The "smart" enemies are not so smart. Turbine has to tweak them as many will continue to run away to try and get optinal distance and not bother to stop and attack again.
If we put it into proper perspective and relate the experiance to more popular games it's hard to say DDO AI is dumb. I'm not saying the AI is flawless, but I am convinced the overall PvE experiance and combat mechanics is more advanced then most of the other mmo's I've played. This simply means I've not played a more engaging experiance.
For the sake of the arguement, could you reference a few other titles where the combat and AI appears intelligent?
Of course I wish the AI in DDO were even "smarter". Would I would like is more randomness to Mob's placement which could even facilitate a Healer NPC that healed other NPCs as the party was attempting to deliver a beat down.
No need to compare it to other games. DDO has the best combat but to say the AI is any good is untrue. The ranged Mobs currently run away and continue this has been documented by Turbine as something they are fixing in Mod 9. It is quite easy to use the limited AI to the players advantage time after time. But this is true of most games.
DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
It has been noted your use of the report facility at the slightest provocation, so I would think twice about flaming with fanboy comments unless you want to be judged by the same standards.
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Well the reality is dynamic content is WAY beyond the scope of Turbine developers. It would be a nice touch - and offer a ton of replayability. I just think people have beat the horse dead enough about whether or not they are going to do it. It's not going to happen, it won't ever happen, and people just need to accept that fact. When the producer says "yeah we're NOT looking into that at this time, but it would be cool to do that" instead of "absolutely, we've got that being worked on" - it's not even on the "nice to have" list.
Something tells me they farmed a lot of the initial development out in the beginning. One time, the devs actually stated that the models and textures were done by a third party. While I don't disagree that this can be more efficient in some scenarios, at best having to piecemeal things together indicates A) a lack of full investment in the proper staff and modules becoming Franken-Ware (each module needing to be "assembled" from parts all using different methodologies).
As it stands now, if you went into a dungeon with the same party, and did the exact same thing every time, the monsters would respond identically--every time.
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Having content evolve would be nice in a single player game, doesn't really work in a mulitplayer game, because the world does not revolve around you. There is no RP reason for the resetting of an instance, or the respawning of a rare mob in any other MMO, it is an artifical construct. Basing AI on a construct that is totally illogical just adds more nonsense. But that should be obvious.
Originally posted by Rokurgepta DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Having content evolve would be nice in a single player game, doesn't really work in a mulitplayer game, because the world does not revolve around you. There is no RP reason for the resetting of an instance, or the respawning of a rare mob in any other MMO, it is an artifical construct. Basing AI on a construct that is totally illogical just adds more nonsense. But that should be obvious.
Actually it would work and in many MMOs things others do can and will affect the game you play. It may not work in DDO, but to say it does not work in multiplayer games is untrue. What is the RP reason of respawning a rare mob in DDO? Or is it the same artificial construct? Sorry Doc but you are wrong. Things like this add to a game they are not illogical. What is illogical is the same named mob always being there when you play. That is illogical.
Both are artificial, in DDO an instance resets as if it had never been played, in a standard MMO you have an incremental reset where spawns reappear as do named encounters. Realistically once a named mob is killed then in theory unless there are some other RP reason for it to be brought back then it should stay dead, never to be seen again. This of course isn't much fun, so we get a reset of some form.
I have to say I haven't seen anything but really superficial player impact in a PvE environment, such as housing or alike. So I would be interested in an example that involved killing a named boss that had an impact on the rest of the players, that didn't involve a reset at some point. If you could give an example where the AI evolved based on each time the rare was killed all the better.
I am also interested how your AI improvement will work for the person who has killed the boss 50 times partnered with a person on their first run, or how the quest would evolve in such a way that a shared experience suits both players. For one the mobs would be fresh and ready to defend their base, for the other just corpses and looted chests surely?
Comments
If we put it into proper perspective and relate the experiance to more popular games it's hard to say DDO AI is dumb. I'm not saying the AI is flawless, but I am convinced the overall PvE experiance and combat mechanics is more advanced then most of the other mmo's I've played. This simply means I've not played a more engaging experiance.
For the sake of the arguement, could you reference a few other titles where the combat and AI appears intelligent?
Of course I wish the AI in DDO were even "smarter". Would I would like is more randomness to Mob's placement which could even facilitate a Healer NPC that healed other NPCs as the party was attempting to deliver a beat down.
