I played WoW since before Retail Release Now no I'm not saying it's done anything Majorly groundbreaking or spectacular since it's release but like some have said before me they've released lots of free content they do TRY to fix glaring problems with the game.
They DID raise the bar as to what is acceptable as a good Marketable MMO now While EVE has much better graphics and sounds the gameplay to me is rather tiring as you have to spend a clear week just to learn to fly in a new ship. WoW never raised any graphics bar other than stepping things up to 3D rather than a simulated or Weak 3D environment, they also raised the bar on fun and gameplay. Now the newer MMOs are following suit in Order to meet or beat WoW. WoW IS the King of the MMO MARKET right now the Market not the Top Dog as far as all factors are concerned it's just WoW's marketshare is a little fatter than others. When the new stuff starts releasing to retail you'll see a steady Decline in WoW consumers if they keep goin like they've been goin the past few months since TBC's release.
These include (not counting TBC expansion) new zones, new raid and group dungeons, world bosses (non instanced), revamped PvP, new Battle grounds, several class make overs (omg they nerfed me... grow up), new abilities & spells, new items and gear, new mounts, new factions, new quests, new world events and some new engine stuff like weather effects.
Not enough for some of you move, WoW end game is Raid always has been, you play through to 70 and then realise you cannot raid is not WoW's fault its yours.
13 updates in 2 and a half years is not really impressing. eq2 had 35 major content updates in about the same time as an example.
I would agree that Blizzard / WOW have raised the bar in the general feel of the game. I would say the graphics have and still are rather cartoony and not much to look at, but over time the graphics do play a lesser role in the game than what is there. I had played for the first 6 months of release and thought ... mmm what else does one do ... not much besides raid things. So I left and came back just as BC was getting its release. Needless to say .... I think I missed out on a lot. Things had changed and all for the good.
I have tried other games (EQ2, COH, COV) but though they had better graphics and the feel of the game could not be matched in some way. I know it sounds a bit odd... but it is a feeling that the world has more life and energy in it.
Sure WOW has a negative side but it can be over looked for all that it does have. I know not everyone will agree but then that is their opinion and everyone has one.
In the end YES, Blizzard is the top MMO for many reasons and yes they have raised the bar for many years to come.
13 updates in 2 and a half years is not really impressing. eq2 had 35 major content updates in about the same time as an example.
You know numbers are really misleading. EQ2 had so many "content" updates as you call them because they retooled the game so much and how horrid the mechanics at launch were. I played on the test server full time for about a year (before and after copies) and the reason they had so many patches is because there was a schedule. That is why SOE patch days are so chaotic and buggy. Meeting the time table is more important for that company than releasing a finished product.
I was actually very impressed with the WoW content patches in so many ways coming from an EQ2 background myself. First of all they worked. The servers were not going to crash for days on end, or completely unrelated abilities would not be broken, etc etc. It was very impressive the amount of testing and polish that went into them. Also the free content like Naxxaramus and AQ20-40 style dungeons also raises the bar a ton for the competition. Giving out free content keeps people subscribing.
Yes I think they have raised the bar more than most companies. New products need to be finished, functional and better be fun from the start or they are in for a rocky road.
So I take it that the 6 months you played were in the last 6 months because if they have been in the first YEAR of the game you certainly would not be saying what you are saying now. I mean don't get me wrong, I played WoW for over 2 years and liked the game but for those of you that are spouting out how wonderful and stable and great the game is must certainly not have played at launch. WoW had a bug filled - content lacking/bugged 12 months after launch. Blizzard did not raise the bar, they finally after over 2 years are starting to MEET IT. It took them over 2 years - 2 YEARS - to get some real new content into the game. Prior to that it was simply trying to make what they had work right. So setting the bar? No, no way, they are finally meeting it.
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, Eve, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game. WOW's problems are so insiginificant compared to problems of the past. I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously. Look at Eve's disaster of a UI, lack of any tutorials or real explanation of how the game even functioned durng its 1st 2 years. You still can't have a battle of over 100 ships in 1 area without unplayable lag or the ability to even warp in to watch.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
Its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games. COnsidering every credible revier on the web agrees how much good WOW brought to the genre, everyone else must be nuts.
So I take it that the 6 months you played were in the last 6 months because if they have been in the first YEAR of the game you certainly would not be saying what you are saying now. I mean don't get me wrong, I played WoW for over 2 years and liked the game but for those of you that are spouting out how wonderful and stable and great the game is must certainly not have played at launch. WoW had a bug filled - content lacking/bugged 12 months after launch. Blizzard did not raise the bar, they finally after over 2 years are starting to MEET IT. It took them over 2 years - 2 YEARS - to get some real new content into the game. Prior to that it was simply trying to make what they had work right. So setting the bar? No, no way, they are finally meeting it.
