Question: do you think WOW has grinding, or are you just using a loose definition of the word GRIND. Someone's view of the word grind depends on the person. The way you put it ( All mmo's have a grind) sounds very loose indeed. FPS's now days have grinding to get rank or gear. I see it as time spent to reach a goal. WOW is very short grind, Silkroad is very long. Aion will not be like wow but not as long as you think. I know because that is what the Dev's have stated and what the playtesters have stated in all three CB's. You fail to see because you fail to research. So please do yourself a favour and read the post above yours. Have a nice day.
Nice post, the difference with WoW and L2 is the level grind really and that's pretty much what gets people's goats. Most I would say are ok with gear grind, PVP grind and dungeon grind, but not the endless leve4l grind and thankfully NCsoft has caught on.
That said WoW can be incredibly grindy, LotrO which is insanely casual and easy to gain levels in, has a lot of grind too, it's called faction grind. Eq2 is supposedly easy mode now as well, well excuse me but they also have title grind, faction grind, raids and what not.
The game of the moment does not have less grind, it just has cleverly disguised grind, or the kind of grind people aren't aversed to spending time in.
What the hell would an MMO be without any grind at all? What would you be trying to achieve? Seriously :P
What the hell would an MMO be without any grind at all? Fun
What would you be trying to achieve? Fun.... lol
Seriously though, I guess it's more of people having a problem with being forced to grind things they do not consider fun in order to have fun. I mean honestly if you thought something was fun I doubt you would call it a grind even if it was a grind because you wouldn't notice. The reason I like Skill based games over class based games is because you don't notice the grind. You go out to fight to get materials, gear or gold. While your fighting you get skill ups, so it's almost always multi tasking. Theres also the problem with things not really meaning anything. When you go fight something in most games your lucky to get anything that may of be of much value if anything so you have to keep killing and killing with the hopes you get that lucky drop. Games I prefer tend to add meaning to each kill. Such as you kill say a Cow for example lol. You can skin it and get the hide and loot meat off of it. It's logical loot from a cow. From a humanoid NPC you can expect loot like the gear there wearing, weapons, items they have and anything they may have on them that they looted from someone else. Having each kill mean something or each action mean something goes a long way to making it so the grind isn't noticable or atleast fun.
FFXI is a good example. When leather crafting if you killed a sheep you MAY get sheep skin....... this caused a simple task to take hours and hours sometimes and it didn't make any sense. You kill a sheep you get sheep skin. It's not like some of the sheep are walking around without skin ....... FFXI example again, you go and fight this big boss mob because he has this nifty shield. It's like he sometimes forgets to bring it with him when he goes out because you kill him and you get nada. Grinding like this makes for borring grind that makes no sense. These kinds of things not only create a borring grind but kill emersion in the world which can take a lot of fun out of it for many players. EQ2 has some ungodly grinds from quests to fame to money to gear to ect ect ect. Everything there is a grind as well.
Almost every MMO out there has grind. Some make it more fun than others but it's still there and eventualy you feel it. You can change tasks but there's a grind in almost every aspect. With linear games the grind is unescapable. You have to do that quest or that particular thing eventualy if you want to progress in the game. Leveling a new toon or different toon doesn't help you avoid this either because you have to do the same stuff all over lol. When tere is only one means of accomplishing a challenge or goal there will be grind unless they make it overly simple then it loses it's fun in a different way.
The only way to negate the grind effect is for linear games to start taking on some sandbox elements. I've never felt like I was grinding in a sanbox style game, but I always do when playing a linear game. If Aion takes a sandbox approach such as skills vs levels and has sensable loot from mobs ect then there may not be much noticable grind.
Then I take it you will not be playing Aion then. Good bye have a nice day.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Yep, I agree with the op.. I was watching a thing where the devs were showing off the game in one of their offices in the States. It is hardly an Asian grindfest style MMO.
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Aion will be great it's the only mmorpg since WoW that's actually trying to be polished before being released, i've never gotten those inbred wow haters, i played mmorpgs before wow came along and played wow beta 2 years before it was released and thought it was the most polished mmorpg just back then, 1 year before Aion is set to be released i saw a lot of it and was like "holy crap, it's been so many years since i had this feeling!".
