Sure, put all the PvErs in one corner and put all the PvPers in another and let them have their own fun. Unless the PvP mechanics suck, like WoW's, because it wasn't even in the game when it released. How can it ever be truly "good"? Open world PvP > any stupid battleground.
-------------------------------------- A human and an Elf get captured by Skaven. The rat-men are getting ready to shoot the first hostage with Dwarf-made guns when he yells, "Earthquake!" The naturally nervous Skaven run and hide from the imaginary threat. He escapes. The Skaven regroup and bring out the Elf. Being very smart, the Elf has figured out what to do. When the Skaven get ready to shoot, the Elf, in order to scare them, yells, "Fire!"
Ganking is the direct result of having high level players being far more powerful then low level players. In order to reduce ganking, you don't let high level players have super-duper uber equipment (ships), or level differences.
"Well why would someone play if you don't advance." You lack imagination, sir. You haven't even considered other alternatives to character-centric gameplay.
If you solve the ganking issue, you solve the PvP vs. PvE argument. Otherwise this is all academic.
Please make the game FFA PVP, 100% Looting, No Instances, and allow players to live and play within their ships and/or houses. And let there be planetary play AS WELL AS spaceship play. - Phos
Aha... then you would be the first one who quit it couse of beiing ganked. This System will never work and every game developer knows it. People dont like to beeing ganked, and they dont like to lose their stuff .... this system it would be a "survival of the fitest", but with the exeption that the "non so fit" players would just quit untill there would be no more victims to gank. Well and then the roxxor games would become vitictims themself of ever more roxxor games, untill they quit too. This geos on unitl the population of the game is zero.
Wow is not such a successfull game without a reason (after so many years).
I quit Eve because I was ganked by gatecampers. Not because I lost, but because the endgame was obviously sitting at spawn points (gates), and shooting at hapless victims. DOes this mean I am a carebear? No, it means that all MMO's are fundamentally flawed.
Honestly I don't see what the big issue is all about.
All sources agree that PvErs are most numerous players, followed by people who like to mix PvP and PvE and ardent PvPers being the smallest group.
Designing a niche game to placate one group is a bad idea from business perspective as it puts all of the eggs in the same basket. It is more reasonable to widen the appeal to ensure the widest possible player base, that is simple consumerism.
Personally I think having separate PvE and PvP servers is the best idea. Mixing PvP and PvE is usually a recipe for a disaster as it causes players to become unhappy by forcing PvPers to PvE and PvErs to PvP.
We will see how it goes, from what I read the developers seem to have adopted a pragamtic busienss approach over the "vision" and I find that refreshing. If anything the sinking wrecks of Vanguard and Pirates of the Burning Sea thought me to shudder at the word "vision".
PS As much as people like to slam WoW PvP (and I will be the first to admit it is flawed etc.) its PvP servers are alive and well with FFA concept. Probably more people does PvP in WoW then all other games combined, including self proclaimed PvP heavens. Obviously Blizzard did something right.
People play WoW because it is the most popular MMO out there. It is not that Blizzard did something right, it is more like "Well this is the most popular MMO and I play it because all of my friends do." Also, I don't understand why PvErs and PvPrs must be kept totally separate? Why can't an innovative developer simply create one unified world but keeps to two apart? While I am against this idea, I do believe it is a better solution than two separate servers.
Again, Eve Online's security space works very well here. Yes, there has been recent suicide ganking in high security causing Carebears to run in all directions. But, JGE could do things different and make their high security space completely and 100% safe for carebears as oppose to Eve which states one is only ever 100% safe only if they are docked at a space station.
Eve's solution to PvP vs. PvE players (high security space) IS NO SOLUTION! It is a shortcut to a fundamental flaw in all MMO game mechanics.