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game. I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games.
You are 100% correct in the list of games you have that were released as buggy. They were and SO WAS WOW. To say that what Blizzard has done has "raised the bar" is totally laughable, just as many of your comments are.
Dude, I am sorry that you feel like Blizzard has raised the bar in the MMO genre, it's hard to be wrong, but you sir are IMHO wrong.
I think before you tell me to take off my goggles, you really need to remove yours as well.
I know some ppl will probably go and have a freak fit but I will be honest and I will be frank about Blizzard and WoW Yes WoW put EQ the Queen of the MMO world to rest while some still play it, it no longer holds the title of MMO royalty even though they did try to recapture their populace with EQ2 which I've had several dozen ppl I know tell me EQ2 sucks. WoW claimed the crown and reigned up until now but there ARE concerns about its future as the New MMOs coming out threaten its title as king. Could we be looking at an MMO Democracy? Perhaps but chances are WoW will soon lose its huge flair as more fans of the other MMOs coming out migrate to those i.e. AoC, Dungeon Runners, WAR, Tabula Rasa WoW has run into player concerns about meeting demand with supply, they raised the Bar but can they keep their OWN product there while they work on their next crowning achievement to reclaim the RTS Market with SC2? Time will tell but for now the bar HAS indeed been raised and most of these New MMOs coming out have pushed their releases back in order to further polish their titles to either try and overthrow or compete with WoW and Blizzard.
Dungeon Runners? I hope that's a joke... lmao.
Even Tabula Rasa won't come close. Out of that list only AoC and WAR have a chance.
This is troll bait plain and simple. Get a life Raven. The next common tactic is to say WOW is like Mcdonalds, or the number of players having fun doesn't mean the game is any good or WOW is only popular because of its name...
So I take it that the 6 months you played were in the last 6 months because if they have been in the first YEAR of the game you certainly would not be saying what you are saying now. I mean don't get me wrong, I played WoW for over 2 years and liked the game but for those of you that are spouting out how wonderful and stable and great the game is must certainly not have played at launch. WoW had a bug filled - content lacking/bugged 12 months after launch. Blizzard did not raise the bar, they finally after over 2 years are starting to MEET IT. It took them over 2 years - 2 YEARS - to get some real new content into the game. Prior to that it was simply trying to make what they had work right. So setting the bar? No, no way, they are finally meeting it.
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, Eve, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game. WOW's problems are so insiginificant compared to problems of the past. I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously. Look at Eve's disaster of a UI, lack of any tutorials or real explanation of how the game even functioned durng its 1st 2 years. You still can't have a battle of over 100 ships in 1 area without unplayable lag or the ability to even warp in to watch.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
Its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games. COnsidering every credible revier on the web agrees how much good WOW brought to the genre, everyone else must be nuts.
Well it's time for me to tell the real truth here..... Fist off WOW is a terrible game in many areas... Before anyone jumps my bubble i played wow since opening day and i also played the burning crusade which after playing for 1 hour i discontinued my account. Now for the truth ..... Eq2 out smarts and has the best graphics... wow is cartoonish based for children. You cannot compair any other game to wow here is why.... daoc best pvp and rvr and mythic will destroy wow with warhammer coming soon. eq2 has the graphics and mature community. eq 1 i hate to say to the fellow who wrote above invented the bazaar , mail system etc all invented by soe and yes wow is a clone of everquest hands down! Content you say wow is nothing like everquest in content the world alone in everquest makes wow look like a nick cartoon ....... eq2 even has a better world and detail than wow. So people look at the facts if you compair games to facts not just being a fanboi for wow you will see eq 2 eq 1 and even doac are better than wow hands down. Why is it all WOW players thing blizzard made all this stuff and other followed its not true like warhammer was around before WOW and they say warhammer is a clone of wow dont make me laugh. Here is why WOW is popular first NO COMPETITION there is none i made 60 in no time and burning crusade is the same crap different armor... Number 2 there is no soloing in wow its based mostly around raiding nothing more and the community is abunch of children let me repeat.... ABUNCH OF CHILDREN the community is the worst in mmo historyin my opinion. So when everyone is ready to leave the childish game wow for a real mature game come to eq2 or even daoc etc or lotr and play a real game let us know we be glad to help ya !
