Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment.
/bows deeply...
All I want is the truth Just gimme some truth John Lennon
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment. /bows deeply...
You wont find any mature politics anywhere. It always will boil down to mickey mouse politics. This years election will be really bad, with George Soros funding the Clinton train of "Move-on.org" idiocy. So if we can't get it right in real life, what makes anyone think politics are viable in mass market mmo? They just aren't.
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of: "I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
I find it kinda funny, I find it kinda sad, The dreams in which I'm dieing are the best I've ever had.
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by vajuras
okay so if role play is more important when it comes to PVP try this
pick a totally gimped character for role playing purposes. go try it. next, step into a PVP zone. Yep there are games like that where you can do it. like city of heroes. many Classes are all out gimp in PVP and those classes u never see them in the PVP zones. roleplay != PVP
Next, if roleplay is more important then do this. take a game like WoW. Tell your buddy to pick the other side. now, go ahead and roleplay
roleplay < PVP PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning. common sense nothing else more to break down. class dismissed
I didn't say RP was more important - I said it offers a different perspective from a particular player view. Therefore Mr Teacher you lacked the awareness that for some it could offer added meaning when in RP, with friends for example.
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
Do you get the above options in an RvR system? And these are just Beta screens.
Dont forget you can set the mandatory boobie size to be accepted into guild - thats gotta be worth something to justify AC2 gamepaly coupled with AO scenery.
okay so if role play is more important when it comes to PVP try this
pick a totally gimped character for role playing purposes. go try it. next, step into a PVP zone. Yep there are games like that where you can do it. like city of heroes. many Classes are all out gimp in PVP and those classes u never see them in the PVP zones. roleplay != PVP
Next, if roleplay is more important then do this. take a game like WoW. Tell your buddy to pick the other side. now, go ahead and roleplay
roleplay < PVP PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning. common sense nothing else more to break down. class dismissed
I didn't say RP was more important - I said it offers a different perspective from a particular player view. Therefore Mr Teacher you lacked the awareness that for some it could offer added meaning when in RP, with friends for example.
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
im very sorry my post was directed at a guy above that post it was late and my head was not screwed on tight. I dont wanna piss off the AoC community and I find this discussion interesting.
I've been reading all the viewpoints trying to get an idea what keeps are instanced and what isnt
Thanks guys I should stop posting when its late good posts and viewpoints here.
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by Euthorus
AmazingAvery Do you get the above options in an RvR system? And these are just Beta screens.
Dont forget you can set the mandatory boobie size to be accepted into guild - thats gotta be worth something to justify AC2 gamepaly coupled with AO scenary.
What options? AC2 gameplay? you played AoC? AO scenery? futuristic > Fantasy ?
Thats nearly as bad as if I dare compare warhammer to WoW...
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment.
/bows deeply...
You wont find any mature politics anywhere. It always will boil down to mickey mouse politics. This years election will be really bad, with George Soros funding the Clinton train of "Move-on.org" idiocy. So if we can't get it right in real life, what makes anyone think politics are viable in mass market mmo? They just aren't.
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
"I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
LOL...point well taken...
Too bad we have so many FPSers out there...most just trash mouth and wanna drive-by ya....jeesh...grow up ...
All I want is the truth Just gimme some truth John Lennon
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by vajuras
im very sorry my post was directed at a guy above that post it was late and my head was not screwed on tight. I dont wanna piss off the AoC community and I find this discussion interesting.
I've been reading all the viewpoints trying to get an idea what keeps are instanced and what isnt Thanks guys I should stop posting when its late good posts and viewpoints here.
No worries, didn't piss anyone off I don't think. It was pretty late! But yes if the stupid comments from others can be left at the door, im all for exploring different viewpoints on PvP being meaningful and peoples perceptions of game mechanic and style that they see fit in their opinion of accomplishing that.
