One good thing out of all of this is I will get my unemployment check for years under Obama right?
No more work for me!!!
i thought i remember receiving an increase to my unemployment benefits back in the 90's. either a 6 month extension or higher money from bill clinton.
did i? if so, why? i thought it was good times back than? why the free money to a high employed country?
i didnt pay much mind to politics back than, but i sort of remember being lazy and milking it for every dime. i thought it was the governments money, not mine.
funny how similar our politicians and a irresponsible 21 yr old think.
As we have repeatedly stated, minors cannot forfeit citizenship. Period, the end. It doesn't matter what Indonesian laws think or don't think. American law does not allow a minor to forfeit citizenship, and rightly so. Further proof, in case anyone is left in the slightest bit of doubt: http://www.travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_777.html
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
As we have repeatedly stated, minors cannot forfeit citizenship. Period, the end. It doesn't matter what Indonesian laws think or don't think. American law does not allow a minor to forfeit citizenship, and rightly so. Further proof, in case anyone is left in the slightest bit of doubt: http://www.travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_777.html
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
that ones easy since it was a recent change ( less than 20 years)
when did that become law and was it retroactive?
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
One good thing out of all of this is I will get my unemployment check for years under Obama right?
No more work for me!!!
But, you will probably get drafted to fight in one of his wars.
Nope.
That is who is firing me. No more Military for me. Health related issues (asthma and knee problems) have caused me to be unable to maintain the physical readiness necessary.
Currently playing: LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too: Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
that ones easy since it was a recent change ( less than 20 years) when did that become law and was it retroactive?
Yeah that is about right. In 1986 the law was changed to what it is now, but it was not retroactive.
There is discussion of which Nationality Act of 1940 or the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952. The one from 1952 looks to be more like it, as the 1940 would only by of his mother:
Section 349(a):
From and after the effective date of this Act a person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by -- (1) obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application, upon an application filed in his behalf by a parent, or duly authorized agent, or through the naturalization of a parent having legal custody of such person: Provided, That nationality shall not be lost by any person under this section as the result of the naturalization of a parent or parents while such person is under the age of twenty-one years, or as the result of naturalization obtained on behalf of a person under twenty-one years of age by a parent, guardian, or duly authorized agent, unless such person shall fail to enter the United States to establish a permanent residence prior to his twenty-fifth
birthday:
Which from the looks of it, as so long as Obama returned to the US before his 25th birthday, then his US citizenship would remain in place.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
MOTION to Dismiss First Amended Complaint filed by BARACK OBAMA, THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE.Memorandum of Law, Certificate of Service.(LAVELLE, JOHN) (Entered: October 20, 2008)
Also looks like a nefty site for legal information...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
All three of you come up with new attacks on Obama on a daily basis. You post links to faux news sites, and proclaim that your Google results are the deathknell for Obama's campaign. Ayers and ACORN ended up being mere blips on the radar, and they did not serve to ruin Obama's march to the Whie House (I imagine to your dissapointment). All the ACORN and Ayers issue did was fill 5 minute segments on REAL news stations, and Obama publicly faced these two issues and laid them to rest. They are done, over with, and did nothing to serve McCain well. In fact some say it backfired.
Why are you bringing up this issue of citizenship? Don't you think the DNC vetted him prior to letting him enter the race? Or maybe you think Obama was vetted in similar fashion to Palin? If that is the case, then there is room to worry : ) It is utterly laughable that Obama could have even made it through the primaries with not being an "actual" citizen. I don't need to look at contitutional law to figure this out, just like I don't need to throw myself off of a building to test gravity. It is common sense. Obama is a citizen, 100%.
It appears to me that all three of you are passive racists, and you probably don't even know it. Many of my friends are the same way, hell, both of my bosses are too.. Your public attitudes towards Obama point to more than just a dislike for a political candidate, or a difference in political idealogies. The fact that you seek to defame Obama through slander and lies speaks very loudly, and I seriously doubt you all gave John Kerry the same treatment 4 years ago. What gives? Please prove me wrong here.
