Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Originally posted by Leel another thing - Senators have to tow the company line. It's significant that they saying what they are. In other words, one would not be concerned with losing one's position if, lets say there was not going to be a position to have anymore. Voluntary position or not.
Personally, I hate the NGE, which is why I quit after 2.5 years. But having said that, I think you guys are reading way to much into the recent posts for Smed and Devs and even this "senator".
You are seeing what you want to see. I'm with you in spirit, I would love to see some Pre-Cu servers. But the bottom line is unless there is a deadicated Development team assigned to FIXING it, it will not last.
The Pre-CU game was far from the glorious game people keep posting about. It had very little to do with what you would expect from a Star Wars game and everything to do with Melee Stackers and Combat Medic tossers. PvE was a joke and so was PvP.
So, a "Classic Server" would get a HUGE instant draw, but would die off quickly if it was not fixed and balanced. And the only way that will happen is if SoE scraps the NGE and reverts back to the Pre-CU on the live servers and I simply do not see that happening.
They have about 150 thousand subscribers paying $15 a month to play the NGE. That is about $2.25m a month. They've reduced the Dev team to a handful of people to minimize cost. Server's are cheap and I willing to bet they are actually making a pretty good return right now.
The window of making SWG a blockbuster starting closing when the CU didn't fix the bugs and tried to change things that didn't need to be changed. The window closed with the NGE.
All SoE needs to do is just keep adding a few new things to keep people busy and they will be fine as is. Reverting back to the Pre-CU would require a MASSIVE investment and one that I doubt they could justify given thier track record.
SWG is what it is. Either play it and love it, or hate it and leave it. But it is what it is.
Originally posted by RysinLexicon Originally posted by Leel another thing - Senators have to tow the company line. It's significant that they saying what they are. In other words, one would not be concerned with losing one's position if, lets say there was not going to be a position to have anymore. Voluntary position or not.
Personally, I hate the NGE, which is why I quit after 2.5 years. But having said that, I think you guys are reading way to much into the recent posts for Smed and Devs and even this "senator".
You are seeing what you want to see. I'm with you in spirit, I would love to see some Pre-Cu servers. But the bottom line is unless there is a deadicated Development team assigned to FIXING it, it will not last.
The Pre-CU game was far from the glorious game people keep posting about. It had very little to do with what you would expect from a Star Wars game and everything to do with Melee Stackers and Combat Medic tossers. PvE was a joke and so was PvP.
So, a "Classic Server" would get a HUGE instant draw, but would die off quickly if it was not fixed and balanced. And the only way that will happen is if SoE scraps the NGE and reverts back to the Pre-CU on the live servers and I simply do not see that happening.
They have about 150 thousand subscribers paying $15 a month to play the NGE. That is about $2.25m a month. They've reduced the Dev team to a handful of people to minimize cost. Server's are cheap and I willing to bet they are actually making a pretty good return right now.
The window of making SWG a blockbuster starting closing when the CU didn't fix the bugs and tried to change things that didn't need to be changed. The window closed with the NGE.
All SoE needs to do is just keep adding a few new things to keep people busy and they will be fine as is. Reverting back to the Pre-CU would require a MASSIVE investment and one that I doubt they could justify given thier track record.
SWG is what it is. Either play it and love it, or hate it and leave it. But it is what it is.
Personally, the only thing I would disagree with here is your estimation of players. At 150k Subs, by Industry average, that would mean there would be about 1700 players on each server (on average at 30% of players on) durring peak hours, and that just simply isn't the case. Subs are probably around 20k - 50k at most.
That said, their expenses are incredibly small compared to the past, and I'd agree they are probably in "coast mode" to save "gas". But what would concern me is I were a current player is that if they are so determined to fix the game & keep it going, why have they cut the Dev team and not invested funds into getting the NGE to a finished state? It seems all they are doing is replacing Devs... or maybe there are a group of them in a dungeon under SOE working on the CUUNGEXL33THAXOR coming soon... are we at 7.5 months yet?
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
I agree, I loved the way pre-CU felt with players trying to make their way in the SW universe. It felt expansive...not just "oh new dungeon opened up, lets get the loot" repeatedly over again...maybe it was because of the newness of the game still. At any rate, players and NPCs actually felt like "real people" to a degree - Im not fond of levels either, it narrows you and your thinking. I liked the aspect that what really mattered was how much health and armour an NPC had, not its combat level strength. It served to give some extra strategy in my opinion, because there was a chance you could beat something that was "12 levels above you"...now...its very cut and dry.
And to the last poster...yes you saw flamethrowers in the prequels - jango fett. Yes, he was a BH...but mandalorians were super-commandos. A problem with the movies and SW lore, anyone could be a BH...commandos...pistoleers...etc. It wasn't a profession, just a willingless to take bounties on people - in essence, be a merceny.
Either though I was never thrilled by Commander Cody, the clones were at least genetic clones of a supercommando...and the clone generals were also ARC-trained (Advanced Recon Commandos). Commando's iconic-ness wasn't as overt as jedi, but it was still there.
But ultimately, we probably managed to survive the great profession purge because we had a whole set of unique weapons which would have been weird to integrate into other professions -or- wouldn't have made sense just having a unique set of weapons that originally comprised a profession floating out there in the game. Heavy Weapons always made a commando, and I think as long as there will be Heavy Weapons in SWG...there will always be a commando profession.
Thankfully...