Aion is the only mmorpg, "to be released", lately that seems worth a damn when it comes to quality and polishment.
I can't wait till it releases, But when it does, it will actually be more than just a pretender.
The haters can crawl back to their gloomy forums...
Aion will be great it's the only mmorpg since WoW that's actually trying to be polished before being released, i've never gotten those inbred wow haters, i played mmorpgs before wow came along and played wow beta 2 years before it was released and thought it was the most polished mmorpg just back then, 1 year before Aion is set to be released i saw a lot of it and was like "holy crap, it's been so many years since i had this feeling!".
Aion is the only mmorpg, "to be released", lately that seems worth a damn when it comes to quality and polishment.
I can't wait till it releases, But when it does, it will actually be more than just a pretender.
The haters can crawl back to their gloomy forums...
When I asked about the inevitable WoW comparisons, NCsoft’s Chris Hager was remarkably candid, admitting immediately that “Aion doesn’t introduce anything radically new. What I think it does is polish things from other MMOs.” He pointed out several examples to me of accepted MMO standards that Aion was taking one step further: The CryTek-powered graphics. The addition of a third NPC faction, the Balaur, to the raging Elyos/Asmodian war — what NCsoft is calling “PvPvE.” The addition of strategic flight. The addition of on-the-fly chained moves to the combat system. Again, he explained, “I don’t think it introduces anything dramatically new, but it definitely increases on what’s already been built.”
It’s definitely a new way of entering the oversaturated MMORPG market. Frequently, newcomers to the field will try and handle the unstoppable presence of WoW by asserting that their game is different enough that there’s room for both titles. Aion, on the other hand, seems to be taking the opposite route: the game is similar to WoW because WoW is a good game, and its millions of players will be able to quickly and comfortably slip right in to Aion — and once they’re there, they’ll find a number of vast improvements.
More than anything else, though, NCsoft is hoping that what gamers will appreciate — or, more accurately, what they won’t notice at all — is the thorough and uncompromising globalization efforts. Our hosts told us that they were keenly aware of the negative stigma attached to Korean MMOs by American gamers, and they have spared no effort in making sure Aion doesn’t fall prey to the usual low standards of localization.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
The point is wehter is the kind of grind you enjoy or the kind you don't, it's still grind. It's a timesink, what we want is a fun time sink, as opposed to a painful one. Taking the FFXI example, making a certain drop so rare it takes two weeks of camping to get it, maybe.... That's disheartening grind, but have a set grind, like kill 150 chickens and you get said drop or title or whatever then you have something you can keep track of and try to achieve.
I'd love to see an MMO with no grind, but if I try to think of ways to design a game that way I can't help but imagine at least one facet of the game to have some sort of grind, because some people really do enjoy that and I'm not sure it would be smart to leave them out.
That said Aion should have a level grind that is aceptable to most MMO players, and not end up being in the asian grind fest category. But to be honest, us fan people can say this all we want, but no one will know until we get to play ourselves. And even then MMOs evolve over time and I'm hoping this time around NCsoft is really paying attention to their community, both eastern and western.
Ya know, i had acomputer built FOR this game... but i got into AoC (terrible) and now I play WAR and have no interest in this game anymore..doesn't seem to offer nearly enough for me...so for those still awaiting this game.. I hope it is as great as you all hope, and I truely hope you enjoy all your gaming.. I will be off in the lands of Warhammer loving my stay.
Ya know, i had acomputer built FOR this game... but i got into AoC (terrible) and now I play WAR and have no interest in this game anymore..doesn't seem to offer nearly enough for me...so for those still awaiting this game.. I hope it is as great as you all hope, and I truely hope you enjoy all your gaming.. I will be off in the lands of Warhammer loving my stay.