Those of you wishing for a PvE Internet spaceship game should simply wait until STO comes out. Being that STO is IP based, I'm sure it'll be carebearish enough for those who don't like to be involved with PvP. Player choice is king. Any developer who goes against this rule is going to fail. However, I am STRONGLY against the "Arena-ization" of PvP in MMOs by players who are basically afraid of PvP or have highly exaggerated views of how bad PvP can be. Compartmentalizing PvP is not player choice. Neither is pigeonholing PVE into repeatable missions that bore the player to hell after doing them for one day. I do not want to see a game that is already an established PvP twitch game be water downed for the sake of people who are afraid of PvP. I am an Eve player and I am a miner/mission runner who is not aligned with any corporation. Am I getting ganked on a daily basis? No. Are 15 year old losers smack talking me down when I am defeated in a fight? No. I mine in high sec space. Have I ever been suicide ganked? No. The point I'm trying to make is I think many people who are afraid of PvP are so through stories they have heard and not by any direct experience themselves. It is like being afraid of their own shadow so they cry to developers begging for the game to take place during the night only. The industry only has ONE all out PvP game and it is called Eve Online. The game has been out since 2003 and is still growing in terms of player subscribers. Sure, it is a niche game , but to say a games success can only be measured by the number of subscribers is doing a disservice to the game and the players. Eve Online is complicated and if you aren't smart enough, or patient enough, you aren't going to like the game. Eve Online also suffers from the lack of a human avatar (which will be changed in the Ambulation update) and non-controllable spaceships. All of these factors probably play into why Eve Online isn't as successful (to some of you) as it could be. I highly doubt unbridled PvP is the reason why. Eve Online is still growing and the reason why is because of player choice. Players who are sick of being hand held in games like WoW or sick of playing in unrealistic worlds where everything is compartmentalized are coming to Eve Online because they want to have a personal impact on the worlds that they play it. They simply aren't satisfied with killing computer controlled opponents. They want to be part of a living/breathing world and Eve is just about the only game that does this. JGE has the chance at this same holy grail of gaming but many of you just want to see it A. dumbed down or B. PvE'd to death which is basically turning a game into a eunuch. There is a solution to this issue. While I applaude the one server model of Eve Online, maybe JGE should offer two servers one for FFA PvP and the other for people who just want to fly around and kill non-human opponents. But why even take this approach? Being a space game, to me, having more than one server kills immersion. Unless JGE is meant to be more of a game as opposed to a virtual world, I suppose two servers would be all right. However, in my case, no game is ever going to take me away from a fully fleshed out player controlled virtual world ala Eve Online. In the end, I think JGE should simply adopt the three space security model. A high security model for the carebears, a low security model for those who like some danger, and a 0.0 security model where it is total PvP and offers no protection to the player. Let it be a one server model so that a real player driven economical, social, and political structure can develop. Otherwise, all this game will turn out to be is an arcade online shooter. B O R I N G
The 3 space security model in Eve Online is Arena-izing.
First you say you hate how players are compartmentalized or "arena-ized", then you say Eve Online is great for compartmentalizing or "arena-izing".
Eve Online is not a model to work on, its a stupid grinding game, and those 3 space security ratings are exactly like W.O.W. zones, where you find all the 1337 loot in the highlevel zones. It is exactly like WOW/EQ/AA....
Dear Developers: I am constantly amazed that MMO games get developed with a strong emphasis on PVP. Frankly, i HATE PVP. Not that I am aginst one on one, which is somewhat honorable,but usually PVP turns out to be a gank fest of 6 on one or it starts after a player is engaged in RVR,which is also unfair.. The most successful MMORPG game in history is WOW. Why not adopt their strategy? Have some servers with very limited PVP unless consensual and some with wide open PVP except for starting areas. This would appeal to everyone. Also, as with WOW, instead of forcing folks into PVP, you can have a few ( and I mean a very few) zones that are PVP oriented and give some good rewards. Thus, you would be using the carrot vs. the stick approach. You can even have special PVP events found in "arena" types of zones. If you are going to put PVP in all servers, then at least make it painless with cheap insurance or little penalty for ship destruction, If you want to maximize your player potential and therefore profitability, you will adopt my suggestions.
Well.....WoW forces players into PvE without purpose. And none want to be forced into something at all. But as it now, WoW is one of the MMOs that forces players to do everything exactly as the game want .
Jumpgates PvP will make every login uniqe. Not two players will have the same experience.
Why do you want to take that away?
No, I do not want to take that away. But in order to prevent stupid ganking where the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most wins all the time, you have to reduce character power between the noob and the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most.
A noob will have to have a chance to win or at least escape, or the noob must be given the opportunity to retaliate against the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most,. Logging on with your alt is stupid, because it means you are also the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most.
WoW approach to PvP is carebear zergfest since there is no fear of dying because there is no significant death penalty or player item looting.
