I don't agree with the people saying listen to the customers. I understand that Sony may have made a mistake by changing their game into a different game. As far as developing a game from scratch I'd rather have the developer make the game they would enjoy to play. The problem with listening to the customer is there are to many different opinions on what makes a good game. This is what has me worried about this game already. They have said they want to make many different groups happy. For instance they want to make the solo, social, and pvp groups all happy. Many games have tried to do this, but something is always done poorly. In WoW PvP was done pretty poorly. In Warhammer PvE was done pretty poorly. On top of this you are forcing each group to do something they don't want to do for portions of the game. The social people will have to solo for large parts of the game. The solo people will have to group for small parts of the game. The pvpers will have to solo and group PvE for parts of the game. Everyone ends up unhappy. I wish a developer would just pick one group to please and stick with it. Bioware makes good PvE games so they should be concentrating most of their efforts on making a good PvE game IMO.
I think that despite what they might be saying about making the game to please many groups you will see that they do exactly opposite of that. If they really want to make this game popular to the masses then they need to make the game a PvE centric game with elements of PvP spattered in. It is my opinion that this is exactly what it sounds like they are doing. Focusing on player stories which leads me to infer a heavy emphasis on PvE.
As far as solo vs. group play I really believe you can please both groups equally. There should be content that allows for grouping and content that allows for solo play. There's no reason that either needs to be required. All this takes is planning and smart development. As I've said before, let's just sit back and see what they say about the game over the next 6 months. After that we'll all have a much better sense of what the Devs are focusing on.
Listen to the hundreds and hundreds of posts and CHANGE THE ART STYLE. As it sits, the way this game looks has dropped almost every ounce of excitement I had for it. I've been waiting for this as long as the next guy, but the visuals so far are utterly disappointing.
The MMO is moving into a next gen market with games like Aion, Blade & Soul, and Age of Conan (visually). These visuals are not what people want and this has been voiced in more threads and posts at swtor.com than I can count.
Don't do what SOE did and ignore what the community wants. BioWare has a much better reputation to protect than SOE.
Ban anyone from forum talking about SWG like a model MMO. It did not work properly from beta 2 and forward, it was never that good, all NGE did was make it worse. if people think that is the best evah.. then they are religious fanatics and could not stay constructive and helpful under any cirumstance. Build an MMO based on KotOR and make it fun... People start spewing SWG ideas.. just ban them immediatly and no regrets.
I would like it to follow a good story like the original two games. The artwork can be similar too since I cant upgrade my computer every 2 months. I'm in need of a good story that can be played and updated, mabey take examples from LOTR.
I hope this turns out well, Im tired of what is out there now.
I don't agree with the people saying listen to the customers. I understand that Sony may have made a mistake by changing their game into a different game. As far as developing a game from scratch I'd rather have the developer make the game they would enjoy to play. The problem with listening to the customer is there are to many different opinions on what makes a good game. This is what has me worried about this game already. They have said they want to make many different groups happy. For instance they want to make the solo, social, and pvp groups all happy. Many games have tried to do this, but something is always done poorly. In WoW PvP was done pretty poorly. In Warhammer PvE was done pretty poorly. On top of this you are forcing each group to do something they don't want to do for portions of the game. The social people will have to solo for large parts of the game. The solo people will have to group for small parts of the game. The pvpers will have to solo and group PvE for parts of the game. Everyone ends up unhappy. I wish a developer would just pick one group to please and stick with it. Bioware makes good PvE games so they should be concentrating most of their efforts on making a good PvE game IMO.
I disagree.
I think Bioware should listen to their fanbase or atleast take the most vocal critics of the current top mmorpgs and hire them (which is exactly what blizzard did when they made world of warcraft).
The fact of the matter is WE, the mmorpg community, knows what fails and what doesn't fail. Sure we vary on taste, but we know what works.
