As long as same people run SoE I will hate em, bash em, flame em and spit on them. I don't care if they make best f*cking MMO of all times that I would want to play for the rest of my life - I will not go back to the after how they played me in SWG. How can I ever trust em again? For 3 years playing there game only to be stabbed in the back. And yes... Everything they touch turns in to shit.
Every time I read your post, I die a little inside...
It's funny reading people say that SOE has a dominaring hold over SWG and LA.
If this was true though, why must everything go through LA before it can be put in game? Why are the Devs not allowed to post about stuff without LA's approval first? Why do any interviews being done about the game have to go through LA rather then SOE? Why must SOE go through the same process to even talk about the game in the official SOE podcast? Why is is up to LA to decide whether SOE is allowed to make an official SWG only podcast?
This is all stuff that has been openly admitted to.
So hey- if I ever get diagnosed with a terminal illness; san diego here I come. I'd also head over to Blizzard smash the WoW servers just for the hell of it- it'd be funny to have that many millions of people want to kill you.
I'm pretty sure that threats like this are against most forum rules.
Everyone always talks about the horrible EQ2 release. For the most part they are really making stuff up. EQ2 had an extremely smooth release. There were not a lot of crashes, I didn't crash once, some did but not a lot. There were not a lot of bugs. At release there was some balancing but not a lot. There was a memory leak. The economy was not ruined, it was actually quite good. Overall EQ2 had one of the best releases.
The release was not smooth, there were plenty of documented issues, and the memory leak was still there more than a year after launch. I can assure you I am not making these issues up.
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
While the game ran smooth and well, they misjudged the market. The product they had was not attracting the numbers that they wanted. So they changed the game, redid class balancing, mellee, and crafting to try and cater to a wider audience. They paniced when they didn't bring in the numbers. Again not because the release was bad, or the product was sub par, but because not enough people found their product entertaining enough compared to what was out in another month.
The game did not run smooth and well. With well above the recommended system requirements, the game lagged like it was going out of style, and various zones... especially TS... crashed every few hours. I tried 3 different servers, each had the same issues to various degree.
The game did attract a lot of players at first. They had to open more servers within a few weeks of launch to lighten the load. The combat, crafting, and class systems were changed multiple times during my experience with EQ2. It seemed every few months, they would completely rework something and screw over a good portion of the player base. Typical SoE development cycle.
And the product launched in better condition than it was a couple of months later. Once they performed the first adjustment of mob difficulty, the game lost a lot of its flare. It was all down hill from there.
In all fairness, however, I have heard from a friend of mine who still plays EQ2 that it isn't nearly as bad as it was 6 months ago... so perhaps SoE finally got it right with the last expansion.
The release was not smooth, there were plenty of documented issues, and the memory leak was still there more than a year after launch. I can assure you I am not making these issues up. The game did not run smooth and well. With well above the recommended system requirements, the game lagged like it was going out of style, and various zones... especially TS... crashed every few hours. I tried 3 different servers, each had the same issues to various degree. The game did attract a lot of players at first. They had to open more servers within a few weeks of launch to lighten the load. The combat, crafting, and class systems were changed multiple times during my experience with EQ2. It seemed every few months, they would completely rework something and screw over a good portion of the player base. Typical SoE development cycle. And the product launched in better condition than it was a couple of months later. Once they performed the first adjustment of mob difficulty, the game lost a lot of its flare. It was all down hill from there. In all fairness, however, I have heard from a friend of mine who still plays EQ2 that it isn't nearly as bad as it was 6 months ago... so perhaps SoE finally got it right with the last expansion. Only took them 2.5 years to do it.
Imo eq2 was a smooth release. I played from release for about a year. I was on runnyeye (the largest server) and ts never crashed every 3 hour. I remember a dungeon in ts that did alot on one day. Most days i can't remember crashing.
Last time i went back to the game most of my guild said they loved all the changes. There's nothing wrong with reworking the game.
