Judge a game from his content ,company services ,community,graphics ,music,gameplay ,lore,server stability and not from his successfull marketing policy .
OK.
Content: I've played WoW for a little over a year now. I've played pretty much every race and class. I've put in hundreds of hours and frankly enjoy the content. There's still a lot of "go kill 10 dogs" type stuff, but there are also a lot of fun, weird, or intricate quests (especially since TBC). As far as PvP content I admi the game falls short, but BGs and arenas can still be engaging and fun, esp with friends. Raids are certainly fun, and I enjoy raiding as one of my guild's tanks.
Company services: To date, the worst response time I've had in regards to a ticket was 2 hours. Typically, it's a matter of minutes. The GMs have been friendly and polite, and I've never felt an issue wasn't resolved to my satisfaction. And I've had few real issues; the most common was reporting goldsellers, but since the recent patches those no longer plague me.
Community: I have friends in WoW. I belong to a medium-sized, friendly guild that still manages to raid and have fun as a family at the same time. I love em. I play on an RP server, and find (for the most part) immature kids are few and far between. The overall community has been pretty good to me.
Graphics: Not the best out there, but there are still areas I consider gorgeous. And the shots I've seen of the next expansion look better than ever.
Music: Honestly I don't care much about game music. I turn it off and play my MP3s. Mind you WoW needs a good built-in MP3 player, the addons I've tried so far I found lacking. But anyway, I can't judge WoW's music cause I just don't listen.
Gameplay: PvE ganmeplay is great, esp in the higher-level instances. There it's all about teamwork and coordination, and I love the challenge of it . Solo play is possible with all clases (although not enjoyable with some builds). PVP...well read what I said above about PvP
Lore: Dude. Warcraft. You can choke to death on the amount of lore here.
Server stability: I've rarely had problems, and NOTHING like what I've seen in other games (EVE, CoX, and AO to name a couple).
Now, is WoW the perfect game? Of course not. Is it the best game for everyone? Of course not. Is it the best game for me? Not entirely. Do I still love playing it? Yes. And that's what matters.
Yeah killing 25000 bugs to get enough faction for an epic is great "content". Oh and the battlegrounds are great, who thought you could turn pvp into a grind? The pve is fun and challenging too, you look up a boss on the internet and then pattern yourself to match the script, its the same every time because variation would be unfun. Warcraft? Lore? What, is there a source besides warcraft 1,2,3? Isn't that like trying to take lore outa a cartoon designed to sell toys? The worst thing about WoW is that it has so many subscribers that all the other developers want to copy it, so it not only ruined its own game but also ruins all the other ones. The only thing fun about this game is griefing but that gets boring after a month or so.
Are you a Pavlovian Fish Biscuit Addict? Get Help Now! I will play no more MMORPGs until somethign good comes out!
Yeah killing 25000 bugs to get enough faction for an epic is great "content". Oh and the battlegrounds are great, who thought you could turn pvp into a grind? The pve is fun and challenging too, you look up a boss on the internet and then pattern yourself to match the script, its the same every time because variation would be unfun. Warcraft? Lore? What, is there a source besides warcraft 1,2,3? Isn't that like trying to take lore outa a cartoon designed to sell toys? The worst thing about WoW is that it has so many subscribers that all the other developers want to copy it, so it not only ruined its own game but also ruins all the other ones. The only thing fun about this game is griefing but that gets boring after a month or so.
By killing bugs I presume you're talking about the AQ grind. First off, they're changed the faction for AQ to make it easier, secondly, since then they've improved that a lot. Faction grinds post TBC are MUCH easier and rarely require massive repetitve grinding. There's a few pesky ones (Scryer/Aldor...ugh!) But gear as good or better can be achieved via arena rewards or raid drops.
PvP grind? BGs can be that way I'll admit. If I had any complaint about Blizz at all (OK I have a few, but the worst is...) it's that they killed world PvP. I still would like to see that fixed.
PvE raids? Yes you can look up a strategy on the interwubs. Try to get 10-40 people to follow it, learning how. Knowing is one thing, doing is another. Or better yet, you and your guild develop a new tactic, a better one.
Lore? Um...yes there's 3 games..and several novels..and the tabletop RPG..and new lore created in game. Go read WoWwiki or even wikipedia sometime. There's tons of backstory. Oh and taking lore from a cartoon made just to sell toys...go look up how much lore there is for GI Joe or the Transformers. Cause, guess what those shows were? Tell THEIR fans there's no lore.
As for other developers I'll agree with you..it's a sad fact of marketing that developers take the safe road and copy what they know works.
And Griefing..meh..if I wanna grief morons I'll go play counterstrike. Although I'll still agree that I'd like a better pvp system. but it's still a good game. To me. if it isn't to you, that's your opinion and I don't fault ya.
just want to say , for all retards that are like 19years old, and have no idea of the world.
Warcraft is not the first ork vs human idea, the first (in tabletop ) was WARHammer, it is and i stay the creation of wow , it is, if anything the reason for warcraft.
the story runs very close to warhammer, but yes wow has made changes to that , making it individual, alowing it to be view by the public as , well not a copy, but it so is all the races are there, the Lore , the gameplay , names , everything CAN be viewed as a copy from warhammer.
understand nomatter what you think, wow was not the first game, just the only one to use cinima ads, and well timed moves to make it big.
so if your going to base a game review on say any fantesy game PLZ for the love of god , dont base it on wow copy ideas
I didn't want to do this, because it's just going to sound like complaining to most people, but maybe someone will care (ya, right, lol). Anyway, here's the issues I had with WoW. These problems and dislikes forced me to quit.
