There is a mistake here, Im not saying Guild Wars looks better than Lotro, as I said it is an older game made to run in weaker machines.
What I said is, Guild Wars does not suffer from the inconsistencies Lotro suffers (characters x landscapes).
Yes, I disagree that Guild Wars looks horrible (liking or disliking the game).
About AA or no AA in the Lotro screenshot, it doesnt matter, my point is not based on texture resolution or alias, I got random screenshots of these games... and again, it is not a permanent point as a mmo can always improve.
Yeah, it's so nice to see someone arguing with using a totally low-res, no-AA screenshot of LOTRO trying to prove his "point". I own both LOTRO and GW. Can play both on full quality settings. They're not even in close leagues to each other. Sorry Umbral, GW looks crap compared to LOTRO. DB
Hrmmm I"m astounded that someone would put Guildwars Avatars above LOTRO -- I mean come on -- every class has 1 avatar. So I think that was a HUGE exageration. As far as realism goes -- I've yet to see an MMO that looks realistic -- period. End that discussion right there, realism is a red herring. Now this was about AoC vs LOTRO but degraded to a percentage of gamers who didn't like the avatars in LOTRO and some folks who decided to call upon *proper art critique* to decide they were bad. In no way do I feel my avatars don't fit the environment -- that's never been an issue for me personally. And save the *you have bad taste* response because the whole *my opinion is based on the way art ought to look* garbage is dragging this thread in to the toilet. My immediate reaction is people didn't take enough time at character creation to improve on their avatars -- but again it appears to be coming down to personal opinion. I've yet to see a single screen shot from AoC that appeals to me, don't even mention Guild wars with graphics it was hardly a graphical masterpiece in comparison to AoC, WAR, Vanguard and LOTRO. I found DDO to be far worse than Guild wars even -- DDO has to be the worst looking MMO in existance atm. So again that comes back to personal opinion. One point to take away from all this is if you go online you'll get a variety of opinions on what *looks* good -- we could start a thread on music in MMO's and get a thread as equally diverse in it's opinion base!! Music, visual art, etc are very very subjective mediums -- no one's opinion is the opinion by which all other opinions should be measured. Everybody plays games that they feel immersed in to and enjoy what they see. I will concede however that the very title of the thread and wording of the OP was inciteful and earned some of the responses -- my only point is that there is great variety out there and there has been a major improvement recently with over all appearance in MMO's. My unbias'd opinion is that WAR, AoC, Vanguard and LOTRO are all in the same league -- my preference is LOTRO followed closely by WAR and Vanguard. AoC not so much. Cheers!
So, let me get this straight...you would rather a female looked like this...
Yes I would --- amazing how different people have different opinions.
Umbral -- I didn't misunderstand your posts -- thanks for rexplaining the exact same thing. I know exactly what you're referring to and guess what!! Miracuously we don't come to the same conclusions. Stop declaring subjective interpretaions as fact and all will be well.
Your LOTRO screenshots as pointed out are on low res and yes don't look good. AoC -- I don't like the look sorry. Guild wars -- I don't like the look sorry.
Artistically I respect and understand what you're saying -- I even told you it was worded poorly but I got what you meant! However, we disagree on your conclusions!!
There are many many people who feel LOTRO has the best graphics in MMO's atm -- and there are many who disagree. No one is *right* and no one is *wrong* no matter how much we embellish our posts.
Yes I would --- amazing how different people have different opinions. Umbral -- I didn't misunderstand your posts -- thanks for rexplaining the exact same thing. I know exactly what you're referring to and guess what!! Miracuously we don't come to the same conclusions. Stop declaring subjective interpretaions as fact and all will be well. Your LOTRO screenshots as pointed out are on low res and yes don't look good. AoC -- I don't like the look sorry. Guild wars -- I don't like the look sorry. Artistically I respect and understand what you're saying -- I even told you it was worded poorly but I got what you meant! However, we disagree on your conclusions!! There are many many people who feel LOTRO has the best graphics in MMO's atm -- and there are many who disagree. No one is *right* and no one is *wrong* no matter how much we embellish our posts.