While WoW is not for everyone, me included, it is the most polished MMorpg ever at the time of release and beyond. That is(and as been) a new idea in MMorpgs. Most companies like to release semi finished products with promises they will bring content in, then actually make customers pay for it again with expansions. Even WoW as finished as it was, was not without its inbalances and incomplete classes at release. But it was far and above the best to date.
I do think they raised the bar in the sense that Blizzard has been quick to address polish. Other games released since WoW, and i wont name them because it always ignites a flamewar, have fallen short of expectations simply for lack of polish.
People forget, when WoW came out, it was in direct competion with EQ2. Before the release many people were torn about which game would be the 1 they chose. I dont think there is any question that WoW's polish and completeness was what set it apart of EQ2 and ultimately pulled most of the gaming world away.
Again, im not a fan of WoW as a game, I dont think it is actually a good game. I just think it is very polished.
This is troll bait plain and simple. Get a life Raven. The next common tactic is to say WOW is like Mcdonalds, or the number of players having fun doesn't mean the game is any good or WOW is only popular because of its name...
Hmm lets see which one it is=)
Troll bait! Hehe Funny how that is an easy out for some. Anyway, I had re-read your post and you are correct about some of the functions WoW had in their game that was new like AH, flying mounts, etc.
But besides the bugs it launched with, I guess I was thinking about the quests it had and probably more in the line of the hand-holding it introduced.
For you maybe it rasied the bar…not so sure about the industry in general however because if "dumbing" down something is "raising the bar" then that is news to me.
Blizzard havn't raised the bar. I can't think of one thing they have done that has set the standard for games to follow, they certainly didn't have a bug free release. Nor have they got any original content, its a fun game but it hasn't set any bars, it has however shown that if you rehash content throw enough money at it, and make a game piss easy, you can generate a large income.
That isn't exactly setting any standards, atm companies are trying to copy the dumbed down rehashed content approach to try capture wows numbers. Its more or less lowered the bar on originality
whats stupid is they will try and make a harder version of wow and you will end up with everquest 3
WoW hasn't released any free content outside of more shit to raid....which I do not count as content as only a small percentage of people playing will actually experience it. Other than that the only thing they ever added were battle grounds which were supposed to be in at release. So tell me, what "Free content" do you keep referring to? Are you talking about the patches that they added that "balanced" classes? Because that's not content either. Oh, how quickly we forget. Let's take a walk down memory lane, shall we?
Patch 1.2
- Maraudon
- Feast of Great Winter
- "Exhaulted" mounts
- New quests in Desolace
- "Addon" interface added Patch 1.3
- Dire Maul
- Interface improvements (more action bars etc)
- Auto Quest tracking
- Meeting Stones
- 2 Dragons added Patch 1.4
- PvP Honor system along with new mounts, weapons, armor sets for PvP
- Gurubashi Arena event
- Elemental Invasion event Patch 1.5
- Battlegrounds
- More quests for Hinterlands, Searing Gorge, Ferelas
- New Flight paths
- New reputation quests Patch 1.6
- Blackwing Lair
- Darkmoon Faire
- Battlemasters
- New Honor tab with an honor bar, today, yesterday, this week honor info Patch 1.7
- Zul'Gurub
- New Battleground (Arathi Basin)
- Fishing event
- Dressing room
- New armor sets Patch 1.8
- 4 more Dragons
- Revamp of Silithus
- Hallow's end event Patch 1.9
- Ahn'Qiraj
- New armor sets
- Linked Auction Houses
- Multiple Battleground Queues
- Raid dungeons are reset weekly
- New Reputation rewards Patch 1.10
- Weather effects
- More Armor sets Patch 1.11
- Naxxramas
- More Armor sets
- Upgraded PvP sets
- Argent Dawn and Cenarion Circle Reputation Rewards
- New Legendary items
- Keyrings
- New Flighpaths Patch 1.12
- Cross-Realm Battlegrounds
- World PvP content Patch 2.01
- Revamped PvP Honor system
- New talents
- Looking for group tool
- PvP 2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas Patch 2.1
- Black Temple
- Druid Epic Flight Form
- New mount - Nether Drake
- New quests for outland
- New Arena (I didn't even know they did this) And remember that this is all on-top of the bug fixes and class rebalancing that goes on constantly. I think maybe she was referring to some of this stuff. Very little of this is "raid" content. A bit more is "high level", but more than half anyone can take advantage of. In fact, the expansion didn't add much of anything other than some more levels, and more items to farm. The expansion actually took the game back a step because all of the items these hard core raiders spent their lives raiding for were easily replaced by blues and greens. This isn't even worth commenting on since I don't have the energy to list all that was added in the expansion.