1. Far too much grinding. Raiding the same boss over and over and over and over (and over) just to TRY and get some rare item irritated the living hell out of me. I really dislike games that are gear centric. I'd like a game that focuses more on skill usage. I also dislike being forced to join some huge group just to get a good item. I wasted so much time just looking for groups, I began to hate the people I was playing with.
2. The classes are just too homogenized. Too many skills overlap with other classes, making every character feel like some cheesy cookie-cutter class regardless of what you do. I suppose the fact that everyone looks almost exactly the same doesn't help either.
3. PvP is horribly unbalanced. Certain classes just don't have any real disadvantages in PvP and thus dominate the scoreboards. Then there's the lack of any real purpose in PvP besides (GASP!) better gear, and with no penalty for losing, PvP gets real boring real fast. I suppose it all boils down to game mechanics in the end. PvP in WoW plays like a lag-ridden FPS game with crappy graphics. What happened to the games that drew you into their world and rallied you to their cause?
4. Travel is a pain. Fly, fly, fly... fly, fly, WHY? I pay for to be entertained, to have fun. Watching my character do the same, boring tasks is not fun for me. Quests are particularly boring. Why must I have to travel all over the place just to get some stupid quest item? I guess it's because the more time I waste, the more money blizzard makes. That alone made mewant to stop playing.
5. Too much micro management. I don't like farming for potions or dealing with 10 gazillion components. My backpack was always stuffed, mostly with useless quest related crap.
I suppose I had some fun playing WoW. It's not a bad game, but these issues were enough to make me quit.
Nike is my prime example of a largely popular product produced for the masses and has equal or HIGHER level of quality than it's competition.
Horribly flawed logic going on here.
First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe).
Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them.
The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity.
To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs".
only reason wow got sucsess is because of the market this game is made for - cusual players
wow like many outher mmo's is a raid-based game.
what made wow different from games like Everquest, is that raiding isnt only primary for the continues player.. but also for the cusual player. reason for this is, most of the dungeon encounters in wow is instance based (where most outher games have open encounters) these instances got a auto-save future, something that makes people able to finish it over longer time..
instanced dungons also means, you will not see outher players than your own raid, and the encounters are always the same..that also means you can make a strategy on what to do, even before you have started.. something that saves lots of time.
outher reasons:
* Extremly easy to use user interface
* Level design
* Cute character design that appels to both women & younger audience..
numbers does not mean a thing..
ejay has sold more than pro tools, does that mean ejay is better?
windows paint has "sold" more than photoshop. does that mean paint is better?
Nike is my prime example of a largely popular product produced for the masses and has equal or HIGHER level of quality than it's competition.
Horribly flawed logic going on here.
First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe).
Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them.
The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity.
To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs".
And yet you use flawed analogy to counter his analogy. Perhaps his analogy is flawed, but yours is much worse. The McDonalds comparison is easily debunked and has been on many occaisions. First of all, WoW costs roughly the same as other MMOs that you might compare it to, such as EQ2 and LOTRO or even EVE - so the cheap and cheerful connotations evaporate.
Secondly, with regards to the "WoW is McDonalds quality" argument; put your anti-WoW pitchforks down for a minute, play the Devil's Advocate, or simply engage your brains and consider this: WoW dilutes its content with time to a lesser extent than, say EQ2. You'll spend much longer in one area in EQ2, looking at the same art, doing killing more of the same mobs, than you would in WoW. Now to me diluting something in that way lessons the quality of the experience.
There's a quest in Runnyeye in EQ2, for example, that requires you to kill literally hundreds of goblins. What makes this worse is that encounters in EQ2 are typically longer - no more skillful, you're just waiting for abilities to refresh more often than you would in WoW.
It's why people wrongly accuse WoW as being easy, because it doesn't take you as long to do certain things. This doesn't make things easier, it just wastes less of the time so that the content you're consuming is less diluted. WoW is the juicy steak, and the other MMOs are the cheap burgers.
That's where your logic is flawed.
Now I don't dispute that other MMOs have features appear to broaden or add depth to their games, but these features are usually unpolished, don't contribute to gameplay, or are simply fluff. Like a sachet of tomato ketchup with your fries, they add a bit of flavour but theres nothing substantial there.
There are many ways in which you can criticize WoW, but to attack its quality is not one of them. It is the most polished, well paced and enjoyable MMO out there. It might lack that 'epic' feeling of your Everquests or EVE, but this feeling comes at a high penalty of time, and those of us with families, jobs and responsibilites simply do not have time to enjoy these games to they extent they can in WoW.
If you're single and have a lot of spare time, then those games are very rewarding. I cannot imagine how people enjoy active sociable lives while playing more time-consuming games than WoW, which is already considered by a great many to be a life stealer. These days, while I enjoy my mid 20s I have to draw the line with WoW, it's the most socially acceptable MMO out there made by Blizzard, who none can disagree are a great game company, and gaming is a lifelong hobby.
And of course, it all comes down to what you like. Some people say WoW is too casual, others say it's too time consuming. Some say the quest system is repetitive - and would prefer to simply grind mobs if you would believe it. Some say WoW has no PvP, others say PvP is the only thing worth doing.
