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Official WAR Sub Numbers: 300k
ParkCarsHere
Member Posts: 666
Sorry if this is old, but it looks like EA has posted the dedicated player base at 300k, along with their $1 billion annual loss financial statement.
Source: www.gamespot.com/news/6209194.html
Edit: (quote for the lazy!) "The most recent info on Warhammer Online puts the game's dedicated player base at 300,000."
Comments
I understand even the devs said sub 500k is a failing game. I personally think 300k is succesful considering every other major mmo launch since wow. Hopefully 300k will supply enough fundage to really work on making this game great.
Overall pretty bad numbers, considering the game was released in Russia since the last report means either the game totaly tanked there or the US and EU sub numbers are still falling.
I agree. Its the expectation game. IN the end 300K to me is a very solid population.
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
300k was reported for last quarter too
www.eurogamer.net/articles/warhammer-online-has-300k-subscribers
EQ2 fan sites
4.5 millions dollar a month from subs only and its not financialy viable..come on, considering how long this game was in developement (very shot) , this only mean good thing no?
Alot of poor numbers should not be a surprise. The world is entrenched in a serious recession and has seen 300-600k job losses(US) every month for 8+ months now. Get real, these numbers are going to continue to fall regardless of anyones opinion/taste in a game itself. No job, no income, no game. Im amazed most games are still doing this well.
Russian launch was Feb. 5th add 30days~ on box. Most of those numbers are probably not calculated in this report. I would imagine that this was a pre-april outline.
Unfortunately this isnt going to be just WAR that is burdened by this realization.
Sorry to break it to you but they won't be makeing anywhere near that much.
Edit: The recession has nothing to do with falling subs if anything most mmorpgs are seeing increased subs because of it.
I happen to have commented on a similar remark on another forum so I'll just paste that here
/Imo there's just as many people looking to MMO's for their entertainment during times of economical downturn (instead of their more expensive hobbies) as there are people who absolutely positively can't even pay for a MMO anymore.
In fact there have been several reports over the past years of MMO's either being unfased or even doing better during times when people have less money.
I *could* agree that people might be less inclined to invest in a MMO they have doubts about or don't feel to be worth the investment as much in bad times though.
Even still, the game probably sold well over a million in EU/US by now and in MJ's own words:
[quote=MJ]That kind of number, which I think he mentioned, was under 50 per cent [of registered users]. Those numbers are considered very low for the industry, very low.[/quote]/
As for the 300k numbers. Indeed rather similar to the last time they disclosed the numbers but most likely that means they continued to show a decline for the US/EU as the game has in the meantime released in several other areas.
So either A) Those area's didn't sell any copies or
The game has declined in the US/EU and the other areas are making up for it. C) A mix of either lol
Edit: Doh, I see I'm just parroting what's already been said with that last part
Edit2: Err Mythic defines their subs *with* people in their free month so those Russians are most definitely counted in there. Also if Russian release is anything like the other areas they sold most of their units at release time and will sell low numbers afterwards, meaning the bulk of expected subs from those areas will be *in* this number. I highly doubt trials count though like I've seen some people saying across the forums.
300k, cool.
I thought the game would be below 200k. I havent played this since october but it's nice to see there are people still hanging in there in craphammer.
No but seriously, I think me and a lot of others had higher expectations due to the fact that the warhammer world is really awesome but this game doesnt nearly give me that feeling of awesomeness.
For me this game was really zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. But still nice to see they are hanging in there.
300k is very solid. 500k is their goal (in my opinion) and i doubt they will ever get higher than that. Still it's enough to keep it running.
MMO wish list:
-Changeable worlds
-Solid non level based game
-Sharks with lasers attached to their heads
don't you just love people that start paragraphs or sentences with the word "No"
Vicky Pollard FTW!
I think you have your sources mixed up. Some players have a bizarre view of how many subs are the 'cut off' for a successful game, and that 500k is the latest arbitrary number I have seen them throw around a lot.
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
I think you have your sources mixed up. Some players have a bizarre view of how many subs are the 'cut off' for a successful game, and that 500k is the latest arbitrary number I have seen them throw around a lot.
