It's very possible that you're only experiencing a case of lag and its not actually everyone in the world using hacks for a game that JUST came out..
Please. That excuse was debunked weeks ago.
How does lag cause people to see through walls? Run across the map in minutes? Teleport to chests, then back to your city? Teleport into the sky and speed hack run through the clouds so you won't be seen? Use no stamina?
Seen 2 speed hackers so far (since launch) and reported them both, after that haven't seen any - 180h played according to xfire. So, hacking being rampant is total BS.
Seen 2 speed hackers so far (since launch) and reported them both, after that haven't seen any - 180h played according to xfire. So, hacking being rampant is total BS.
The problem here is that initially you get not very subtle hacking whereas later you will find players start to use hacks in a more subtle way to give them the competative edge. Especially when the stakes are high. The first wave might be banned through simple observation but the next wave will be more difficult unless AV secures its client, does more validation and finds a way to automatically search for odd behaviour.
I am afraid AV are quite incapable of responding to this just based on there past performance. Also as a final nail in the coffin many hacks where confirmed whhhay back in beta. AV did nothing to create easy detection back then.
Its funny. People do't play but see hackers everywhere and people who play barely see any hackers.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Originally posted by Zodan Let's think about possible cheats in DFO;
Those are only the top of the iceberg.
Realistically thinking; in MMOs and computer software in general there are always some bugs and coding errors that can be exploited by those that try. Normally the amount of subtle bugs are greater than the amount of obvious bugs for logical reasons. It is only common sense that when the Darkfall software have such massive flaws that allows those major exploits to happen it has an enormous potential to be exploited in more subtle ways.
By its nature Darkfall will attrackt a lot of peeps who won't stand back from meta-gaming or going very close to borderline cheating, and others who will cross to do subtle exploits just to get that little more edge. And I have no interest in trying to compete with people who simply can't stick within the boundaries of the game. In this case I am standing weak, as the current state of Darkfall makes the boundaries diffuse. I also know how these weak boundaries will give some people great advantages that will forever set their position within the game, that is why I have lost interest.
Darkfall will proberly survive though, it just isn't as awesome as it would like to appear.
Let's think about possible cheats in DFO; Modified graphics, ok you can see through walls - who cares about the minimal advantage ("hard" to detect) I think the rest of the community will disagree with you , i doubt that it is a "minimal advantage" since sometimes (if not all times) the difference between a winner and a loser of a confrontation in a game like Darkfall or CS can be the pre-emptive strike and who deals it 3rd party software controlling targeting - aimbots (good luck with bows) Hmm must've missed that one on Youtube Teleporting - easy to detect because you moved too fast from point a to point b without going the line between a to b It's only easy to detect if you are on point b on the time of the arrival and suddenly you see X number of toons falling from the sky or popping up under you like it's zombie apocalypse day, everything else is just speculation. I think lord Tasos even made a reference to the subject when he mentioned in the last update and i'm paraphrasing "that several accounts that were checked for using 3rd party software were found clean" sounds to me the community like the community has already started the low-blows and cheap-tricks but hey, all is fair in Darkfall right? Flying - easy to detect because your Z-axis is messed up Maybe you spend the ocassional time watching the Darkfall pixel clouds "oh' look it's like an elephant, oh look it's like a dog, oh look it's a hacker using a fly hack "click,click" *report* " ,but i'm not sure that everyone does so. Then again there is the "underground flying hack" which is just a bit more difficult to detect since the person using it can see you but you in return cannot see him. Besides how do you know that the z-axis is messed up? Trying some hacks lately ,have we? Moving too fast - also easy to detect No arguing there but then again with all those nice teleport hacks who needs it? Unlimited stamina - easy to detect and this was based on a bug which was fixed and it's no longer possible In a one-to-one fight, maybe since one can only be that much better than you in combat without being a virtual superman but what happens in a big fight? What happens in a siege? Sieges in Darkfall are chaotic one is receiving blows from players he can't even see, players that just stand on a wall and shoot their arrows at the opposing side . So how diffiult would it be to spot when one side just supplies a number of players with adequate arrows (received from using the tp hack to open chests and gain gold more quickly) and have them standing on top of the wall firing arrows at the other side using a stamina hack while their main force is waiting for you on the ground (maybe some of them use the stamina hack also?) to finish off what the arrows haven't ? What are you or antone gonna do then? Report them for hacking because they kicked your ass and there is no way in the world that your l33t guild could've lost that battle? But i suppose that is what is going on currently or else we wouldn't have statements like "that several accounts that were checked for using 3rd party software were found clean" ,would we now?
