Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
This is why you don't use SOE!!!
Hi-Five
Member Posts: 48
FLS & POTBS Community,
I remember when I got a warning for posting, "the pink elephant in the room is SOE” in the POTBS beta forum.
When FLS announced the partnership with SOE, everyone in BETA was really angry. The outcry was so loud that Mr. Rusty has to make a statement on this subject...
Cute's Top 5 assumptions regarding FLS and SOE backdoor deal that killed POTBS:
5- "Release soon, so it won't compete with other next gen MMO, such as Pirate of the Caribbean Online"
4-"Release this game within the time frame of the movie, while hype is still hot"
3-"We (SOE) are the world leader for MMO business, just look at SWG and Vanguard"
2-"SOE will enable FLS to focus on the creativity and maintaining the game, while SOE will enable FLS to get rich in Marketing, advertisement, promotion and subscription"
1-"Because we are Sony Online Entertainment (SOE)... we got great PowerPoint presentation, oh by the way, we own SWG and Vanguard...so FLS, you can be rich too... what ya say??" [Little giggle in the boardroom]
V/r
Cute
Comments
I can't see why any developper would want to do business with SOE, unless they really don't care about their names. I would "never" cut a deal with them, even if they would be the last company on the planet to fund indi project. And yes, i'm an independent developer, with a lot of needs for funding. But common... How can you be that desperate to let those butchers get their hands on your baby?...
Creativity : The ability to transcend traditional ideas, rules, patterns, relationships, or the like, and to create meaningful new ideas, forms, methods or interpretations; using originality, progressiveness, or imagination.
If people don't learn after Vanguard and PotBS they never will. Getting into bed with SOE is a very bad way to do business.
whats the point in being children , ever since SOE made the big change to SWG , there classed as useless , well we all make mistakes you all really need to get over it , such sad sad little lifes you lead and yes if you want to call it im trolling , but this needed to be said because some of us like SOE.
And both of you are playing Pirates of the BS.
If people don't learn after Vanguard and PotBS they never will. Getting into bed with SOE is a very bad way to do business.
Admittingly I havent played PotBS, but I'm pretty sure Vanguard wasn't there fault, it was Sigil's.
It's more that I feel like SOE keeps making bad decisions on which projects to acquire, lol.
PoTBS was in abotu the same state its in now before SoE got involved, save for technical stuff like bugs. Vanguard's biggest problem is that it had an absent, opiate addicted moron at the helm named Brad McQuaid BEFORE SoE had anything to do with it. Changes to SWG was LucasArts idea. SoE are publishers of PotBS, so anything bad with the game itself has nothing to do with them. I don't know why I even try though, people on these forums don't seem to be big fans of things like 'facts' and 'evidence', course I take comfort in the FACT that SoE is around, making more money and growing so most people know better, they just don't spout off like children on forums all day.
Yeah, SoE, the games publishers were the ones to ruin it, that makes sooo much sense..
Vanguard too, that was ALL SoE's fault right? B/c again, SoE developed the game.....
Yeah, SoE destroyed SWG as well and LucasArts had absolutely NOTHING to do with the NGE despite being the ones that told SoE to make the change, and that the current subscribers didn't matter b/c they would be replaced by many more who wanted the playstyle of the NGE. And before you jokers say that isn't true, Google is your friend, go do some research. That statement about subscribers, and many more detailing why LA thought the change was needed and why they made the call to do it, were made by a gal named Nancy Macintyre who was the LA executive in charge of SWG at the time.
Seriously, you guys need to learn WTF you are talking about before spouting off on stuff like this. Blaming SoE, who had nothing to do with developing the game, for it being a shitty game is like blaming Def Jam b/c LLCoolJ's last album sucked.
That is a varry intresting point and rases an intresting issue.
If LLCoolJ put out a bad LP then it is his fault not Def Jam's on its face that sounds great.
But what if Def Jam whent to LLCoolJ and told him that they did not care if he was ready to put out another LP at that time but since they controled the contract he had to. Would the LP that sucked be his fault or Def Jam's. Do they share in it or is one more to blame then the other. I grant that in a perfect world he could say no but in the world of contracts thats not easly done.
Just something to think about.
Is it a coincidence that all SOE games suck?
Lets get some facts straight right now SOE only role in this game is servers, marketing and putting boxes in stores. FLS are the ones doing all the developing it(SOE can't step in and say anything) so blame them when you talk about the problems with the game.
Thread over.
