Oh well. If you follow logic, warrior women should look more 'body buildy' than 'porn star' if you ask me.
And there was one saying earlier that there was few, if any warrior woman through our history. I beg to differ, www.lothene.org/others/women.html. And thats just one link. I can google alot more if needed, but that one should suffice for now.
Heh, and the wierdest thing, I do have a problem with death defying, gravity collapsing, over the top, huge boobs. Around a handful is more than enough for me . More attractive too. But thats probably cause I've gotten past my puberty, being an old fart and all
"warrior women" in history have mainly gotten by on treachery and deceit (hillary clinton & martha stewart being a modern day examples). personally i kinda dig the whole amazon/body building goddess thing, but when you look @ female body builders that haven't had operations they hardly have ANY breasts (certainly more than a mouth full tho). as a society we have for some reason shifted to scrawny broads over the more ample sturdy ones. and i kinda hate it.
when i think warrior woman i think of someone i could wrestle with (ok in jello.. FINE), not somebody who i would have to worry about breaking. i really hope they dont dumb anything in this game down, if anything they need to set an example at a grade A adult game (as opposed to all the softcore/hardcore b/s that has passed for adult so far ex:valerie, 2 moons, plumbers dont wear neck ties, and leisure suit larry) to prove it can work.
alot of kids out there cant get into bars or clubs/venues , it doesn't stop them from making $$ hand over sweaty fist.
This really shouldn't turn into a sexism debate... The character models are being adapted to be visually appealing while sticking with the ideas of the original Conan story. So they're too thin - is that really going to affect your gameplay? Big breasts - oooh, wow. You're staring at their back most of the time anyway. Warrior-thongs...ok?
The people who are complaining about this would be the true Storyists (RPers or RP-sympathizers [I patent that name]) who care about making fantasy as realistic as possible to be more immersive. There is nothing wrong with this, though it is hard to find a game that is fully immersive.
A woman should be buffer if she can be just as powerful as a male Conan-esque warrior. Ok. We know she should, though this is a game where that isn't necessarily put out into the models concepts. These models are made to be visually appealing to the larger masses.
So basically, more people would rather stare at a warrior-vixen than a brute-woman. Sorry, but it is the sad truth that more people are affected by visually appealing objects.
A second note - I'll tie in my argument for movies and books (What are the chances [Insert Protagonist Name Here] would be [Insert Place] when [Insert Event] happens?) The truth is that you wouldn't want to hear a story about some guy who drove to the grocery store and DIDN'T end up in a high-speed chase. You don't want to hear about him complaining on which cheese to buy. And generally you won't want to hear a story about a muscular female warrior. Sure it might be interesting, but more people would want to hear about the girl who can kill four men with her bare hands while maintaining her groomed appearance and alluring another hero with her Victoria's Secret physique.
End Note: It's just a game.
As for the sex buffing - again, it's apart of the Conan world. If anything, it's comical.
Don't draw fire. It irritates the people around you.
Friendly fire - isn't.
When in doubt empty the magazine.
Teamwork is essential. It gives the enemy someone else to shoot at.
Oh well. If you follow logic, warrior women should look more 'body buildy' than 'porn star' if you ask me.
And there was one saying earlier that there was few, if any warrior woman through our history. I beg to differ, www.lothene.org/others/women.html. And thats just one link. I can google alot more if needed, but that one should suffice for now. Heh, and the wierdest thing, I do have a problem with death defying, gravity collapsing, over the top, huge boobs. Around a handful is more than enough for me . More attractive too. But thats probably cause I've gotten past my puberty, being an old fart and all
I never said, "if any" and most examples of pre gunpowder women actually fighting (forget the idea of crowned women running into battle) were desperation--not callings. Find a thousand more examples and it will still be few
This 50/50 nonsense ruins immersion...even in straight up FRP games it's there with npc's. The idea that women ended up with their function in society was NOT based on choice (but for rare exceptions).
So my biggest problem with what was written is that the little fellas who designed this game actually blamed women's roles in the original books on Howard's unenlightened writing period. If anything, he was kind. Why didn't they just say, "We are trying to have everyone on the planet with a computer buy this game and it takes catering to the most delusional of women (and p-whips)who would otherwise not play it...we feel that those who were suckered into thinking this was going to be brutal are still hyped for having no where else to go"
I love running into real female characters, but the idea that everyone's physicaly and socially equall in this kind of world (much less our ancient one) is pathetic. Just watch, 10-50 percent of all npc warriors including town guards, mercenaries, blacksmiths or trainers will be women....oh Crom, they turned your world into Neverwinter Nights
I still say, why end here? Lets make children as strong as grown men without the need for all that heavy muscle....they were subjegated in the stories too, but only because Howard was writing as a stupid man in the 30's
Oh well. If you follow logic, warrior women should look more 'body buildy' than 'porn star' if you ask me.
