I would be interested in playing a game like this. But I think I'd prefer player controlled factions against one another. I'm not sure if there are any games that exist, where cities, kingdoms, outposts regions are controlled by particular race, and races compete for their national standing. of course it would be difficult to guarantee that the races will have a comparable population size, although maybe they should since real life wars are unbalanced.
in the case of unbalanced race populations, the small populations really need to band together to make any progress, and may have tools that the other races dont have (science, weapons, God) to win some battles. I dunno, i think id be interested in where players are ACTUALLY fighting for some sort of acomplishment, may it be the supremacy of their race or the fate of the world.
edit: also, races may need to depend on each other sometimes, and alliances can be made and broken. there just will need to be some sort of leadership system, you know, kings, barons, dukes, sheiks, sultans, amirs, pharoahs, masters, etc whatever it is. people appointed, voted, decided by battle to take certain positions. have actual strategic meetings to decide the fate of their people. i dunno
Favourite Game SWG - Sabanak, Retired Jedi, Bria
Playing: Nothing
Waiting for: SWG Pre-CU
Retired: SWG, CoX, Vanguard, MxO, Guildwars, Archlord, Auto Assault, EQ2, Final Fantasy XI, Lineage 2, Saga of Ryzom, DAOC, WoW, AOC, WAR
I think this would be great. And to make sure someone stays on the same side they put in *gasp* alpha classes. I think something like fury would work. You get a charcter if your side wipes you restart with that name and stuff. BUT lets say that you and a guild of 20 just kicked ass the whole time but lost becuase the rest of the server isnt that great. You work towards a alpha class that cant be lost untill gained then can be lost. You can wait to use the alpha class until other people so you wouldnt be forced to use it right before a wipe. These classes would be super powerful and would make the the jedi's in SWG look weak. But they could only die a set amount of times. After that they would be reset like a server wipe. For the untimiate evil type game classes that come to mind are.
Good-Paladin, Divine Priest, Crusader, Wizard(mage would be the weaker verison)
Evil-Death knight, Warlock, Unholy priest, demon.
Hold on Snow Leopard, imma let you finish, but Windows had one of the best operating systems of all time.
If the Powerball lottery was like Lotro, nobody would win for 2 years, and then everyone in Nebraska would win on the same day. And then Nebraska would get nerfed.-pinkwood lotro fourms
AMD 4800 2.4ghz-3GB RAM 533mhz-EVGA 9500GT 512mb-320gb HD
Suppose that an MMO had an ultimate evil that could destroy that game world, and it was up to the players to stop it. Not something that could happen easily, or in the first couple of years after release. 1) The ultimate evil wins and destroys the world, destroying all characters and assets, and the game continues as a new world where the players all have to start over. 2) The players defeat the ultimate evil, and save their world. Life goes on. New challenges soon to come. How would you feel about it? Would you play it, skip it, be pissed if all your stuffs is destroyed and you have to start over, what?
An outlandish idea. Completely shocking. I love it !!!!
Your idea is actually immersion/sense of belonging/brand and customer loyalty/community all taken to the extreme. You don't log in just to chat/check your crafting/do PvP-PvE ..... You log in because you need to save the world and people you know depend on you and need you input in the prolonged tactics/strategy. I hear so many people playing different MMOs that they don't see any purpose to log in anymore. Well, this concept would be a pretty good motivator !!
But, I think I'd modify it just a bit. I'd like to kill off all the Uber leveled characters, or have them succeed, but not destroy the world.
Give max level characters a chance to change the gameworld, or die. The "evil" that comes to the world, or grows in power, makes changes to the game world that suck, like destroys bridges that are short cuts, or causes all merchant prices to double, or all players lose an important ability becuase of a spell, or something that really impacts the world.
Max level characters can change the world for the better by defeating the "evil" but the fight is in a perma death zone. Players can risk changing the world for the better, or losing their characters, but the world isn't destroyed.
Alternatively, I like the destroyed world idea, and everyone starts over, since it gets rid of all the maxed out uber characters. I don't like expansions which just add levels. Ok, you're level 100, now we add an expansion so you can be level 150, then level 200, etc. There is some point where characters shouldn't get any more powerful, because it's just ridiculous.