WoW established a higher MMO bar by doing everything right. The game works, there's plenty of content, it's easy to learn ( but takes some time to truly master a class ), the PVP is consensual with good rewards......I could go on and on.
I tested EQ1 as one of the first hundred beta testers and played it on release for some time - my view on it ended up, sorry, but most people want to be able to hold a job *and* play a game. A game that is too much work is a turn off for most players. I want to be able to get something done if I only have two or three hours to play, not camp a spawn for 12 hours...... Yes, nothing is ground breaking in WoW,but with all the buggy games out there, it's a breath of fresh air in this MMORPG world.
So I take it that the 6 months you played were in the last 6 months because if they have been in the first YEAR of the game you certainly would not be saying what you are saying now. I mean don't get me wrong, I played WoW for over 2 years and liked the game but for those of you that are spouting out how wonderful and stable and great the game is must certainly not have played at launch. WoW had a bug filled - content lacking/bugged 12 months after launch. Blizzard did not raise the bar, they finally after over 2 years are starting to MEET IT. It took them over 2 years - 2 YEARS - to get some real new content into the game. Prior to that it was simply trying to make what they had work right. So setting the bar? No, no way, they are finally meeting it.
WoW and during that time they brought in what, like 6 million customers? Just how stupid are we? LOL
I Played since beta - still playing. Never had any bugs that kept me from playing. The only thing that ever kept me from playing was servers filled to the top with people playing. C'mon Blizz, get yer shit together!!! LOL You make me smile. Thx.
A small percantage? Like it's so freakn' difficult to login in the evening for 3 h or even less and slay a few bosses. People who say that raiding in WoW was a hardcore content only, clearly doesn't have an idea of what hes talking about. You just need to find a good and organized guild and some time after work. Before TBC I was able to get full T1 within little over a month (instances reseted once a weak) while playing not more then 3 - 4 h a day.
Casual players have a 1-2 hour a day game window, not 3-4h.
Not on their payroll no... im sry if I upset you for putting my point across, had no idea your opinion was king.
I was replying to the many who said blizz does not give free content. To your post..... PVP revamp was content with battle ground zones Alteric vally and Warsong gultch and later on Arathi basin, and weather effects might not be classed as content but it is a game addition.
As to end game yes it is a players fault if they cannot play endgame, endgame is raiding always has been. If they dont have time to raid or lack the social skills to join a guild its 100% their fault.
raiding does not require social skills or time to raid. it requires nothing but the want or need to obtain items through boring and repetitive gameplay. some people play these games to have fun, i know this idea might blow your mind, they may not like raiding in any form for whichever reason they choose. if people dont find raiding fun, guess what. they wont play it. end of story.
this is the part where its blizzards fault here, you see there is no alternative pve end game. thats right. blizzard offers nothing to aid players who do not wish to raid. any other form of fun gameplay for pve doesnt exist.
WoW hasn't released any free content outside of more shit to raid....which I do not count as content as only a small percentage of people playing will actually experience it. Other than that the only thing they ever added were battle grounds which were supposed to be in at release. So tell me, what "Free content" do you keep referring to? Are you talking about the patches that they added that "balanced" classes? Because that's not content either. Oh, how quickly we forget. Let's take a walk down memory lane, shall we?