Are you speaking of my screenshots?
They were captured at 1920x1200 with AA and full post processing. So, why would you state otherwise?
I personally believe your answers deal with disagreeing to disagree, as I cannot comprehend how you could possibly feel the claymation like visuals of LOTRO are better than the multifaceted shaded AoC shots or the texture detailed GW screens.
Now, if you were to state that you do not like realistic visuals in your games, then THAT would make sense. I did see your remark of liking WAR's visuals better than AoC or GW also. This leads me to believe that the realistic nature of todays graphics are bothersome to your eye, and as such, you could not possibly see anything good within a character model that attempts to follow proper form and function.
WoW would also fit into this.
I think thanks to todays technology, I have moved beyond a cartoony style, and prefer a a more advanced visual style. I will stick with realistic in that respect.
Yes I would --- amazing how different people have different opinions. Umbral -- I didn't misunderstand your posts -- thanks for rexplaining the exact same thing. I know exactly what you're referring to and guess what!! Miracuously we don't come to the same conclusions. Stop declaring subjective interpretaions as fact and all will be well. Taste is subjetive, discrepancies in the concept and art style is a rational statement. You made 2 mistakes. 1-You are too concerned with an absolute truth where no argumment has value 2-You think this is a matter of like and dislike, the only argument you have is what you like and what you hate, Im not talking about taste here, characters in Lotro are not at the same level of Lotro´s landscapes, you only need rational perception to realize that, it doesnt matter if you like it or not. Reality and perception can be relative, of course, but you already showed you have no rational argument (beside what you like) to express why in your eyes Lotro has a coese visual between landscapes and characters. Your LOTRO screenshots as pointed out are on low res and yes don't look good. AoC -- I don't like the look sorry. Guild wars -- I don't like the look sorry. I understand it is hard for you to forget the argument about what you like and what you dont like, this is pretty comon these days. Inconscistences in art style is a rational matter, it is not limited to taste, this is a requirement for everyone that studied or work with cinema, art expression etc... sure, it is not a requirement for gamers, but we can talk about it here. When someone say, I loathe how Lotro looks or I love how Lotro looks (exacly what you are doing) this person is expressing only personal taste, this is not the case.
Artistically I respect and understand what you're saying -- I even told you it was worded poorly but I got what you meant! However, we disagree on your conclusions!! No, you are bounded to the common "like or dislike" perspective, the only reason why you think I worded it poorly is because... surprise... you are not able to understand the difference between a rational argument about esthetical/expression/artstyle and a opinion based only on taste. This is why, after so many arguments about the inconsistencies in Lotro´s visuals you were unable to express any argument beside the "but I like it". Your only argument against is "I disagree"... dont you think a internet Forum would be pretty boring if everyone only used two bases of discussions "I agree/disagree", "I like/dislike"? There are many many people who feel LOTRO has the best graphics in MMO's atm -- and there are many who disagree. No one is *right* and no one is *wrong* no matter how much we embellish our posts. I know you will disagree, but this is not the point as it will be boring to go on with this... anyway, you said you like how Warhammer looks, right? Get your Warhammer character and explore a couple of locations, then join a couple of warbands and pay atention to all characters and landscapes... then do the same in Lotro, then try to be rational about and ask yourself, wich one looks and feels more coese between landscapes, buildings and characters...
So, let me get this straight...you would rather a female looked like this... LOTRO 1 LOTRO 2 Vanguard Than this? AoC 1 AoC 2 GW Hmmm...taste is relative, and it makes me wonder how you visualize these images...
Some of your screenshots are not working, but the ones that are working shows some of the clear issues among Lotro´s characters.
Art, modeling and posture.
Posture would be the easier issue to fix, if Turbine fix it, part of the goofy aspect would be removed from characters... Vanguard has a similar issue (I cant tell by your screenshot, but I played both games for a while).
Of course they need to improve the overall art to be on par with landscapes and Tolkien´s lore...
Well, about Guild Wars, it is impressive how a game that was released in April 2005 and run in ridiculous weak PCs still look so good.