Drifting Off Topic: Commandos definatly have a place in SWG, but the way they have been done has been a bit weak IMO. I would have liked to have seen Commandos be an offshoot of the Soldier, along with Squad Leader and a Combat Engineer. The difference for me is that I would have prefered to see the Commando get Innate Armor, some Basic Stealth Abilities (sneaking, not cloaking), Bonuses with some Weps (Carbines, Rifles & Unarmed), and specials along the lines of Explosives, Sniping & Orbital Strikes. I would have liked to see a Combat Engineer added that used Heavy Weapons, place defences, place turrets, and could opperate Large Vehicals (AT-ST's), similar to real CE's. Pre-CU until now, they really could have done a MUCH better job with the GCW combat rolls.
Also, Rank and Rank Abilities/Bonuses should be kept in line with the GCW faction system, not a profession. Give SL's Special Tactical abilities, but keep rank and those bonuses seperate. For example, give a Colonel better Group Bonuses if he is leading the group, but give a SL Col double the bonuses...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
[quote]Originally posted by Unagi [b] Originally posted by SODAofBRIA Originally posted by Unagi Originally posted by SODAofBRIA What I want to know is: Why is it that all the Senators that were flown in to Austin to test out the NGE (remember this was early stages of NGE too!) absolutely RAVED about it?Then compare that to the community reaction.
What I'd really like is for somebody who wasn't even there to tell me again exactly what it was I saw in Austin.
Dude...I didn't TELL you anything. I asked a very simple question, very directly. Be careful, my emoticons have you outnumbered. So, since you're feeling "chatty"...What DID you see? It couldn't have been what dropped on November 15th, 2005 because I came back to test it out by like the 17th and it was a crapfest. An admitted crapfest, mind you.* Or, did they show you something totally different? Did they decieve you?* Or, were/are you just towing the line? Does your compass point the same direction no matter what happens?* Or, did they make you do kegstands before you tested it and slipped in Ikari Warriors for the SNES? Who ordered the CODE RED?! Yeah, actually you did "tell" me something. You told me and the rest of us here I was lying about what I saw in Austin. And then later on here you got kind of pedantic about how simple and direct you were being - which is more than a little disingenuous.Slightly out of context there so bear with me as I refer you back to one of your own posts. In another thread - recently and on these boards - you pulled up these three quotes from me that I made back in the first week of last November: Originally posted by SODAofBRIA Throw another liar on the barbie!
[url=http://soe.lithium.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Bria&message.id=1063256#M1063256] Darth_Sushi Galactic SenatorPosts: 3359Registered: 07-17-2003 posted: 11-02-2005 03:03 PM It's all true. I have been in SOE's offices in Austin all day playing with the new changes and talking with the developers, designers and producers. It looks awesome. The CU was a band-aid on a broken system. This is a brand new game. And it rocks. The game has never looked, felt and played more like "Star Wars" then it did when I logged into the test console this morning.
posted: 11-02-2005 02:08 PM OK - So you may have heard by now that SWG is shaking things up a bit. I have been in Austin at SOE's offices all day testing a lot of these new upcoming changes. While there is likely to be a lot of fear, uncertainty and doubt about the new direction of the game, my first impression is one of sheer amazement and joy. I can assure you that the future of Squad Leader is quite bright. And I mean bright like:
Airstrikes Artillery Orbital Bombardment Please check out New Game Enhancements forum. And remember to keep it civil and stay on target.
i'm 100% positive if he were to be candid he would describe his original vision as overambitious and laud the changes coming for this game.
Overambitious indeed. The orginal design wasn't flawed, per se. However, that system was too complex to maintain and enhance given the limitations of the technology used to build and support it. There are too many things they want to do with this game that are simply impossible or infeasible from a technical and/or finanical standpoint in it's current incarnation.
Wow...it sure was thick in there around November! See what you did there? You called me a liar. It's right there in bold red. You did this first. And without justifiable basis. I am sure you just thought you were being cute, and maybe you were only joking, and maybe you thought I'd never actually read or respond to the obvious trolling and flamebait you were laying down, but by making this baseless assertion you have lost any moral high ground you might have otherwise been able to legitimately claim - as you seemingly attempt in the first quote of yours I cited above. Clear so far? Good.Now, since you saw fit to call me a liar, and you did call me a liar, you must necessarily know what it was that I saw that I was describing in the posts you quoted above in order to know that I was lying about it. I understand that you don't agree with me or my assessment. On this there can be no doubt. That you have a differing opinion does not make me a liar. Conversely, I was also not lying if I believed it when i said it. Even if, hypothetically, I no longer believe now what I said then it is still not a lie. You claim that I was lying. So as I stated above, in response to a post of your very own creation, please share with us all what it was that I saw or did that I then lied about. See where I'm going with this? Cool.Your follow up questions in this thread certainly seem to concur with my assertion that you actually have no idea what it was I was shown in Austin. If it then follows that if you don't know what it was I saw, on what basis could you possibly hope to determine my veracity? You can't. See? And I'm afraid that even though I could be the bigger guy here and let it slide, I have to admit I'm kind of fixated on it. It seems I have some kind of problem with you calling me a liar and then demanding more information from me like you have some kind of entitlement to it. It bothers me. So just admit it, man up and apologize so we can get over this hurdle and on to talking about more important stuff. Like what I actually saw in Austin - to the extent that it matters, since you have already made your opinion on the topic abundantly clear.And on a completely unrelated topic:This other thing that you accuse me of above - and that various others around here seem to like acusing my fellow Senators of - the appropriate idiomatic expression is to "toe" the line and not "tow" it. [/b][/quote]
LOL.... and you STILL didnt answer the question. All those big words and it seems ya still cant read...