Actually MJ himself said somewhere he would consider 500k "successful".
Sorry to break it to you but they won't be makeing anywhere near that much.
Edit: The recession has nothing to do with falling subs if anything most mmorpgs are seeing increased subs because of it.
Just curious, but where are you getting your information? Almost every major MMO i've seen recently is losing subs, or barely hanging on to the ones they already have. WoW included.
Numbers... Statstics...
They are what you want them to be.
I still consider 250-300k subs a good number. And since we don't know if the RU numbers are in there we can only speculate about that.
This have been a good conversation
MMOs are recession proof. Cheap entertainment. When the economy does better, the numbers will drop, for WoW too.
.
Using Xfire how do you actually get an active sub number?
I dont use the site so its basically just a question not to discredit the whole system.
I would actually like to see Eves active subs since after CCP released the 250k subs info the Games persistent player activity has risen almost 35% in the year and change since that announcement.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Wow, I can't believe people are STILL using Xfire numbers to make gross oversimplifications of subscription numbers. I'm sorry to say this, but MOST PEOPLE STILL DO NOT USE XFIRE. I've used it since I heard about it a few years back, but I don't have it on every single minute that I'm playing a game.
Using Xfire numbers as a way to predict anything is purely missing the point. The sample size is too small, and it only caters to the select few of WAR, or any game, who play their MMO while having Xfire running.
Unfortunately the Russian subs are included in the total.
As for xfire it is good at showing general trends in games which you can't really argue that it dosen't because everything it's shown so far has near enough confirmed by official figures, I remember someone on either this board or VN did a mathematical break down of wars xfire stats compared to WOWs and he came up 375k subs everbody laughed at him for useing xfire yet 2-3 months later they released the 300k figure proveing that he was right yet the idiots still refused to admit that he was right.
I played the game since day one and recently cancelled and have two months left on my sub. I wanted the game to do well but honestly there are times when you can log into the game on gorfang and it is deserted. RVR will not happen without players.
There are many problems with the game that really hurt it. The two faction system is not conducive to RVR. Currently if you are on the losing side you will see alot of players just leave the game to roll on the winning side. This puts the currently losing faction at an even bigger disadvantage.
The end game content to be honest is not RVR but PVE. The bosses are still as buggy as the first time we defended our city, Most players do not even bother going anymore. This may change now with the new token system but most players will never see the end game content because we work! Yes 75 to 90% of the city takes are between 12 to 3 am. Very poor design on Mythic's part.
Buggy buggy buggy on fort and city takes. The chest that you get your rewards from are bugged alot of times and Mythic will only send you an Email telling you we are sorry for the problem but we will not help you with your lost bag.
Population caps in forts when the real thing that needs to happen is make them level based content and shard the server. It is tough when you are one of the main tanks and die but cannot get back into the fight. Hmm maybe allow the folks that got there to start with finish the darn fight!!
Bosses two shotting fully warded and gear players. The UI being too slow. Sad when you can go to a free to play game do mass pvp and the UI is more responsive then Mythic's
The worst CSR support of any MMORPG I have played. I have beta tested and been playing MMORPG's since 1998. Go check out the official forums or the fansites. The straw that broke the camels back for me was another 16 hour push to get into the city only to have another chest bug out for the third time and get no response unless you are off line. Do not expect any support from the CSR's or Mythic in this game.
I will not even get into the lag issues.
I wish I could be more positive about the game. I really do enjoy the game but the bugs and lack of support killed it for me.
I think you have your sources mixed up. Some players have a bizarre view of how many subs are the 'cut off' for a successful game, and that 500k is the latest arbitrary number I have seen them throw around a lot.
Actually MJ himself said somewhere he would consider 500k "successful".
You don't see a big difference between MJ saying that he would consider 500k a success and the statement that under 500k is a failing game?
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
On behalf of us lazy people: Thank you! :-)
Unfortunately it's a number that is not clear-cut, which is probably a necessity for Mythic and EA as a clear subscriptions number would bring expectations of another one down the line.