Originally posted by zipit /bump due to quality of topic
QFE
"And after blizzard takes over the world, they are gonna gather a bunch of lemmings, sit on their fat asses near a cliff, and watch the little fuzzy bastards suicide dive into the ground below. . . . . all just for their own entertainment."
Originally posted by Amaranthar Suppose that an MMO had an ultimate evil that could destroy that game world, and it was up to the players to stop it. Not something that could happen easily, or in the first couple of years after release. 1) The ultimate evil wins and destroys the world, destroying all characters and assets, and the game continues as a new world where the players all have to start over. 2) The players defeat the ultimate evil, and save their world. Life goes on. New challenges soon to come. How would you feel about it? Would you play it, skip it, be pissed if all your stuffs is destroyed and you have to start over, what?
I'd have to say....no. At least not in that fashion, though the basic server reset idea has some merit.
I do like the idea of it, but knowing my luck my internet wouldn't work for the whole week of armageddon... having played for a year or so to hone my skills for this final combat, having to miss it might make me a little... frustrated!
see the problem with your idea is.. Yea i would play it.. and so would a few thousand others.. and more importantly we would straight up love it... but the masses would hate it and so the game owners would have the choice of making money off the game by watering it down.. or continue to make payments on theyre production costs for the next 50 years..
Sorry guys but its the truth... Games that are coming out are all about the numbers. Everyone has an idea of the perfect mmo for themselves but developers always water it down so that you kind of like it but everyone else kind of likes it to... They would rather everyone is kinda into the game then having 10000 Finatic fans
Suppose that an MMO had an ultimate evil that could destroy that game world, and it was up to the players to stop it. Not something that could happen easily, or in the first couple of years after release. 1) The ultimate evil wins and destroys the world, destroying all characters and assets, and the game continues as a new world where the players all have to start over. 2) The players defeat the ultimate evil, and save their world. Life goes on. New challenges soon to come. How would you feel about it? Would you play it, skip it, be pissed if all your stuffs is destroyed and you have to start over, what?
No. World destruction and permadeath are very bad ideas. People choose MMO's carefully, because they want a decent "ongoing" game to commit time to. When worlds or characters can be permenently eliminated that that effectively severs most of the online relationships and character identities folks have strived to create.
In a good MMORPG, people want persistence and permanence.
see the problem with your idea is.. Yea i would play it.. and so would a few thousand others.. and more importantly we would straight up love it... but the masses would hate it and so the game owners would have the choice of making money off the game by watering it down.. or continue to make payments on theyre production costs for the next 50 years..
Sorry guys but its the truth... Games that are coming out are all about the numbers. Everyone has an idea of the perfect mmo for themselves but developers always water it down so that you kind of like it but everyone else kind of likes it to... They would rather everyone is kinda into the game then having 10000 Finatic fans
This is why I think it's important for MMO developers to think about the niche market rather then trying to make a mega-hit like WoW. Obviously this market is becoming rather saturated, and innovative ideas like the OP's will allow for a real and meaningful choice in games.
I believe that if you develop a strong community in a niche MMO then the masses will follow. The community is the foundation of a game. Build upon that solid foundation, maintain it, and the structure will last for several years.
Hey man im with you but investors want money they could give to @#$#$# about the community and finatic fans. The truth is WOW makes more money in a month than most games do in a year and were on the receiving end dude.. we can complain all we want we still play those watered down games . all they want is our money loyalty is an afterthought
Hey man im with you but investors want money they could give to @#$#$# about the community and finatic fans. The truth is WOW makes more money in a month than most games do in a year and were on the receiving end dude.. we can complain all we want we still play those watered down games . all they want is our money loyalty is an afterthought
Oh I hear ya, but I think in striving for WoW like numbers will only cause those games to fail.That is why I say the niche market is the only way to be successful in this genre now.
And by developing that strong niche game with a solid foundation will ensure the longevity of it's profit making potential. Although I've never really played Eve it seems to me that it's subscription base has steadily increased, probably from this result.
I believe that a saturated market sets us up for some pretty serious innovation. Developers will have to offer alternatives, and come up with some great ideas to make sure their product stands out. I honestly believe that we, as gamers, are on the threshold of some serious advances in MMO's. The downside of course is it will take a few years for those new ideas to make it into a game.