Originally posted by Shayde Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
QFE
I think the air must be getting thin up on top of his high horse
"Uh, we had a slight weapons malfunction, but uh... everything's perfectly all right now. We're fine. We're all fine here now, thank you. How are you?"
Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Funny. I had a feeling somebody would take that route. It's too obvious not to. I ran my post through the spelling & grammar checker in Word and the reading level estimator indicated that it wouldn't even take a 7th grade education on the Flesch-Kincaid scale to understand what I wrote. Talking over the twelve year olds that you guys spend so much energy mocking? Maybe so. Sorry for setting the bar so high, Shayde. I guess Nancy McIntyre was right after all when she said that SWG players don't seem to like reading all them big and fancy junior high school level words. This paragraph requires a 6th grade reading level. Good luck. Reading comprehension FTW.
You know, I'm glad to see a couple of the senators joining the discussions here. Most are profession correspondents from pre-nge and they really know and care about certain areas of the game. Having them available in a freer forum share their ideas and knowledge can be a valuable thing.
I see people pointing fingers at the senators all the time as if they're responsible for the NGE, well doh, let's face it they're not. Many of the senators are defensive, some kowtow to the company line too much, but they are just avid players like many of us.
I'm just saying, if they come here to talk about the game, it benefits everyone to give them the same benefit of the doubt as any new poster here.
Originally posted by Unagi Originally posted by Shayde
Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Funny. I had a feeling somebody would take that route. It's too obvious not to. I ran my post through the spelling & grammar checker in Word and the reading level estimator indicated that it wouldn't even take a 7th grade education on the Flesch-Kincaid scale to understand what I wrote. Talking over the twelve year olds that you guys spend so much energy mocking? Maybe so. Sorry for setting the bar so high, Shayde. I guess Nancy McIntyre was right after all when she said that SWG players don't seem to like reading all them big and fancy junior high school level words. This paragraph requires a 6th grade reading level. Good luck. Reading comprehension FTW.
Wow, Shayde was a bit hard but you're just digging yourself a hole. Fine, you think people are taking shots at you, call them on it. Then move on, don't make yourself look like a Jerk. Seriously, the way you come accross makes you seem arrogant and a @$$. I'd prefer not believe that, but you're not proving them wrong so far...
Let's keep this discussion going in a postive manner. It's good IMO to see some Sen's stopping in, and so far StarNick has been adding quite a bit. Notice, no one is flaming him...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
Originally posted by Unagi Originally posted by Shayde
Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Funny. I had a feeling somebody would take that route. It's too obvious not to. I ran my post through the spelling & grammar checker in Word and the reading level estimator indicated that it wouldn't even take a 7th grade education on the Flesch-Kincaid scale to understand what I wrote. Talking over the twelve year olds that you guys spend so much energy mocking? Maybe so. Sorry for setting the bar so high, Shayde. I guess Nancy McIntyre was right after all when she said that SWG players don't seem to like reading all them big and fancy junior high school level words. This paragraph requires a 6th grade reading level. Good luck. Reading comprehension FTW.
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Unagi...You said a lot of words, but came nowhere near answering anything.
"It's true as long as you believe it"....Sure thing...Maybe you can help get me off on a Temporary Insanity plea someday. You sound like a half-assed jailhouse lawyer/snitch.
Apparently, there is a logical explaination for why you thought the NGE was the greatest thing to happen to SWG? Did they feed you drugs? Threaten to kill your family? Stick pins under your fingernails?
You can answer the questions or not..If you are waiting on an apology, get a comfortable chair. I'm not kissing your ass, or anyone elses, for an answer. You helped mislead (is that better for you?) the entire playerbase, do you have a valid excuse or are you just a douchebag (as you called many of the SWG vets)?
Why don't you "Man Up" and answer the question? It's not just me that wants to know. Of course, I understand that you need to buy time to come up with a good excuse like this.
Now, since you saw fit to call me a liar, and you did call me a liar, you must necessarily know what it was that I saw that I was describing in the posts you quoted above in order to know that I was lying about it. I understand that you don't agree with me or my assessment. On this there can be no doubt. That you have a differing opinion does not make me a liar. Conversely, I was also not lying if I believed it when i said it. Even if, hypothetically, I no longer believe now what I said then it is still not a lie. You claim that I was lying. So as I stated above, in response to a post of your very own creation, please share with us all what it was that I saw or did that I then lied about. See where I'm going with this? Cool.
I love the pompous responses you keep firing off trying to defend yourself and your impressions of the NGE. Although none of us were "there with you" at Austin we all experienced the NGE once it went live. Maybe you played an entirely different version than what was pushed live, but somehow I doubt that. Personally I hated the NGE from the first few hours I played it. I hoped my feelings would change but after 2 months I hated it just as much as the day it launched and each time I have gone back because somebody convinced me it was "better than ever" I quit in disgust within a few days.
You get riled when somebody calls you a liar, but what else can people think? You didn't play some completely different super secret version that nobody has ever seen...you played the craptastic piece of trash that gutted thousands of hours of hard work by players to build their own corner of the Star Wars universe. Maybe you aren't a liar. Maybe you are just a moron, but you don't seem like one. Do you expect us to simply believe that it was an honest opinion that the NGE was a good change?