M
Its alway good to see someone that found a game they love to play, have fun bashing heads in WAR Cya around someday mabe, G/L and have fun.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I just hate it when people come to these fourms and post stupid ass comments like "oh this game is just another WoW clone." or "Just another Korean Grindfest.". it makes me sad to see how stupid and ignorant some people are. if your going to say shit about a game do some research on it then come here and post. I will admit this game is a little bit like WoW, but then again what game isnt? it has been stated thousands of times before that Aion isnt really anything new its just taking stuff from other games and improving them, and throwing in a new feature in every now and then. like the stigma system, and the fact you can take stats from one set of armor and put them on another. This game isnt trying anything new instead its just playing it safe. this game looks like its going to be a nice Solid Game. So those who want to play a game that isnt going to fall apart on them i would look into this. And for those who say this is just another asian grinder LOL. this also has been stated that this game is going for a more weastern style game (questing and such). so plz All people who come to these fourms PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ do some research instead of just leaving stuipid ignorant comments. Sorry for the Rant everyone.....
Good post!
All games "copy" each other, its fact. And why? because its smart. Take the good bits from all the other MMO's and you will have a good MMO yourself. Improve all those good bits and your MMO will be great.
I just hate it when people come to these fourms and post stupid ass comments like "oh this game is just another WoW clone." or "Just another Korean Grindfest.". it makes me sad to see how stupid and ignorant some people are. if your going to say shit about a game do some research on it then come here and post. I will admit this game is a little bit like WoW, but then again what game isnt? it has been stated thousands of times before that Aion isnt really anything new its just taking stuff from other games and improving them, and throwing in a new feature in every now and then. like the stigma system, and the fact you can take stats from one set of armor and put them on another. This game isnt trying anything new instead its just playing it safe. this game looks like its going to be a nice Solid Game. So those who want to play a game that isnt going to fall apart on them i would look into this. And for those who say this is just another asian grinder LOL. this also has been stated that this game is going for a more weastern style game (questing and such). so plz All people who come to these fourms PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ do some research instead of just leaving stuipid ignorant comments. Sorry for the Rant everyone.....
Since it's not in open beta, we can't test it out for ourselves. Frankly, an article stating how Aion will have a "western gaming style" means shit. Why? All MMO's have a grind. Asian MMO's have it a lot more, but still. I fail to see how Aion will be different in that aspect.
Question: do you think WOW has grinding, or are you just using a loose definition of the word GRIND. Someone's view of the word grind depends on the person. The way you put it ( All mmo's have a grind) sounds very loose indeed. FPS's now days have grinding to get rank or gear. I see it as time spent to reach a goal. WOW is very short grind, Silkroad is very long. Aion will not be like wow but not as long as you think. I know because that is what the Dev's have stated and what the playtesters have stated in all three CB's. You fail to see because you fail to research. So please do yourself a favour and read the post above yours. Have a nice day.
Actually, the common definition of "grind" is spending time, doing the same thing over and over while NOT enjoying doing it, simply to get a certain reward (or to reach a certain level). It's like standing in a production line in a factory, hammering the same type of nail into the same type of board, all day long. Why? For the paycheck. I have yet to find an FPS to be a "grind", by the way.
Developer's statements are just that. Developer's statements. Hasn't time proven you anything? Look at AoC, WAR, and whatnot. Statements are one thing. Finding out for yourself is another. And playtester's opinions mean even less to me.
Lastly, I read the post above mine. I dared him for facts. I have yet to receive any .
Than again i only played WoW to level 20 and decided it was cartoony and carebear... anyways i trust NCsoft, i think they did a great job on Lineage 2. Aion should turn out pret good imo.
Dude other than Tabula Rasa NCsoft games are good and NCsoft is a great MMO company/distributer.
CoX,GW, L2 and even F2p DR and Exteel are polished games.
I just hate it when people come to these fourms and post stupid ass comments like "oh this game is just another WoW clone." or "Just another Korean Grindfest.". it makes me sad to see how stupid and ignorant some people are. if your going to say shit about a game do some research on it then come here and post. I will admit this game is a little bit like WoW, but then again what game isnt? it has been stated thousands of times before that Aion isnt really anything new its just taking stuff from other games and improving them, and throwing in a new feature in every now and then. like the stigma system, and the fact you can take stats from one set of armor and put them on another. This game isnt trying anything new instead its just playing it safe. this game looks like its going to be a nice Solid Game. So those who want to play a game that isnt going to fall apart on them i would look into this. And for those who say this is just another asian grinder LOL. this also has been stated that this game is going for a more weastern style game (questing and such). so plz All people who come to these fourms PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ PLZ do some research instead of just leaving stuipid ignorant comments. Sorry for the Rant everyone.....
