I just dont wanna invest hours apon hours into a game and then have everything taken away by someone else. It would make me mad and quit. Life is stressful enough why would i want the same in a game? Its about having fun and relaxing, not stressing out about having to regain all of my gear. I love pvp but not when it affects the mood of a game. Pvp is better when it adds to the quality and makes it enjoyable.
I understand what your saying.
But why do you think FFApvp is stressful? It's only a game, most of the things you lose when you die you either have more of in a bank or aren't hard to replace with cash you make with normal play.
My RL is pretty demanding yet I find fun in FFA games I would never consider them stressful (why play a game if its stressful?)
Im a married man, with four children. I have a fulltime job in sales and a partime job helping my brother unload trucks at his job (extra cash is good). I would be the first dude to piss and moun if the 5-10 hours i get to play a MMO a week was stressful LOL!
FFAPVP = fun, not stress.
If you dont mind can you tell me if you actually tried to get into a FFA pvp game? or is the idea of losing stuff seem like it wouldnt be fun for you?
Again, that is because you are wired that way.
I have friends who view all video games as a complete waste of time. I also have coworkers who view them as something that adults wouldn't be doing.
And they give their reasons and I can't say they are too far off. Except that I am wired in such a way to find them fun.
It really is about temperment.
I mean, there are people who love and collect hummel figurines. I can't for the life of me understand why, but they do it and they love it and there is a market for it.
It's probably because I am wired differently.
So people who don't want to lose equipment are probably enjoying a different angle in the game.
Case in point. I don't get frustrated in traffic. Ever. Ever. Ever. I also have infinite patience with lines. Doesn't matter how long.
But you can't tell me that the average person can't stand traffic and hates lines. Because much is made of the fact that they do.
Are they any lesser than me or weaker? No. Though there is in my opinion nothing stressful about traffic or lines for some reason people hate it. I chalk it up to them being wired in a completely different way.
I understand people, like what they like. I am in no way saying my style of play makes me better or worse than someone else.
My thread is basically a helping hand to pvp fans that have never tried FFA for some reason.
Some people just have the wrong Idea when it comes to FFA pvp.
Like the person that I was responding to when you quoted me seems like one of those players that never ever tried FFA they just have an idea of how it would feel to lose stuff and think its a bad thing.
Well, I'm not saying that you are attributing anything to anyone. But when you say FFAPVP = fun, not stress it's important to point out that your temperment is such that you find it fun. But other people will just not be able to make that leap.
Quite frankly the real way to get people who like pvp but are reticent to do ffa pvp is to put them in a large warband and "have at it".
Or even just a full party (or whatever the system is in Eve for instance).
Like another person mentioned, they need a reason to attack another and can't find it in themselves to attack someone just because they can. I fall into that same category. I just can't go up to a stranger and just attack him. It just doesn't occur to me to even want to do that.
But when setting up larger battles or even roving warbands that makes a bit more sense to me. It sort of sets the stage for what ffa is about (at least how I view it).
Of course there is the whole ganking mentality but the hope is that by attacking a small party or individual, you will bring out a larger party or warband.
If not then that also would not be fun as I don't find ganking people fun or enjoyable and it would get old pretty fast.
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I understand people, like what they like. I am in no way saying my style of play makes me better or worse than someone else. My thread is basically a helping hand to pvp fans that have never tried FFA for some reason. Some people just have the wrong Idea when it comes to FFA pvp. Like the person that I was responding to when you quoted me seems like one of those players that never ever tried FFA they just have an idea of how it would feel to lose stuff and think its a bad thing.
I have to agree with you here. If you like PvP then the only reason why you would ot want to try full loot PvP is if you just do not like taking stuff from people you defeat. Personally I am not wired that way so I see no reason to take/destory stuff other players have just because I have beaten them in PvP. As such I see no reason to engage in fool loot PvP.
PvP would be more fun if people are nicer about it. Nothing ruins gameplay when you pk someone and they start cussing at you or they pk you and still cuss at you. I think people needs an attitude adjustment.
They're just words, man. Personally I've never been one to smak-talk in PVP, but I have no problem ignoring those who do.
I guess I just have a "thicker skin" than some people about these things, and don't take everythng personally.
Part of that could be a person's own environment. There are a good many people (believe it or not) who actually embrace social manners and who would never think to insult a person just to do it. It comes as a shock to see this done in such a cavalier attitude.
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I don't like ffapvp at all, with or without looting. I've always preferred faction based pvp, rvr like daoc. As far as looting, I find it a pain to have to craft, keep stuff in bank, go to bank, get out stuff to go back out and fight. It is just another kind of time sink. Thats cool Dude, If you tried FFA and don't like it thats your choice. FFA is only a pvp option its not the only way to enjoy pvp. I actually like RVR also. one of the reason why I play DAoC Lite (WAR) as my second MMO.
