10And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.
11And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?
12But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
13But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
romans 2:4 "the goodness of god brings men to repentance"
In 1 corinthians chapter 5 paul writes to them about an issue of a member of the church is committing fornication with his step mother. paul first instructs them to give this man up to satan for the destruction of the flesh, to purge out the leaven so it doesn't leaveneth the whole lump. but paul in 2 corinthians follows this up with heaviness of heart and sorrow that they would restore the man in love, and kindness that they should forgive him. what i believe jesus would do and every christian should do is to continue to love this person. You can love this person and not condone his actions. What satan wants everyone to do is to except these people as if their sin is okay, with that mindset he can bring all kinds of sin into acceptance, we are seeing that today in the church, pastors and teachers and boards are beginning to say homosexuality is okay and they can be a pastor, god is changing his mind sin of homosexuality and that it is okay, when its not and never will be. its not better thinking to have acceptance, its not the evolution of a better mind to have tolerance its a degradation of the mind in all aspects, you begin to violate your conscious which leads to reprobate minds filled with all kinds of evil imaginations. People sin is real, you have to understand that we are all sinners, we have all fallen short of the glory of God. We need to love one another, we have forgiveness of sins by Jesus Christ all we have to do is recognize that and repent. folks the reason sin is so bad is because it leads to 1. physical death and 2. spiritual & eternal death. You think God is bad because he has such a harsh stance on sin, but in fact its the opposite, God loves us so much he doesn't want to see us fall into death and destruction, which he provided a way out for all those that would except it, he won't force it upon us because then that violates our free will and violates the laws of love.
"for god so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whoesoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting live"
john 3:16
keeperofkeb
God never changed his mind. He's always loved me. Man has changed his mind and is catching up with God. More and more people are learning what those verses certain men hold against people like me really mean. And it will change over time. And it's going to be good for everyone. People who hate people like me will see we're not bad after all, and people like me will not be so scared to find their way to the church to learn more about what God really wants from us.
All I can say is that I made my annual Christmas call to my parents, but again to no avail. I'll keep it up until either they're both dead or I am, or hopefully until the day that we can reconcile our differences. I know exactly how this whole thing pans out. I'm living it. I celebrated Christmas with all the tolerance that Jesus taught us to show. I would not do otherwise. However, I would love to receive that same tolerance and love back at me. Especially from my mom and dad.
I wish you a late merry christmas and a happy new year Upallnight... And may god bless you and keep you. Strengthen you and give you guidance. I know your road is difficult but god doesn't give you a test/trial/tribulation unless you are able to handle it.
Homo is a sin, and it can not be tolerated by God and that's what happen to sodom and gomorrah. Even though your conscience tells you that its ok, it is still wrong in God's eye, and whoever that continue to perform such act wil never inheirt the kingdom of God. There's no compromise. Another thing, homo is not generic, you can refer to the web below.
"http://www.family.org/lifechallenges/A000000186.cfm"; Basically it says that if its generic than both twins will be gay, but as studies found out, its not so, more of it is depend on the upbring, the places that they are in. Finally, please note that there's a difference of teaching between catholic and christianity.
It is widely accepted with the scientific community that homosexuality is at the very least partly genetic.
We can see this with animals as well. In fact, we can currently make fruit flies gay, showing that even among animals homosexuality is genetic.
The problem is that you're looking for information about homosexuality at a religious site, which, unfortunatly, in most cases is biased.
You can be born gay or straight, but behavior is a choice. You are born who you are and your behavior towards others creates how people view you. Homosexual behavior is a choice just like heterosexual behavior. You are carrying out an action through impulses and/or desires. God doesn't judge you for who you are but judges you for the actions you decide to take through you free will. You can't will yourself to become something else but you can will yourself in your actions towards yourself and others. Also, if you are gay or straight adultery is still adultery and thats a basic sin.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
10And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.
11And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?
