parsing out anyone who took part in a flame thread -- did you also parse the intent of the threads? Did you also separate the ideas behind the "flames"? Were they flames? Were they just frustration? Already your "project" has flaws.
Well,as you may have noted Cholayna, in my last reply to Zippy i do acknowledge that waht I said can be used by AD and Farlan. But really the post is critical of AD and Farlan and asks the readers to consider other bad practices, such as the use of fans for other things. Given that I am critical and that what I am refering too, as i have stated, is different from AD and Farlan's past remarks I dont see it is too irresponsible.
I am willing to except my use of that term as slightly irresponsible, but by the same token only if you accept that your use of my words do exagerate the issue, as well as failing to see that I am being critical of AD in that post rather than justifying their actions through the use of the terms that has got everyones backs up....!?
p.s.
read the title of the thread? 'DNL/AD spread excuses', that is my mentioning of a swarm as an excuse? If so sureley my earlier points stand?
p.p.s
regarding possible errors in my research, yes you do well to cite some of them and what i plan to do after releasing my initial analysis (which has many blanks) will be to take such criticisms on board and take comments so that i can change filters etc. and make it more accurate. Hopefully I will contact people regarding other events so that I can judge intent, and I had planned this from the satrt when i submitted my research proposal to the university i study at.
pfft typical DNL. Release something not thoroughly researched, with many things missing. Whats the pt? Except to once again, spread an irresponsible flavor using the complete failure of AD/DNL to do what they were supposed to? And this approved by a university professor? You have GOT to be kidding me?!!?
This just gets better and better now dont it?
Cholayna,
As I wrote that statement I have every right to respond to mis-interpretations and mis-representations of it, and so really it is about me--how was it you phrased it in ur last post...ahhh yes the issue of INTENT!...what I am making plain to you now.
To say I understand why there is poor, specifically quick-fire moderation, and give a reason, is not to say that I am justifying it and is not a baseless statement.
p.s.
Why are you equating my research project with AD/Farlan again? They have nothing to do with it. And your comment regrding releasing unfinished projects or early findings just shows an ignorance of the research process. To throw results out there and get good critical comments, such as yours, is part of the process of completing said project, which will be when I submit my thesis in two years time.
The intent , once again, was not a personal attack but to show what is the ultimate in denial of professionalism in the DNL/AD boards. Your "understanding" of is, as you stated, is "coordinated attacks" which dont exist and you are only furthering this lie by making this "slightly irresponsible" statement.
REad this thread again, please. Comprehend the stated word. Leave your ego out of it and you will see what not only I but most of the posters here see and agree with. Very simple really. This isnt a thread about you. This isnt a thread about a wacky "research paper'. This isnt a thread about a personal attack.
This is a thread ONCE AGAIN about the woefully horribly run game as well as a trigger happy moderation. Statements made like this one only further the crap they both try to flavor their own boards with. Your own statement of trying to get this thread closed is again, and indeed, a great example of that self same thing.
It was an irresponsible, misleading and untrue statement. You dont have any proof that any of the bad mouthing posts were made with a coordinated effort simply because the posters are unknown. Get names, dates and proof of the cohesion of these perpetrators THEN carry on with the misleading and incomplete parsing of threads/posts made by each AS WELL as the intent of each post and you MAY have somethign worthy of university level acceptance. However, unless and until you identify and establish a definite link between these co-conspirators of a "coordinated attack" your statement thus is rendered irresponsible and baseless.
Thats all there is to it dude. You made the statement. You later agreed that it was 'slightly irresponsible' . You are arguing your own words now. You should have quit long ago.
I am equating the same train of thought used in releasing DNL as you are using in releasing your "research". Allowing for an incomplete release with the "input" not made by you but by others as to the idea that a 'coordinated attack" has occured -- and thinking you will get a "good critical comments" is NOT part of a bonafide research. Simply releasing a half baked idea (that only furthers AD/DNL misleading conceptions/perceptions) and basing this on an unfinished core is ridiculous.
I would really love to talk to your professor if he accepts this type of thing. Would be much more interesting convo
I will be leaving this thread alone though those who want to impress their side of the argument to me, please feel free to PM or email me. If I can be shown I am wrong through this medium then I will post stating that on MMORPG and recieve the public flogging that you desire.
Quintilian signing out
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Check your PMs as I have attempted to answer your question there.
I'm compiling a data-chart comparing the flam-swarm attack with the number of sea pirates over time. I need to know the following.
1) How many flame swarm attacks you have participated in.
2) Do you have a peg leg.
3) What is your favorite movie rating.
4) Do you like rum?
I'll then chart this with all the variables and permutations and compute this (A process that is very hard to explain, but trust me is accurate to the Z factor) and have it posted for you all.
This thread is understandable. I agree wholeheartedly with Cho and I too say
Ok Cho..you win.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.