This is from a current designer from VG, namely Nino, posted on a guild site, someone linked it to me:
"I'm not in charge of the Test Server, but I am thinking of making that my home so I can help prevent mistakes from hitting the live servers. Plus I will have GM powers there so I can /nuke people. I play on the FFA PVP server and I am glad I can't use GM powers there. So many jackholes I would have dropped off a cliff by now. Legions of ganking dorks; but I digress."
How unprofessional is this company really talking about their customers like that. Lol, I have lost all respect for these people or "brad" for that matter. It sounds so amateur'ish to me.
Wow, I completely respect that. I want to be in that GM's guild. Wish more Gm's or Devs would just put some of these friggin idiots in there places.
You would complain if the GM focused is wrath on you.
I dont want a GM to put anyone in their place, their personal feelings arent an issue. If it is a real GM, he covered his ass because he said he uses his powers on a test server, who knows......... Maybe you will be lucky enough to group with him, i bet his butt takes like ice cream since you are foaming at the mouth as i type this.
It's not like Nino is the first, or last, dev that's come out and said, "hey, some of our players are asshats.". Compared to some of the things I've heard some devs say on their respective games official forums, Nino's jackhole comment, on a private forum, is pretty tame by comparison. Thunderheart's, or whichever one it was, rant on the SWG forums comes to mind. Though, taken in context, I think what he said was perfectly warranted.
I think some people are of the misguided belief that the customer is always right, and that their $14.99 a month extends beyond being able to log in and play a game, to having the developers as their personal lapdogs.
I don't care how bad any MMO is hurting for customers, some of them by their actions, ingame or out, will cost the company more money in the long run, than they would lose by just telling them to take their fifteen bucks, and fuck off back to Dixie.
Originally posted by Sceptix Originally posted by ste2000 Originally posted by Sceptix Originally posted by ste2000 I would offer this Nino a big pint of beer if I had a chance You take this things too seriously guys. Companies don't like customers, they might smile in your face but quickly they show you the middle fingers as soon as you turn your back. They just want your money, get it? That s a fact of life, get over it.
This man speaks the truth, he is wise beyond his 13 years. Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult.
drugs and hookers? legally? Where do you live, and do they have an extradition treaty with the US?
This is one of the most difficult parts of working in this sort of industry: professionalism.
I, for example, generally try to post my personal thoughts and opinions in a very orderly, efficient, respectful manner. However, everyone has those moments where they just let the world get to them. Speaking from personal experience, I have to be careful of what I say when I post, as does Nino, but sometimes we just slip up and go into a rage. It can be very frustrating. There are a LOT of times when I'm on the forums and I see something so irrefutably retarded, that I just want to flame the person into oblivion. While it's happened once or twice, and I honestly don't even regret it, we generally moderate ourselves pretty efficiently.
I can't fault Nino here for being discontent. Sometimes, the truth isn't always pretty. While it is disrespectful and unprofessional, it happens. However, try to consider how you'd react if you were surrounded by people all the time, sometimes posting things deliberately to get under your skin/make your job more difficult. Any of you who have ever worked customer service of any kind know how frustrating it gets if you have 1 or 2 unreasonable people in a day...imagine having several hundred.
Plus, I generally believe it's better to associate with the community. I think that it makes your opinions, reviews, previews, and other such things that much more credible, because instead of hiding from those who disagree with you, you're tackling them head on.
I look at this board for example. I express a lot of criticism regarding the game, Sigil, Brad, and many other aspects associated with Vanguard. As a result, I've acquired quite a few people who I'm sure consider me the devil, an ignorant fool, and many other unfriendly expletives. However, I think there's also a group of people here who respect my opinion that much more, take what I have to say at a higher level, and believe my word carries more weight with it then others. It's a double-edged sword; do you speak your mind openly and honestly, and in turn risk offending people, or do you choose to say nothing at all, and seem distant from your community?
Just my thoughts on the matter.