I don't mind time sinks, but that particular one just bores me. I rather lose experience, even a level, or stats that have to always visit the bank and get armor than most likely I had to take up crafting for (which I'm not fond of). Take into account having to gather materials if can't just buy easily, ugh, see where I am going with this? I find that extremely boring, lol. Just like how you would prefer to de-level when you die I would rahter just lose gear. I already tried the XP loss death penalty and it wasn't my bag.
One other reason I am not fond of looting in pvp, and it is a bit of a silly one, but I hate to loot, lol. Having to click the corpse and then each item or a loot all even, just don't want to bother. When I am rich in a game, I usually don't even loot the corpses, or if I do, I'll just grab the cash. That leads me into why I love the group, hehe. Other people like to loot corpses usually, so I let them do all the work and if it is something good, I get a chance to roll for the item. LOL! everyone has their quirks.
Oh, also the whole only risk what you're willing to lose is usually the smart way of playing, but it seems to take something away from the game. People just end up playing with easily obtained gear, stuff they store in bank and makes me wonder, whats the whole point. It is all worthless stuff and just wastes time going back and forth. If someone were to use really good stuff and lose it, the person taking it would most likely just bank it so they wouldn't lose. you're a bit mistaken on the gear being worthless atleast in EvE anyway. See i've been playing Eve for a decent amount of time. the stuff that I consider "stuff I could easily replace" would freaking make a new player so rich they could pay for a two month Eve game subscription if they killed me. Also the stuff I bank are special item. not Wtf pwnage items things that took forever to get that are special too me. i dont take them out because the other stuff I use is just better.
I do see one fix to this which people probably wouldn't like and that is to make the game heavily gear dependant, as well as player skill. That way, someone with really rare gear will demolish those 4 guys who are naked and in noob gear, or just the run of the mill crafted crap. This would force people to actually use good equipment because otherwise they would not be able to win. Thats a pretty cool option, in Eve a vet in a t2 ship depending on who he's fighting would hand 2-3 newbs in t1 ships. that makes the guys in lesser gear/ships work harder and get into better stuff as time goes on. Its not all pvp in throw away stuff
Maybe have like gear values such as the lowbie crafted sword is a 10, but the guy wearing great armor is a armor value of 20 so no weapons of lower value can do significant dmg. People can use them at any time of course, it is just you won't have a legion of people with starter gearing taking out vets. Of course if enough people with that value 10 sword attacks the guy with value 20 armor, they will kill him, but without risking your good stuff, you won't get the reward. Anyway something like that. I just never liked how risk vs reward was done and the time sink of replacing gear taking away from the whole purpose of ffapvp You have a couple decent Ideas if you do ever decide to get into a FFA game you should stop by a suggestion forums and drop a few lines for the devs to read.
Even though my thread wasn't directed toward you (more toward pvpers that never tried FFA but like the idea) i enjoyed responding to ya. thanks for the post.
I don't like ffapvp at all, with or without looting. I've always preferred faction based pvp, rvr like daoc.
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
PvP would be more fun if people are nicer about it. Nothing ruins gameplay when you pk someone and they start cussing at you or they pk you and still cuss at you. I think people needs an attitude adjustment.
They're just words, man. Personally I've never been one to smak-talk in PVP, but I have no problem ignoring those who do.
I guess I just have a "thicker skin" than some people about these things, and don't take everythng personally.
The problem here that it is personal because the other guy made it personal. When someone beats me in PvP it is them playing their character beating me playing my character. It's a contest of skills and it would be silly to take it personal. Yet for some people insist on making it personal by insulting me directly. I can ignore it as I would ignore any other insect but I have to take it peronally because the other person already made it personal.
I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
The problem here that it is personal because the other guy made it personal. When someone beats me in PvP it is them playing their character beating me playing my character. It's a contest of skills and it would be silly to take it personal. Yet for some people insist on making it personal by insulting me directly. I can ignore it as I would ignore any other insect but I have to take it peronally because the other person already made it personal.
You do realize that even though these games are labeled as "Hardcore. Personal insults and RL threats are against the Rules if done in Chat within the game.
This is only a videogame its ment to be fun, sure things could get heated but if someone is really trying to verbally assault you when they kill you. you can get those guys banned for a while.
This is one of the reasons why the most you will get out of me in a public chat is "GF"
I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
I don't like ffapvp at all, with or without looting. I've always preferred faction based pvp, rvr like daoc.
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
I would have to agree with you. I find it more fun to just have the battle lines drawn and then we have at it.
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I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well, first off I think that's splitting hairs. He is not using the word "work" as doing some sort of arduous task in order to gain a far greater reward. I means putting in effort.
However, you bring up a very important point which is usually not addressed in these types of threads and that is the territorial conflict.
Lately I've been playing warhammer because I miss pvp but don't want to devote my life to a game. And there is no sense of ownership in that game. at least not on lower tiers (I'm currently in Tier 3).
I joined a warband and we were taking keeps and battlefield objectives. We then go to one keep but we find out that in order to take it we will have to expend a lot of effort.
So what does the group do? They decide to go to another pariing so they can have an easier time of it.