You should all vent your frustrations and hatred out on greedy wall street billionaires who pocketed trillions off of your over-inflated housing prices, or the HMO's who make billions yearly off of your healthcare, or out-dated and out-of-touch senators who have no business being in a 21st century government. At least these are non-partisan issues we can agree on, and at least you can find REAL news from REAL sources to aid your public lamentation of the status quo.
I voted for Obama in the California Primary, if I was a racist I would have voted for someone else (besides Clinton) such as Edwards.
I was a Democrat of this year... a Conservative Democrat. Which does get annoying of the stereo-typing that goes on (Democrats are Liberals and Republicans are Conservative). Now I am a Republican and thought I give it a try, but after this election I'll become Independent.
Then you need to add in the other factor.
Drama, not Desperation
I consider these forums as a place of PvP. Politics are one of the three bad topics to discuss and as duly noted they can get heated.
So how's that bet of yours with Rusty going?
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
To Dracus, Blueberryhaze (nice name btw) & Devil: All three of you come up with new attacks on Obama on a daily basis. You post links to faux news sites, and proclaim that your Google results are the deathknell for Obama's campaign. Ayers and ACORN ended up being mere blips on the radar, and they did not serve to ruin Obama's march to the Whie House (I imagine to your dissapointment). All the ACORN and Ayers issue did was fill 5 minute segments on REAL news stations, and Obama publicly faced these two issues and laid them to rest. They are done, over with, and did nothing to serve McCain well. In fact some say it backfired. Why are you bringing up this issue of citizenship? Don't you think the DNC vetted him prior to letting him enter the race? Or maybe you think Obama was vetted in similar fashion to Palin? If that is the case, then there is room to worry : ) It is utterly laughable that Obama could have even made it through the primaries with not being an "actual" citizen. I don't need to look at contitutional law to figure this out, just like I don't need to throw myself off of a building to test gravity. It is common sense. Obama is a citizen, 100%. It appears to me that all three of you are passive racists, and you probably don't even know it. Many of my friends are the same way, hell, both of my bosses are too.. Your public attitudes towards Obama point to more than just a dislike for a political candidate, or a difference in political idealogies. The fact that you seek to defame Obama through slander and lies speaks very loudly, and I seriously doubt you all gave John Kerry the same treatment 4 years ago. What gives? Please prove me wrong here. You should all vent your frustrations and hatred out on greedy wall street billionaires who pocketed trillions off of your over-inflated housing prices, or the HMO's who make billions yearly off of your healthcare, or out-dated and out-of-touch senators who have no business being in a 21st century government. At least these are non-partisan issues we can agree on, and at least you can find REAL news from REAL sources to aid your public lamentation of the status quo.
LOL ! I don't like McCain either... I have no hatred, and your assumptions and accusations are absurd. I did not bring his citizenship case to court, no A DEMOCRAT did that. And Justia is fake news sites? LOL!! I strongly disgaree with both of their policies, I disagree with Obama's more, nothing more than that, though that seems hard for you to accept.
Many people of all races disagree with Obamas policies, this is not limited to any race. The only people I have seen thus far bringing race or religion to this conversation are those that are actually saying that if you do not support Obama you must be racist. His policies speak for themselves, and not in a good way.
I happen to live in a state that never had OVERINFLATED housing because our state was intelligent enough to put regulation into place to keep that from happening. Texas along with a few other states actually learned from the last time this happened and prevented that from happening again, but yet we are paying for the other states mistakes here.
As for healthcare both of their plans are terrible, and only treat the symptoms not the problems. As long as we allow pharamcutical companies to be more concerned about making medications to keep you dependant rather than make you well, and allow insurance companies to falter on their contracts we will have problems .
What really needs to be done is :
1. regulate Pharamcutical companies . Only at most 25% of their budget is spent on research and development at most, most aren;t even close to spending that, some are as low as 5% the rest is spent on trying to bribe doctors, lavish vacations and catering to doctors offices. That IS the real reason grandma can;t afford her heart medicine. They refuse to produce medications unless they are profitable, meaning you must have to take them over an extended period of time, they do not want more effective medication and make effective medication all of the time, just nevr produce it for public use.
2. We need to force insurance companies to hold up their end of the bargain rather than try to get out of every possible claim they can. We need to allow for more insurance to become available not just through employers and have a larger variety of plans.