What are you trying to tell us is the reason for the way you panted and gushed about something that the vast majority of us hated from the moment we played it? You aren't making yourself clear because you are doing what senators are best at. You avoid the question and attack whoever asks the question so you can protect the special color on your forum name and call everyone who doesn't agree with you an idiot as if your opinion is worth more than the thousands who have canceled and walked away.
Personally I blame all of those who participated in the Austin event as much as SOE. Maybe if more of you had spoken up when you had the opportunity we would still have a game worth playing instead of the half baked, ill conceived, meandering, pointless fps hybrid that SWG is today.
I think you are under the mistaken impression you are on the SWG boards where people actually care that you are a senator. To me it is a sign of treachery because you all sold us out for a plane ticket, t shirt and a special color on your forum name. Have you no shame?
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by Unagi Originally posted by Shayde
Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Funny. I had a feeling somebody would take that route. It's too obvious not to. I ran my post through the spelling & grammar checker in Word and the reading level estimator indicated that it wouldn't even take a 7th grade education on the Flesch-Kincaid scale to understand what I wrote. Talking over the twelve year olds that you guys spend so much energy mocking? Maybe so. Sorry for setting the bar so high, Shayde. I guess Nancy McIntyre was right after all when she said that SWG players don't seem to like reading all them big and fancy junior high school level words. This paragraph requires a 6th grade reading level. Good luck. Reading comprehension FTW.
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
I don't know how old you are, Unagi, but adults are trying to have a conversation.
You obviously need a time out, son. If I were a mod, I'd ban your angery butt.
That being said, I'd like to point out that you should take this hate-filled angerfest to PMs if you a have personal problem with someone.
Not only have you derailed this thread, but you've just been a rude and immature dick about it.
You represent all that sucks about the internet: Crusty, angry, jerks that hide behind the anonymity of the internet. Go into a crowd of people and tell them all that they can't understand what you're saying because you're SO much more sofisticated than them.
Maybe the mod was right in locking this thread. The mod would definitely be in the right for banning you as you've done nothing but incite anger with your condesendence.
I think he's just mad that the bootlickers they call Senators will be where they belong: among the great unwashed once the pre-CU servers come out, because the community has no respect for them.
All the good ones were gone before or shortly after the NGE. The ones that are there now barely conceal their contempt for the player community. Unagi's attitude is quite typical of the most visible of them. They have their little club, and they like it enough that they will literally lick the bullshit off of SOE's jackboots.
Oh sure, they will keep their Status with SOE, so long as the NGE game lasts... Which won't be very long after the pre-CU base game is near complete
One reason why I see LEC doing what they are doing is that SWG has to be shut down, NGE is clearly not working and they'd rather just work on SWG2. Why not let the community take over SWG1, run it ourselves (with LEC oversight)? That way LEC can learn about what we want in a Star Wars MMO without spending much money to do it. With the code being open source and LEC retaining rights to it, heck, they can even use it if they want to.
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by Unagi Originally posted by Shayde
Wow... they must be handing out thesaruses to the senators. Pedantic AND disingenuous in the same paragraph.. no the same sentence.
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Funny. I had a feeling somebody would take that route. It's too obvious not to. I ran my post through the spelling & grammar checker in Word and the reading level estimator indicated that it wouldn't even take a 7th grade education on the Flesch-Kincaid scale to understand what I wrote. Talking over the twelve year olds that you guys spend so much energy mocking? Maybe so. Sorry for setting the bar so high, Shayde. I guess Nancy McIntyre was right after all when she said that SWG players don't seem to like reading all them big and fancy junior high school level words. This paragraph requires a 6th grade reading level. Good luck. Reading comprehension FTW.
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
Not to join in on the war but the use of complex aka "fifty cent" words in a social setting where they are not called for nor needed is a symptom of inferiority issues. A reflex in which to give one's self a bit of leverage in a debate albeit only in the speaker's mindset. Kind of like wearing blue on the day of a test. It also needs mentioned that the employment of such words in a social forum is a known tactic to obfuscate the explanation given.
I won't assume that said person is guilty of such. The only thing I could truly find him guilty of is his statement that assumes us to be beneath him. Sure it was a reaction to Shayde's post but I am sure that had he held himself to the same scales and estimations - he would have noted that a good bit of the posters here are more than up to the task of interpreting his or any other senator's posts or intent.
In layman's terms, we can use big words as well. However, condescending tones and attitudes should be checked in at the door. It wouldn't matter if it was Stephen Hawking posting to this board, no one can assume they are "better" or more intelligent than anyone else here regardless of any "post" that they might hold.
And by the way, this message was checked in Open Office. Just thought you should know.
Thanks guys... thanks for lowering yourselves to his level, and as a result giving the Mods EVERY reason to lock this post, one that was inspiring some good discussion. We all know how he was acting, we didn't need to get personal with him. His attitude was pointed out, and all could see it.
It's sad that (and I'm just as guilty from time to time) we can so easily be sucked into other's hate. Yoda was right...
I'll add while we're still not locked: Thanks StarNick. You added to the conversation, and negotiated the angry waters well. I hope you stop in more often, you are a formidable foe for those of us who detest the NGE. Not a Fanboi, not a hater and to top it off, a member of the "hated" Senate. OMG! You're an actual person with your OWN opinions! Props to you...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
Originally posted by MX13 Thanks guys... thanks for lowering yourselves to his level, and as a result giving the Mods EVERY reason to lock this post, one that was inspiring some good discussion. We all know how he was acting, we didn't need to get personal with him. His attitude was pointed out, and all could see it. It's sad that (and I'm just as guilty from time to time) we can so easily be sucked into other's hate. Yoda was right...