It's just easy to toss couple cool pics and quote a site that customer's get banned sooner or later, meanwhile I'll have my fun in DFO. Yeah it's easy but not as easy as to make one line speculation theories without backing them up and it seems to me that it's more later than sooner they're banned, but i suppose that the old saying is right and ignorance is bliss. Please by all means have fun in Darkfall and if a man approaches you and offers you a choice between 2 pills go for the blue one, the red one doesn't lead to any place that is good, Mr Anderson.
Please by all means have fun in Darkfall and if a man approaches you and offers you a choice between 2 pills go for the blue one, the red one doesn't lead to any place that is good, Mr Anderson.
I think someone just had the matrix smiley they wanted to use..
Please by all means have fun in Darkfall and if a man approaches you and offers you a choice between 2 pills go for the blue one, the red one doesn't lead to any place that is good, Mr Anderson.
I think someone just had the matrix smiley they wanted to use..
Nope . A spontaneous burst of inspiration from the bump i received triggerd by tumble i took from my chair + a lil' bit of luck when searching for a pic to match my matrix analogy that i made in my post = what you see in front of your screen atm
Seen 2 speed hackers so far (since launch) and reported them both, after that haven't seen any - 180h played according to xfire. So, hacking being rampant is total BS.
How would you know if they are just running at the limits of normal speed without using stam? There are several conclusions one could make from your observation (or lack of it). Hacking not being rampant is not a logical one.
How would you know if they are just running at the limits of normal speed without using stam? There are several conclusions one could make from your observation (or lack of it). Hacking not being rampant is not a logical one.
You can see that easily because sprinting and running animations are different - speed hackers use the run animation while have the sprint speed.
Anyway, point being it was easily noticeable.
Some are hard to see, others not.
Tip for guys that don't know how cheaters are detected: Server logs.
Game is fantastic great fun, seen very little evidence of hacking you do come accross better players who get accused of hacking but all in all great MMO.
These posts seem to be a little false around the edges .. I wonder why.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Seen 2 speed hackers so far (since launch) and reported them both, after that haven't seen any - 180h played according to xfire. So, hacking being rampant is total BS.
The problem here is that initially you get not very subtle hacking whereas later you will find players start to use hacks in a more subtle way to give them the competative edge. Especially when the stakes are high. The first wave might be banned through simple observation but the next wave will be more difficult unless AV secures its client, does more validation and finds a way to automatically search for odd behaviour.
I am afraid AV are quite incapable of responding to this just based on there past performance. Also as a final nail in the coffin many hacks where confirmed whhhay back in beta. AV did nothing to create easy detection back then.
As I said in another thread weeks ago,
It's the knowledge that cheating is potentially possible by so many that spoils the game.
You lose a fight that should have been in your favour? Then your opponant "must" have been cheating.
Guild A had a city in no time? "Must" have been cheating?
How can I compete with players that can obtain good gear, mounts and cash by "cheating" if I play by the rules?
By this point the game is futile. Every loss you incurr you can account to someone possibly cheating. Why? Because the client is easy to manipulate and unguarded.
Game is fantastic great fun, seen very little evidence of hacking you do come accross better players who get accused of hacking but all in all great MMO. These posts seem to be a little false around the edges .. I wonder why.
They haven't been enlightened by the DF gospel yet!
Game is fantastic great fun, seen very little evidence of hacking you do come accross better players who get accused of hacking but all in all great MMO. These posts seem to be a little false around the edges .. I wonder why.
They haven't been enlightened by the DF gospel yet!
Eventually even the non believers see the light.
Game is awesome incredible tremendous magnificent fun, seen only tiny insignificant minuscule evidence of hacking except on youtube or from players on the official forums or from several official developer responses to said hacking issues, I'm not in denial.
You do come across many better players like me who do get accused of hacking, but we are all definitely not hacking we are all just better players then you, all in all the greatest most awesome best MMO ever.
These posts (anything negative about Darkfall) seem to be a little false around the edges, because everything negative about Darkfall is obviously false and only posted by care bare troll haters, people who have not even played Darkfall and developers from other games that are threatened by Darkfalls success , I'm not in denial.
I went to the Damncheaters hompage (using a public computer) and seeing what they could present there I no longer feel any interest in this game.
