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What did PotBS do wrong?

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  • Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej


    Stuff by me


    Stuff by oledaddy


     

    You said something about words being twisted around four or five times by the time I stopped reading.  You made a wild statement that I could've taken one of two ways, so I addressed it twice with explanation of the two different ways I was reading what you wrote.  You said I avoided the basic premise that it's possible to enjoy PvP in non-Level 50 ships when I said exactly that in the very next paragraph.  Which you then turned around and acknowledged that, on that point at least, we are in agreement.

    Who's not reading posts and twisting words around, really?  Doesn't matter, to be honest.  Point remains, the choice of players to use big, slow, harder-hitting ships or big, fast mediocre-hitting ships or smaller, faster lighter-hitting ships is not something that "PotBS did wrong," it's player choice.  If you want to be like Jack Simple was and never level beyond level 30 (I think he said somewhere that he stopped at like, level 27 or level 29?) and just hunt merchants and lowbies, you can do so!  If you want to level up to 50 but don't like sailing big, slow tubs you don't have to 'cause like we've both already said, you can still sail the smaller ships.  But once you've made a conscious decision not to play a certain way you forfeit all grounds for complaining when other people do choose to play that way.  That was the point I was making.  Whatever else you said about word twisting... whatever.  :)

    Regarding your next post; That was then.  And at the moment, Antigua, Blackbeard and Roberts are experiencing healthy PvP/RvR with all nations being competitive (except Antigua Brits, they are legion but they're terrible).  Rackham remains ghost-towned and judging by their server forum and some time spent there, Defiant seems to be still ghost-towned but very, very slowly improving as a few good players roll alts there.  Where Defiant will be in six months is hard to say, but if things keep going as they have been it's got a fair chance of coming out of the gutter.

    If you don't like closed-loop society econ, don't participate in it.  Join a society that isn't so anal about it or start your own.  

  • olddaddyolddaddy Member Posts: 3,356
    Originally posted by Havohej

    Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej


    Stuff by me


    Stuff by oledaddy


     

    You said something about words being twisted around four or five times by the time I stopped reading.  You made a wild statement that I could've taken one of two ways, so I addressed it twice with explanation of the two different ways I was reading what you wrote.  You said I avoided the basic premise that it's possible to enjoy PvP in non-Level 50 ships when I said exactly that in the very next paragraph.  Which you then turned around and acknowledged that, on that point at least, we are in agreement.

    You still aren't. I addressed each one of your points, paragraph by paragraph. I addressed you twisting my words implying intentions which I never had in the first paragraph of my reply. No place in my initial post did I use any of those words you attribute to me, nor did I argue what you attribute to me. I re-itterated my arguement, that it is not about the affordability to PvP in under level 50 ships, it is about a certain segment of the population's desire to be able to afford a 1st rate. And FLS has catered since beta, and continues to cater to, that certain segment. That is the mistake of FLS. You make an erroneous point, I make a counterpoint.

    In the next paragraph you go on to discuss under 50 ships in PvP, which I address in my next paragraph. You make a point, I agree with your point. To reitterate, you do not need level 50 ships to enjoy PvP. You do not need LSB insurance. So, why threaten to rage quit? What is their agenda?  

    Two seperate points. Two seperate responses. Really easy. You twisted words to change my intention and distract from the point of my post. then you discussing why I was wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible. A common tactic in arguements, rather than respond to the point discredit the one making the point to distract from the unsavory original point.

    I will re-itterated my position that PvP in under level 50 ships is possible, and fun, and it does not take LSBs with insurance to play the game. My entire post is directed against a segment of the playerbase that controls the societies, controls the game, and has been catered to by FLS since beta.

    You definately got my point, because you are all defensive about the role of the uber leet in the game, as evidenced by your implication against me for using that term. 

