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Members of the EU starting to push back against socialism

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  • PyrichPyrich Member Posts: 1,040
    Originally posted by baff


    All right wingers are largely ignored in Europe. The far right is quite often outlawed completely.

     
    France, Britain and Germany are all large enough to ignore everyone all the time and do. 
     
    The EU is set up to be a direct counter to the U.S.
    Close alliance with the U.S. by it's members is almost seen as treachery. The cowds all boo and hiss at any such suggestion that U.S. co-operation/integration is more important to you than theirs.



     

    As it should,  when founded the US basic foriegn policy was to not take sides out of non-US affairs.  Most of the military (all of the Navy and a very large amount of the Amry) was disbanded in hopes of being far enough away to being left the hell alone. 

    The Quasi War proved that fantasy (though nice) wasn't going to work well with France getting upset because we refused to pay their king after they beheaded him.  Navy was reborn and watery warfare ensued.  The other choice was a war with Britain.....  which happened again anyways....  and grew us a little more....  a number of other conflicts and then the civil war.  Each one reinforcing the idea of having a stronger federal military rather than a group of armed concerned citizens only willing to go to extremes when things where personal.

    The invention of the nuclear bomb has pretty much caused what was left of the philosophy to disappear.

     

     

    All the founding fathers of the US warned against making enemies just as much as allies.  Not that we (Europeans decendants mostly) shouldn't wish well, be feelingless or even turn a cold shoulder for the plight of the place of our ancestories,  just that it isn't our problem we left/ got kicked out after all.

  • baffbaff Member Posts: 9,457

    It isn't 1800 anymore. This letter did not take 3 months to get to you. You aren't "far away" at all.

     

     

    It is your problem when a block of nations as powerful as Europe is trying to take over from you economically and militarily.

    You make a lot of extra money by having the Dollar as the reserve currency of the world. You have control over the entire worlds life savings.

    You make a lot of money by being the largest trade block in the world.

     

    You don't want your military actions in the Middle East or the Caribeean or South America or the Pacific directly blocked or impinged by proxy. There are resources there much loved by the U.S. citizens. Highly profitable trade routes and markets too.

    Your national foreign policy is far easier to pursue when you are the military leader. The worlds only super power.

     

    If you sit back and do nothing, the status quo won't just "stay the same". Someone with more will than you is going to take away from you many of things you have worked hard to get.

     

     

    It's not in Czechs intrests or my countries intrests to see that happen. If you don't give a shit, then we might as well just join right in with the EU and get as much as we can out of your downfall, I guess.

     

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
    Originally posted by Pyrich

    Originally posted by Elikal


    Boy, you dont the HECK know whatcha talking about. I grew up in a socialist country. You have NO IDEA what socialism means. The truth we realized now is, that it isnt capitalism that is theatened, it is capitalism that's the threat!
    You have been fed with so much misinformation, it sickens me. As if there was only dark age communism or total free market and no in between. I thought we stopped thinking in such extremes some time ago? Fact is that total free market is just as bad as total control of the government; there must be some form of balance, and after some sorts of speculative money making put the traditional capitalism at risk, it is a logical thing to make some controls. Freedoms ends where actions endanger the entire system itself! After all, a democratic goverment is for the common good, not the particular good of 2% stock brokers and high risk traders.
    So readjustments are the logical consequence of the system failure. I dont see why there is such a fuzz over simple, logical reactions and necessities.



     

    Most Americans agree that socialism is an awesome idea.

     

    We just are a little wary of giving complete control of government,  money AND the worlds strongest military all to the same people. (our generation or 6 generations ahead of us)

     

    Keep them seperate and hope for the best.

     

     

     

    ** I mean it just smells like a bad recipe.  Somthing you dont want in the oven.

     

    ***The last serious liberal president we had forced the American people against their will to go to some boondock Asian country for crying out load.  All in the name of their version of democracy,  why only the unbathed and drug induced "Peace, love and chicken grease" crowd seen this as a MAJOR problem just escapes me.

     

    You know, thats the root of all the common misconception that is so widespread in USA. This fear of giving "the government" too much power. You still have that political reflex of the era of George Washington. Back then all governments were Monarchies and his suspicioun was well founded. This "on noes socialism comes" is such a ridiculous fetish in America ever since the commie-hunt days.