Some examples of art inspired by Tolkien´s work ...sure a 3d model would never be exacly like a concept but it is easy to realize, characters in Lotro could be more expressive.
This is a small example of Alan Lee´s art, it is clear that a couple of landscapes in Lotro are inspired in his art work... but the goofy ingame characters, well, who knows what or who inspired Turbine...
Yes I would --- amazing how different people have different opinions. Umbral -- I didn't misunderstand your posts -- thanks for rexplaining the exact same thing. I know exactly what you're referring to and guess what!! Miracuously we don't come to the same conclusions. Stop declaring subjective interpretaions as fact and all will be well. Your LOTRO screenshots as pointed out are on low res and yes don't look good. AoC -- I don't like the look sorry. Guild wars -- I don't like the look sorry. Artistically I respect and understand what you're saying -- I even told you it was worded poorly but I got what you meant! However, we disagree on your conclusions!! There are many many people who feel LOTRO has the best graphics in MMO's atm -- and there are many who disagree. No one is *right* and no one is *wrong* no matter how much we embellish our posts.
Unfortunately, those who just come to these boards to bash will never both read and comprehend your last paragraph - like the one not even noticing that you are referring to the low-res, non-AA screenshots of LOTRO posted by Umbral
There is nothing more subjective than visuals. I could even believe that someone likes GW's graphics better, but this should have come from someone with at least a HINT of neutrality and credibility on these boards (again, NOT talking about Umbral
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
I played for about a month or so after initial release then stopped. Cant recall why exactly but I am sure my addiction to a certin other game (hint...me an 10 million others) had something to do with it. Anyway, this game may be the best kept secret in MMO's. It has, by far the best graphics (I have played AoC and LoTR is far better). It uses DirectX 10 (only current MMO?) and is just plain fun. I hope more people will give it a try. Dont expect it to compete membership wise with above un-named game...but would like for it to stay around for a long time. I think espec ially those that think AoC is best graphically should give it a shot. They are in for a surprise.
This just in: Vanilla is the best flavour......... not a well-known fact.
Yet another pointless subjective thread with opinion posing as fact.
[Yawn]
P.S. I found the LoTRO graphics to be much like the game as a whole... pretty good, fairly bland, mostly inoffensive, but with nothing particularly to recommend it.
Hrmmm I"m astounded that someone would put Guildwars Avatars above LOTRO -- I mean come on -- every class has 1 avatar. So I think that was a HUGE exageration. As far as realism goes -- I've yet to see an MMO that looks realistic -- period. End that discussion right there, realism is a red herring. Now this was about AoC vs LOTRO but degraded to a percentage of gamers who didn't like the avatars in LOTRO and some folks who decided to call upon *proper art critique* to decide they were bad. In no way do I feel my avatars don't fit the environment -- that's never been an issue for me personally. And save the *you have bad taste* response because the whole *my opinion is based on the way art ought to look* garbage is dragging this thread in to the toilet. My immediate reaction is people didn't take enough time at character creation to improve on their avatars -- but again it appears to be coming down to personal opinion. I've yet to see a single screen shot from AoC that appeals to me, don't even mention Guild wars with graphics it was hardly a graphical masterpiece in comparison to AoC, WAR, Vanguard and LOTRO. I found DDO to be far worse than Guild wars even -- DDO has to be the worst looking MMO in existance atm. So again that comes back to personal opinion. One point to take away from all this is if you go online you'll get a variety of opinions on what *looks* good -- we could start a thread on music in MMO's and get a thread as equally diverse in it's opinion base!! Music, visual art, etc are very very subjective mediums -- no one's opinion is the opinion by which all other opinions should be measured. Everybody plays games that they feel immersed in to and enjoy what they see. I will concede however that the very title of the thread and wording of the OP was inciteful and earned some of the responses -- my only point is that there is great variety out there and there has been a major improvement recently with over all appearance in MMO's. My unbias'd opinion is that WAR, AoC, Vanguard and LOTRO are all in the same league -- my preference is LOTRO followed closely by WAR and Vanguard. AoC not so much. Cheers!