I think you and many others are forgeting/don't know the flexibility AoC have when creating a character. Its up to the player if he/she want theire female charactar to look like f.exa. Paris Hilton with huge implants. its just the matter of taste I belive heres a link to show some basic charatar creation www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6MPDhg4rhc
i WANT a PVP experience where i'm being attacked from all sides by scantily clad chicks with huge knockers!!! funbags of EPIC proportion!! nobody make males at all! i want all breasts on my screen all day long! i hope they have a jiggle factor like DOA!!
on a slightly less adult behaving like a child note: females are supposed to have higher pain thresholds than males anyways so the whole thing about them being apt warriois is fine with me, just wouldn't it make more sense to like raise their stats to counter a males? -1 str for +1 sta or -1 str for +1 agi (whatever the system i would feel better if it was done like that just for the realism. there has never been a world record held for power lifting held by a female (excluding of course the world record for female power lifting which is not infact THE record for most weight lifted)
other facts about females: their bones weaken easier/sooner, and PMS is a force to be reckoned with, not to mention the (generally) heightened emotions they deal with (except again those blood elf dudes in the back).
realism and immersion are great things, how much fun would it be to lop peoples heads off if flowers spilled out instead of blood (SILENCE blood elves!)?
Hehe...with hearts, bunnies, peepoo and fluffy things
Say what you want, I still find it kinda sexist and stereotypical of FC to depict womens like that. But they all do. Oh well, they'll learn sooner or later.
For my part I think the new screenies simply indicate that this game looks to be heading down the same worn out path as oh so many fantasy games before with respect to female clothing.
If they really want to impress me, a female character in full clothing from neck down would be a start. Don't get me wrong, it is nice to see female armour back in a game's design (UO had female only armour, what, 10 years ago now? Then it just became an alternate graphic). But there should be modest armour too, and there should be no reason at all for it not to look great at the same time. Choice is good.
I also expect that they would increase the appeal of this game to female gamers (indeed all gamers) if they include a wide range of elegant social clothing. SWG did that, and people loved it. A screen shot of some female avatars not in armour would be interesting - something full length, flattering, modest, and silk (texture and light)... but I really do expect to only ever see illogical uncomfortable armour in this game.
I am in the army and I know alot of female soldiers who care about there look, its just natural. So just because they are warriors doesnt mean they have to neglect there look.
Completely agree. Of course a lot of male soldiers care about how they look too, Adonis eat your heart out. Effectively a free gym membership for life, used with dedication and skill over time can really get results
That said, I also have served with a female infantry officer who looked like she could crush rocks with her hands. She wasn't a body builder or anything, she was just solid, which was hardly surprising because to have her platoon she had to be capable of all of the tasks expected of her soldiers - and she was.
Besides, if you are female in most militaries you need to care about how you look, because it's probably only a matter of time until you hit the glass ceiling and need to move out to civvy street, where that can be the difference between getting the job and not. Fair or not, it just is that way still many places.
Aren't women still not allowed to be involved in ground combat in the US military? Kinda negates this whole idea of a woman soldier that still cares about her looks. Also, last I checked hygiene is an important part of military training, thus wouldn't you also expect any male to also care about his appearance (though unlikely to the extent of a woman, well, cuz men just don't care as much).
In reality, a big breasted woman swinging a 2-handed sword around is going to have some issues. Those thing are gunna get in the way, nothing you can do about it. Appearance, however, is not affected whatsoever. Your clear complexion, blue-eyes, soft-skin won't affect jack, unless she's fighting a typical man.
But it's not like you can take big-breasts out of a game. It's more unrealistic in their absence. So do you put controls in to adjust breast size during character creation? Sound like a great idea to me, and also some horrible publicity. Perhaps then we can have a setting to adjust the size of the bulge under my pallies' pants.
Or, rather than go down that road we'll just make all girls in the game reasonably large-breasted. Sure, not as realistic, thus not as ideal for role-playing. But seriously, have you ever met a girl who was like "damn, I wish I had a flat chest." I know of no girl that hates big breasts for their appearance. It's always the back pains, or how running a mile with a 20 lb. pack on the wrong side of your body is exhausting.
And its commercialized, of course they are going to feature females as sex objects, afterall who is our target audience in COMPUTER GAMES, particularly hack and slash MMOs? Guys...
Why else would you have booth babes at conventions???
Unless its a religious conference or feminist movement group...
Maybe some of you are looking at different screenshots than I am, because to me those images look quite demure compared to many games. WoW has numerous outfits that are far more risque than the AoC ones shown.