It depends what you consider a failure... these games were made by (at the time) relativly small companies.. so a moderate success is great... but in modern times a small company with a small wallet will fail before it goes live.... games that try for WoW will most likely fall short but short is still gonna have 5X the subscribers of EvE... so its only a failure in your eyes you see? just because it doesnt hold your interest doesnt mean its not making money...EvE is what i would call the biggest of the small MMO's.. but look at what ccp does.. they have a huge fan fest each year along with discounted flights if you want to go.. I think it cost me 450 US dollars round trip to iceland with hotel room included i believe (i didnt go). they give back ... then you look at a mega game like WOW or EQ2 that gives nothing back and you just scratch your head.. If CCP can afford to give something back then SOE sure as @#$% can... but they dont because they dont care.. they will continue to put out mediocre crap games that make money until some big game that actually gives us a new look at MMO's... and when that happens the mega corps will make a new gen of games that meets the new Minimum and nothing more....
The truth is that you.. Just like me are the poor bastards that dare to have different non mainstream tastes. Chances are were never gonna get a game that we love because theres too much fluff.. and if one does come out.. the 12 year old whiners will complain that they cant get the Super Rifle 2000 In 2 days and the game will be changed for fear of losing subs...
I would do this in a hearbeat, but also realize that this feature would lend itself better to a skill-based game, and not a level-based game.
Imagine having to re-grind every time the server reset itself.
That being said, World War II Online did such a thing very well. I wish Planetside had this feature too. It was oft-requested, but never implemented.
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
to make it appealing,such evil would need the joined forces of hte whole server,and that would mean instant fail.
i trust nobody but my friends, and dont expect others fucking nubs to help, more like to not bother.
that said,i doubt that we could stop without at least everybody doind their part. and considering that in a 5000ppl server,in general terms, less than a 10% are skilled,and a 1% of those are really good players, i dont see why all my hard work have to become dust due to a throng of un-trained monkeys.
A dynamic game world? yes... the ability to change the world? yes... world can be destroyed? no.
MMORPG is about a consistent world, not like a FPS game where one side wins and the game reset. And it should never go in that direction. Because in that sense, if it gets to the point one way or the other, it's just a great time sink (to keep people to do their role to save the world, or for most to not do it and destroy the world)...
If it is not the world that will change, but the ruling government changes. (such as a kingdom used to be rule by a good king, but evil force took over and the kingdom is now under the domain of the evil force.) This way you can have players to either accept the change, and stay away of the said kingdom, or you can have players to become rebel forces and start a revolution in the kingdom... Dynamic content is the best way to incorporate fun and yet not letting players feel bored.
This way your character actually impact the game world, and it would be recorded in the game world. (and since each server is different, you will have xx versions of game world that are somewhat different due to players involvements...)
1) The ultimate evil wins and destroys the world, destroying all characters and assets, and the game continues as a new world where the players all have to start over.
Comments
I would be interested in playing a game like this. But I think I'd prefer player controlled factions against one another. I'm not sure if there are any games that exist, where cities, kingdoms, outposts regions are controlled by particular race, and races compete for their national standing. of course it would be difficult to guarantee that the races will have a comparable population size, although maybe they should since real life wars are unbalanced.
in the case of unbalanced race populations, the small populations really need to band together to make any progress, and may have tools that the other races dont have (science, weapons, God) to win some battles. I dunno, i think id be interested in where players are ACTUALLY fighting for some sort of acomplishment, may it be the supremacy of their race or the fate of the world.
edit: also, races may need to depend on each other sometimes, and alliances can be made and broken. there just will need to be some sort of leadership system, you know, kings, barons, dukes, sheiks, sultans, amirs, pharoahs, masters, etc whatever it is. people appointed, voted, decided by battle to take certain positions. have actual strategic meetings to decide the fate of their people. i dunno
Favourite Game
SWG - Sabanak, Retired Jedi, Bria
Playing: Nothing
Waiting for: SWG Pre-CU
Retired: SWG, CoX, Vanguard, MxO, Guildwars, Archlord, Auto Assault, EQ2, Final Fantasy XI,
Lineage 2, Saga of Ryzom, DAOC, WoW, AOC, WAR
I think this would be great. And to make sure someone stays on the same side they put in *gasp* alpha classes. I think something like fury would work. You get a charcter if your side wipes you restart with that name and stuff. BUT lets say that you and a guild of 20 just kicked ass the whole time but lost becuase the rest of the server isnt that great. You work towards a alpha class that cant be lost untill gained then can be lost. You can wait to use the alpha class until other people so you wouldnt be forced to use it right before a wipe. These classes would be super powerful and would make the the jedi's in SWG look weak. But they could only die a set amount of times. After that they would be reset like a server wipe. For the untimiate evil type game classes that come to mind are.