QFE! I had to PM the mod to get it unlocked. BTW anyone else see this?
Thunderheart
FYI - The transition to New Forums for the SWG Community is not Tuesday, August 15th, 2006 any longer. As soon as we have a revised date for the transition, we’ll post it for you here in Announcements. Thanks!
Unagi: I think you may have chosen the wrong place to try and defend the Senate. Look around, everyone is here for a reason. I don't really care if you lied, or you just have a very queer taste in games. All I know is that you have never represented the playerbase at all. You were supposed to represent the community to the devs, not squelch "Pre-Cu fanboys". If 80% of the board was screaming about something in the game, whether you agreed with them or not, it was your job to make those voices heard to the devs.
Originally posted by Leel Unagi: I think you may have chosen the wrong place to try and defend the Senate. Look around, everyone is here for a reason. I don't really care if you lied, or you just have a very queer taste in games. All I know is that you have never represented the playerbase at all. You were supposed to represent the community to the devs, not squelch "Pre-Cu fanboys". If 80% of the board was screaming about something in the game, whether you agreed with them or not, it was your job to make those voices heard to the devs. You never once spoke for me. Why?
Originally posted by tillamook Originally posted by MX13 Thanks guys... thanks for lowering yourselves to his level, and as a result giving the Mods EVERY reason to lock this post, one that was inspiring some good discussion. We all know how he was acting, we didn't need to get personal with him. His attitude was pointed out, and all could see it. It's sad that (and I'm just as guilty from time to time) we can so easily be sucked into other's hate. Yoda was right...
QFE! I had to PM the mod to get it unlocked. BTW anyone else see this?
Thunderheart
FYI - The transition to New Forums for the SWG Community is not Tuesday, August 15th, 2006 any longer. As soon as we have a revised date for the transition, we’ll post it for you here in Announcements. Thanks!
Closing the thread now.
That's an awefully late notice change, not to mention strange considering they have no further info... You'ld figure they'd have an idea when it would happen if it was going to happen anytime soon...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
Originally posted by MX13 Thanks guys... thanks for lowering yourselves to his level, and as a result giving the Mods EVERY reason to lock this post, one that was inspiring some good discussion. We all know how he was acting, we didn't need to get personal with him. His attitude was pointed out, and all could see it. It's sad that (and I'm just as guilty from time to time) we can so easily be sucked into other's hate. Yoda was right... I'll add while we're still not locked: Thanks StarNick. You added to the conversation, and negotiated the angry waters well. I hope you stop in more often, you are a formidable foe for those of us who detest the NGE. Not a Fanboi, not a hater and to top it off, a member of the "hated" Senate. OMG! You're an actual person with your OWN opinions! Props to you...
Despite all of everyone's differences here - I would like to assume that we here at this forum are part of a community. Yes, we get a little rabid but still I think that we have a certain level of community pride and self esteem that we hold dear. I don't regret my words and want him to think twice before coming here again in the manner that he did before. Threads come and go. Locks happen and so do bans.
And you were right to thank StarNick, good information and posts. Would have loved for it to have been at the start of thread with the topic being related. Some of this stuff should be cut and pasted into another thread for later reference.
Comments
He wonders why the senators are accused of "talking down" to the others on the forum. Guess if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them in big words and bullshit.
Well at least he didn't take bagderbanger's "fukuyounooblearn2playreeeeetard" approach.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Personally, I hate the NGE, which is why I quit after 2.5 years. But having said that, I think you guys are reading way to much into the recent posts for Smed and Devs and even this "senator".
You are seeing what you want to see. I'm with you in spirit, I would love to see some Pre-Cu servers. But the bottom line is unless there is a deadicated Development team assigned to FIXING it, it will not last.
The Pre-CU game was far from the glorious game people keep posting about. It had very little to do with what you would expect from a Star Wars game and everything to do with Melee Stackers and Combat Medic tossers. PvE was a joke and so was PvP.
So, a "Classic Server" would get a HUGE instant draw, but would die off quickly if it was not fixed and balanced. And the only way that will happen is if SoE scraps the NGE and reverts back to the Pre-CU on the live servers and I simply do not see that happening.
They have about 150 thousand subscribers paying $15 a month to play the NGE. That is about $2.25m a month. They've reduced the Dev team to a handful of people to minimize cost. Server's are cheap and I willing to bet they are actually making a pretty good return right now.
The window of making SWG a blockbuster starting closing when the CU didn't fix the bugs and tried to change things that didn't need to be changed. The window closed with the NGE.
All SoE needs to do is just keep adding a few new things to keep people busy and they will be fine as is. Reverting back to the Pre-CU would require a MASSIVE investment and one that I doubt they could justify given thier track record.
SWG is what it is. Either play it and love it, or hate it and leave it. But it is what it is.
Concept for SWG 2
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/90081
Personally, I hate the NGE, which is why I quit after 2.5 years. But having said that, I think you guys are reading way to much into the recent posts for Smed and Devs and even this "senator".
You are seeing what you want to see. I'm with you in spirit, I would love to see some Pre-Cu servers. But the bottom line is unless there is a deadicated Development team assigned to FIXING it, it will not last.
