The usual fetch X quests doesn't actually have any connection to anything and doesn't feel logical. Why would this person ask you to go and fetch 10 pumpkins for no reason at all?
I would prefer logical quests that ask you to go "slay the Dinosaurs at the farm" and then you get there and see that the place is already cleaned out so you return and say "I slaughtered the dinosaurs" and then you finish the quest. How does the person know it was you who did it anyway?
Quests with connection to the storyline and push it forward is also funnier to play as it feels like you do something that actually has some kind of impact on the world.
This discussion is all well and good and useful, but its important to make a point here.
People are using "quest" in very different ways. WoW has get X eyes or kill x tigers type quests. They also have quests that bring you into a custom instance have you do various things. Usually multiple quests for that instance.
So WoW has both the generic and the custom quests. So saying all of WoW's quests are inferior to DDO is wring.
DDOs advantages are the following:
- a lot MORE custom instances
- a greater variety of type and length(short to very long to chain instance/quests)
DDO's "quests" are no different in character than a subset of WoW quests, DDO has simply opted to emphasize that type of custom instance quest.
However they are clearly fairly different animals. To the point that I do not think its a good idea to lump these two types of "quests" together under one aegis. Especially when you consider custom quests are often instanced. And generic quests tend to be for a shared world. And that is not a coincidence.
The usual fetch X quests doesn't actually have any connection to anything and doesn't feel logical. Why would this person ask you to go and fetch 10 pumpkins for no reason at all? I would prefer logical quests that ask you to go "slay the Dinosaurs at the farm" and then you get there and see that the place is already cleaned out so you return and say "I slaughtered the dinosaurs" and then you finish the quest. How does the person know it was you who did it anyway? Quests with connection to the storyline and push it forward is also funnier to play as it feels like you do something that actually has some kind of impact on the world.
But that is why they force to to collect heads. Of course I still haven't figured out why only every 5th guy has a head. They must be zombies!
I'd also like to see quests/work randomized and dynamic (screw handcrafted lore in annoying little text boxes) so that it's unpredictable, and you aren't doing the exact same thing as everyone else. So if a princess does need saving, it's because a random NPC approaches your character, and your character alone, making the quest a special opportunity.
Computers don't make very good GMs. The only thing they can change is numbers. So yes, you could have the computer vary mob HP, mob damage, mob model, mob colour... those basic things.
What you have described above is not that. If you want each player to experience unique opportunities, you have to have designers working all day on one-shot only content. The computer cannot make content like that on the fly. I promise you.
So on one hand you say "screw hand crafted content" and on the other "give players unique experiences". Unfortunately, you can't have both.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players.
(This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
.. Simple question to this is what were players expecting?
1. Good voice overs... something along the lines of Charlton Heston type actors, giving impassioned pleas for rat tails would make it much more enjoyable.
2. Multiple possible outcomes. I want have options... maybe keep the rat tails and send them to my x-guildmate in a box, and get to film her reaction when they open it.
3. Boobies. We need more boobies. I don't know how to make that fit in with rat tails... but that's why you need creative people on a dev team.
I'd also like to see quests/work randomized and dynamic (screw handcrafted lore in annoying little text boxes) so that it's unpredictable, and you aren't doing the exact same thing as everyone else. So if a princess does need saving, it's because a random NPC approaches your character, and your character alone, making the quest a special opportunity.
Computers don't make very good GMs. The only thing they can change is numbers. So yes, you could have the computer vary mob HP, mob damage, mob model, mob colour... those basic things.
What you have described above is not that. If you want each player to experience unique opportunities, you have to have designers working all day on one-shot only content. The computer cannot make content like that on the fly. I promise you.
So on one hand you say "screw hand crafted content" and on the other "give players unique experiences". Unfortunately, you can't have both.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players.
(This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
Do you mean like the EVE mission/storyline system? Because that gets fairly generic. Its nice and its useful and it infinite. And it offers missions of various types. But it doesn't take that long to get all the kill missions down or whatever. And usually people interested in kill missions avoid, say, courier missions.