There is no death penalty because players spent hours on end accumulating the sword of uberness +10, and losing it would suck. Solve that problem, you will solve the WOW approach which we all hate.
In Planetside and WWIIONLINE, there is nothing but vigorous PvP. Have you ever pondered why? BECAUSE YOU DONT SPEND HOURS ON END GRINDING FOR YOUR SWORD OF UBERNESS +10, so you can turn around and gank a noob who hasn't spent hours on end grinding for their sword of uberness +10. Any noob can kill any vet.
Now, last time I played jumpgate, You had to grind for hourson end to obtain your fighter of uberness. This is bad, it means that jumpgate classic suffers from the very same critical failures thatevery other MMO suffers from,and if they don't address this critical problem then jumpgate will remain another dime a dozen holey moley is this a long sentence or what.
Jeez. I'm bloody sick of hearing about WoW. Every game in development has someone commenting on how 'WoW does it this way', 'WoW is the greatest game of all time', 'WoW was the pioneer of MMORPGs'. What a load of crap, it's time to break out of the mould and make something new. This is a Space MMORPG, 'that' game shouldn't even be in the equation.
Jeez. I'm bloody sick of hearing about WoW. Every game in development has someone commenting on how 'WoW does it this way', 'WoW is the greatest game of all time', 'WoW was the pioneer of MMORPGs'. What a load of crap, it's time to break out of the mould and make something new.
This is a Space MMORPG, 'that' game shouldn't even be in the equation. /rant off
I don't have a problem with people using WOW as a reference because all these games are generally the same thing with a few exceptions like Planetside and WWIIONLINE:
Making this game hardcore PvP alienates so much of the market. Why shoot yourself in the foot when you're out to make money? My still all-time favortie MMO was EnB and it had zero PvP. Granted, at some times I wish it did. If I wanted hardcore PvP I would be playing Eve (and yeah I played that for a while but it was so tremendously boring). IMO, PvP really works when there's no real penalty for dying (maybe time or XP or equipment durability ala EnB or other intangables like that). When you venture into the realm of losing your ship or equipment for dying, the game becomes a little too like reality for me. I have enough reality in my life. I play games to have fun. Regardless of what happens, I'll try JGE. Whether or not I stay depends on the game itself.
The title of the thread should be changed to please have different server rule types. It is just turning into a PvP verses PvE debate.
From what I have read about Jumpgate they will have PvE content but there will not be tons of it, so having a alternative PvE server would be pointless because people on that server would run out of things to do very quickly.
There will be safe areas from what I understand, and from what others have said on the forums here and on the Jumpgate site it is entirely possible to avoid PvP if you do not want to participate in it.
Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Dear Developers: I am constantly amazed that MMO games get developed with a strong emphasis on PVP. Frankly, i HATE PVP. Not that I am aginst one on one, which is somewhat honorable,but usually PVP turns out to be a gank fest of 6 on one or it starts after a player is engaged in RVR,which is also unfair.. The most successful MMORPG game in history is WOW. Why not adopt their strategy? Have some servers with very limited PVP unless consensual and some with wide open PVP except for starting areas. This would appeal to everyone. Also, as with WOW, instead of forcing folks into PVP, you can have a few ( and I mean a very few) zones that are PVP oriented and give some good rewards. Thus, you would be using the carrot vs. the stick approach. You can even have special PVP events found in "arena" types of zones. If you are going to put PVP in all servers, then at least make it painless with cheap insurance or little penalty for ship destruction, If you want to maximize your player potential and therefore profitability, you will adopt my suggestions.
Yup. MMOs are dead. It has been taken over completly by the NIntendo generation. What the heck are mature adult normal gamers supposed to play in the future? Not a single genre is allowed to exist without the flipping console kiddies waltzin in and screaming to high heaven until its all grinded down into some simplified, children approved, nonchallenging mush.
"This is not a game to be tossed aside lightly. It should be thrown with great force"
...Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Then the game will degrade into the old WOW formula:
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
...Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Then the game will degrade into the old WOW formula:
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
Would it be so terrible... maybe not if you have some kind of flagging system I guess, but most people seem not to like that idea either. Flags with cooldowns are ok with me--stops people attacking then turning their pvp flag off.
Personally, I would prefer one big server WITH flagging, than seperate PVE and PVP servers, BUT I prefer both of those ideas over a free-for-all pvp gankfest. I don't care how many times players swear with hand on hearts they won't gank lowbies, we ALL know that is BS and they will do it.
