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Why was tabula rasa made?
Nomatica
Member Posts: 132
Something that urks me, i played the trial and i soloed everything, from outpost to everything it was fast and easy. I asked in chat does this game get any harder, and the majority said no. It was bassically a solo fest. But why? Why do mmorpgs today hate player interaction? Why is this game so easy to play? Even though it was Sci-FI it still felt like i was playing another WoW. And the worst part of it all is that it was EASIER then WoW. WoW was like EQ classic hardmode compared to Tabula rasa. I didnt have to interact with another soul and no other soul in TR wanted to interact with any one else.
But why? Why pay money when you can play a single player game and get more interaction out of NPCs then you do players. you would think a 40 year old virgin you lives in a make believe castle would know better.
Comments
It's sort of simple when you think about it. WoW was a huge success. Why? Because its so easy. There's no risk vs reward. It's just reward and instant gratification. Any semblance of a feature that could have caused stress was simplified and removed. So, since then, every MMO that's come out has been simple and easy to compete with WoW's massive numbers that keep getting filled with more and more noobs that don't want challenge.
Those people feel that you should never have to group, and should be able to solo most of an MMO. The thing that WoW did right, is that all MMOs are addictive by nature. However, most MMOs have a challenge factor and a learning curve that may turn people away. WoW did not. WoW had that addictive gameplay that drew in thousands of noobs, and they said to themselves "This is awesome" because it was so easy to get into. Most of them don't even know there's an MMO genre, or other, better games out there, because they never went out to try them. They just got sucked in by WoW's level of ease, and its that that other companies are trying to duplicate.
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i know what your saying but WoW is a one hit wonder EQ2 is the next inline that has the same WoW like gameplay and its no where near successful as WoW is, when will companys get a clue that we dont want another WoW like game?
They made the game to make money, same as every other mmo company.
TR tries to use a different formula. It replaces the slow plodding combat of typical mmo genre and replace it with an fps hybrid. For the most part I think on this front they succeed. The game definitely needs some improvement though. Most noticeably, community building tools. Without the community aspect and with crafting implemented poorly from what I have read, the game comes across as shallow.
I think mmo's are adding a lot more solo content because that's what a huge segment of the market wants. And as far as I'm concerned, that's fine. But they need to add game mechanics that will foster the community, so that people would rather work together instead of alone. Community is what makes a game feel alive and immersive more so than many other things.
Also don't forget, not everyone plays mmo's for the same reason. Some people like to be apart of a community. Some don't. Some people just want to come home from a hard day of work and spend an hour or two in the game banging on stuff mindlessly to relieve stress. Nobody's opinion as two how mmo's should be are any more valid than another person's, since their $15 dollars is just the same as yours.
It's pretty simple, really. Until game publishers decide to go after segmented markets (broken out by age, in this case), the lowest common denominator (LCD) for MMOs will be even lower than in most industries.
Can you imagine, for example, if 13-year-old children were actually a major market segment for something like Photoshop? Think about how stupidly simplistic the interface would have to become due to teenagers complaining in forums about how they didn't understand how to use the Pen tool.
The LCD for US adults is pretty fucking low as it is, mind you. I'm only suggesting that it seems even more exaggerated in the gaming industry because developers haven't adopted business models that fully exclude tweens and teens as a revenue base yet. I'm hopeful that as the generation before mine (people aged 20-25 now, who grew up on modern video games and not a C64, Atari, and NES like myself) grows up and gains more disposable income that game devs and publishers will evolve a system more akin to the way the movie industry works today. There's plenty to go around for all ages and IQs, and everyone makes some money in the process.
I believe that's the reason that the video game industry has been so quick to plateau - when your ceiling is that low, it's hard to evolve.
The problem with Tabula Rasa is that it is born from the current environment. The current game design theories are very limiting and, by following "best practices" within the industry, they've arrived at a very boring, shallow experience ... because that's what sold four years ago. No one can afford to experiment, because MMOs have bloated, unreasonable, overhead costs currently and publishers like SOE want to start earning their way out of the red ASAP - there is no long view.
This post has gone on for too long, but I'll say this before I sign off: a video game should not cost as much as a movie to create in this day and age, given the product we're seeing. Sure, a great game with truly ground-breaking interfaces and ideas could/should cost that much ... but when something like Vanguard or TR goes over the 10 million mark, there's something very wrong with your workflow and methodology, IMHO. No industry can be expected to do better than Tabula Rasa with that sort of ineffeciency and short-sightedness.
