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General: NCsoft Tackles Illegal Servers
Szark
News ManagerMember Posts: 4,420
NCsoft has announced in a press release that they are increasing their efforts to combat illegal online game servers, particularly in Eastern Europe.
NCsoft®, the world-leading, publisher of massively multiplayer online games such as Guild Wars®, Lineage® II and City of Heroes®, today announced that it was stepping up its fight against the growing menace of intellectual property theft. This action comes as a direct response to the rise of illegal online game servers throughout Eastern Europe, particularly in Greece and Russia where NCsoft’s fantasy-based online role playing game, Lineage II, is extremely popular.
The fraudulent servers in question are being used by players playing at home and in internet cafes, but such unauthorised servers often feature – or require users to download – illegally modified and potentially harmful game data, thereby changing the intended online experience.
NCsoft’s European office has identified several prominent illegal servers across Europe and is in the process of taking action against individuals and corporations deemed to be in breach of international copyright laws. In a lawsuit that was commenced last year in Greece, NCsoft successfully obtained a court order against Internet Cafe business, ‘e-GLOBAL’ following which four of its cafes were raided and illegal software was seized. This led to the shutting down of illegal servers on which pirate copies of Lineage II software was loaded. Georgios Katostaris – Chairman of the Board and Managing Director, Constantinos Zygouras – Vice-Chairman of the Board and Managing Director, Athanassios Dobros – Deputy Managing Director and Dimitrios Koutsoukos – Administrator of the company under the name ‘INTERNET DYNAMICS LLC’ have all been made personal defendants to the proceedings that are continuing in the Greek Courts in which NCsoft is seeking damages as well as criminal remedies.
Read more here.
Comments
The only issue I have with that article is it claims that NCSoft lost up to 6 million on private servers due to them "Stealing" business.
Last time I looked at private servers, they are so different from live its not funny. Faster levels, different rewards, etc. People playing private servers arent going to go back to NCsofts... thats just a legal method to get them to shut down.
However, it is their software, and their ip...however claiming a free to download software is pirated does make me laugh
they will never combat them with any great success, just as easy for new ones to come out , that they cannot reach lol. oh no i lost my player controlled lvl 100 char..where i am known.. hmm Ill email my friend and get a new one in the new server we just made 10minutes ago =p.
pretty pointless attempt...and yes I agree with above poster the gameplay on those private server are what the people want in the game, if they wanted to play on the real servers they would be... but guess what, they are not
Unless the private servers are charging....they are just wasting time. Players that play on them aren't playing because they intend to give anyone 15 a month. Its because they DON'T.
Legal, illegal...who cares. Its all about the bottom line, and frankly...its not gonna earn them a dime most likely unless the illegal servers WERE charging lower monthly fees. In that case...they stand to earn quite a bit from this.
So if a company came out and offered free Whoppers that were cooked faster and didn't have any pickles, Burger King shouldn't claim they lost business because if people wanted the real whoppers they would be paying for them?
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Of course piracy and private servers are hurting the Software industry and they should be shut down. It is illegal and it costs the people that designed the software hard earned money.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
Totally right whatever reason .
-Semper ubi sub ubi!
always wear underwear
OMGZORZZ!!! free whoopers, I am so there..and everyone else would be too, you cannot compete with free, bye bye burger king. your analogy is poor lol
PS: I dont like pickles
I don't think a company could stay in business very long offering enough free whoppers to hurt Burger King's sales. Someone has to buy the cow meat.
For reference, WoW just netted 1.2 *billion* last year.
How many yachts can you water-ski behind? When is enough enough...?
NCsoft: don't go the way of the movie/music dinosaur cartels - offer value adds that make ppl want to pay for your services. Anything else is pure greed. Suing your own customers - never good for business, whichever way you slice the cake. Here endeth the lesson.
They say that right before you die, your life flashes before your eyes. That's true, even for a blind man. ^DareDevil^
And for the record, there are far more "illegal" servers for World of Warcraft than there are for Lineage 2.
People who play private servers do it because they're too lazy or too cheap to play retail. Generally, you can play on a private server for free, forever. Private servers usually run much higher rates for drops/exp/etc than retail does, making the whole experience much more enjoyable for people who have to work and don't want to take 80 days /played to get max level in lineage 2.
The claim that NCsoft is losing business through these servers is just wrong, people who play private servers play them because they don't like what retail has to offer. Shutting down these servers is just going to cause players to migrate to other servers, not to retail.
Now with 57.3% more flames!
In this particular case it seems that the problem is that the servers are set up, the players are being charged, and the charges are being made in the name of NCSoft, not in the name of the fraudulent server companies.