These are just typical, yet extreme opinions from very opinionated people that grace our boards and throw giant wads of shit in the direction of WoW and the people that play it. I can play WoW, and EQ2, and EVE and I see the qualities in all. I defend WoW the most because its the game criticized the most for the wrong reasons. I would even go to say that these 3 games are the top 3 MMOs out there, and being generous, would say that they are on par with each other if you're accustomed to the type of gameplay each offers.
It all comes down to the fact that WoW is popular and a popular game has a lot more critics. An objective mind knows differently, and considering I've experienced most of what these games have to offer, I feel that I am safely objective. WoW haters will tell you I'm a fanboy, but that's only because their perspective is warped so much around hating WoW that any amount of defense or rebuke is considered zealotic.
Enjoy your burger.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Nicely said, WoW is definitely the best MMO on the market right now. People who hate it claim it is simplistic and takes features from other mmos. Of course it is that is why it appeals to millions of people, and it's obviously gonna take features from other MMOs, it is an mmo. That's like saying halo is a crappy fps, because it takes features from other first person shooters. I didn't quit WoW, because I hate it, I quit it because it became boring for me. Every game becomes boring over a long period of time. Regardless if that game is innovative, has several features, or is a social game. I wen't on a forum one time and a guy was bashing WoW and claimed that Guild Wars was better. 2 months latter he started bashing Guild Wars lol. MMOrpgs may last for a long time, but they will always get boring no matter what. Trust me Age of Conan, Warhammer Online, Gods and Heroes, Tabula Rasa, and several other MMOs that are bring new features to MMOs will not last forever. But that is the problem with all games, so don't say a game sucks, because you got bored of it. Only say a game sucks when the game truly is crap. That was just what I thought was a needed addition to your post Renoaku.
WoW best mmo my @$$. WoW just has the most subscribers. I play 1 70 and a 60 the only way to get anywhere is to be a hardcore idiot who dedicates 5 hours a night "excludeing" sundays?Also it's very hard to get into a good PvE guild because there so worried about exp and gear so it makes it very hard for new players to get into the endgame raid dungeons. Plus flying mounts cost like 2000-4000 gold?WoW is a very time consuming game and its boring
Nicely said, WoW is definitely the best MMO on the market right now. People who hate it claim it is simplistic and takes features from other mmos. Of course it is that is why it appeals to millions of people, and it's obviously gonna take features from other MMOs, it is an mmo. That's like saying halo is a crappy fps, because it takes features from other first person shooters. I didn't quit WoW, because I hate it, I quit it because it became boring for me. Every game becomes boring over a long period of time. Regardless if that game is innovative, has several features, or is a social game. I wen't on a forum one time and a guy was bashing WoW and claimed that Guild Wars was better. 2 months latter he started bashing Guild Wars lol. MMOrpgs may last for a long time, but they will always get boring no matter what. Trust me Age of Conan, Warhammer Online, Gods and Heroes, Tabula Rasa, and several other MMOs that are bring new features to MMOs will not last forever. But that is the problem with all games, so don't say a game sucks, because you got bored of it. Only say a game sucks when the game truly is crap. That was just what I thought was a needed addition to your post Renoaku.
WoW best mmo my @$$. WoW just has the most subscribers. I play 1 70 and a 60 the only way to get anywhere is to be a hardcore idiot who dedicates 5 hours a night "excludeing" sundays?Also it's very hard to get into a good PvE guild because there so worried about exp and gear so it makes it very hard for new players to get into the endgame raid dungeons. Plus flying mounts cost like 2000-4000 gold?WoW is a very time consuming game and its boring
Looks like you haven't seen the end games of other MMOs, I think you're in for a shock. I recommend changing genres if you think that WoW is time consuming compared to other MMOs. What other MMOs have you played for as long as WoW, and how are their end games any better?
I suspect you haven't even played them. I suspect that WoW is your first MMO and you've become burned out on it. There's no other logical explanation, when you consider that you're doing EXACTLY THE SAME kind of things in other MMOs at their end game.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
People cant really expect to see end game instances and stuff in WoW if you dont put some effort in it. People who want that are like ones who comes to my gym...."ooo i wana do workout once a week and look like Arnold in one month..."
--------------------> Would you like some cheese with that whine?
ie: What's popular must be desirable or else it wouldn't be popular.
To say what most may or may not or cannot do is YOU speaking for too many that YOU do not know. Just because YOU think, doesn't make it so. I guess I give people more credit than you. Some people may not just be all about style(my opinion), Some may be about functionality(my opinion). I could easily say the flip side of asking the average person which shoe was better and they would pick the one that enhanced a function they were looking for, my opinion because I actually wouldn't know unless it was done. Good looking shit fails too you know. Video game wise this is even more prevalent.
The comparison between Nike and WoW isn't what I was trying to do. It was asked if a product could be named that could basically be popular and of better quality than it's competition. So I used the Nike company as a whole to show why that brand (as a whole) provides equal or better quality than it's competitors. It IS a price game and Nike pays and makes the most. Why? because they have shitty quality? Nah, don't think so. Because they have great marketing, well yeah but that only compounds the quality they offer. Also, I used Brands because just like I said(well something to the effect), Some BRANDS (Nike)PRIDE THEMSELVES ON PUTTING OUT EXTREMELY HIGH QUALITY ITEMS/ PRODUCTS(AirMax '90, or Jordan 17's). It's not always manufacturer's trying to slip one by or pull one over on the populace. That's too blanket.
I agree that the quality of WoW is irrelevant. That wasn't my argument. I still play the game. Getting bored of it, but I still play cause I have goals ingame I wanna reach.