The Pre-CU game was far from the glorious game people keep posting about. It had very little to do with what you would expect from a Star Wars game and everything to do with Melee Stackers and Combat Medic tossers. PvE was a joke and so was PvP.
So, a "Classic Server" would get a HUGE instant draw, but would die off quickly if it was not fixed and balanced. And the only way that will happen is if SoE scraps the NGE and reverts back to the Pre-CU on the live servers and I simply do not see that happening.
They have about 150 thousand subscribers paying $15 a month to play the NGE. That is about $2.25m a month. They've reduced the Dev team to a handful of people to minimize cost. Server's are cheap and I willing to bet they are actually making a pretty good return right now.
The window of making SWG a blockbuster starting closing when the CU didn't fix the bugs and tried to change things that didn't need to be changed. The window closed with the NGE.
All SoE needs to do is just keep adding a few new things to keep people busy and they will be fine as is. Reverting back to the Pre-CU would require a MASSIVE investment and one that I doubt they could justify given thier track record.
SWG is what it is. Either play it and love it, or hate it and leave it. But it is what it is.
Personally, the only thing I would disagree with here is your estimation of players. At 150k Subs, by Industry average, that would mean there would be about 1700 players on each server (on average at 30% of players on) durring peak hours, and that just simply isn't the case. Subs are probably around 20k - 50k at most.
That said, their expenses are incredibly small compared to the past, and I'd agree they are probably in "coast mode" to save "gas". But what would concern me is I were a current player is that if they are so determined to fix the game & keep it going, why have they cut the Dev team and not invested funds into getting the NGE to a finished state? It seems all they are doing is replacing Devs... or maybe there are a group of them in a dungeon under SOE working on the CUUNGEXL33THAXOR coming soon... are we at 7.5 months yet?
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
And to the last poster...yes you saw flamethrowers in the prequels - jango fett. Yes, he was a BH...but mandalorians were super-commandos. A problem with the movies and SW lore, anyone could be a BH...commandos...pistoleers...etc. It wasn't a profession, just a willingless to take bounties on people - in essence, be a merceny.
Either though I was never thrilled by Commander Cody, the clones were at least genetic clones of a supercommando...and the clone generals were also ARC-trained (Advanced Recon Commandos). Commando's iconic-ness wasn't as overt as jedi, but it was still there.
But ultimately, we probably managed to survive the great profession purge because we had a whole set of unique weapons which would have been weird to integrate into other professions -or- wouldn't have made sense just having a unique set of weapons that originally comprised a profession floating out there in the game. Heavy Weapons always made a commando, and I think as long as there will be Heavy Weapons in SWG...there will always be a commando profession.
Thankfully...
Drifting Off Topic: Commandos definatly have a place in SWG, but the way they have been done has been a bit weak IMO. I would have liked to have seen Commandos be an offshoot of the Soldier, along with Squad Leader and a Combat Engineer. The difference for me is that I would have prefered to see the Commando get Innate Armor, some Basic Stealth Abilities (sneaking, not cloaking), Bonuses with some Weps (Carbines, Rifles & Unarmed), and specials along the lines of Explosives, Sniping & Orbital Strikes. I would have liked to see a Combat Engineer added that used Heavy Weapons, place defences, place turrets, and could opperate Large Vehicals (AT-ST's), similar to real CE's. Pre-CU until now, they really could have done a MUCH better job with the GCW combat rolls.
Also, Rank and Rank Abilities/Bonuses should be kept in line with the GCW faction system, not a profession. Give SL's Special Tactical abilities, but keep rank and those bonuses seperate. For example, give a Colonel better Group Bonuses if he is leading the group, but give a SL Col double the bonuses...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
[quote]Originally posted by Unagi
[b]
Originally posted by SODAofBRIA
Originally posted by Unagi
Originally posted by SODAofBRIA
What I want to know is:
Why is it that all the Senators that were flown in to Austin to test out the NGE (remember this was early stages of NGE too!) absolutely RAVED about it?Then compare that to the community reaction.
What I'd really like is for somebody who wasn't even there to tell me again exactly what it was I saw in Austin.
Dude...I didn't TELL you anything. I asked a very simple question, very directly. Be careful, my emoticons have you outnumbered.
So, since you're feeling "chatty"...What DID you see? It couldn't have been what dropped on November 15th, 2005 because I came back to test it out by like the 17th and it was a crapfest. An admitted crapfest, mind you.* Or, did they show you something totally different? Did they decieve you?* Or, were/are you just towing the line? Does your compass point the same direction no matter what happens?* Or, did they make you do kegstands before you tested it and slipped in Ikari Warriors for the SNES?
Who ordered the CODE RED?!
Yeah, actually you did "tell" me something. You told me and the rest of us here I was lying about what I saw in Austin. And then later on here you got kind of pedantic about how simple and direct you were being - which is more than a little disingenuous.Slightly out of context there so bear with me as I refer you back to one of your own posts. In another thread - recently and on these boards - you pulled up these three quotes from me that I made back in the first week of last November:
Originally posted by SODAofBRIA
Throw another liar on the barbie!
[url=http://soe.lithium.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Bria&message.id=1063256#M1063256]
Darth_Sushi Galactic SenatorPosts: 3359Registered: 07-17-2003
posted: 11-02-2005 03:03 PM
It's all true. I have been in SOE's offices in Austin all day
playing with the new changes and talking with the developers, designers
and producers. It looks awesome. The CU was a band-aid on a broken
system. This is a brand new game. And it rocks. The game has never
looked, felt and played more like "Star Wars" then it did when I logged
into the test console this morning.