It has its advantages but I think most people admit it starts to get repetitive. Even though its not usually kill 10 guristas and is encounter based, you still see the pattern.
Although in some respects the courier aspect is interesting, because for people who play the economy via trade routes and buying/selling the courier and trade missions add some extra computer generated sideline things to do that go along with their sandboxy stuff. I don't think that many people are into that though.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players. (This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
Those 150 quests still have to be hand-crafted, which is what he was against. Hand-crafted and unique, computer-generated and formulaic, that is the only choice.
Quests are only really enjoyable if they have a story woven into them anyhow. A computer can ask you to kill a mob, deliever and item and whatnot, but it can't make up a decent story to explain why you are doing this.
the quests are almost always handcrafted in MMO's, someone sits down in front of a terminal or a PC that connects to the database, and writes them all out.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
As the title states this topic is mainly to disccuss the fact I've noted very often now that players use the reason 'quests are the same fech/kill as X game' when they play a new MMO not to continue playing the game.. Simple question to this is what were players expecting? For pratical and logical reasons (and money) I cannot see an alturnative way for doing things unless the system itself was changed as the quests cannot, I mean we can't really go kill raid bosses at level one, thats just silly as stats wise there is no way a character can hold up on their own and being limited on skills and lack of knowlege about the system, it's logical to have these simple quest types. Mid to end game yes I'll expect it to fold into either pvp or pve (or both) grouping as thats the next logical step and then to massive combat bits at 'endgame' to fit that first M in MMO but what are players expecting this is the main question? to walk into a game with a full set of skills and have massive raid type battles from day one? Like I said it's not practical.. So I put the two questions to you: why are players expecting more then just fech/kill quests when they first play, and what do they expect which isn't practically sound with their questing?
Simple more story driven complex and rpg style quests, majority of quests these days is kill 10x boars or collect 10x feathers or npc x say go to npc y he is east off city lol, these are boring and stupid quests.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
If you wanted to make quests fun,add variable random events for each quest,events that have a small or high chance to trigger ,here is a exemple:
You are given a quest to eat a ton of pies in 5 minutes,you eat the pies and get the reward but when you are eating those buys you bite onto a solid object,you find a ring and a finger,you get a aditional quest to find out who the ring belongs to and give it back or go to a jeweler and sell it or keep it,
Or after you have eaten the pies,you discover that they were infested with a micro organism that makes you sleepy,you have to find a healer or you will be put in a very long sleep,you stumble upon a NPC healer who knowns of the bacteria and wants a chance to study it but hasnt gotten the chance ,he offers you a sack of gold to be his guinee pig.
The events are pretty easy to implement and would kinda act as random loot on a mob,you have a chance to get it or not.
Look like how alot of quests where in Oblivion alot more complex and fun to do and Oblivion was a very popular solo game they can easyly implement that kind of quests into mmo,s.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
As the title states this topic is mainly to disccuss the fact I've noted very often now that players use the reason 'quests are the same fech/kill as X game' when they play a new MMO not to continue playing the game.. Simple question to this is what were players expecting? For pratical and logical reasons (and money) I cannot see an alturnative way for doing things unless the system itself was changed as the quests cannot, I mean we can't really go kill raid bosses at level one, thats just silly as stats wise there is no way a character can hold up on their own and being limited on skills and lack of knowlege about the system, it's logical to have these simple quest types. Mid to end game yes I'll expect it to fold into either pvp or pve (or both) grouping as thats the next logical step and then to massive combat bits at 'endgame' to fit that first M in MMO but what are players expecting this is the main question? to walk into a game with a full set of skills and have massive raid type battles from day one? Like I said it's not practical.. So I put the two questions to you: why are players expecting more then just fech/kill quests when they first play, and what do they expect which isn't practically sound with their questing?