Good-Paladin, Divine Priest, Crusader, Wizard(mage would be the weaker verison)
Evil-Death knight, Warlock, Unholy priest, demon.
Hold on Snow Leopard, imma let you finish, but Windows had one of the best operating systems of all time.
If the Powerball lottery was like Lotro, nobody would win for 2 years, and then everyone in Nebraska would win on the same day.
And then Nebraska would get nerfed.-pinkwood lotro fourms
AMD 4800 2.4ghz-3GB RAM 533mhz-EVGA 9500GT 512mb-320gb HD
I would gladly play it...
until the world did die, then I would get pissed and complain and troll the forums all day
Yay! A great evil coming to destroy the world and I am most likely offline before coming back to a new character!
No thanks.
-Azure Prower
http://www.youtube.com/AzurePrower
Azures got a point.You have to be a nolifer to play a game like that,otherwise you log out with your char and log in with a noob.
An outlandish idea. Completely shocking. I love it !!!!
Your idea is actually immersion/sense of belonging/brand and customer loyalty/community all taken to the extreme. You don't log in just to chat/check your crafting/do PvP-PvE ..... You log in because you need to save the world and people you know depend on you and need you input in the prolonged tactics/strategy. I hear so many people playing different MMOs that they don't see any purpose to log in anymore. Well, this concept would be a pretty good motivator !!
I like the idea, and I think it has potential.
But, I think I'd modify it just a bit. I'd like to kill off all the Uber leveled characters, or have them succeed, but not destroy the world.
Give max level characters a chance to change the gameworld, or die. The "evil" that comes to the world, or grows in power, makes changes to the game world that suck, like destroys bridges that are short cuts, or causes all merchant prices to double, or all players lose an important ability becuase of a spell, or something that really impacts the world.
Max level characters can change the world for the better by defeating the "evil" but the fight is in a perma death zone. Players can risk changing the world for the better, or losing their characters, but the world isn't destroyed.
Alternatively, I like the destroyed world idea, and everyone starts over, since it gets rid of all the maxed out uber characters. I don't like expansions which just add levels. Ok, you're level 100, now we add an expansion so you can be level 150, then level 200, etc. There is some point where characters shouldn't get any more powerful, because it's just ridiculous.
MMORPG Maker
/bump due to quality of topic
QFE
"And after blizzard takes over the world, they are gonna gather a bunch of lemmings, sit on their fat asses near a cliff, and watch the little fuzzy bastards suicide dive into the ground below. . . . . all just for their own entertainment."
Similar ideas here, it's a long read but you might like it:
http://vnboards.ign.com/mmorpg_concepts_and_design_discussion_forum/b22584/105600183/p1/?16
Keep in mind this is all Old Horizons no matter how you want to cut it.
I'd have to say....no. At least not in that fashion, though the basic server reset idea has some merit.
D.
Old Horizons was pretty good stuff....before they nerfed it to something all too familiar.
Once upon a time....
I do like the idea of it, but knowing my luck my internet wouldn't work for the whole week of armageddon... having played for a year or so to hone my skills for this final combat, having to miss it might make me a little... frustrated!
this sounds like an interesting premise. I would like to see it implemented
see the problem with your idea is.. Yea i would play it.. and so would a few thousand others.. and more importantly we would straight up love it... but the masses would hate it and so the game owners would have the choice of making money off the game by watering it down.. or continue to make payments on theyre production costs for the next 50 years..