[url=http://soe.lithium.com/swg/board/message?board.id=squad_leader&message.id=31425#M31425]
Darth_Sushi Galactic SenatorPosts: 3359Registered: 07-17-2003
posted: 11-02-2005 02:08 PM
OK - So you may have heard by now that SWG is shaking things up a
bit. I have been in Austin at SOE's offices all day testing a lot of
these new upcoming changes. While there is likely to be a lot of fear,
uncertainty and doubt about the new direction of the game, my first
impression is one of sheer amazement and joy. I can assure you that the
future of Squad Leader is quite bright. And I mean bright like:
Airstrikes
Artillery
Orbital Bombardment
Please check out New Game Enhancements forum.
And remember to keep it civil and stay on target.
[url=http://soe.lithium.com/swg/board/message?board.id=nge_discussion&message.id=44922#M44922]
Darth_Sushi Galactic SenatorPosts: 3359Registered: 07-17-2003
posted: 11-05-2005 10:00 PM
quadpers0n wrote:
i'm 100% positive if he were to be candid he would describe his
original vision as overambitious and laud the changes coming for this
game.
Overambitious indeed. The orginal design wasn't flawed, per se.
However, that system was too complex to maintain and enhance given the
limitations of the technology used to build and support it. There are
too many things they want to do with this game that are
simply impossible or infeasible from a technical and/or finanical
standpoint in it's current incarnation.
Wow...it sure was thick in there around November!
See what you did there? You called me a liar. It's right there in bold red. You did this first. And without justifiable basis. I am sure you just thought you were being cute, and maybe you were only joking, and maybe you thought I'd never actually read or respond to the obvious trolling and flamebait you were laying down, but by making this baseless assertion you have lost any moral high ground you might have otherwise been able to legitimately claim - as you seemingly attempt in the first quote of yours I cited above. Clear so far? Good.Now, since you saw fit to call me a liar, and you did call me a liar, you must necessarily know what it was that I saw that I was describing in the posts you quoted above in order to know that I was lying about it. I understand that you don't agree with me or my assessment. On this there can be no doubt. That you have a differing opinion does not make me a
liar. Conversely, I was also not lying if I believed it when i said it. Even if, hypothetically, I no longer believe now what I said then it is still not a lie. You claim that I was lying. So as I stated above, in response to a post of your very own creation, please share with us all what it was that I saw or did that I then lied about. See where I'm going with this? Cool.Your follow up questions in this thread certainly seem to concur with my assertion that you actually have no idea what it was I was shown in Austin. If it then follows that if you don't know what it was I saw, on what basis could you possibly hope to determine my veracity? You can't. See? And I'm afraid that even though I could be the bigger guy here and let it slide, I have to admit I'm kind of fixated on it. It seems I have some kind of problem with you calling me a liar and then demanding more information from me like you have some kind of entitlement to it. It bothers me. So just admit it, man up and apologize so we can get over this hurdle and on to talking about more important stuff. Like what I actually saw in Austin - to the extent that it matters, since you have already made your opinion on the topic abundantly clear.And on a completely unrelated topic:This other thing that you accuse me of above - and that various others around here seem to like acusing my fellow Senators of - the appropriate idiomatic expression is to "toe" the line and not "tow" it. [/b][/quote]
LOL.... and you STILL didnt answer the question. All those big words and it seems ya still cant read...
Hooked on Phonics worked for me!
QFE
I think the air must be getting thin up on top of his high horse
"Uh, we had a slight weapons malfunction, but uh... everything's perfectly all right now.
We're fine. We're all fine here now, thank you. How are you?"
You know, I'm glad to see a couple of the senators joining the discussions here. Most are profession correspondents from pre-nge and they really know and care about certain areas of the game. Having them available in a freer forum share their ideas and knowledge can be a valuable thing.
I see people pointing fingers at the senators all the time as if they're responsible for the NGE, well doh, let's face it they're not. Many of the senators are defensive, some kowtow to the company line too much, but they are just avid players like many of us.
I'm just saying, if they come here to talk about the game, it benefits everyone to give them the same benefit of the doubt as any new poster here.
Wow, Shayde was a bit hard but you're just digging yourself a hole. Fine, you think people are taking shots at you, call them on it. Then move on, don't make yourself look like a Jerk. Seriously, the way you come accross makes you seem arrogant and a @$$. I'd prefer not believe that, but you're not proving them wrong so far...
Let's keep this discussion going in a postive manner. It's good IMO to see some Sen's stopping in, and so far StarNick has been adding quite a bit. Notice, no one is flaming him...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Unagi...You said a lot of words, but came nowhere near answering anything.
"It's true as long as you believe it"....Sure thing...Maybe you can help get me off on a Temporary Insanity plea someday. You sound like a half-assed jailhouse lawyer/snitch.
Apparently, there is a logical explaination for why you thought the NGE was the greatest thing to happen to SWG? Did they feed you drugs? Threaten to kill your family? Stick pins under your fingernails?
You can answer the questions or not..If you are waiting on an apology, get a comfortable chair. I'm not kissing your ass, or anyone elses, for an answer.
You helped mislead (is that better for you?) the entire playerbase, do you have a valid excuse or are you just a douchebag (as you called many of the SWG vets)?