12But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
13But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
romans 2:4 "the goodness of god brings men to repentance"
In 1 corinthians chapter 5 paul writes to them about an issue of a member of the church is committing fornication with his step mother. paul first instructs them to give this man up to satan for the destruction of the flesh, to purge out the leaven so it doesn't leaveneth the whole lump. but paul in 2 corinthians follows this up with heaviness of heart and sorrow that they would restore the man in love, and kindness that they should forgive him. what i believe jesus would do and every christian should do is to continue to love this person. You can love this person and not condone his actions. What satan wants everyone to do is to except these people as if their sin is okay, with that mindset he can bring all kinds of sin into acceptance, we are seeing that today in the church, pastors and teachers and boards are beginning to say homosexuality is okay and they can be a pastor, god is changing his mind sin of homosexuality and that it is okay, when its not and never will be. its not better thinking to have acceptance, its not the evolution of a better mind to have tolerance its a degradation of the mind in all aspects, you begin to violate your conscious which leads to reprobate minds filled with all kinds of evil imaginations. People sin is real, you have to understand that we are all sinners, we have all fallen short of the glory of God. We need to love one another, we have forgiveness of sins by Jesus Christ all we have to do is recognize that and repent. folks the reason sin is so bad is because it leads to 1. physical death and 2. spiritual & eternal death. You think God is bad because he has such a harsh stance on sin, but in fact its the opposite, God loves us so much he doesn't want to see us fall into death and destruction, which he provided a way out for all those that would except it, he won't force it upon us because then that violates our free will and violates the laws of love.
"for god so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whoesoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting live"
john 3:16
keeperofkeb
God never changed his mind. He's always loved me. Man has changed his mind and is catching up with God. More and more people are learning what those verses certain men hold against people like me really mean. And it will change over time. And it's going to be good for everyone. People who hate people like me will see we're not bad after all, and people like me will not be so scared to find their way to the church to learn more about what God really wants from us.
I don't believe God ever changed his mind. I think he still believes sin is sin no matter what but, he loves everyone just the same no matter what they do. personally I have no problem with a homosexual person, i don't agree with what they do because the bible says its wrong, but i'm commanded to love and thats what i'll do. Now i can't speak for everyone else but if your a christian your commanded to love as well, someone mentioned that love the person hate the sin is a cop out, i believe that mentioning that love the person hate the sin as a cop out is a cop out in and of itself, you have side stepped the issue on truth and won't face the facts that that is what the bible truly teaches.
The people who are being intolerant, who are saying that gays are reprobate and non believers of God, are committing a bigger sin than gays. No where in the Ten Commandments says you cannot be gay. One Commandment says you cannot slander. If making gays look worse than they really are is not slander, I don't know what is. Even though the Bible describes homosexuality as an abomination, the Ten Commandments is still superior. Breaking one of the Commandments merely to punish a sin - be it a sin or not - as trivial as homosexuality, is more wrong than good. It is what the Puritans did during the 1600s, they punished harshly small crimes and, through such acts, themselves sinned.
The people who are being intolerant, who are saying that gays are reprobate and non believers of God, are committing a bigger sin than gays. No where in the Ten Commandments says you cannot be gay. One Commandment says you cannot slander. If making gays look worse than they really are is not slander, I don't know what is. Even though the Bible describes homosexuality as an abomination, the Ten Commandments is still superior. Breaking one of the Commandments merely to punish a sin - be it a sin or not - as trivial as homosexuality, is more wrong than good. It is what the Puritans did during the 1600s, they punished harshly small crimes and, through such acts, themselves sinned.
Homosexuality just like heterosexuality can produce such behaviors that do go against the 10 commandments. It doesn't matter what you were born but your behavior. You can stil break those commandments. Both could cause a person to behave in a manner that would break one or possibly all 10 commandments. Stop trying to make excuses for peoples behavior.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
'It is a cop out because the bible was never ment for a tool for you to give your opinion on any sin. It is the word of God.'
My opinion? If you say that the Bible is the word of God, and the Bible says that homosexuality is wrong, then the Word of God says that homosexuality is wrong. How is that merely my opinion?
'Yes it is extraordinarily difficult to understand. If its not a mans action good actions that makes him good, what does make him good. Once again your opinion, once again. Its Gods word not yours.'
Jesus says that we must judge a man by his actions, but that God judges men by what lies within their hearts. As I said before: we are not merely the sum of our actions, good or bad. However, our actions *do* have an effect on us -- on our inner selves. This is why we should try to do good deeds and think good thoughts. And while you say this is extraordinarily difficult for you to understand, it is as clear as day to me. You've said it's God's words, not mine, but haven't indicated where God contradicted what I said.
