Limited freedom in Ryzom

Kaiserjager

First I apologize for repeating lines I posted elswhere.

I am one of those that tried Ryzom when it became avilable again after following the game forums for some time.

Ryzom was and is promoted as a sandbox game with supposed freedom of action. The underlying assumption is that Ryzom offers more then stadard quest/level oriented "linear" MMO.

To be honest I fail to see where is freedom in Ryzom. My experience runned something along the following lines and I happen to know few people who had similar issues.

After logging in and familiarizing myself with the game I wanted to try a caster. I intended to avoid the other three branches (combat, harvesting, crafting) until I get more familiar with the game, I didn't get far before I was pointed out that I should level melee fighting first because it was the easiest way to garner hit points.

Very well, I thought that I could form some sort of a hybrid fgihter/magic user. That was the second wall because to be effective in combat you need heavy armour that severly impares use of magic. If you stick with ligh armour you remain very squishy. Basically multiple classes are impossible, at any given time you can be a fighter or a magic user but not both.

That brought me to third step, I needed combat branch and ranged combat became available (skill branches inside of the category every so often). Now, since my magic user and hybrid ideas couldn't really work I went for ranged combat. I also didn't went far becaue to be proficinet in ranged combat you need to train harvesting materials. On top of that ranged weapons are bugged, underpowered compared with other weapons of the same level and use huge amounts of ammunition that is expensive. If you decide to torture yourself with ranged combat you should be ready to harvest and craft your own ammunition.

In short (copy/pasted from another thread):

"For character to be effective a player is pressured by game mechanics to pursue all four categories (combat, magic, harvest, crafting) to some extent. It creates a world filled with characters who happen to be jack of all trades. You want to focus on magic? Well too bad, but best way to build hit points is by melee combat. You want to purusue ranged combat? Great but for that you need focus and that is increased fastest with harvesting. And so on and so forth.

Ryzom gives freedom to grind component A, B, C & D in any order one likes but it does not offer the real freedom just to focus on components, say A and B. Of course, nobody forces you to do all four categories but freedom not to do that is equal to the freedom of WoW player not to grind for gear. In short it is there but it is not practical.

The game also has issues, ranged combat is bugged and ranged weapons (save launchers) do insignificant damage and eat up huge amounts of amunition. Ammunition you are best of by crafting it yourself due to high cost of projectiles. Again, and so on and so forth.

The smug attitude of veterans also does not help. I witnessed more then once that any and all critical comments are dimissed, usually by pointing out how superior Ryzom player is to everyone else. Naturally everyone else is a sheep and fit only to play asian grinders or liner games like WoW. This hardly helps the game starved for new players.

In short Ryzom shows its age (2004 release if I am not mistaken) and its sandbox freedom is very limited.

My observation is that the game will not get far above and beyond Ryzom vets, not because people are averse to sandbox but because Ryzom's concept has shortcommings."

 

To conclude on a more positive note I would like to say that background story, races and graphics are really well done and defnitelly refreshing. Crafting is very well done and quite deep although harvesting that is closely attached to it might not be fun, depending on personal taste. Combat and magic suffer from a number of bugs but otherwise serve their pourpose.

Thoughts? Opinions? Comments?

gatheris

from what i read it does not seem you have left noob island (silan)

and you are uhm - complaining - that the noob island part of the game is trying to force you to experience several aspects of the game - seems like it is doing its job very well - if you want to specialize do it after the island

though i haven't left myself from what i understand it is a completely different game but since i'm having such a great time - playing three characters right now for various reasons - none of which has anything to do with specializing as you can be whatever you want to be

i have not witnessed either melee combat or magic combat bugs that you mention - what are they?

nor have i seen or read in chat this smug attitude from vets you write of - probably a case of interpretation from chat - maybe a bit clichish as it does seem sometimes that the vets all know each other and us noobs might feel a bit left out

ranged weapons are most likely as you say as i haven't done them

on top of that it is a beautiful game with settings on high (spring is here and it is VERY nice) - crafting and digging is very well done and very deep(heheh) - spell effects are top notch - lots of variation in the look of the various armors (though more limited on the island of course) - it has been interesting to watch older videos of the game and see the variety of looks that are available in the game - hardly any two characters look alike

i hope you give it another chance by moving to the mainland and giving it a go and tell us what you find - i'll get there eventually myself but until then.............

 

 

Souvec

Well, all I can say really is no.

If you want to continue a self-sufficient life in Ryzom then yes.... your freedom may be somewhat limited in the way you've expressed it.  Ultimately though, thats the joy of having a supportive and active community that is quite diverse in the various skill branches you spoke of.  Also this is the purpose of playing a MMORPG, to become part of and build the community around you.

What I can say is that I have never personally crafted my own equipment, from armor to weaponry.  Granted I have dabbled a bit here and there, but everything I use currently as been provided by others or paid for personally.  Also.... there are vendors that offer up stock/basic equipment in which you can purchase also allowing once again a means for you to bypass those skill branches.

While initially the skill system and game itself may appear to be a revolving cycle, there are alternate paths that you can take.  Not every path is as rewarding as the other, but if you truly want freedom from all things including the community.... it is and can be attainable.

On the topic of bugs, yes there are bugs but overall the core concepts are in place and have been functional for quite some time.  Range Weaponry does need an overhaul and it was planned before Ryzom fell into receivership.  But even for its age, Ryzom truly has a unique beauty which I still prefer over most.  Its a dynamic world with unique races and lore.  It goes beyond the traditional linear ride, and allows you to make your own path.  

Overall, I think you need to look a little deeper into Ryzom as you may have missed a few things along the way.

Kaiserjager

I left Silan, ranged weapons are not avilable in the starting zone.

I also got all four categories to at least skill level 50 and I was informed that interdependence only gets worse as one makes level progress.

The experience with vets in universal chat is not something I can claim as a constant occurance, the attitude however can be seen on these forums also.

The bugs I mentioned are, for example, ranged combat always reverting to auto attack after special attack. That auto attack cannot be stopped unless the desired special attack is double clicked after which it repeats itself. The ammo loss is enormous and damage is insignificant.

I think that if I feel like it, I should be able to completely ignore one to three categories without my character suffering for it. As the things stand now that is impossible in Ryzom, quite simply you cannot be whatever you want to be - instead you have to be everything or your character will simply not be competitive.

Therefore I am under the impression that its freedom is limited, maybe limited in a different way then say LOTRO but at the same order of magnitude.

metalhead980

Guys disregard this post I actually talked to this person in game and she/he said the same thing about ryzom then, Lack of freedom due to mob difficulty and lack of freedom due to needing to spec into all four trees to be effective.

This person created another account and has already posted "ryzoms lack of freedom" three times.