Why don't you "Man Up" and answer the question? It's not just me that wants to know.
Of course, I understand that you need to buy time to come up with a good excuse like this.
Love, Sodapop
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
I don't know how old you are, Unagi, but adults are trying to have a conversation.
You obviously need a time out, son. If I were a mod, I'd ban your angery butt.
That being said, I'd like to point out that you should take this hate-filled angerfest to PMs if you a have personal problem with someone.
Not only have you derailed this thread, but you've just been a rude and immature dick about it.
You represent all that sucks about the internet: Crusty, angry, jerks that hide behind the anonymity of the internet. Go into a crowd of people and tell them all that they can't understand what you're saying because you're SO much more sofisticated than them.
Maybe the mod was right in locking this thread. The mod would definitely be in the right for banning you as you've done nothing but incite anger with your condesendence.
I think he's just mad that the bootlickers they call Senators will be where they belong: among the great unwashed once the pre-CU servers come out, because the community has no respect for them.
All the good ones were gone before or shortly after the NGE. The ones that are there now barely conceal their contempt for the player community. Unagi's attitude is quite typical of the most visible of them. They have their little club, and they like it enough that they will literally lick the bullshit off of SOE's jackboots.
Oh sure, they will keep their Status with SOE, so long as the NGE game lasts... Which won't be very long after the pre-CU base game is near complete
One reason why I see LEC doing what they are doing is that SWG has to be shut down, NGE is clearly not working and they'd rather just work on SWG2. Why not let the community take over SWG1, run it ourselves (with LEC oversight)? That way LEC can learn about what we want in a Star Wars MMO without spending much money to do it. With the code being open source and LEC retaining rights to it, heck, they can even use it if they want to.
Yet you love the nge. Guess the mensa meeting is just filled with mouthbreathers too.
Of course, it's even funnier that you spout off about reading comprehension, yet don't understand the meaning of my post. I'm not criticizing you for using your word-a-day calendar, I'm criticizing you for talking down to people with a condecending attitude.
Not to join in on the war but the use of complex aka "fifty cent" words in a social setting where they are not called for nor needed is a symptom of inferiority issues. A reflex in which to give one's self a bit of leverage in a debate albeit only in the speaker's mindset. Kind of like wearing blue on the day of a test. It also needs mentioned that the employment of such words in a social forum is a known tactic to obfuscate the explanation given.
I won't assume that said person is guilty of such. The only thing I could truly find him guilty of is his statement that assumes us to be beneath him. Sure it was a reaction to Shayde's post but I am sure that had he held himself to the same scales and estimations - he would have noted that a good bit of the posters here are more than up to the task of interpreting his or any other senator's posts or intent.
In layman's terms, we can use big words as well. However, condescending tones and attitudes should be checked in at the door. It wouldn't matter if it was Stephen Hawking posting to this board, no one can assume they are "better" or more intelligent than anyone else here regardless of any "post" that they might hold.
And by the way, this message was checked in Open Office. Just thought you should know.
Thanks guys... thanks for lowering yourselves to his level, and as a result giving the Mods EVERY reason to lock this post, one that was inspiring some good discussion. We all know how he was acting, we didn't need to get personal with him. His attitude was pointed out, and all could see it.
It's sad that (and I'm just as guilty from time to time) we can so easily be sucked into other's hate. Yoda was right...
I'll add while we're still not locked: Thanks StarNick. You added to the conversation, and negotiated the angry waters well. I hope you stop in more often, you are a formidable foe for those of us who detest the NGE. Not a Fanboi, not a hater and to top it off, a member of the "hated" Senate. OMG! You're an actual person with your OWN opinions! Props to you...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
QFE! I had to PM the mod to get it unlocked. BTW anyone else see this?
Thunderheart
FYI - The transition to New Forums for the SWG Community is not Tuesday, August 15th, 2006 any longer.
As soon as we have a revised date for the transition, we’ll post it for you here in Announcements.
Thanks!
Closing the thread now.
Unagi: I think you may have chosen the wrong place to try and defend the Senate. Look around, everyone is here for a reason. I don't really care if you lied, or you just have a very queer taste in games. All I know is that you have never represented the playerbase at all. You were supposed to represent the community to the devs, not squelch "Pre-Cu fanboys". If 80% of the board was screaming about something in the game, whether you agreed with them or not, it was your job to make those voices heard to the devs.
You never once spoke for me.
Why?
QFE! I had to PM the mod to get it unlocked. BTW anyone else see this?
Thunderheart
FYI - The transition to New Forums for the SWG Community is not Tuesday, August 15th, 2006 any longer.
As soon as we have a revised date for the transition, we’ll post it for you here in Announcements.
Thanks!
Closing the thread now.
That's an awefully late notice change, not to mention strange considering they have no further info... You'ld figure they'd have an idea when it would happen if it was going to happen anytime soon...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
400 posts.... PFT! Noob...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
400 posts.... PFT! Noob...
It took longer to hit that on the sucky forums. I had dodge the agro from the mods.
Despite all of everyone's differences here - I would like to assume that we here at this forum are part of a community. Yes, we get a little rabid but still I think that we have a certain level of community pride and self esteem that we hold dear. I don't regret my words and want him to think twice before coming here again in the manner that he did before. Threads come and go. Locks happen and so do bans.
And you were right to thank StarNick, good information and posts. Would have loved for it to have been at the start of thread with the topic being related. Some of this stuff should be cut and pasted into another thread for later reference.