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
As the title states this topic is mainly to disccuss the fact I've noted very often now that players use the reason 'quests are the same fech/kill as X game' when they play a new MMO not to continue playing the game.. Simple question to this is what were players expecting? For pratical and logical reasons (and money) I cannot see an alturnative way for doing things unless the system itself was changed as the quests cannot, I mean we can't really go kill raid bosses at level one, thats just silly as stats wise there is no way a character can hold up on their own and being limited on skills and lack of knowlege about the system, it's logical to have these simple quest types. Mid to end game yes I'll expect it to fold into either pvp or pve (or both) grouping as thats the next logical step and then to massive combat bits at 'endgame' to fit that first M in MMO but what are players expecting this is the main question? to walk into a game with a full set of skills and have massive raid type battles from day one? Like I said it's not practical.. So I put the two questions to you: why are players expecting more then just fech/kill quests when they first play, and what do they expect which isn't practically sound with their questing?
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
People like quests. Even if they have issues with various implementations.
In the most general sense a quest is simply giving someone a task to do. This is something that has been done in all human societies from time immemorial. You will never get away from it. Its too basic. Especially considering the ratio of doers versus followers.
Without some mechanism to give out tasks you must expect everyone to blaze their own trail. That is not realistic. Most people do not really blaze their own trail, even if most people want a certain amount of freedom they still do not blaze their own trail.
Equating people not liking restrictions to being the same as people being the sort to blaze their own trail is a mistake that is often made. Very few people actually want to lead or set the goal, even if they get really pissed when you tell them how to arrange their furniture or what to wear.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players. (This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
Those 150 quests still have to be hand-crafted, which is what he was against. Hand-crafted and unique, computer-generated and formulaic, that is the only choice.
Quests are only really enjoyable if they have a story woven into them anyhow. A computer can ask you to kill a mob, deliever and item and whatnot, but it can't make up a decent story to explain why you are doing this.
I believe his focus was a more dynamic and random quest which makes each quest and encounter unique in the sense that I do not do the same quest for the same result as you. (At least that's how I see it when I read his post.)
To do that, each "quest" format must be open to allow multi-branch results, and that each part makes sense in a story and the game world. I think he was more against the present form of everyone can do the same quests due to the fact that the quests system are more static than dynamic.
I think his statement regard the "hand-crafted" quests are about the ones the developers "hand-crafted" for and set in the game as static quests. So in that essence, the idea of 150 form of quests (They are just a general quest format that contains no stories... Then maybe you have a database which depend on what the players where doing when unlocking the related quests, they generate a story for the quest based on the database by search for a story that made most sense.
This way, depends on the situation and the database, you can get same quest format with different stories to make sense to the player based on his action. This brings the player even more into the game and the quest since it doesn't feel the quest is so out of place.
As the title states this topic is mainly to disccuss the fact I've noted very often now that players use the reason 'quests are the same fech/kill as X game' when they play a new MMO not to continue playing the game.. Simple question to this is what were players expecting? For pratical and logical reasons (and money) I cannot see an alturnative way for doing things unless the system itself was changed as the quests cannot, I mean we can't really go kill raid bosses at level one, thats just silly as stats wise there is no way a character can hold up on their own and being limited on skills and lack of knowlege about the system, it's logical to have these simple quest types. Mid to end game yes I'll expect it to fold into either pvp or pve (or both) grouping as thats the next logical step and then to massive combat bits at 'endgame' to fit that first M in MMO but what are players expecting this is the main question? to walk into a game with a full set of skills and have massive raid type battles from day one? Like I said it's not practical.. So I put the two questions to you: why are players expecting more then just fech/kill quests when they first play, and what do they expect which isn't practically sound with their questing?
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
People like quests. Even if they have issues with various implementations.
In the most general sense a quest is simply giving someone a task to do. This is something that has been done in all human societies from time immemorial. You will never get away from it. Its too basic. Especially considering the ratio of doers versus followers.
Without some mechanism to give out tasks you must expect everyone to blaze their own trail. That is not realistic. Most people do not really blaze their own trail, even if most people want a certain amount of freedom they still do not blaze their own trail.