    Who's not reading posts and twisting words around, really?  Doesn't matter, to be honest.  Point remains, the choice of players to use big, slow, harder-hitting ships or big, fast mediocre-hitting ships or smaller, faster lighter-hitting ships is not something that "PotBS did wrong," it's player choice.  If you want to be like Jack Simple was and never level beyond level 30 (I think he said somewhere that he stopped at like, level 27 or level 29?) and just hunt merchants and lowbies, you can do so!  If you want to level up to 50 but don't like sailing big, slow tubs you don't have to 'cause like we've both already said, you can still sail the smaller ships.  But once you've made a conscious decision not to play a certain way you forfeit all grounds for complaining when other people do choose to play that way.  That was the point I was making.  Whatever else you said about word twisting... whatever.  :)

    Once again, you misrepresent my post as being the ships are something FLS did wrong, and refuse to acknowledge or address the point that FLS catered to the hardcore 16hr/day uber leet fanboi, rather than take into consideration what the casual gamer wanted. I included several examples of this, ones that Vetarnias picked up on, but that you gloss over because they are not what you want to hear, or discuss.

    Now, in your race to continue to obscure that facts, you decide to paint me as "Jack Simple". Way to go, you really can't be unbiased in your discussion of the direction FLS took the game, and why they went down to one viable server, can you?

    Regarding your next post; That was then.  And at the moment, Antigua, Blackbeard and Roberts are experiencing healthy PvP/RvR with all nations being competitive (except Antigua Brits, they are legion but they're terrible).  Rackham remains ghost-towned and judging by their server forum and some time spent there, Defiant seems to be still ghost-towned but very, very slowly improving as a few good players roll alts there.  Where Defiant will be in six months is hard to say, but if things keep going as they have been it's got a fair chance of coming out of the gutter.

    Oh, I don't know about healthy. How many of a few good players are rolling alts where? How many multiple accounts? How many brand spanking new players? Can you post those specific numbers for us? Just want to see your source about new players. Please provide the numbers from FLS of exactly how many new players have signed up and stayed (past the two week trial) in the last 30 days? The last 60 days? The last 90 days?

    The same problems exist today as what existed then, the direction FLS took the game in was away from the casual player and catered to the 16hr/day player crowd. That direction is still there, now mitigated by not insuring LSBs, and the forums full of threats to rage quite with all their accounts if FLS doesn't insure LSBs. The mentality hasn't changed. As we both discussed, and agreed, you don't need LSBs to PvP. So why the threat to rage quit by the multiple account 16hr/day playerbase? Is it about PvP, or is it about being uber leet and having a 1st rate?

    If you don't like closed-loop society econ, don't participate in it.  Join a society that isn't so anal about it or start your own.  

    I don't participate in it, and my prior post above says why. I do not pay $15/month to play a game so that I can run around at the beck and call of some dim witted insecure asshole that thinks he is a game god because he can control my supply of ships and outfittings. Closed market model.

    Second, like Veternius states, a casual society has no chance of being competitive with the 16hr/day multiple account boys, because the game is skewed against them. I cannot participate in PBs like would would want to because individually, or in conjuction with a casual society, I am unable to field a rated ship. Survival time for showing up to a PB in a Mediator would be laughable at best. When was the last time two national councils ever agreed that a port battle would be for smaller ships? Never? Is PvP by agreement in a port battle in smaller ships prohibited under the game rules? Should new players be told to refuse PBs until they grow up? Then be told to refuse PBs because they have no experience? Then be told "maybe one day, just be a good kid and bring me 2000 sailcloth"?

    You expect them to pay $15/moth to do that?

    I can see where you stand in the game quite clearly, really. You like the closed market societies, you like the control over the game that these societies have. You like the direction the game took, favoring the 16hr/day uber leeet over the casual player. It really is your game, isn't it? Not just a game for everbody to enjoy, but your game to control. To control the players by controlling the society, to control FLS by controlling multiple accounts and stating you speak for that society.

    Go ahead and continue to twist my words, call me Jack Simple, talk about the ships, not the players, and continue to ignore FLS steps adverse to the casual player. Steps like removing penants for free Mediator cutters, so all, but especially low level players could get a free ship, or a cheap upgrade. It's much better to tell them they have to join a society, grind sail cloth, and get a Mediator in exchange. That's the move FLS made to benefit the casual player. That's what it's all about, putting new players on the treadmill, and keeping them running for the uber leets benefit.

    Next, society auction houses, so nothing will ever hit the market again unless the society approves it.

    Wonderful game you have there. Mind if I warn others about your little treadmill?