Since it's not in open beta, we can't test it out for ourselves. Frankly, an article stating how Aion will have a "western gaming style" means shit. Why? All MMO's have a grind. Asian MMO's have it a lot more, but still. I fail to see how Aion will be different in that aspect.
Question: do you think WOW has grinding, or are you just using a loose definition of the word GRIND. Someone's view of the word grind depends on the person. The way you put it ( All mmo's have a grind) sounds very loose indeed. FPS's now days have grinding to get rank or gear. I see it as time spent to reach a goal. WOW is very short grind, Silkroad is very long. Aion will not be like wow but not as long as you think. I know because that is what the Dev's have stated and what the playtesters have stated in all three CB's. You fail to see because you fail to research. So please do yourself a favour and read the post above yours. Have a nice day.
Actually, the common definition of "grind" is spending time, doing the same thing over and over while NOT enjoying doing it, simply to get a certain reward (or to reach a certain level). It's like standing in a production line in a factory, hammering the same type of nail into the same type of board, all day long. Why? For the paycheck. I have yet to find an FPS to be a "grind", by the way.
Developer's statements are just that. Developer's statements. Hasn't time proven you anything? Look at AoC, WAR, and whatnot. Statements are one thing. Finding out for yourself is another. And playtester's opinions mean even less to me.
Lastly, I read the post above mine. I dared him for facts. I have yet to receive any .
Have a nice day.
Why do playtesters opinions mean little to you, Is it becaue you don't trust opinions real gamers and even less that dev's statments...wow i find that hard to believe. Should be the other way around. Please point to me a few games that do not have grind as you define it.....As you stated above all mmo's have grind and so will Aion. that is not in question but how much is. And this is where me and you disagree.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
With only two races aren't all people going to look alike with only minor differences? I looked at all the customization options and there's a good bit, but pretty limited considering there's only two races. It's something minor if the gameplay ends up being really good, but I don't enjoy looking like everyone else.
Edit Add: Are you able to adjust height, weight, arm size, and so on? I only saw the hair color and faces.
I have a question... With only two races aren't all people going to look alike with only minor differences? I looked at all the customization options and there's a good bit, but pretty limited considering there's only two races. It's something minor if the gameplay ends up being really good, but I don't enjoy looking like everyone else. Edit Add: Are you able to adjust height, weight, arm size, and so on? I only saw the hair color and faces.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Actually, the common definition of "grind" is spending time, doing the same thing over and over while NOT enjoying doing it, simply to get a certain reward (or to reach a certain level). It's like standing in a production line in a factory, hammering the same type of nail into the same type of board, all day long. Why? For the paycheck. I have yet to find an FPS to be a "grind", by the way. Developer's statements are just that. Developer's statements. Hasn't time proven you anything? Look at AoC, WAR, and whatnot. Statements are one thing. Finding out for yourself is another. And playtester's opinions mean even less to me. Lastly, I read the post above mine. I dared him for facts. I have yet to receive any . Have a nice day.
Why do playtesters opinions mean little to you, Is it becaue you don't trust opinions real gamers and even less that dev's statments...wow i find that hard to believe. Should be the other way around. Please point to me a few games that do not have grind as you define it.....As you stated above all mmo's have grind and so will Aion. that is not in question but how much is. And this is where me and you disagree.
Well, technically, WoW has THE best questing system out there. Err, it had, at some point. It still has a grind in it. What will Aion do? Even more quests? Is that the "western style" they keep referring to? Heh.
And frankly, playtester's opinions mean shit to me (again). Why? I'lle repeat myself. I've seen what testers said about AoC, and I've seen what they said about WAR. No matter how you put it, they are still opinions. I've learnt long ago that the only thing that matters is what I think, not what some 12 year old tester has to say (to give an example). If you don't see that, fine by me. Go and pre-order stuff .
EQ clone...only the truly uninformed call ANYTHING a wow clone. NC soft sucks horribly, i dont see why you would put any faith in them to deliver anything BUT a P.O.S.