Yes, the arms look frail, and hopefully that can be adjusted when making a character. But I desperately hope Funcom doesn't listen to some of the more prudish comments here, as an irrational fear of anything mildly provocative led to DAoC and EQ2 both having some of the ugliest clothing (and therefore characters) in any game I've played.
As long as you have enough variety in your choices of body type and clothing coverage, I fail to see the harm in an M-rated game allowing a level of provocativeness prsent in both the source material AND the average modern community (go downtown at night or to a beach on a sunny day).
I find laughable the suggestion that the female clothing will be significantly more revealing than the male versions... have you SEEN how Conan dressed?
You have every right to find the female models and clothing in Conan to be as appealing or unappealing as you like. And I have every right to find your opinion prudish and irrational if you take issue with PG-13 level provocative content yet have no problem with the liberal amounts of violence in the game. But buy or don't buy the game, just give a rest to the demonizing of anyone that thinks skin does not equal EVIL.
Chances are that no matter what anyone says here, the game is going to be what it is and nothing is gonna change it so it's pointless to have a debate over. Although in my opinion, the women in the game look fine... Everyone has their own view of what's attractive so no matter what the women looked like, someone would probly be out complaining about it.
Sex and violence sells and I doubt Funcom is working for charity. As long as this is the case, women in games are gonna appear as exaggerated sex objects.
I think how the females look in age of conan is more realistic then any other mmo I seen and played. They look hot why is people so mad about it. And anyway in the end its up to the player how the female character will look like because you can customize it kind of like in Oblivion. So if you think they should be big bulky women then make it like that. Its just the ones shown on the screenshots are made to look good so people will find it attractive.
Most female martial artists ive seen dont look like big butch she-men. They look fit and thin, its what women look like when they are fit. Just like the men are broad shouldered, have big pecs and six packs in these games and fighting games. Its what people expect to see from a physically capable person.
You dont see any fat guy characters, or guys with skinny arms and legs. Theres no double standards involved, everyone gets the same treatment. Its societies view of what a fit person is.
Interesting to come back and read the many thoughtful posts on a provoking topic. Most of the responses heavily reinforced my initial impressions. The guys like Megaflux are going to love playing Conan & running around with 15 year old semi naked boys showing off their big beautiful love bubbles and making personal donations to get the sex buff. The rest of us will choose games with more mature content. And yes gurl gamers (occasionally referred to as women) do a have a weapon of choice and it's name is Mastercard.
I wonder if there will be male hookers to get the sex buff from, or if all the women in Hyboria are lesbians.
Either way if you read any of the comics or books, thats what the women are portrayed as. Petite and deadly. You certainly cant blame the programmers for staying true to Conans IP.
Check out the 8/25 post by Jon Wood in the News section of this website. Of course it's alway possible his source was inaccurate. I don't recall reading posts here where anyone expressed disgust at seeing a female with "suberb body shape". I understand that sometimes it's easy to jump to conclusions if one fails to read carefully.
talk about reading carefully...this article isn't about what their arms or boobs look like, it's about their role and how it will be different to Howard's vision (which they have a problem with then blame their problem on the 1930's).
They didn't go much into detail other than saying player character females will be just as strong (with their skinny arms) as males and that the world will be filled with competent female fighters (presumably npc's because they mentioned prostitutes as well)...expect then to see a 20-50 percent female fighter/guard/trainer presence in npc roles ala Never Winter Nights
well Conan was written in the 30's but was in an ancient Earth like setting....the silly "appeal to all" nature of the cookie cutter fantasy shcit that is written in this century shouldn't change the more plausible setting of Howard's works.
Girls are as strong as boys and have equal employment opportunities in Hyboria! Hooray! Now if only the designers could understand that children are smarter than adults and allow 10 year old girls to rule the world of Conan, the sales would go through the roof!
I'll not go into the lore debate -- I'm not one of the designers on the team -- but I do want to comment on how Funcom tries to show how Age of Conan is a mature title when we do demonstrations.
I certainly understand that some people think it's a case of "shooting yourself in the foot" when you talk about female nudity to make a case on the game's level of maturity. However, nudity is an important ingredient when selling the game's mature theme and it is one of the best ways of showing it during a short demonstration in front of people who are not already familiar with the game. Most if not all MMOs out there right now have little to no nudity, and we really want to hammer home the fact that we have it in Age of Conan. It is a central element of the lore, so it's only natural for us to for instance show off the bare breasted succubus, even though it might be interpreted as a "haha, look, boobies!" sort of thing. It is, of course, not.
The fact that Age of Conan has a mature world is something we really want to point out to people when they first see and hear about the game. People are so used to elves, fairies and teen rated MMOs now, and we're very proud of the fact that we're aiming for a mature rating. That's why we bring up subjects such as nudity, heavy drinking, pirates urinating, heads flying etc. The danger of all this is that it might come across as immature, and we might have to be more careful on how we word ourselves in future demonstrations.