     

     



     

  • LinnaLinna Member Posts: 387
    Originally posted by DJXeon

    Originally posted by Linna


     
    These are players who WANT to love the game, but find they cannot. Who come back to try these vaunted changes, and are very disappointed. You can dismiss this, or you can accept it as a sign all is still far from well. I've always said people need to make up their own minds on this.
    I WOULD like to point out that software developers usually have separate teams on different types of changes. If all their resources are tied up on just the avcom, that in itself is not a great sign.
    As to my missing out: banned, remember. Missing out kinda implies you have the option to try and see how wonderful it all is. Yes, the affair surrounding that whole story upsets me, but the game itself frankly leaves me cold at this point. You and Havohej overestimate my emotional involvement with this by a fairly wide margin (hell, I was never one of those threatening to firebomb Smedley either, and that fiasco was way worse). But by all means keep drawing attention to it, makes people curious to see what the whole deal is about. Always good to educate people about the less savory side of businesses.
    Linna



     

    Well i can only assume that because you keep posting in "what went wrong " that you wish to empathize your points. Presumably you thought Potbs was reasonable up to the time you got banned otherwise why were you subscribing  to it.

    Sure mistakes have been made which even FLS has admitted to & more content is needed but that is the case with many mmos. If wooden ship combat is your thing there is no competition.

    Saying you cant play because you are banned, what is to stop another member of your family from making an account?

     



     

    The fact that I enter this discussion, and think I can contribute to it, does not mean I'm running wild and daily fill the forums with posts hammering my points. If anything, I rarely initiate, I usually just react. Everyone who checks my posting history (Linna on MMORPG and Broom on the POTBS forums) can see that.

    You really need to look up the word 'banned' in the context of modern computer applications. They have our IP. They know our Sony account names. They have our credit card numbers and address. Even if I were still interested in playing (and I am not), what makes you think any new account wouldn't be banned within days? The only way to play would be by committing identity fraud, and frankly, I think it would be incredibly stupid to commit a crime just to be able to play a game.

    And yes, every MMO makes mistakes. And therefore every MMO that I am involved with, will see me posting about whatever flaws it has. Because if no one speaks, nothing ever changes. I personally still believe the mistakes POTBS made are irredeemable, and that the recent patches are mostly window dressing without substance. Whether you want to believe it or not, the people I know who have tried the recent changes all make comments like 'they managed to ruin it even further'. Many of those had an involvement with the game since beta, and were amongst its most ardent fans.

    No, POTBS was not reasonable till the point I unsubscribed/was banned. It had become nearly intolerable to play Spanish months before, and every patch brought changes that made it less fun to play. The two things that held me there were my friends (in three nations) and my guild. I had the choice to abandon the remaining Spanish and the handful of new Fated members, who had just picked up the game and were still eager to explore it, or to stick it out and hope and fight for improvement. I was unable to do the first, so it had to be the latter.

    Linna

  • Originally posted by olddaddy

    You still aren't. I addressed each one of your points, paragraph by paragraph. I addressed you twisting my words implying intentions which I never had in the first paragraph of my reply. No place in my initial post did I use any of those words you attribute to me, nor did I argue what you attribute to me. I re-itterated my arguement, that it is not about the affordability to PvP in under level 50 ships, it is about a certain segment of the population's desire to be able to afford a 1st rate. And FLS has catered since beta, and continues to cater to, that certain segment. That is the mistake of FLS. You make an erroneous point, I make a counterpoint.


     

     

    Ugh.  I still aren't what?  What are you even talking about?  Seriously, it's like you're on rage against the machine mode and I don't even know what the machine is.  Have fun with that.

     

    EDIT: You know what, I decided to re-read that meandering post a third time and managed to lock onto this:

    "You twisted words to change my intention and distract from the point of my post. then you discussing why I was wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible. A common tactic in arguements, rather than respond to the point discredit the one making the point to distract from the unsavory original point."

    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible.

     

  • olddaddyolddaddy Member Posts: 3,356
    Originally posted by Havohej  
    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible. 



     

    Not a problem. As "Pirates of the Burning Sea Correspondant" you never replied to the original point in my posts anyway. You went into defensive mod over the game. You are not truly independant of your topic.

    You insistent on twisting my words to impose your own interpretation, attacking me as a poster by insuating my "Jack Simple" gameplay sytle, then playing the said/she said game. But you never discussed the issue. All you did was twist the issue to discuss only that which you felt defensible.