Equating people not liking restrictions to being the same as people being the sort to blaze their own trail is a mistake that is often made. Very few people actually want to lead or set the goal, even if they get really pissed when you tell them how to arrange their furniture or what to wear.
Then that's pretty sad if most people are easily satisfied with the rudimentary mechanic of quests. I personally don't play MMOs to be told what to do or how to play, I play them to carve out my own place in the world, to be immersed in and effect my surroundings. The genre is capable of better gaming experiences than that.
People don't really enjoy quests, they just have never experienced anything else in an MMO game. Quests are just filler, to get you occupied and make grinding/leveling up not seem as monotonous, which is only necessary if your game is nothing but a grind.
How about i just kill mobs to the max level?....Brilliant!
Why should you get more exp for quests? quests should be optional. Im getting gimped because i dont want to quest. That is why i dont play any quest driven games.
Then that's pretty sad if most people are easily satisfied with the rudimentary mechanic of quests. I personally don't play MMOs to be told what to do or how to play, I play them to carve out my own place in the world, to be immersed in and effect my surroundings. The genre is capable of better gaming experiences than that.
People don't really enjoy quests, they just have never experienced anything else in an MMO game. Quests are just filler, to get you occupied and make grinding/leveling up not seem as monotonous, which is only necessary if your game is nothing but a grind.
It's got to be easier to remove nested quotes than this....
Anyhow. If you are removing objective-driven gameplay, then there are no objective. This means no NPC may reward any player for doing something. Because the minute you have a reward for doing something, that is a quest.
Which means, well I'm not sure exactly. In most worlds, real and imaginary, people mostly reward others for helping them.
How about i just kill mobs to the max level?....Brilliant!
Why should you get more exp for quests? quests should be optional. Im getting gimped because i dont want to quest. That is why i dont play any quest driven games.
You didn't read the thread now, did you.
Having quests =/= grinding quests for XP. EQ had quests which didn't give XP. It is not necessary to remove quests if you don't like grinding them for XP.
Then that's pretty sad if most people are easily satisfied with the rudimentary mechanic of quests. I personally don't play MMOs to be told what to do or how to play, I play them to carve out my own place in the world, to be immersed in and effect my surroundings. The genre is capable of better gaming experiences than that.
People don't really enjoy quests, they just have never experienced anything else in an MMO game. Quests are just filler, to get you occupied and make grinding/leveling up not seem as monotonous, which is only necessary if your game is nothing but a grind.
It's got to be easier to remove nested quotes than this....
Anyhow. If you are removing objective-driven gameplay, then there are no objective. This means no NPC may reward any player for doing something. Because the minute you have a reward for doing something, that is a quest.
Which means, well I'm not sure exactly. In most worlds, real and imaginary, people mostly reward others for helping them.
In a properly designed MMO, there are open-ended objectives. You reward yourself by creating your own goals. People don't understand this. This is why unrestricted PvP, player-driven sandbox elements with twitch-combat, no levels/no classes, only skills and attributes are important, because the game wouldn't require hard-coded quests to have content.
Mid to end game yes I'll expect it to fold into either pvp or pve (or both) grouping as thats the next logical step and then to massive combat bits at 'endgame' to fit that first M in MMO but what are players expecting this is the main question? to walk into a game with a full set of skills and have massive raid type battles from day one? Like I said it's not practical.. So I put the two questions to you: why are players expecting more then just fech/kill quests when they first play, and what do they expect which isn't practically sound with their questing?
Seeing someone asking such a question, unfortunately reminds me that chances are we'll never see another virtual world like UO and will always be stuck with the modern day stat grinding video games.
No offense to you man, too bad you missed the good days of this genre when we created our own "quest".
In a properly designed MMO, there are open-ended objectives. You reward yourself by creating your own goals. People don't understand this. This is why unrestricted PvP, player-driven sandbox elements with twitch-combat, no levels/no classes, only skills and attributes are important, because the game wouldn't require hard-coded quests to have content.
Forgive me, but that sounds an awful lot like Counterstrike or Planetside or QuakeWars - but with sklils and stats.