Another thing to keep in mind is that you guys and girls have seen hundreds of different demonstrations, and when you see the succbus breasts being pointed out for the one hundredth time, I am sure it gets very old. But for people who has not seen the game yet, who is used to playing other MMOs, that "ingredient" right there is enough to put a bit of a shock into them and to really underline the point that we're trying to do something different here. There are of course plenty of other things in there that makes Age of Conan a mature game -- the level of violence, the quest themes, the conversations etc. -- but right then and there , during these short demonstrations, that bit of nudity really sends the message home. We will, of course, try and show you more of how the maturity is reflected in the game.
Again, thanks for all the constructive criticism. Keep it coming, but be nice!
He makes it pretty clear that by mature they do not mean the type of content found in the New York Times or Wall Street Journal. I find it odd the writer characterizes gratuitous gore and T&A as mature rather than adult but to each their own. They've identified their target customer and clearly that's not me. Big disappointment. I was looking forward to a mature game. This isn't it.
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by Raingirl
Absolutely correct Glivin. The scope of the original article was fairly narrow. However this was recently posted and expands on the topic.He makes it pretty clear that by mature they do not mean the type of content found in the New York Times or Wall Street Journal. I find it odd the writer characterizes gratuitous gore and T&A as mature rather than adult but to each their own. They've identified their target customer and clearly that's not me. Big disappointment. I was looking forward to a mature game. This isn't it.
Its Mature Rated describing MATURE content as intended for adults. Anyone can read a newspaper.
So the writer (Product Manager) explains that the content is mature in this regard - PRETTY obvious.
Target audience ultimately would be anyone that is deemed able to purchase, by the rating's board in agreement with legislation for whatever particular country or continent abides by.
Funcom makes game with content > ratings board give rating > Consumer purchases or not.
Furthermore, game content as a whole is marketed, as always been the case. I dont see two massive boobs on the box art. I don't see official trailers with people "livin it up" I see screen shots of content and some include bare-chested male and female demons, be-heading etc
It looks like you have an opinion on what the specific target audience will be based upon "Gratuitous Gore" and "Tits & Ass" - if I was to form an opinion such as you have, Im sure my friends would say I have "tunnel vision". There is a whole lot more to the game, something which you fail to include on your initial assumptions. If you really feel these initial assumptions to be fact then really, LotRO or something might be more to your liking.
What you neglect to include in your pre-emptive assumption/opinion is the bigger picture, the game content as a whole. Thats fine say if you want to buy a car without checking if the tires aren't flat or and engine is missing.. you would as a buyer would probably do a bit more research.
Really, like I have said many times, if the view of breasts (pixelated form) and "Gratutious Gore" offend then really you shouldn't waste your time anymore, the game will just upset you.
Now I've already taken the approach that the character model CAN be changed drastically and dynamically to the users preferance (hence mmorpg where customisation is important to allow you more affinity with your character) and I've also explained the lore side of things in relation to the game.
But it looks like from my interpretation from your posts that:
A. Breasts and Gore offend you in a computer game ~ specifically an mmorpg
B. You assume Breasts and Gore will attract the "type of audience" you dont want to be associated with, and you assume you will have the company of said audience 100% of the time.
C. By Mature you might mean content found in a Newspaper, where they talk daily life, such as sex, drugs, rock n roll, rape, robberies, kidnapping, abuse, terrorism, politics, education etc etc.
Age of Conan's content is the backbone of the game, change it and you end up with something totally different.
The principle fact is this game has "mature content" - (like all the nasty stuff you find in real life) whether you agree or disagree if this will make the community for the game shitty can only be detirmined "properly" sometime after the game launches, right? Thats the only logical way I see it. You see "mature" has several definitions one being: "Suitable or intended for adults" most likely applying here, again logically thinking you would most likely be in favour of this leading to a mature community. But we know that this hasn't been done in an mmorpg before, specifically the content.
In my opinion it be prudish to assume these negative things now, if so I would hate to designate people with that opinon as a prude, rather than some people free from personal prejudice and a more open mind.
There is a reason for the ratings. I am sorry your initial presumptions make you think that this isn't the game for you, I do respect your opinion but i have to disagree. I am very much looking forward to the release of the game.
*What is up with the talk about sex drives and drug usage?
- There will be no explicit sex in AoC. It will be part of the atmosphere (wenches and prostitutes) and will be hinted at or even overt in your interactions with NPCs, but it won't be shown or anything you can actually do within the game. There was talk in the beginning by having some buffs associated with what goes on behind closed doors, but nothing definitive. As far as I was told, there will be no drug usage in AoC as there was in like SWG (drugs were used for buffs that often had serious downers). Poisons will be predominate (lotus).