Here is her/his original post that i responded to basically showing everyone that she didn't know one god damn thing about ryzom.

Her/his post in red and my response in yellow:

Originally posted by crunchyblack

 

well the first few weeks of ryzom was pretty nice community wise, but recently the hordes of wow players looking for the next wow have come in. Conversations are now arguments over which mmo is best ect.

The game really isnt that sandbox...at all...you have no set level which is nice but you really have to skill fighter/magic/crafting/and foraging to really build a good character. I found myself having trouble fighting mobs that i should have been able to kill easily at my level as a fighter...my problem...i had neglected using magic to kill mobs and crafting and foraging for crafting materials. This means there really is only one way to go when making your character...everything. Finding this out really ruined the sandbox feel of being able to do anything i wanted.

See when you "ding" a skill type by using it you get 10 points that can purchase what amounts to your active and passive skills (passive being more hp and other skill based pools). SO by neglecting a certain skill type your missing out on rasing stats, as well as skills related to that skill type. If you are a mage and neglect fighting mobs with weapons to skill fighter, you will have abysmal hp and hp regen, as well as weak self heals and buffs, vise versa your fighter will be missing out on the same hp/regen skills as well as weapon enhancment buffs and other stats.

Gameplay reminded me of Anarchy Online. Magic skills are all basically one animation reskinned, Fighting animations are based on weapon and sometimes dont even show (i hit mob but am still staning still)

The enviroment is really something though, it did feel like a living planet with migrating herds of animals, predators and prey. Very beautiful scenery.

Im really not trying to knock the game, it just seems that everything written about the game seems to skip past what i mentioned and focuses on "its a sandbox" and "it has a beautiful setting/living planet"

All in all its a good game if thats your thing, its not a game on easy mode. Not sure about later levels but the game really reminds me of Anarchy Online in that it has a lot of decent content and character building but lacked on animations and gameplay.

I was kinda just turned off on the having to be a fighter/mage/crafter/forager or be gimped thing. Also the community is on a downward spiral.

Try the game though, it needs people to survive and definatly is in a niche of game types that is rather untouched by mainstream games, definatly worth a try, just dont expect a reskinned wow experience.

 

Somehow I had a feeling this post would show up

Ok, first of all the having to skill up on all four trees isn't true at all.

Check those skill trees again you will notice the passive skills are in every tree.

Lets say you want level 1 cons which increases Health if ur a fighter you train it in the fighting tree.

Now if you look in the magic tree Cons level 1 is no longer in the magic tree it is replaced by level 2.

Basically you have the freedom to level attributes in any tree you can, not grab the same level of every attribute skill in each tree that would be stupid.

This game doesn't force you to skill up in everything.

 

You say you had trouble fighting mobs at your fighting level because of attributes? maybe it was due to lack of quality armor or a weapon your fight level? Were you fighting 4 and 5 star blue mobs cause those are above level 50 skill.

I'm sorry but you can not just simply walk into a creature much higher skill level than you and expect to win.

In no sandbox MMO can you expect to walk in every area at a very low skill level and not feel restricted due to mob difficulty.

Mainland in ryzom is challenging It's a nice change of pace from the mentally challenged focused linear mmo's of today.

 

Now the community is getting larger and with it brings the normal riff raff any mmo would have. This is what the /ignore function is for.

I find the community helpful and my guild has helped me tremendously.

My friends list is about 30 players long since i realized right away this game would be more enjoyable in a group.

 

You say the spell animations look reskined? did you have problems putting this game on high settings?

Last time i checked fear and acid bolt looked nothing alike, Cold and rot looked totally different.

I will agree Ryzoms game world is wonderful to look at and the mob AI is spectacular atleast that part of your review is correct.

 

I'm sorry but this post seems like you spent a couple hours playing and decided you didn't like that the game was hard so you totally wrote it off.

If you would of said the game felt too grindy for you then I would of agreed but to say that this isn't a real sandbox due to Mod difficulty restriction thats just telling me you want the game dumbed down and I'm sure the rest of the community will disagree with you.

 

Ok now to this post, You do not need to spec in both fighting and magic, players simply suggested to go into melee since you can spend non-important skill points to raise health its nice but not needed.

Ranged combat if leveling from level 21 with no cash to buy ammo suck but in no way is it gimped.

Did you level up the balance attribute to use better guns?

Sure crafting ammo is helpful but in no way is it needed i had a crap ton of ammo just by selling animal parts while killing with my gun.

Being underpowered in ranged due to low skill level does not mean combat is bugged.

This game gives you the freedom to play and build a character how you want.

You say you can't be a hybrid cause you need to use Light armor? thats BS if you want to be a melee/caster hybrid you grab Medium armor it works out perfectly.

This whole post is bullshit and it bothers me that you would create a new account just to post the same damn thing over again in two more posts!

Have a good day and hope you enjoy WAR!

 

 

 

 

metalhead980

I hate people that go out of thier way to post nonsense about another game so they can sway new players away.

Zorvan

Originally posted by Kaiserjager


First I apologize for repeating lines I posted elswhere.
I am one of those that tried Ryzom when it became avilable again after following the game forums for some time.
Ryzom was and is promoted as a sandbox game with supposed freedom of action. The underlying assumption is that Ryzom offers more then stadard quest/level oriented "linear" MMO.
To be honest I fail to see where is freedom in Ryzom. My experience runned something along the following lines and I happen to know few people who had similar issues.
After logging in and familiarizing myself with the game I wanted to try a caster. I intended to avoid the other three branches (combat, harvesting, crafting) until I get more familiar with the game, I didn't get far before I was pointed out that I should level melee fighting first because it was the easiest way to garner hit points.
 