Might I ask, what function would NPCs play in such an environment? Would you even have NPCs? I guess they would run shops and that would be about it.
Now personally, I have enjoyed Quake at various different times. But I wouldn't pay a monthly fee to play it.
In a properly designed MMO, there are open-ended objectives. You reward yourself by creating your own goals. People don't understand this. This is why unrestricted PvP, player-driven sandbox elements with twitch-combat, no levels/no classes, only skills and attributes are important, because the game wouldn't require hard-coded quests to have content.
Forgive me, but that sounds an awful lot like Counterstrike or Planetside or QuakeWars - but with sklils and stats.
Might I ask, what function would NPCs play in such an environment? Would you even have NPCs? I guess they would run shops and that would be about it.
Now personally, I have enjoyed Quake at various different times. But I wouldn't pay a monthly fee to play it.
Twitch-based doesn't have to be first person shooters. NPCs would be dynamic and have advanced AI, and can be used for many different purposes.
And I don't see how there's a difference between paying a monthly fee to engage in turn-based combat and paying to engage in real-time combat. The fees have nothing to do with the type of gameplay it is, the fee goes towards the server that allows you to be able to play in a persistent world with thousands of other players in that same world.
Comments
The usual fetch X quests doesn't actually have any connection to anything and doesn't feel logical. Why would this person ask you to go and fetch 10 pumpkins for no reason at all?
I would prefer logical quests that ask you to go "slay the Dinosaurs at the farm" and then you get there and see that the place is already cleaned out so you return and say "I slaughtered the dinosaurs" and then you finish the quest. How does the person know it was you who did it anyway?
Quests with connection to the storyline and push it forward is also funnier to play as it feels like you do something that actually has some kind of impact on the world.
And to that end, even if it is (as I predict) Harry Pottter...I'm so playing
This discussion is all well and good and useful, but its important to make a point here.
People are using "quest" in very different ways. WoW has get X eyes or kill x tigers type quests. They also have quests that bring you into a custom instance have you do various things. Usually multiple quests for that instance.
So WoW has both the generic and the custom quests. So saying all of WoW's quests are inferior to DDO is wring.
DDOs advantages are the following:
- a lot MORE custom instances
- a greater variety of type and length(short to very long to chain instance/quests)
DDO's "quests" are no different in character than a subset of WoW quests, DDO has simply opted to emphasize that type of custom instance quest.
However they are clearly fairly different animals. To the point that I do not think its a good idea to lump these two types of "quests" together under one aegis. Especially when you consider custom quests are often instanced. And generic quests tend to be for a shared world. And that is not a coincidence.
But that is why they force to to collect heads. Of course I still haven't figured out why only every 5th guy has a head. They must be zombies!
What you have described above is not that. If you want each player to experience unique opportunities, you have to have designers working all day on one-shot only content. The computer cannot make content like that on the fly. I promise you.
So on one hand you say "screw hand crafted content" and on the other "give players unique experiences". Unfortunately, you can't have both.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players.
(This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
Current MMO: FFXIV:ARR
Past MMO: Way too many (P2P and F2P)
1. Good voice overs... something along the lines of Charlton Heston type actors, giving impassioned pleas for rat tails would make it much more enjoyable.
2. Multiple possible outcomes. I want have options... maybe keep the rat tails and send them to my x-guildmate in a box, and get to film her reaction when they open it.
3. Boobies. We need more boobies. I don't know how to make that fit in with rat tails... but that's why you need creative people on a dev team.
What you have described above is not that. If you want each player to experience unique opportunities, you have to have designers working all day on one-shot only content. The computer cannot make content like that on the fly. I promise you.
So on one hand you say "screw hand crafted content" and on the other "give players unique experiences". Unfortunately, you can't have both.
You don't necessary need to create the so-call "one-shot" only content. You could design, say 150 different unique quests format, and as players unlock a certain quests, the computer randomly choose from the 150 forms of quest and pick out one. This does offer a certain uniqueness in the quests that players are doing, and at the same time not put the developers on a path where they have to keep making "quests" to satisfy the players.