I agree with you on the EQ thing because WoW was a War rip with an EQ spin.
However while NC soft isn't my fav company it is a decent company I've done several closed beta's for them. While I personaly don't enjoy many of the games they have a decent stability with there games versus many other companies. Now I am not saying there are perfect or great to me they are just decent definetly not in the "Sucks Horribly" category. Wild Tangent would be a good fit for that category lol, but not NCsoft.
EQ clone...only the truly uninformed call ANYTHING a wow clone. NC soft sucks horribly, i dont see why you would put any faith in them to deliver anything BUT a P.O.S.
Why did people put any faith in AoC? AO was one of the most bugged games to be released.
Why did people put any faith in WAR? Daoc was inbalanced and with a lot of optimization issues.
Simply put, times change, people give second chances.
Also, because this game looks awesome and plays really well.
I have a question... With only two races aren't all people going to look alike with only minor differences? I looked at all the customization options and there's a good bit, but pretty limited considering there's only two races. It's something minor if the gameplay ends up being really good, but I don't enjoy looking like everyone else. Edit Add: Are you able to adjust height, weight, arm size, and so on? I only saw the hair color and faces.
I have a question... With only two races aren't all people going to look alike with only minor differences? I looked at all the customization options and there's a good bit, but pretty limited considering there's only two races. It's something minor if the gameplay ends up being really good, but I don't enjoy looking like everyone else. Edit Add: Are you able to adjust height, weight, arm size, and so on? I only saw the hair color and faces.
Yay by far my favorite thing about Aion is it's in depth character creation. In fact if the rest of the game is as good as it's character creation I will never need another game. ^^
Now on the subject of races, yes there is only two and that may seem limiting however if you look at your traditional fantasy MMO all of the different races are just humans with pointy ears, a different skin tone, horns or furries ect.. Though we can't make furries yet, no cat, bull, rat, frog, or lizard people for you, you can make a dark elf if you want, a light elf, an erudite like in Eq2, sure at least something that comes close to it. You can make Bilbo Baggins if you want I mean whatever you can think of you can make it, except for furries.
Although this IS NCsoft I wouldn't put it past them to give us cat ears and bunny ears to wear eventually too... :P
Hey Mark posted this link on the source and I think many of you posting in this thread would be very interested in this article: The Escapist: Beautiful 21rst Century. It's all bout Aion, Warcraft and basically what we've been discussing here.
Comments
Nice post, the difference with WoW and L2 is the level grind really and that's pretty much what gets people's goats. Most I would say are ok with gear grind, PVP grind and dungeon grind, but not the endless leve4l grind and thankfully NCsoft has caught on.
That said WoW can be incredibly grindy, LotrO which is insanely casual and easy to gain levels in, has a lot of grind too, it's called faction grind. Eq2 is supposedly easy mode now as well, well excuse me but they also have title grind, faction grind, raids and what not.
The game of the moment does not have less grind, it just has cleverly disguised grind, or the kind of grind people aren't aversed to spending time in.
What the hell would an MMO be without any grind at all? What would you be trying to achieve? Seriously :P
What the hell would an MMO be without any grind at all? Fun
What would you be trying to achieve? Fun.... lol
Seriously though, I guess it's more of people having a problem with being forced to grind things they do not consider fun in order to have fun. I mean honestly if you thought something was fun I doubt you would call it a grind even if it was a grind because you wouldn't notice. The reason I like Skill based games over class based games is because you don't notice the grind. You go out to fight to get materials, gear or gold. While your fighting you get skill ups, so it's almost always multi tasking. Theres also the problem with things not really meaning anything. When you go fight something in most games your lucky to get anything that may of be of much value if anything so you have to keep killing and killing with the hopes you get that lucky drop. Games I prefer tend to add meaning to each kill. Such as you kill say a Cow for example lol. You can skin it and get the hide and loot meat off of it. It's logical loot from a cow. From a humanoid NPC you can expect loot like the gear there wearing, weapons, items they have and anything they may have on them that they looted from someone else. Having each kill mean something or each action mean something goes a long way to making it so the grind isn't noticable or atleast fun.