My logic is flawed only if I were comparing Nike to WoW which is dumb. I know Nike is a brand like Blizzard. I know that Nike is a shoe company and not a Gaming Co. Apples and Shirt ties. But I guess that's your style, assuming we people to be gullible and ignorant.
Pardon me, had to do this in edit form...thought I had quoted an earlier post, but had replied as a new post instead by accident.
Originally posted by Neosapience
, "Horribly flawed logic going on here. First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe). Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them. The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity. To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs"."
Blizzard does nothing original. They market for the value of keeping people in their grasp for fees. Sony runs their games much better than Blizzard and Blizzard's model is to appeal to masses and offer the minimal. Not like Black Temple (getting to or getting through) is difficult. How many times are they gonna reuse ideas of boss encounters? Seriously. They lack everything a true indepth MMORPG is.
GLADLY CANCELLED MY WOW ACCOUNT AFTER BEING IN BT ~ Blizzard has no intuition or creativeness left in their dry veins.
/bye
Retired Max LvL and Raiding for - EQ - DAoC - Dungeon Runners - WoW - LoTR:Online - GW/All Expansions - CoH/V - SWG *** Currently Playing EQ2 *** Awaiting - PoTBS!
the main reason why other mmo's pick on wow is because wow is oficialy number 1 and there not easy and i think everyones forgeting wow is the biggest mmo on the planet
ya know...perhaps were all forgetting a very valid point....
World of Warcraft and or Blizzard. has alot, alot, ALOT of people to "please". Some MMO's go, hey, this is our game, we are a hardcore grind game. end of story. well, if u think about it. Blizzard trie's to give us different things to do, but cant make EVERYONE happy. but we all still play and ENJOY our time we play it. it sucks, but if they make it how us, bit more hardcore MMO'ers would have it. they would lose alot of people prolly. because, its just a casual MMO in the end. until you reach max lv.
and, im neutral in the love/hate WoW thing.
Long version: I respect your point but they're not really succeeding, if they were there would be a lot less haters and retired WoW boxes (like the one I have gathering dust over there in the corner). I mean if they have 9 million acounts, then they're doing something right. But in all that trying to make everyone happy they ended up pissing people like me off, and botching the core game. WoW was (in my opinion) a great game before BC, which brought it down a rather large notch (Timeline: I quit just before this because I saw the trouble ahead), and WotLK is not going to fix that by any measure, quite the opposite I do believe. Anyway my point is this, I used to get mad when some LvL 60 alliance town would camp my LvL 20 undead zone for easy kills (Honor system kinda remedied this) while waiting to get into his BG, but even then I could hide in the town, and the guards could hold 'em off (I have some rather fond memories of watching 2 alliance guys getting chased out of town by NPCs but now one level 80's just going to walk in blow up the NPCs and all the lower lvl guys while not giving a damn about the dishonour. But oddly enough I liked being stuck in town while 3 lvl ?? guys were circling the town, and occasionally making a break for it just to have an arcane missile slam me in the back because it was fun. I fail to see where the fun is in getting you're whole town ganked until some friendly lvl 80/70s show up and kill him.
Short version: Until Blizzard fixes the core game, and set's it so that it works like it did pre BC, it will always remain in my "love lost" pile.
the main reason why other mmo's pick on wow is because wow is oficialy number 1 and there not easy and i think everyones forgeting wow is the biggest mmo on the planet
First of all I would like to clear up a few things about World Of Warcraft. #1 Basically every mmorpg has healing spells, spell casters, Melee users ect, Now from all the mmorpg's Ive played I would say Lineage 2, at that one temple that has all the pretty lights stole it from final fantasy game, and ect, because of the way the lights are, they are an exact match from the game, However they did not actually steal it, they took an idea, and remade it them selves, same goes for world of warcraft, they havent really stolen anything, because every mmorpg has the same model's on some things, and same graphics on some things, but its always a little different. For Instance, In World Of Warcraft, Lightning shoots from a shman lightning form like it doesnt strike from the sky, But on Final Fantasy XI, and a couple of other old mmorpg I played, The 4th Comming it does, Am I suppose to say they stole it, or did they just use an idea maybe, or a sugguestion? #2 World Of Warcraft, is in my opinion the best mmorpg on the market, here is why Most mmorpg's that have updated their stuff every 6 months or 1 year like Lineage 2 always puts a nerf to make something better, to make one class a bit more powerfull than another, Also I lost a level 55 on lineage 2, because they nerfed my character a lot, and I could not play it no more, and then I had my account hacked, and lost a lot of my gear, it was someone, or a corrupt gm Server side using a porgram or something, and they took a packaged sell for free, without paying for the other stuff that was there, Although I did have packaged sell checked, maybe it was corruption in the game client, or lag between server, or something, but it was taken, all lost, I lost all my money, items, ect, although it doesnt seem like it was a glitch because it was a naked dwarf who took them, although in World Of Warcraft, their changes ive seen so far have not effected me at all in any of my classes, Although some people say mages are over powered, and warlocks are over powered, its still true, a person with skill can kill them, Ive killed mage as a paladin before having a level 50 sum pally vs 50 sum mage, and I won, not saying it was easy, but its possible. Also another thing people forget mage's are suppose to be the most powerfull instant damage spell caster in game, just as pallies are suppose to tank a lot of damage before dying, and priests are suppose to be healers. #3 Increaseing Cap to level 70, Basically when you increase talents, skills, ect. you