I was floored.
Where is the effort of taking that keep away from them? Using some tactics? In Lineage 2, win or lose, we had two hours. And we would fight our hearts out.
But in Warhammer it seems that if it's hard then you just go do something else. A flaw in that game.
But sure, the taking of territory is key. I sort of envy players of eve and dark fall when I look at territory markers. Where you can carve out your own kingdom and defend it. That is what really needs to be emphasized in these ffa threads.
The looting? Who cares is my opinion.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I don't like ffapvp at all, with or without looting. I've always preferred faction based pvp, rvr like daoc.
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
I would have to agree with you. I find it more fun to just have the battle lines drawn and then we have at it.
Do you really think a FFA pvp game is all about ganking and stealing shit from weaker people?
You think people have no reason to pvp?
We have faction pvp, Gvg, AvA, Tourneys and all kinds of pvp.
So many people have the wrong idea when it comes to FFA pvp.
I don't get how so many people could see FFA that way.
FFA is only another form of death penalty it doesnt mean we dont have reasons to pvp other then ganking.
Edit: LOL! you responded to my other post. lol ok atleast you realize that FFApvp/sandbox mmo players have a reason to pvp.
I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well, first off I think that's splitting hairs. He is not using the word "work" as doing some sort of arduous task in order to gain a far greater reward. I means putting in effort.
However, you bring up a very important point which is usually not addressed in these types of threads and that is the territorial conflict.
Lately I've been playing warhammer because I miss pvp but don't want to devote my life to a game. And there is no sense of ownership in that game. at least not on lower tiers (I'm currently in Tier 3).
I joined a warband and we were taking keeps and battlefield objectives. We then go to one keep but we find out that in order to take it we will have to expend a lot of effort.
So what does the group do? They decide to go to another pariing so they can have an easier time of it.
I was floored.
Where is the effort of taking that keep away from them? Using some tactics? In Lineage 2, win or lose, we had two hours. And we would fight our hearts out.
But in Warhammer it seems that if it's hard then you just go do something else. A flaw in that game.
But sure, the taking of territory is key. I sort of envy players of eve and dark fall when I look at territory markers. Where you can carve out your own kingdom and defend it. That is what really needs to be emphasized in these ffa threads.
The looting? Who cares is my opinion.
Agreed. Not sure why FFAPvP has to be lumped together with player looting. Ownership of territory, defense of that territory (ahh, the glory days of Shadowbane), that is what appeals to a broad-base of PvPers and has yet to be done truly right (again other than Shadowbane, which had it's own major flaws not related to PvP).
Before WAR was released, these were the things that sounded so appealing to me. Territory control, keep control, sacking of cities.....it's just not how it turned out, or at least it didn't have the type of meaning that I thought it would.
I've been running into this alot lately in Eve and I used to run into this in UO also. I would get a long list of buddies then later find out that over half of them were just straight up too scared to venture into FFA areas. It's only a videogame guys, please take advantage of a game and its FFApvp mechanic. I can understand if you dont like FFApvp thats not what this is about. Im talking about the players that play these games and stay in a safe area all day... forever. In Eve these guys either stay in high sec space 100% or pay rent to some 0.0 alliance and are basically even safer in this area of the game then the high sec guys. They all miss out on so much of the game by doing this, it kills me. When my very own buddies do this it kills me even more. last week I let a friend use my Alt account to come with me to low sec and mess a few people up (or try LOL!) Since that day he's been skilling up his main for Frig pvp in low sec and thanks me everytime he sees me. Basically saying "Bro, If it wasn't for you I would be running missions forever like a pussy". Guys please stop being afraid and this just doesnt go for Eve this goes for any game with some type of risky pvp. We have a few games coming out soon that will use this FFA mechanic how are you going to take advantage of these new games if your too afraid to experience the best parts???
And again im talking about the people that play these games and actually like the idea of FFA but are too afraid to lose gear and money Not the guys that hate pvp and dont think pvp with risk is fun.
Thanks for reading.
Eve has a sadistically brutal death penalty. It isn't about item looting, it's about the cost of replacement. I think most of the potential Eve has is wasted on the overly harsh death penalty. Sure, you can train 12 million skill points, but most people cant afford to lose the gear that those skill points make available. Cool looking new visibly customizable new ships... that no one can afford to pilot.
Do you really think a FFA pvp game is all about ganking and stealing shit from weaker people? You think people have no reason to pvp? We have faction pvp, Gvg, AvA, Tourneys and all kinds of pvp. So many people have the wrong idea when it comes to FFA pvp. I don't get how so many people could see FFA that way. FFA is only another form of death penalty it doesnt mean we dont have reasons to pvp other then ganking.
Of course there is a significant difference between FFA PvP and FFA Full Loot PvP. So while I see no reason to engage in FFA Full Loot PvP I actually have no objections to engaging in FFA No Loot PvP and have done so as a nice distraction from my usual playstyle.