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment. /bows deeply...
play EVE Online such things cannot be explained even the critics praise that part of EVE
You won't see a 'meaningful' PvP game developed unless that company is willing to put out a 'niche' game. Sorry but the casuals and the carebears rule the market, a majority(surprisingly) of people will not play a MMO where it is possible to be PK'd and lose items that you spent hours working to get. Players simply will not play a MMO in great number where it is possible to completely lose the land or your house that your 'player town' is on. While that would be fun and realistic it simply is not viable in the MMO market nowadays where the $$$$$$ drives developers visions. Find a developer that is able to convince a major an investor, "Hey we're going to design a game that historically will not attract a huge number of players."
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment.
/bows deeply...
You wont find any mature politics anywhere. It always will boil down to mickey mouse politics. This years election will be really bad, with George Soros funding the Clinton train of "Move-on.org" idiocy. So if we can't get it right in real life, what makes anyone think politics are viable in mass market mmo? They just aren't.
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
"I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
I never said PVP was better then RP I play on real role playing servers where it is strictly enforced. I said RP != PVP. I elaborated on it in my blog RolePlay and PVP
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment.
/bows deeply...
You wont find any mature politics anywhere. It always will boil down to mickey mouse politics. This years election will be really bad, with George Soros funding the Clinton train of "Move-on.org" idiocy. So if we can't get it right in real life, what makes anyone think politics are viable in mass market mmo? They just aren't.
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
"I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
LOL...point well taken...
Too bad we have so many FPSers out there...most just trash mouth and wanna drive-by ya....jeesh...grow up ...
um I've been registered at official AoC boards for a long time now. If you read the FAQ for AoC more cloesly you'll see mentioning of things like 'aim' and using terrain for cover. These are concepts from FPS.
I just never read up much on the keeps in the border kingdoms. I'm a little interested for the player skill they promise and GvG (sieges and such).
i just never post 'here'. Games I'm really interested in I go to official boards
Your cities are in instances, so they can't be attacked. You can attack keeps, but each guild can only have one keep. So what do you do after you get a keep? Nothing.
No empire building, no politics, ne real virtual worlds. I don't see why people want a game with no point to it.
The PVp battles may be fun, but you don't need a MMORPG to do that. You could just make a FPS for that
I gave up on TR so i decided to see if i can gather any info on this game,to wich caught my eye awhile back.Your overview seems to me to be an honest one and doesn't give the game much hope.I laughed when i saw another post,where the guy started by saying this game is oustanding for me,what's in it? lol.
I noticed another player mention "What game has meaningful PVP".Well just because there isn't any game with meaningful PVP out there,doesn't make it right.I totally agree with GHOUL in saying PVP belongs in FPS[first person shooters]not mmo's.Not only that PVP in a FPS ,you can search around till you find a playable server.In a MMO that is about longevity,you will be on one server for ever,so any lag problems your done like dinner.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
okay so if role play is more important when it comes to PVP try this
pick a totally gimped character for role playing purposes. go try it. next, step into a PVP zone. Yep there are games like that where you can do it. like city of heroes. many Classes are all out gimp in PVP and those classes u never see them in the PVP zones. roleplay != PVP
Next, if roleplay is more important then do this. take a game like WoW. Tell your buddy to pick the other side. now, go ahead and roleplay
roleplay < PVP PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning. common sense nothing else more to break down. class dismissed
I didn't say RP was more important - I said it offers a different perspective from a particular player view. Therefore Mr Teacher you lacked the awareness that for some it could offer added meaning when in RP, with friends for example.
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
im very sorry my post was directed at a guy above that post it was late and my head was not screwed on tight. I dont wanna piss off the AoC community and I find this discussion interesting.
I've been reading all the viewpoints trying to get an idea what keeps are instanced and what isnt
Thanks guys I should stop posting when its late good posts and viewpoints here.
It was late when I posted that as well, but I shouldn't make any kind of excuse. I am tired of defending my right to RP, as its not only been under attack by other players, but the companies themselves.
I do appologize, as after reading your posts I misconstrued some of your comments because I really didn't feel like reading into them and getting to what you really meant.
I find it kinda funny, I find it kinda sad, The dreams in which I'm dieing are the best I've ever had.
