RvR is not about just sieging, it's a lot more than that. WoW's sieging sounds somewhat entertaining, but it won't come even close to WAR's RvR. RvR is about everyone acting as a team. Everyone working together for one goal: To take over the enemies CC. Everything you do contributes to that end goal is some way. It's more than just sieging, it's about working together as a team.
Yes, and I think that the crowd of "it-looks-just-like-WoW" people do not understand how RvR works.
Mythic's take on PvP (Realm vs. Realm warfare) creates a game that is fundamentally different than the WoW experience.
Dark Age of Camelot was their first foray into Realm vs. Realm warfare and, as such, was a noble effort. It entertained many people, but had some notable flaws in class balance and realm balance, too much crowd control and avatars who died far too easily.
Also, notably, it lacked the "happy ending" payoff that players wanted: capital city siege.
WAR seems to be addressing those issues and wrapping the new package in the lore of Warhammer. And that ain't bad.
20 classes -- 10 per realm (Order/Destruction). You should be able to find something you like.
Two massive capital cities to siege at release -- with four more to come when the development is done.
~~~
I think the idea is not to kill WoW but to offer a "WoW-alternative."
Also, I am pretty sure that the type of players who were attracted to DAoC will be attracted to WAR and overall that will be a good thing.
Have to say that at the moment much of the hyped content of WAR relies on the RvR system. However, if the other content isn't on par with the quality people are accustomed to no amount of RvR glory will amend the situation as AoC has shown. Will be interesting to also see how they have solved the drop in frames per second rate that most games are so concerned with massive PvP scenes: if you put 600 players in the same screen casting spells I could wager that either a) game will be most unplayable for most or b) the effects have to be drasticly reduced in intensity which then again might drive away people who look for eye-candy.
All-in-all, more from the gameplay features has to be released and showed in public and I would atleast as a customer like to see some "actual" footage instead of glorified promo-pictures where, of course, everything looks just about perfect. After all, it is not the perfect scenario players will play this game and even then it has to play smoothly and, most importantly, be fun. Hope but for the best to WAR but would love to get a chance to try the game before giving it a pole position on the grand prix to beat WoW.
Have to say that at the moment much of the hyped content of WAR relies on the RvR system. However, if the other content isn't on par with the quality people are accustomed to no amount of RvR glory will amend the situation as AoC has shown. Will be interesting to also see how they have solved the drop in frames per second rate that most games are so concerned with massive PvP scenes: if you put 600 players in the same screen casting spells I could wager that either a) game will be most unplayable for most or b) the effects have to be drasticly reduced in intensity which then again might drive away people who look for eye-candy. All-in-all, more from the gameplay features has to be released and showed in public and I would atleast as a customer like to see some "actual" footage instead of glorified promo-pictures where, of course, everything looks just about perfect. After all, it is not the perfect scenario players will play this game and even then it has to play smoothly and, most importantly, be fun. Hope but for the best to WAR but would love to get a chance to try the game before giving it a pole position on the grand prix to beat WoW.
One would think people looking for "eye candy" would have a decent system able to run the currenlty available "eye candy". Do people complain they can't play Crysis on a computer built 5 years ago? (I really don't know the answer to this... maybe they do)
A WoW killer would not be very good for us hardcore oldschool mmo types.. any game that manages to surpass wow will be even more of a watered down please-everyone mass market deal, and not a sophisticated alternate reality game..
A WoW killer would not be very good for us hardcore oldschool mmo types.. any game that manages to surpass wow will be even more of a watered down please-everyone mass market deal, and not a sophisticated alternate reality game..
Quite possibly the most accurate and profound statement I've ever read on these forums.
A WoW killer would not be very good for us hardcore oldschool mmo types.. any game that manages to surpass wow will be even more of a watered down please-everyone mass market deal, and not a sophisticated alternate reality game..
Once this game comes out, there will be no reason to be playing WoW for arena/BG's. There is no incentive there, and it's incredibly unrewarding. For PvE/Raiding I can understand, but this game will absorb many many players, including me.