'Any idiot who has read the bible can tell you Jesus doesnt want us to chace around his sons with the bible. As you said before, religion is between you and God.... So why dont you keep it that way. If you are homosexual you can discuss it with God and i promise you no homosexuals will come to you and ask you how to run their life.'
You're trying to tell me how to run my life right now, aren't you? Sure seems that way to me.
I've said I think homosexuality is wrong. If someone is a drunkard and refuses to stop drinking, I will think less of them for it, and I might not want to socialize with them. If someone continually unleashes cruel barbs at mentally retarded people and refuses to stop, I will think less of them and not want to socialize with them. I do that not simply because I disagree with their actions, but because they refuse to STOP and instead they embrace their flawed ways.
'As Jesus said. This man owes you $400 this man owes you $20, who has sinned more. No-one.'
If you're implying that I believe that people who commit homosexual acts have somehow done some wrong against me, I don't think that at all. I don't think people who engage in homosexual behavior owe me some sort of spiritual money.
'Jesus Christ is love. All we are expected to do is practice love and compassion. When judgement day comes, you will not receive bonus points for each homosexual you convert to being straight.'
We are expected to try to help one another, just as in the example I earlier gave about the runner. If I had no compassion, I wouldn't care if they were messing themselves up. There are two reasons for pointing out someone doing something wrong: to inform or to mock. One is to try to help, the other is to bring about self-hatred. One is done out of care, the other out of cruelty.
As for how God judges my actions in this, hopefully he believes that I am trying to help others and am not shuddering with glee attempting to get people to hate themselves. I can't speak for what motivates others. BTW, nice failure to answer my question.
'precisely, and calling other people sinners is not a way to happiness. Let he who casts the first stone, and the likes.'
Yes, and afterwards, he turns to the lady they were about to stone and ends by saying to her, "Go, and sin no more." Oh? Did he refer to what she had done as a sin? Yes, he did. He didn't say, "Well, as long as you are happy with yourself, it's okay with me if you screw a married man." Wow, maybe he was intolerant of adultry.
So far as I know, Jesus never talks about homosexuality in the NT. I don't think he talked about murder, either, or not honoring your mother and your father. Are you saying that simply because Jesus never addressed it directly that he doesn't think it is wrong? If you don't talk about something, it doesn't exist? I don't think so.
Finally, you mentioned my earlier post to someone else. I'm not entirely sure which aspect of that you're trying to tie into this. I have NEVER said that a person who practices homosexuality is not a Christian. I think you can practice homosexuality and be a Christian. It may also be that God doesn't mind homosexuality at all; that is, I could be wrong in how I've interpreted things. For this reason above all others I would never say that if you actively pursue homosexual relationships all of your life until you die that you are going to Hell. I have no idea where anyone is going, including me. I'm only pointing out that I think, based on what I've read and thought, that engaging in homosexuality is detrimental to your relationship with God, and so should be avoided. I've NEVER said that anyone *has* to accept what I say, or believe what I believe, or do what I tell them to do. People make their own decisions and then have to accept the consequences of them, good or bad. If I point out that a course of action may well have a bad consequence, should I be condemned for that? I don't think so. But if people want to take that stance towards me, that is, once again, their own decision.
Regardless of any specific religious doctrine, be it Christian or Muslim or Jewish or anything, I absolutely refuse to believe that any loving God would make homosexuality a sin. I don't care what any book says, and although I am not personally gay, I have a whole lot of friends who are, and they are some of the nicest and friendliest people I know. Despite what many people in the area where I live seem to think, they do not CHOOSE to be gay. For many if not most of them, it's even something they truly wish they could change, but they can't. That's just the way the are, and there's nothing wrong with that.
I'm sorry, but any God who would create people with some sort of pre-programed "sin" in their life that try as they might, they can't change and are therefore "doomed" to hell, is no God at all. Blasphemy or not, I would never follow a God like that even if I knew him to be true.
Schutzbar - Human Warrior - Windrunner Alliance - World of Warcraft Nihilanth - Kerra Paladin - Blackburrow - EverQuest II XBL Gamertag - Eagle15GT
I just feel like the whole idea of government sponsored holidays is ridiculous. I mean, we are supposed to have freedom of religion, but in reality, what if everyone started their own religion and decided what days were holidays. We could eventually end up with 365 days of the year being different holidays. There is no reason why some specific religion's holiday should be recognized and not any others. What we really need is just more vacation time overall.