arent going to get them free, as a mage, as well as a warlock, and paladin, ive gotten all classses in the game to level 30, and my mage to level 65 almost level 70 in 24 hours play time on my mage alone, and thats not that long, considering I get more talents, and considering in lineage 2, and most korean, and japaneese based mmorpg's it takes a lot longer like weeks to grind, For those of you who want to complain about this, #1 Either Quit World OF Warcraft, Or #2 Just get to level 60 forget about level 70. #4 The Only Thing I find hard about World Of Warcraft, is finding the best gear in the game at level 70, I hear its T6, at the moment, but not sure. ( OFF TOPIC) #5 Ive Played the Following games, and I Quit Their Services For One Of The Following Reasons. Bad Customer Service, Training Time Took Forever, and no Point to it, Nerfs/Cost Of items because of Ebayers, Game Play Sucked. Final Fantasy XI, Is A great team game, but on my server, it takes way long to get a group, and you cant even really solo at all as some classes, unless you go beast master, But has a nice story line, and cut scenes. Lineage 2, Was so damn great, I loved the graphics when I first started, & I still miss the music from Elf Village ):, however they ruined my level 55 sorcerer, and I had my gear stolen, GM didnt do anything, and I lost my character due to nerf, so I quit. EVE Online, Great MMORPG for pvp, but the thing I dont like about it how much training time it takes to train a skill, ID rather kill npc bosses, and mobs, and fourm gangs to gain points to level things up the classic way than wait hours, days, months to train skills to level it up, I mean look at all that play time wasted, nothing to do but wait a lil over a year till ready for all out pvp like the top players, and no way to catch up to someone way higher than you in about 6 months like other mmorpg's. T4C was a great grat game, I still miss it although 16 bit graphics or lower werent that great, But www.t4cbible.com is a great game, and the reason it got ruined is because this guy from a server called xavus started being a prick, not watching out for his customers, and it shut down, I lost my character on his server, and also because people all started paying to host the game with their own rules, and everything now theres no reason to play, because no one is ever on T4C anymore, because we got 8-10 servers competeing for each other players, members, they refuse to merge, and work together as 3, one for Role Play, Normal Game, and PVP, but they wont. By the way the story of the game is a great story too if you read it. Planet Side, I loved this game at first, but guess what, they never update the game really, with any new veh's, new weapons, or anything, so after playing for 7 hours it gets old. Neocron 2 Great game, but the boring part is this having to look for all these weapon parts, have your armor repaired, ect, and by the way, as a newb when you die with LE in your veh, still at Regants you gotta walk all the way back, it gets boring. O hey, if you can put up with this stuff, and like the PVP then this game is for you. Guild Wars, Its an ok game, does get kinda boring, the only reason I play it is because its free. 9 Dragons, Itsa great game, but Donations to acclaim games sucks, heres why, a 4 month package only goes on one character, and to get it on 2nd you would have to use 4k points for each one, when a 4 month package should work on whole account for that time, and give potions and stuff tradeable between characters, but no they screwed it up, not to mention no one ever talks, and to shout it costs real life money, so thats why I stopped playing it. RF online again another great game at first I thought, but after paying $70 rush delivery for the CD when it came out it was awsome, now everyone is level 70, no one crafts lower level items, All my characters are lower level, and I cant find any gear, or good weapons to buy them, because no one uses the auction house, its annoying as hell. Note to all. The Word fre mmorpg means its FREE, however theres always a hidden catch on most like item mail, so those who pay get way special advantages over you in pvp, and pve, thats why Id rather pay my $9 a month for World Of Warcraft, and get the same advantages everyone does, because IF I donated it would still cost more than paying $9 a month over all.
wait, best mmorpg on the market? I'm sorry I thought I was talking to somebody intelligent
The following statement is true: I just told a lie
wait, best mmorpg on the market? I'm sorry I thought I was talking to somebody intelligent
When you are unable to engage in any kind of debate without resorting to insulting people, you automatically lose. This works the same way as in real life as it does on the internet.
But this is typical of life around here isn't it? It goes like this.
1) Guy flames WoW and it's player base for specific reason.
2) WoW player rebukes said reason with logic.
3) Guy insults WoW poster.
Very intelligent indeed!
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Comments
Its like a h****r cheep and easy to forget....
Content: I've played WoW for a little over a year now. I've played pretty much every race and class. I've put in hundreds of hours and frankly enjoy the content. There's still a lot of "go kill 10 dogs" type stuff, but there are also a lot of fun, weird, or intricate quests (especially since TBC). As far as PvP content I admi the game falls short, but BGs and arenas can still be engaging and fun, esp with friends. Raids are certainly fun, and I enjoy raiding as one of my guild's tanks.
Company services: To date, the worst response time I've had in regards to a ticket was 2 hours. Typically, it's a matter of minutes. The GMs have been friendly and polite, and I've never felt an issue wasn't resolved to my satisfaction. And I've had few real issues; the most common was reporting goldsellers, but since the recent patches those no longer plague me.
Community: I have friends in WoW. I belong to a medium-sized, friendly guild that still manages to raid and have fun as a family at the same time. I love em. I play on an RP server, and find (for the most part) immature kids are few and far between. The overall community has been pretty good to me.
Graphics: Not the best out there, but there are still areas I consider gorgeous. And the shots I've seen of the next expansion look better than ever.