3. we need to expnad our current doctors educational program. The reason doctors are so expensive is that they are usually paying off student loans until they are 45- 60 years old. they get out of school to a lifetime of debt they may never pay off. The shortage of doctors in this country is due to the cost of schooling, and the difficulty to obtain Scholarships that cover the sheer amount of costs of completing medical school. We need to expand our current program for free schooling for doctors in exchange for services to the underprivledged. If any student has the grades, passes the tests and is qualified to do so, they can qualify for school assistance regardless of families income. This would apply for doctors, nurses, medical assistants and any other position in the medical field to simply allow for us to have enough medical proffesionals in the field to provide assistance to those who need it. This is not socialism, it is an exchange of services. We help the doctors with their education, they in turn give a designated amount of service until their debt for the educational costs are compensated for. This solves the doctor shortage and provides enough quality doctors in the field to help the poor.
I do care about the problems in this country, I want to see everyone do better, the issues I have is them trying to push through half ass written plans that do not solve the problems they just create more problems. These things could be simplified and made to work more effiecently than what they are currrently trying to give us. I know Obama and Mccain are both big fat liars, and I do not think either of them have anything to offer this country except more suffering.
The biggest problem with Obama is with him in the white house we have a corrupted absolute power in control of our entire government. Pelosi + Dodd + Obama = absolute power, yup we give absolute power to those that help create this mess, at least with the randomness of McCain we can hope for some gridlock, maybe a veto here and there.. that guy is like a human superball .. all over the place never know what he is going to do next. LOL Where is Marcy Kaptur when you need her? She sounds like a better candidate than any of these YO- YO's we have running right now.
As someone who has grown up working in law offices, clerked for attorneys, and hung out with them enough to learn the basic jargon....
Looking at the notes above showing the dates and motions, etc...
The obama camp keeps trying to get the judge to throw it out.(Motion to dismiss)..several times... and of course it isn't thrown out and so then obama puts a lock down on his records.... sure looks like he has something to hide.
the dems are trying all kinds of technical reasons to get this thrown out, but Berg is persistant! LOL.
Like Berg said, Obama has the power to end this instantly by just showing his REAL TRUE birth certificate. (EVERYTHING you libs have posted here is fradulent documents and not the legal long form)
So no, this isn't just...racism. As supposed by dis-Odor.
Racism? The only positive thing I can find about the man is that it would be cool to have an African American president -- to have his daughters grow up in the White House. That would be awesome.
But, the fact that he is a socialist, wants to rob from the upper middle class and give to the lower middle class, that he is the most unqualified man to ever run for the presidency, and that he has to keep whatever it is he is trying to hide -- birth records, school records, everything about his past -- from the public, is what the problem is with voting for him.
As we have repeatedly stated, minors cannot forfeit citizenship. Period, the end. It doesn't matter what Indonesian laws think or don't think. American law does not allow a minor to forfeit citizenship, and rightly so. Further proof, in case anyone is left in the slightest bit of doubt: http://www.travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_777.html
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
Fine. Obama didn't forfeit his citizenship. Period, the end. No spin. The 'spin' here is all coming from people who are making up this garbage.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
still the job he is applying for has a requirement.
He was asked by a court to provide proof to meet that requirement.
he said no , name one company , one job anywhere that will still let you work if you just say nope when they ask for proof soemthing required for the job?
just show the damn form if its that easy. and make McCain and Barr ant the others show theirs .. hell i need 3 forms of ID and a thumb print for a DL , so i wont get upset my president has to have a valid Birth Certificate to get sworn in.
How often do the innocent protest something they can prove their way out of just by following the law?
Cop: did you do this ?
Innocent: No i didnt
Cop: got proof?
innocent sure do right here !
Cop : great move along...
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
Now, I did research this story myself, when I first brought this to everyone's attention and got banned by one of the biased mods here. I found this little tidbit which helps prove Barry's case:
all I ever want is the truth of the matter. It's what I am all about.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
Now, I did research this story myself, when I first brought this to everyone's attention and got banned by one of the biased mods here. I found this little tidbit which helps prove Barry's case:
all I ever want is the truth of the matter. It's what I am all about.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
Oh I agree, and it is evidence that he IS hiding something -- actually, a great many things.