I think if you are an older player, like 40+, your twitch reflexes slow down a bit. I used to play a quake style fps anywhere from 2 to 8 hours a day and I got pretty good at it. But after a few years I just couldn't tolerate the incessant clicking. So I left fps and moved to mmo's with their turn based combat.
Now it seems that a lot of newer mmo's, especially those with pvp, want to use psuedo fps type combat. Atleast in real fps you can use skill to get a head shot, or maybe time someone's movements and hit them with a two or three shot combo and take them out, with the right weapon. In mmo's with this alleged fps style combat, you end up clicking the same mob 15 to 20 times. Well, doing that hour after hour adds up.
So pvp with the newer combat styles is sort of biased toward the younger players. Probably a good number of people in the 40+ range with years of gaming behind them are gonna be at a disadvantage.
The other thing is a younger player may have a different attitude toward full loot because their outlook on time invested is different. A young person feels like they have eternity ahead of them, so if they lose time invested maybe they feel it's no big deal. But as you get older you realize time is infact finite, and you don't appreciate having the time you invested in something washed down the drain. Especially when you get gang banged and your corpse dry humped. Playing a game, achieving something, only to get raped makes you feel like maybe your time could have been spent more productively some place else.
These are just my opinions ofcourse. I'm sure there are players 40+ with views 180 degrees different from mine.
The other thing is a younger player may have a different attitude toward full loot because their outlook on time invested is different. A young person feels like they have eternity ahead of them, so if they lose time invested maybe they feel it's no big deal. But as you get older you realize time is infact finite, and you don't appreciate having the time you invested in something washed down the drain. Especially when you get gang banged and your corpse dry humped. Playing a game, achieving something, only to get raped makes you feel like maybe your time could have been spent more productively some place else.
These are just my opinions ofcourse. I'm sure there are players 40+ with views 180 degrees different from mine.
I agree with this viewpoint. Annoying people, limited game play time .. it's just not worth it anymore.
Do you really think a FFA pvp game is all about ganking and stealing shit from weaker people? You think people have no reason to pvp? We have faction pvp, Gvg, AvA, Tourneys and all kinds of pvp. So many people have the wrong idea when it comes to FFA pvp. I don't get how so many people could see FFA that way. FFA is only another form of death penalty it doesnt mean we dont have reasons to pvp other then ganking.
Of course there is a significant difference between FFA PvP and FFA Full Loot PvP. So while I see no reason to engage in FFA Full Loot PvP I actually have no objections to engaging in FFA No Loot PvP and have done so as a nice distraction from my usual playstyle.
Like I said All Full loot or partial loot is, is a Death penalty.
I tell new players to think about it like a Repair bill. only difference is you know the amount of the repair bill before you get blown up and it could get expensive.
Once you get around that FFA full loot pvp is just like everything else with the exception of maybe trying not to die a little more since you may not want to pay a repair bill lol.
Eve is partial loot anyway, pirates dont get Ships, implants or Isk when they blow you up. they get about 20-30% of the fittings you had lol. its not bad.
I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well I say work but I dont mean it in the term you took it as. Someone above used a better term, that term was effort.
I do realize that there is more to FFA PvP than just ganking. A big percentage in those games is just that, ganking.
Talk to me about FFA PvP without player looting and I have no problem with that but IMO player looting changes the dynamic of FFA PvP games. (there is other consequnces to loosing besides loosing items that you put effort into getting)
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Does losing a fight mean a hour of time lost? A few hours? Only a 1/2 hour? If so, no thanks. My time is far too valuable and making me grind for virtual cash to re-buy what I lost is not FUN, challenging, hardcore, or requires any amount of skill. It just requires TIME. WIth a job, family, and only around 2 hrs to play each night, I don't want to spend any amount of that time recouping ANYTHING. Am I afraid to waste my time? Hell no. I just don't want to. Besides, If you have plenty of time to waste, what the heck are you actually risking anyway? You can just play long enough to eliminate any sort of loss.
ON a PvP server in WOW I could win and lose fights, have fun, and still get a thrill and feel a rush. And I could go back and crush the people I lost against without feeling like I'm wasting my time or theirs. Punishing myself or punishing the other guy doesn't make me feel better about myself. If that turns you on, so be it. Just don't expect most people to think thats a fun activity.
Afraid? Oh please. The act of winning or losing, knowing I was better or the opponent was better is good enough for a videogame folks. Its a v i d e o g a m e.
Does losing a fight mean a hour of time lost? A few hours? Only a 1/2 hour? If so, no thanks. My time is far too valuable and making me grind for virtual cash to re-buy what I lost is not FUN, challenging, hardcore, or requires any amount of skill. It just requires TIME. WIth a job, family, and only around 2 hrs to play each night, I don't want to spend any amount of that time recouping ANYTHING. Am I afraid to waste my time? Hell no. I just don't want to. Besides, If you have plenty of time to waste, what the heck are you actually risking anyway? You can just play long enough to eliminate any sort of loss. ON a PvP server in WOW I could win and lose fights, have fun, and still get a thrill and feel a rush. And I could go back and crush the people I lost against without feeling like I'm wasting my time or theirs. Punishing myself or punishing the other guy doesn't make me feel better about myself. If that turns you on, so be it. Just don't expect most people to think thats a fun activity. Afraid? Oh please. The act of winning or losing, knowing I was better or the opponent was better is good enough for a videogame folks. Its a v i d e o g a m e.