Music: Honestly I don't care much about game music. I turn it off and play my MP3s. Mind you WoW needs a good built-in MP3 player, the addons I've tried so far I found lacking. But anyway, I can't judge WoW's music cause I just don't listen.
Gameplay: PvE ganmeplay is great, esp in the higher-level instances. There it's all about teamwork and coordination, and I love the challenge of it . Solo play is possible with all clases (although not enjoyable with some builds). PVP...well read what I said above about PvP
Lore: Dude. Warcraft. You can choke to death on the amount of lore here.
Server stability: I've rarely had problems, and NOTHING like what I've seen in other games (EVE, CoX, and AO to name a couple).
Now, is WoW the perfect game? Of course not. Is it the best game for everyone? Of course not. Is it the best game for me? Not entirely. Do I still love playing it? Yes. And that's what matters.
Yeah killing 25000 bugs to get enough faction for an epic is great "content". Oh and the battlegrounds are great, who thought you could turn pvp into a grind? The pve is fun and challenging too, you look up a boss on the internet and then pattern yourself to match the script, its the same every time because variation would be unfun. Warcraft? Lore? What, is there a source besides warcraft 1,2,3? Isn't that like trying to take lore outa a cartoon designed to sell toys? The worst thing about WoW is that it has so many subscribers that all the other developers want to copy it, so it not only ruined its own game but also ruins all the other ones. The only thing fun about this game is griefing but that gets boring after a month or so.
Are you a Pavlovian Fish Biscuit Addict? Get Help Now!
I will play no more MMORPGs until somethign good comes out!
By killing bugs I presume you're talking about the AQ grind. First off, they're changed the faction for AQ to make it easier, secondly, since then they've improved that a lot. Faction grinds post TBC are MUCH easier and rarely require massive repetitve grinding. There's a few pesky ones (Scryer/Aldor...ugh!) But gear as good or better can be achieved via arena rewards or raid drops.
PvP grind? BGs can be that way I'll admit. If I had any complaint about Blizz at all (OK I have a few, but the worst is...) it's that they killed world PvP. I still would like to see that fixed.
PvE raids? Yes you can look up a strategy on the interwubs. Try to get 10-40 people to follow it, learning how. Knowing is one thing, doing is another. Or better yet, you and your guild develop a new tactic, a better one.
Lore? Um...yes there's 3 games..and several novels..and the tabletop RPG..and new lore created in game. Go read WoWwiki or even wikipedia sometime. There's tons of backstory. Oh and taking lore from a cartoon made just to sell toys...go look up how much lore there is for GI Joe or the Transformers. Cause, guess what those shows were? Tell THEIR fans there's no lore.
As for other developers I'll agree with you..it's a sad fact of marketing that developers take the safe road and copy what they know works.
And Griefing..meh..if I wanna grief morons I'll go play counterstrike. Although I'll still agree that I'd like a better pvp system. but it's still a good game. To me. if it isn't to you, that's your opinion and I don't fault ya.
just want to say , for all retards that are like 19years old, and have no idea of the world.
Warcraft is not the first ork vs human idea, the first (in tabletop ) was WARHammer, it is and i stay the creation of wow , it is, if anything the reason for warcraft.
the story runs very close to warhammer, but yes wow has made changes to that , making it individual, alowing it to be view by the public as , well not a copy, but it so is all the races are there, the Lore , the gameplay , names , everything CAN be viewed as a copy from warhammer.
understand nomatter what you think, wow was not the first game, just the only one to use cinima ads, and well timed moves to make it big.
so if your going to base a game review on say any fantesy game PLZ for the love of god , dont base it on wow copy ideas
thanks
I didn't want to do this, because it's just going to sound like complaining to most people, but maybe someone will care (ya, right, lol). Anyway, here's the issues I had with WoW. These problems and dislikes forced me to quit.
1. Far too much grinding. Raiding the same boss over and over and over and over (and over) just to TRY and get some rare item irritated the living hell out of me. I really dislike games that are gear centric. I'd like a game that focuses more on skill usage. I also dislike being forced to join some huge group just to get a good item. I wasted so much time just looking for groups, I began to hate the people I was playing with.
2. The classes are just too homogenized. Too many skills overlap with other classes, making every character feel like some cheesy cookie-cutter class regardless of what you do. I suppose the fact that everyone looks almost exactly the same doesn't help either.
3. PvP is horribly unbalanced. Certain classes just don't have any real disadvantages in PvP and thus dominate the scoreboards. Then there's the lack of any real purpose in PvP besides (GASP!) better gear, and with no penalty for losing, PvP gets real boring real fast. I suppose it all boils down to game mechanics in the end. PvP in WoW plays like a lag-ridden FPS game with crappy graphics. What happened to the games that drew you into their world and rallied you to their cause?
4. Travel is a pain. Fly, fly, fly... fly, fly, WHY? I pay for to be entertained, to have fun. Watching my character do the same, boring tasks is not fun for me. Quests are particularly boring. Why must I have to travel all over the place just to get some stupid quest item? I guess it's because the more time I waste, the more money blizzard makes. That alone made me want to stop playing.
5. Too much micro management. I don't like farming for potions or dealing with 10 gazillion components. My backpack was always stuffed, mostly with useless quest related crap.
I suppose I had some fun playing WoW. It's not a bad game, but these issues were enough to make me quit.
Originally posted by Sovren1Horribly flawed logic going on here.
First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe).
Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them.
The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity.
To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs".
If you enjoy it play it, if you don't, then don't. It really is that simple!