Originally posted by Gorair just show the damn form if its that easy. and make McCain and Barr ant the others show theirs .. hell i need 3 forms of ID and a thumb print for a DL , so i wont get upset my president has to have a valid Birth Certificate to get sworn in. still the job he is applying for has a requirement.
He was asked by a court to provide proof to meet that requirement. he said no , name one company , one job anywhere that will still let you work if you just say nope when they ask for proof soemthing required for the job? How often do the innocent protest something they can prove their way out of just by following the law? Cop: did you do this ? Innocent: No i didnt Cop: got proof? innocent sure do right here ! Cop : great move along...
I have protested against such and would protest anytime any place agianst that sort of crap. I am citizen and have the right of innocent until proven guilty. Its not guilty until proven innocent.
If you are not being responded to directly, you are probably on my ignore list.
also if he can turn his back on somethnig in the consitution then basically say it doesnt apply here , not to me , not now, how does that insipire me to think the values anything else written on it? What is there to say he wont disregard my rights when it suits him, what assurances do i have?
Change - how so? current politicans hide everything they can , unless its good for them in which case they run a TV spot and go on Letterman to brag about it. Seems like the same thing practiced by every other politician out there.
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
Now, I did research this story myself, when I first brought this to everyone's attention and got banned by one of the biased mods here. I found this little tidbit which helps prove Barry's case:
all I ever want is the truth of the matter. It's what I am all about.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
the thing is he cant win. Hes shown his REAL birth certificate. Hawaii recognizes this as his REAL birth certificate. Hes used this REAL birth certificate for his proof of citizenship. However, some braniac conservative so-called "specialists" or "analysts" reviewed this and claim it to be fraud. Meanwhile, theyre not getting anywhere in the courts and many of you are starting to believe he has no valid proof of birth!
what is being asked for has been done and is not being accepted as being REAL. Its like if you were to ask for proof that you have a belly button and someone pointed directly to it and you saying "ya thats not my belly button, I want to see my REAL belly button".
and ya, it makes complete sense why hes wanting to dismiss this because what he has already offered is not being accepted by the individuals filing suit against him. Its not rocket science and some of you are acting like hes pulled one of the biggest conspiracies since the magic bullet and the grassy knoll
seriously, go back to the terrorist link theories. those are still way beyond BS but more believable than this.
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
Ok the questions/points being asked/brought up in the source article are just a waste of time.
1) Irrelevant. Why would he exactly? If I had a bunch of conspiracy theorists asking inane questions I would ignore them as much as I could also.
2) Irrelevant. Doesn't make any difference with regards to citizenship, he was born in the US as the annoucement shows.
3) That isn't a question its speculation.
4) Not a question. Has no bearing.
5) His father didn't stick around. Yes that has been established. He has no photos from when he was an infant. So? Are you proposing he popped out full grown? Possibly the stupidest question of the lot. Whether there are infant photos or not has no bearing on anything.
6) Not a question. Has no relevant concerns.
7) Irrelevant. Has no bearing.
8) Might? Speculation again.
9) This has been brought up before earlier in the thread and has been addressed.
10) Has no bearing on citizenship. Religion is a separate thread.
11) Speculation. Nothing more.
12) Speculation again.
As the annoucement shows, he was born in the US. Yes he is a citizen. There, now lets all go home.
If you are not being responded to directly, you are probably on my ignore list.
How does Obama show the real deal? He's shown his birth certificate. He has a SS number. I'm sure he's shown his driver's license and passport at some point. He gave all the necessary documentation.
What is he supposed to show here? What's the magical piece of documentation that will convince the crazies? Obviously not a birth certificate, we can rule that out. Simple question - what is it?