Originally posted by Dunlopez I just feel like the whole idea of government sponsored holidays is ridiculous. I mean, we are supposed to have freedom of religion, but in reality, what if everyone started their own religion and decided what days were holidays. We could eventually end up with 365 days of the year being different holidays. There is no reason why some specific religion's holiday should be recognized and not any others. What we really need is just more vacation time overall.
All hail the flying spaghetti monster! (It's from Pastafarians, it's a religion made up with the purpose of poking fun at organized religion. midgets and pirates are its chosen people lol!)
Comments
God never changed his mind. He's always loved me. Man has changed his mind and is catching up with God. More and more people are learning what those verses certain men hold against people like me really mean. And it will change over time. And it's going to be good for everyone. People who hate people like me will see we're not bad after all, and people like me will not be so scared to find their way to the church to learn more about what God really wants from us.
--------------------------------------
--------------------------------------
It is widely accepted with the scientific community that homosexuality is at the very least partly genetic.
We can see this with animals as well. In fact, we can currently make fruit flies gay, showing that even among animals homosexuality is genetic.
The problem is that you're looking for information about homosexuality at a religious site, which, unfortunatly, in most cases is biased.
You can be born gay or straight, but behavior is a choice. You are born who you are and your behavior towards others creates how people view you. Homosexual behavior is a choice just like heterosexual behavior. You are carrying out an action through impulses and/or desires. God doesn't judge you for who you are but judges you for the actions you decide to take through you free will. You can't will yourself to become something else but you can will yourself in your actions towards yourself and others. Also, if you are gay or straight adultery is still adultery and thats a basic sin.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
God never changed his mind. He's always loved me. Man has changed his mind and is catching up with God. More and more people are learning what those verses certain men hold against people like me really mean. And it will change over time. And it's going to be good for everyone. People who hate people like me will see we're not bad after all, and people like me will not be so scared to find their way to the church to learn more about what God really wants from us.
I don't believe God ever changed his mind. I think he still believes sin is sin no matter what but, he loves everyone just the same no matter what they do. personally I have no problem with a homosexual person, i don't agree with what they do because the bible says its wrong, but i'm commanded to love and thats what i'll do. Now i can't speak for everyone else but if your a christian your commanded to love as well, someone mentioned that love the person hate the sin is a cop out, i believe that mentioning that love the person hate the sin as a cop out is a cop out in and of itself, you have side stepped the issue on truth and won't face the facts that that is what the bible truly teaches.
keeperofkeb
The people who are being intolerant, who are saying that gays are reprobate and non believers of God, are committing a bigger sin than gays. No where in the Ten Commandments says you cannot be gay. One Commandment says you cannot slander. If making gays look worse than they really are is not slander, I don't know what is. Even though the Bible describes homosexuality as an abomination, the Ten Commandments is still superior. Breaking one of the Commandments merely to punish a sin - be it a sin or not - as trivial as homosexuality, is more wrong than good. It is what the Puritans did during the 1600s, they punished harshly small crimes and, through such acts, themselves sinned.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Nasica wrote:
'It is a cop out because the bible was never ment for a tool for you to give your opinion on any sin. It is the word of God.'
My opinion? If you say that the Bible is the word of God, and the Bible says that homosexuality is wrong, then the Word of God says that homosexuality is wrong. How is that merely my opinion?
'Yes it is extraordinarily difficult to understand. If its not a mans action good actions that makes him good, what does make him good. Once again your opinion, once again. Its Gods word not yours.'
Jesus says that we must judge a man by his actions, but that God judges men by what lies within their hearts. As I said before: we are not merely the sum of our actions, good or bad. However, our actions *do* have an effect on us -- on our inner selves. This is why we should try to do good deeds and think good thoughts. And while you say this is extraordinarily difficult for you to understand, it is as clear as day to me. You've said it's God's words, not mine, but haven't indicated where God contradicted what I said.
'Any idiot who has read the bible can tell you Jesus doesnt want us to chace around his sons with the bible. As you said before, religion is between you and God.... So why dont you keep it that way. If you are homosexual you can discuss it with God and i promise you no homosexuals will come to you and ask you how to run their life.'