Honestly i'm as excited about war as I am about hello kitty online. Some people here dotn realise that many players are not interested about one more over hyped game. It might be a great game but so far unless you camp the war forums what you've heard abou this game is a lot of wow killer nonsense and that they will be cutting some content. Last time we heard that it was for aoc.
I'm not a no life that sits in front of his computer all day long, I'm an intern that sits in front of his computer all day long.
I play Wow for everything it has, not "just the Bg's". If that's the only draw to WAR in the end, to replace only that part I'll take a lesser PvP combined with everything else WoW has to offer in a heartbeat. They have to have a better total package for me to make a permanent crossover, not just better PvP.
any game that manages to surpass wow will be even more of a watered down please-everyone mass market deal
This is an argument I have never really grasped: How come a game that is entertaining is somehow different in entertainment value for "oldskool players" than it is for "wutlolbbq kids"? I have been playing these silly Internet multiplayer RPGs ever since MUDs and still I fail to see how arduous grinding and mindless ganking is somehow "quality". However, this seems to be just the kind of valorised action that "oldskool" players are looking for. A chance to ruin totally others fun-factor of the game is to me the very anti-thesis of fun and its prevention has nothing to do with watering down the game.
I am not refering to WAR in particular with this but on the mindset that the more unfriendly the game the better. One just has to admit that long gone are the days when games were difficult to the point where they were frustrating. These days they offer various levels of challenge and it is there that WoW excels, like it or not. It just seems to me that e-peen can't grow long enough if also those with less time (skill?) to invest can excel in the game. Sorry for derailing but had to rant a bit.
I play Wow for everything it has, not "just the Bg's". If that's the only draw to WAR in the end, to replace only that part I'll take a lesser PvP combined with everything else WoW has to offer in a heartbeat. They have to have a better total package for me to make a permanent crossover, not just better PvP.
Its a matter of taste. WAR will appeal to mostly the hardcore PvPers and past DAOC players who miss large scale PvP and those they want to progress with both PvE and PvP.
Most of the PvErs and those happy with the BG & arena system as endgame PvP will stay with WoW.
It's good tho, most this makes for a more competitive environment.
Most of the players who started with WoW don't really know how realm objective based large scale MMO PvP feels like so they don't know what they will be missing.
For me, I'm I just wanna RvR all day everyday not just repeat the same instance many many times. : )
Im in beta and to be honest to me the game doesnt seem to be aiming to be the wow killer. Besides.... wow killer. What is this ??
Nothing can kill wow. What game would just take away 8 to 10 million players from wow ? That's simply not ever gonna happen. Wow was timed right thats it.
Warhammer isnt aiming at the wow playerbase i believe. Well in a way they are aiming at those who would love a great pvp system and well if that includes a bunch of wow gamers then so be it.
Im happy warhammer is being the way it is. I want it to be popular but i dont care if itll have 10 million players or a good solid playerbase of a few hundred k for the next comming years. As long as itll have enough players to have some awesome pvp fun because there's no other mmorpg out there that delivers pvp like warhammer does, except daoc ofcourse.
I've never payed much attention to warhammer coz when i heard the inclusion of scenario's, instance pvp, i thought it would just go do what most new mmorpgs do...make it as easy and linear and simplified as possible to attract the newer mmorpg player. Well now i play it since a few days in beta i can say that thank god mythic is sticking to what it does best. Making a great content based RvR game.
Im actually sure many of the newer mmorpg players that started mmorpgs with wow and beyond and who are used to being terribly spoiled, by linear gameplay and fast lvling and having everything layed out for you, will at first not like warhammer at all, simple as that. They might come back later but at first they'll be like behhhh slow lvling, bla bla bla. Warhammer will be to much work for them. That plus itll be behind on a lot of content wow created in the mean time with a shitload of dungeons and grind quests and whatever else they all have. Its hard to catch up on that for any mmorpg. Wow plays like... well like wow and i think its an awesome game also with so much to do in it. Wow's like a virtual kindergarten where you can do just whatever you want and have fun. Thats what wow does best.