So, let me get this straight...you would rather a female looked like this...
Yeah I know taste differs but AoC with a 280 GTX is the most stunning thing I ever seen except Crysis maybe.
Lotro could use some work of the character and npc models and I base that on the fact that they don't really seem to fit in, they look like you photoshoped them in...
The backgrounds of LOTRO are impressing though, that's the problem for me, if all looked the same as the humans then it wouldnt be a problem. I am a Tolkien fan myselfand I just think it looks like they cut corners a bit there.
Beuty is off course in the eye of the beholder but do take a look on the screens...
I am not a fan of AOC but I think AOC has better graphics than LOTRO or GW and WARHAMMER would have good graphics if it was put inot a time machine and sent back to 2000.
I am not a fan of AOC but I think AOC has better graphics than LOTRO or GW and WARHAMMER would have good graphics if it was put inot a time machine and sent back to 2000.
You never seen a game from 2000, I can hear that. WAR graphics is just a bit better than Wows which would take us to 2005 or 2006. It is a bit dated 2008 that is true but it is not in the class with Linage or something from 2000, that is sure as h*ll.
But WAR was long in development and that usually makes it look a bit old. I don't really have any problem with the graphics but if the game is gonna last as long as Wow they will have to upgrade it a bit. Also you kinda have to choose between massive and really good graphics, in a massive PvP game like WAR it is very hard to keep lagg away if you have too good textures.
Also Mythic chose to make so it can run on older computers, and while it is possible to make a good looking games like Guildwars for low comps they also cut corners, that's why you cant jump there for one thing.
LOTRO has good landscape graphics. Most of the models are ugly though.
Best graphics probably goes to AOC, even though the game is a disaster in other areas. Landscapes look great and avatars are awesome, especially with shader 3.0 and hi res with all the lighting, shadow effects, etc.
Argueing graphics though is pointless though, as it is a matter of taste.
loke666, AOC looks great also on ATI 4870 with everything on max. But it fails in other aspects. As for LOTRO models, they are not the best, but also far from being ugly. Is the art from Hildebrant brothers so bad compared to Alan Lee's or Ted Nasmith's works? I admit I do prefer Ted Nasmith more then Alan Lee, although I like works from all of them.
We are talking graphics here, not other aspects. If you want to discuss that make another thread.
Now... don't get me wrong, many games have loading screens. AoC just has quite a number more than most.
Somehow... Lotro manages this:
Without as many loading screens.
If my memory Serves me correctly, going from town, to the fields, to the next area... was fairly seamless.
But at the cost... as most people point out... of:
of character looks.
Better? What is the standard of better? At the moment, this is topping subscriptions:
So... what was the point of this? Opinions?
Sure fling them around, facts...
There once was a time when slavery was a fact, and most of the world thought it was ok.
Shows that sometimes, most of the world can be wrong.
At this point in time, I think our ability to mesh good graphics with good gameplay is being tested, and I don't believe we will be able to achieve a great game WITH great graphics till a massive break-through in technology. Network Speed, and system Performance are still not where they need to be.
im lotro player but i think lineage 2 have the best graphic out there , just 1 map and u can go everywhere with no instances and game world is very very large compare to other western mmos
But I rly hope, you like real females more. These are just games he he. BTW Umbral, Hobbits fit excellent in Shire area, Lossoth in Forochel ... Dwarfs in Thorin's Hall ... As for art, even AOC looks far from Frank Frazetta's art. Maybe Turbine used art from brothers Greg and Tim Hildebrant for creating models in LOTRO. Hildebrant
I also enjoy the art of Greg and Tim Hildebrant Mentor 73. I understand why you said Turbine is inspired by them in the characters art, their art is less dramatic than Alan Lee´s work, but it still is expressive, even with this base, I still belive Turbine can improve characters.
Different postures and more expressive eyes/faces would make a very positive difference, some changes in proportions and armors aswell, specially in human models.
About armors, clothes are not bad, but most of heavy armors are a bit off...
Age of Conan looks far from Frank Frazetta´s art, but I dont think this is an issue as everything looks coese in a mix between ancient history and fantasy, of course, a lot of people just dont like the low fantasy/realistic/down to Earth setting.