Originally posted by godpuppet ahem... To identify two of your points...
LA has been labeled as a cause to the NGE, the issue has been discussed and rediscussed. But at the end of the day Sony is responsible for making those changes, more time and effort could have been made to further ensure the NGE was smooth and that the games features met the players demands. Instead what you had was a stealth patch which durastically changed the nature of a game, changed peoples classes and further more, they did it without announcing its full changes and did it just before the pre-orders for obi wan expansions.
Those changes were done at the request of Lucas Arts. The changes were coming whether you liked them or not and irregardless of any community input because Lucas Arts wanted them. So after a long time of not having anything to do with SWG, suddenly Lucas Arts decides they want more control over a game that uses their IP. So what happens is that SOE has no recourse but to go along with LA. Lucas Arts has the legal right to pull their IP licensing deal with SOE if LA feel they do not like the current state of the game.
In conclusion I feel that your own conclusion that SOE just steam rolled over changes is flat out wrong IMHO. SOE had no real power to prevent the changes requested by the LA who in fact wanted to change the very nature of the game to meet their own profit and marketing expectations. As well as to stay current with the market trends for a MMO that used their IP.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
I've played EQ, PS, and EQ2 for some time. SOE does deserve some of its bashing (customer service, listening to its fan-base), but I think it's simply become the cool thing to do.
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
I've played EQ, PS, and EQ2 for some time. SOE does deserve some of its bashing (customer service, listening to its fan-base), but I think it's simply become the cool thing to do.
Hey... I wish SoE wasn't so horrible... I'd rather love 'em. I left a lot of friends when I quite EQ2, but I couldn't take the BS any longer.
There still seem to be people willing to make excuses for SOE's past actions. They are the ones that don't think. When Smedley ridicules the players who were alienated by the SWG changes, and SOE again and again keeps changing fundamental design aspects of every game they are involved with after gamers have bought a product and invested time in a product based on it's original design, that should be clear indication to anyone with any sense to stay away from their products.
Please this is a totally false statement
EQ2 ,EQ1 and planetside all underwent some changes like ALL mmorpg(if u doubt that there a single mmorpg without a change name one popular mmorpg and i tell you changes).
However,none of those went thru any fundamental changes or even radical ones and this are the only true SoE products.The changes in EQ2 which i suppose had the msot changes actually was to make the game better which most agree such as remove group debt and increase soloing ability.Certainly not fundamental way the game is been play!
Others are SWG a joint venture,vanguard which is sigil development and MxO which was bought over as part of a deal.
Get the facts straight please.
If SOE made games better, then their subscriptions numbers would reflect that. The sad reality is that SOE does not make a game better. EQ, EQ2, Planetside, Vanguard or SWG would be a massive success. Instead they are considered "niche" games that every 6 motnhs have to consolidate servers.
There still seem to be people willing to make excuses for SOE's past actions. They are the ones that don't think. When Smedley ridicules the players who were alienated by the SWG changes, and SOE again and again keeps changing fundamental design aspects of every game they are involved with after gamers have bought a product and invested time in a product based on it's original design, that should be clear indication to anyone with any sense to stay away from their products.
Please this is a totally false statement EQ2 ,EQ1 and planetside all underwent some changes like ALL mmorpg(if u doubt that there a single mmorpg without a change name one popular mmorpg and i tell you changes). However,none of those went thru any fundamental changes or even radical ones and this are the only true SoE products.The changes in EQ2 which i suppose had the msot changes actually was to make the game better which most agree such as remove group debt and increase soloing ability.Certainly not fundamental way the game is been play! Others are SWG a joint venture,vanguard which is sigil development and MxO which was bought over as part of a deal. Get the facts straight please.
If SOE made games better, then their subscriptions numbers would reflect that. The sad reality is that SOE does not make a game better. EQ, EQ2, Planetside, Vanguard or SWG would be a massive success. Instead they are considered "niche" games that every 6 motnhs have to consolidate servers.