Warhammer caters more towards the older mmorpg players who think the newer mmorpgs are just to simplified plus itll cater towards those who love great pvp. Its a good mix of oldfashioned and modern. Warhammer gives Realm Vs Realm and its not even comparable to pvp as most players know it. Realm Vs Realm is on an entirely new lvl of pvp and itll give a feeling of satisfaction most new mmorpg players never even have experienced. A feeling of unity and the experience of what alliances truely are about and a true feeling of WAR ! Thats what daoc was and it seems that thats what warhammer will be about.
But like the above poster said. Many of the people who never experienced RvR and do not know what a feeling of unity and intensity and involvement it can give you ... well they wont know what they are missing if they are not willing to try which is a shame.
Oh and btw i dont know if anyone still remembers but all this talk about great launches of mmorpgs i always see about lotro and the other newer games.
Daoc 6 years ago had an awesome launch with a solid game and a solid content with hardly any bugs. Its beta played great already and was very stable and polished. So far the beta is the same even though there's still things missing they are working on. Though back then the days were different, maybe now for launch at least it will probably expect many more players, since the playerbase is way bigger today, and well we'll see how it goes.
I play Wow for everything it has, not "just the Bg's". If that's the only draw to WAR in the end, to replace only that part I'll take a lesser PvP combined with everything else WoW has to offer in a heartbeat. They have to have a better total package for me to make a permanent crossover, not just better PvP.
Obviously you don't understand what RvR is. There is raiding and outdoor raid bosses in this game, a Tome of Knowledge full of real unlocks, public quests and much more. The thing this game has that is completely superior to any other MMORPG is RvR. The package IS better, if you enjoy PvP. You'll see when it comes out. WoW was made by a company with 0 MMORP experience. WAR is made by a company with 13 years of MMORPG experience and success.
There is absolutely no way that WAR kills WoW, but who would want it to. WoW can keep all of its kids, farmers, AFKers. The whole point to WAR is to want to play and participate in the PvP, which has not been the case for WoW where it really has no fun or meaning to go off and Open World PvP as you do what? get a buff for an hour or 30 minutes?
PvP guilds are ABSOLUTELY pointless in WoW, you get no benefit from them. It is always easy to get in a group and do a BG. It's going to be nice to play something where your pvp efforts and that of others in your guild will help you out in the future.
Finwe on microphones in MMOs: "it'd eliminate l33t speak....But it would bring in ebonics."
Does anyone really believe WoW has 10 million active subscribers? I've always thought they used interesting wording, I think they have 10 million accounts some are active, some are inactive, some are closed. If blizzard had 10 million active accounts all paying for 6 months to get the cheapest rate possible $12/month and they didn't make any other money at all from transfers, other games like starcraft/diablo/etc, the card game etc, they would be pulling in $360 a quarter alone, but it's public record they brought in less than $300 million last quarter and that would have included all the other forms of income I mentioned.
Comments
I have to agree. The E3 video's where not even close to some of the other video's out there.
Hey, Pink Floyd reference. That just made my day.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
Yes, and I think that the crowd of "it-looks-just-like-WoW" people do not understand how RvR works.
Mythic's take on PvP (Realm vs. Realm warfare) creates a game that is fundamentally different than the WoW experience.
Dark Age of Camelot was their first foray into Realm vs. Realm warfare and, as such, was a noble effort. It entertained many people, but had some notable flaws in class balance and realm balance, too much crowd control and avatars who died far too easily.
Also, notably, it lacked the "happy ending" payoff that players wanted: capital city siege.
WAR seems to be addressing those issues and wrapping the new package in the lore of Warhammer. And that ain't bad.
20 classes -- 10 per realm (Order/Destruction). You should be able to find something you like.
Two massive capital cities to siege at release -- with four more to come when the development is done.
~~~
I think the idea is not to kill WoW but to offer a "WoW-alternative."
Also, I am pretty sure that the type of players who were attracted to DAoC will be attracted to WAR and overall that will be a good thing.
~ Ancient Membership ~
WAR a wow killer? no, but I wish it takes the best pvpers and bring them here.WAR is to WoW what a river is to the land...it will erode it slowly
In the land of Predators,the lion does not fear the jackals...