Patch 1.2
- Maraudon
- Feast of Great Winter
- "Exhaulted" mounts
- New quests in Desolace
- "Addon" interface added Patch 1.3
- Dire Maul
- Interface improvements (more action bars etc)
- Auto Quest tracking
- Meeting Stones
- 2 Dragons added Patch 1.4
- PvP Honor system along with new mounts, weapons, armor sets for PvP
- Gurubashi Arena event
- Elemental Invasion event Patch 1.5
- Battlegrounds
- More quests for Hinterlands, Searing Gorge, Ferelas
- New Flight paths
- New reputation quests Patch 1.6
- Blackwing Lair
- Darkmoon Faire
- Battlemasters
- New Honor tab with an honor bar, today, yesterday, this week honor info Patch 1.7
- Zul'Gurub
- New Battleground (Arathi Basin)
- Fishing event
- Dressing room
- New armor sets Patch 1.8
- 4 more Dragons
- Revamp of Silithus
- Hallow's end event Patch 1.9
- Ahn'Qiraj
- New armor sets
- Linked Auction Houses
- Multiple Battleground Queues
- Raid dungeons are reset weekly
- New Reputation rewards Patch 1.10
- Weather effects
- More Armor sets Patch 1.11
- Naxxramas
- More Armor sets
- Upgraded PvP sets
- Argent Dawn and Cenarion Circle Reputation Rewards
- New Legendary items
- Keyrings
- New Flighpaths Patch 1.12
- Cross-Realm Battlegrounds
- World PvP content Patch 2.01
- Revamped PvP Honor system
- New talents
- Looking for group tool
- PvP 2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas Patch 2.1
- Black Temple
- Druid Epic Flight Form
- New mount - Nether Drake
- New quests for outland
- New Arena (I didn't even know they did this) And remember that this is all on-top of the bug fixes and class rebalancing that goes on constantly. I think maybe she was referring to some of this stuff. Very little of this is "raid" content. A bit more is "high level", but more than half anyone can take advantage of. In fact, the expansion didn't add much of anything other than some more levels, and more items to farm. The expansion actually took the game back a step because all of the items these hard core raiders spent their lives raiding for were easily replaced by blues and greens. This isn't even worth commenting on since I don't have the energy to list all that was added in the expansion.
All of that was ment to be in from release. The stuff that isnt raid related was badly implemented and ruined other content. 1.5 upwards have been bad updates after bad updates, the only people who disagree with this are ones that havnt been playing the game from the start or at least pre-aq, or are raiders who are the ones that have been catered to the most.
And the tbc takes the cake, it is honestly the worst example of what you should do in an mmo, making all of your old content which you spent millions on obsolete lol and it made itemisation worse, it isnt even a full expansion either they keep adding content that should of been there from release.
Blizzard are showing what gamers should not expect, incomplete products, I dont know how they can justify charging the full price of a game and a monthly fee when they don't provide all of the content they advertise on the package from the start of the purchase. whats funny is people think they make well polished games lol
Would you buy a car say a ferrai (sp?), and except only getting a steering wheel then a tire, then some more bits that you should of got from the initial purchase? then on the way, they decide that they dont want to give you a ferrai instead they will give you a ford.
You obviously would be pissed off, its the same with mmos, why should they advertise a product then change the gameplay of it completly at the end of the game, and only provide you the mmo in pieces lol The fact that this is standard practice for the mmo industry and in alot of cases the rest of the gaming industry, is why in general is not taken seriously, because they act un-profestionaly. ( man this forum needs a spell checker )
And the consumers accept it, its why games like dark and light manage to get peoples money, they have low standards, and would pay for anything,
edit: oh im not trying to insult whoever i just quoted i just think it is incredibly bad how blizzard have gone about their game, and how this industry in general seem to think should be the norm.
people play WoW because they can play wow. have you seen the normal computer specs, but requiring 700+mb of ram you're effectively cutting out half the market.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
All of that was ment to be in from release. The stuff that isnt raid related was badly implemented and ruined other content. 1.5 upwards have been bad updates after bad updates, the only people who disagree with this are ones that havnt been playing the game from the start or at least pre-aq, or are raiders who are the ones that have been catered to the most.
I disagree with you and I've been playing since beta and I don't raid. I've been to MC 1 time. I've never been to Naxx or any other high level instance. I've never seen Onyxia up close. Please stop talking for me, because you have no idea what I think. It's very convenient to say all of it was meant to be in from release, but unless you have inside knowledge of Blizzard's plans you don't know that for certain so don't speak for Blizzard either. edit: oh im not trying to insult whoever i just quoted i just think it is incredibly bad how blizzard have gone about their game, and how this industry in general seem to think should be the norm.
people play WoW because they can play wow. have you seen the normal computer specs, but requiring 700+mb of ram you're effectively cutting out half the market.
erm no people play wow because they enjoy it. my dads boss plays wow, he has one of them custom build alien computers that can run everything, i believe he has vista and dx10 as well now lol and he only plays wow
Personally my computer can run everything at the moment, maybe not the latest games on high settings but on medium, my brother, and everyone i have spoken to in game have similer computers thats around 2-3k people.
Its nothing to do with system specs, or wows name, wow was fun, before the constant bad updates, most of us who are still there since release are hoping for them to improve the game or waiting for other games. they have actually started improving the game, its just to little to late.
I dont know why people post system specs as why you play games. i can run my little pony does that mean i like it HELLLLLLLL NOOOO
Scriar, where did you get the idea that everything Blizzard has added since release was supposed to be there on day 1? And in what MMORPG ever has an expansion not allowed you to further advance your character? Every single one by the way. By advancing, something becomes obsolete. Its just the way it is. Every MMORPG in the future will follow suit because if there aren't newer and cooler things to see or earn people quit. But, since you hate WOW so much, thats probably what you'd like.