Here is an example of rabid SOE-Hater zealot folks. Despite being told that Vangaurd was not developed by SOE and that SWG was a join venture the SOE-hater zealot continues to restate these fallacies over and over again. It is as if repeating them would somehow make them true.
P.S. I will admit that EQ2 was a steaming pile of poo at launch in terms of performance and it's game play issues. I will also give SOE credit though for doing an about face with EQ2 and addressing many issues in EQ2 and bringing it up to par with many top end MMO's.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
Well, you can commend SOE for doing an about face. I will ridicule them for realizing the error of their ways 5 years too late.
Wait, they have not realized the error of their ways. They continue to jack up prices. Raising prices punishes the loyal players that were with the game from day one.
In addition SOE sells their games with all the expansions for dirt cheap. That is another slap in the face for each original player that payed for every single stand alone box.
Why continue to pay money to a company that does not respect its loyal customers? I will never purchase a game that has anything to do with SOE.
That is saying a lot because I used to work for SOE as a tester before they plunged into PC games.
Just read some of Smedley's posts, the man is truely delusional. No wonder people bash SOE.
I have to agree the Vanguard lead designer is way over his head. He really has not a clue what he is doing. But they lost funding and SOE came in and funded them with the provision that the game would be published. So part of the blame rests on SOE shoulders.
EQ2 launch was changed by SOE to be before WOW, not the other way around.
At launch EQ2 had serious problems, it ran only marginally on my mid range system. It was not ready for play yet, just like Vanguard. It had alot of issues and was extremely solo unfriendly. Took them two years to get EQ2 right, it is not a bad game now.
Go read Ralph Kostner's site sometime, It was the SOE suits that made them do the NGE changes, the dev team was told to shut up and do it or quit. Ralph also told the suits at SOE that NGE was not ready when it was implemented, but was told to put it in or else. If you notice Ralph does not lay the blame on LA even though they contributed to this.
I think Sony could fire the entire management staff at SOE and their stock would go up. They are that detested.
The problem with SOE these days, they have a multitude of MMO's to support and keep throwing money at more of them hoping to find a winner. All this does is overload the support staff. While on the other hand blizzard has to support one game.
That's all that is left after they screwed over all their customers and made their games suck.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Wow first of all you are claiming nonsense when there are way many more reports on the poor design of eq2 on release, the poor engine design the poor performance has alot to do with the game being unfinished if you want to live in a state of denial thats your choice but get your facts straight.
That is ironic when your jumping to conclusions yourself you have no idea how many games we experienced with soe, there are plenty of constructive posts about peoples experience with soe and you want to say its made up? LOL I highly doubt these experiences explained in detail is made up ive played since eq1 and watched soe turn into another greedy big money cooperation releasing expansion after expansion making the games less and less fun unless you spend more money come on dude its time to wake up.
Wow omg just wow, yea it was soe's choice to release the game with lots and lots of bugs this makes so much sense, atleast sigil was trying to make the game fun and they just did not realize how much money it was going to cost them in the long run. If you where devleloping a game and knew you would not have the money to keep up the project then all of your effort, time, and money is wasted you would sell to bud what choice did they have?
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by Battleship Originally posted by hercules Do people think anymore of just go SoE bashing
Yep! I pretty much just SOE bash!
That's all that is left after they screwed over all their customers and made their games suck.
Amen to that. They're the only company that I've ever seen hate the players as much as they do and still make money. For me I guess, I'd just had enough of getting screwed by them from EQ, Planetside, and finally SWG. I won't play any of their other games ever. To the OP and SOE Lovers, Just because some of you have a higher tolerance for getting your sand pounded doesn't mean the people who've had it must shut up about it.
So I guess everyone else is wrong about there experiences and your right because you claim to have none of these issues? Think about it look at all the people who have had the run around with soe, and believe me if they would have finished the game alot more at release it had alot of issues and by the way look at the huge class revamps since release they constantly do this because they did not do it right in the first place if they would of actually tested things out correctly then it would have been atleast half way better but soe does not test right they test lazy.