Have to say that at the moment much of the hyped content of WAR relies on the RvR system. However, if the other content isn't on par with the quality people are accustomed to no amount of RvR glory will amend the situation as AoC has shown. Will be interesting to also see how they have solved the drop in frames per second rate that most games are so concerned with massive PvP scenes: if you put 600 players in the same screen casting spells I could wager that either a) game will be most unplayable for most or b) the effects have to be drasticly reduced in intensity which then again might drive away people who look for eye-candy.
All-in-all, more from the gameplay features has to be released and showed in public and I would atleast as a customer like to see some "actual" footage instead of glorified promo-pictures where, of course, everything looks just about perfect. After all, it is not the perfect scenario players will play this game and even then it has to play smoothly and, most importantly, be fun. Hope but for the best to WAR but would love to get a chance to try the game before giving it a pole position on the grand prix to beat WoW.
One would think people looking for "eye candy" would have a decent system able to run the currenlty available "eye candy". Do people complain they can't play Crysis on a computer built 5 years ago? (I really don't know the answer to this... maybe they do)
i just love the crap out of this thread title...sorry to interrupt.
This is as entertaining as the Vanguard/LotR/AOC killing WoW threads.
I just don't uinderstand why everybody seem so fucking concerned and interested about it being a WoW-killer or not.
It doesnt make any sense to me. I mean who cares if it "kills" wow or not.
Personally I dont think any MMO coming out, can take away the 10+ mill. subscribers wow has atm
A WoW killer would not be very good for us hardcore oldschool mmo types.. any game that manages to surpass wow will be even more of a watered down please-everyone mass market deal, and not a sophisticated alternate reality game..
Quite possibly the most accurate and profound statement I've ever read on these forums.
I must agree with this 100%.
Once this game comes out, there will be no reason to be playing WoW for arena/BG's. There is no incentive there, and it's incredibly unrewarding. For PvE/Raiding I can understand, but this game will absorb many many players, including me.
Honestly i'm as excited about war as I am about hello kitty online. Some people here dotn realise that many players are not interested about one more over hyped game. It might be a great game but so far unless you camp the war forums what you've heard abou this game is a lot of wow killer nonsense and that they will be cutting some content. Last time we heard that it was for aoc.
I'm not a no life that sits in front of his computer all day long, I'm an intern that sits in front of his computer all day long.
I play Wow for everything it has, not "just the Bg's". If that's the only draw to WAR in the end, to replace only that part I'll take a lesser PvP combined with everything else WoW has to offer in a heartbeat. They have to have a better total package for me to make a permanent crossover, not just better PvP.
I am not refering to WAR in particular with this but on the mindset that the more unfriendly the game the better. One just has to admit that long gone are the days when games were difficult to the point where they were frustrating. These days they offer various levels of challenge and it is there that WoW excels, like it or not. It just seems to me that e-peen can't grow long enough if also those with less time (skill?) to invest can excel in the game. Sorry for derailing but had to rant a bit.
Its a matter of taste. WAR will appeal to mostly the hardcore PvPers and past DAOC players who miss large scale PvP and those they want to progress with both PvE and PvP.
Most of the PvErs and those happy with the BG & arena system as endgame PvP will stay with WoW.
It's good tho, most this makes for a more competitive environment.
Most of the players who started with WoW don't really know how realm objective based large scale MMO PvP feels like so they don't know what they will be missing.
For me, I'm I just wanna RvR all day everyday not just repeat the same instance many many times. : )
Im in beta and to be honest to me the game doesnt seem to be aiming to be the wow killer. Besides.... wow killer. What is this ??
Nothing can kill wow. What game would just take away 8 to 10 million players from wow ? That's simply not ever gonna happen. Wow was timed right thats it.
Warhammer isnt aiming at the wow playerbase i believe. Well in a way they are aiming at those who would love a great pvp system and well if that includes a bunch of wow gamers then so be it.