Give safe zones, OR flagging, OR seperate servers. But do one of them.
WoW PvP has turned into a sport rather than a true battle royale of warfare.
I hate WoW style PvP.
Small, very small, battlefields pitted with two sides that struggle, tug of war style over seemingly unimportant objectives like a flag.
What has happened to WoW PvP is akin to what happened to the Unreal games when they went tournament style. Playing WoW with my hunter I half expect to hear the words "HEAD SHOT" when taking out the dwarves in the Eye - god I hate dwarves.
The Battlegrounds and Arena system are some of the worst things that happened to WoW IMO. Back in the day, when WoW players did true PvP there were some epic battles at the Xroads, Tarren Mill and the like. Hell, we even raided Alliance cities - when is the last time you saw that?
I don't want MMO Sports. I want true warfare. Planetside, DOAC, WWII online, EVE all represent the better approaches to PvP in my opinion.
And as unpopular as this may seem the PvP style of play I believe that has unbelievable potential is LOTRO. If there were multiple Etenmoors that were linked together in some way, that would be so good. But even as is I find Lotro's PVmP really well done. The battles are much more warfare like than sport like, the environment (PVE) plays a huge role, there are a lot of intermingled quests, and the addition of the Delving of Fror makes the war truly epic.
Either way, whether it's LOTRO, Warhammer RVR, EVE open world security zone based or WWII online / Planetside its good - just don't make it WoW PvP. I hate that.
WoW PvP has turned into a sport rather than a true battle royale of warfare. I hate WoW style PvP. Small, very small, battlefields pitted with two sides that struggle, tug of war style over seemingly unimportant objectives like a flag. What has happened to WoW PvP is akin to what happened to the Unreal games when they went tournament style. Playing WoW with my hunter I half expect to hear the words "HEAD SHOT" when taking out the dwarves in the Eye - god I hate dwarves. The Battlegrounds and Arena system are some of the worst things that happened to WoW IMO. Back in the day, when WoW players did true PvP there were some epic battles at the Xroads, Tarren Mill and the like. Hell, we even raided Alliance cities - when is the last time you saw that? I don't want MMO Sports. I want true warfare. Planetside, DOAC, WWII online, EVE all represent the better approaches to PvP in my opinion. And as unpopular as this may seem the PvP style of play I believe that has unbelievable potential is LOTRO. If there were multiple Etenmoors that were linked together in some way, that would be so good. But even as is I find Lotro's PVmP really well done. The battles are much more warfare like than sport like, the environment (PVE) plays a huge role, there are a lot of intermingled quests, and the addition of the Delving of Fror makes the war truly epic. Either way, whether it's LOTRO, Warhammer RVR, EVE open world security zone based or WWII online / Planetside its good - just don't make it WoW PvP. I hate that.
i guess I am only the one who notices how Eve Online's security rating (higher mineral value in higher security ratingPvP zones), is exactly the same thing is World of Warcraft zones (higher mineral value in PvP zones).
...Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Then the game will degrade into the old WOW formula:
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
And what's wrong with following a winning formula that serves 10M?
WoW PvP has turned into a sport rather than a true battle royale of warfare. I hate WoW style PvP. Small, very small, battlefields pitted with two sides that struggle, tug of war style over seemingly unimportant objectives like a flag. What has happened to WoW PvP is akin to what happened to the Unreal games when they went tournament style. Playing WoW with my hunter I half expect to hear the words "HEAD SHOT" when taking out the dwarves in the Eye - god I hate dwarves. The Battlegrounds and Arena system are some of the worst things that happened to WoW IMO. Back in the day, when WoW players did true PvP there were some epic battles at the Xroads, Tarren Mill and the like. Hell, we even raided Alliance cities - when is the last time you saw that? I don't want MMO Sports. I want true warfare. Planetside, DOAC, WWII online, EVE all represent the better approaches to PvP in my opinion. And as unpopular as this may seem the PvP style of play I believe that has unbelievable potential is LOTRO. If there were multiple Etenmoors that were linked together in some way, that would be so good. But even as is I find Lotro's PVmP really well done. The battles are much more warfare like than sport like, the environment (PVE) plays a huge role, there are a lot of intermingled quests, and the addition of the Delving of Fror makes the war truly epic. Either way, whether it's LOTRO, Warhammer RVR, EVE open world security zone based or WWII online / Planetside its good - just don't make it WoW PvP. I hate that.