My only advice is the same as a few people have said ........ take absoulutley no notice of SWG Vets ... make the game you want to make SWG Vets are living in the past. And if you do anything to upset them they'll try and bring your game down as well .( although they hav'nt succeeded with SWG thank goodness )
My advice is for the Developers and Artists of SWTOR at Bioware:
First.....Get out of the contract with Lucas Arts now if you can. You gals and guys deserve better treatment and artist license than what LA is going to allow you. Look around, play with some ideas, get creative, and make your own Single player focused MMO. You will be glad you did. Lucas Arts interferes too much with MMO/Game Developers and really should make their own games.
If that fails, than Secondly......If you choose to stay with SWTOR and the contract with LA, then no matter how much they try to push you into a product, stay focused and make the best product you can and take as long as you need to to do so. Players will stand behind you and support you in this. Players are your customers, so remember that if you make a product that keeps the Players happy, then you will ultimately be happy with the work you have done.
And Thirdly....SWTOR can not be, nor should be SWG II. As much as I desire to see a revamped and recreated SWG that is not what SWTOR is going to be about from what your game outline states. Remember that we Players will scream for a rebirth of SWG and forgive us for our passions. SWTOR is an MMO version of the KOTOR, so stay with that. KOTOR was a worthy and enjoyable game series on it's own merits, and SWTOR can be too, in fact I hope it surpasses KOTOR and proves that sequels can best the greatest of original ideas.
my advice: do NOT listen to the community : - recruit your beta testers from people that play console and singleplayer games
- do not stray away from a clear vision neither by pressure fro marketing/analysts or loudmouth hardcore mmoers
- produce a kick ass game wo dreaming about how much $$$ bliz makes each month
I think thats what Mythic did.
Not listening to the community and creating a MMO for the Xbox kiddies and see how that went.
Sorry about that I just had to vent my loathing towards Microsoft and their shitty console which they will abandon prematurely for it's successor I surely bet.
Like I said there are to many different view on what people would like in a game. Listening to the community gets you nowhere. When Blizzard made WoW it was easy for them to capitalize on a market that lacked games with a lot of solo content. Many people were tired of grinding mobs in Everquest or other games at the time. WoW introduced quests and fast solo leveling. Many people tried it because it was a relief after playing something as hard and time consuming as MMOs were at the time. Right now there is no real cry for a specific thing. Yes some people want sandbox, but it's only a small group of people. There are just as many if not more who want a linear story driven game. Now who should Bioware listen to? The people who want all PvP? The people who want sandbox? The people who want PvE? The people who want group PvE? Basically none of the above. They should make the game they think would be fun to play and see what happens.
My piece of advice (and yes I am a VET) is to ignore the complaints of the players. Make the game the way you want to make the game. Release it when it's ready and do not totally change the game when you realize that the game you released wasn't what you wanted to make.
Comments
I think that despite what they might be saying about making the game to please many groups you will see that they do exactly opposite of that. If they really want to make this game popular to the masses then they need to make the game a PvE centric game with elements of PvP spattered in. It is my opinion that this is exactly what it sounds like they are doing. Focusing on player stories which leads me to infer a heavy emphasis on PvE.
As far as solo vs. group play I really believe you can please both groups equally. There should be content that allows for grouping and content that allows for solo play. There's no reason that either needs to be required. All this takes is planning and smart development. As I've said before, let's just sit back and see what they say about the game over the next 6 months. After that we'll all have a much better sense of what the Devs are focusing on.
Advice?
Listen to the hundreds and hundreds of posts and CHANGE THE ART STYLE. As it sits, the way this game looks has dropped almost every ounce of excitement I had for it. I've been waiting for this as long as the next guy, but the visuals so far are utterly disappointing.
The MMO is moving into a next gen market with games like Aion, Blade & Soul, and Age of Conan (visually). These visuals are not what people want and this has been voiced in more threads and posts at swtor.com than I can count.
Don't do what SOE did and ignore what the community wants. BioWare has a much better reputation to protect than SOE.
Knite - Administrator, AionSource.com
Stay true to your vision.
Ban anyone from forum talking about SWG like a model MMO. It did not work properly from beta 2 and forward, it was never that good, all NGE did was make it worse. if people think that is the best evah.. then they are religious fanatics and could not stay constructive and helpful under any cirumstance. Build an MMO based on KotOR and make it fun... People start spewing SWG ideas.. just ban them immediatly and no regrets.
