No, because to do good some games ahve to take fans from others
But on the topic, I don't think LoTRO is going to be a very big game after long seeing as to the limited PvP, or Monster Play, because as we can see from the huge WoW feedback wanting more PvP...
I think the two top contenders will be WAR and AoC with new MMORPGs
Thought LoTR already has a huge fan base, they may keep a good lot of those people but outside that, with the actual gaming comunity, I think they have lost
EDIT: And anyone who says WoW sucks (I agree it sucks the big one) we are prolly not hardcore PvEers, because it is a PvEers dream, which is obvious due to the 8million or however many there are subscribers... The amount of subscribers doesnt make it a good game though, the person does. If they like it its good if not it isn't, it's obviously an opinion, theres no factual "it sucks" or "it rocks"
No, because to do good some games ahve to take fans from others But on the topic, I don't think LoTRO is going to be a very big game after long seeing as to the limited PvP, or Monster Play, because as we can see from the huge WoW feedback wanting more PvP... I think the two top contenders will be WAR and AoC with new MMORPGs Thought LoTR already has a huge fan base, they may keep a good lot of those people but outside that, with the actual gaming comunity, I think they have lost EDIT: And anyone who says WoW sucks (I agree it sucks the big one) we are prolly not hardcore PvEers, because it is a PvEers dream, which is obvious due to the 8million or however many there are subscribers... The amount of subscribers doesnt make it a good game though, the person does. If they like it its good if not it isn't, it's obviously an opinion, theres no factual "it sucks" or "it rocks"
I'm not sure how many players actually like PVP however... Maybe the folks that provide the feedback indeed do... But what about the silent majority? Maybe they all do, but I wouldn't bet my farm on that. I figure they could always expand the pvp aspect in this game... But I am not going to tell my friends that this game is the be all and end all of pvp... My rough estimate is that this game is 95% pve, 5% pvp.
By the end of 2008, the top games in the MMO market will be(# of subscribers)...1. WoW 2. LotRO 3. WAR 4. AoC just a prediction WoW- 9 mill. LotRO- 1.5 mill WAR- 900k AoC-750k all just guesses, no hard #'s to back anything
Those are some really big numbers...I hope you are right.
WoW is soooo overated, stupid, dull, boring, worst game i'v ever played. I loved SWG but got bored after 3 months. Been playing LOTRO for about a month and can easily say i'll be playing this game for anouther 6+ months. As for WoW having 9 MIL subscriptions not gonna happen. They are at 8 Mil but there are lots of WoW players who are leaving to play the better games (finally). As for the WoW fanboys they'll stay there, only getting a trial for LOTRO or WARHAMMER online or something, not even play the game and say THIS GAME SUCKS, WoW is better! but WoW is finally going to lose a good amount of subscribers. Sadly I think LOTRO should be able to beat WoW but alot of people are going to stick to WoW saying that this game is a WoW clone when its not. I hate WoW but love this game. MY OPINIONS SO WoW BOYS BUZZ OFF! :P I expect to get flammed on this post oh well.
By the end of 2008, the top games in the MMO market will be(# of subscribers)...1. WoW 2. LotRO 3. WAR 4. AoC just a prediction WoW- 9 mill. LotRO- 1.5 mill WAR- 900k AoC-750k all just guesses, no hard #'s to back anything
Those are some really big numbers...I hope you are right.
yea, I went a bit high, but doesnt WoW have 7 or so mill now? Whats next as far as numbers, right now? GW has 1 mill maybe but not true 14.99 a month kinda deal.
I'm asking this because, each thread i read all i see is people telling LOTRO is wow 2 and trying to compare the worst of WOW with LOTRO, any review i see about LOTRO, someone always jump in to say its the same in WOW.
The reason you see these posts is that 3 years ago you had around 500k MMORPG subscribers worldwide (not counting Asia). Today you have 8mil +. I bet you around 80% of todays MMORPG subscribers had never played another MMORPG before they got sucked into WoW. Now whenever these MMORPG first timers see a new MMORPG they will all go OMFWTFBBQ it's just like WoW!!! And they are right, but fail to realise that WoW is "just" like the games before it - UO, EQ, AO, AC etc etc. (Old story, been told a million times by now).