FFXI is a good example. When leather crafting if you killed a sheep you MAY get sheep skin....... this caused a simple task to take hours and hours sometimes and it didn't make any sense. You kill a sheep you get sheep skin. It's not like some of the sheep are walking around without skin ....... FFXI example again, you go and fight this big boss mob because he has this nifty shield. It's like he sometimes forgets to bring it with him when he goes out because you kill him and you get nada. Grinding like this makes for borring grind that makes no sense. These kinds of things not only create a borring grind but kill emersion in the world which can take a lot of fun out of it for many players. EQ2 has some ungodly grinds from quests to fame to money to gear to ect ect ect. Everything there is a grind as well.
Almost every MMO out there has grind. Some make it more fun than others but it's still there and eventualy you feel it. You can change tasks but there's a grind in almost every aspect. With linear games the grind is unescapable. You have to do that quest or that particular thing eventualy if you want to progress in the game. Leveling a new toon or different toon doesn't help you avoid this either because you have to do the same stuff all over lol. When tere is only one means of accomplishing a challenge or goal there will be grind unless they make it overly simple then it loses it's fun in a different way.
The only way to negate the grind effect is for linear games to start taking on some sandbox elements. I've never felt like I was grinding in a sanbox style game, but I always do when playing a linear game. If Aion takes a sandbox approach such as skills vs levels and has sensable loot from mobs ect then there may not be much noticable grind.
Then I take it you will not be playing Aion then. Good bye have a nice day.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I still hold out some hope for it. Many have said it has sandbox elements and isn't another grind game so I am willing to try it atleast.
Yep, I agree with the op.. I was watching a thing where the devs were showing off the game in one of their offices in the States. It is hardly an Asian grindfest style MMO.
Have a winner and don't go on a game over! Does your avatar make you powerful in real life? Check out the Mystical Enders gaming community. www.mysticalenders.com
Aion will be great it's the only mmorpg since WoW that's actually trying to be polished before being released, i've never gotten those inbred wow haters, i played mmorpgs before wow came along and played wow beta 2 years before it was released and thought it was the most polished mmorpg just back then, 1 year before Aion is set to be released i saw a lot of it and was like "holy crap, it's been so many years since i had this feeling!".
Aion is the only mmorpg, "to be released", lately that seems worth a damn when it comes to quality and polishment.
I can't wait till it releases, But when it does, it will actually be more than just a pretender.
The haters can crawl back to their gloomy forums...
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
Don't hate WOW or L2 , there very good games. Aion took the best of all those games and polished it up a bit, so everyone wins. Note this review: www.gamecyte.com/preview-hands-on-with-aion-tower-of-eternity
Quote:
When I asked about the inevitable WoW comparisons, NCsoft’s Chris Hager was remarkably candid, admitting immediately that “Aion doesn’t introduce anything radically new. What I think it does is polish things from other MMOs.” He pointed out several examples to me of accepted MMO standards that Aion was taking one step further: The CryTek-powered graphics. The addition of a third NPC faction, the Balaur, to the raging Elyos/Asmodian war — what NCsoft is calling “PvPvE.” The addition of strategic flight. The addition of on-the-fly chained moves to the combat system. Again, he explained, “I don’t think it introduces anything dramatically new, but it definitely increases on what’s already been built.”
It’s definitely a new way of entering the oversaturated MMORPG market. Frequently, newcomers to the field will try and handle the unstoppable presence of WoW by asserting that their game is different enough that there’s room for both titles. Aion, on the other hand, seems to be taking the opposite route: the game is similar to WoW because WoW is a good game, and its millions of players will be able to quickly and comfortably slip right in to Aion — and once they’re there, they’ll find a number of vast improvements.
More than anything else, though, NCsoft is hoping that what gamers will appreciate — or, more accurately, what they won’t notice at all — is the thorough and uncompromising globalization efforts. Our hosts told us that they were keenly aware of the negative stigma attached to Korean MMOs by American gamers, and they have spared no effort in making sure Aion doesn’t fall prey to the usual low standards of localization.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
The point is wehter is the kind of grind you enjoy or the kind you don't, it's still grind. It's a timesink, what we want is a fun time sink, as opposed to a painful one. Taking the FFXI example, making a certain drop so rare it takes two weeks of camping to get it, maybe.... That's disheartening grind, but have a set grind, like kill 150 chickens and you get said drop or title or whatever then you have something you can keep track of and try to achieve.