Teenagers aren't the ones who play the easy games, they have time to grind. Adults with jobs and kids want easy MMOs, because we don't have the time to grind forever. I just quit EVE online because one bad fight cost me about two weeks worth of play time. If i played several hours a day it would have been a small setback, but when you can only play for a bit after the kids fall asleep you really can't have a difficult game, because you would never get anywhere.
Adults have much more money than teenagers, BTW, so we are good people to market to. We pay the same subscription fee and put less of a load on the servers :-)
IMO I hear you guys but i think for the most part these games are successful at a first glance because people buy them because they are new, not because the game is good, in which tabula rasa again imo is not. But because its new, its sci-fi. A game like EVerquest in its prime brough tthe community together, it brought people together it made grouping a blast. Come on now when playing EQ classic did you care about getting phat loots? no it was more interesting fight and meeting new people and exploring then caring about loot.
I dunno i think your wrong here many adults played EQ classic.
I dunno i think your wrong here many adults played EQ classic.
My wife and I were two EQ classic players who jumped ship as soon as WoW came out. WoW has a lower death penalty and faster out-of-combat regen times, making it much more fun. We played EQ because it was the best game of it's type at the time. When we no longer *had* to go on corpse runs to get our stuff back and we didn't have to sit for ten minutes to recharge we were much happier.BTW, when a game has minigames to pass the time while you are regaining health and mana, the game has a problem.
Myself, I'm probably somewhere between casual and hardcore. I put in a lot of hours but I don't like to raid (boring). I appreciate what TR did with the combat. It's kinda fun. But they need to add another dimension to the game if it's going to succeed probably. Running around in the game, it felt a little lonely. Everyone is doing their own thing. And while that is fine for the free trial, after a month or two I would start to feel a little lonely.
From what I understand, this game is buggy in the mid to high level part of the game. Unfortunately they may be forced into pouring resources and time into fixing this part of the game, and as a result will not be adding much needed depth of play to the game any time soon. Hence, it may fizzle very quickly.
I don't think you understand how to play this game, no offense.. I think you understand the gameplay, but not why. You don't know how or why this game is what it is.
It's a bit like Guild Wars. Gear and playstyle don't matter all that much in them, and it's not about progression in these games, progression is a means, not a goal.
I love them, and I love the way they are designed. Yes, you're right that they're nothing like EQ where a lot do nothing but lvl'ing and joinging high-end guilds and raid and where community is important for advancement.
I'm sorry if you don't like the game, but I don't think you understand what it's goal is, or just don't like the style. I do, I like it better than the hardcore grind and goal progressed style.
I don't know what you have against a different playstyle, there's games for adults or people with a lot of time on their hands too, EQ - Vanguard etc..where you can rush through content and where mostly adults and communities play the game.
That doesn't mean TR is a bad game, it's a great game for me, because I don't play to win.
I don't think you understand how to play this game, no offense.. I think you understand the gameplay, but not why. You don't know how or why this game is what it is.
It's a bit like Guild Wars. Gear and playstyle don't matter all that much in them, and it's not about progression in these games, progression is a means, not a goal.
I love them, and I love the way they are designed. Yes, you're right that they're nothing like EQ where a lot do nothing but lvl'ing and joinging high-end guilds and raid and where community is important for advancement.
I'm sorry if you don't like the game, but I don't think you understand what it's goal is, or just don't like the style. I do, I like it better than the hardcore grind and goal progressed style.
I don't know what you have against a different playstyle, there's games for adults or people with a lot of time on their hands too, EQ - Vanguard etc..where you can rush through content and where mostly adults and communities play the game.
That doesn't mean TR is a bad game, it's a great game for me, because I don't play to win.
When youve played WoW then you played EQ2 then you played guildwars then you play LOTRO, there comes a point in to that time when you start to realize these are all the same game but with a different coat of paint. right after you played your third clone you will start to see that these games do suck, and yes TR does suck its not a opinion its a fact. It sucks because its a singleplayer game that labels itsself as a mmorpg. Every game today comming out including AOC and WAR are catered to your playstyle, companys forgot about the other playstyles of the old schooler UOers and the oldschool EQers.
Grinding is not what I was talking about. I was talking about simplistic game designs in which there is nothing to do other than shoot NPCs and shoot rocks (mining). I want more out of an MMO. I want social interaction that requires a mature mind, not grouping and zergs. Eve comes close to this, but is ultimately a huge yawning bore due to a lack of a ground game (IMHO) - that said, if anyone is going to make me happy down the road, it's CCP. They have a high-brow approach and don't seem particularly concerned with the under-20 market.