/Amen
Glad to see a staff writer here stand up for what he believes when many on this site have such hatred for the game and the people involved.
Originally posted by Sceptix Originally posted by Coldmeat
Originally posted by Sceptix
Originally posted by ste2000
Originally posted by Sceptix
Originally posted by ste2000 I would offer this Nino a big pint of beer if I had a chance You take this things too seriously guys. Companies don't like customers, they might smile in your face but quickly they show you the middle fingers as soon as you turn your back. They just want your money, get it? That s a fact of life, get over it.
This man speaks the truth, he is wise beyond his 13 years. Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult. drugs and hookers? legally? Where do you live, and do they have an extradition treaty with the US? Im not at liberty to discuss..... they could be watching me right now......
Nino's comments sound like humor to me. He's expressing in a backhanded way his player desire to obliterate those that irritate him, and also expressing something like gratitude or relief that he is not capable of giving in to the temptation to do so in a dishonorable way. The only other two options were keeping silent or insincerely flattering those he considers dorks and jackholes. Neither silence nor insincere flattery are very effective PR methods in this community of shared interest.
It's not like Nino is the first, or last, dev that's come out and said, "hey, some of our players are asshats.". Compared to some of the things I've heard some devs say on their respective games official forums, Nino's jackhole comment, on a private forum, is pretty tame by comparison. Thunderheart's, or whichever one it was, rant on the SWG forums comes to mind. Though, taken in context, I think what he said was perfectly warranted. I think some people are of the misguided belief that the customer is always right, and that their $14.99 a month extends beyond being able to log in and play a game, to having the developers as their personal lapdogs. I don't care how bad any MMO is hurting for customers, some of them by their actions, ingame or out, will cost the company more money in the long run, than they would lose by just telling them to take their fifteen bucks, and fuck off back to Dixie.
It isn't that customers aren't always right. It isn't that customers need to understand that developers are people too. It's the fact that customers DO believe they're always right and they don't care that developers are people too.
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
none of you guys find it ironic that a designer of this game is essentially complaining that the game developed promotes the style of play that would encourage the type of behaviors he doesnt like.
Originally posted by sepher Originally posted by Coldmeat It's not like Nino is the first, or last, dev that's come out and said, "hey, some of our players are asshats.". Compared to some of the things I've heard some devs say on their respective games official forums, Nino's jackhole comment, on a private forum, is pretty tame by comparison. Thunderheart's, or whichever one it was, rant on the SWG forums comes to mind. Though, taken in context, I think what he said was perfectly warranted. I think some people are of the misguided belief that the customer is always right, and that their $14.99 a month extends beyond being able to log in and play a game, to having the developers as their personal lapdogs. I don't care how bad any MMO is hurting for customers, some of them by their actions, ingame or out, will cost the company more money in the long run, than they would lose by just telling them to take their fifteen bucks, and fuck off back to Dixie.
It isn't that customers aren't always right. It isn't that customers need to understand that developers are people too. It's the fact that customers DO believe they're always right and they don't care that developers are people too.
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
Most of the people I've seen getting their panties in a wad over this are the ones that hate the game anyway. It's a tempest in a teapot.
Might not have been the best move on his part as it gives a bit more ammo to the legions of people who have nothing better to do with their time than waste it coming up with conspiracy theories about how SOE is out to get them.
But I don't forsee their playerbase making a mass exodus over this.
Originally posted by Coldmeat It's not like Nino is the first, or last, dev that's come out and said, "hey, some of our players are asshats.". Compared to some of the things I've heard some devs say on their respective games official forums, Nino's jackhole comment, on a private forum, is pretty tame by comparison. Thunderheart's, or whichever one it was, rant on the SWG forums comes to mind. Though, taken in context, I think what he said was perfectly warranted.
I think some people are of the misguided belief that the customer is always right, and that their $14.99 a month extends beyond being able to log in and play a game, to having the developers as their personal lapdogs.