In most games, casters have low hitpoints, so what's the trouble there? If you want to be a pure caster, be one. Just be prepared to party alot. Which, since Ryzom is built on socialization, is pretty much encouraged, not to mention encouraged by most other mmorpgs.
Very well, I thought that I could form some sort of a hybrid fgihter/magic user. That was the second wall because to be effective in combat you need heavy armour that severly impares use of magic. If you stick with ligh armour you remain very squishy. Basically multiple classes are impossible, at any given time you can be a fighter or a magic user but not both.
Were you incapable of carrying two sets of armor, one heavy and one light/caster? Most of us do.
That brought me to third step, I needed combat branch and ranged combat became available (skill branches inside of the category every so often). Now, since my magic user and hybrid ideas couldn't really work I went for ranged combat. I also didn't went far becaue to be proficinet in ranged combat you need to train harvesting materials. On top of that ranged weapons are bugged, underpowered compared with other weapons of the same level and use huge amounts of ammunition that is expensive. If you decide to torture yourself with ranged combat you should be ready to harvest and craft your own ammunition.
Every player has a choice in every game of what type of weapon to use, and every weapon in every game out there has pluses and minuses to using them.
In short (copy/pasted from another thread):
"For character to be effective a player is pressured by game mechanics to pursue all four categories (combat, magic, harvest, crafting) to some extent. It creates a world filled with characters who happen to be jack of all trades. You want to focus on magic? Well too bad, but best way to build hit points is by melee combat. You want to purusue ranged combat? Great but for that you need focus and that is increased fastest with harvesting. And so on and so forth.
You can be a "pure" anything you want. There are things called guilds, there are shops which sell armoor and weapons made by crafters so you don't have to harvest or craft, there are people without guilds who would be happy to help you level magic while they level melee.
Ryzom gives freedom to grind component A, B, C & D in any order one likes but it does not offer the real freedom just to focus on components, say A and B. Of course, nobody forces you to do all four categories but freedom not to do that is equal to the freedom of WoW player not to grind for gear. In short it is there but it is not practical.
Already covered above, the freedom is there.
The game also has issues, ranged combat is bugged and ranged weapons (save launchers) do insignificant damage and eat up huge amounts of amunition. Ammunition you are best of by crafting it yourself due to high cost of projectiles. Again, and so on and so forth.
The game was not finished when Nevrax went bankrupt, and Gameforge did nothing the whole time they had it. The new company has released the game as is for beta purposes. This is why it is up for free right now.
The smug attitude of veterans also does not help. I witnessed more then once that any and all critical comments are dimissed, usually by pointing out how superior Ryzom player is to everyone else. Naturally everyone else is a sheep and fit only to play asian grinders or liner games like WoW. This hardly helps the game starved for new players.
There are elitist in every game, from Eve to WoW, so that isn't exactly earthshattering or a true condemnation of the game itself or the majority of its community who happen to be very helpful for the most part. However, they do tend to get tired of answering the same questions over and over simply because players refuse to read, for example.
In short Ryzom shows its age (2004 release if I am not mistaken) and its sandbox freedom is very limited.
And looks better than most new games, has greater AI than most newer games, gives a higher impression of a real living world than most other games, and is currently in beta waiting for further development. And again, the freedom is only limited by the person playing, not the game.
My observation is that the game will not get far above and beyond Ryzom vets, not because people are averse to sandbox but because Ryzom's concept has shortcommings."
 
To conclude on a more positive note I would like to say that background story, races and graphics are really well done and defnitelly refreshing. Crafting is very well done and quite deep although harvesting that is closely attached to it might not be fun, depending on personal taste. Combat and magic suffer from a number of bugs but otherwise serve their pourpose.
Thoughts? Opinions? Comments?

 

Originally posted by Kaiserjager 


 
The bugs I mentioned are, for example, ranged combat always reverting to auto attack after special attack. That auto attack cannot be stopped unless the desired special attack is double clicked after which it repeats itself. The ammo loss is enormous and damage is insignificant.
That is why stanzas are customizable. You can edit the default attack to include the special, therefore making the special attack default.
 
 

rushin

hmm yeah sorry, thats mostly rubbish

if you want to be the *best* magic user then its helpful to level melee as you will end up with more HP. only thing making you do it is you. I have a digger alt. He digs, thats it save for some levels in healing so i can rez people. 100HP, level 1 fight, never killed anything and he is very happy thanks.

if you want to use ranged you have to use ammo. If you are not prepared to dig/craft your own ammo then find someone to help. That is not a shortcoming of the game, by your argument because its 'sandbox' there should be a button that fills your bag with ammo just because you dont see why you should procure it yourself.

about arrogant/unhelpful vets, umm hello please pay a visit to planet reality. The Ryzom community is amazing helpful compared to every single other game i have played. If you were somehow expecting every single person who plays to be a shining beacon of light then you are just being silly. With Ryzom you have to look past a handful of idiots to find the hordes of nice helpful ones, in most mmo's its the other way round

ranged isnt broken, you simply havent got a good understanding of the mechanics, and no i cant really be arsed to explain cause it will take ages. however whether you like it or not its true.

Kaiserjager

Originally posted by metalhead980


Guys disregard this post I actually talked to this person in game and she/he said the same thing about ryzom then, Lack of freedom due to mob difficulty and lack of freedom due to needing to spec into all four trees to be effective.
This person created another account and has already posted "ryzoms lack of freedom" three times.
Here is her/his original post that i responded to basically showing everyone that she didn't know one god damn thing about ryzom.
Her/his post in red and my response in yellow:
Originally posted by crunchyblack
 
well the first few weeks of ryzom was pretty nice community wise, but recently the hordes of wow players looking for the next wow have come in. Conversations are now arguments over which mmo is best ect.
The game really isnt that sandbox...at all...you have no set level which is nice but you really have to skill fighter/magic/crafting/and foraging to really build a good character. I found myself having trouble fighting mobs that i should have been able to kill easily at my level as a fighter...my problem...i had neglected using magic to kill mobs and crafting and foraging for crafting materials. This means there really is only one way to go when making your character...everything. Finding this out really ruined the sandbox feel of being able to do anything i wanted.
See when you "ding" a skill type by using it you get 10 points that can purchase what amounts to your active and passive skills (passive being more hp and other skill based pools). SO by neglecting a certain skill type your missing out on rasing stats, as well as skills related to that skill type. If you are a mage and neglect fighting mobs with weapons to skill fighter, you will have abysmal hp and hp regen, as well as weak self heals and buffs, vise versa your fighter will be missing out on the same hp/regen skills as well as weapon enhancment buffs and other stats.
Gameplay reminded me of Anarchy Online. Magic skills are all basically one animation reskinned, Fighting animations are based on weapon and sometimes dont even show (i hit mob but am still staning still)
The enviroment is really something though, it did feel like a living planet with migrating herds of animals, predators and prey. Very beautiful scenery.
Im really not trying to knock the game, it just seems that everything written about the game seems to skip past what i mentioned and focuses on "its a sandbox" and "it has a beautiful setting/living planet"
All in all its a good game if thats your thing, its not a game on easy mode. Not sure about later levels but the game really reminds me of Anarchy Online in that it has a lot of decent content and character building but lacked on animations and gameplay.
I was kinda just turned off on the having to be a fighter/mage/crafter/forager or be gimped thing. Also the community is on a downward spiral.
Try the game though, it needs people to survive and definatly is in a niche of game types that is rather untouched by mainstream games, definatly worth a try, just dont expect a reskinned wow experience.
 