WoW is in many regards the epitome of 2nd generation MMOPRPGs (the 1st generaion is in my book MUDs. we have yet to see a 3rd), the tried and true of everything that went before it. It would be stupid to throw all that on the floor when developing a new MMORPG (which is a very costly affair), unless of cause you are hell bent on risking your skin trying to do something different. There are few games out there pushing the genre, and even less succeding. But I think (hope) that we'll see more and more games pushing the bounderies of MMORPGs as subscribers get tired of the same old mechanics in new clothing.
Btw. this should not be seen as a WoW bashing post, as I have played it happily for 1½ years. But it does annoy me when every new MMORPG is reduced to being "just another WoW clone", as if WoW itself was the original.
/D
8 mill counting with asia, without will be about 3 millions.
WoW is soooo overated, stupid, dull, boring, worst game i'v ever played. I loved SWG but got bored after 3 months. Been playing LOTRO for about a month and can easily say i'll be playing this game for anouther 6+ months. As for WoW having 9 MIL subscriptions not gonna happen. They are at 8 Mil but there are lots of WoW players who are leaving to play the better games (finally). As for the WoW fanboys they'll stay there, only getting a trial for LOTRO or WARHAMMER online or something, not even play the game and say THIS GAME SUCKS, WoW is better! but WoW is finally going to lose a good amount of subscribers. Sadly I think LOTRO should be able to beat WoW but alot of people are going to stick to WoW saying that this game is a WoW clone when its not. I hate WoW but love this game. MY OPINIONS SO WoW BOYS BUZZ OFF! :P I expect to get flammed on this post oh well.
as I said, my #'s may be totally off. WoW may lose steam, so lets say it levels out at 5 million. LotRO may get to 2 mill. but the bar set is too high. In a few years, the market will be full, and dopes like me refuse to pay for more than one game at a time. There will be no game to reach the numbers of WoW as it is right now, I don't think.
WoW is soooo overated, stupid, dull, boring, worst game i'v ever played. I loved SWG but got bored after 3 months. Been playing LOTRO for about a month and can easily say i'll be playing this game for anouther 6+ months. As for WoW having 9 MIL subscriptions not gonna happen. They are at 8 Mil but there are lots of WoW players who are leaving to play the better games (finally). As for the WoW fanboys they'll stay there, only getting a trial for LOTRO or WARHAMMER online or something, not even play the game and say THIS GAME SUCKS, WoW is better! but WoW is finally going to lose a good amount of subscribers. Sadly I think LOTRO should be able to beat WoW but alot of people are going to stick to WoW saying that this game is a WoW clone when its not. I hate WoW but love this game. MY OPINIONS SO WoW BOYS BUZZ OFF! :P I expect to get flammed on this post oh well.
as I said, my #'s may be totally off. WoW may lose steam, so lets say it levels out at 5 million. LotRO may get to 2 mill. but the bar set is too high. In a few years, the market will be full, and dopes like me refuse to pay for more than one game at a time. There will be no game to reach the numbers of WoW as it is right now, I don't think.
Your numbers are also based on the assumption that anyone that will play mmorpg's already is, and are just shuffling around the market... Much like how SOE seemed to think and still does. Remember before WOW, the MMORPG market had already reached critical mass, no one could beat the heady heights of 500,000 subscriptions, according to the guys that knew everything about this industry.
The only reason I state this, is because when you project 5 million for WOW, you put LOTRO up... But only after subtracting from WOW, which indicates shuffling. Shuffling will occur, but the market will also gain folks that are totally new to the style of game delivery... How else do you think WOW made its money?
WoW is soooo overated, stupid, dull, boring, worst game i'v ever played. I loved SWG but got bored after 3 months. Been playing LOTRO for about a month and can easily say i'll be playing this game for anouther 6+ months. As for WoW having 9 MIL subscriptions not gonna happen. They are at 8 Mil but there are lots of WoW players who are leaving to play the better games (finally). As for the WoW fanboys they'll stay there, only getting a trial for LOTRO or WARHAMMER online or something, not even play the game and say THIS GAME SUCKS, WoW is better! but WoW is finally going to lose a good amount of subscribers. Sadly I think LOTRO should be able to beat WoW but alot of people are going to stick to WoW saying that this game is a WoW clone when its not. I hate WoW but love this game. MY OPINIONS SO WoW BOYS BUZZ OFF! :P I expect to get flammed on this post oh well.
as I said, my #'s may be totally off. WoW may lose steam, so lets say it levels out at 5 million. LotRO may get to 2 mill. but the bar set is too high. In a few years, the market will be full, and dopes like me refuse to pay for more than one game at a time. There will be no game to reach the numbers of WoW as it is right now, I don't think.