___________________________________________________
Anatomy of a Fanboi
This is you.
Use SOE's example of what NOT to do.
I would like it to follow a good story like the original two games. The artwork can be similar too since I cant upgrade my computer every 2 months. I'm in need of a good story that can be played and updated, mabey take examples from LOTR.
I hope this turns out well, Im tired of what is out there now.
Make Battle Droids a playable race/class.
I disagree.
I think Bioware should listen to their fanbase or atleast take the most vocal critics of the current top mmorpgs and hire them (which is exactly what blizzard did when they made world of warcraft).
The fact of the matter is WE, the mmorpg community, knows what fails and what doesn't fail. Sure we vary on taste, but we know what works.
My only advice is the same as a few people have said ........ take absoulutley no notice of SWG Vets ... make the game you want to make SWG Vets are living in the past. And if you do anything to upset them they'll try and bring your game down as well .( although they hav'nt succeeded with SWG thank goodness )
My advice is for the Developers and Artists of SWTOR at Bioware:
First.....Get out of the contract with Lucas Arts now if you can. You gals and guys deserve better treatment and artist license than what LA is going to allow you. Look around, play with some ideas, get creative, and make your own Single player focused MMO. You will be glad you did. Lucas Arts interferes too much with MMO/Game Developers and really should make their own games.
If that fails, than Secondly......If you choose to stay with SWTOR and the contract with LA, then no matter how much they try to push you into a product, stay focused and make the best product you can and take as long as you need to to do so. Players will stand behind you and support you in this. Players are your customers, so remember that if you make a product that keeps the Players happy, then you will ultimately be happy with the work you have done.
And Thirdly....SWTOR can not be, nor should be SWG II. As much as I desire to see a revamped and recreated SWG that is not what SWTOR is going to be about from what your game outline states. Remember that we Players will scream for a rebirth of SWG and forgive us for our passions. SWTOR is an MMO version of the KOTOR, so stay with that. KOTOR was a worthy and enjoyable game series on it's own merits, and SWTOR can be too, in fact I hope it surpasses KOTOR and proves that sequels can best the greatest of original ideas.
Make it fun, interesting and minimize the issues at release.
my advice:
do NOT listen to the community :
- recruit your beta testers from people that play console and singleplayer games
- do not stray away from a clear vision neither by pressure fro marketing/analysts or loudmouth hardcore mmoers
- produce a kick ass game wo dreaming about how much $$$ bliz makes each month
if your bored, visit my blog at:
http://craylon.wordpress.com/ dealing with the look of mmos with the nvidia 3d vision glasses
I think thats what Mythic did.
Not listening to the community and creating a MMO for the Xbox kiddies and see how that went.
Sorry about that I just had to vent my loathing towards Microsoft and their shitty console which they will abandon prematurely for it's successor I surely bet.
Like I said there are to many different view on what people would like in a game. Listening to the community gets you nowhere. When Blizzard made WoW it was easy for them to capitalize on a market that lacked games with a lot of solo content. Many people were tired of grinding mobs in Everquest or other games at the time. WoW introduced quests and fast solo leveling. Many people tried it because it was a relief after playing something as hard and time consuming as MMOs were at the time. Right now there is no real cry for a specific thing. Yes some people want sandbox, but it's only a small group of people. There are just as many if not more who want a linear story driven game. Now who should Bioware listen to? The people who want all PvP? The people who want sandbox? The people who want PvE? The people who want group PvE? Basically none of the above. They should make the game they think would be fun to play and see what happens.
Ignore the "vets."
This right here is pure 80's gold. Best advice in the world.
I triple quote this for truth.
QFT QFT QFT
This is pure 90's gold. It is even more important than the 80's gold I gave the other guy.
I will quad quote this one for truth. The less you listen to the "vets" the better off you will be.
QFT QFT QFT QFT
My piece of advice (and yes I am a VET) is to ignore the complaints of the players. Make the game the way you want to make the game. Release it when it's ready and do not totally change the game when you realize that the game you released wasn't what you wanted to make.
That would be my advice.