I dont think realism is the point in every game as Warhammer has a very coese and impressive art style based on caricatures,miniatures and fantasy illustrations.
I used Alan Lee´s as an example because there are a couple of locations in Lotro that are very similar to his art and Im sure Turbine was inspired by him in the landscape/locations area.
*sigh* ok glutton for punnishment that I am -- let's go back to square one and I"ll be a bit more detailed since I've been purposely vague:
My initial issue was that I felt stating LOTRO was FAR worse graphically than Guildwars was an exageration -- this was attempted to be explained by an issue with the Avatars vs the Landscape. There was never a discussion about the terrible use of colours in Guildwar (from my perspective) that made the characters look as if a child had chose the colours to colour them -- and also from a landscape perspective the whole game felt 2 dimensional to me when I played it. The world looked *flat* to me. Therefore I was shocked by that statement.
My initial responses summed up as best as I can was that I actually stated yes there is a difference in style between the avatars in LOTRO and the landscape but I still disagreed. I should have finished by stating that I still disagreed that LOTRO was FAR worse graphically than Guild Wars. I don't feel that original statement was ever supported. But obviously somehow the argument turned to AoC graphics WAR graphics and to my total incompetence in analising artwork based on some posts on a forum which totally sums up my intellectual abilities -- apparently.
Are there issues with LOTRO avatars? I've always felt the elf posture was a bit funky -- I think hobbits are pretty good over all, humans too, dwarves seem to wobble etc. So yes -- I don't think they are beyond critique. However to make an over all statement just because of the avatars that Guild Wars is far superior is still astonishing to me and is definately an exageration. Both games could be criticized heavily from an artistic perspective. The avatars greatly improve at higher resolutions imho which is why I objected to the low res example but the basic posture issues are definately there. Worse in the female models than the male models actually.
The accusation of me clinging to absolute truth indicates to me that my posts were not fully read -- I was the one stating that this whole conversation was subjective and that different opinions should be respected. My RL philosphies do not cling to an absolute truth -- not one that could be understood in this lifetime at least and that comment was totally out of context in a minor dispute over a statement about graphics.
The whole thing turned absolutely rediculous Umbral so I bow out of this whole thing here. You can form all of the personal views about me, my ability to analise/appreciate art, my personal philosophies, my basic incompetence that you want to -- but they have nothing to do with whether or not Guild Wars is a FAR better game than LOTRO graphically. That should be evaluated on all the graphics as a whole not just issues with avatars.
*sigh* ok glutton for punnishment that I am... My initial issue was that I felt stating LOTRO was FAR worse graphically than Guildwars was an exageration... my intellectual abilities -- apparently... Are there issues with LOTRO avatars? The whole thing turned absolutely rediculous Umbral so I bow out of this whole thing here. You can form all of the personal views about me, my ability to analise/appreciate art, my personal philosophies, my basic incompetence that you want to...
You are not punishing anyone here musicman, sorry.
I never said Lotro was far worse graphically than GuildWars in an overall aspect.
Your intellectual abilities are not in question, only arguments and counter arguments expressed here.
Yes, if you compare with some pretty nice landscapes we find in lotro, some expressive art related to Tolkien´s work and the standart for avatars these days, there are a couple of issues.
I have no personal views about you, only about the point of view and arguments expressed here, this is not a personal discussion for me, but unfortunately it is for you, so lets finish it here.
Comments
Don't agree with Umbral. Next time you post screenshots from LOTRO, try a little better.
http://www.ifoto.si/index.php?page=img&id=1254&size=3
http://www.ifoto.si/index.php?page=img&id=1253&size=3
http://www.ifoto.si/index.php?page=img&id=1252&size=3
It's not the best, but is not bad either.
There is a mistake here, Im not saying Guild Wars looks better than Lotro, as I said it is an older game made to run in weaker machines.
What I said is, Guild Wars does not suffer from the inconsistencies Lotro suffers (characters x landscapes).
Yes, I disagree that Guild Wars looks horrible (liking or disliking the game).