    Not once did you address the underlying problem that the FLS developement team catered to the 16hr/day uber leets by changing game mechanics at the expense of the casual players. Nor did you discuss the motivations of the 16hr/day uber leets.

    Good day to you Sir, discussion closed.  

  • LinnaLinna Member Posts: 387
    Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej  
    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible. 



     

    Not a problem. As "Pirates of the Burning Sea Correspondant" you never replied to the original point in my posts anyway. You went into defensive mod over the game. You are not truly independant of your topic.

    You insistent on twisting my words to impose your own interpretation, attacking me as a poster by insuating my "Jack Simple" gameplay sytle, then playing the said/she said game. But you never discussed the issue. All you did was twist the issue to discuss only that which you felt defensible.

    Not once did you address the underlying problem that the FLS developement team catered to the 16hr/day uber leets by changing game mechanics at the expense of the casual players. 

     



     

    As a hardcore PVPer, I can assure you most of us NEVER asked for the stuff FLS decided to implement. Worse even: a lot of us who actually owned and sailed rated ships BEFORE insurance (second rate in my case), told them to please just delete the damn things from the game entirely, as it was turning into a gear/grind game in stead of the skill based game we wanted to play.

    Linna

  • olddaddyolddaddy Member Posts: 3,356
    Originally posted by Linna  
    As a hardcore PVPer, I can assure you most of us NEVER asked for the stuff FLS decided to implement. Worse even: a lot of us who actually owned and sailed rated ships BEFORE insurance (second rate in my case), told them to please just delete the damn things from the game entirely, as it was turning into a gear/grind game in stead of the skill based game we wanted to play.
    Linna



     

    It's funny about that, I'm not really sure who was the motivation to change the direction of the game away from casual, and move to more hardcore. I can't believe FLS thought that one up all by themselves. There are far more gamers that have a job, a wife, and kids that can only grab a few hours a night/day of gaming then there are 16hr/day uber leets.

    After France imploded on Rackham the free market dried up and I had to join a society. I actually was told that they didn't give a fuck that I produced small and medium ships, I was to change my production to sail cloth. Prior to that I was independant, having fun, and immune to the French national politics.

    I was told to go out and sit in the Gulf of Mexico by New Orleans in case Spain tried to PvP our newbs as they tried to run missions. It was a waste of time for several reasons. That, and I was never allowed, no matter how many times I asked, to go out to the Antilles and help grind a port out there so I could participate in a port battle. Matter of fact, I was distinctly told that if I as ever invited to a port battle I was to decline.

    1. Spain wasn't the problem. Spain controlled New Orleans ever since the first or second port battle there. The problem was some French society kept insisting on going back to New Orleans, putting into contention, and then getting their butts kicked in the ensuing port battle. It was a matter of "place your keyboards on the floor and step away from the computer dumbasses". I sat out there many nights, and only once saw a few Spanish show up to grind PB contention points. I have no idea when your side got their points for PBs.

    2. Spain was out in the Antilles PvP action, when they could. They had imploded just before France. The only ones that seemed to ever drift down to New Orleans once in a while was the pirates, and they only stayed a few minutes then got bored and left. Usually they headed out to the Antilles too.

    3. France had very few newbs left to run missions. They had gotten digusted with France constantly putting New Orleans back into the red circle, and dropped by then.

    Anyway, I could read a book, go afk on my computer, log out, sleep, or do just about anything except be seen by my society in the Antilles. I could craft anything as long as it was sail cloth. I could play my little heart away, as long as I did what the society leadership told me to do. But I couldn't build durability for my frigate if I lost it without my society leadership's approval.

    So I took my money, and went to Havana, and bought my frigate endurance off Spain (maybe Garbad?). I produced enough sail cloth not to get thrown out of my society, bought refined sugar and meat in Havana, and sold ships provisions in Havana. I bought a Santiago Galleon for my freetrader in Havana. It got so it was easier and more fun to play the game with Spain then France, if that makes any sense.

    Spain seemed more open market, less control freaks.

    Anyway, I grew sick and tired of the bullshit, and just did what the rest of the French had done, and voted with my feet.

     

  • Wow... you do realize that EVERY society isn't like that?  I wouldn't be in a society like that for longer than 10 minutes (about as long as it took for them to explain their "rules" to me and for me to click Leave Society in the Social window).  I don't know why you did.