As to your point about marketing to adults ... umm, adults pay for teenagers to play. That's what parents do, by and large. It makes no difference that teens have no money, any more than it matters that toddlers don't have any money. They still make commercials to appeal to young children, bc those children will complain until their parents spend money on them.
Linked from the front page of MMORPG.com
:
www.mmorpg.com/freetrials/tabularasa_trial.cfm
The games don't suck, but I personally have killed enough imaginary orcs and dragons to last me a long time. WoW is the best version of that style of game ever made, IMHO, but it is still the same game.
You realize MMO's cant be anything other than easy due to the simple fact you cant aim or dodge, I mean when you see people hyping warhammer for its pvp you have to shake your head...
The only skill I see is moving back a level in "zones" so you dont die to the mobs at your current power level. In counter-strike it is possible for 1 person to win a tournament against 10 other people, theres no way anything like that can happen in an mmorpg.
Why is it necessary for a game to force people to socialize?
If you want to socialize, find like-minded people and enjoy their company. It's not hard to do. You can do this in any online game.
I dont think it sucks - thats my opinion. The fact that you thinks it sucks doesnt make it a fact - its still your opinion. The fact that so many people are happy to solo and not group - just backs my theory that gamers are basically anti-social.
Companies havent forgotten about other playstyles. Bottom line - companies want to make money. So they can either target the 9 million odd gamers WOW added to the market, or the 1/2 million odd gamers who grew up on EQ, UO etc. Which would you choose?
And Vanguard was released just last year to target the market you describe. Based on how well that is going I cant see too many companies jumping up and down for funding to make similar games.
Problem is Vanguard didn't fail because of the target audience, it failed because it was very very very very poorly made.
@ TR: I don't think the number of soloing players is the fault of TR's design. There are plenty of reasons to partner up, from defending checkpoints to doing instances to killing tough bosses. The chat system is a little wonky but certainly not the worst I've seen. Players are soloing out of choice - and I'm not sure there's much you can do about that except force them into grouping situations. Which of course opens a whole other can of worms.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
Companies havent forgotten about other playstyles. Bottom line - companies want to make money. So they can either target the 9 million odd gamers WOW added to the market, or the 1/2 million odd gamers who grew up on EQ, UO etc. Which would you choose?
This is what companies are doing and it's a horribly flawed way to look at the MMO market. I personally know a ton of people that WoW brought into this genre and there is one little fact that other game companies just don't get. These people absolutely hate the whole concept of playing an MMO. They play WoW because it is Warcraft from Blizzard and most of them will NEVER play another MMO. Why you ask? Because in their minds they are not playing a MMO, they are playing Multi-player Warcraft.It's time MMO companies stop reaching for the brass ring that is the WoW player base as no matter how much they try it will be always just out of reach. These companies need to realize that even though the true MMO gamer is a smaller share of the market it's where their money lies. They need to forget about WoW and start to make games for MMO lovers again. Only then will this industry start to grow and develop again as right now it's stagnated to the point that all games are just the same old tired crap with a pretty new paint job.
Bren
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I played TR beta up until about a week before release. Then they nerfed a bunch of stuff so that many of the instances were not soloable, and I quit.
Call me anti-social if you want, but I looooove an MMO that let's me experience every iota of content without ever forcing me to team once.
Too bad TR was so dull and repetitive.
TR has its flaws , no doubt. But it came in and is still one of the few SCI-FI MMORPGs. It has its players from the boom of WoW but also from the destruction of SWG.
Torrential
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
you know...just because you don't like to solo doesn't mean everybody else doesn't either. that's why there are so many different mmorpgs out on the market, each suited to an individual's preference. i personally know a lot of players who prefer soloing over teamwork and teamplay. they play for the game and not for the community.
as for it being too easy, sometimes i just don't understand people. everybody whines and complains about asian mmorpgs because it's always a grindfest, you always have to party to level up later, and then when a game comes out where some people can actually solo easily, people just whine and moan some more. there is no middle line because people's tastes are just too different. i.e, tons of people loved ge, but for me it was like wth? afk grinding ftw, and absolutely no community. nobody needed each other because you have all you need in your own party.
again, just because you can solo easily doesn't mean others can too. playing style is different for each person.