Reread my posts in this thread please. This thread is not directed to people that dont like the Idea of FFApvp.
Does losing a fight mean a hour of time lost? A few hours? Only a 1/2 hour? If so, no thanks. My time is far too valuable and making me grind for virtual cash to re-buy what I lost is not FUN, challenging, hardcore, or requires any amount of skill. It just requires TIME. WIth a job, family, and only around 2 hrs to play each night, I don't want to spend any amount of that time recouping ANYTHING. Am I afraid to waste my time? Hell no. I just don't want to. Besides, If you have plenty of time to waste, what the heck are you actually risking anyway? You can just play long enough to eliminate any sort of loss. ON a PvP server in WOW I could win and lose fights, have fun, and still get a thrill and feel a rush. And I could go back and crush the people I lost against without feeling like I'm wasting my time or theirs. Punishing myself or punishing the other guy doesn't make me feel better about myself. If that turns you on, so be it. Just don't expect most people to think thats a fun activity. Afraid? Oh please. The act of winning or losing, knowing I was better or the opponent was better is good enough for a videogame folks. Its a v i d e o g a m e.
Reread my posts in this thread please. This thread is not directed to people that dont like the Idea of FFApvp.
And the bottom line is, they may not be afraid of FFA PvP, it just might not be their style. Simple as that. Just because I'm not scared of jumping out of an airplane doesn't mean that I want to do it.
I love the feeling of going out into a FFA environment with possibility of losing it all. Risk vs Reward, one of the true staples of a quality and successful game. But after playing the epic failure that is Darkfall, I have a WHOLE NEW respect for Eve online and what they have accomplished in all these years. Everything from a true sandbox MMO, to epic graphics updates that continue to revitalize the genre. When you step into 0.0 space you know you can make ALOT of money or lose it all, it is a great feeling. All 0.0 pirates know exactly what I mean.
Bravo CCP!
There is hope yet for the FFA-PVP MMORPG genre.
Sidenote: Notice all the darkfall fanboys already attacking people in this thread for no reason at all? Typical
And the bottom line is, they may not be afraid of FFA PvP, it just might not be their style. Simple as that. Just because I'm not scared of jumping out of an airplane doesn't mean that I want to do it. Yes I did only read your OP and this one, lol.
Sums it up nicely. It really has nothing to do with fear. Time is money, and becomes frequently more scarce as you get older, and most people don't want to waste it losing their achievements to people who have little responsability and can afford to stalk the servers 70-80 hours a week. It's just simply not fun.
I think the people that don't play these types of games are having a hardtime understanding my OP.
I'll use Eve as an example since its the FFA game im playing atm.
In Eve we have players that read about Eve's pvp, they liked the idea of FFA pvp, they thought the 0.0 Pvp sounded cool and Faction warfare seemed interesting.
So they download Eve and enjoy the game. Now these players came to the game with the intetions of actually pvping.
well instead these guys/gals decided to run missions for cash (which is smart actually) and over time they get into cooler ships and after hearing all the pvp horror stories actually become afraid of the whole concept.
I know this sounds stupid but seriously this is how things go down in Eve and is one of the reasons so many players are in high sec lol.
I have friends like this and after getting a few of them into pvp even though they were a bit afraid I figured I would come to the forums and Knudge a few interested Pvpers into the whole pvp scene by reasuring them that FFA pvp isnt the devil and its only a game and they should actually try it out.
My OP is targetting players that think FFA might be cool but their a bit afraid to try it out.
This is not a thread asking if you like Eve or FFA, this is not a thread talking about Niche mmo features and this totally isnt a thread asking what game you would rather pvp in.
Comments
I understand what your saying.
But why do you think FFApvp is stressful? It's only a game, most of the things you lose when you die you either have more of in a bank or aren't hard to replace with cash you make with normal play.
My RL is pretty demanding yet I find fun in FFA games I would never consider them stressful (why play a game if its stressful?)
Im a married man, with four children. I have a fulltime job in sales and a partime job helping my brother unload trucks at his job (extra cash is good). I would be the first dude to piss and moun if the 5-10 hours i get to play a MMO a week was stressful LOL!
FFAPVP = fun, not stress.
If you dont mind can you tell me if you actually tried to get into a FFA pvp game? or is the idea of losing stuff seem like it wouldnt be fun for you?
Again, that is because you are wired that way.
I have friends who view all video games as a complete waste of time. I also have coworkers who view them as something that adults wouldn't be doing.
And they give their reasons and I can't say they are too far off. Except that I am wired in such a way to find them fun.
It really is about temperment.