    (Yeah, so I lied about not reading anything you post after your irrational tirades before... you know, the fit you threw when I was AGREEING with you?  At least now I think I understand a little better why you were so angry about "uber leet" players as it sounds like that's what your society fancied themselves.)

  • olddaddyolddaddy Member Posts: 3,356
    Originally posted by Havohej


    Wow... you do realize that EVERY society isn't like that?  I wouldn't be in a society like that for longer than 10 minutes (about as long as it took for them to explain their "rules" to me and for me to click Leave Society in the Social window).  I don't know why you did.


    (Yeah, so I lied about not reading anything you post after your irrational tirades before... you know, the fit you threw when I was AGREEING with you?  At least now I think I understand a little better why you were so angry about "uber leet" players as it sounds like that's what your society fancied themselves.)



     

    France had imploded. I couldn't stay independant and sell on the market, there was no market. I couldn't buy a friggin Defiant, just a Defiant even, to PvP in. If I needed a Defiant  I had to get it through the closed society economic model, ask politely, and wait until they decided I was to get a Defiant. bend down, place nose between buttchecks, and kiss their asses.

    At least til I discovered Spain was still an reasonably open market, and it may have been Garbad selling them to me. From what I understand Garbad did buy "internally" too, but he allowed some profit. I may have been selling to Garbad too for all I know. But I was at least deciding what I wanted to make, buying and making raw materials, putting them together, and selling on a market.

    I could at least pay my $15/month and play the way I wanted to play, not play the way someone else told me to play.

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Linna

    Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej  
    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible. 



     

    Not a problem. As "Pirates of the Burning Sea Correspondant" you never replied to the original point in my posts anyway. You went into defensive mod over the game. You are not truly independant of your topic.

    You insistent on twisting my words to impose your own interpretation, attacking me as a poster by insuating my "Jack Simple" gameplay sytle, then playing the said/she said game. But you never discussed the issue. All you did was twist the issue to discuss only that which you felt defensible.

    Not once did you address the underlying problem that the FLS developement team catered to the 16hr/day uber leets by changing game mechanics at the expense of the casual players. 

     



     

    As a hardcore PVPer, I can assure you most of us NEVER asked for the stuff FLS decided to implement. Worse even: a lot of us who actually owned and sailed rated ships BEFORE insurance (second rate in my case), told them to please just delete the damn things from the game entirely, as it was turning into a gear/grind game in stead of the skill based game we wanted to play.

    Linna



     

    Can i join your fan club Linna?

    I have been banned from the FLS forum for posting the truth.

    He calls players jerks on the official forums & they get infractions for answering back lol

    Havohej is about as correspondent as a dead man's slipper & pretends to know all about Potbs when he rarely participates in RvR.

    mmorpg.com members are a wise bunch of gamers & we don't need his sort here.

     

     

     

  • lol If you didn't want to be banned from the PotBS forums, you shouldn't have been trolling and starting flamewars.  :)

    Also:

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2566

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2615

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2657

    Further, you don't have to be in every port battle on your server(s) to know now to make the simple mistakes made by one faction in this port battle: http://www.burningsea.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50224

    Just sayin', mate.  Just sayin'.

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Havohej


    lol If you didn't want to be banned from the PotBS forums, you shouldn't have been trolling and starting flamewars.  :)
    Also:


    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2566


    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2615


    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/68/feature/2657



     

    It didn't happen like that & if you were truthful you would admitt to it.

    I'm not even going to waste my time looking at your links because there are no tricks you can teach an old beta player like me.

  • So you didn't instigate flamewars vs. VDD Spanish players on the Defiant sub-forum for three days running?

    Anyway, all this is off-topic from this thread (which has run its course anyway imo, all of the things PotBS did wrong have been pretty well covered by now, 20 pages' worth of the same things being repeated for months now).  If you want to make a thread all about your forum ban (which is probably temporary anyway, right?) and stuff like civilian ships of the line, feel free :D

  • dhayes68dhayes68 Member UncommonPosts: 1,388

    I'll tell ya what they did wrong: They got published by SoE. When I heard about this game I went to the website, to check it out, saw that SoE logo and walked away.