*How naked will players (particularly female players) be able to get?
-Depends on the rating board. The females are designed to be completely topless, at the moment they have some flimsy cover, but it is only a matter of what they can get away with by having an M rating. Anything that will give the game an AO rating will be cut or covered up.
Comments
Oh well. If you follow logic, warrior women should look more 'body buildy' than 'porn star' if you ask me.
And there was one saying earlier that there was few, if any warrior woman through our history. I beg to differ, www.lothene.org/others/women.html. And thats just one link. I can google alot more if needed, but that one should suffice for now.
Heh, and the wierdest thing, I do have a problem with death defying, gravity collapsing, over the top, huge boobs. Around a handful is more than enough for me
. More attractive too. But thats probably cause I've gotten past my puberty, being an old fart and all 
---
Grammar nazi's. This one is for you.
"warrior women" in history have mainly gotten by on treachery and deceit (hillary clinton & martha stewart being a modern day examples). personally i kinda dig the whole amazon/body building goddess thing, but when you look @ female body builders that haven't had operations they hardly have ANY breasts (certainly more than a mouth full tho). as a society we have for some reason shifted to scrawny broads over the more ample sturdy ones. and i kinda hate it.
when i think warrior woman i think of someone i could wrestle with (ok in jello.. FINE), not somebody who i would have to worry about breaking. i really hope they dont dumb anything in this game down, if anything they need to set an example at a grade A adult game (as opposed to all the softcore/hardcore b/s that has passed for adult so far ex:valerie, 2 moons, plumbers dont wear neck ties, and leisure suit larry) to prove it can work.
alot of kids out there cant get into bars or clubs/venues , it doesn't stop them from making $$ hand over sweaty fist.
This really shouldn't turn into a sexism debate... The character models are being adapted to be visually appealing while sticking with the ideas of the original Conan story. So they're too thin - is that really going to affect your gameplay? Big breasts - oooh, wow. You're staring at their back most of the time anyway. Warrior-thongs...ok?
The people who are complaining about this would be the true Storyists (RPers or RP-sympathizers [I patent that name]) who care about making fantasy as realistic as possible to be more immersive. There is nothing wrong with this, though it is hard to find a game that is fully immersive.
A woman should be buffer if she can be just as powerful as a male Conan-esque warrior. Ok. We know she should, though this is a game where that isn't necessarily put out into the models concepts. These models are made to be visually appealing to the larger masses.
So basically, more people would rather stare at a warrior-vixen than a brute-woman. Sorry, but it is the sad truth that more people are affected by visually appealing objects.
A second note - I'll tie in my argument for movies and books (What are the chances [Insert Protagonist Name Here] would be [Insert Place] when [Insert Event] happens?) The truth is that you wouldn't want to hear a story about some guy who drove to the grocery store and DIDN'T end up in a high-speed chase. You don't want to hear about him complaining on which cheese to buy. And generally you won't want to hear a story about a muscular female warrior. Sure it might be interesting, but more people would want to hear about the girl who can kill four men with her bare hands while maintaining her groomed appearance and alluring another hero with her Victoria's Secret physique.
End Note: It's just a game.
As for the sex buffing - again, it's apart of the Conan world. If anything, it's comical.
Don't draw fire. It irritates the people around you.
Friendly fire - isn't.
When in doubt empty the magazine.
Teamwork is essential. It gives the enemy someone else to shoot at.
I never said, "if any" and most examples of pre gunpowder women actually fighting (forget the idea of crowned women running into battle) were desperation--not callings. Find a thousand more examples and it will still be few
This 50/50 nonsense ruins immersion...even in straight up FRP games it's there with npc's. The idea that women ended up with their function in society was NOT based on choice (but for rare exceptions).
So my biggest problem with what was written is that the little fellas who designed this game actually blamed women's roles in the original books on Howard's unenlightened writing period. If anything, he was kind. Why didn't they just say, "We are trying to have everyone on the planet with a computer buy this game and it takes catering to the most delusional of women (and p-whips)who would otherwise not play it...we feel that those who were suckered into thinking this was going to be brutal are still hyped for having no where else to go"
I love running into real female characters, but the idea that everyone's physicaly and socially equall in this kind of world (much less our ancient one) is pathetic. Just watch, 10-50 percent of all npc warriors including town guards, mercenaries, blacksmiths or trainers will be women....oh Crom, they turned your world into Neverwinter Nights
I still say, why end here? Lets make children as strong as grown men without the need for all that heavy muscle....they were subjegated in the stories too, but only because Howard was writing as a stupid man in the 30's
I think you and many others are forgeting/don't know the flexibility AoC have when creating a character. Its up to the player if he/she want theire female charactar to look like f.exa. Paris Hilton with huge implants. its just the matter of taste I belive
heres a link to show some basic charatar creation www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6MPDhg4rhc
..............