This can hurt NCSoft quite severely if (when) something goes awry or service is closed down and some customers want refunds from NCSoft. It could also potentially harm their brand significantly in the market.
I don't know how, but I blame this on ED, NGE and SOE CS! :P
Honestly; I would never even consider such an illegal server myself and here are the reasons:
1- They can only offer casuals/test servers to anyone remotedly serious about the game.
2- You cannot trust them, who is cheating, who is getting unfair bonuses? Will they delete my character?
3- Virus+
4- I want my game to evolves and developp, money can spoil devs bad (see SOE), but it can also promotes a game by supporting it. See, devs has to work because they want to, not because they are been paid and have to.
So...as long as this is "corporate NC" and not "Devs NC" which focus their efforts on this, why would I care or should we even talk about this? If "Devs NC" are wasting their talents on this, I want a private meeting to beat the crap out of "Corporate NC". :P
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
People arguing that this type of piracy doesn't cost the game industry money are kidding themselves. If the people playing on the pirate servers weren't playing on the pirate servers they'd either be playing on the official NCSoft servers...or they'd be playing another game. At some point a good chunk of the people playing on the pirate servers would be paying money to a legitimate company...so someone is losing money from at least a portion of the people playing on the free servers. Assuming all of them would eventually pay money is going a bit far I think as a smaller portion of the people playing on the servers are no doubt just cheap and wouldn't pay no matter what. But they have the right to make that claim...it is their IP after all.
Good luck to NCSoft...if you like the game pay for it...if not don't play it...simple as that.
I quit Lineage 2 awhile back due to the farmers and botters. Not the game or community. Now I play on private servers because it has none or very very few famers/botters. AND the GMs in the private servers are ACTIVE banning offenders with no questions asked. Bottom line is, private servers are able to give a much more enjoyable and valuable play experience compared to retail.
NCSoft lost my 15 bucks a month do to their own negligence and extremely limited ingame support. Not because of some private servers that were setup. If it wasn't for them, I wouldn't be playing on their software at all.
Maybe if game companies start supporting what the create and offer a consistantly fun experience, people would stay with retail. Companies are losing players and losing money because they aren't hiring enough bodies to keep the virus's that we call botters and farmers out. Spend some money, gain some money.
IMO developers can learn much from the community of private servers.
If developers were to spend TIME on creating a good QUALITY game with much needed SUPPORT for offenders of the EULA (THAT MEANS HIRE IN GAME GMS WHO DO NOTHING BUT BAN/SUSPEND BOTTERS/FAMERS/CHEATERS) we may have a beacon of hope.
You can make more money off the offenders by banning them right out than going through all these "safety" procedures before you click the "nuke" button. They will go out and just buy more copies of the game @ $20 - $50 a pop. And you ban em again, eventually the offenders would be spending more money than they are making.
The problem is at the source, the heart, the core. Not the ones who branch out looking for a good quality experience of "fun". God forbid if the games stop becoming enjoyable, so we go out and produce our own answers because the companies can't supply the demands of the players. Supply and demand my friends, supply and demand.
Well said Zero. There are other reasons a person might want to play on or even install a personal server, so his game is available for years to come. Will I be able to play GW1 or CoH or LOTRO or WoW in 10 years time, as I know I will D2 on a LAN, for example...?
What have companies like Blizzard given us/you for the billions of dollars of profit? More servers (aka online slot machines lol!) & one piddly expansion in 4 years? I mean, hullo, McFly???
And I'm sick & tired of the IP debates. IP laws are fundamentally flawed, dated & run by pure greed. The Internet is seeing a diametric shift in how musos & other independents self-publish. Adapt or die, like any other business. You can't own an idea. Your founding fathers would probably turn over in their graves if they saw what patent laws & copyrights have amounted to. Most movies only make money for the producers in the first 6 weeks at the box office. Everything else is middle-men & cartels spreading their greedy fingers around, with licenses for anything & everything they didn't create, nor should they own or profit from. Whatever happened to making movies/music/games/art for the love of it? I guess it went the same place as quality, originality & innovative design *sigh*.
As far as games go, online delivery mechanisms such as Steam is finally seeing half-price games instead of the US$40-50 price tag (up to $100 in Aus for some games!) we've seen for far too many years. I buy my fair share of games, but I always try b4 I buy. I'm not giving a dev/publisher $70-90 for something I may only fiddle with for a couple hours b4 I realise it's pants. And demos don't cut it - they're pre-alpha usually & never a good indication of release gameplay. Most of my purchases these days are indy or online titles for this reason.
And then God said: "Let there be file sharing!".