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Havohej


    So you didn't instigate flamewars vs. VDD Spanish players on the Defiant sub-forum for three days running?




     

    Actually I was quite enjoying them until Danicia started cutting posts & deleting threads.

    She is clearly anti-brit as she plays that server as another nation, she dishes out forum infractions like they are going out of fashion.

    Go look and see how many brits are posting in the recent Turtle Bay port battle thread that they won btw.

     

     

  • YOU may have been enjoying those threads, GB.  I was, too, tbh - they were funny.  But as I only play on Defiant part-time (betcha didn't know that, or what nation I've been playing either :p) I didn't wanna bother getting into it - with the exception of that one post I made because I felt left out of the trolling/flaming.

    Be honest mate, all trolling aside, you were definitely stirring the pot.  imo, not very helpful in the sense of trying to promote a fun, inviting server but from what I've seen in the last few weeks and what I gather from conversations with more "permanent" Defiant players it's slowly, veryveryvery slowly improving...  dunno if the population incentives are too little too late, though.  At least the folks who decided to stick it out are actively PvPing and keeping themselves entertained!  We'll see how Defiant's doing in three months; if it can get to the point where Roberts is by then, it may have a chance.  Especially if some of the folks breaking away from Antigua choose to roll there.

    (This post was sort-of on topic again.)

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Havohej


    Be honest mate, all trolling aside, you were definitely stirring the pot. 



     

    I don't deny it but no where as much as some VDD society members were, funny i got banned & they still post with nearly the whole Brit nation on Defiant ignoring them isn't it?

    Forums need a bita spice otherwise they get boring & moderators are supposed to be impartial.

    That said I don't believe in flaming or trolling others - I was probably the most trolled player on FLS forums so they decided it was better to ban me lol.

    They got it wrong again as usual, enjoy your forums without me.

  • VetarniasVetarnias Member UncommonPosts: 630
    Originally posted by DJXeon

    Originally posted by Linna

    Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej  
    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible. 



     

    Not a problem. As "Pirates of the Burning Sea Correspondant" you never replied to the original point in my posts anyway. You went into defensive mod over the game. You are not truly independant of your topic.

    You insistent on twisting my words to impose your own interpretation, attacking me as a poster by insuating my "Jack Simple" gameplay sytle, then playing the said/she said game. But you never discussed the issue. All you did was twist the issue to discuss only that which you felt defensible.

    Not once did you address the underlying problem that the FLS developement team catered to the 16hr/day uber leets by changing game mechanics at the expense of the casual players. 

     



     

    As a hardcore PVPer, I can assure you most of us NEVER asked for the stuff FLS decided to implement. Worse even: a lot of us who actually owned and sailed rated ships BEFORE insurance (second rate in my case), told them to please just delete the damn things from the game entirely, as it was turning into a gear/grind game in stead of the skill based game we wanted to play.

    Linna



     

    Can i join your fan club Linna?

    I have been banned from the FLS forum for posting the truth.

    He calls players jerks on the official forums & they get infractions for answering back lol

    Havohej is about as correspondent as a dead man's slipper & pretends to know all about Potbs when he rarely participates in RvR.

    mmorpg.com members are a wise bunch of gamers & we don't need his sort here.

    I have no idea how you ended up being banned over there.  I didn't necessarily agree with your views, but you rarely went overboard -- unless they implemented a zero-tolerance approach to ampersands.

    However, I think Danicia couldn't care less that you play British or any other faction; as long as you pay your $15, you're part of the FLS Appreciation Club.

    About Havohej being correspondent, well, he has a definite advantage over most of the posters here in that he still plays the game, you being perhaps the only other person to qualify.  However, I too would like to know exactly what being a "correspondent" entails.  If it's just about writing puff pieces (see that 2008 recap) or reprinting the developers' every word, it really doesn't matter to whom you give the title, since the purpose is to maintain access to the devs, and you can't do that for long if you're critical, even slightly.  Can you imagine "You Banned Me" Linna, "We Told You So" Gyrus, or "Next Big Failure" Vetarnias sitting (metaphorically speaking) in front of Isildur or Rusty  with a list of questions that would address real concerns?

    If supporting the game comes with the territory, just as well that the correspondent should be someone who seems to genuinely enjoy it, like Havohej.  At least we're spared the whiffs of hypocrisy -- as long as you specifically tell us that it is the purpose of the job.