I gave up on TR so i decided to see if i can gather any info on this game,to wich caught my eye awhile back.Your overview seems to me to be an honest one and doesn't give the game much hope.I laughed when i saw another post,where the guy started by saying this game is oustanding for me,what's in it? lol. I noticed another player mention "What game has meaningful PVP".Well just because there isn't any game with meaningful PVP out there,doesn't make it right.I totally agree with GHOUL in saying PVP belongs in FPS[first person shooters]not mmo's.Not only that PVP in a FPS ,you can search around till you find a playable server.In a MMO that is about longevity,you will be on one server for ever,so any lag problems your done like dinner.
Well, first of all, I believe that PvP is one of, if not the important thing in an MMO. FPS just have a different kind of PvP. Saying that PvP belongs in FPSs is ignorant, just like saying stories arcs belong in RPGs. Secondly, when I asked "What game has meaningful PvP?", I was pointing out that this game has more meaningful PvP than most games recent MMOs. Every single game has a major flaw in it's PvP (even this one) but the flaws in this seem to me to less detrimental (just my tastes). Thirdly, the OP is just trying to shine a bad light on the game, so while being "honest" what he's saying is a lot of half truths. EG: "Your cities are in instances, so they can't be attacked." is false, your keep can be attacked, and it's PvE equivalent can be attacked by NPCs. "You can attack keeps, but each guild can only have one keep. So what do you do after you get a keep? Nothing." is just a half truth, in reality you get rewards for sacking a city. The bigger the city the better the rewards the devs said. Let's not forget that you A) Defend your keep as well, and there's PvP outside of cities too. "No empire building, no politics, ne real virtual worlds." Which are all half truths. You build a city, but not an empire. The politics are minor (who do I attack?), and that last bit doesn't make any sense. Lastly "The PVp battles may be fun, but you don't need a MMORPG to do that. You could just make a FPS for that", this is just bad, FPSs are not my forte. Too much twitch, no development, poor stories (generally), Not much to do besides shoot. No thanks, I'll stick to MMORPGs thanks. The difference is in an MMO you can really get connected to your character (), and it plays out differently than an FPS too. I only play them when I want something to do for 5 to 10 minutes. So, if you've managed to read all this congratulations.
roleplay < PVP PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning.
Actually Vaj, the people designing AOC disagree with your viewpoint.
Gaute Godager: No we have decided on two types of servers, and their difference being how we handle PvP. A) Massive glorious Siege PvP in the Border Kingdoms, Tier Based Mini-game PvP and Drunken brawling as the only PvP options on the "normal" servers. As in 100% voluntary PvP. RPvP servers. Here you find Roleplaying and free-for-all except in hubs. This is our decision on this (and I'm trying to coin the RPvP abbreviation of course ;p) because in Hyboria (Conan's world) there is no Role Playing without being able to kill someone. It is as simple as this, killing your friends is always in character.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
roleplay < PVP PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning.
Actually Vaj, the people designing AOC disagree with your viewpoint.
Gaute Godager: No we have decided on two types of servers, and their difference being how we handle PvP. A) Massive glorious Siege PvP in the Border Kingdoms, Tier Based Mini-game PvP and Drunken brawling as the only PvP options on the "normal" servers. As in 100% voluntary PvP. RPvP servers. Here you find Roleplaying and free-for-all except in hubs. This is our decision on this (and I'm trying to coin the RPvP abbreviation of course ;p) because in Hyboria (Conan's world) there is no Role Playing without being able to kill someone. It is as simple as this, killing your friends is always in character.
please read my blog RolePlay and PVP for more clarity, thanks.