Good luck with finding a game without hackers. It is obvious that they are people who will make hacks and people who are willing to use them.
So ? I have seen them in every multiplayer game I played : CS, DoD, Starcraft, CoD4, Cod:WaW, AoC etc.
I don't know any secured, hack-proof games or software. Get real.
At least here like in all pay to play games you can successfully ban the account which is used by cheater.
If they would stick to credit/debit cards as way of payment then ban on CC/DC number would solve a problem with keeping hackers away from DF servers.
Of course it means they have actually have GM / admins online constantly looking for such people. I believe they should introduce a new command ingame to report hackers for fast admin respond.
The whole 'all games have hacks' argument is naieve. Lets take WoW for example, it is relatively secure despit the market for hacks being hundreds of thousands times larger than DF. They aggresively fight the fight legally, technically and in game. Having said that there is a working comercial bot (the creator is being sued by blizzard). At the other end of the scale is DF way to much 'trust' of the client, no server checking, little security in the netcode. The reazson it has been hacked is because it was trivial to do so.
As an aside It's ironic to improve your character (and so getbetter skills) in WoW requires a clever (and quite complex) comercial piece of software. To do it in DF requires something that pushes the left mouse button every 10 seconds.
AV having a clear line on 'cheating' would be helpful to. e.g. is un attended macroing OK or not? Ask 100 players and 50 will say yes 50 will say no. AV will say one thing one week sonething different the next.
Comments
Please. That excuse was debunked weeks ago.
How does lag cause people to see through walls? Run across the map in minutes? Teleport to chests, then back to your city? Teleport into the sky and speed hack run through the clouds so you won't be seen? Use no stamina?
The evidence is pretty in contrevertable to be honest,
Mortal Online seams to have a very brutal PvP ... look here. First they are joking abit ... this pre closed beta clip. Thereafter it gets very mortal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P09ErtE3emM&feature=channel_page
Btw, there will allways be hackers. I hope admins bann those people ... forever.
Seen 2 speed hackers so far (since launch) and reported them both, after that haven't seen any - 180h played according to xfire.
So, hacking being rampant is total BS.
Iiii-iiiiiit's.... me!!! *Hooray*
I went to the Damncheaters hompage (using a public computer) and seeing what they could present there I no longer feel any interest in this game.
The problem here is that initially you get not very subtle hacking whereas later you will find players start to use hacks in a more subtle way to give them the competative edge. Especially when the stakes are high. The first wave might be banned through simple observation but the next wave will be more difficult unless AV secures its client, does more validation and finds a way to automatically search for odd behaviour.
I am afraid AV are quite incapable of responding to this just based on there past performance. Also as a final nail in the coffin many hacks where confirmed whhhay back in beta. AV did nothing to create easy detection back then.
Its funny. People do't play but see hackers everywhere and people who play barely see any hackers.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Let's think about possible cheats in DFO;
Modified graphics, ok you can see through walls - who cares about the minimal advantage ("hard" to detect)
3rd party software controlling targeting - aimbots (good luck with bows)
Teleporting - easy to detect because you moved too fast from point a to point b without going the line between a to b
Flying - easy to detect because your Z-axis is messed up
Moving too fast - also easy to detect
Unlimited stamina - easy to detect and this was based on a bug which was fixed and it's no longer possible
It's just easy to toss couple cool pics and quote a site that customer's get banned sooner or later, meanwhile I'll have my fun in DFO.
Those are only the top of the iceberg.
Realistically thinking; in MMOs and computer software in general there are always some bugs and coding errors that can be exploited by those that try. Normally the amount of subtle bugs are greater than the amount of obvious bugs for logical reasons. It is only common sense that when the Darkfall software have such massive flaws that allows those major exploits to happen it has an enormous potential to be exploited in more subtle ways.
By its nature Darkfall will attrackt a lot of peeps who won't stand back from meta-gaming or going very close to borderline cheating, and others who will cross to do subtle exploits just to get that little more edge. And I have no interest in trying to compete with people who simply can't stick within the boundaries of the game. In this case I am standing weak, as the current state of Darkfall makes the boundaries diffuse. I also know how these weak boundaries will give some people great advantages that will forever set their position within the game, that is why I have lost interest.
Darkfall will proberly survive though, it just isn't as awesome as it would like to appear.