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
Now, I did research this story myself, when I first brought this to everyone's attention and got banned by one of the biased mods here. I found this little tidbit which helps prove Barry's case:
all I ever want is the truth of the matter. It's what I am all about.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
the thing is he cant win. Hes shown his REAL birth certificate. Hawaii recognizes this as his REAL birth certificate. Hes used this REAL birth certificate for his proof of citizenship. However, some braniac conservative so-called "specialists" or "analysts" reviewed this and claim it to be fraud. Meanwhile, theyre not getting anywhere in the courts and many of you are starting to believe he has no valid proof of birth!
what is being asked for has been done and is not being accepted as being REAL. Its like if you were to ask for proof that you have a belly button and someone pointed directly to it and you saying "ya thats not my belly button, I want to see my REAL belly button".
and ya, it makes complete sense why hes wanting to dismiss this because what he has already offered is not being accepted by the individuals filing suit against him. Its not rocket science and some of you are acting like hes pulled one of the biggest conspiracies since the magic bullet and the grassy knoll
seriously, go back to the terrorist link theories. those are still way beyond BS but more believable than this.
Actually, it's a long time Democrat who is challenging him. Why does he refuse to provide the court with that which is being asked for? It's not conspiracy. A conspiracy is when a group of people do things in secret for bad purposes. This is openly shifty behavior on his part.
How does Obama show the real deal? He's shown his birth certificate. He has a SS number. I'm sure he's shown his driver's license and passport at some point. He gave all the necessary documentation.
What is he supposed to show here? What's the magical piece of documentation that will convince the crazies? Obviously not a birth certificate, we can rule that out. Simple question - what is it?
he refuses to present a vault copy of his burth certificate. Why is that?
Comments
i thought i remember receiving an increase to my unemployment benefits back in the 90's. either a 6 month extension or higher money from bill clinton.
did i? if so, why? i thought it was good times back than? why the free money to a high employed country?
i didnt pay much mind to politics back than, but i sort of remember being lazy and milking it for every dime. i thought it was the governments money, not mine.
funny how similar our politicians and a irresponsible 21 yr old think.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
that ones easy since it was a recent change ( less than 20 years)
when did that become law and was it retroactive?
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
But, you will probably get drafted to fight in one of his wars.
Nope.
That is who is firing me. No more Military for me. Health related issues (asthma and knee problems) have caused me to be unable to maintain the physical readiness necessary.
Currently playing:
LOTRO & WoW (not much WoW though because Mines of Moria rocks!!!!)
Looking Foward too:
Bioware games (Dragon Age & Star Wars The Old Republic)
This reminds me how dumb the rule of allowing only americans born in the country to become presidents is.
...
"word"
i wish that mohamed atta was able to run for president.
too bad he was preoccupied with its demise.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Yeah that is about right. In 1986 the law was changed to what it is now, but it was not retroactive.
There is discussion of which Nationality Act of 1940 or the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952. The one from 1952 looks to be more like it, as the 1940 would only by of his mother:
Section 349(a):
From and after the effective date of this Act a person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by -- (1) obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application, upon an application filed in his behalf by a parent, or duly authorized agent, or through the naturalization of a parent having legal custody of such person: Provided, That nationality shall not be lost by any person under this section as the result of the naturalization of a parent or parents while such person is under the age of twenty-one years, or as the result of naturalization obtained on behalf of a person under twenty-one years of age by a parent, guardian, or duly authorized agent, unless such person shall fail to enter the United States to establish a permanent residence prior to his twenty-fifth
birthday:
Which from the looks of it, as so long as Obama returned to the US before his 25th birthday, then his US citizenship would remain in place.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
So do you want to see how the lawsuit is going, just click on here:
BERG v. OBAMA et al
http://news.justia.com/cases/featured/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/
Latest update:
October 20, 2008
MOTION to Dismiss First Amended Complaint filed by BARACK OBAMA, THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE.Memorandum of Law, Certificate of Service.(LAVELLE, JOHN) (Entered: October 20, 2008)
Also looks like a nefty site for legal information...
Want to know of what lawsuits are going on?
http://news.justia.com/cases/
A lot against Google...
Homepage:
http://www.justia.com/
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
To Dracus, Blueberryhaze (nice name btw) & Devil:
All three of you come up with new attacks on Obama on a daily basis. You post links to faux news sites, and proclaim that your Google results are the deathknell for Obama's campaign. Ayers and ACORN ended up being mere blips on the radar, and they did not serve to ruin Obama's march to the Whie House (I imagine to your dissapointment). All the ACORN and Ayers issue did was fill 5 minute segments on REAL news stations, and Obama publicly faced these two issues and laid them to rest. They are done, over with, and did nothing to serve McCain well. In fact some say it backfired.