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Vetarnias

    Originally posted by DJXeon

    Originally posted by Linna

    Originally posted by olddaddy

    Originally posted by Havohej  
    Now I know you're just raging for the sake of raging.  I didn't "discuss why you were wrong and PvP in under 50 ships was possible."  I AGREED WITH YOU that PvP in under 50 ships was possible, going even further and saying that I do it myself, frequently.  So what in the hell are you talking about with this "common tactic" crap about distractions and "unsavory original points"?  I'm neither reading nor replying to anymore of your posts in this thread, oledaddy... incredible. 



     

    Not a problem. As "Pirates of the Burning Sea Correspondant" you never replied to the original point in my posts anyway. You went into defensive mod over the game. You are not truly independant of your topic.

    You insistent on twisting my words to impose your own interpretation, attacking me as a poster by insuating my "Jack Simple" gameplay sytle, then playing the said/she said game. But you never discussed the issue. All you did was twist the issue to discuss only that which you felt defensible.

    Not once did you address the underlying problem that the FLS developement team catered to the 16hr/day uber leets by changing game mechanics at the expense of the casual players. 

     



     

    As a hardcore PVPer, I can assure you most of us NEVER asked for the stuff FLS decided to implement. Worse even: a lot of us who actually owned and sailed rated ships BEFORE insurance (second rate in my case), told them to please just delete the damn things from the game entirely, as it was turning into a gear/grind game in stead of the skill based game we wanted to play.

    Linna



     

    Can i join your fan club Linna?

    I have been banned from the FLS forum for posting the truth.

    He calls players jerks on the official forums & they get infractions for answering back lol

    Havohej is about as correspondent as a dead man's slipper & pretends to know all about Potbs when he rarely participates in RvR.

    mmorpg.com members are a wise bunch of gamers & we don't need his sort here.

     

    However, I think Danicia couldn't care less that you play British or any other faction; as long as you pay your $15, you're part of the FLS Appreciation Club.

    About Havohej being correspondent, well, he has a definite advantage over most of the posters here in that he still plays the game, you being perhaps the only other person to qualify.  However, I too would like to know exactly what being a "correspondent" entails.  If it's just about writing puff pieces (see that 2008 recap) or reprinting the developers' every word, it really doesn't matter to whom you give the title, since the purpose is to maintain access to the devs, and you can't do that for long if you're critical, even slightly.  Can you imagine "You Banned Me" Linna, "We Told You So" Gyrus, or "Next Big Failure" Vetarnias sitting (metaphorically speaking) in front of Isildur or Rusty  with a list of questions that would address real concerns?

    If supporting the game comes with the territory, just as well that the correspondent should be someone who seems to genuinely enjoy it, like Havohej.  At least we're spared the whiffs of hypocrisy -- as long as you specifically tell us that it is the purpose of the job.



     

    About  Danicia couldn't care less just about sums it up, it probably never occurred to her that someone like myself that despite not being afraid to criticize FLS where its due has overall been one of their biggest fans.

    Populations have almost doubled on Defiant during the last 6 weeks since I've been there, players no longer see it as an inevitable failure, so i see my contribution as being useful to FLS that did not deserve a forum ban.

    Even members of defiants Spanish VDD society that left to play on Antigua because of lack of PvP came back to challenge the British after our several confrontations on Defiant's forums that drove Danicia nuts & landed up in my Ban.

    Here is an extract from recent a classic post of Randomplayer describing the Turtle Bay port battle with VDD on the FLS forum:

    *But mostly I thank you for the 5 minutes or so there of GB's plaintive cries for help on Vent as he was left hung out to dry in utter silence after the month long forum drama which ended in him getting himself banned and britain into the battle in question.

    Pure online gaming platinum set, diamond studded, gold *

     

    All she worries about apart from bacon recipees is chopping & deleting threads & issuing infraction penalties to the point of adding a lot of tension to the community; getting rid of the "bad stuff" as she once described it.

    It would be far better if she would let some threads run their course so that players can gain mutual respect thou its understood that moderation is sometimes needed; cutting & deleting threads often adds fuel to the fire for the next forum encounter.