Originally posted by Angelbound So I guess everyone else is wrong about your experiences and your right because you claim to have none of these issues? Think about it look at all the people who have had the run around with soe, and believe me they would have finished the game alot more at release it had alot of issues and btw look at the huge class revamps since release they constantly do this because they did not do it right in the first place if they would of actually tested things out correctly then it would have been atleast half way better but soe does not test right they test lazily.
Huh?
If this post was directed at me then don't bother.... 1) I can't understand a damn thing you're typing (Run on sentences anyone?) 2) Sounds like you hate SOE too. In that case you're preaching to the choir. 3) Huh?
Well said I agree on most points but you must understand that experience and speculation are 2 differant things completely and my experiences have proven to me soe is just greedy and do not care about the fun factor of there games nor there customers for that matter, and the last thing you said not everyone is but we do still slip once and a while.
Comments
It's funny reading people say that SOE has a dominaring hold over SWG and LA.
If this was true though, why must everything go through LA before it can be put in game? Why are the Devs not allowed to post about stuff without LA's approval first? Why do any interviews being done about the game have to go through LA rather then SOE? Why must SOE go through the same process to even talk about the game in the official SOE podcast? Why is is up to LA to decide whether SOE is allowed to make an official SWG only podcast?
This is all stuff that has been openly admitted to.
I'm pretty sure that threats like this are against most forum rules.
The release was not smooth, there were plenty of documented issues, and the memory leak was still there more than a year after launch. I can assure you I am not making these issues up.
The game did not run smooth and well. With well above the recommended system requirements, the game lagged like it was going out of style, and various zones... especially TS... crashed every few hours. I tried 3 different servers, each had the same issues to various degree.
The game did attract a lot of players at first. They had to open more servers within a few weeks of launch to lighten the load. The combat, crafting, and class systems were changed multiple times during my experience with EQ2. It seemed every few months, they would completely rework something and screw over a good portion of the player base. Typical SoE development cycle.
And the product launched in better condition than it was a couple of months later. Once they performed the first adjustment of mob difficulty, the game lost a lot of its flare. It was all down hill from there.
In all fairness, however, I have heard from a friend of mine who still plays EQ2 that it isn't nearly as bad as it was 6 months ago... so perhaps SoE finally got it right with the last expansion.
Only took them 2.5 years to do it.
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Support Independent Game Developers
Imo eq2 was a smooth release. I played from release for about a year. I was on runnyeye (the largest server) and ts never crashed every 3 hour. I remember a dungeon in ts that did alot on one day. Most days i can't remember crashing.
Last time i went back to the game most of my guild said they loved all the changes. There's nothing wrong with reworking the game.
Those changes were done at the request of Lucas Arts. The changes were coming whether you liked them or not and irregardless of any community input because Lucas Arts wanted them. So after a long time of not having anything to do with SWG, suddenly Lucas Arts decides they want more control over a game that uses their IP. So what happens is that SOE has no recourse but to go along with LA. Lucas Arts has the legal right to pull their IP licensing deal with SOE if LA feel they do not like the current state of the game.
In conclusion I feel that your own conclusion that SOE just steam rolled over changes is flat out wrong IMHO. SOE had no real power to prevent the changes requested by the LA who in fact wanted to change the very nature of the game to meet their own profit and marketing expectations. As well as to stay current with the market trends for a MMO that used their IP.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
Game(s) I Am Currently Playing:
GW2 (+LoL and BF3)
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
Yep! I pretty much just SOE bash!
- - - -
Support Independent Game Developers
Please this is a totally false statement
EQ2 ,EQ1 and planetside all underwent some changes like ALL mmorpg(if u doubt that there a single mmorpg without a change name one popular mmorpg and i tell you changes).