I don't care how bad any MMO is hurting for customers, some of them by their actions, ingame or out, will cost the company more money in the long run, than they would lose by just telling them to take their fifteen bucks, and fuck off back to Dixie.
It isn't that customers aren't always right. It isn't that customers need to understand that developers are people too. It's the fact that customers DO believe they're always right and they don't care that developers are people too.
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
Most of the people I've seen getting their panties in a wad over this are the ones that hate the game anyway. It's a tempest in a teapot.
Might not have been the best move on his part as it gives a bit more ammo to the legions of people who have nothing better to do with their time than waste it coming up with conspiracy theories about how SOE is out to get them.
But I don't forsee their playerbase making a mass exodus over this.
Nope, but even a single player alienated or a single post like this created isn't good. When it happens multiple times, it becomes a pattern. If that pattern becomes typical behavior it's etched in Sigil history and stains reputation, with it's consequences.
All I'm saying is, on a business level it's best to avoid it no matter how you attempt to justify it. No need to spin the issue as some kind of Nino taking up a spear against the 'haters'. It's best if no one knows Nino in such a way at all rather than a scenario be presented where one side likes him and what he said, and one side doesn't. The former scenario is neutral and no one effected, the latter splits no matter if it's 9,999 in favor of Nino and 1 discontented by such posts.
It's just common sense, it's best to remain neutral or anonymous in your identity as a player rather than say anything that can draw any kind of lines; creating discontent on one side and content on the other. It isn't about who is RIGHT in this thread it's the mere fact that divides like this do happen. It isn't about poising this little insignificant matter as something that could create an exodus, it's just about saying we could do without these matters all together and any avenues that allow them.
You can still be a company that encourages close relations with players on all levels of development; but that's a professional decision, because ultimately it's a move to aid your game and it's players. So responsibilities come with it; like never mentioning where you can and can't cause judgment day with a slash command, your ill-disposition towards a certain sect of players, and other loose-lipped things.
On another note, that is the guy's guild forum. But because of the developer's have so very often used it as a conduit to exclusively discuss some of the more relevant things about the game, like the whole recent 100,000k debacle, it's my opinion that they really should start treating it and any other place obviously attracting consumer attention as an affiliate site, or otherwise a place demanding of professionalism.
It's just a tip. I'm thick-skinned, I could care less what's said. But I can diagnose the issue beyond "I LIKE NINO" or "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT GUY?" and see that it's best if such thoughts were never spawned in the first place.
Comments
You would complain if the GM focused is wrath on you.
I dont want a GM to put anyone in their place, their personal feelings arent an issue. If it is a real GM, he covered his ass because he said he uses his powers on a test server, who knows......... Maybe you will be lucky enough to group with him, i bet his butt takes like ice cream since you are foaming at the mouth as i type this.
You take this things too seriously guys.
Companies don't like customers, they might smile in your face but quickly they show you the middle fingers as soon as you turn your back.
They just want your money, get it?
That s a fact of life, get over it.
Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
It's not like Nino is the first, or last, dev that's come out and said, "hey, some of our players are asshats.". Compared to some of the things I've heard some devs say on their respective games official forums, Nino's jackhole comment, on a private forum, is pretty tame by comparison. Thunderheart's, or whichever one it was, rant on the SWG forums comes to mind. Though, taken in context, I think what he said was perfectly warranted.
I think some people are of the misguided belief that the customer is always right, and that their $14.99 a month extends beyond being able to log in and play a game, to having the developers as their personal lapdogs.
I don't care how bad any MMO is hurting for customers, some of them by their actions, ingame or out, will cost the company more money in the long run, than they would lose by just telling them to take their fifteen bucks, and fuck off back to Dixie.
Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult.
Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult.
drugs and hookers? legally? Where do you live, and do they have an extradition treaty with the US?
Glad to see a staff writer here stand up for what he believes when many on this site have such hatred for the game and the people involved.
Peace
Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult.
drugs and hookers? legally? Where do you live, and do they have an extradition treaty with the US?
Im not at liberty to discuss..... they could be watching me right now......