Your numbers are also based on the assumption that anyone that will play mmorpg's already is, and are just shuffling around the market... Much like how SOE seemed to think and still does. Remember before WOW, the MMORPG market had already reached critical mass, no one could beat the heady heights of 500,000 subscriptions, according to the guys that knew everything about this industry.
The only reason I state this, is because when you project 5 million for WOW, you put LOTRO up... But only after subtracting from WOW, which indicates shuffling.
both games are great! I dont think there will be any 1 game to rule them all any time soon. there are tons of games out there and TONS of people to play them. theres really no reason for a "a game thats gonna spell the end for WoW" thread! there are going to be people out there who dislike 1 if not both of the games. whoopty-freakin-doo bazzle! no biggie. To each his/her own
Im a fan right now of lotro because I just really dig the game. I used to dig WoW too but I havent had time to play in a while. I would be as bold as to say that anyone who likes WoW should try playing both games. not that lotro is ripping them off or anything (i mean seriously all mmo's evolve from previous ones) but they are similar games that share great questing, a very user friendly interface and mechanics. IMO... both are clear winners to me
I think alot of MMO companies are getting way too full of themselves. Especially SOE, I still can't figure out where their headed. Back on topic though, I'm not sure if LotRO could overtake alot of other MMO's. It lacks conflict. The fact that you cannot take the side of evil alone makes me go "wow, really!?!" But both are very good games I think in the end.
another "is this going to be the WoW killer?" post / yawn i remember when VG:SoH was suppose to be "the WoW killer!" but where is it now? where is EQ2? at 8+ million subscribers? think not
First off to answer the OP's question, the only thing that can kill WOW is it's own complacency.
Next to the quote above...
Another feeble "WOW has sold 8 Million+ units reply?" Post
/Yawn
I remember that Brittany Spears has sold a hell of allot more than 8 Million units..
Where is she now?
8+ million subscribers? Means nothing to us vets.
You're assertion that units sold in some way equates to quality is not only tired but fruitless.
Honestly some of you people really need a new song because that one is played.
I think alot of MMO companies are getting way too full of themselves. Especially SOE, I still can't figure out where their headed. Back on topic though, I'm not sure if LotRO could overtake alot of other MMO's. It lacks conflict. The fact that you cannot take the side of evil alone makes me go "wow, really!?!" But both are very good games I think in the end.
another "is this going to be the WoW killer?" post / yawn i remember when VG:SoH was suppose to be "the WoW killer!" but where is it now? where is EQ2? at 8+ million subscribers? think not
I think WoW is overrated.. I like it and all but i mean really. Wow is just the perfered game its easy its fun but its stupid arguing about how one game will kill another as long as someone likes a game how can it be dead? I personally like CoH at the moment but you know what one day I might wake up and say hmmmm. I think ill play runescape or i think ill play Everquest 2. Its all on having fun remember guys this is just a game its made for fun not to spend your life playing and missing work today. I dont have a job yet which is why i spend most of my time playing games. Games are for fun JUST REMEMBER THAT!
WoW sucks just like LOTR. Small worlds with shallow quests, catered to the players who don't like to work for something.
I dont have time to 'work' in a game I pay my money so I can have fun. I already get 'worked' by my employer. thats fine you like having a job in a game maybe you have no real life but don't diss games that cater to more casual players I'm sure you go play an asian grinder and have fun working hrs and hrs just to gain a level
I think alot of MMO companies are getting way too full of themselves. Especially SOE, I still can't figure out where their headed. Back on topic though, I'm not sure if LotRO could overtake alot of other MMO's. It lacks conflict. The fact that you cannot take the side of evil alone makes me go "wow, really!?!" But both are very good games I think in the end.
monster play... if thats not taking the side of evil then what is lol no I know what your saying, your main toon cannot be evil. this kinda made me cringe at first as well buuuuuut, when I tried monster play I was very very satisfied. its very new very different and quite a bit o fun
WoW sucks just like LOTR. Small worlds with shallow quests, catered to the players who don't like to work for something. As long as those type of players stay off the game sim playing, ill be happy. I beta'd lotr for a while, and i was stunned on how a companycould screw up 2 huge names, lotr and D&D. turbine should never be allowed ot make games again.