after thinking long and hard i have decided....
i WANT a PVP experience where i'm being attacked from all sides by scantily clad chicks with huge knockers!!! funbags of EPIC proportion!! nobody make males at all! i want all breasts on my screen all day long! i hope they have a jiggle factor like DOA!!
on a slightly less adult behaving like a child note: females are supposed to have higher pain thresholds than males anyways so the whole thing about them being apt warriois is fine with me, just wouldn't it make more sense to like raise their stats to counter a males? -1 str for +1 sta or -1 str for +1 agi (whatever the system i would feel better if it was done like that just for the realism. there has never been a world record held for power lifting held by a female (excluding of course the world record for female power lifting which is not infact THE record for most weight lifted)
other facts about females: their bones weaken easier/sooner, and PMS is a force to be reckoned with, not to mention the (generally) heightened emotions they deal with (except again those blood elf dudes in the back).
realism and immersion are great things, how much fun would it be to lop peoples heads off if flowers spilled out instead of blood (SILENCE blood elves!)?
Hehe...with hearts, bunnies, peepoo and fluffy things
Say what you want, I still find it kinda sexist and stereotypical of FC to depict womens like that. But they all do. Oh well, they'll learn sooner or later.
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Grammar nazi's. This one is for you.
its not like they are giving them +50 to cooking. just great glorious love globes.
For my part I think the new screenies simply indicate that this game looks to be heading down the same worn out path as oh so many fantasy games before with respect to female clothing.
If they really want to impress me, a female character in full clothing from neck down would be a start. Don't get me wrong, it is nice to see female armour back in a game's design (UO had female only armour, what, 10 years ago now? Then it just became an alternate graphic). But there should be modest armour too, and there should be no reason at all for it not to look great at the same time. Choice is good.
I also expect that they would increase the appeal of this game to female gamers (indeed all gamers) if they include a wide range of elegant social clothing. SWG did that, and people loved it. A screen shot of some female avatars not in armour would be interesting - something full length, flattering, modest, and silk (texture and light)... but I really do expect to only ever see illogical uncomfortable armour in this game.
Completely agree. Of course a lot of male soldiers care about how they look too, Adonis eat your heart out. Effectively a free gym membership for life, used with dedication and skill over time can really get results
That said, I also have served with a female infantry officer who looked like she could crush rocks with her hands. She wasn't a body builder or anything, she was just solid, which was hardly surprising because to have her platoon she had to be capable of all of the tasks expected of her soldiers - and she was.
Besides, if you are female in most militaries you need to care about how you look, because it's probably only a matter of time until you hit the glass ceiling and need to move out to civvy street, where that can be the difference between getting the job and not. Fair or not, it just is that way still many places.
Aren't women still not allowed to be involved in ground combat in the US military? Kinda negates this whole idea of a woman soldier that still cares about her looks. Also, last I checked hygiene is an important part of military training, thus wouldn't you also expect any male to also care about his appearance (though unlikely to the extent of a woman, well, cuz men just don't care as much).
In reality, a big breasted woman swinging a 2-handed sword around is going to have some issues. Those thing are gunna get in the way, nothing you can do about it. Appearance, however, is not affected whatsoever. Your clear complexion, blue-eyes, soft-skin won't affect jack, unless she's fighting a typical man.
But it's not like you can take big-breasts out of a game. It's more unrealistic in their absence. So do you put controls in to adjust breast size during character creation? Sound like a great idea to me, and also some horrible publicity. Perhaps then we can have a setting to adjust the size of the bulge under my pallies' pants.
Or, rather than go down that road we'll just make all girls in the game reasonably large-breasted. Sure, not as realistic, thus not as ideal for role-playing. But seriously, have you ever met a girl who was like "damn, I wish I had a flat chest." I know of no girl that hates big breasts for their appearance. It's always the back pains, or how running a mile with a 20 lb. pack on the wrong side of your body is exhausting.
Its just a game...
And its commercialized, of course they are going to feature females as sex objects, afterall who is our target audience in COMPUTER GAMES, particularly hack and slash MMOs? Guys...
Why else would you have booth babes at conventions???
Unless its a religious conference or feminist movement group...
Maybe some of you are looking at different screenshots than I am, because to me those images look quite demure compared to many games. WoW has numerous outfits that are far more risque than the AoC ones shown.
Yes, the arms look frail, and hopefully that can be adjusted when making a character. But I desperately hope Funcom doesn't listen to some of the more prudish comments here, as an irrational fear of anything mildly provocative led to DAoC and EQ2 both having some of the ugliest clothing (and therefore characters) in any game I've played.