About AA or no AA in the Lotro screenshot, it doesnt matter, my point is not based on texture resolution or alias, I got random screenshots of these games... and again, it is not a permanent point as a mmo can always improve.
...
I would disagree...
GW
Cutscene in game engine
Note facial details, something LOTRO totally throws out the window
Eye of the North added VERY open landscapes, 90% of this image's landscape is accesible
As always, Gorgeous females abound, that LOTRO still forgets about
LOTRO
Females look like a barbie doll (no details)
Having a seat (lol)
All characters facial details are just plastic
But, the one thing LOTRO always get right?
Landscapes
All of the LOTRO images are full quality and AA on...
I see a huge quality discrepency between GW and LOTRO. In my opinion...GW is MUCH better.
So, let me get this straight...you would rather a female looked like this...
LOTRO 1
LOTRO 2
Vanguard
Than this?
AoC 1
AoC 2
GW
Hmmm...taste is relative, and it makes me wonder how you visualize these images...
Yes I would --- amazing how different people have different opinions.
Umbral -- I didn't misunderstand your posts -- thanks for rexplaining the exact same thing. I know exactly what you're referring to and guess what!! Miracuously we don't come to the same conclusions. Stop declaring subjective interpretaions as fact and all will be well.
Your LOTRO screenshots as pointed out are on low res and yes don't look good. AoC -- I don't like the look sorry. Guild wars -- I don't like the look sorry.
Artistically I respect and understand what you're saying -- I even told you it was worded poorly but I got what you meant! However, we disagree on your conclusions!!
There are many many people who feel LOTRO has the best graphics in MMO's atm -- and there are many who disagree. No one is *right* and no one is *wrong* no matter how much we embellish our posts.
Are you speaking of my screenshots?
They were captured at 1920x1200 with AA and full post processing. So, why would you state otherwise?
I personally believe your answers deal with disagreeing to disagree, as I cannot comprehend how you could possibly feel the claymation like visuals of LOTRO are better than the multifaceted shaded AoC shots or the texture detailed GW screens.
Now, if you were to state that you do not like realistic visuals in your games, then THAT would make sense. I did see your remark of liking WAR's visuals better than AoC or GW also. This leads me to believe that the realistic nature of todays graphics are bothersome to your eye, and as such, you could not possibly see anything good within a character model that attempts to follow proper form and function.
WoW would also fit into this.
I think thanks to todays technology, I have moved beyond a cartoony style, and prefer a a more advanced visual style. I will stick with realistic in that respect.
Thanks for your input.
Some of your screenshots are not working, but the ones that are working shows some of the clear issues among Lotro´s characters.
Art, modeling and posture.
Posture would be the easier issue to fix, if Turbine fix it, part of the goofy aspect would be removed from characters... Vanguard has a similar issue (I cant tell by your screenshot, but I played both games for a while).
Of course they need to improve the overall art to be on par with landscapes and Tolkien´s lore...
Well, about Guild Wars, it is impressive how a game that was released in April 2005 and run in ridiculous weak PCs still look so good.
Some examples of art inspired by Tolkien´s work ...sure a 3d model would never be exacly like a concept but it is easy to realize, characters in Lotro could be more expressive.
This is a small example of Alan Lee´s art, it is clear that a couple of landscapes in Lotro are inspired in his art work... but the goofy ingame characters, well, who knows what or who inspired Turbine...
Unfortunately, those who just come to these boards to bash will never both read and comprehend your last paragraph - like the one not even noticing that you are referring to the low-res, non-AA screenshots of LOTRO posted by Umbral
There is nothing more subjective than visuals. I could even believe that someone likes GW's graphics better, but this should have come from someone with at least a HINT of neutrality and credibility on these boards (again, NOT talking about Umbral
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
This just in: Vanilla is the best flavour......... not a well-known fact.
Yet another pointless subjective thread with opinion posing as fact.
[Yawn]
P.S. I found the LoTRO graphics to be much like the game as a whole... pretty good, fairly bland, mostly inoffensive, but with nothing particularly to recommend it.