I much prefer just writing a blog on a good topic like that. forum posts, they get misconstrued. Blogs, now those are much mroe clear and better places to discuss good general topics like that
boy did this thread get derailed. ghoul31 it would be interesting to read a blog from you on this topic whereas you could define good PVP parameters and elaborate on your experiences in Shadowbane. I guarantee you it would be very interesting if you invested the time
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta . If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta . If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta . If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta . If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
I can understand the allure of WAR for the RvR aspects but right now I unfortunately can't agree on WoW.
this is the rule- we won't see PVP really get any better until the rigid Class/Level system is abandoned. I'll explain my views later in a blog
that being said I look forward to AoC because it appears to be the less evil MMO too me atm and that is something I cant elaborate on right now either (edit- I mean I anticipate the most between Spellborn, WAR, TR if you feel me)
This is just another game with meaningless PVp Your cities are in instances, so they can't be attacked. You can attack keeps, but each guild can only have one keep. So what do you do after you get a keep? Nothing.
No empire building, no politics, ne real virtual worlds. I don't see why people want a game with no point to it. The PVp battles may be fun, but you don't need a MMORPG to do that. You could just make a FPS for that.
By those standards, name one single MMO that's coming out with meaningful PvP. WAR PvP is just as meaningful, except you can't build your own city, or really chose which city to siege. DF PvP would be meaningful to a degree, too bad I'll be on my deathbed when it comes out. TCoS will be less meaningful than any of these. PotBS would be meaningful, better too if you didn't have to do dozens of quests just to make it so pirates can PvP, even more so that you can PvP. Count me out of that.
Secondly FPS games don't offer the same kind of action as an MMO. With an MMO it's more paced. Combat has usually comes in the form of a Group vs Group melee. FPSs are usually 1-2 on 1-2 at a distance. MMOs require strategy and AoC will have some skill, whereas FPSs are only skill, if you can even call it that. It's more like an ability to twitch with accuracy.
BTW, you get stuff from sieging. And from what I can remember from dev quotes, everyone will have their own place in a siege.
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta . If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
you're really doing everyone a disservice I still think you should write a blog otherwise you'll just be writing up this post again in a few months hehe. If you put it all in a blog you can attack AoC / WAR together in one blow. haha, sounds funny but true. I know where you're coming from but it would be way more clearer if you could explain Shadowbane more to folks.
Comments
Since we are talking meaningful PvP, I would like to know what some you consider politics in a guild vs guild environment. After several years playing Lineage 2 and seeing an open PvP environment and very strong-felt politics on old Gustin server deteriorate into middle-school pie throwing antics..in your face trash talk, and absolutely immature bafoonery, it would be nice to hear from some of you all on what you would consider a political viewpoint as one might find in an MMO playing environment.
/bows deeply...
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
"I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
I find it kinda funny, I find it kinda sad, The dreams in which I'm dieing are the best I've ever had.
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
AmazingAvery
Do you get the above options in an RvR system? And these are just Beta screens.
Dont forget you can set the mandatory boobie size to be accepted into guild - thats gotta be worth something to justify AC2 gamepaly coupled with AO scenery.
FUNCOM - putting the FUN in disFUNctional !
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
im very sorry my post was directed at a guy above that post it was late and my head was not screwed on tight. I dont wanna piss off the AoC community and I find this discussion interesting.
I've been reading all the viewpoints trying to get an idea what keeps are instanced and what isnt
Thanks guys I should stop posting when its late good posts and viewpoints here.
What options? AC2 gameplay? you played AoC? AO scenery? futuristic > Fantasy ?
Thats nearly as bad as if I dare compare warhammer to WoW...
Poor attempt mate, but nice colours!
Really well presented constructive comment there
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
LOL...point well taken..."I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
Too bad we have so many FPSers out there...most just trash mouth and wanna drive-by ya....jeesh...grow up ...
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
No worries, didn't piss anyone off I don't think. It was pretty late! But yes if the stupid comments from others can be left at the door, im all for exploring different viewpoints on PvP being meaningful and peoples perceptions of game mechanic and style that they see fit in their opinion of accomplishing that.
vajuras = rock'em sock'em robots!
and you need to come to tuturoing my classroom starting @ 7:45..runs until 8:25!