Somehow I had a feeling this post would show up
Ok, first of all the having to skill up on all four trees isn't true at all.
Check those skill trees again you will notice the passive skills are in every tree.
Lets say you want level 1 cons which increases Health if ur a fighter you train it in the fighting tree.
Now if you look in the magic tree Cons level 1 is no longer in the magic tree it is replaced by level 2.
Basically you have the freedom to level attributes in any tree you can, not grab the same level of every attribute skill in each tree that would be stupid.
This game doesn't force you to skill up in everything.
 
You say you had trouble fighting mobs at your fighting level because of attributes? maybe it was due to lack of quality armor or a weapon your fight level? Were you fighting 4 and 5 star blue mobs cause those are above level 50 skill.
I'm sorry but you can not just simply walk into a creature much higher skill level than you and expect to win.
In no sandbox MMO can you expect to walk in every area at a very low skill level and not feel restricted due to mob difficulty.
Mainland in ryzom is challenging It's a nice change of pace from the mentally challenged focused linear mmo's of today.
 
Now the community is getting larger and with it brings the normal riff raff any mmo would have. This is what the /ignore function is for.
I find the community helpful and my guild has helped me tremendously.
My friends list is about 30 players long since i realized right away this game would be more enjoyable in a group.
 
You say the spell animations look reskined? did you have problems putting this game on high settings?
Last time i checked fear and acid bolt looked nothing alike, Cold and rot looked totally different.
I will agree Ryzoms game world is wonderful to look at and the mob AI is spectacular atleast that part of your review is correct.
 
I'm sorry but this post seems like you spent a couple hours playing and decided you didn't like that the game was hard so you totally wrote it off.
If you would of said the game felt too grindy for you then I would of agreed but to say that this isn't a real sandbox due to Mod difficulty restriction thats just telling me you want the game dumbed down and I'm sure the rest of the community will disagree with you.
 
Ok now to this post, You do not need to spec in both fighting and magic, players simply suggested to go into melee since you can spend non-important skill points to raise health its nice but not needed.
Ranged combat if leveling from level 21 with no cash to buy ammo suck but in no way is it gimped.
Did you level up the balance attribute to use better guns?
Sure crafting ammo is helpful but in no way is it needed i had a crap ton of ammo just by selling animal parts while killing with my gun.
Being underpowered in ranged due to low skill level does not mean combat is bugged.
This game gives you the freedom to play and build a character how you want.
You say you can't be a hybrid cause you need to use Light armor? thats BS if you want to be a melee/caster hybrid you grab Medium armor it works out perfectly.
This whole post is bullshit and it bothers me that you would create a new account just to post the same damn thing over again in two more posts!
Have a good day and hope you enjoy WAR!
 
 
 
 

Ahh yes, I see metalhead980 is promoting that friendly Ryzom community and that is the veteran attitude I was mentioning before. Thank you for proving my point.

Unfortunately I have to dissapoint, that post was not made by me and I don't have time or patience to run multiple accounts just to argue over a video game. Not to mention that the writing style is a bit different but think what you like.

Rather that post repeats the points made by quite a few people who tried Ryzom recently.

Thank you metalhead980, your answers to that fellow's question however those really only partially covering issues that I stated.

My point was, and I will repat it here, that I have a feeling game pressures me to level A, B, C & D. I can chose to in what order but I cannot chose to ignore, say C, because everything is interdependant.

That leads in medium to long run to all characters being mgic users, fighters, crafters and harvesters.

How is that freedom?

metalhead980

Originally posted by Kaiserjager


I left Silan, ranged weapons are not avilable in the starting zone.
I also got all four categories to at least skill level 50 and I was informed that interdependence only gets worse as one makes level progress.
The experience with vets in universal chat is not something I can claim as a constant occurance, the attitude however can be seen on these forums also.
The bugs I mentioned are, for example, ranged combat always reverting to auto attack after special attack. That auto attack cannot be stopped unless the desired special attack is double clicked after which it repeats itself. The ammo loss is enormous and damage is insignificant.
I think that if I feel like it, I should be able to completely ignore one to three categories without my character suffering for it. As the things stand now that is impossible in Ryzom, quite simply you cannot be whatever you want to be - instead you have to be everything or your character will simply not be competitive.
Therefore I am under the impression that its freedom is limited, maybe limited in a different way then say LOTRO but at the same order of magnitude.

 

50 in everything huh?

Log in my name is minmitaro i have only leveled combat to around 60 so far lets see what type of disadvantage I have against you.

Since you leveled everything to 50+ you should have a huge advantage right?

You don't need to level everything to be competitive.

 

 

 

metalhead980

Unfortunately I have to dissapoint, that post was not made by me and I don't have time or patience to run multiple accounts just to argue over a video game. Not to mention that the writing style is a bit different but think what you like.
Rather that post repeats the points made by quite a few people who tried Ryzom recently.
Thank you metalhead980, your answers to that fellow's question however those really only partially covering issues that I stated.
My point was, and I will repat it here, that I have a feeling game pressures me to level A, B, C & D. I can chose to in what order but I cannot chose to ignore, say C, because everything is interdependant.
That leads in medium to long run to all characters being mgic users, fighters, crafters and harvesters.
How is that freedom?

 

Give me a break, look at the responses you are getting.

No one agrees with you at all.

Again you don't have to level all four (magic, fight,craft.gather) and no if you only level fighting or crafting you will not feel pressured to spec in all four.

Oh please check my posts history i am no troll or elitist.

this game gives you the freedom to play how you want.

This will be my last response to you, I'm sure you will make another account to post this again and deny that I know you.

Everyone will disagree with you your complaint is invalid.

 

Edit: i don't even know why im bothering noone on these boards listens to anyone with 5 posts which four of the 5 are about negetive feedback of Ryzom.

Edit2: I wish your complaints were valid I actually enjoy discussing features of ryzom that need to be improved, If you said the game was too much of a grind, had a terrible housing feature or lacked staples like pet taming i would of agreed with you.

Kaiserjager

Originally posted by Zorvan

Originally posted by Kaiserjager


First I apologize for repeating lines I posted elswhere.
I am one of those that tried Ryzom when it became avilable again after following the game forums for some time.
Ryzom was and is promoted as a sandbox game with supposed freedom of action. The underlying assumption is that Ryzom offers more then stadard quest/level oriented "linear" MMO.
To be honest I fail to see where is freedom in Ryzom. My experience runned something along the following lines and I happen to know few people who had similar issues.
After logging in and familiarizing myself with the game I wanted to try a caster. I intended to avoid the other three branches (combat, harvesting, crafting) until I get more familiar with the game, I didn't get far before I was pointed out that I should level melee fighting first because it was the easiest way to garner hit points.
 