No need to compare it to other games. DDO has the best combat but to say the AI is any good is untrue. The ranged Mobs currently run away and continue this has been documented by Turbine as something they are fixing in Mod 9. It is quite easy to use the limited AI to the players advantage time after time. But this is true of most games.
DDO does not have great MOB AI. You run the same quests over and over and the MOBs never advance their tactics. You would think in a game that has limited content the MOBs would at least learn a bit from the hundreds of parties to have killed it in the past.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
It has been noted your use of the report facility at the slightest provocation, so I would think twice about flaming with fanboy comments unless you want to be judged by the same standards.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Well the reality is dynamic content is WAY beyond the scope of Turbine developers. It would be a nice touch - and offer a ton of replayability. I just think people have beat the horse dead enough about whether or not they are going to do it. It's not going to happen, it won't ever happen, and people just need to accept that fact. When the producer says "yeah we're NOT looking into that at this time, but it would be cool to do that" instead of "absolutely, we've got that being worked on" - it's not even on the "nice to have" list.
Something tells me they farmed a lot of the initial development out in the beginning. One time, the devs actually stated that the models and textures were done by a third party. While I don't disagree that this can be more efficient in some scenarios, at best having to piecemeal things together indicates A) a lack of full investment in the proper staff and
modules becoming Franken-Ware (each module needing to be "assembled" from parts all using different methodologies).
As it stands now, if you went into a dungeon with the same party, and did the exact same thing every time, the monsters would respond identically--every time.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Having content evolve would be nice in a single player game, doesn't really work in a mulitplayer game, because the world does not revolve around you. There is no RP reason for the resetting of an instance, or the respawning of a rare mob in any other MMO, it is an artifical construct. Basing AI on a construct that is totally illogical just adds more nonsense. But that should be obvious.
Blimey is it the same mob every time you play the instance, the poor thing, it must be a nightmare for it having to repeat the same encounter, sometimes having to play the same part in multiple instances at the same time. How remiss of Turbine not to build that obvious fact in to the AI!
Sorry but your response made absolutely no sense. Stop being a fanboy and think for yourself and then come back.
There is a difference between you not being able to understand and something not making sense. But to clarify, you inferred in your post that mob AI should be based on the learning ability of a dead mob. Death normally limits the learning process, unless you are implying that same mob is resurrected repeatedly.
I have highlighted the relevant part just in your post in case you didn't read what you had written.
So we are to assume that in a game where we run the same quest and run into the same named mobs everytime that they are in fact different mobs? Sorry but that makes no sense as I said before. So yes the implication is the same mob gets resurrected over and over and therefore should learn a bit from these experiences, Imagine how cool it would be to actually have the instances change over time? Oh my god dynamic content.
Having content evolve would be nice in a single player game, doesn't really work in a mulitplayer game, because the world does not revolve around you. There is no RP reason for the resetting of an instance, or the respawning of a rare mob in any other MMO, it is an artifical construct. Basing AI on a construct that is totally illogical just adds more nonsense. But that should be obvious.
Actually it would work and in many MMOs things others do can and will affect the game you play. It may not work in DDO, but to say it does not work in multiplayer games is untrue. What is the RP reason of respawning a rare mob in DDO? Or is it the same artificial construct? Sorry Doc but you are wrong. Things like this add to a game they are not illogical. What is illogical is the same named mob always being there when you play. That is illogical.
Both are artificial, in DDO an instance resets as if it had never been played, in a standard MMO you have an incremental reset where spawns reappear as do named encounters. Realistically once a named mob is killed then in theory unless there are some other RP reason for it to be brought back then it should stay dead, never to be seen again. This of course isn't much fun, so we get a reset of some form.
I have to say I haven't seen anything but really superficial player impact in a PvE environment, such as housing or alike. So I would be interested in an example that involved killing a named boss that had an impact on the rest of the players, that didn't involve a reset at some point. If you could give an example where the AI evolved based on each time the rare was killed all the better.
I am also interested how your AI improvement will work for the person who has killed the boss 50 times partnered with a person on their first run, or how the quest would evolve in such a way that a shared experience suits both players. For one the mobs would be fresh and ready to defend their base, for the other just corpses and looted chests surely?