Haha.
The remaining 100 people playing Vanguard probably think you are their hero
...catered to the players who don't like to work for something...
Players who don't want to work for something....... You know, that might be me. I play games to have fun. I work to make money. I do not confuse my MMOs with work.
The day I feel like I'm "working" in a game is the day I quit.
Well I dont believe it should take 30minutes to complete a quets that give out the best rewards in a game. If you prefer that then save your money and play diablo 2. I aint bashing d2, but cmon you should have to work a little harded to get something in a game, that makes achieving something that much sweeter. If you dont have the time, then go play console games or single player games. Save your money.
Look, if you want to argue something at least try to not seem like a complete fool. And like Robin Williams said to Mat Damon, "it's not your fault", "it's not your fault"... that Vanguard didn't bring back that loving feeling.
Seriously, I doubt you have any idea what achieving is all about. Anyone who thinks it's "time based" is an idiot. Achieving is about using smarts and skills, which has nothing to do with the bs companies like Sigil would have you put up with.
Thank god we have Turbine, Blizzard and companies like them who understand what real gamers are looking for.
Comments
No, because to do good some games ahve to take fans from others
But on the topic, I don't think LoTRO is going to be a very big game after long seeing as to the limited PvP, or Monster Play, because as we can see from the huge WoW feedback wanting more PvP...
I think the two top contenders will be WAR and AoC with new MMORPGs
Thought LoTR already has a huge fan base, they may keep a good lot of those people but outside that, with the actual gaming comunity, I think they have lost
EDIT: And anyone who says WoW sucks (I agree it sucks the big one) we are prolly not hardcore PvEers, because it is a PvEers dream, which is obvious due to the 8million or however many there are subscribers... The amount of subscribers doesnt make it a good game though, the person does. If they like it its good if not it isn't, it's obviously an opinion, theres no factual "it sucks" or "it rocks"
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
By the end of 2008, the top games in the MMO market will be(# of subscribers)...1. WoW 2. LotRO 3. WAR 4. AoC
just a prediction WoW- 9 mill. LotRO- 1.5 mill WAR- 900k AoC-750k all just guesses, no hard #'s to back anything
Those are some really big numbers...I hope you are right.
Those are some really big numbers...I hope you are right.
yea, I went a bit high, but doesnt WoW have 7 or so mill now? Whats next as far as numbers, right now? GW has 1 mill maybe but not true 14.99 a month kinda deal.
The reason you see these posts is that 3 years ago you had around 500k MMORPG subscribers worldwide (not counting Asia). Today you have 8mil +. I bet you around 80% of todays MMORPG subscribers had never played another MMORPG before they got sucked into WoW. Now whenever these MMORPG first timers see a new MMORPG they will all go OMFWTFBBQ it's just like WoW!!! And they are right, but fail to realise that WoW is "just" like the games before it - UO, EQ, AO, AC etc etc. (Old story, been told a million times by now).
WoW is in many regards the epitome of 2nd generation MMOPRPGs (the 1st generaion is in my book MUDs. we have yet to see a 3rd), the tried and true of everything that went before it. It would be stupid to throw all that on the floor when developing a new MMORPG (which is a very costly affair), unless of cause you are hell bent on risking your skin trying to do something different. There are few games out there pushing the genre, and even less succeding. But I think (hope) that we'll see more and more games pushing the bounderies of MMORPGs as subscribers get tired of the same old mechanics in new clothing.
Btw. this should not be seen as a WoW bashing post, as I have played it happily for 1½ years. But it does annoy me when every new MMORPG is reduced to being "just another WoW clone", as if WoW itself was the original.
/D
8 mill counting with asia, without will be about 3 millions.Your numbers are also based on the assumption that anyone that will play mmorpg's already is, and are just shuffling around the market... Much like how SOE seemed to think and still does. Remember before WOW, the MMORPG market had already reached critical mass, no one could beat the heady heights of 500,000 subscriptions, according to the guys that knew everything about this industry.
The only reason I state this, is because when you project 5 million for WOW, you put LOTRO up... But only after subtracting from WOW, which indicates shuffling. Shuffling will occur, but the market will also gain folks that are totally new to the style of game delivery... How else do you think WOW made its money?