That is just you. BG is 100x better than open world PvP which gets in the way of the PvE game.
...Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Then the game will degrade into the old WOW formula:
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
And what's wrong with following a winning formula that serves 10M?
I agree this game has a lot of potential but if they follow the Eve model it's in trouble. The mainstream audience does NOT like non-consenual PvP or games like Eve-Online would be far more successful.
I agree this game has a lot of potential but if they follow the Eve model it's in trouble. The mainstream audience does NOT like non-consenual PvP or games like Eve-Online would be far more successful.
Eve Online is exactly like a WoW PvP server. When you go to the zones with the high level loot, you can be ganked. I'm sure WoW's PvP servers get lots of traffic.
However everytime a game has become WOW'ed, it has failed misearably. Probably because all the customers that like WoW are already playing WoW.
...Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Then the game will degrade into the old WOW formula:
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
If they make the game so that you can go about PvE with out ever having to PvP theres no reason why people that are PvEing would be ganked.
From what I understand the game is going to be like EvE online where there are low security and High security areas, and from what I hear until recently that has meant that those that do not want high risk of PvP can stay in those areas and still get by. Also in the orginal Jumpgate I have read PvErs were able to go about PvE activitys and never get involved in PvP so theres no reason to think PvP will occur if you do not wish it to.
Btw I believe in a skill based game it is not possible to be ganked, since technically the game provides you with the mechanics to fight back so it is some what fair. The most that could happen is for a solo player to run into group and even then a really good player supposedly can stand a chance or at least get away depending on the situation.
Ganking will occur if level is the main deciding factor in the game for who wins a fight. From what I understand level in this game grants you access to new ships but not nesscesscerily ships that will always win a fight against lower tier ships. So ganking should not be a huge problem in this game if that is true.
Comments
I'll make my opinion pretty simple: People like you are destroying the MMO industry. Go back to your safe, single player world.
Nope. The MMO industry expands to 17M subscribers because it does not listen to you. Your opinion counts very little.
Let's all vote with our dollars and see who the developers listen to.
Sure, put all the PvErs in one corner and put all the PvPers in another and let them have their own fun. Unless the PvP mechanics suck, like WoW's, because it wasn't even in the game when it released. How can it ever be truly "good"? Open world PvP > any stupid battleground.
--------------------------------------
A human and an Elf get captured by Skaven. The rat-men are getting ready to shoot the first hostage with Dwarf-made guns when he yells, "Earthquake!" The naturally nervous Skaven run and hide from the imaginary threat. He escapes. The Skaven regroup and bring out the Elf. Being very smart, the Elf has figured out what to do. When the Skaven get ready to shoot, the Elf, in order to scare them, yells, "Fire!"
Order of the White Border.
Ganking is the direct result of having high level players being far more powerful then low level players. In order to reduce ganking, you don't let high level players have super-duper uber equipment (ships), or level differences.
"Well why would someone play if you don't advance." You lack imagination, sir. You haven't even considered other alternatives to character-centric gameplay.
If you solve the ganking issue, you solve the PvP vs. PvE argument. Otherwise this is all academic.
Aha... then you would be the first one who quit it couse of beiing ganked. This System will never work and every game developer knows it. People dont like to beeing ganked, and they dont like to lose their stuff .... this system it would be a "survival of the fitest", but with the exeption that the "non so fit" players would just quit untill there would be no more victims to gank. Well and then the roxxor games would become vitictims themself of ever more roxxor games, untill they quit too. This geos on unitl the population of the game is zero.
Wow is not such a successfull game without a reason (after so many years).
I quit Eve because I was ganked by gatecampers. Not because I lost, but because the endgame was obviously sitting at spawn points (gates), and shooting at hapless victims. DOes this mean I am a carebear? No, it means that all MMO's are fundamentally flawed.
People play WoW because it is the most popular MMO out there. It is not that Blizzard did something right, it is more like "Well this is the most popular MMO and I play it because all of my friends do." Also, I don't understand why PvErs and PvPrs must be kept totally separate? Why can't an innovative developer simply create one unified world but keeps to two apart? While I am against this idea, I do believe it is a better solution than two separate servers.