Considering new people are STILL buying WOW, everything before TBC is not obsolete and wasn't obsolete for the 3 years people were playing it.
If WOW is an example of an incomplete MMORPG, you seriously haven't really seen incomplete MMORPGs. You sound like someone who's still a bit fresh to the genre and don't understand it all that well. If you've been around a while, your view is just a bit out of touch or unrealistic. MMORPGs are never complete. All you can hope is that theres a lot there. Blizzard delivered more than many MMORPGs combined.
WOW lacks in the RPing dept, since you can't really set up shops or effect the world all that much, but since most people don't give a rip about RPing, it wasn't missing much. The more you allow players the change the world, the more people get pissed off. People want content on their schedual and they don't want people screwing with that schedual.
Originally posted by SWGLover I tested EQ1 as one of the first hundred beta testers and played it on release for some time - my view on it ended up, sorry, but most people want to be able to hold a job *and* play a game. A game that is too much work is a turn off for most players. I want to be able to get something done if I only have two or three hours to play, not camp a spawn for 12 hours......
Me too, then I continued with it for 6 friggin years. WoW refined the gameplay into something quite rewarding, which EQ1 ultimately was not.
Only had to camp a spawn for 12 hours? You were certainly lucky! Monk epic I had to have people bring me food and water for three days straight.
Comments
I played WoW since before Retail Release Now no I'm not saying it's done anything Majorly groundbreaking or spectacular since it's release but like some have said before me they've released lots of free content they do TRY to fix glaring problems with the game.
They DID raise the bar as to what is acceptable as a good Marketable MMO now While EVE has much better graphics and sounds the gameplay to me is rather tiring as you have to spend a clear week just to learn to fly in a new ship. WoW never raised any graphics bar other than stepping things up to 3D rather than a simulated or Weak 3D environment, they also raised the bar on fun and gameplay. Now the newer MMOs are following suit in Order to meet or beat WoW. WoW IS the King of the MMO MARKET right now the Market not the Top Dog as far as all factors are concerned it's just WoW's marketshare is a little fatter than others. When the new stuff starts releasing to retail you'll see a steady Decline in WoW consumers if they keep goin like they've been goin the past few months since TBC's release.
Until you cancel your subscription, you are only helping to continue the cycle of mediocrity.
I have tried other games (EQ2, COH, COV) but though they had better graphics and the feel of the game could not be matched in some way. I know it sounds a bit odd... but it is a feeling that the world has more life and energy in it.
Sure WOW has a negative side but it can be over looked for all that it does have. I know not everyone will agree but then that is their opinion and everyone has one.
In the end YES, Blizzard is the top MMO for many reasons and yes they have raised the bar for many years to come.
I was actually very impressed with the WoW content patches in so many ways coming from an EQ2 background myself. First of all they worked. The servers were not going to crash for days on end, or completely unrelated abilities would not be broken, etc etc. It was very impressive the amount of testing and polish that went into them. Also the free content like Naxxaramus and AQ20-40 style dungeons also raises the bar a ton for the competition. Giving out free content keeps people subscribing.
Yes I think they have raised the bar more than most companies. New products need to be finished, functional and better be fun from the start or they are in for a rocky road.
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, Eve, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game.
WOW's problems are so insiginificant compared to problems of the past. I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously. Look at Eve's disaster of a UI, lack of any tutorials or real explanation of how the game even functioned durng its 1st 2 years. You still can't have a battle of over 100 ships in 1 area without unplayable lag or the ability to even warp in to watch.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
Its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games. COnsidering every credible revier on the web agrees how much good WOW brought to the genre, everyone else must be nuts.
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game.
I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games.
You are 100% correct in the list of games you have that were released as buggy. They were and SO WAS WOW. To say that what Blizzard has done has "raised the bar" is totally laughable, just as many of your comments are.
Dude, I am sorry that you feel like Blizzard has raised the bar in the MMO genre, it's hard to be wrong, but you sir are IMHO wrong.
I think before you tell me to take off my goggles, you really need to remove yours as well.
Dungeon Runners? I hope that's a joke... lmao.
Even Tabula Rasa won't come close. Out of that list only AoC and WAR have a chance.