</rant>
They say that right before you die, your life flashes before your eyes. That's true, even for a blind man. ^DareDevil^
/End.
You can't blame people who want to enjoy a game they paid for and over 4 years get completely neglected and auto-response who then decide they've wasted enough time. Maybe if NC Soft didn't suck balls they wouldn't have to cry about their own losses.
You're "tired of IP debates"? Well why do YOU get to be the sole arbiter of what someone is allowed to earn? Can you answer me that? If WoW isnt delivering value in your eyes, then dont play it. I like how your basic answer is "no, Ill steal it instea" and to rationalize that you wrap it in some BS moralistic strawman argument. This is ALWAYS the stance of folks I see arguing from your side. "they make TOO much... I dont want to pay so much! why isnt the stuff I want free!"
What happened to making things for the love of it? Do YOU do that? What do YOU do for a living? Do you refuse pay?
/End.
You can't blame people who want to enjoy a game they paid for and over 4 years get completely neglected and auto-response who then decide they've wasted enough time. Maybe if NC Soft didn't suck balls they wouldn't have to cry about their own losses.
Uh huh... because thats at the source of this. You hate NC, good for you. But dont begin to pretend that this has ANYTHING to do with folks on your crusade. This is about people wanting something for free. If they hate the company, they shouldnt play the game. But instead INTERNET CAFES put up FREE servers and then CHARGE people to use the cafe.
I dont expect you to see any other side of this because you are laser focused on hating a company which is too bad, because one thing has nothing to do with another.
Here's a news flash for people who think this way... Just because you feel a product is "defective" in some way doesnt give you the right to STEAL IT. Get it? Why is that hard? You paid a monthly fee for a service. You could have cancelled at any time. You are owed exactly JACK SQUAT. The fact you chose to keep paying for something that was causing you grief (apparently) is YOU PROBLEM. That has NOTHING to do with people STEALING that service/codebase/content, etc.
It is theft. Theft of the original game code and theft of potential players. They have every right to go after these other servers.
It does show you a few things. One, that there are a lot of people that like to play L2, just not the specific way (mostly grind and difficulty of obtaining items). It is a good game, runs smooth, fun classes, great graphics for a 4 year old game. Another, is that people don't care much for the botters, they would much rather play on a server where everything is easier to buy and adena (in game money) is easier to earn. 15 bucks a month for a game that takes years ( or at least a poo-load of hours) to get a high level?
Perhaps NCsoft should attack the botters and cheaters as hard as they are attacking these private servers.
I don't think a company could stay in business very long offering enough free whoppers to hurt Burger King's sales. Someone has to buy the cow meat.
See this is a very profound point. People ACCEPT this because it involves a tangible good. People do NOT want to accept the value of IP because they CANT touch it. So really, we havent evolved AT ALL. Still idiot cavemen scrambling and fighting over scraps. The value of an idea? Totally alien concept. Just take what you want. If its physical, cant take it or someone bigger and stronger will smash your skull. See the law has teeth with tangible good, but with IP, it seems the tide is turning towards NO protection (corps that want IP protections are demonized by the new world socialist wave)
Soon we will be back to a pre-knowledge based world economy. For the guys who live on MMORPGs and websites about MMOs... That isnt good for you. In case you havent noticed, your first world economy is based ENTIRELY on knowledge. You dont grow anything, manufacture anything or make anything. Since 99% of us are KNOWLEDGE WORKERS, its AMAZING how few of us VALUE knowlege!
If they dont attack the private servers, they set a precedent that private servers are ok. Today it is some guys basement and some internet cafe. Tomorrow it is a company in China with 100.000 users. How will they attack THAT operation if they ignored the SMALL private servers? Believe me... Precedent is strong in court.
As for the botters, there are no botters on "private" servers because there are no PEOPLE there really and everyone just hits the "win" button or the "easy" button and gets what they want. I dont consider "fun" just being able to run around in god mode and, just because many seem to, doesnt mean it makes sense for a company to cater to them or means it is ok to steal a game engine.
The argument of "well its a fun game, but its too hard, there are too many cheaters, there are botters, I dont have tons of time, I just want to BE lvl 100, and if I dont get all of that Ill steal it!" just isnt reasonable.
I love lineage 2... Best MMO I had every played. I have many many great memories of the game, especially in its ealier years. PvP was by far the best I had ever done, and the politics? I can't imagine ill find another game that offers such in depth politics and drama.
NCSoft didn't ruin the game, the bots and farmers did. Granted there has been no effective way to rid of those problems that ANY company has efficiently done, including blizzard, reguardless of how many times they sue a bot creator or farmer company, anything anyone does just proves to be beating a dead horse.