Again, Eve Online's security space works very well here. Yes, there has been recent suicide ganking in high security causing Carebears to run in all directions. But, JGE could do things different and make their high security space completely and 100% safe for carebears as oppose to Eve which states one is only ever 100% safe only if they are docked at a space station.
Eve's solution to PvP vs. PvE players (high security space) IS NO SOLUTION! It is a shortcut to a fundamental flaw in all MMO game mechanics.
First you say you hate how players are compartmentalized or "arena-ized", then you say Eve Online is great for compartmentalizing or "arena-izing".
Eve Online is not a model to work on, its a stupid grinding game, and those 3 space security ratings are exactly like W.O.W. zones, where you find all the 1337 loot in the highlevel zones. It is exactly like WOW/EQ/AA....
Well.....WoW forces players into PvE without purpose. And none want to be forced into something at all. But as it now, WoW is one of the MMOs that forces players to do everything exactly as the game want .
Jumpgates PvP will make every login uniqe. Not two players will have the same experience.
Why do you want to take that away?
No, I do not want to take that away. But in order to prevent stupid ganking where the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most wins all the time, you have to reduce character power between the noob and the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most.A noob will have to have a chance to win or at least escape, or the noob must be given the opportunity to retaliate against the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most,. Logging on with your alt is stupid, because it means you are also the 'loser without a life' who grinded the most.
There is no death penalty because players spent hours on end accumulating the sword of uberness +10, and losing it would suck. Solve that problem, you will solve the WOW approach which we all hate.
In Planetside and WWIIONLINE, there is nothing but vigorous PvP. Have you ever pondered why? BECAUSE YOU DONT SPEND HOURS ON END GRINDING FOR YOUR SWORD OF UBERNESS +10, so you can turn around and gank a noob who hasn't spent hours on end grinding for their sword of uberness +10. Any noob can kill any vet.
Now, last time I played jumpgate, You had to grind for hourson end to obtain your fighter of uberness. This is bad, it means that jumpgate classic suffers from the very same critical failures thatevery other MMO suffers from,and if they don't address this critical problem then jumpgate will remain another dime a dozen holey moley is this a long sentence or what.
Jeez. I'm bloody sick of hearing about WoW. Every game in development has someone commenting on how 'WoW does it this way', 'WoW is the greatest game of all time', 'WoW was the pioneer of MMORPGs'. What a load of crap, it's time to break out of the mould and make something new.
This is a Space MMORPG, 'that' game shouldn't even be in the equation.
/rant off
Anarchy Online ArchLord Asheron's Call City of Heroes City of Villains D&D Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark and Light EVE Online Everquest Everquest II Face of Mankind Final Fantasy XI Fury Guild Wars Hellgate: London Horizons Knight Online Lineage II Lord of the Rings Online MapleStory The Matrix Online Phantasy Star Universe Pirates of the Burning Sea Planetside RF Online Ragnarok Online Roma Victor The Saga of Ryzom Second Life Shadowbane Silkroad Online Star Wars Galaxies Tabula Rasa Ultima Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes World War II Online World of Warcraft
Age of Conan Aion Champions Online The Chronicles of Spellborn Darkfall Fallen Earth Hero's Journey Huxley Jumpgate Evolution Requiem: Bloodymare SUN Star Trek Online Stargate Worlds WAR (Warhammer Online)
Making this game hardcore PvP alienates so much of the market. Why shoot yourself in the foot when you're out to make money? My still all-time favortie MMO was EnB and it had zero PvP. Granted, at some times I wish it did. If I wanted hardcore PvP I would be playing Eve (and yeah I played that for a while but it was so tremendously boring). IMO, PvP really works when there's no real penalty for dying (maybe time or XP or equipment durability ala EnB or other intangables like that). When you venture into the realm of losing your ship or equipment for dying, the game becomes a little too like reality for me. I have enough reality in my life. I play games to have fun. Regardless of what happens, I'll try JGE. Whether or not I stay depends on the game itself.
Too much PvP is bad.
The title of the thread should be changed to please have different server rule types. It is just turning into a PvP verses PvE debate.
From what I have read about Jumpgate they will have PvE content but there will not be tons of it, so having a alternative PvE server would be pointless because people on that server would run out of things to do very quickly.