Currently Playing: WoW (somewhat)
Testing: None
Played: WoW, CoV, AL, SWG, VC, EVE, SWToR
This is troll bait plain and simple. Get a life Raven. The next common tactic is to say WOW is like Mcdonalds, or the number of players having fun doesn't mean the game is any good or WOW is only popular because of its name...
Hmm lets see which one it is=)
The goggles you're wearing are quite thick sir;) If WOW was buggy or lacked content, what the heck was DAOC, AO or EQ, UO, Eve, SWG and AC like during their 1st years. I guess grinding mob spawns for months watching a bar slowely move or chatting & role playing was considered quality content for you? SLOW advancement was designed to hide the complete lack of actual content. I don't remember controllable mounts unique to every race, numerous modes of travel, 8 totally unique classes(not cookie cutter classes with name changes), an AH, mailsystem, a huge selection of gear that wasn't just numerical and 1000s of quests to do, in any other MMOGs at release? I don't remember any other MMOGs that made soloing fun & viable? I don't rememer any MMORPGs that have nearly the detail Blizzard put in to every single zone. WOW had more content on day 1 then all of those games had after multiple expansions. I don't recall having rollbacks that eliminated entire play sessions of advancement, but I remember that happeneing in DAOC and EQ and AO. You have a major case of selective memory and a deluded idea of what constitudes as CONTENT or bugs. If you didn't think WOW "worked right" you havent' been playing MMORPGs very long or again, have selective memory in order to bash a game.
WOW's problems are so insiginificant compared to problems of the past. I enjoyed plenty of MMORPGs I used to play, but its almost laughable calling WOW buggy or lacking in content compared to what came out previously. Look at Eve's disaster of a UI, lack of any tutorials or real explanation of how the game even functioned durng its 1st 2 years. You still can't have a battle of over 100 ships in 1 area without unplayable lag or the ability to even warp in to watch.
The only MMORPG that launched as clean as WOW was COH and you can hardly even compare the feature set or scope. The queues were Blizzards biggest problem, but name one MMORPG that had millions of people playing within a few months all trying to get onto the same servers. Frankly, waiting 10 or 15 minutes at most to log in during peak hours was way better than unplayable lag.
Its really amazing how much people take for granted in WOW, but accepted as the norm in past games. COnsidering every credible revier on the web agrees how much good WOW brought to the genre, everyone else must be nuts.
Well it's time for me to tell the real truth here..... Fist off WOW is a terrible game in many areas... Before anyone jumps my bubble i played wow since opening day and i also played the burning crusade which after playing for 1 hour i discontinued my account. Now for the truth ..... Eq2 out smarts and has the best graphics... wow is cartoonish based for children. You cannot compair any other game to wow here is why.... daoc best pvp and rvr and mythic will destroy wow with warhammer coming soon. eq2 has the graphics and mature community. eq 1 i hate to say to the fellow who wrote above invented the bazaar , mail system etc all invented by soe and yes wow is a clone of everquest hands down! Content you say wow is nothing like everquest in content the world alone in everquest makes wow look like a nick cartoon ....... eq2 even has a better world and detail than wow. So people look at the facts if you compair games to facts not just being a fanboi for wow you will see eq 2 eq 1 and even doac are better than wow hands down. Why is it all WOW players thing blizzard made all this stuff and other followed its not true like warhammer was around before WOW and they say warhammer is a clone of wow dont make me laugh. Here is why WOW is popular first NO COMPETITION there is none i made 60 in no time and burning crusade is the same crap different armor... Number 2 there is no soloing in wow its based mostly around raiding nothing more and the community is abunch of children let me repeat.... ABUNCH OF CHILDREN the community is the worst in mmo historyin my opinion. So when everyone is ready to leave the childish game wow for a real mature game come to eq2 or even daoc etc or lotr and play a real game let us know we be glad to help ya !
I think the original poster nailed it.
While WoW is not for everyone, me included, it is the most polished MMorpg ever at the time of release and beyond. That is(and as been) a new idea in MMorpgs. Most companies like to release semi finished products with promises they will bring content in, then actually make customers pay for it again with expansions. Even WoW as finished as it was, was not without its inbalances and incomplete classes at release. But it was far and above the best to date.
I do think they raised the bar in the sense that Blizzard has been quick to address polish. Other games released since WoW, and i wont name them because it always ignites a flamewar, have fallen short of expectations simply for lack of polish.
People forget, when WoW came out, it was in direct competion with EQ2. Before the release many people were torn about which game would be the 1 they chose. I dont think there is any question that WoW's polish and completeness was what set it apart of EQ2 and ultimately pulled most of the gaming world away.