In most games, casters have low hitpoints, so what's the trouble there? If you want to be a pure caster, be one. Just be prepared to party alot. Which, since Ryzom is built on socialization, is pretty much encouraged, not to mention encouraged by most other mmorpgs.
In most games casters are effective on their own with their own limitations.  Being pure caster isn't feasible since game encourages you to dabble in other fields. Now we are comming to a point that I can be non-effective but should then party. I suspect this will probably end with me being sent to play single player games as I don't like to party often. That is not freedom of action, that is just chosing one defect over another, that is unely I make my life easier and simply copy everyone lese and dabble in all four fields.
Very well, I thought that I could form some sort of a hybrid fgihter/magic user. That was the second wall because to be effective in combat you need heavy armour that severly impares use of magic. If you stick with ligh armour you remain very squishy. Basically multiple classes are impossible, at any given time you can be a fighter or a magic user but not both.
Were you incapable of carrying two sets of armor, one heavy and one light/caster? Most of us do.
Actually inventory is rather limited before mount or house but the point was I cannot use combat and magic. I have to swap to combat or to magic, again that is hardly freedom as even theo ld tabletop Ad&D had multiclasses.
That brought me to third step, I needed combat branch and ranged combat became available (skill branches inside of the category every so often). Now, since my magic user and hybrid ideas couldn't really work I went for ranged combat. I also didn't went far becaue to be proficinet in ranged combat you need to train harvesting materials. On top of that ranged weapons are bugged, underpowered compared with other weapons of the same level and use huge amounts of ammunition that is expensive. If you decide to torture yourself with ranged combat you should be ready to harvest and craft your own ammunition.
Every player has a choice in every game of what type of weapon to use, and every weapon in every game out there has pluses and minuses to using them.
I am sorry but that is just false, ranged weapons are known to be badly underpowered in comparison to melee weapons. And even if it was so, what is the benefit of a ranged weapon? I could not find any.
In short (copy/pasted from another thread):
"For character to be effective a player is pressured by game mechanics to pursue all four categories (combat, magic, harvest, crafting) to some extent. It creates a world filled with characters who happen to be jack of all trades. You want to focus on magic? Well too bad, but best way to build hit points is by melee combat. You want to purusue ranged combat? Great but for that you need focus and that is increased fastest with harvesting. And so on and so forth.
You can be a "pure" anything you want. There are things called guilds, there are shops which sell armoor and weapons made by crafters so you don't have to harvest or craft, there are people without guilds who would be happy to help you level magic while they level melee.
There are guilds and I am actually guilded, however I will again state that game that pressures me to join the guild hardly supports freedom of action.
Ryzom gives freedom to grind component A, B, C & D in any order one likes but it does not offer the real freedom just to focus on components, say A and B. Of course, nobody forces you to do all four categories but freedom not to do that is equal to the freedom of WoW player not to grind for gear. In short it is there but it is not practical.
Already covered above, the freedom is there.
And I disagreed with it above.
The game also has issues, ranged combat is bugged and ranged weapons (save launchers) do insignificant damage and eat up huge amounts of amunition. Ammunition you are best of by crafting it yourself due to high cost of projectiles. Again, and so on and so forth.
The game was not finished when Nevrax went bankrupt, and Gameforge did nothing the whole time they had it. The new company has released the game as is for beta purposes. This is why it is up for free right now.
It was released in 2004, it should have been fixed by now but granted there was a lot of turbulence. Still the issue remains regardless of the cause. 
The smug attitude of veterans also does not help. I witnessed more then once that any and all critical comments are dimissed, usually by pointing out how superior Ryzom player is to everyone else. Naturally everyone else is a sheep and fit only to play asian grinders or liner games like WoW. This hardly helps the game starved for new players.
There are elitist in every game, from Eve to WoW, so that isn't exactly earthshattering or a true condemnation of the game itself or the majority of its community who happen to be very helpful for the most part. However, they do tend to get tired of answering the same questions over and over simply because players refuse to read, for example.
Let us say that it holds more weight since EVE and WoW never took pride in the community. Also, there is no excuse for insults even if tired. Is it so hard to simply say nothing? Apparently so because I saw enough Ryzom veterans with language that rival that on WoW PvP server. The majority of community is indeed helpful but there is a seizable percentage that is abusive.
In short Ryzom shows its age (2004 release if I am not mistaken) and its sandbox freedom is very limited.
And looks better than most new games, has greater AI than most newer games, gives a higher impression of a real living world than most other games, and is currently in beta waiting for further development. And again, the freedom is only limited by the person playing, not the game.
 I agree with your first sentence but I beleive second one is false. The freedom is much less then what one would expect and I pointed out just some of the several heavy limitations. Without being rude I saw arguments on AoC forum that blame players and not the game. Freedom here is limited by the game itself.  
My observation is that the game will not get far above and beyond Ryzom vets, not because people are averse to sandbox but because Ryzom's concept has shortcommings."
 
To conclude on a more positive note I would like to say that background story, races and graphics are really well done and defnitelly refreshing. Crafting is very well done and quite deep although harvesting that is closely attached to it might not be fun, depending on personal taste. Combat and magic suffer from a number of bugs but otherwise serve their pourpose.
Thoughts? Opinions? Comments?

 

 

Originally posted by Kaiserjager 


 
The bugs I mentioned are, for example, ranged combat always reverting to auto attack after special attack. That auto attack cannot be stopped unless the desired special attack is double clicked after which it repeats itself. The ammo loss is enormous and damage is insignificant.
That is why stanzas are customizable. You can edit the default attack to include the special, therefore making the special attack default.
It doesn't have anything to do with stanzas but with the known ranged weapon bug.
 
 

 

Kaiserjager

Originally posted by metalhead980




Unfortunately I have to dissapoint, that post was not made by me and I don't have time or patience to run multiple accounts just to argue over a video game. Not to mention that the writing style is a bit different but think what you like.
Rather that post repeats the points made by quite a few people who tried Ryzom recently.
Thank you metalhead980, your answers to that fellow's question however those really only partially covering issues that I stated.
My point was, and I will repat it here, that I have a feeling game pressures me to level A, B, C & D. I can chose to in what order but I cannot chose to ignore, say C, because everything is interdependant.
That leads in medium to long run to all characters being mgic users, fighters, crafters and harvesters.
How is that freedom?

 

Give me a break, look at the responses you are getting.

No one agrees with you at all.

Again you don't have to level all four (magic, fight,craft.gather) and no if you only level fighting or crafting you will not feel pressured to spec in all four.

Oh please check my posts history i am no troll or elitist.

this game gives you the freedom to play how you want.

This will be my last response to you, I'm sure you will make another account to post this again and deny that I know you.

Everyone will disagree with you your complaint is invalid.

 

Edit: i don't even know why im bothering noone on these boards listens to anyone with 5 posts which four of the 5 are about negetive feedback of Ryzom.