However,none of those went thru any fundamental changes or even radical ones and this are the only true SoE products.The changes in EQ2 which i suppose had the msot changes actually was to make the game better which most agree such as remove group debt and increase soloing ability.Certainly not fundamental way the game is been play!
Others are SWG a joint venture,vanguard which is sigil development and MxO which was bought over as part of a deal.
Get the facts straight please.
If SOE made games better, then their subscriptions numbers would reflect that. The sad reality is that SOE does not make a game better. EQ, EQ2, Planetside, Vanguard or SWG would be a massive success. Instead they are considered "niche" games that every 6 motnhs have to consolidate servers.Here is an example of rabid SOE-Hater zealot folks. Despite being told that Vangaurd was not developed by SOE and that SWG was a join venture the SOE-hater zealot continues to restate these fallacies over and over again. It is as if repeating them would somehow make them true.
P.S. I will admit that EQ2 was a steaming pile of poo at launch in terms of performance and it's game play issues. I will also give SOE credit though for doing an about face with EQ2 and addressing many issues in EQ2 and bringing it up to par with many top end MMO's.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
Game(s) I Am Currently Playing:
GW2 (+LoL and BF3)
Wait, they have not realized the error of their ways. They continue to jack up prices. Raising prices punishes the loyal players that were with the game from day one.
In addition SOE sells their games with all the expansions for dirt cheap. That is another slap in the face for each original player that payed for every single stand alone box.
Why continue to pay money to a company that does not respect its loyal customers? I will never purchase a game that has anything to do with SOE.
That is saying a lot because I used to work for SOE as a tester before they plunged into PC games.
Just read some of Smedley's posts, the man is truely delusional. No wonder people bash SOE.
I have to agree the Vanguard lead designer is way over his head. He really has not a clue what he is doing. But they lost funding and SOE came in and funded them with the provision that the game would be published. So part of the blame rests on SOE shoulders.
EQ2 launch was changed by SOE to be before WOW, not the other way around.
At launch EQ2 had serious problems, it ran only marginally on my mid range system. It was not ready for play yet, just like Vanguard. It had alot of issues and was extremely solo unfriendly. Took them two years to get EQ2 right, it is not a bad game now.
Go read Ralph Kostner's site sometime, It was the SOE suits that made them do the NGE changes, the dev team was told to shut up and do it or quit. Ralph also told the suits at SOE that NGE was not ready when it was implemented, but was told to put it in or else. If you notice Ralph does not lay the blame on LA even though they contributed to this.
I think Sony could fire the entire management staff at SOE and their stock would go up. They are that detested.
The problem with SOE these days, they have a multitude of MMO's to support and keep throwing money at more of them hoping to find a winner. All this does is overload the support staff. While on the other hand blizzard has to support one game.
Yep! I pretty much just SOE bash!
That's all that is left after they screwed over all their customers and made their games suck.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
- - - -
Support Independent Game Developers
That is ironic when your jumping to conclusions yourself you have no idea how many games we experienced with soe, there are plenty of constructive posts about peoples experience with soe and you want to say its made up? LOL I highly doubt these experiences explained in detail is made up ive played since eq1 and watched soe turn into another greedy big money cooperation releasing expansion after expansion making the games less and less fun unless you spend more money come on dude its time to wake up.
Yep! I pretty much just SOE bash!
That's all that is left after they screwed over all their customers and made their games suck.
Amen to that.
They're the only company that I've ever seen hate the players as much as they do and still make money. For me I guess, I'd just had enough of getting screwed by them from EQ, Planetside, and finally SWG. I won't play any of their other games ever.
To the OP and SOE Lovers, Just because some of you have a higher tolerance for getting your sand pounded doesn't mean the people who've had it must shut up about it.
Have a nice day!
Angelbound..
took 3 posts to get your thoughts out or you just trying to kick up your post count?
Huh?
If this post was directed at me then don't bother....
1) I can't understand a damn thing you're typing (Run on sentences anyone?)
2) Sounds like you hate SOE too. In that case you're preaching to the choir.
3) Huh?