Bottom line is - I love lineage 2, but I do not find it fun playing retail because your FORCED to buy adena in game to survive with its economy. Otherwise you stand NO chance of advancement. No chance of advancement = No fun! I dont want to pay more than 15 bucks a month, and I want to have a good time while playing. Something that I am unable to do while I play retail. ITS NOT FUN.
So then you move onto the private servers. To continue my enjoyment of the game that I had spent more hours than I would like to recall playing. I play them because its fun. Bottom line. Stealing or not. Its not viewed the same here as it is in the real world of stealing bread from wal-mart. Im simply trying to continue my enjoyment and fondness of the game, because I dont want to quit. I want to continue to play. And if the farmers and botters were all gone in retail, you can bet I would reactivate my account almost instantly.
The means and tools are out there for me to continue my enjoyment for the game... But I shouldn't because the software is being stolen to make private servers.
Logically it makes sense yes.
But they wont be able to stop private servers anymore than botting or farming can be stopped.
So Ill continue to have fun and enjoyment out of a game I like to play.
The means and tools are out there for me to continue my enjoyment for the game... But I shouldn't because the software is being stolen to make private servers.
Logically it makes sense yes.
But they wont be able to stop private servers anymore than botting or farming can be stopped.
So Ill continue to have fun and enjoyment out of a game I like to play.
And the next time someone robs your house or steals your car hey, they were just having some fun so they should be able to get away with it.Stealing is criminal, if you engage in it you deserve to pay, just like any other criminal. Games can cost millions to develope, the salaries of the developers and programmers are not cheap. You have abolutely NO right to just help yourself to the fruits of their labor.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
The means and tools are out there for me to continue my enjoyment for the game... But I shouldn't because the software is being stolen to make private servers.
Logically it makes sense yes.
But they wont be able to stop private servers anymore than botting or farming can be stopped.
So Ill continue to have fun and enjoyment out of a game I like to play.
And the next time someone robs your house or steals your car hey, they were just having some fun so they should be able to get away with it.Stealing is criminal, if you engage in it you deserve to pay, just like any other criminal. Games can cost millions to develope, the salaries of the developers and programmers are not cheap. You have abolutely NO right to just help yourself to the fruits of their labor.
This right here is the truth of the matter. Where do you draw the line at? It's okay to steal a few songs off the internet because the record companies make so much money, or it's okay to pirate software and movies because those industries make so much money. Well it's okay for me to steal your wallet because you make more money then me. Oh its okay for me to break into your house and steal all of your belongings because I can't get them from the store myself or I don't feel like paying for them. Or it's okay for me to steal your car because I don't like how Ford makes their cars so I wouldn't pay for one but if I can just take yours then it's okay. As long as I am not supporting the company I don't like.
It is all a bunch of BS excuses. People who pirate software, movies, music, etc are just as bad as any other criminal. I really hope that western governments get stronger on this and really prosecute against people who play on private servers. I actually love seeing the people sued by the RIAA and MPAA and I hope to see criminal charges added as well.
We are talking about theft, plain and simple. People who try to rationalize it are either extremely naive, extremely stupid, or just plain bad people. In the first two cases hopefully some education would fix it. In the last they deserve to be in jail like any other criminal.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
The means and tools are out there for me to continue my enjoyment for the game... But I shouldn't because the software is being stolen to make private servers.
Logically it makes sense yes.
But they wont be able to stop private servers anymore than botting or farming can be stopped.
So Ill continue to have fun and enjoyment out of a game I like to play.
And the next time someone robs your house or steals your car hey, they were just having some fun so they should be able to get away with it.Stealing is criminal, if you engage in it you deserve to pay, just like any other criminal. Games can cost millions to develope, the salaries of the developers and programmers are not cheap. You have abolutely NO right to just help yourself to the fruits of their labor.
And I do agree with you, I understand it. But as long as people are able to exploit they will continue to do so. Its like thinking that placing cameras in a store is going to stop stealing, when in reality, it wont, because there is ways around it. There will always be ways around it.
Its funny I heard the other day on the radio that they are advertising a number to call to turn in people who are actively pirating software and movies, and there is "up to 1 million dollar reward." I thought this is just another outcry to the public saying we have limited to no power to stop it.
There is just no effective way a company can fight this, its too widespread and costs way too much money. Money they are not willing to fork out or even have the budget for.
I dont see an end to piracy in any near future. I hate to endorse it, but its all about "me me me me" to people now adays.
Its a shame this is how it plays out, because I WANT to give ncsoft my money to further develope the games. But I won't because its not enjoyable and not worth my money.
This whole thing is a catch-22
Many ideas, no real solutions.