I'd love to see an MMO with no grind, but if I try to think of ways to design a game that way I can't help but imagine at least one facet of the game to have some sort of grind, because some people really do enjoy that and I'm not sure it would be smart to leave them out.
That said Aion should have a level grind that is aceptable to most MMO players, and not end up being in the asian grind fest category.
But to be honest, us fan people can say this all we want, but no one will know until we get to play ourselves. And even then MMOs evolve over time and I'm hoping this time around NCsoft is really paying attention to their community, both eastern and western.
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This game will be epic. No clone of any game. It will be amazing
Waiting for Aion!!
Ya know, i had acomputer built FOR this game... but i got into AoC (terrible) and now I play WAR and have no interest in this game anymore..doesn't seem to offer nearly enough for me...so for those still awaiting this game.. I hope it is as great as you all hope, and I truely hope you enjoy all your gaming.. I will be off in the lands of Warhammer loving my stay.
M
Its alway good to see someone that found a game they love to play, have fun bashing heads in WAR
Cya around someday mabe, G/L and have fun.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Good post!
All games "copy" each other, its fact. And why? because its smart. Take the good bits from all the other MMO's and you will have a good MMO yourself. Improve all those good bits and your MMO will be great.
Since it's not in open beta, we can't test it out for ourselves. Frankly, an article stating how Aion will have a "western gaming style" means shit. Why? All MMO's have a grind. Asian MMO's have it a lot more, but still. I fail to see how Aion will be different in that aspect.
Question: do you think WOW has grinding, or are you just using a loose definition of the word GRIND. Someone's view of the word grind depends on the person. The way you put it ( All mmo's have a grind) sounds very loose indeed. FPS's now days have grinding to get rank or gear. I see it as time spent to reach a goal. WOW is very short grind, Silkroad is very long. Aion will not be like wow but not as long as you think. I know because that is what the Dev's have stated and what the playtesters have stated in all three CB's. You fail to see because you fail to research. So please do yourself a favour and read the post above yours. Have a nice day.
Actually, the common definition of "grind" is spending time, doing the same thing over and over while NOT enjoying doing it, simply to get a certain reward (or to reach a certain level). It's like standing in a production line in a factory, hammering the same type of nail into the same type of board, all day long. Why? For the paycheck. I have yet to find an FPS to be a "grind", by the way.
Developer's statements are just that. Developer's statements. Hasn't time proven you anything? Look at AoC, WAR, and whatnot. Statements are one thing. Finding out for yourself is another. And playtester's opinions mean even less to me.
Lastly, I read the post above mine. I dared him for facts. I have yet to receive any
.
Have a nice day.
Dude other than Tabula Rasa NCsoft games are good and NCsoft is a great MMO company/distributer.
CoX,GW, L2 and even F2p DR and Exteel are polished games.
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
Since it's not in open beta, we can't test it out for ourselves. Frankly, an article stating how Aion will have a "western gaming style" means shit. Why? All MMO's have a grind. Asian MMO's have it a lot more, but still. I fail to see how Aion will be different in that aspect.
Question: do you think WOW has grinding, or are you just using a loose definition of the word GRIND. Someone's view of the word grind depends on the person. The way you put it ( All mmo's have a grind) sounds very loose indeed. FPS's now days have grinding to get rank or gear. I see it as time spent to reach a goal. WOW is very short grind, Silkroad is very long. Aion will not be like wow but not as long as you think. I know because that is what the Dev's have stated and what the playtesters have stated in all three CB's. You fail to see because you fail to research. So please do yourself a favour and read the post above yours. Have a nice day.
Actually, the common definition of "grind" is spending time, doing the same thing over and over while NOT enjoying doing it, simply to get a certain reward (or to reach a certain level). It's like standing in a production line in a factory, hammering the same type of nail into the same type of board, all day long. Why? For the paycheck. I have yet to find an FPS to be a "grind", by the way.
