Additionally, there are games out there that provide more than WoW, but players like yourself (I'm generalizing here forgive me) ignore them because they are not mainstream and don't have naked dark elf females. The Chronicles of Spellborn is a prime example. That has a wonderful skill/ability system, quests that don't tell you exactly where to go unlike WoW/WAR, and probably the best PvP (due to the skill system and more dynamic combat). But the playerbase is tiny because it doesn't have Orcs, naked elves, and isn't a copy/paste from EQ/EQ2/WoW/WAR, etc.
Hey I agree the Fantasy thing is overdone and love seeing something different but seriously, TCoS is just not that fun of a game. I downloaded the trial to try out the PvP combat and the whole spinning rows of spells thing was just boring to me. I've never been into the Asian hackfests so I might have been biased against the game from the start but it was far from the best PvP.
I'd love to see a game with the AoC combat system, SWG crafting system, DAoC style RvR, be polished at launch and run on older systems like WoW and offer a mixture of 10, 25 and 48 man raids with variable difficulties from WoW and EQ. Wrap it all up in an Underworld/Vamp/Werewolf theme and call it casual hardcore so everyones happy .
as others have said in different phrasings: what is hardcore then? all it is is more time in the game with a lot of grind.
It still exists, just not in the newest releases perhaps. Although, imagine say WoW - so you have 10 alts all geared up and achievements galore. no casual player has that.
Games are not hardcore. People mistake games that are loaded with time sinks to be hardcore. You want hardcore? Turn off the computer, go outside and experience life. That's hardcore.
For me personally a Hardcore game is actually challenging, sure it could have timesinks but what game doesn't?
Games that have harsh death penalties and are more forced grouping or group centric are hardcore to me.
A MMO like Final fantasy with ultra hard raids and a group centric game world is a hardcore game. A game like Eve with a Learning cliff and harsh death penalty are hardcopre games.
I wish you guys would stop telling me to go outside though I have a full time job and spend a massive amount of time with my Wife and children outdoors. Stop pegging everyone that wants a challenging experience as a basement dwelling loser.
Hare core players have never been relevant, in terms of financially, or influence.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
im amazed that people dont think wow is 'hardcore'. any game that has you on a relentless,never ending loot treadmill that takes up hours and hours of your daily life is pretty hardcore (and time wasting) to me. great way to throw away years of your life I suppose, but hey, atleast you got some shiny purple belts and shoes!
in reality there is no such thing as a hardcore game, and those who use the term very likely lead a very sheltered existance. its not hardcore cos you lost your pixelated spaceship in EVE or your pixelated axe in darkfall, all that happened was you lost some pixels in a game and now youre going to have to grind even harder to make up for all the time youve just wasted.
I dislike the terms hardcore and casual as they seem to cater to one very select part of the gaming community, namingly a group of whiners who are constantly crowing and whining because they dont like some aspect in a game, which of course makes a devs job even harder to balance everything out.
I believe valve changed the weapon unlocks to random because they didnt want achievement grind servers being the basis of unlocks, not to appease 'casuals' (though they screwed it up by letting idlers get stuff too). its interesting to note that the first people to whinge, whine and cry were the ones who had spent 16 hours on the first day trying to unlock everything to no avail. would these people be considered hardcore, or casual?
im amazed that people dont think wow is 'hardcore'. any game that has you on a relentless,never ending loot treadmill that takes up hours and hours of your daily life is pretty hardcore (and time wasting) to me. great way to throw away years of your life I suppose, but hey, atleast you got some shiny purple belts and shoes! in reality there is no such thing as a hardcore game, and those who use the term very likely lead a very sheltered existance. its not hardcore cos you lost your pixelated spaceship in EVE or your pixelated axe in darkfall, all that happened was you lost some pixels in a game and now youre going to have to grind even harder to make up for all the time youve just wasted. I dislike the terms hardcore and casual as they seem to cater to one very select part of the gaming community, namingly a group of whiners who are constantly crowing and whining because they dont like some aspect in a game, which of course makes a devs job even harder to balance everything out. I believe valve changed the weapon unlocks to random because they didnt want achievement grind servers being the basis of unlocks, not to appease 'casuals' (though they screwed it up by letting idlers get stuff too). its interesting to note that the first people to whinge, whine and cry were the ones who had spent 16 hours on the first day trying to unlock everything to no avail. would these people be considered hardcore, or casual?
Well, I would say that at this point WoW can be hardcore but it doesn't have to be if you don't put yourself on a loot treadmill. This is something that a certain group of people has done to themselves. It is very feasible to just play it a little here and there, do some quests with family and friends and not even care about upper level loot.
I do agree that there is way too much crying because of video games and it really is a disturbing trend.
I'm not quite sure what you were trying to allude to with whether or not losing pixelated spacehips or axes makes a game hardcore.
Doesn't matter if it is pixelated or not. It's all representational and it all represents time and effort. I can say the same thing about money as the value of money is very relative (and representational) yet people still worry if they lose it.
Some people don't find it fun to lose achievements that they've made in a game. Now, one can argue that that is the game but only a certain subset of people really don't care. And to be honest, I've seen people who claim they don't care go completely nuts about being pk'ed in a game. So apparently they do care. They just care more when it happens to them.
Still, there are players who are very on board with hard loss in a game. But again, that is only a certain subset of players. Many gamers would probably find another game after they realized they didn't like it. Nothing wrong with that.