So, let me get this straight...you would rather a female looked like this...
LOTRO 1
LOTRO 2
Vanguard
Than this?
AoC 1
AoC 2
GW
Hmmm...taste is relative, and it makes me wonder how you visualize these images...
But I rly hope, you like real females more. These are just games he he.
BTW Umbral, Hobbits fit excellent in Shire area, Lossoth in Forochel ... Dwarfs in Thorin's Hall ...
As for art, even AOC looks far from Frank Frazetta's art.
Maybe Turbine used art from brothers Greg and Tim Hildebrant for creating models in LOTRO.
Hildebrant
You really don't think these shots look good?
i72.photobucket.com/albums/i199/Judas_photos/Rhianwen_picture069.png
i72.photobucket.com/albums/i199/Judas_photos/Rhianwen_picture065.png
i72.photobucket.com/albums/i199/Judas_photos/Rhianwen_picture061.png
Yeah I know taste differs but AoC with a 280 GTX is the most stunning thing I ever seen except Crysis maybe.
Lotro could use some work of the character and npc models and I base that on the fact that they don't really seem to fit in, they look like you photoshoped them in...
The backgrounds of LOTRO are impressing though, that's the problem for me, if all looked the same as the humans then it wouldnt be a problem. I am a Tolkien fan myselfand I just think it looks like they cut corners a bit there.
Beuty is off course in the eye of the beholder but do take a look on the screens...
I am not a fan of AOC but I think AOC has better graphics than LOTRO or GW and WARHAMMER would have good graphics if it was put inot a time machine and sent back to 2000.
You never seen a game from 2000, I can hear that. WAR graphics is just a bit better than Wows which would take us to 2005 or 2006. It is a bit dated 2008 that is true but it is not in the class with Linage or something from 2000, that is sure as h*ll.
But WAR was long in development and that usually makes it look a bit old. I don't really have any problem with the graphics but if the game is gonna last as long as Wow they will have to upgrade it a bit. Also you kinda have to choose between massive and really good graphics, in a massive PvP game like WAR it is very hard to keep lagg away if you have too good textures.
Also Mythic chose to make so it can run on older computers, and while it is possible to make a good looking games like Guildwars for low comps they also cut corners, that's why you cant jump there for one thing.
LOTRO has good landscape graphics. Most of the models are ugly though.
Best graphics probably goes to AOC, even though the game is a disaster in other areas. Landscapes look great and avatars are awesome, especially with shader 3.0 and hi res with all the lighting, shadow effects, etc.
Argueing graphics though is pointless though, as it is a matter of taste.
loke666, AOC looks great also on ATI 4870 with everything on max. But it fails in other aspects.
As for LOTRO models, they are not the best, but also far from being ugly.
Is the art from Hildebrant brothers so bad compared to Alan Lee's or Ted Nasmith's works?
I admit I do prefer Ted Nasmith more then Alan Lee, although I like works from all of them.
We are talking graphics here, not other aspects. If you want to discuss that make another thread.
No need to open more. There are a lot of topics how AOC fails in many aspects other then graphics.
Each excel in their own areas,
AoC excels, graphically in many areas.
However, that is mainly due to this:
Now... don't get me wrong, many games have loading screens. AoC just has quite a number more than most.
Somehow... Lotro manages this:
Without as many loading screens.
If my memory Serves me correctly, going from town, to the fields, to the next area... was fairly seamless.
But at the cost... as most people point out... of:
of character looks.
Better? What is the standard of better? At the moment, this is topping subscriptions:
So... what was the point of this? Opinions?
Sure fling them around, facts...
There once was a time when slavery was a fact, and most of the world thought it was ok.
Shows that sometimes, most of the world can be wrong.
At this point in time, I think our ability to mesh good graphics with good gameplay is being tested, and I don't believe we will be able to achieve a great game WITH great graphics till a massive break-through in technology. Network Speed, and system Performance are still not where they need to be.
Perhaps soon.
I'm playing this right now, it's the my favorite.
This is how it looks on login screen.
The posture is an issue to me there.