Why are you bringing up this issue of citizenship? Don't you think the DNC vetted him prior to letting him enter the race? Or maybe you think Obama was vetted in similar fashion to Palin? If that is the case, then there is room to worry : ) It is utterly laughable that Obama could have even made it through the primaries with not being an "actual" citizen. I don't need to look at contitutional law to figure this out, just like I don't need to throw myself off of a building to test gravity. It is common sense. Obama is a citizen, 100%.
It appears to me that all three of you are passive racists, and you probably don't even know it. Many of my friends are the same way, hell, both of my bosses are too.. Your public attitudes towards Obama point to more than just a dislike for a political candidate, or a difference in political idealogies. The fact that you seek to defame Obama through slander and lies speaks very loudly, and I seriously doubt you all gave John Kerry the same treatment 4 years ago. What gives? Please prove me wrong here.
You should all vent your frustrations and hatred out on greedy wall street billionaires who pocketed trillions off of your over-inflated housing prices, or the HMO's who make billions yearly off of your healthcare, or out-dated and out-of-touch senators who have no business being in a 21st century government. At least these are non-partisan issues we can agree on, and at least you can find REAL news from REAL sources to aid your public lamentation of the status quo.
I voted for Obama in the California Primary, if I was a racist I would have voted for someone else (besides Clinton) such as Edwards.
I was a Democrat of this year... a Conservative Democrat. Which does get annoying of the stereo-typing that goes on (Democrats are Liberals and Republicans are Conservative). Now I am a Republican and thought I give it a try, but after this election I'll become Independent.
Then you need to add in the other factor.
Drama, not Desperation
I consider these forums as a place of PvP. Politics are one of the three bad topics to discuss and as duly noted they can get heated.
So how's that bet of yours with Rusty going?
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
LOL ! I don't like McCain either... I have no hatred, and your assumptions and accusations are absurd. I did not bring his citizenship case to court, no A DEMOCRAT did that. And Justia is fake news sites? LOL!! I strongly disgaree with both of their policies, I disagree with Obama's more, nothing more than that, though that seems hard for you to accept.
Many people of all races disagree with Obamas policies, this is not limited to any race. The only people I have seen thus far bringing race or religion to this conversation are those that are actually saying that if you do not support Obama you must be racist. His policies speak for themselves, and not in a good way.
I happen to live in a state that never had OVERINFLATED housing because our state was intelligent enough to put regulation into place to keep that from happening. Texas along with a few other states actually learned from the last time this happened and prevented that from happening again, but yet we are paying for the other states mistakes here.
As for healthcare both of their plans are terrible, and only treat the symptoms not the problems. As long as we allow pharamcutical companies to be more concerned about making medications to keep you dependant rather than make you well, and allow insurance companies to falter on their contracts we will have problems .
What really needs to be done is :
1. regulate Pharamcutical companies . Only at most 25% of their budget is spent on research and development at most, most aren;t even close to spending that, some are as low as 5% the rest is spent on trying to bribe doctors, lavish vacations and catering to doctors offices. That IS the real reason grandma can;t afford her heart medicine. They refuse to produce medications unless they are profitable, meaning you must have to take them over an extended period of time, they do not want more effective medication and make effective medication all of the time, just nevr produce it for public use.
2. We need to force insurance companies to hold up their end of the bargain rather than try to get out of every possible claim they can. We need to allow for more insurance to become available not just through employers and have a larger variety of plans.
3. we need to expnad our current doctors educational program. The reason doctors are so expensive is that they are usually paying off student loans until they are 45- 60 years old. they get out of school to a lifetime of debt they may never pay off. The shortage of doctors in this country is due to the cost of schooling, and the difficulty to obtain Scholarships that cover the sheer amount of costs of completing medical school. We need to expand our current program for free schooling for doctors in exchange for services to the underprivledged. If any student has the grades, passes the tests and is qualified to do so, they can qualify for school assistance regardless of families income. This would apply for doctors, nurses, medical assistants and any other position in the medical field to simply allow for us to have enough medical proffesionals in the field to provide assistance to those who need it. This is not socialism, it is an exchange of services. We help the doctors with their education, they in turn give a designated amount of service until their debt for the educational costs are compensated for. This solves the doctor shortage and provides enough quality doctors in the field to help the poor.