Im happy warhammer is being the way it is. I want it to be popular but i dont care if itll have 10 million players or a good solid playerbase of a few hundred k for the next comming years. As long as itll have enough players to have some awesome pvp fun because there's no other mmorpg out there that delivers pvp like warhammer does, except daoc ofcourse.
I've never payed much attention to warhammer coz when i heard the inclusion of scenario's, instance pvp, i thought it would just go do what most new mmorpgs do...make it as easy and linear and simplified as possible to attract the newer mmorpg player. Well now i play it since a few days in beta i can say that thank god mythic is sticking to what it does best. Making a great content based RvR game.
Im actually sure many of the newer mmorpg players that started mmorpgs with wow and beyond and who are used to being terribly spoiled, by linear gameplay and fast lvling and having everything layed out for you, will at first not like warhammer at all, simple as that. They might come back later but at first they'll be like behhhh slow lvling, bla bla bla. Warhammer will be to much work for them. That plus itll be behind on a lot of content wow created in the mean time with a shitload of dungeons and grind quests and whatever else they all have. Its hard to catch up on that for any mmorpg. Wow plays like... well like wow and i think its an awesome game also with so much to do in it. Wow's like a virtual kindergarten where you can do just whatever you want and have fun. Thats what wow does best.
Warhammer caters more towards the older mmorpg players who think the newer mmorpgs are just to simplified plus itll cater towards those who love great pvp. Its a good mix of oldfashioned and modern. Warhammer gives Realm Vs Realm and its not even comparable to pvp as most players know it. Realm Vs Realm is on an entirely new lvl of pvp and itll give a feeling of satisfaction most new mmorpg players never even have experienced. A feeling of unity and the experience of what alliances truely are about and a true feeling of WAR ! Thats what daoc was and it seems that thats what warhammer will be about.
But like the above poster said. Many of the people who never experienced RvR and do not know what a feeling of unity and intensity and involvement it can give you ... well they wont know what they are missing if they are not willing to try which is a shame.
Oh and btw i dont know if anyone still remembers but all this talk about great launches of mmorpgs i always see about lotro and the other newer games.
Daoc 6 years ago had an awesome launch with a solid game and a solid content with hardly any bugs. Its beta played great already and was very stable and polished. So far the beta is the same even though there's still things missing they are working on. Though back then the days were different, maybe now for launch at least it will probably expect many more players, since the playerbase is way bigger today, and well we'll see how it goes.
Obviously you don't understand what RvR is. There is raiding and outdoor raid bosses in this game, a Tome of Knowledge full of real unlocks, public quests and much more. The thing this game has that is completely superior to any other MMORPG is RvR. The package IS better, if you enjoy PvP. You'll see when it comes out. WoW was made by a company with 0 MMORP experience. WAR is made by a company with 13 years of MMORPG experience and success.
Nice title! I just HAD to put on my David Gilmour "Remember that night" DVD
There is absolutely no way that WAR kills WoW, but who would want it to. WoW can keep all of its kids, farmers, AFKers. The whole point to WAR is to want to play and participate in the PvP, which has not been the case for WoW where it really has no fun or meaning to go off and Open World PvP as you do what? get a buff for an hour or 30 minutes?
PvP guilds are ABSOLUTELY pointless in WoW, you get no benefit from them. It is always easy to get in a group and do a BG. It's going to be nice to play something where your pvp efforts and that of others in your guild will help you out in the future.
Finwe on microphones in MMOs: "it'd eliminate l33t speak....But it would bring in ebonics."
O btw this game has a better chance of killing wow: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/334/view/forums/thread/180284/page/1
no rly
I'm not a no life that sits in front of his computer all day long, I'm an intern that sits in front of his computer all day long.
Does anyone really believe WoW has 10 million active subscribers? I've always thought they used interesting wording, I think they have 10 million accounts some are active, some are inactive, some are closed. If blizzard had 10 million active accounts all paying for 6 months to get the cheapest rate possible $12/month and they didn't make any other money at all from transfers, other games like starcraft/diablo/etc, the card game etc, they would be pulling in $360 a quarter alone, but it's public record they brought in less than $300 million last quarter and that would have included all the other forms of income I mentioned.