Ahhh, gotcha. They are a crafty lot, aren't they?
Nino's comments sound like humor to me. He's expressing in a backhanded way his player desire to obliterate those that irritate him, and also expressing something like gratitude or relief that he is not capable of giving in to the temptation to do so in a dishonorable way. The only other two options were keeping silent or insincerely flattering those he considers dorks and jackholes. Neither silence nor insincere flattery are very effective PR methods in this community of shared interest.
Too bad Sigil can't award permanent titles to players like, "Jackhole" and "Dork". Just think of their reaction when they log in.......
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
Yes I agree, I always though it was better being wise as a kid than being stupid as an adult, we agree on this old man
Well at least i can drink, do drugs, and get hookers legally young man since im an adult. Ohhhhhh.........what a bad boy you are, I am impressed
That's the most funny thing you ever said, I almost laughed..........
none of you guys find it ironic that a designer of this game is essentially complaining that the game developed promotes the style of play that would encourage the type of behaviors he doesnt like.
...........................................
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
Most of the people I've seen getting their panties in a wad over this are the ones that hate the game anyway. It's a tempest in a teapot.
Might not have been the best move on his part as it gives a bit more ammo to the legions of people who have nothing better to do with their time than waste it coming up with conspiracy theories about how SOE is out to get them.
But I don't forsee their playerbase making a mass exodus over this.
Of course that's not everyone, but so long as its some, you chance to alienate some people and prompt threads like this to be started when you could've just shut your mouth. I get the whole human fallacy thing when it comes to being professional 100% of the time, and it's perfectly understandable, maybe even average and typical. But a fallacy is a fallacy.
All I'm saying is, even if a sect of gamers see justice or openness in it all, or believe a 'veil' of professionalism is pretty much bull, threads like this are the result. It's just best to leave no room for suspicion or dissatisfaction at all. No matter who is right and who is wrong.
Most of the people I've seen getting their panties in a wad over this are the ones that hate the game anyway. It's a tempest in a teapot.
Might not have been the best move on his part as it gives a bit more ammo to the legions of people who have nothing better to do with their time than waste it coming up with conspiracy theories about how SOE is out to get them.
But I don't forsee their playerbase making a mass exodus over this.
Nope, but even a single player alienated or a single post like this created isn't good. When it happens multiple times, it becomes a pattern. If that pattern becomes typical behavior it's etched in Sigil history and stains reputation, with it's consequences.All I'm saying is, on a business level it's best to avoid it no matter how you attempt to justify it. No need to spin the issue as some kind of Nino taking up a spear against the 'haters'. It's best if no one knows Nino in such a way at all rather than a scenario be presented where one side likes him and what he said, and one side doesn't. The former scenario is neutral and no one effected, the latter splits no matter if it's 9,999 in favor of Nino and 1 discontented by such posts.
It's just common sense, it's best to remain neutral or anonymous in your identity as a player rather than say anything that can draw any kind of lines; creating discontent on one side and content on the other. It isn't about who is RIGHT in this thread it's the mere fact that divides like this do happen. It isn't about poising this little insignificant matter as something that could create an exodus, it's just about saying we could do without these matters all together and any avenues that allow them.
You can still be a company that encourages close relations with players on all levels of development; but that's a professional decision, because ultimately it's a move to aid your game and it's players. So responsibilities come with it; like never mentioning where you can and can't cause judgment day with a slash command, your ill-disposition towards a certain sect of players, and other loose-lipped things.
On another note, that is the guy's guild forum. But because of the developer's have so very often used it as a conduit to exclusively discuss some of the more relevant things about the game, like the whole recent 100,000k debacle, it's my opinion that they really should start treating it and any other place obviously attracting consumer attention as an affiliate site, or otherwise a place demanding of professionalism.
It's just a tip. I'm thick-skinned, I could care less what's said. But I can diagnose the issue beyond "I LIKE NINO" or "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT GUY?" and see that it's best if such thoughts were never spawned in the first place.