I mean, there are people who love and collect hummel figurines. I can't for the life of me understand why, but they do it and they love it and there is a market for it.
It's probably because I am wired differently.
So people who don't want to lose equipment are probably enjoying a different angle in the game.
Case in point. I don't get frustrated in traffic. Ever. Ever. Ever. I also have infinite patience with lines. Doesn't matter how long.
But you can't tell me that the average person can't stand traffic and hates lines. Because much is made of the fact that they do.
Are they any lesser than me or weaker? No. Though there is in my opinion nothing stressful about traffic or lines for some reason people hate it. I chalk it up to them being wired in a completely different way.
I understand people, like what they like. I am in no way saying my style of play makes me better or worse than someone else.
My thread is basically a helping hand to pvp fans that have never tried FFA for some reason.
Some people just have the wrong Idea when it comes to FFA pvp.
Like the person that I was responding to when you quoted me seems like one of those players that never ever tried FFA they just have an idea of how it would feel to lose stuff and think its a bad thing.
Well, I'm not saying that you are attributing anything to anyone. But when you say FFAPVP = fun, not stress it's important to point out that your temperment is such that you find it fun. But other people will just not be able to make that leap.
Quite frankly the real way to get people who like pvp but are reticent to do ffa pvp is to put them in a large warband and "have at it".
Or even just a full party (or whatever the system is in Eve for instance).
Like another person mentioned, they need a reason to attack another and can't find it in themselves to attack someone just because they can. I fall into that same category. I just can't go up to a stranger and just attack him. It just doesn't occur to me to even want to do that.
But when setting up larger battles or even roving warbands that makes a bit more sense to me. It sort of sets the stage for what ffa is about (at least how I view it).
Of course there is the whole ganking mentality but the hope is that by attacking a small party or individual, you will bring out a larger party or warband.
If not then that also would not be fun as I don't find ganking people fun or enjoyable and it would get old pretty fast.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I have to agree with you here. If you like PvP then the only reason why you would ot want to try full loot PvP is if you just do not like taking stuff from people you defeat. Personally I am not wired that way so I see no reason to take/destory stuff other players have just because I have beaten them in PvP. As such I see no reason to engage in fool loot PvP.
They're just words, man. Personally I've never been one to smak-talk in PVP, but I have no problem ignoring those who do.
I guess I just have a "thicker skin" than some people about these things, and don't take everythng personally.
Part of that could be a person's own environment. There are a good many people (believe it or not) who actually embrace social manners and who would never think to insult a person just to do it. It comes as a shock to see this done in such a cavalier attitude.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Even though my thread wasn't directed toward you (more toward pvpers that never tried FFA but like the idea) i enjoyed responding to ya. thanks for the post.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
They're just words, man. Personally I've never been one to smak-talk in PVP, but I have no problem ignoring those who do.
I guess I just have a "thicker skin" than some people about these things, and don't take everythng personally.
The problem here that it is personal because the other guy made it personal. When someone beats me in PvP it is them playing their character beating me playing my character. It's a contest of skills and it would be silly to take it personal. Yet for some people insist on making it personal by insulting me directly. I can ignore it as I would ignore any other insect but I have to take it peronally because the other person already made it personal.
I am sorry but I dont want to work my tail off to get something just to get ganked by a squad whos sole purpose is to take your stuff, and I dont want to be in a gank squad that steals some other poor dudes stuff that he worked for. No Thanks Ill pass.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
You do realize that even though these games are labeled as "Hardcore. Personal insults and RL threats are against the Rules if done in Chat within the game.
This is only a videogame its ment to be fun, sure things could get heated but if someone is really trying to verbally assault you when they kill you. you can get those guys banned for a while.
This is one of the reasons why the most you will get out of me in a public chat is "GF"
Edit GF=Goodfight btw lol.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
I would have to agree with you. I find it more fun to just have the battle lines drawn and then we have at it.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well, first off I think that's splitting hairs. He is not using the word "work" as doing some sort of arduous task in order to gain a far greater reward. I means putting in effort.
However, you bring up a very important point which is usually not addressed in these types of threads and that is the territorial conflict.
Lately I've been playing warhammer because I miss pvp but don't want to devote my life to a game. And there is no sense of ownership in that game. at least not on lower tiers (I'm currently in Tier 3).
I joined a warband and we were taking keeps and battlefield objectives. We then go to one keep but we find out that in order to take it we will have to expend a lot of effort.
So what does the group do? They decide to go to another pariing so they can have an easier time of it.
I was floored.
Where is the effort of taking that keep away from them? Using some tactics? In Lineage 2, win or lose, we had two hours. And we would fight our hearts out.
But in Warhammer it seems that if it's hard then you just go do something else. A flaw in that game.
But sure, the taking of territory is key. I sort of envy players of eve and dark fall when I look at territory markers. Where you can carve out your own kingdom and defend it. That is what really needs to be emphasized in these ffa threads.
The looting? Who cares is my opinion.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Same here.