You're trying to tell me how to run my life right now, aren't you? Sure seems that way to me.
I've said I think homosexuality is wrong. If someone is a drunkard and refuses to stop drinking, I will think less of them for it, and I might not want to socialize with them. If someone continually unleashes cruel barbs at mentally retarded people and refuses to stop, I will think less of them and not want to socialize with them. I do that not simply because I disagree with their actions, but because they refuse to STOP and instead they embrace their flawed ways.
'As Jesus said. This man owes you $400 this man owes you $20, who has sinned more. No-one.'
If you're implying that I believe that people who commit homosexual acts have somehow done some wrong against me, I don't think that at all. I don't think people who engage in homosexual behavior owe me some sort of spiritual money.
'Jesus Christ is love. All we are expected to do is practice love and compassion. When judgement day comes, you will not receive bonus points for each homosexual you convert to being straight.'
We are expected to try to help one another, just as in the example I earlier gave about the runner. If I had no compassion, I wouldn't care if they were messing themselves up. There are two reasons for pointing out someone doing something wrong: to inform or to mock. One is to try to help, the other is to bring about self-hatred. One is done out of care, the other out of cruelty.
As for how God judges my actions in this, hopefully he believes that I am trying to help others and am not shuddering with glee attempting to get people to hate themselves. I can't speak for what motivates others. BTW, nice failure to answer my question.
'precisely, and calling other people sinners is not a way to happiness. Let he who casts the first stone, and the likes.'
Yes, and afterwards, he turns to the lady they were about to stone and ends by saying to her, "Go, and sin no more." Oh? Did he refer to what she had done as a sin? Yes, he did. He didn't say, "Well, as long as you are happy with yourself, it's okay with me if you screw a married man." Wow, maybe he was intolerant of adultry.
So far as I know, Jesus never talks about homosexuality in the NT. I don't think he talked about murder, either, or not honoring your mother and your father. Are you saying that simply because Jesus never addressed it directly that he doesn't think it is wrong? If you don't talk about something, it doesn't exist? I don't think so.
Finally, you mentioned my earlier post to someone else. I'm not entirely sure which aspect of that you're trying to tie into this. I have NEVER said that a person who practices homosexuality is not a Christian. I think you can practice homosexuality and be a Christian. It may also be that God doesn't mind homosexuality at all; that is, I could be wrong in how I've interpreted things. For this reason above all others I would never say that if you actively pursue homosexual relationships all of your life until you die that you are going to Hell. I have no idea where anyone is going, including me. I'm only pointing out that I think, based on what I've read and thought, that engaging in homosexuality is detrimental to your relationship with God, and so should be avoided. I've NEVER said that anyone *has* to accept what I say, or believe what I believe, or do what I tell them to do. People make their own decisions and then have to accept the consequences of them, good or bad. If I point out that a course of action may well have a bad consequence, should I be condemned for that? I don't think so. But if people want to take that stance towards me, that is, once again, their own decision.
Regardless of any specific religious doctrine, be it Christian or Muslim or Jewish or anything, I absolutely refuse to believe that any loving God would make homosexuality a sin. I don't care what any book says, and although I am not personally gay, I have a whole lot of friends who are, and they are some of the nicest and friendliest people I know. Despite what many people in the area where I live seem to think, they do not CHOOSE to be gay. For many if not most of them, it's even something they truly wish they could change, but they can't. That's just the way the are, and there's nothing wrong with that.
I'm sorry, but any God who would create people with some sort of pre-programed "sin" in their life that try as they might, they can't change and are therefore "doomed" to hell, is no God at all. Blasphemy or not, I would never follow a God like that even if I knew him to be true.
Schutzbar - Human Warrior - Windrunner Alliance - World of Warcraft
Nihilanth - Kerra Paladin - Blackburrow - EverQuest II
XBL Gamertag - Eagle15GT
I just feel like the whole idea of government sponsored holidays is ridiculous. I mean, we are supposed to have freedom of religion, but in reality, what if everyone started their own religion and decided what days were holidays. We could eventually end up with 365 days of the year being different holidays. There is no reason why some specific religion's holiday should be recognized and not any others. What we really need is just more vacation time overall.
All hail the flying spaghetti monster! (It's from Pastafarians, it's a religion made up with the purpose of poking fun at organized religion. midgets and pirates are its chosen people lol!)