Again, im not a fan of WoW as a game, I dont think it is actually a good game. I just think it is very polished.
That isn't exactly setting any standards, atm companies are trying to copy the dumbed down rehashed content approach to try capture wows numbers. Its more or less lowered the bar on originality
whats stupid is they will try and make a harder version of wow and you will end up with everquest 3
SOMEONE JUST GOT PWNT
WoW established a higher MMO bar by doing everything right.
The game works, there's plenty of content, it's easy to learn ( but takes some time to truly master a class ), the PVP is consensual with good rewards......I could go on and on.
I tested EQ1 as one of the first hundred beta testers and played it on release for some time - my view on it ended up, sorry, but most people want to be able to hold a job *and* play a game. A game that is too much work is a turn off for most players. I want to be able to get something done if I only have two or three hours to play, not camp a spawn for 12 hours......
Yes, nothing is ground breaking in WoW,but with all the buggy games out there, it's a breath of fresh air in this MMORPG world.
WoW and during that time they brought in what, like 6 million customers? Just how stupid are we? LOL
I Played since beta - still playing. Never had any bugs that kept me from playing. The only thing that ever kept me from playing was servers filled to the top with people playing. C'mon Blizz, get yer shit together!!! LOL You make me smile. Thx.
this is the part where its blizzards fault here, you see there is no alternative pve end game. thats right. blizzard offers nothing to aid players who do not wish to raid. any other form of fun gameplay for pve doesnt exist.
And the tbc takes the cake, it is honestly the worst example of what you should do in an mmo, making all of your old content which you spent millions on obsolete lol and it made itemisation worse, it isnt even a full expansion either they keep adding content that should of been there from release.
Blizzard are showing what gamers should not expect, incomplete products, I dont know how they can justify charging the full price of a game and a monthly fee when they don't provide all of the content they advertise on the package from the start of the purchase. whats funny is people think they make well polished games lol
Would you buy a car say a ferrai (sp?), and except only getting a steering wheel then a tire, then some more bits that you should of got from the initial purchase? then on the way, they decide that they dont want to give you a ferrai instead they will give you a ford.
You obviously would be pissed off, its the same with mmos, why should they advertise a product then change the gameplay of it completly at the end of the game, and only provide you the mmo in pieces lol The fact that this is standard practice for the mmo industry and in alot of cases the rest of the gaming industry, is why in general is not taken seriously, because they act un-profestionaly. ( man this forum needs a spell checker
And the consumers accept it, its why games like dark and light manage to get peoples money, they have low standards, and would pay for anything,
edit: oh im not trying to insult whoever i just quoted i just think it is incredibly bad how blizzard have gone about their game, and how this industry in general seem to think should be the norm.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
Personally my computer can run everything at the moment, maybe not the latest games on high settings but on medium, my brother, and everyone i have spoken to in game have similer computers thats around 2-3k people.
Its nothing to do with system specs, or wows name, wow was fun, before the constant bad updates, most of us who are still there since release are hoping for them to improve the game or waiting for other games. they have actually started improving the game, its just to little to late.
I dont know why people post system specs as why you play games. i can run my little pony does that mean i like it HELLLLLLLL NOOOO
Scriar, where did you get the idea that everything Blizzard has added since release was supposed to be there on day 1? And in what MMORPG ever has an expansion not allowed you to further advance your character? Every single one by the way. By advancing, something becomes obsolete. Its just the way it is. Every MMORPG in the future will follow suit because if there aren't newer and cooler things to see or earn people quit. But, since you hate WOW so much, thats probably what you'd like.
Considering new people are STILL buying WOW, everything before TBC is not obsolete and wasn't obsolete for the 3 years people were playing it.
If WOW is an example of an incomplete MMORPG, you seriously haven't really seen incomplete MMORPGs. You sound like someone who's still a bit fresh to the genre and don't understand it all that well. If you've been around a while, your view is just a bit out of touch or unrealistic. MMORPGs are never complete. All you can hope is that theres a lot there. Blizzard delivered more than many MMORPGs combined.
WOW lacks in the RPing dept, since you can't really set up shops or effect the world all that much, but since most people don't give a rip about RPing, it wasn't missing much. The more you allow players the change the world, the more people get pissed off. People want content on their schedual and they don't want people screwing with that schedual.
Me too, then I continued with it for 6 friggin years. WoW refined the gameplay into something quite rewarding, which EQ1 ultimately was not.
Only had to camp a spawn for 12 hours? You were certainly lucky! Monk epic I had to have people bring me food and water for three days straight.