Personally, I don't mind PvP, but I'd rather have a reason behind it, like factional warfare or RvR. FFA PvP, especially with full player loot, just feels like pointless, mindless killing just because you can, at least to me. If I'm going to fight another player, I need control of a territory or some other faction/RP based reason behind WHY I'm fighting them for it to make more sense to me.
Killing him and taking his stuff just because he's there is boring, IMO. After that, what's the point of playing the game? To get more gear so you can have it on hand for the next time you get ganked? Yawn. It just sounds like a meaningless time sink to me.
I would have to agree with you. I find it more fun to just have the battle lines drawn and then we have at it.
Do you really think a FFA pvp game is all about ganking and stealing shit from weaker people?
You think people have no reason to pvp?
We have faction pvp, Gvg, AvA, Tourneys and all kinds of pvp.
So many people have the wrong idea when it comes to FFA pvp.
I don't get how so many people could see FFA that way.
FFA is only another form of death penalty it doesnt mean we dont have reasons to pvp other then ganking.
Edit: LOL! you responded to my other post. lol ok atleast you realize that FFApvp/sandbox mmo players have a reason to pvp.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well, first off I think that's splitting hairs. He is not using the word "work" as doing some sort of arduous task in order to gain a far greater reward. I means putting in effort.
However, you bring up a very important point which is usually not addressed in these types of threads and that is the territorial conflict.
Lately I've been playing warhammer because I miss pvp but don't want to devote my life to a game. And there is no sense of ownership in that game. at least not on lower tiers (I'm currently in Tier 3).
I joined a warband and we were taking keeps and battlefield objectives. We then go to one keep but we find out that in order to take it we will have to expend a lot of effort.
So what does the group do? They decide to go to another pariing so they can have an easier time of it.
I was floored.
Where is the effort of taking that keep away from them? Using some tactics? In Lineage 2, win or lose, we had two hours. And we would fight our hearts out.
But in Warhammer it seems that if it's hard then you just go do something else. A flaw in that game.
But sure, the taking of territory is key. I sort of envy players of eve and dark fall when I look at territory markers. Where you can carve out your own kingdom and defend it. That is what really needs to be emphasized in these ffa threads.
The looting? Who cares is my opinion.
Agreed. Not sure why FFAPvP has to be lumped together with player looting. Ownership of territory, defense of that territory (ahh, the glory days of Shadowbane), that is what appeals to a broad-base of PvPers and has yet to be done truly right (again other than Shadowbane, which had it's own major flaws not related to PvP).
Before WAR was released, these were the things that sounded so appealing to me. Territory control, keep control, sacking of cities.....it's just not how it turned out, or at least it didn't have the type of meaning that I thought it would.
Eve has a sadistically brutal death penalty. It isn't about item looting, it's about the cost of replacement. I think most of the potential Eve has is wasted on the overly harsh death penalty. Sure, you can train 12 million skill points, but most people cant afford to lose the gear that those skill points make available. Cool looking new visibly customizable new ships... that no one can afford to pilot.
-----Zero Punctuation Eve Online Review-----
Of course there is a significant difference between FFA PvP and FFA Full Loot PvP. So while I see no reason to engage in FFA Full Loot PvP I actually have no objections to engaging in FFA No Loot PvP and have done so as a nice distraction from my usual playstyle.
I think if you are an older player, like 40+, your twitch reflexes slow down a bit. I used to play a quake style fps anywhere from 2 to 8 hours a day and I got pretty good at it. But after a few years I just couldn't tolerate the incessant clicking. So I left fps and moved to mmo's with their turn based combat.
Now it seems that a lot of newer mmo's, especially those with pvp, want to use psuedo fps type combat. Atleast in real fps you can use skill to get a head shot, or maybe time someone's movements and hit them with a two or three shot combo and take them out, with the right weapon. In mmo's with this alleged fps style combat, you end up clicking the same mob 15 to 20 times. Well, doing that hour after hour adds up.
So pvp with the newer combat styles is sort of biased toward the younger players. Probably a good number of people in the 40+ range with years of gaming behind them are gonna be at a disadvantage.
The other thing is a younger player may have a different attitude toward full loot because their outlook on time invested is different. A young person feels like they have eternity ahead of them, so if they lose time invested maybe they feel it's no big deal. But as you get older you realize time is infact finite, and you don't appreciate having the time you invested in something washed down the drain. Especially when you get gang banged and your corpse dry humped. Playing a game, achieving something, only to get raped makes you feel like maybe your time could have been spent more productively some place else.
These are just my opinions ofcourse. I'm sure there are players 40+ with views 180 degrees different from mine.
I agree with this viewpoint. Annoying people, limited game play time .. it's just not worth it anymore.
Of course there is a significant difference between FFA PvP and FFA Full Loot PvP. So while I see no reason to engage in FFA Full Loot PvP I actually have no objections to engaging in FFA No Loot PvP and have done so as a nice distraction from my usual playstyle.