    Sure you can listen to the well paid stock experts and economy professors. But maybe you look on whose payrolls they are. Sure they get Nobel Prices... but OTHER well paid "experts". They speak for the interests of the 2% richest! Of course they want total freedom of the government - total freedom to answer the people! But is that democratic? No. They want to be free to answer YOU. They want to rip you of, use you as source for their riches and leave you with minimal rights and influence. Sure, they give you a job when it suits them. One that pays more and more Americans SO little that they have to have 3 jobs and STILL must sleep in their cars. Maybe you start to look at whats going on in your wonderful country. Millions of homeless, millions of undernourished, millions of people who are poor EVEN THO they have a job, many who loose their homes, their houses, their savings, and the topdogs even take bonuses! The USA education system, health care, social welfare is the worst in ALL of the west. Heck, in Germany even in the 1880ies under an Emperor we had better social welfare than you have today. I really dont hate USA, but heck your system is casino capitalism! It means putting humans into an arena of "wolf eats wolf"- reality. They talked you into that, and it serves only those 2%. It doesnt serve you.

     

    But you live in a democracy! Its the government OF the people BY the people FOR the people, not some alien power coming from Mars, heck! It is YOU to whom you give power - or not! The people must have the final say over everything! The government of the people must regulate everything; there can be no "private" thing that is only one self's matter, because all decisions have results, and usually they effect the common good. In a real democracy where REALLY the will of the people and the good of the people is executed, the only thing that is "private" is sleep!

    I know you value your so called "freedoms", but you can never be free of the results of your actions, and thus unconditional freedom exists only in anarchy of endless crime-wars, not in a just and secure society, where the government of the people saves the majority from the greed and treachery of a few. I am afraid America will have to learn this the hard way one day not too far now.

     

    On a higher level, it is funny to see that now things come back to America what they did to others. And even though it is in a mild form. Heck, didnt you plaster every European city with your trashy fast food chains, with sugar-filled Cola, with soldiers and imported all the wonderous American good? I know SO many people and companies where American locusts (aka investors) took over so many European companies just to fire everyone and be rid of the competition. For decades USA even implemented its own governments where it suited them! Maybe you ask the family of Mr. Aliende in Chile what they feel about USA. America acted as if they owned the planet, aggressively invading foreign cultures, politics and economy for decades. USA always wanted other nations to open their markets for their trash products and US themselves closed and protected their own market with tax funds and laws to foreign nations. They preach water and drink wine. You only were for open market when you benefitted; when it damaged US interets USA NEVER practices open trade themselves. And now, finally, the tide of economy has turned. And what you did to the economy of others for decades fires back to you.

    You can call it what you want. I call it JUSTICE. You finally get what you sowed, what you did to other nations so long. And when finally your nation belongs to France, UK, Japan and China maybe you are lucky and those cultured nations teach you something about a better government, because you could learn a lot from them. (I say that being neither of them.)

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • LynxJSALynxJSA Member RarePosts: 3,334
    Originally posted by Pyrich



    Most Americans agree that socialism is an awesome idea.

     

    Source?

     

     

    -- Whammy - a 64x64 miniRPG 
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  • HuntingtomHuntingtom Member Posts: 41

    Europeans are finally realizing the negative effects of socialism.  I hope Obama takes note.

    PBBG List.

  • ZindaihasZindaihas Member UncommonPosts: 3,662
    Originally posted by xxvicexx


    Obama has spent almost 3.5 trillion dollars in less then a month for his grand society.
    Just today he decided to use the government to decide the affairs of a private company.
    His goal is as obvious as Chavez's was..He will use the institutes of this nation to destroy the foundations of this nation.
     
    He needs to be removed from power asap. I'd rather have 3.6 years of Biden then another month of this joke.



     

    Yeah, I could be wrong, but I think President Obama just crossed a line that has never been crossed before in American History.  A sitting President of the United States forcing out the CEO of a major US corporation.  He's essentially appointed a puppet CEO to run GM, making Obama the de facto CEO of the car company.

    Very Chavez-esque and very scary.

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