(This is just a part of what I think quest system is like. Becuase I separate the idea of the mundane tasks (kill x creature, bring back y item) as missions/tasks, and uses another system to handle such.)
Do you mean like the EVE mission/storyline system? Because that gets fairly generic. Its nice and its useful and it infinite. And it offers missions of various types. But it doesn't take that long to get all the kill missions down or whatever. And usually people interested in kill missions avoid, say, courier missions.It has its advantages but I think most people admit it starts to get repetitive. Even though its not usually kill 10 guristas and is encounter based, you still see the pattern.
Although in some respects the courier aspect is interesting, because for people who play the economy via trade routes and buying/selling the courier and trade missions add some extra computer generated sideline things to do that go along with their sandboxy stuff. I don't think that many people are into that though.
Quests are only really enjoyable if they have a story woven into them anyhow. A computer can ask you to kill a mob, deliever and item and whatnot, but it can't make up a decent story to explain why you are doing this.
the quests are almost always handcrafted in MMO's, someone sits down in front of a terminal or a PC that connects to the database, and writes them all out.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
Simple more story driven complex and rpg style quests, majority of quests these days is kill 10x boars or collect 10x feathers or npc x say go to npc y he is east off city lol, these are boring and stupid quests.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
If you wanted to make quests fun,add variable random events for each quest,events that have a small or high chance to trigger ,here is a exemple:
You are given a quest to eat a ton of pies in 5 minutes,you eat the pies and get the reward but when you are eating those buys you bite onto a solid object,you find a ring and a finger,you get a aditional quest to find out who the ring belongs to and give it back or go to a jeweler and sell it or keep it,
Or after you have eaten the pies,you discover that they were infested with a micro organism that makes you sleepy,you have to find a healer or you will be put in a very long sleep,you stumble upon a NPC healer who knowns of the bacteria and wants a chance to study it but hasnt gotten the chance ,he offers you a sack of gold to be his guinee pig.
The events are pretty easy to implement and would kinda act as random loot on a mob,you have a chance to get it or not.
Look like how alot of quests where in Oblivion alot more complex and fun to do and Oblivion was a very popular solo game they can easyly implement that kind of quests into mmo,s.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
People like quests. Even if they have issues with various implementations.In the most general sense a quest is simply giving someone a task to do. This is something that has been done in all human societies from time immemorial. You will never get away from it. Its too basic. Especially considering the ratio of doers versus followers.
Without some mechanism to give out tasks you must expect everyone to blaze their own trail. That is not realistic. Most people do not really blaze their own trail, even if most people want a certain amount of freedom they still do not blaze their own trail.
Equating people not liking restrictions to being the same as people being the sort to blaze their own trail is a mistake that is often made. Very few people actually want to lead or set the goal, even if they get really pissed when you tell them how to arrange their furniture or what to wear.
Quests are only really enjoyable if they have a story woven into them anyhow. A computer can ask you to kill a mob, deliever and item and whatnot, but it can't make up a decent story to explain why you are doing this.
I believe his focus was a more dynamic and random quest which makes each quest and encounter unique in the sense that I do not do the same quest for the same result as you. (At least that's how I see it when I read his post.)
To do that, each "quest" format must be open to allow multi-branch results, and that each part makes sense in a story and the game world. I think he was more against the present form of everyone can do the same quests due to the fact that the quests system are more static than dynamic.
I think his statement regard the "hand-crafted" quests are about the ones the developers "hand-crafted" for and set in the game as static quests. So in that essence, the idea of 150 form of quests (They are just a general quest format that contains no stories... Then maybe you have a database which depend on what the players where doing when unlocking the related quests, they generate a story for the quest based on the database by search for a story that made most sense.
This way, depends on the situation and the database, you can get same quest format with different stories to make sense to the player based on his action. This brings the player even more into the game and the quest since it doesn't feel the quest is so out of place.