5) That was FLS's deceision. SOE could give a crap less when the game is released because they aren't paying for development. They get paid to host the servers... among other things.
4) I'm sorry what movie was that? When I think of pirate movies.. Johnny Depp isn't in them.
3) SWG.. yes.. but then LEC had a hand in that. But.. wtf does Vanguard have to do with anything? Somehow everyone seems to forget that Microsoft flushed that turd after Brad McVanguard cost them 10's of millions. It shows if anything how stupid Smed is.. that he bought Brad's BS as well.
2) I'm not really sure where you are going with that. It doesn't take long reading the potbs forums to see.. that the developers don't have a friggin clue. They had an idea but never actually tried to complete it or understand if it would succeed (there is a history of how open pvp gank fest games do in mass market... that's what market research is for *gasp*)
1) Not sure I understand this one at all. Every says VG and SWG have no subs.. how exactly does that get you rich?
I would think that NCSoft is about the only other company out there that could maybe host for people. One could argue EA but they are doing their own thing.
Where is either companies long list of stellar games? (oh wait never mind).
Potbs.. suffers yes.. not due to SOE. Its more to the fact that the devs just didn't do a very good job (imho).
Let me clarify that.. they released a decent game.. they just didn't think out the mechanics very well. Which is why the subs dropped as fast as they did. I don't even log in anymore... which has nothing to do with SOE... (unless a soe dev was in charge of the games economic systems.. the f'd up pvp etc etc)
Now if you want to talk about the NGE... ya I'll gladly talk about how bad SOE handled something..
I've never said that SOE had anything to do with what a terrible game Vanguard is. My only point is that SOE has a stable of crappy games and I don't understand why any developer would want to get into business with them.
Now for all the people chanting over and over again that SOE is only responsible for hosting the servers, selling the boxes, etc. Those are the *exact* same things the Vanguard fanbois said when that game launched. Six months later SOE owned the game outright and I'd be willing to bet the same thing will happen with PotBS.
SOE does not directlly own POTBS, that is true.
SOE however is a busienss partner of FLS and has direct and indirect interest in the venture, as well as leverage and influence in the matter.
so after six months later SOE owned the game as u say , well if they hadnt taken it over it wouldnt be here now would it! , so theres still a player base for the game and SOE saved it simple.
These games would have sucked whether SOE got involved or not. It is the developers fault for making bad games.
People get caught up in hating SOE they will blame them for anything.
In what way?
Do this or you(FLS) are not allowed to "pay" us(SOE) money?
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
sigh. i guess it will take actually having your game soe'd to see the truth. yes soon soe will own potbs. they will gut FL and keep one or two devs and then set about changing the nature of gameplay making oranges out of apples. first swg. then vanguard. next potbs!
http://www.soesucks.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=10
I guess I could be classified as an SOE "hater" in that I'll never play any game developed or published by them. I won't have a good word to say about them as well. Sure, I know LA had a hand in the NGE. I also know that LA didn't gag SOE with regard to them advising their customers in advance that these changes were coming. I know that LA didn't keep SOE from selling us the Trial of Obi-Wan expansion under the guise it was business/game as usual, and then a week later saying "oh by the way, now that we have your money for the expansion, we're totally changing the game".
Those are the things that I personally can't forget and won't forgive. Sorry, but your characterization of SOE "haters" isn't accurate. I don't spend my days on vet forums bashing SOE or start threads to that effect, but when someone posts as if SOE did nothing wrong, I will say a word or two. Unfortunatly LA really doesn't have anything in the MMO space other than SWG so it's not like people can advise against playing a LA MMO because they make bad decisions.
Never fear, though as if the Bioware MMO in production is a LA licensed product, once its game mechanics are made known we'll know if LA learned anything. If the game has a WoW/SWG post-NGE look then we'll know that:
1) LA learned nothing (at which point I'll burn my Star Wars movies---that is a joke, have humor, laugh)
2) Bioware has gotten in bed with a diseased harlot (LA), in which case I won't be trying their game.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
With all due respect but it was one of the worst MMO's I ever played. Reason I say "was" is I cannot see Potbs lasting more than a couple years if that...it's disgraceful. I think It is right on par with another MMO called Roma Victar.
With all due respect but it was one of the worst MMO's I ever played. Reason I say "was" is I cannot see Potbs lasting more than a couple years if that...it's disgraceful. I think It is right on par with another MMO called Roma Victar.
As long as it's on the Station Pass Life Support System it will be around for a while. SOE's master plan is to have a large stable of crappy games that they keep going with the minimum amount of money spent. I think all of the Station Pass games except for EQ2 has a very small dev team made up of people with limited experience who can't command a decent salary.