There will be safe areas from what I understand, and from what others have said on the forums here and on the Jumpgate site it is entirely possible to avoid PvP if you do not want to participate in it.
Will it be so terrible to have servers where both PvPers and PvErs are present if you can still go about the areas of the game you enjoy without participating in the bits you do not enjoy?
Yup. MMOs are dead. It has been taken over completly by the NIntendo generation. What the heck are mature adult normal gamers supposed to play in the future? Not a single genre is allowed to exist without the flipping console kiddies waltzin in and screaming to high heaven until its all grinded down into some simplified, children approved, nonchallenging mush.
"This is not a game to be tossed aside lightly.
It should be thrown with great force"
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
Would it be so terrible... maybe not if you have some kind of flagging system I guess, but most people seem not to like that idea either. Flags with cooldowns are ok with me--stops people attacking then turning their pvp flag off.
Personally, I would prefer one big server WITH flagging, than seperate PVE and PVP servers, BUT I prefer both of those ideas over a free-for-all pvp gankfest. I don't care how many times players swear with hand on hearts they won't gank lowbies, we ALL know that is BS and they will do it.
Give safe zones, OR flagging, OR seperate servers. But do one of them.
______________
Mark E. Cooper
AKA Tohrment
Proud member of Damned Souls since 2007.
http://www.damnedsouls.eu
WoW PvP has turned into a sport rather than a true battle royale of warfare.
I hate WoW style PvP.
Small, very small, battlefields pitted with two sides that struggle, tug of war style over seemingly unimportant objectives like a flag.
What has happened to WoW PvP is akin to what happened to the Unreal games when they went tournament style. Playing WoW with my hunter I half expect to hear the words "HEAD SHOT" when taking out the dwarves in the Eye - god I hate dwarves.
The Battlegrounds and Arena system are some of the worst things that happened to WoW IMO. Back in the day, when WoW players did true PvP there were some epic battles at the Xroads, Tarren Mill and the like. Hell, we even raided Alliance cities - when is the last time you saw that?
I don't want MMO Sports. I want true warfare. Planetside, DOAC, WWII online, EVE all represent the better approaches to PvP in my opinion.
And as unpopular as this may seem the PvP style of play I believe that has unbelievable potential is LOTRO. If there were multiple Etenmoors that were linked together in some way, that would be so good. But even as is I find Lotro's PVmP really well done. The battles are much more warfare like than sport like, the environment (PVE) plays a huge role, there are a lot of intermingled quests, and the addition of the Delving of Fror makes the war truly epic.
Either way, whether it's LOTRO, Warhammer RVR, EVE open world security zone based or WWII online / Planetside its good - just don't make it WoW PvP. I hate that.
i guess I am only the one who notices how Eve Online's security rating (higher mineral value in higher security ratingPvP zones), is exactly the same thing is World of Warcraft zones (higher mineral value in PvP zones).
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
And what's wrong with following a winning formula that serves 10M?
That is just you. BG is 100x better than open world PvP which gets in the way of the PvE game.
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
And what's wrong with following a winning formula that serves 10M?
2 words: StarWars Galaxies
I agree this game has a lot of potential but if they follow the Eve model it's in trouble. The mainstream audience does NOT like non-consenual PvP or games like Eve-Online would be far more successful.
However everytime a game has become WOW'ed, it has failed misearably. Probably because all the customers that like WoW are already playing WoW.
Grind to level 60--->Gank lowbies--->Declare your leetness.
If they make the game so that you can go about PvE with out ever having to PvP theres no reason why people that are PvEing would be ganked.From what I understand the game is going to be like EvE online where there are low security and High security areas, and from what I hear until recently that has meant that those that do not want high risk of PvP can stay in those areas and still get by. Also in the orginal Jumpgate I have read PvErs were able to go about PvE activitys and never get involved in PvP so theres no reason to think PvP will occur if you do not wish it to.
Btw I believe in a skill based game it is not possible to be ganked, since technically the game provides you with the mechanics to fight back so it is some what fair. The most that could happen is for a solo player to run into group and even then a really good player supposedly can stand a chance or at least get away depending on the situation.
Ganking will occur if level is the main deciding factor in the game for who wins a fight. From what I understand level in this game grants you access to new ships but not nesscesscerily ships that will always win a fight against lower tier ships. So ganking should not be a huge problem in this game if that is true.