    In all truth Havohej has also done a lot of good work for FLS but he often failed to know the difference between constructive criticism & detrimental posts so he goes on the offensive unduly at times; i like to think that i tell things for what they are good or bad in the hope that FLS will notice & make adjustments.

    Given more time I'm sure we could have worked together but FLS banned me losing potentially one of their biggest fans as i cancelled my sub today.

    While I'm here this is my tribute to my character GB Nelson a Lvl50 Defiant Brit:

    GB is no more :(

    He put up some good fights defending his beliefs for the good of his nation & FLS.

    GB shall be remembered for his bravery & honesty in the face of stiff opposition.

    Never one to give up, defender of the good, he fought till the end...

    Nothing could defeat him!

    Ironically it was only FLS themselves that could deal the final death blow.

    I believe he was still smiling when he died as he lived his life to the full his way.

    RIP GB.

    He will be remembered & sadly missed. :(

  • @Vetarnias:  You ain't seen nothin' yet.  Next one's about Defiant.

    And the stuff GB did that got him banned has all been "cleaned" from the forums by various mods (including Danicia, Traebien and Rhaegar each of whom I saw in the "Who's online" list at different times when the GB vs. Van Diemen's Demise society threads magically disappeared).  To be fair, if they gave GB forum MoVs, they should've given them to a couple of VDD guys too for responding to his trolling/flaming in kind, but meh.

    EDIT:  Also, I don't cover devlogs and official announcements, MMORPG.com has someone else entirely for that.  As a GC, I give first-hand player accounts of situations relevant to the gaming community at large; people who are or may become interested in the game itself.  I've blasted the game about things on my personal blog (click the signature image) and on their forums.  So far, I haven't written about anything I disagreed with or personally didn't like, but it's only been three articles.  And these articles ain't paid for by Flying Lab Software, they're paid for by MMORPG.com.

  • Originally posted by DJXeon



    Given more time I'm sure we could have worked together but FLS banned me losing potentially one of their biggest fans as i cancelled my sub today.
    While I'm here this is my tribute to my character GB Nelson a Lvl50 Defiant Brit:
    GB is no more :(

    He put up some good fights defending his beliefs for the good of his nation & FLS.
    GB shall be remembered for his bravery & honesty in the face of stiff opposition.

    Never one to give up, defender of the good, he fought till the end...
    Nothing could defeat him!
    Ironically it was only FLS themselves that could deal the final death blow.
    I believe he was still smiling when he died as he lived his life to the full his way.
    RIP GB.

    He will be remembered & sadly missed. :(

     

    GB... TWICE I offered you a forum truce over there.  And TWICE you responded frankly childishly.  Given more time...?  Heh.

    And what's this about "Alas, poor Yurick, I knew GB Nelson well"?  You just got a forum ban, amirite?  So you're still gonna be filling Area chat with "GB Nelson says something in English" aren't you?

    EDIT:  Doh!  Missed the part about you cancelling your sub.  

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Havohej


    @Vetarnias:  You ain't seen nothin' yet.  Next one's about Defiant.
    And the stuff GB did that got him banned has all been "cleaned" from the forums by various mods (including Danicia, Traebien and Rhaegar each of whom I saw in the "Who's online" list at different times when the GB vs. Van Diemen's Demise society threads magically disappeared).  To be fair, if they gave GB forum MoVs, they should've given them to a couple of VDD guys too for responding to his trolling/flaming in kind, but meh.



     

    meh to you maybe but another lost paying customer & fan to FLS.

    Whenever will they learn?

     

    tbh i think FLS have had it in for me as i resigned my group captain position from the boarding party committee since i got a PM from deake out of the blue accusing me of getting all my info from them.

  • GyrusGyrus Member UncommonPosts: 2,413

    Oh Good God...

    I have been away for a little while and I come back to this

    They banned you (too) GB?

    *shakes head* Not a lot to say really, is there?

     

    Hmmm... where to next for you?

    Edit: Danicia hasn't changed then. 

    Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.

  • DJXeonDJXeon Member UncommonPosts: 553

     

    edit :double post

  • RekitRekit Member Posts: 53
    Originally posted by Taljinn


     They didn't listen to there beta testers! 



     

    correct!

    image
    Eve Trial <- Try 14 days of Eve for FREE
    Im against SOE

This discussion has been closed.