Iiii-iiiiiit's.... me!!! *Hooray*
I think someone just had the matrix smiley they wanted to use..
Currently playing Real Life..
http://i36.tinypic.com/2uyod3k.gif
For all your stalking needs..
http://www.plurk.com/Random_
I don't about you but I'm playing since Monday and didn't see anyone hack,untill now.But there are A LOT of macroers.
Also from my clanmates i only heard 3 or 4 times that they saw someone hack...
I think someone just had the matrix smiley they wanted to use..
Nope . A spontaneous burst of inspiration from the bump i received triggerd by tumble i took from my chair
+ a lil' bit of luck when searching for a pic to match my matrix analogy that i made in my post =
what you see in front of your screen atm
Iiii-iiiiiit's.... me!!! *Hooray*
How would you know if they are just running at the limits of normal speed without using stam? There are several conclusions one could make from your observation (or lack of it). Hacking not being rampant is not a logical one.
You can see that easily because sprinting and running animations are different - speed hackers use the run animation while have the sprint speed.
Anyway, point being it was easily noticeable.
Some are hard to see, others not.
Tip for guys that don't know how cheaters are detected: Server logs.
Game is fantastic great fun, seen very little evidence of hacking you do come accross better players who get accused of hacking but all in all great MMO.
These posts seem to be a little false around the edges .. I wonder why.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
The problem here is that initially you get not very subtle hacking whereas later you will find players start to use hacks in a more subtle way to give them the competative edge. Especially when the stakes are high. The first wave might be banned through simple observation but the next wave will be more difficult unless AV secures its client, does more validation and finds a way to automatically search for odd behaviour.
I am afraid AV are quite incapable of responding to this just based on there past performance. Also as a final nail in the coffin many hacks where confirmed whhhay back in beta. AV did nothing to create easy detection back then.
As I said in another thread weeks ago,
It's the knowledge that cheating is potentially possible by so many that spoils the game.
You lose a fight that should have been in your favour? Then your opponant "must" have been cheating.
Guild A had a city in no time? "Must" have been cheating?
How can I compete with players that can obtain good gear, mounts and cash by "cheating" if I play by the rules?
By this point the game is futile. Every loss you incurr you can account to someone possibly cheating. Why? Because the client is easy to manipulate and unguarded.
They haven't been enlightened by the DF gospel yet!
Eventually even the non believers see the light.
They haven't been enlightened by the DF gospel yet!
Eventually even the non believers see the light.
Game is awesome incredible tremendous magnificent fun, seen only tiny insignificant minuscule evidence of hacking except on youtube or from players on the official forums or from several official developer responses to said hacking issues, I'm not in denial.
You do come across many better players like me who do get accused of hacking, but we are all definitely not hacking we are all just better players then you, all in all the greatest most awesome best MMO ever.
These posts (anything negative about Darkfall) seem to be a little false around the edges, because everything negative about Darkfall is obviously false and only posted by care bare troll haters, people who have not even played Darkfall and developers from other games that are threatened by Darkfalls success , I'm not in denial.
Good luck with finding a game without hackers. It is obvious that they are people who will make hacks and people who are willing to use them.
So ? I have seen them in every multiplayer game I played : CS, DoD, Starcraft, CoD4, Cod:WaW, AoC etc.
I don't know any secured, hack-proof games or software. Get real.
At least here like in all pay to play games you can successfully ban the account which is used by cheater.
If they would stick to credit/debit cards as way of payment then ban on CC/DC number would solve a problem with keeping hackers away from DF servers.
Of course it means they have actually have GM / admins online constantly looking for such people. I believe they should introduce a new command ingame to report hackers for fast admin respond.
The whole 'all games have hacks' argument is naieve. Lets take WoW for example, it is relatively secure despit the market for hacks being hundreds of thousands times larger than DF. They aggresively fight the fight legally, technically and in game. Having said that there is a working comercial bot (the creator is being sued by blizzard). At the other end of the scale is DF way to much 'trust' of the client, no server checking, little security in the netcode. The reazson it has been hacked is because it was trivial to do so.
As an aside It's ironic to improve your character (and so getbetter skills) in WoW requires a clever (and quite complex) comercial piece of software. To do it in DF requires something that pushes the left mouse button every 10 seconds.
AV having a clear line on 'cheating' would be helpful to. e.g. is un attended macroing OK or not? Ask 100 players and 50 will say yes 50 will say no. AV will say one thing one week sonething different the next.