No signature, I don't have a pen
only reason wow got sucsess is because of the market this game is made for - cusual players
wow like many outher mmo's is a raid-based game.
what made wow different from games like Everquest, is that raiding isnt only primary for the continues player.. but also for the cusual player. reason for this is, most of the dungeon encounters in wow is instance based (where most outher games have open encounters) these instances got a auto-save future, something that makes people able to finish it over longer time..
instanced dungons also means, you will not see outher players than your own raid, and the encounters are always the same..that also means you can make a strategy on what to do, even before you have started.. something that saves lots of time.
outher reasons:
* Extremly easy to use user interface
* Level design
* Cute character design that appels to both women & younger audience..
numbers does not mean a thing..
ejay has sold more than pro tools, does that mean ejay is better?
windows paint has "sold" more than photoshop. does that mean paint is better?
Originally posted by Sovren1Horribly flawed logic going on here.
First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe).
Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them.
The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity.
To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs".
And yet you use flawed analogy to counter his analogy. Perhaps his analogy is flawed, but yours is much worse. The McDonalds comparison is easily debunked and has been on many occaisions. First of all, WoW costs roughly the same as other MMOs that you might compare it to, such as EQ2 and LOTRO or even EVE - so the cheap and cheerful connotations evaporate.
Secondly, with regards to the "WoW is McDonalds quality" argument; put your anti-WoW pitchforks down for a minute, play the Devil's Advocate, or simply engage your brains and consider this: WoW dilutes its content with time to a lesser extent than, say EQ2. You'll spend much longer in one area in EQ2, looking at the same art, doing killing more of the same mobs, than you would in WoW. Now to me diluting something in that way lessons the quality of the experience.
There's a quest in Runnyeye in EQ2, for example, that requires you to kill literally hundreds of goblins. What makes this worse is that encounters in EQ2 are typically longer - no more skillful, you're just waiting for abilities to refresh more often than you would in WoW.
It's why people wrongly accuse WoW as being easy, because it doesn't take you as long to do certain things. This doesn't make things easier, it just wastes less of the time so that the content you're consuming is less diluted. WoW is the juicy steak, and the other MMOs are the cheap burgers.
That's where your logic is flawed.
Now I don't dispute that other MMOs have features appear to broaden or add depth to their games, but these features are usually unpolished, don't contribute to gameplay, or are simply fluff. Like a sachet of tomato ketchup with your fries, they add a bit of flavour but theres nothing substantial there.
There are many ways in which you can criticize WoW, but to attack its quality is not one of them. It is the most polished, well paced and enjoyable MMO out there. It might lack that 'epic' feeling of your Everquests or EVE, but this feeling comes at a high penalty of time, and those of us with families, jobs and responsibilites simply do not have time to enjoy these games to they extent they can in WoW.
If you're single and have a lot of spare time, then those games are very rewarding. I cannot imagine how people enjoy active sociable lives while playing more time-consuming games than WoW, which is already considered by a great many to be a life stealer. These days, while I enjoy my mid 20s I have to draw the line with WoW, it's the most socially acceptable MMO out there made by Blizzard, who none can disagree are a great game company, and gaming is a lifelong hobby.
And of course, it all comes down to what you like. Some people say WoW is too casual, others say it's too time consuming. Some say the quest system is repetitive - and would prefer to simply grind mobs if you would believe it. Some say WoW has no PvP, others say PvP is the only thing worth doing.
These are just typical, yet extreme opinions from very opinionated people that grace our boards and throw giant wads of shit in the direction of WoW and the people that play it. I can play WoW, and EQ2, and EVE and I see the qualities in all. I defend WoW the most because its the game criticized the most for the wrong reasons. I would even go to say that these 3 games are the top 3 MMOs out there, and being generous, would say that they are on par with each other if you're accustomed to the type of gameplay each offers.
It all comes down to the fact that WoW is popular and a popular game has a lot more critics. An objective mind knows differently, and considering I've experienced most of what these games have to offer, I feel that I am safely objective. WoW haters will tell you I'm a fanboy, but that's only because their perspective is warped so much around hating WoW that any amount of defense or rebuke is considered zealotic.
Enjoy your burger.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
WoW best mmo my @$$. WoW just has the most subscribers. I play 1 70 and a 60 the only way to get anywhere is to be a hardcore idiot who dedicates 5 hours a night "excludeing" sundays?Also it's very hard to get into a good PvE guild because there so worried about exp and gear so it makes it very hard for new players to get into the endgame raid dungeons. Plus flying mounts cost like 2000-4000 gold?WoW is a very time consuming game and its boring
WoW best mmo my @$$. WoW just has the most subscribers. I play 1 70 and a 60 the only way to get anywhere is to be a hardcore idiot who dedicates 5 hours a night "excludeing" sundays?Also it's very hard to get into a good PvE guild because there so worried about exp and gear so it makes it very hard for new players to get into the endgame raid dungeons. Plus flying mounts cost like 2000-4000 gold?WoW is a very time consuming game and its boring
Looks like you haven't seen the end games of other MMOs, I think you're in for a shock. I recommend changing genres if you think that WoW is time consuming compared to other MMOs. What other MMOs have you played for as long as WoW, and how are their end games any better?
I suspect you haven't even played them. I suspect that WoW is your first MMO and you've become burned out on it. There's no other logical explanation, when you consider that you're doing EXACTLY THE SAME kind of things in other MMOs at their end game.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
People cant really expect to see end game instances and stuff in WoW if you dont put some effort in it. People who want that are like ones who comes to my gym...."ooo i wana do workout once a week and look like Arnold in one month..."