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
play EVE Online such things cannot be explained even the critics praise that part of EVE
one word: EVE/CCP
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
"I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
I never said PVP was better then RP I play on real role playing servers where it is strictly enforced. I said RP != PVP. I elaborated on it in my blog RolePlay and PVP
Oh, and by the way, to the poster who says that PvP is better than RP, you really need to be more tolerant of others play styles. I don't care if you pvp, so why should it bother you that anyone else Rps? does it impede your play style? didn't think so.
Whats happening is the kids are starting to rot some of the mature players with the elitist mentality of:
LOL...point well taken..."I have played MMO's for years, therefore I'm right hahahaha" or their just to new to know any better.
Too bad we have so many FPSers out there...most just trash mouth and wanna drive-by ya....jeesh...grow up ...
um I've been registered at official AoC boards for a long time now. If you read the FAQ for AoC more cloesly you'll see mentioning of things like 'aim' and using terrain for cover. These are concepts from FPS.
I just never read up much on the keeps in the border kingdoms. I'm a little interested for the player skill they promise and GvG (sieges and such).
i just never post 'here'. Games I'm really interested in I go to official boards
This is just another game with meaningless PVp
Your cities are in instances, so they can't be attacked. You can attack keeps, but each guild can only have one keep. So what do you do after you get a keep? Nothing.
No empire building, no politics, ne real virtual worlds. I don't see why people want a game with no point to it.
The PVp battles may be fun, but you don't need a MMORPG to do that. You could just make a FPS for that
I gave up on TR so i decided to see if i can gather any info on this game,to wich caught my eye awhile back.Your overview seems to me to be an honest one and doesn't give the game much hope.I laughed when i saw another post,where the guy started by saying this game is oustanding for me,what's in it? lol.
I noticed another player mention "What game has meaningful PVP".Well just because there isn't any game with meaningful PVP out there,doesn't make it right.I totally agree with GHOUL in saying PVP belongs in FPS[first person shooters]not mmo's.Not only that PVP in a FPS ,you can search around till you find a playable server.In a MMO that is about longevity,you will be on one server for ever,so any lag problems your done like dinner.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Lets take this for example, many AoC guilds have some sort of affiliation to RP. This is probably due to the lore, being literature heavy. People have already started to make a background story for their character, some people may of spent alot of time on this or not doesn't matter, they have done it, say in a community of like minded people for fun. They log onto AoC upon release, on a RP-PvP server, (do the things I listed in post number 3), participate in a large scale battle in guild RP mode. Does this, or could this "participation" offer more meaning to someone in PvP in the RP situation/server that AoC caters for. Sure it could if you have an open mind...
Its obvious that the Lore is important to majority of people on the official boards, what Im trying to convey is potentially in PvP considering this, then facilitate in an RP-PvP server, bake @ 200 degrees for 40 minutes and you are going to get people who quite possibly might find added meaning to PvP, hence topic title.
Participation has meaning too you know. Participation, with extras, might have added meaning! The taking part does count, because you take something learned away, whether won or lost, making it again meaningful from a different perspective.
If you want to close your mind, like the OP (for different reasons), into thinking or generalising PvP into "PVP is about winning period. fighting with good friends and owning" and not taking into account other possibilites then you fail @ being a 'PvP Zen Master' - I agree with your comment, but my mind isn't closed to other options (for some).
To have meaningful PvP you first have to have participation, that in its own right could be sensitive to the type of server and also the player preferance. For some its about full loot, for others its the taking part that counts and for nearly all of us its about winning. For me no one enters into competition with the desire to lose.
At the end of the day the broad stroke of catering to most types, or possibilities, will always cater for more types of meaning in certain PvP situations.
im very sorry my post was directed at a guy above that post it was late and my head was not screwed on tight. I dont wanna piss off the AoC community and I find this discussion interesting.
I've been reading all the viewpoints trying to get an idea what keeps are instanced and what isnt
Thanks guys I should stop posting when its late good posts and viewpoints here.
It was late when I posted that as well, but I shouldn't make any kind of excuse. I am tired of defending my right to RP, as its not only been under attack by other players, but the companies themselves.I do appologize, as after reading your posts I misconstrued some of your comments because I really didn't feel like reading into them and getting to what you really meant.