As long as you have enough variety in your choices of body type and clothing coverage, I fail to see the harm in an M-rated game allowing a level of provocativeness prsent in both the source material AND the average modern community (go downtown at night or to a beach on a sunny day).
I find laughable the suggestion that the female clothing will be significantly more revealing than the male versions... have you SEEN how Conan dressed?
You have every right to find the female models and clothing in Conan to be as appealing or unappealing as you like. And I have every right to find your opinion prudish and irrational if you take issue with PG-13 level provocative content yet have no problem with the liberal amounts of violence in the game. But buy or don't buy the game, just give a rest to the demonizing of anyone that thinks skin does not equal EVIL.
Chances are that no matter what anyone says here, the game is going to be what it is and nothing is gonna change it so it's pointless to have a debate over. Although in my opinion, the women in the game look fine... Everyone has their own view of what's attractive so no matter what the women looked like, someone would probly be out complaining about it.
Sex and violence sells and I doubt Funcom is working for charity. As long as this is the case, women in games are gonna appear as exaggerated sex objects.
I think how the females look in age of conan is more realistic then any other mmo I seen and played. They look hot why is people so mad about it. And anyway in the end its up to the player how the female character will look like because you can customize it kind of like in Oblivion. So if you think they should be big bulky women then make it like that. Its just the ones shown on the screenshots are made to look good so people will find it attractive.
Most female martial artists ive seen dont look like big butch she-men. They look fit and thin, its what women look like when they are fit. Just like the men are broad shouldered, have big pecs and six packs in these games and fighting games. Its what people expect to see from a physically capable person.
You dont see any fat guy characters, or guys with skinny arms and legs. Theres no double standards involved, everyone gets the same treatment. Its societies view of what a fit person is.
Interesting to come back and read the many thoughtful posts on a provoking topic. Most of the responses heavily reinforced my initial impressions. The guys like Megaflux are going to love playing Conan & running around with 15 year old semi naked boys showing off their big beautiful love bubbles and making personal donations to get the sex buff. The rest of us will choose games with more mature content. And yes gurl gamers (occasionally referred to as women) do a have a weapon of choice and it's name is Mastercard.
I wonder if there will be male hookers to get the sex buff from, or if all the women in Hyboria are lesbians.
Either way if you read any of the comics or books, thats what the women are portrayed as. Petite and deadly. You certainly cant blame the programmers for staying true to Conans IP.
Check out the 8/25 post by Jon Wood in the News section of this website. Of course it's alway possible his source was inaccurate. I don't recall reading posts here where anyone expressed disgust at seeing a female with "suberb body shape". I understand that sometimes it's easy to jump to conclusions if one fails to read carefully.
talk about reading carefully...this article isn't about what their arms or boobs look like, it's about their role and how it will be different to Howard's vision (which they have a problem with then blame their problem on the 1930's).
They didn't go much into detail other than saying player character females will be just as strong (with their skinny arms) as males and that the world will be filled with competent female fighters (presumably npc's because they mentioned prostitutes as well)...expect then to see a 20-50 percent female fighter/guard/trainer presence in npc roles ala Never Winter Nights
well Conan was written in the 30's but was in an ancient Earth like setting....the silly "appeal to all" nature of the cookie cutter fantasy shcit that is written in this century shouldn't change the more plausible setting of Howard's works.
Girls are as strong as boys and have equal employment opportunities in Hyboria! Hooray! Now if only the designers could understand that children are smarter than adults and allow 10 year old girls to rule the world of Conan, the sales would go through the roof!
I really like the game screen, comfortable to me.
Absolutely correct Glivin. The scope of the original article was fairly narrow. However this was recently posted and expands on the topic.
Funcom
I'll not go into the lore debate -- I'm not one of the designers on the team -- but I do want to comment on how Funcom tries to show how Age of Conan is a mature title when we do demonstrations.
I certainly understand that some people think it's a case of "shooting yourself in the foot" when you talk about female nudity to make a case on the game's level of maturity. However, nudity is an important ingredient when selling the game's mature theme and it is one of the best ways of showing it during a short demonstration in front of people who are not already familiar with the game. Most if not all MMOs out there right now have little to no nudity, and we really want to hammer home the fact that we have it in Age of Conan. It is a central element of the lore, so it's only natural for us to for instance show off the bare breasted succubus, even though it might be interpreted as a "haha, look, boobies!" sort of thing. It is, of course, not.
The fact that Age of Conan has a mature world is something we really want to point out to people when they first see and hear about the game. People are so used to elves, fairies and teen rated MMOs now, and we're very proud of the fact that we're aiming for a mature rating. That's why we bring up subjects such as nudity, heavy drinking, pirates urinating, heads flying etc. The danger of all this is that it might come across as immature, and we might have to be more careful on how we word ourselves in future demonstrations.