I do care about the problems in this country, I want to see everyone do better, the issues I have is them trying to push through half ass written plans that do not solve the problems they just create more problems. These things could be simplified and made to work more effiecently than what they are currrently trying to give us. I know Obama and Mccain are both big fat liars, and I do not think either of them have anything to offer this country except more suffering.
The biggest problem with Obama is with him in the white house we have a corrupted absolute power in control of our entire government. Pelosi + Dodd + Obama = absolute power, yup we give absolute power to those that help create this mess, at least with the randomness of McCain we can hope for some gridlock, maybe a veto here and there.. that guy is like a human superball .. all over the place never know what he is going to do next. LOL Where is Marcy Kaptur when you need her? She sounds like a better candidate than any of these YO- YO's we have running right now.
As someone who has grown up working in law offices, clerked for attorneys, and hung out with them enough to learn the basic jargon....
Looking at the notes above showing the dates and motions, etc...
The obama camp keeps trying to get the judge to throw it out.(Motion to dismiss)..several times... and of course it isn't thrown out and so then obama puts a lock down on his records.... sure looks like he has something to hide.
the dems are trying all kinds of technical reasons to get this thrown out, but Berg is persistant! LOL.
Like Berg said, Obama has the power to end this instantly by just showing his REAL TRUE birth certificate. (EVERYTHING you libs have posted here is fradulent documents and not the legal long form)
So no, this isn't just...racism. As supposed by dis-Odor.
Racism? The only positive thing I can find about the man is that it would be cool to have an African American president -- to have his daughters grow up in the White House. That would be awesome.
But, the fact that he is a socialist, wants to rob from the upper middle class and give to the lower middle class, that he is the most unqualified man to ever run for the presidency, and that he has to keep whatever it is he is trying to hide -- birth records, school records, everything about his past -- from the public, is what the problem is with voting for him.
What is Barry hiding?
fishermage.blogspot.com
Now, I did research this story myself, when I first brought this to everyone's attention and got banned by one of the biased mods here.
I found this little tidbit which helps prove Barry's case:
www.reason.com/blog/show/127704.html
all I ever want is the truth of the matter. It's what I am all about.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Wrong again.
You keep failing to take the extra step.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN
Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Care to spin this.
Fine. Obama didn't forfeit his citizenship. Period, the end. No spin. The 'spin' here is all coming from people who are making up this garbage.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
still the job he is applying for has a requirement.
He was asked by a court to provide proof to meet that requirement.
he said no , name one company , one job anywhere that will still let you work if you just say nope when they ask for proof soemthing required for the job?
just show the damn form if its that easy. and make McCain and Barr ant the others show theirs .. hell i need 3 forms of ID and a thumb print for a DL , so i wont get upset my president has to have a valid Birth Certificate to get sworn in.
How often do the innocent protest something they can prove their way out of just by following the law?
Cop: did you do this ?
Innocent: No i didnt
Cop: got proof?
innocent sure do right here !
Cop : great move along...
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
Oh I agree, and it is evidence that he IS hiding something -- actually, a great many things.
fishermage.blogspot.com
I have protested against such and would protest anytime any place agianst that sort of crap. I am citizen and have the right of innocent until proven guilty. Its not guilty until proven innocent.
If you are not being responded to directly, you are probably on my ignore list.
also if he can turn his back on somethnig in the consitution then basically say it doesnt apply here , not to me , not now, how does that insipire me to think the values anything else written on it? What is there to say he wont disregard my rights when it suits him, what assurances do i have?
Change - how so? current politicans hide everything they can , unless its good for them in which case they run a TV spot and go on Letterman to brag about it. Seems like the same thing practiced by every other politician out there.