In general, $OE has earned every bit of bad reputation it has. Aside from all the NGE stuff, which people think is the source of all $OE hate, there are the well documented shady business practices, industry worst customer service across all its games, non- communication and disregard of its various player bases, and general opinion that the "customer is always wrong".
Some of that was involved with SWG, but not all. Before the NGE, $OE was the same way. Everything, for them is about the $$$. Making money is fine, and the point of running a company, but if the customer is not happy, its hard to do that.
Heck, even as far as Pirates of the BS are concerned, they pooched the release of that too. They were paid to advertise (to the distributors) and distribute the game. There were many reports that this was not done well or professionally. People had trouble finding copies in many markets and several major retailers didn't know anything about this game.
If anything, you can blame some of the rough release on $OE, and that might be part of the reason this game has not come close to meeting population expectations (aside from the game having several major weaknesses).
That would make me think that the Pirates of the BS fans here would like $OE less, not more.
True - but SoE added their own special brand of incompetence to the mix, and easily cost them allot of people who will never bother with a game SoE has anything to do with (especially one not getting good word of mouth). SoE fumbled patching pretty bad early on with major speed problems and consistently patching down wrong files through closed beta even. SoE Fed up the pre order distribution in about the worst way possible getting it to stores a month past the date it was supposed to get to stores. SoE also Fed up royally with general distribution taking until now to finally get it in stores, and in some countries distribution is even worse, still. In short - SoE made things worse and ensured a game that needed smooth and trouble free marketing and distribution got the opposite.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
Take it from someone who followed this game for YEARS...and boycotted it when they announced their partnership with SOE: You have NO IDEA what you are talking about!
SOE NEVER pushed them to release within the timeframe of the movies....the PLAYERS did. We were begging them to release at their promised time, in June of 07, so that we would see some free publicity from the movies. But they didn't. They DELAYED, first until Oct., then until Feb. of 08....all while under the agreement with SOE. Notice that line again: The game, originally slated for June of 07 was pushed to Feb of 08, nine months after the last POTC movie, all while under SOE, and against the hopes of the players.
And the FLS crew was well aware of PotC online...for YEARS. It was brought up at least once a day on the forums, from as far back as 2005. FLS said over and over again that they didn't care about PotC, way before they signed with Sony. Heck, they said they didn't care about AoC, back when the fans thought it would release in Oct., just four months after. FLS never based their release decisions on other games...again, an attitude the followers weren't always pleased about.
As for falsely promoting themselves: The Vanguard debacle was happening WHILE SOE and FLS were in negotiations. SOE couldn't really promote their work with Vanguard when there was news EVERYWHERE about the mess it was in, and the way they took over. Again, as someone who was on the boards, we reminded FLS about that daily, hoping they weren't in negotiations at the time. They were, to my dislike. But, they went in with eyes wide open.
Look....I boycott SOE and its products. I followed FLS for years, and left within a week of the announcement of the SOE signing, a personal decision. That said...making up false statements about what role companies played in a problem release is both silly, and useless. If we keep giving people false impressions about what went wrong, and if we keep forgiving some peoples mistakes over others, then the industry will NEVER get the right message. Don't lay on SOE the faults of the developers. And don't lay SOE's faults on someone else. Call the failures right...it will help
everyone down the line.
And, in case you're wondering, there IS fault here for both sides...just not the bogus ramblings you listed.
FLS: Got away from their strengths as a developer, tried to add designs to the game instead of ensuring the basics were set, did not give themselves enough time originally, and ended up delaying too long. All the while, they failed to come up with a decent marketing strategy. In the end, they ended up with a tacked on avatar system that's the weakest part of the game, watered down the game so that level cap happens in a month or so, and never completely polished the PvP aspects of the game (particularly the PIRATE part).
SOE: Picked up the marketing where FLS left off....and did very little to distinguish the game from any other mmo's. When tasked with getting the games in stores, and, even more importantly, getting the pre-orders into the hands of the hardcore fans, they failed miserably. While they blamed all the software retailers, potential players spent weeks posting the locations where games could, and could not, be found. They also failed to advise FLS on the potential pitfalls of spreading gamers among SO MANY servers. They are NOT responsible for the design flaws, the poor added features, or the delays in release.
The conversations about SOE, and games in general, would be so much better if we could keep them in reality.
Who cares? The game was a piece of s*** to begin with.