Edit2: I wish your complaints were valid I actually enjoy discussing features of ryzom that need to be improved, If you said the game was too much of a grind, had a terrible housing feature or lacked staples like pet taming i would of agreed with you.

Let me get your logic straight, critique is a work of one troll who abuses multiple accounts. He/she/it should therefore dismissed.

At the same time when half dozen Ryzom veterans agree with each other that proves that nobody has any issues with the game.

Sorry but I prefer to think that all voices, if argumented, are equally valid.

There are issues with Ryzom and as a game veteran I suspect you don't want to hear them. Fair enough but character assassination without proof was tasteless to say the least. Not to mention it is false.

Kaiserjager

Originally posted by rushin


hmm yeah sorry, thats mostly rubbish
if you want to be the *best* magic user then its helpful to level melee as you will end up with more HP. only thing making you do it is you. I have a digger alt. He digs, thats it save for some levels in healing so i can rez people. 100HP, level 1 fight, never killed anything and he is very happy thanks.
if you want to use ranged you have to use ammo. If you are not prepared to dig/craft your own ammo then find someone to help. That is not a shortcoming of the game, by your argument because its 'sandbox' there should be a button that fills your bag with ammo just because you dont see why you should procure it yourself.
about arrogant/unhelpful vets, umm hello please pay a visit to planet reality. The Ryzom community is amazing helpful compared to every single other game i have played. If you were somehow expecting every single person who plays to be a shining beacon of light then you are just being silly. With Ryzom you have to look past a handful of idiots to find the hordes of nice helpful ones, in most mmo's its the other way round
ranged isnt broken, you simply havent got a good understanding of the mechanics, and no i cant really be arsed to explain cause it will take ages. however whether you like it or not its true.

I think we disagree on the level of "helpful", my ten days stint convinced me that it is crucial thus it is not an option to drop it.

 

I am sorry but ranged is bugged and nobody asked fro free ammo. I asked for effective ranged weaposn and affordable ammunition without playing the munition factory. And I cannot do that.

Please read your fellow vet's comments posted in this thread, first one accused me of running multiple accounts because I posted some valid concerns. That is hardly a showcase for community.

Your truth seem to be different from my truth, so whos truth is it? Anyways I explained and argumented my position, you called it false without giving arguments. Like it or not I think ti is not true.

Souvec

Kaiser, you seem like someone who enjoys arguing for arguments sake.  In reality every issue  you mentioned has been met with a definitive answer to prove otherwise.  Facts most importantly have shown that you simply do not have to follow any set plan other than the one in which you have made for yourself.

If there is an issue with freedom, it is completely in your own hands.  You don't have to wear heavy armor to me a melee fighter, nor do you have to use amplifiers to cast magic.  The choice is yours, and no one is pressuring you to play in any different manor.  If anything, the players as well as Ryzoms tutorials are merely showing you the various possibilities within.  Its your choice on how effective you want to be... but let me reitterate for the umphteenth time.... it is still all your choice.

I have been with Ryzom for quite some time and truly I don't see the logic in your theory simply because you have taken choice and turned it against yourself.

 

Kaiserjager

Originally posted by Souvec


Kaiser, you seem like someone who enjoys arguing for arguments sake.  In reality every issue  you mentioned has been met with a definitive answer to prove otherwise.  Facts most importantly have shown that you simply do not have to follow any set plan other than the one in which you have made for yourself.
If there is an issue with freedom, it is completely in your own hands.  You don't have to wear heavy armor to me a melee fighter, nor do you have to use amplifiers to cast magic.  The choice is yours, and no one is pressuring you to play in any different manor.  If anything, the players as well as Ryzoms tutorials are merely showing you the various possibilities within.  Its your choice on how effective you want to be... but let me reitterate for the umphteenth time.... it is still all your choice.
I have been with Ryzom for quite some time and truly I don't see the logic in your theory simply because you have taken choice and turned it against yourself.
 

I am sorry but for now I got almost no arguments on the topic, but I did get quite a few "I know better", "shut up and listen" and a character assassination posts.

That proves what actually? That discussing Ryzom on Ryzom forum with Ryzom veteran players is posible only if one lavishes praises on the game.

I simply stated Ryzom has its limitations, those limitations are game based. I can either be jack of all trades or run with a group, how is that freedom? WoW offers you freedom to grind instances or battlegounds, that is no freedom at all.

Now, I can understand that min-maxers enjoy grinding everything across the chart. I can understand that some people like to play jack of all trades or run around grouped. That is actually a very limited number of choices, most games have limited number of choices.

I subscribed to Ryzom because I beleived what veterans spread around, I tried it and my observation is of a different experince. While playing I noted that am not the only one with that impression. My post stands and I am happy if it provides a counter balance to the others that might shown interest in the game.

Oddly enough I have issues with the game but I do like it or I wouldn't bother with comments. I started as a fence sitter however after tonight  it is unlikely I will subscribe to Ryzom when it goes pay to play. While I beleive that community is healthy and friendly I saw extremes tonight and I am not inclined to pay for that privilege.

My special thanks to gatheris and Zorvan for civilized replies

olepi

I try to keep some skills in all the different classes, that makes it easier to find and help groups. For example, my main character is about 175 in melee, 125 in magic, about 50 in range. This lets me join groups as a level 175, 125, or 50 and contribute at that level. In other MMO's, your caster is a different character than your melee fighter, so you make alts. No alts are needed in Ryzom. Just different equipment and armor for your current task.

However, you don't need or have to level everything. I would recommend leveling healing magic and melee, since this lets you play as a healer and/or tanker, filling two good roles in any teams. Offensive magic is also good for pure damage casting.

There are also many other things you could do:

- Crowd control -- it is useful to have lots of roots, stuns, confuses, etc. You could easily just focus on this to help your teams.

- Debuff/DoT -- you could also just focus on dotting the enemies, or casting buff auras on your team, or debuffs on the enemies.

- range -- I love range I do dig and make my own ammo, and that gives me something to dig for. I was never the type to like games where you attack an enemy by just clicking on them and sitting back. I would rather press the buttons my self, so your bug example does not affect me. Range does good damage once you get it trained up and have good ammo.

- 1H vs 2H -- 2H weapons typically do more damage, but I like the look of shields and 1H maces. So I went that way for pure RP reasons. Have not leveled 2H at all.

So I made a new character for the new server (Cho), and that is now my main. He is way ahead in digging, has decent melee and range, and low magic, with almost no CC or debuff/buffs. He uses 1H maces and shields. I am not levelling any of the other skills yet (except healing, always level healing). Seems like freedom to me

 

 

 

rushin

Originally posted by Kaiserjager

I am sorry but ranged is bugged and nobody asked fro free ammo. I asked for effective ranged weaposn and affordable ammunition without playing the munition factory. And I cannot do that.
Please read your fellow vet's comments posted in this thread, first one accused me of running multiple accounts because I posted some valid concerns. That is hardly a showcase for community.
Your truth seem to be different from my truth, so whos truth is it? Anyways I explained and argumented my position, you called it false without giving arguments. Like it or not I think ti is not true.