Sorry guys but its the truth... Games that are coming out are all about the numbers. Everyone has an idea of the perfect mmo for themselves but developers always water it down so that you kind of like it but everyone else kind of likes it to... They would rather everyone is kinda into the game then having 10000 Finatic fans
No. World destruction and permadeath are very bad ideas. People choose MMO's carefully, because they want a decent "ongoing" game to commit time to. When worlds or characters can be permenently eliminated that that effectively severs most of the online relationships and character identities folks have strived to create.
In a good MMORPG, people want persistence and permanence.
I believe that if you develop a strong community in a niche MMO then the masses will follow. The community is the foundation of a game. Build upon that solid foundation, maintain it, and the structure will last for several years.
Hey man im with you but investors want money they could give to @#$#$# about the community and finatic fans. The truth is WOW makes more money in a month than most games do in a year and were on the receiving end dude.. we can complain all we want we still play those watered down games . all they want is our money loyalty is an afterthought
And by developing that strong niche game with a solid foundation will ensure the longevity of it's profit making potential. Although I've never really played Eve it seems to me that it's subscription base has steadily increased, probably from this result.
I believe that a saturated market sets us up for some pretty serious innovation. Developers will have to offer alternatives, and come up with some great ideas to make sure their product stands out. I honestly believe that we, as gamers, are on the threshold of some serious advances in MMO's. The downside of course is it will take a few years for those new ideas to make it into a game.
niche market games i have played are
EvE
UO
It depends what you consider a failure... these games were made by (at the time) relativly small companies.. so a moderate success is great... but in modern times a small company with a small wallet will fail before it goes live.... games that try for WoW will most likely fall short but short is still gonna have 5X the subscribers of EvE... so its only a failure in your eyes you see? just because it doesnt hold your interest doesnt mean its not making money...EvE is what i would call the biggest of the small MMO's.. but look at what ccp does.. they have a huge fan fest each year along with discounted flights if you want to go.. I think it cost me 450 US dollars round trip to iceland with hotel room included i believe (i didnt go). they give back ... then you look at a mega game like WOW or EQ2 that gives nothing back and you just scratch your head.. If CCP can afford to give something back then SOE sure as @#$% can... but they dont because they dont care.. they will continue to put out mediocre crap games that make money until some big game that actually gives us a new look at MMO's... and when that happens the mega corps will make a new gen of games that meets the new Minimum and nothing more....
The truth is that you.. Just like me are the poor bastards that dare to have different non mainstream tastes. Chances are were never gonna get a game that we love because theres too much fluff.. and if one does come out.. the 12 year old whiners will complain that they cant get the Super Rifle 2000 In 2 days and the game will be changed for fear of losing subs...
I would do this in a hearbeat, but also realize that this feature would lend itself better to a skill-based game, and not a level-based game.
Imagine having to re-grind every time the server reset itself.
That being said, World War II Online did such a thing very well. I wish Planetside had this feature too. It was oft-requested, but never implemented.
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
obviously no
to make it appealing,such evil would need the joined forces of hte whole server,and that would mean instant fail.
i trust nobody but my friends, and dont expect others fucking nubs to help, more like to not bother.
that said,i doubt that we could stop without at least everybody doind their part. and considering that in a 5000ppl server,in general terms, less than a 10% are skilled,and a 1% of those are really good players, i dont see why all my hard work have to become dust due to a throng of un-trained monkeys.
A dynamic game world? yes... the ability to change the world? yes... world can be destroyed? no.
MMORPG is about a consistent world, not like a FPS game where one side wins and the game reset. And it should never go in that direction. Because in that sense, if it gets to the point one way or the other, it's just a great time sink (to keep people to do their role to save the world, or for most to not do it and destroy the world)...
If it is not the world that will change, but the ruling government changes. (such as a kingdom used to be rule by a good king, but evil force took over and the kingdom is now under the domain of the evil force.) This way you can have players to either accept the change, and stay away of the said kingdom, or you can have players to become rebel forces and start a revolution in the kingdom... Dynamic content is the best way to incorporate fun and yet not letting players feel bored.
This way your character actually impact the game world, and it would be recorded in the game world. (and since each server is different, you will have xx versions of game world that are somewhat different due to players involvements...)
Current MMO: FFXIV:ARR
Past MMO: Way too many (P2P and F2P)
If this idea is ever implemented in a game, the destruction of the world would likely be a long process.
This kinda reminds me of what SOE did to SWG.