Developer's statements are just that. Developer's statements. Hasn't time proven you anything? Look at AoC, WAR, and whatnot. Statements are one thing. Finding out for yourself is another. And playtester's opinions mean even less to me.
Lastly, I read the post above mine. I dared him for facts. I have yet to receive any
.
Have a nice day.
Why do playtesters opinions mean little to you, Is it becaue you don't trust opinions real gamers and even less that dev's statments...wow i find that hard to believe. Should be the other way around. Please point to me a few games that do not have grind as you define it.....As you stated above all mmo's have grind and so will Aion. that is not in question but how much is. And this is where me and you disagree.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
OP, you're entire post explains exactly why a lot of people aren't planning to play this game.
They're playing it safe. Money-grabbing pansies.
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Self-confessed DF fanboy. Finally a real ****ing MMO.
I have a question...
With only two races aren't all people going to look alike with only minor differences? I looked at all the customization options and there's a good bit, but pretty limited considering there's only two races. It's something minor if the gameplay ends up being really good, but I don't enjoy looking like everyone else.
Edit Add: Are you able to adjust height, weight, arm size, and so on? I only saw the hair color and faces.
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A work in progress: (Update: 08/09/10)Easily find your favorite type of MMO
This site has a generic / demo CC in it www.gamerzines.com/downloading-MMOZine_7.html and yes you can change all those things.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Why do playtesters opinions mean little to you, Is it becaue you don't trust opinions real gamers and even less that dev's statments...wow i find that hard to believe. Should be the other way around. Please point to me a few games that do not have grind as you define it.....As you stated above all mmo's have grind and so will Aion. that is not in question but how much is. And this is where me and you disagree.
Well, technically, WoW has THE best questing system out there. Err, it had, at some point. It still has a grind in it. What will Aion do? Even more quests? Is that the "western style" they keep referring to? Heh.
And frankly, playtester's opinions mean shit to me (again). Why? I'lle repeat myself. I've seen what testers said about AoC, and I've seen what they said about WAR. No matter how you put it, they are still opinions. I've learnt long ago that the only thing that matters is what I think, not what some 12 year old tester has to say (to give an example). If you don't see that, fine by me. Go and pre-order stuff
.
EQ clone...only the truly uninformed call ANYTHING a wow clone.
NC soft sucks horribly, i dont see why you would put any faith in them to deliver anything BUT a P.O.S.
I agree with you on the EQ thing because WoW was a War rip with an EQ spin.
However while NC soft isn't my fav company it is a decent company I've done several closed beta's for them. While I personaly don't enjoy many of the games they have a decent stability with there games versus many other companies. Now I am not saying there are perfect or great to me they are just decent definetly not in the "Sucks Horribly" category. Wild Tangent would be a good fit for that category lol, but not NCsoft.
Why did people put any faith in AoC? AO was one of the most bugged games to be released.
Why did people put any faith in WAR? Daoc was inbalanced and with a lot of optimization issues.
Simply put, times change, people give second chances.
Also, because this game looks awesome and plays really well.
watch
If you look like someone else, it's because you both are trying to look like some celebrity.
Yay by far my favorite thing about Aion is it's in depth character creation. In fact if the rest of the game is as good as it's character creation I will never need another game. ^^
Now on the subject of races, yes there is only two and that may seem limiting however if you look at your traditional fantasy MMO all of the different races are just humans with pointy ears, a different skin tone, horns or furries ect.. Though we can't make furries yet, no cat, bull, rat, frog, or lizard people for you, you can make a dark elf if you want, a light elf, an erudite like in Eq2, sure at least something that comes close to it. You can make Bilbo Baggins if you want I mean whatever you can think of you can make it, except for furries.
Although this IS NCsoft I wouldn't put it past them to give us cat ears and bunny ears to wear eventually too... :P
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Very nice character creation video. Thanks for the info and links guys.
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A work in progress: (Update: 08/09/10)Easily find your favorite type of MMO
Hey Mark posted this link on the source and I think many of you posting in this thread would be very interested in this article: The Escapist: Beautiful 21rst Century. It's all bout Aion, Warcraft and basically what we've been discussing here.
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