 

err what arguments are you after exactly?

you are saying there is no freedom because you feel you have to do everything. I have explained there is no reason to do everything. This is a difference of opinion certainly, but as i originally stated its you that are forcing yourself to level everything, not the game.

so ranged. you make an action you double click it and that is your default action, same as other branches. how is this bugged? If you have a 'default attack' action on the bar you are using either modify it with the stanza's you want to use or move it the right of the action you are chaining.

you said you need to level harvesting for ranged. this isnt true you can buy/loot/find a nice person to provide ammo

you said ranged combat does insignificant dmg compared to other weapons. the DPS is not so different to melee actually. plus you can run while shooting. plus you can learn a stanza to increase your firing rate. Are you using max dmg ammo? its not hard to make or buy, only needs choice mats. I can carry enough ammo for many hours of shooting, there are also pack animals. they are designed to carry things around for you, ohh i dont know ammo maybe, take one with you next time you go hunting, you can leave at nearest OP so it will be safe. Are you using the right kind of ammo? are you fighting the right sort of mob?

Other big point is that hunting solo while possible takes a lot of effort, mostly in research as to what makes good targets, but also optimising your equipment and actions. If you are in a team then it doesnt matter if you are doing the most damage, you have a role to play and ranged wont be lead dmg dealer. Silan is super easy because its no fun to die constantly when you are learning a new game, but on the mainland the challenge ramps up as you would expect

The point is you say ohnoes its bugged, but dont back this up with anything. If your entire 'bugged' argument revolves around a default action being chosen after your special attack then this is a whole lot of everytimes time thats being wasted.

we were all newbies once. The way to leave newbie land behind is to learn, adapt or whatever. Why not say my 2h ranged is level xxx. i am in xxx zone trying to kill xxx mobs and then you could expect some constructive help?

I dont really take any enjoyment of arguing with people on forums, but i do open my mouth to comment on inaccurate information.

Yours,

smug, nasty vet ryzom player

 

Zyllos

Well, I really do not see how it *forces* you to do that, but why wouldnt you do that? Thats my problem, its TOO free, in the end, everyone WANTS max skill in crafting, melee, ranged, magic, ect. What games in the future need to do is keep the skill based systems in, but limit which skills are available dependent on what class you are. Its the best of both worlds: no levels, skill based, structured, know what each class will do, still allows freedom, ect, ect.

Souvec

Originally posted by Kaiserjager

Originally posted by Souvec


Kaiser, you seem like someone who enjoys arguing for arguments sake.  In reality every issue  you mentioned has been met with a definitive answer to prove otherwise.  Facts most importantly have shown that you simply do not have to follow any set plan other than the one in which you have made for yourself.
If there is an issue with freedom, it is completely in your own hands.  You don't have to wear heavy armor to me a melee fighter, nor do you have to use amplifiers to cast magic.  The choice is yours, and no one is pressuring you to play in any different manor.  If anything, the players as well as Ryzoms tutorials are merely showing you the various possibilities within.  Its your choice on how effective you want to be... but let me reitterate for the umphteenth time.... it is still all your choice.
I have been with Ryzom for quite some time and truly I don't see the logic in your theory simply because you have taken choice and turned it against yourself.
 

I am sorry but for now I got almost no arguments on the topic, but I did get quite a few "I know better", "shut up and listen" and a character assassination posts.

That proves what actually? That discussing Ryzom on Ryzom forum with Ryzom veteran players is posible only if one lavishes praises on the game.

I simply stated Ryzom has its limitations, those limitations are game based. I can either be jack of all trades or run with a group, how is that freedom? WoW offers you freedom to grind instances or battlegounds, that is no freedom at all.

Now, I can understand that min-maxers enjoy grinding everything across the chart. I can understand that some people like to play jack of all trades or run around grouped. That is actually a very limited number of choices, most games have limited number of choices.

I subscribed to Ryzom because I beleived what veterans spread around, I tried it and my observation is of a different experince. While playing I noted that am not the only one with that impression. My post stands and I am happy if it provides a counter balance to the others that might shown interest in the game.

Oddly enough I have issues with the game but I do like it or I wouldn't bother with comments. I started as a fence sitter however after tonight  it is unlikely I will subscribe to Ryzom when it goes pay to play. While I beleive that community is healthy and friendly I saw extremes tonight and I am not inclined to pay for that privilege.

My special thanks to gatheris and Zorvan for civilized replies

Well I apologize if it seemed as if I was coming off rude, but if you continue to refuse to listen what more can you expect?

Discussing Ryzom is one thing, but spreading mistruths about the games skill system and freedom is another.  You have made attempt after attempt to convince us of Ryzom's lack of freedom, yet you can not free yourself from your own thoughts.  It has been said time after time, there are alternative paths, and there are ways you can purchase items without even going into other skill trees.  That and no one person whether NPC or PC is telling you how or what to do in the game.

The only pressure you are facing is your own self-induced pressures.  If your post stands only to counter-balance the positive things in Ryzom, then its purpose it lost.  Intentionally making up certain issues, even when faced with the facts truly does nothing to support your entire argument.

While you raise some key issues with Ranged Weaponry, I have yet to disagree with such.  If you wish to point out more of its prevalent flaws please feel free to do so.  This is the place to do so, but don't expect for others who know the "in's and outs" of Ryzom to call you out on something as blatently false as freedom.

Simply put, we have a disagreement, imagine that happening on the internet.

Sasi

Ranged combat really comes into its own at higher skill levels. Watch the autolauncher masters in action at an OP battle and see what I mean.

Meanwhile, back in regular homin life, see Rushin's post for some of the advantages of ranged. The big one in my opinion is that you can move while shooting. With a good supply of ammo and a bit of player skill, you can take down a very tough mob and never take a hit. Because of that, making ranged combat higher "powered" (meaning more DPS) would run a serious risk of making it far too powerful and discouraging all other forms of combat. (The old cliche "Brought a knife to a gunfight" springs to mind.)

It's true that you have to craft or buy ammo. Again, this is a balancing factor.

It's true that the first levels of ranged fighting are tough going.

And, as mentioned elsewhere, it's true that leveling a variety of skills makes life easier in Ryzom.

I'm happy with that, personally.

For more great info on Ranged combat in Ryzom, see http://www.ryzomranger.co.uk/

jackoba

leave off the op he's sorta right,

ok lets address his post instead of flaming him.