-------------------->
Would you like some cheese with that whine?
Picking apart one line is very easy to do.
ie: What's popular must be desirable or else it wouldn't be popular.
To say what most may or may not or cannot do is YOU speaking for too many that YOU do not know. Just because YOU think, doesn't make it so. I guess I give people more credit than you. Some people may not just be all about style(my opinion), Some may be about functionality(my opinion). I could easily say the flip side of asking the average person which shoe was better and they would pick the one that enhanced a function they were looking for, my opinion because I actually wouldn't know unless it was done. Good looking shit fails too you know. Video game wise this is even more prevalent.
The comparison between Nike and WoW isn't what I was trying to do. It was asked if a product could be named that could basically be popular and of better quality than it's competition. So I used the Nike company as a whole to show why that brand (as a whole) provides equal or better quality than it's competitors. It IS a price game and Nike pays and makes the most. Why? because they have shitty quality? Nah, don't think so. Because they have great marketing, well yeah but that only compounds the quality they offer. Also, I used Brands because just like I said(well something to the effect), Some BRANDS (Nike)PRIDE THEMSELVES ON PUTTING OUT EXTREMELY HIGH QUALITY ITEMS/ PRODUCTS(AirMax '90, or Jordan 17's). It's not always manufacturer's trying to slip one by or pull one over on the populace. That's too blanket.
I agree that the quality of WoW is irrelevant. That wasn't my argument. I still play the game. Getting bored of it, but I still play cause I have goals ingame I wanna reach.
My logic is flawed only if I were comparing Nike to WoW which is dumb. I know Nike is a brand like Blizzard. I know that Nike is a shoe company and not a Gaming Co. Apples and Shirt ties. But I guess that's your style, assuming we people to be gullible and ignorant.
Pardon me, had to do this in edit form...thought I had quoted an earlier post, but had replied as a new post instead by accident.
Originally posted by Neosapience
, "Horribly flawed logic going on here. First off, a brand is not a specific item. Nike sells all kinds of shoe types with different styles and prices. We're talking about WoW (specific shoe), not Blizzard (the brand of shoe). Second, what's popular is not the same was what's desirable. Quality is something that most people cannot distinguish without some form of comparison. Most people go by price, but if you took two pairs of shoes that had no logos and asked the average person to tell you which one was better, they would simply pick the one that has a style that appeals to them. They wouldn't have any clue as to how to gauge the actual quality of the shoes. In fact, manufactures rely on this when marketing their products. People are gullible and ignorant which allows smart people to get rich off them. The quality of WoW is irrelevant to most people, they like the style and are easily amused, hence it's popularity. To quote a phrase - "WoW is the McDonalds of MMOs"."
Blizzard does nothing original. They market for the value of keeping people in their grasp for fees. Sony runs their games much better than Blizzard and Blizzard's model is to appeal to masses and offer the minimal. Not like Black Temple (getting to or getting through) is difficult. How many times are they gonna reuse ideas of boss encounters? Seriously. They lack everything a true indepth MMORPG is.
GLADLY CANCELLED MY WOW ACCOUNT AFTER BEING IN BT ~ Blizzard has no intuition or creativeness left in their dry veins.
/bye
Retired Max LvL and Raiding for - EQ - DAoC - Dungeon Runners - WoW - LoTR:Online - GW/All Expansions - CoH/V - SWG *** Currently Playing EQ2 *** Awaiting - PoTBS!
the main reason why other mmo's pick on wow is because wow is oficialy number 1 and there not easy and i think everyones forgeting wow is the biggest mmo on the planet
Long version: I respect your point but they're not really succeeding, if they were there would be a lot less haters and retired WoW boxes (like the one I have gathering dust over there in the corner). I mean if they have 9 million acounts, then they're doing something right. But in all that trying to make everyone happy they ended up pissing people like me off, and botching the core game. WoW was (in my opinion) a great game before BC, which brought it down a rather large notch (Timeline: I quit just before this because I saw the trouble ahead), and WotLK is not going to fix that by any measure, quite the opposite I do believe. Anyway my point is this, I used to get mad when some LvL 60 alliance town would camp my LvL 20 undead zone for easy kills (Honor system kinda remedied this) while waiting to get into his BG, but even then I could hide in the town, and the guards could hold 'em off (I have some rather fond memories of watching 2 alliance guys getting chased out of town by NPCs but now one level 80's just going to walk in blow up the NPCs and all the lower lvl guys while not giving a damn about the dishonour. But oddly enough I liked being stuck in town while 3 lvl ?? guys were circling the town, and occasionally making a break for it just to have an arcane missile slam me in the back because it was fun. I fail to see where the fun is in getting you're whole town ganked until some friendly lvl 80/70s show up and kill him.
Short version: Until Blizzard fixes the core game, and set's it so that it works like it did pre BC, it will always remain in my "love lost" pile.
"Hooba Jooba what now?"
wait, best mmorpg on the market? I'm sorry I thought I was talking to somebody intelligent
The following statement is true: I just told a lie
When you are unable to engage in any kind of debate without resorting to insulting people, you automatically lose. This works the same way as in real life as it does on the internet.
But this is typical of life around here isn't it? It goes like this.
1) Guy flames WoW and it's player base for specific reason.
2) WoW player rebukes said reason with logic.
3) Guy insults WoW poster.
Very intelligent indeed!
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...