Look here (AoC login Male)
And here (AoC female)
The "realistic" quality is a big difference. AoC has it in spades. The characters in LOTRO are more "stylized" and I just prefer more realism.
But, like someone else said, no accounting for taste, as WoW and their dated graphics are number 1...and the new #2 is WAR...more dated graphics...
Ah well
here my dx9 jpg
im lotro player but i think lineage 2 have the best graphic out there , just 1 map and u can go everywhere with no instances and game world is very very large compare to other western mmos
ps.sry for my english
I also enjoy the art of Greg and Tim Hildebrant Mentor 73. I understand why you said Turbine is inspired by them in the characters art, their art is less dramatic than Alan Lee´s work, but it still is expressive, even with this base, I still belive Turbine can improve characters.
Different postures and more expressive eyes/faces would make a very positive difference, some changes in proportions and armors aswell, specially in human models.
About armors, clothes are not bad, but most of heavy armors are a bit off...
Age of Conan looks far from Frank Frazetta´s art, but I dont think this is an issue as everything looks coese in a mix between ancient history and fantasy, of course, a lot of people just dont like the low fantasy/realistic/down to Earth setting.
I dont think realism is the point in every game as Warhammer has a very coese and impressive art style based on caricatures,miniatures and fantasy illustrations.
I used Alan Lee´s as an example because there are a couple of locations in Lotro that are very similar to his art and Im sure Turbine was inspired by him in the landscape/locations area.
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*sigh* ok glutton for punnishment that I am -- let's go back to square one and I"ll be a bit more detailed since I've been purposely vague:
My initial issue was that I felt stating LOTRO was FAR worse graphically than Guildwars was an exageration -- this was attempted to be explained by an issue with the Avatars vs the Landscape. There was never a discussion about the terrible use of colours in Guildwar (from my perspective) that made the characters look as if a child had chose the colours to colour them -- and also from a landscape perspective the whole game felt 2 dimensional to me when I played it. The world looked *flat* to me. Therefore I was shocked by that statement.
My initial responses summed up as best as I can was that I actually stated yes there is a difference in style between the avatars in LOTRO and the landscape but I still disagreed. I should have finished by stating that I still disagreed that LOTRO was FAR worse graphically than Guild Wars. I don't feel that original statement was ever supported. But obviously somehow the argument turned to AoC graphics WAR graphics and to my total incompetence in analising artwork based on some posts on a forum which totally sums up my intellectual abilities -- apparently.
Are there issues with LOTRO avatars? I've always felt the elf posture was a bit funky -- I think hobbits are pretty good over all, humans too, dwarves seem to wobble etc. So yes -- I don't think they are beyond critique. However to make an over all statement just because of the avatars that Guild Wars is far superior is still astonishing to me and is definately an exageration. Both games could be criticized heavily from an artistic perspective. The avatars greatly improve at higher resolutions imho which is why I objected to the low res example but the basic posture issues are definately there. Worse in the female models than the male models actually.
The accusation of me clinging to absolute truth indicates to me that my posts were not fully read -- I was the one stating that this whole conversation was subjective and that different opinions should be respected. My RL philosphies do not cling to an absolute truth -- not one that could be understood in this lifetime at least and that comment was totally out of context in a minor dispute over a statement about graphics.
The whole thing turned absolutely rediculous Umbral so I bow out of this whole thing here. You can form all of the personal views about me, my ability to analise/appreciate art, my personal philosophies, my basic incompetence that you want to -- but they have nothing to do with whether or not Guild Wars is a FAR better game than LOTRO graphically. That should be evaluated on all the graphics as a whole not just issues with avatars.
You are not punishing anyone here musicman, sorry.
I never said Lotro was far worse graphically than GuildWars in an overall aspect.
Your intellectual abilities are not in question, only arguments and counter arguments expressed here.
Yes, if you compare with some pretty nice landscapes we find in lotro, some expressive art related to Tolkien´s work and the standart for avatars these days, there are a couple of issues.
I have no personal views about you, only about the point of view and arguments expressed here, this is not a personal discussion for me, but unfortunately it is for you, so lets finish it here.
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