"Dedicated player base" can mean anything from the extremely positive "number of players logged in last week" (suggesting subscriptions are in the 500k+), to the extremely negative "number of players who had an account open during any time during the last quarter, including trials" (which could actually place the current sub number below 100k).
Given the natural inclination to "spin" the numbers a little, I'm guessing it means "the number of players who can currently log into the game, including trials". I would also guess the actual number is not above 300k, as then the text would say "above", not "at".
So 300k, including trials. Using Xfire numbers as guidance (and nothing more), WAR increased about 20% in activity from the trial opened to one month later, so I'd say no more than 20% can be trial accounts at this point. That would place the actual subscribers at 240-300k. Pretty good, imo. People - players and developers - need to stop comparing to WoW.
I think you have your sources mixed up. Some players have a bizarre view of how many subs are the 'cut off' for a successful game, and that 500k is the latest arbitrary number I have seen them throw around a lot.
Actually MJ himself said somewhere he would consider 500k "successful".
You don't see a big difference between MJ saying that he would consider 500k a success and the statement that under 500k is a failing game?
That I can agree with, but I also don't think 40% under his success number was really what he would call successful either.
And to be honest, I think anyone who was there around release time knows there were hoping/expecting for *way* more than either of those numbers and I would *not* have been surprised if they had.
I was guestimating around a million subs before release. Especially after the initial 800k seeing it come to this was surely not in the expectations. (supported by mark's comment of "under 50% of registered users is considered very very low for the industrry).
300k subscriptions worldwide announced by EA for Q4 2008 for Warhammer Online.
WAR goes on a massive advertising blitz, including all major World of Warcraft fan sites.
Adds two long awaited classes, Choppa and Slayer.
Adds a free "expansion".
Advertises tons of bug fixes.
Adds a new token system.
Works on cast lag.
Closes 63 servers to improve population balances.
Announces an opening in Russia claiming much fanfare.
Announces Blue Oyster Cult is writing songs for Warhammer.
Gives away tons of 10-day free trials, with no strings attached.
Increases benefits for returning players to WAR.
Rewards current subs for mass recruiting with free pets, trinkets, baubles and faster in-game mounts.
Mythic attends conventions, sends emissaries to shows and seminars all over the globe to promote WAR.
--------
Result?
--------
300k subscriptions worldwide announced by EA for Q1 for Warhammer Online.
So Q4 2008, you had a guy furiously bailing water out of a leaky rowboat using a bucket that had numerous fist-sized holes.
Now in Q1 2009, the same guy is insanely rowing the boat while its still securely anchored to the dock.
Either way, not much movement and doesn't look good... but maybe they plugged some holes.
"TO MICHAEL!"
On behalf of us lazy people: Thank you! :-)
Unfortunately it's a number that is not clear-cut, which is probably a necessity for Mythic and EA as a clear subscriptions number would bring expectations of another one down the line.
"Dedicated player base" can mean anything from the extremely positive "number of players logged in last week" (suggesting subscriptions are in the 500k+), to the extremely negative "number of players who had an account open during any time during the last quarter, including trials" (which could actually place the current sub number below 100k).
Given the natural inclination to "spin" the numbers a little, I'm guessing it means "the number of players who can currently log into the game, including trials". I would also guess the actual number is not above 300k, as then the text would say "above", not "at".
So 300k, including trials. Using Xfire numbers as guidance (and nothing more), WAR increased about 20% in activity from the trial opened to one month later, so I'd say no more than 20% can be trial accounts at this point. That would place the actual subscribers at 240-300k. Pretty good, imo. People - players and developers - need to stop comparing to WoW.
I agree with most of what you said here, especially your use of Xfire as a guide, not a fool proof method of determining MMO subs.
However, and maybe I'm giving Mythic/EA too much credit, when I see "dedicated player base", I think of the people who were currently subbed for at least 2 billing periods (inc. free months on the retail box). This would mean people played for a month (be it with a sub or their free month) and then liked it enough / forgot they had it and subbed for another month.
I'm sure that's NOT what it means, but I can hope! I'm planning on returning to WAR in the summer when I get some more time, so I'd like to think there are still a lot of people playing it, lol.