Current MMO: FFXIV:ARR
Past MMO: Way too many (P2P and F2P)
What makes you think an MMO game should involve quests, levels and dungeons in the first place? The genre and technology of massive players and persistent worlds is capable of FAR more complex and in-depth gameplay... the only reason those typical elements are common is because it's a successful business formula, not that many companies are interested in breaking the mold or making innovations.
People like quests. Even if they have issues with various implementations.In the most general sense a quest is simply giving someone a task to do. This is something that has been done in all human societies from time immemorial. You will never get away from it. Its too basic. Especially considering the ratio of doers versus followers.
Without some mechanism to give out tasks you must expect everyone to blaze their own trail. That is not realistic. Most people do not really blaze their own trail, even if most people want a certain amount of freedom they still do not blaze their own trail.
Equating people not liking restrictions to being the same as people being the sort to blaze their own trail is a mistake that is often made. Very few people actually want to lead or set the goal, even if they get really pissed when you tell them how to arrange their furniture or what to wear.
Then that's pretty sad if most people are easily satisfied with the rudimentary mechanic of quests. I personally don't play MMOs to be told what to do or how to play, I play them to carve out my own place in the world, to be immersed in and effect my surroundings. The genre is capable of better gaming experiences than that.
People don't really enjoy quests, they just have never experienced anything else in an MMO game. Quests are just filler, to get you occupied and make grinding/leveling up not seem as monotonous, which is only necessary if your game is nothing but a grind.
At its most abstract level, a quest is an objective given to a player.
What exactly is so backwards about that, that new games should remove questing entirely? Makes no sense...
How about i just kill mobs to the max level?....Brilliant!
Why should you get more exp for quests? quests should be optional. Im getting gimped because i dont want to quest. That is why i dont play any quest driven games.
HOGG4LIFE
Anyhow. If you are removing objective-driven gameplay, then there are no objective. This means no NPC may reward any player for doing something. Because the minute you have a reward for doing something, that is a quest.
Which means, well I'm not sure exactly. In most worlds, real and imaginary, people mostly reward others for helping them.
Having quests =/= grinding quests for XP. EQ had quests which didn't give XP. It is not necessary to remove quests if you don't like grinding them for XP.
But you probably won't even read this reply...
I didnt read it, i dont have to read it, why do i have to read it?
I just thought i would give my opinion on quests. I know it doesnt have anything to with anything but i dont care so..........
HOGG4LIFE
Anyhow. If you are removing objective-driven gameplay, then there are no objective. This means no NPC may reward any player for doing something. Because the minute you have a reward for doing something, that is a quest.
Which means, well I'm not sure exactly. In most worlds, real and imaginary, people mostly reward others for helping them.
In a properly designed MMO, there are open-ended objectives. You reward yourself by creating your own goals. People don't understand this. This is why unrestricted PvP, player-driven sandbox elements with twitch-combat, no levels/no classes, only skills and attributes are important, because the game wouldn't require hard-coded quests to have content.
Seeing someone asking such a question, unfortunately reminds me that chances are we'll never see another virtual world like UO and will always be stuck with the modern day stat grinding video games.
No offense to you man, too bad you missed the good days of this genre when we created our own "quest".
Might I ask, what function would NPCs play in such an environment? Would you even have NPCs? I guess they would run shops and that would be about it.
Now personally, I have enjoyed Quake at various different times. But I wouldn't pay a monthly fee to play it.
Might I ask, what function would NPCs play in such an environment? Would you even have NPCs? I guess they would run shops and that would be about it.
Now personally, I have enjoyed Quake at various different times. But I wouldn't pay a monthly fee to play it.
Twitch-based doesn't have to be first person shooters. NPCs would be dynamic and have advanced AI, and can be used for many different purposes.
And I don't see how there's a difference between paying a monthly fee to engage in turn-based combat and paying to engage in real-time combat. The fees have nothing to do with the type of gameplay it is, the fee goes towards the server that allows you to be able to play in a persistent world with thousands of other players in that same world.