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
Your numbers are also based on the assumption that anyone that will play mmorpg's already is, and are just shuffling around the market... Much like how SOE seemed to think and still does. Remember before WOW, the MMORPG market had already reached critical mass, no one could beat the heady heights of 500,000 subscriptions, according to the guys that knew everything about this industry.
The only reason I state this, is because when you project 5 million for WOW, you put LOTRO up... But only after subtracting from WOW, which indicates shuffling.
good point, nice discussion as well.
seriously folks... calm urselves haha
both games are great! I dont think there will be any 1 game to rule them all any time soon. there are tons of games out there and TONS of people to play them. theres really no reason for a "a game thats gonna spell the end for WoW" thread! there are going to be people out there who dislike 1 if not both of the games. whoopty-freakin-doo bazzle! no biggie. To each his/her own
Im a fan right now of lotro because I just really dig the game. I used to dig WoW too but I havent had time to play in a while. I would be as bold as to say that anyone who likes WoW should try playing both games. not that lotro is ripping them off or anything (i mean seriously all mmo's evolve from previous ones) but they are similar games that share great questing, a very user friendly interface and mechanics. IMO... both are clear winners to me
L2 has over 20 million right now
EQ had over 1.2 million before WoW
Granted that L2 has less then 1 million people in America playing their game
And WoW expantion sold 2.5 million in one day in the US
The market for mmorpg is not yea at its cap as more people join it every day
WoW did bring a huge number of players to MMORPG but sadly their first game was WoW
MMORPG normally lose people if their game becomes stale , they charge players for updates that sould be free and if a new game comes out.
companies believe that just putting a product out will have people running to their game, Ceaters feel making a great game is its own reward.
I think alot of MMO companies are getting way too full of themselves. Especially SOE, I still can't figure out where their headed. Back on topic though, I'm not sure if LotRO could overtake alot of other MMO's. It lacks conflict. The fact that you cannot take the side of evil alone makes me go "wow, really!?!" But both are very good games I think in the end.
Next to the quote above...
Another feeble "WOW has sold 8 Million+ units reply?" Post
/Yawn
I remember that Brittany Spears has sold a hell of allot more than 8 Million units..
Where is she now?
8+ million subscribers? Means nothing to us vets.
You're assertion that units sold in some way equates to quality is not only tired but fruitless.
Honestly some of you people really need a new song because that one is played.
Hmmm...Kinda Like Brittany Spears.
Dutchess Zarraa Voltayre
Reborn/Zero Sum/Ancient Legacy/Jagged Legion/Feared/Nuke & Pave.
www.eternalempire.net/forum/phpBB2/album_cat.php
You can play evil side and go kill hobbits yes.
It looks like a fun game, but it is not native to MacOS so I'll be sticking with WoW.
who me ?
My opinion matters to everyone...
J. B.
I dont have time to 'work' in a game I pay my money so I can have fun. I already get 'worked' by my employer. thats fine you like having a job in a game maybe you have no real life but don't diss games that cater to more casual players I'm sure you go play an asian grinder and have fun working hrs and hrs just to gain a level
monster play... if thats not taking the side of evil then what is lol no I know what your saying, your main toon cannot be evil. this kinda made me cringe at first as well buuuuuut, when I tried monster play I was very very satisfied. its very new very different and quite a bit o fun
cheers
The remaining 100 people playing Vanguard probably think you are their hero
Players who don't want to work for something....... You know, that might be me. I play games to have fun. I work to make money. I do not confuse my MMOs with work.
The day I feel like I'm "working" in a game is the day I quit.
Well I dont believe it should take 30minutes to complete a quets that give out the best rewards in a game. If you prefer that then save your money and play diablo 2. I aint bashing d2, but cmon you should have to work a little harded to get something in a game, that makes achieving something that much sweeter. If you dont have the time, then go play console games or single player games. Save your money.
Look, if you want to argue something at least try to not seem like a complete fool. And like Robin Williams said to Mat Damon, "it's not your fault", "it's not your fault"... that Vanguard didn't bring back that loving feeling.
Seriously, I doubt you have any idea what achieving is all about. Anyone who thinks it's "time based" is an idiot. Achieving is about using smarts and skills, which has nothing to do with the bs companies like Sigil would have you put up with.
Thank god we have Turbine, Blizzard and companies like them who understand what real gamers are looking for.
Cheers