I find it kinda funny, I find it kinda sad, The dreams in which I'm dieing are the best I've ever had.
Well, first of all, I believe that PvP is one of, if not the important thing in an MMO. FPS just have a different kind of PvP. Saying that PvP belongs in FPSs is ignorant, just like saying stories arcs belong in RPGs. Secondly, when I asked "What game has meaningful PvP?", I was pointing out that this game has more meaningful PvP than most games recent MMOs. Every single game has a major flaw in it's PvP (even this one) but the flaws in this seem to me to less detrimental (just my tastes). Thirdly, the OP is just trying to shine a bad light on the game, so while being "honest" what he's saying is a lot of half truths. EG: "Your cities are in instances, so they can't be attacked." is false, your keep can be attacked, and it's PvE equivalent can be attacked by NPCs. "You can attack keeps, but each guild can only have one keep. So what do you do after you get a keep? Nothing." is just a half truth, in reality you get rewards for sacking a city. The bigger the city the better the rewards the devs said. Let's not forget that you A) Defend your keep as well, and
there's PvP outside of cities too. "No empire building, no politics, ne real virtual worlds." Which are all half truths. You build a city, but not an empire. The politics are minor (who do I attack?), and that last bit doesn't make any sense. Lastly "The PVp battles may be fun, but you don't need a MMORPG to do that. You could just make a FPS for that", this is just bad, FPSs are not my forte. Too much twitch, no development, poor stories (generally), Not much to do besides shoot. No thanks, I'll stick to MMORPGs thanks. The difference is in an MMO you can really get connected to your character (
), and it plays out differently than an FPS too. I only play them when I want something to do for 5 to 10 minutes. So, if you've managed to read all this congratulations.
aoc.warcry.com/news/view/72914-Exclusive-Interview-with-Gaute-Godager
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Actually Vaj, the people designing AOC disagree with your viewpoint.aoc.warcry.com/news/view/72914-Exclusive-Interview-with-Gaute-Godager
your post has nothing to do with my post.
please read my blog RolePlay and PVP for more clarity, thanks.
I much prefer just writing a blog on a good topic like that. forum posts, they get misconstrued. Blogs, now those are much mroe clear and better places to discuss good general topics like that
boy did this thread get derailed. ghoul31 it would be interesting to read a blog from you on this topic whereas you could define good PVP parameters and elaborate on your experiences in Shadowbane. I guarantee you it would be very interesting if you invested the time
If you like pvp wait for warhammer. or play wow. this might be good too didn't get into beta
. If you like Pve play eq 1 untill something better ever comes out. Eq 2 isn't great. EQ 1 still best mmorpg on market.
www.myspace.com/solidwhitetuna
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
I really do hope it is a joke.
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
I can understand the allure of WAR for the RvR aspects but right now I unfortunately can't agree on WoW.
this is the rule- we won't see PVP really get any better until the rigid Class/Level system is abandoned. I'll explain my views later in a blog
that being said I look forward to AoC because it appears to be the less evil MMO too me atm and that is something I cant elaborate on right now either (edit- I mean I anticipate the most between Spellborn, WAR, TR if you feel me)
Secondly FPS games don't offer the same kind of action as an MMO. With an MMO it's more paced. Combat has usually comes in the form of a Group vs Group melee. FPSs are usually 1-2 on 1-2 at a distance. MMOs require strategy and AoC will have some skill, whereas FPSs are only skill, if you can even call it that. It's more like an ability to twitch with accuracy.
BTW, you get stuff from sieging. And from what I can remember from dev quotes, everyone will have their own place in a siege.
One word, Darkfall
is this a joke post? u think WOW is the best PVP game and eq1 is the best PVE game
This must be a joke
you're really doing everyone a disservice I still think you should write a blog otherwise you'll just be writing up this post again in a few months hehe. If you put it all in a blog you can attack AoC / WAR together in one blow. haha, sounds funny but true. I know where you're coming from but it would be way more clearer if you could explain Shadowbane more to folks.