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
the thing is he cant win. Hes shown his REAL birth certificate. Hawaii recognizes this as his REAL birth certificate. Hes used this REAL birth certificate for his proof of citizenship. However, some braniac conservative so-called "specialists" or "analysts" reviewed this and claim it to be fraud. Meanwhile, theyre not getting anywhere in the courts and many of you are starting to believe he has no valid proof of birth!
what is being asked for has been done and is not being accepted as being REAL. Its like if you were to ask for proof that you have a belly button and someone pointed directly to it and you saying "ya thats not my belly button, I want to see my REAL belly button".
and ya, it makes complete sense why hes wanting to dismiss this because what he has already offered is not being accepted by the individuals filing suit against him. Its not rocket science and some of you are acting like hes pulled one of the biggest conspiracies since the magic bullet and the grassy knoll
seriously, go back to the terrorist link theories. those are still way beyond BS but more believable than this.
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
Ok the questions/points being asked/brought up in the source article are just a waste of time.
1) Irrelevant. Why would he exactly? If I had a bunch of conspiracy theorists asking inane questions I would ignore them as much as I could also.
2) Irrelevant. Doesn't make any difference with regards to citizenship, he was born in the US as the annoucement shows.
3) That isn't a question its speculation.
4) Not a question. Has no bearing.
5) His father didn't stick around. Yes that has been established. He has no photos from when he was an infant. So? Are you proposing he popped out full grown? Possibly the stupidest question of the lot. Whether there are infant photos or not has no bearing on anything.
6) Not a question. Has no relevant concerns.
7) Irrelevant. Has no bearing.
8) Might? Speculation again.
9) This has been brought up before earlier in the thread and has been addressed.
10) Has no bearing on citizenship. Religion is a separate thread.
11) Speculation. Nothing more.
12) Speculation again.
As the annoucement shows, he was born in the US. Yes he is a citizen. There, now lets all go home.
If you are not being responded to directly, you are probably on my ignore list.
How does Obama show the real deal? He's shown his birth certificate. He has a SS number. I'm sure he's shown his driver's license and passport at some point. He gave all the necessary documentation.
What is he supposed to show here? What's the magical piece of documentation that will convince the crazies? Obviously not a birth certificate, we can rule that out. Simple question - what is it?
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
Hey that link is VERY interesting! But I followed it back to it's original source and found the questions on THAT page to be every bit the more making the case against him being legal in this matter.....
Here is my issue...
if he really was born here in the u.s. then why not just show the real deal and stop the BS.
I confess that if he was born HERE, then dragged off by his mom as a child to indonesia.... if THAT is the issue at hand then I say the issue should be dropped and/or the law changed to favor Obama in this...I HATE when dems use technical issues to bypass the intent of law, and I would not want to stop him from being a legal person running on the same principle....
THAT being said... THE RULE OF LAW HAS TO MATTER or society crumbles. /shrug It's black and white, not grey.
Obama should come clean with his REAL cert and stop this once and for all.
the thing is he cant win. Hes shown his REAL birth certificate. Hawaii recognizes this as his REAL birth certificate. Hes used this REAL birth certificate for his proof of citizenship. However, some braniac conservative so-called "specialists" or "analysts" reviewed this and claim it to be fraud. Meanwhile, theyre not getting anywhere in the courts and many of you are starting to believe he has no valid proof of birth!
what is being asked for has been done and is not being accepted as being REAL. Its like if you were to ask for proof that you have a belly button and someone pointed directly to it and you saying "ya thats not my belly button, I want to see my REAL belly button".
and ya, it makes complete sense why hes wanting to dismiss this because what he has already offered is not being accepted by the individuals filing suit against him. Its not rocket science and some of you are acting like hes pulled one of the biggest conspiracies since the magic bullet and the grassy knoll
seriously, go back to the terrorist link theories. those are still way beyond BS but more believable than this.
Actually, it's a long time Democrat who is challenging him. Why does he refuse to provide the court with that which is being asked for? It's not conspiracy. A conspiracy is when a group of people do things in secret for bad purposes. This is openly shifty behavior on his part.
fishermage.blogspot.com
he refuses to present a vault copy of his burth certificate. Why is that?
fishermage.blogspot.com