1. yes there is interdependence in skills in a way, however you could if you wanted to train all 4 mage tree's to max and buy 75% of the hp upgradesfrom the mage trainer that melee can buy. *if* you wanted to live a little longer however its suggested you level a melee tree (see it as inadvertadly levelling your mage if you want).

2. you are in no way forced to become a harvester/crafter. sure you wont be able to make your own gear and will have to live off the the charity of others but you are by no means forced to do it. Exception - unless someone really loves you, you WILL have to dig for ranged ammo and craft it, this is part of the ranged tree which is in my opinion a rich players side project class rather than a bread and butter everyday class.

3. smug veterans, now this is an awfully odd thing I've noticed, sure there are smug vets, but the real "smug vets" seem to be 1 month old players parroting what they have heard in guild chat. Even I who am not known for my patience with dealing with new players have been appauled @ uni chat baiting. Best idea for uni atm is watch who is answering questions patiently and send them a /tell or if you drop me a /tell I'm mostly willing to answer a few questions about game mechanics etc (I know nothing of silan before I get spammed).

last note, the ranged reverting to non special attacks thing, you can avoid this by double clicking on your special attack and then never clicking on it again till the mob is dead, repeated clicking seems to on/off the special attack (different when doing melee)

 

hope I've been of some help rather than the usual omg you suck and know nothing kinda post, /tell jackoba if you have any more questions.

smoochak

hmm just a few notes from my experience

In all mmos that i've been playing I always played melee specialized characters. I didn't want to craft, dig or my dear god do that magic thing. Only sword, sweat and blood was my way.

When I first started Ryzom I wanted to continue this way. Of course some of the players, but mostly new one as me, told me that I should learn both magic skills and digging skills to be able to live on Atys normaly (lack of knowledge perhaps).

So I was guildless, magicless, dig/craftless for my first 160 lvls in melee. Not a single level in any other skill than melee. I asked homins around to make me sap crystals and they made me a sword with heal spell that I can rez with. I always kindly ask ed for armors and other equipment. I never dug or craft anything because that is not for real melee character.

Hmm was it hard? When I look back, yes, it was hard but key point is that was available to do. Problem is that although there is a choice to do whatever you want, it will not be easy, at least not always.

Leveling only melee or any other skill only is strange but it's completely doable. What I like more was the fact that no one told me like "I don't want you in my guild/team " because you can't nuke zerx in one hit or heal multiple characters full hp/sap. I think thats freedom. I was completely free to do what I wanted and thought that is way for me.

Is it normal to know only one skill? Dunno, if that is what you like it, just do it (as I am). Ryzom, in this terms are real fantasy world where you can emerge into and you can do whatever you want.

What is true that Ryzom is free both in the way of thinking and way of playing. I havent played game except EVE that offers you that opportunity.

Perkwunos

*cats are evil*

 

Machieltje

Ok I didn't bother going through the entire thread because frankly I don't really care what others have to say on the subject I'll just give you make take on all of this "I have no freedom" buissness.

 

The short and sweet: You want freedom? Then don't listen to what others have to say!

 

To clarify:

1. Yes it is easier to level some fight branch even if all you want to do is magic but that doesn't mean you have to! If magic is all you want than magic is all you'll do it might be harder but if you don't mind teaming most of the time than there's no reason why you can't be a mage.

 

2. Whoever told you you should wear heavy armour to play a hybrid (whatever the hell that means it certianly has no meaning in Ryzom as everyone is hybrid there) was dead wrong! Heavy armour is for tanks and hybrids are not tanks! For those that don't want the heavy penalty of HA there's medium armour and while it does impare casting to some extent it's a viable option for, oh well, "hybrids"

 

3. Ranged,as a whole, is not bugged, it is in fact a very fun skill and once you get past the dabbling with pistols you get a decent to good damage output.

 

As to the smug "veterans" I don't know who you've been listening to and how you could tell they were veterans but most vets I know are nice people who would help a newbie in everyway they can.

Now I've heard the "Ryzom is not a real sandbox" argument before and just about everyone uses the same things as you to point out why that is the case and it makes me want to tell those people that "they can't handle freedom" but that would probably make me one of the "smug veterans" people get so upset about. Fact remains that Ryzom gives you all the freedom you need to play with the sand if only you choose to.

If you take player advice as "The Aboslute Inescapable Truth" then maybe you should ask yourself "do I really want this freedom?"  Because that's all it is: advice. There is no wrong or right way to play Ryzom. You can choose the easy way or the hard way and everything in between.

 

So if you want, and can handle the freedom, then do whatever the hell you want but if you need people to tell you what to do next then you're not going to find freedom here or anywhere else...

 

(ask the right questions; get the right answer...)

 

 

ps I did level magic almost without fight so I know what the hell I'm talking about!

Gilgameesh

The OP seems confusing on what 'sandbox' means in Ryzom.

It's not that you are free to choose one class, then realize you are not totally free.

There are no classes in Ryzom and your freedom is to do whatever you prefer to do for the day.

The 'sandbox' in Ryzom means you have to build your life in the world, in any way you want.

You can be a 'pure' magician. Maybe you will not be powerful as a mage that has melee skills too, but it's normal, in my opinion, that a player with one master cannot be better than a player with 2 masters (but still you can make the difference in team).

But this doesn't affect your PvE really. You want to be uber? Master everything.

You are free to choose.

Neutrality in Ryzom has some penalty, still many guilds and many players decided to stay neutral. They were free to choose to be aligned or not.

I know many very good crafters/havervesters that still have low/medium combat skills. They were aware of the risks of that decision, but they were free to decide.

Ryzom is not solo-friendly, being part of a guild and teaming up is a good way to play the game. Still, there are a lot of players that like to solo. they are aware of the disadvantages related to the cooldowns, but they are free to choose.

Any decision you make in Ryzom doesn't affect your chance to be a strong, trusted player. Any decision you do will not prevent you to gain the best stuff in game, as everything is player crafted. And you don't need the 'best' stuff to play well in Ryzom.

Some aspect of the game can need specific decisions, such as if you want to PvP. That's still a choice, you are not forced to PvP in any way, if you don't want.

Still, you are free to decide your gameplay. When you have decided one, and learnt what that would means in terms of your skills, you will play accordingly.

If you still think there is no freedom in Ryzom, then Ryzom is not the game for you.

 

 

paulscott

Sandbox is a very broad term.  But mostly sums up to develop the way you want without being prenerfed unless you want to be.

You can get the health upgrades just fine solely doing magic you don't need to do fighting at all, however being a mage you're going to value the harder work of getting a high level to the next a lot more than spending a twentith of the time leveling fighting.

Seriously most real wizzards spent at least a little time practicing with real weapons instead of just magic and it doesn't hurt to do so a little bit.