Like I said All Full loot or partial loot is, is a Death penalty.
I tell new players to think about it like a Repair bill. only difference is you know the amount of the repair bill before you get blown up and it could get expensive.
Once you get around that FFA full loot pvp is just like everything else with the exception of maybe trying not to die a little more since you may not want to pay a repair bill lol.
Eve is partial loot anyway, pirates dont get Ships, implants or Isk when they blow you up. they get about 20-30% of the fittings you had lol. its not bad.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
How do you "work" for something in a videogame?
I think if you consider anything Work in a game you need to stop playing it. no wonder most of you guys hate on MMO on this site LOL . You consider it work!
You do realise the FFA is more then just ganking for gear/cash right?
You realize these games have Territorial conflicts, factional warfare and other types of pvp also.
Pvp has meaning to the people that play these games.
I think your whole Idea about FFApvp=Gank squad/kill the newbie is really far off.
But it doesnt matter ur a pvp fan just like me. If you like other types of pvp thats cool.
Just try to get the right idea of a game mechanic before you post your going to give players the wrong idea.
Well I say work but I dont mean it in the term you took it as. Someone above used a better term, that term was effort.
I do realize that there is more to FFA PvP than just ganking. A big percentage in those games is just that, ganking.
Talk to me about FFA PvP without player looting and I have no problem with that but IMO player looting changes the dynamic of FFA PvP games. (there is other consequnces to loosing besides loosing items that you put effort into getting)
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Does losing a fight mean a hour of time lost? A few hours? Only a 1/2 hour? If so, no thanks. My time is far too valuable and making me grind for virtual cash to re-buy what I lost is not FUN, challenging, hardcore, or requires any amount of skill. It just requires TIME. WIth a job, family, and only around 2 hrs to play each night, I don't want to spend any amount of that time recouping ANYTHING. Am I afraid to waste my time? Hell no. I just don't want to. Besides, If you have plenty of time to waste, what the heck are you actually risking anyway? You can just play long enough to eliminate any sort of loss.
ON a PvP server in WOW I could win and lose fights, have fun, and still get a thrill and feel a rush. And I could go back and crush the people I lost against without feeling like I'm wasting my time or theirs. Punishing myself or punishing the other guy doesn't make me feel better about myself. If that turns you on, so be it. Just don't expect most people to think thats a fun activity.
Afraid? Oh please. The act of winning or losing, knowing I was better or the opponent was better is good enough for a videogame folks. Its a v i d e o g a m e.
Reread my posts in this thread please. This thread is not directed to people that dont like the Idea of FFApvp.
[Mod Edit]
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Reread my posts in this thread please. This thread is not directed to people that dont like the Idea of FFApvp.
And the bottom line is, they may not be afraid of FFA PvP, it just might not be their style. Simple as that. Just because I'm not scared of jumping out of an airplane doesn't mean that I want to do it.
Yes I did only read your OP and this one, lol.
I love the feeling of going out into a FFA environment with possibility of losing it all. Risk vs Reward, one of the true staples of a quality and successful game. But after playing the epic failure that is Darkfall, I have a WHOLE NEW respect for Eve online and what they have accomplished in all these years. Everything from a true sandbox MMO, to epic graphics updates that continue to revitalize the genre. When you step into 0.0 space you know you can make ALOT of money or lose it all, it is a great feeling. All 0.0 pirates know exactly what I mean.
Bravo CCP!
There is hope yet for the FFA-PVP MMORPG genre.
Sidenote: Notice all the darkfall fanboys already attacking people in this thread for no reason at all? Typical
Sums it up nicely. It really has nothing to do with fear. Time is money, and becomes frequently more scarce as you get older, and most people don't want to waste it losing their achievements to people who have little responsability and can afford to stalk the servers 70-80 hours a week. It's just simply not fun.
I think the people that don't play these types of games are having a hardtime understanding my OP.
I'll use Eve as an example since its the FFA game im playing atm.
In Eve we have players that read about Eve's pvp, they liked the idea of FFA pvp, they thought the 0.0 Pvp sounded cool and Faction warfare seemed interesting.
So they download Eve and enjoy the game. Now these players came to the game with the intetions of actually pvping.
well instead these guys/gals decided to run missions for cash (which is smart actually) and over time they get into cooler ships and after hearing all the pvp horror stories actually become afraid of the whole concept.
I know this sounds stupid but seriously this is how things go down in Eve and is one of the reasons so many players are in high sec lol.
I have friends like this and after getting a few of them into pvp even though they were a bit afraid I figured I would come to the forums and Knudge a few interested Pvpers into the whole pvp scene by reasuring them that FFA pvp isnt the devil and its only a game and they should actually try it out.
My OP is targetting players that think FFA might be cool but their a bit afraid to try it out.
This is not a thread asking if you like Eve or FFA, this is not a thread talking about Niche mmo features and this totally isnt a thread asking what game you would rather pvp in.
Hopefully this clears things up if not I give lol
laterz
Playing: EvE, Ryzom