Another thing to keep in mind is that you guys and girls have seen hundreds of different demonstrations, and when you see the succbus breasts being pointed out for the one hundredth time, I am sure it gets very old. But for people who has not seen the game yet, who is used to playing other MMOs, that "ingredient" right there is enough to put a bit of a shock into them and to really underline the point that we're trying to do something different here. There are of course plenty of other things in there that makes Age of Conan a mature game -- the level of violence, the quest themes, the conversations etc. -- but right then and there , during these short demonstrations, that bit of nudity really sends the message home. We will, of course, try and show you more of how the maturity is reflected in the game.
Again, thanks for all the constructive criticism. Keep it coming, but be nice!
He makes it pretty clear that by mature they do not mean the type of content found in the New York Times or Wall Street Journal. I find it odd the writer characterizes gratuitous gore and T&A as mature rather than adult but to each their own. They've identified their target customer and clearly that's not me. Big disappointment. I was looking forward to a mature game. This isn't it.
Its Mature Rated describing MATURE content as intended for adults. Anyone can read a newspaper.
So the writer (Product Manager) explains that the content is mature in this regard - PRETTY obvious.
Target audience ultimately would be anyone that is deemed able to purchase, by the rating's board in agreement with legislation for whatever particular country or continent abides by.
Funcom makes game with content > ratings board give rating > Consumer purchases or not.
Furthermore, game content as a whole is marketed, as always been the case. I dont see two massive boobs on the box art. I don't see official trailers with people "livin it up" I see screen shots of content and some include bare-chested male and female demons, be-heading etc
It looks like you have an opinion on what the specific target audience will be based upon "Gratuitous Gore" and "Tits & Ass" - if I was to form an opinion such as you have, Im sure my friends would say I have "tunnel vision". There is a whole lot more to the game, something which you fail to include on your initial assumptions. If you really feel these initial assumptions to be fact then really, LotRO or something might be more to your liking.
What you neglect to include in your pre-emptive assumption/opinion is the bigger picture, the game content as a whole. Thats fine say if you want to buy a car without checking if the tires aren't flat or and engine is missing.. you would as a buyer would probably do a bit more research.
Really, like I have said many times, if the view of breasts (pixelated form) and "Gratutious Gore" offend then really you shouldn't waste your time anymore, the game will just upset you.
Now I've already taken the approach that the character model CAN be changed drastically and dynamically to the users preferance (hence mmorpg where customisation is important to allow you more affinity with your character) and I've also explained the lore side of things in relation to the game.
But it looks like from my interpretation from your posts that:
A. Breasts and Gore offend you in a computer game ~ specifically an mmorpg
B. You assume Breasts and Gore will attract the "type of audience" you dont want to be associated with, and you assume you will have the company of said audience 100% of the time.
C. By Mature you might mean content found in a Newspaper, where they talk daily life, such as sex, drugs, rock n roll, rape, robberies, kidnapping, abuse, terrorism, politics, education etc etc.
Age of Conan's content is the backbone of the game, change it and you end up with something totally different.
The principle fact is this game has "mature content" - (like all the nasty stuff you find in real life) whether you agree or disagree if this will make the community for the game shitty can only be detirmined "properly" sometime after the game launches, right? Thats the only logical way I see it. You see "mature" has several definitions one being: "Suitable or intended for adults" most likely applying here, again logically thinking you would most likely be in favour of this leading to a mature community. But we know that this hasn't been done in an mmorpg before, specifically the content.
In my opinion it be prudish to assume these negative things now, if so I would hate to designate people with that opinon as a prude, rather than some people free from personal prejudice and a more open mind.
There is a reason for the ratings. I am sorry your initial presumptions make you think that this isn't the game for you, I do respect your opinion but i have to disagree. I am very much looking forward to the release of the game.
*What is up with the talk about sex drives and drug usage?
- There will be no explicit sex in AoC. It will be part of the atmosphere (wenches and prostitutes) and will be hinted at or even overt in your interactions with NPCs, but it won't be shown or anything you can actually do within the game. There was talk in the beginning by having some buffs associated with what goes on behind closed doors, but nothing definitive. As far as I was told, there will be no drug usage in AoC as there was in like SWG (drugs were used for buffs that often had serious downers). Poisons will be predominate (lotus).
*How naked will players (particularly female players) be able to get?
-Depends on the rating board. The females are designed to be completely topless, at the moment they have some flimsy cover, but it is only a matter of what they can get away with by having an M rating. Anything that will give the game an AO rating will be cut or covered up.
AoC @ DragonCon - Age of Conan Forums
Dragon Con was after the GC.