And yes, I would say that if one spends 16 hours in a day trying to achieve something in a game then that is hardcore.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
hmmm. well just think what really matters in a game. a piece of armor that everyone around you have or the fact that you feel you are much more skilled. you know that and its cool. whats the point of showing off really? are you like 'hey i grinded 24/7 so im better than u'. others would be 'well ok, my son who is ill and skips kindergarten did that a few weeks ago'. skill can only be shown in real time. most of 'achievements', 'stamps' that you did something is more or less grindable. in guildwars everyones lvl20 with same looking weapons and armor. no one complains.
Showing off shows off your hard work and accomplishments withought having to be like oh yeah i did that yeah look at my profile its in my achievement board. Instead you are wearing it on your chest with a sign on the back that says ^ BAD ASS
There is no reason to complain in guild wars. It is Free.
I don't have a problem with creating a game casuals can play but I hate this new thing of dumbing down the game so theres nothing for the hardcore and casuals can get everything. We've seen this with World of Warcraft where theres nothing really anymore for the hardcore to differentiate themselves from the casual players. Now everyone can have everything and things like epics arn't special anymore and you miss that sense of omg he's badass. In SWG for example there was so much you could do to make yourselves different and the main reason for that is they didn't spoon feed the content to you and you had to work it out for yourselves. The suprising satistics I found of how few people did the things that I did, even other hardcore players and it made me feel proud. However if the game is too easy and thousands upon thousands of people have done that same thing, then you just don't care about doing anything. Even in TF2 now they looked at how many people had the unlocked weapons and only a small percentage of players did so they decided to change the system to random so everyone had the chance. I just think thats dumb because the hardcore player has to have something to be different from the rest and if everyone had them then they arn't special anymore. Why should everyone be able to see everything? Alot of people complain about content they wont see but why should they? I just want a game where the time I put into it makes me different and unique so I can feel happy about my character which is important for an mmorpg.
Because content is expensive to make and it won't help the game if 99% of the players wont see it.
You are talking about what YOU want because you are a hardcore. That is obvious NOT what casual players want (do they want epics? do they want to see the raids? hell yes). And they outnumber you 99 to 1. And they don't care if YOU are special.
I see this is a GOOD trend. Development resources is not for the enjoyment of MORE people, not fewer. You don't like it, go find a hardcore game. I highly doubt the game would miss a few of the hardcore players if they can attract more casuals.
im amazed that people dont think wow is 'hardcore'. any game that has you on a relentless,never ending loot treadmill that takes up hours and hours of your daily life is pretty hardcore (and time wasting) to me.
It all depends on what a person sees as hardcore. Personally, I don't find the ability to do repetitive tasks in a zero risk environment for long periods of time to be hardcore, I see that as very dedicated gaming, but not hardcore. Each person has their own definition of what 'hardcore' is and that definition is often based on a comparison to their own playstyle. If someone is into grinding, they'll see the 8-hour a day grinder as hardcore. If someone is into PvP, they'll usually see the people who are into a higher risk form of PvP to be hardcore. If someone is into RP, they'll often see the more diehard RPers as hardocre RPers.
-- Whammy - a 64x64 miniRPG - RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right? - FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
Then those hardcores that rushed to the endgame and to be first, are also the first to bitch at the game devs that the game is too easy. Then they jump ship n off to the next new MMO to do the same thing all over again. So why should Devs concentrate on the Hardcores who are the first to get there and the first to leave? A smart thing would be to concentrate on the players that will keep playing for months if not years, rather than the few that will play a few months.
What a bullcrap. I know no hardcore who complained that game was too easy. And i know no hardcore who left game because he has seen everything. On the contrary, people stick to games where they have proven themselves and have higher hard earned position than the rest. The like to stay and show how leet they are and build their fame as living game legend.
What you are talking about concerns only single player game like resident evil or final fantasy: finish on hardest difficulty, unlock all secrets, see all there is and move onto next game. In case of mmo its just stupid conclusion.
Playing: Rohan Played (from best to worst): Shadowbane, Guild Wars, Shayia, Age of Conan, Warhammer, Runes of Magic, Rappelz, Archlord, Knight online, King of Kings, Kal online, Last chaos
What you are talking about concerns only single player game like resident evil or final fantasy: finish on hardest difficulty, unlock all secrets, see all there is and move onto next game. In case of mmo its just stupid conclusion.What a bullcrap. I know no hardcore who complained that game was too easy. And i know no hardcore who left game because he has seen everything. On the contrary, people stick to games where they have proven themselves and have higher hard earned position than the rest. The like to stay and show how leet they are and build their fame as living game legend.
I totaly disagree with you.
I am hardcore and I do exactly this with mmo's. Just take a recent example Atlantica, I played the game when a new server opened pushed up to lvl 115 had finished every quest in game all I really had left was to continue to run the same stuff I have been running to level my mercs and or new mercs as I got them but technicaly I had finished the content and I quit to move to next game. Same as World of warcrack lvl 60 did some pve saw content was first hwl on my server then quit, back for BC hit lvl 70 stayed for 2 seasons of arena got gladiator in both quit, back for next xpac got 80 saw the content did a season of arena got gladiator and quit again.
Not everyone cares about nerds resepcting them. I dont log in to have kids kiss my ass casue I attained something they dont have in a video game when I know full well I got it casue Im hardcore with the time to put in. I play for my own fun I do what I wanan do with a game and move on.
However people lke me are a serious minority and to think a game would be deveolpoed to cater to people like myself is a pipe dream. Gaming companies are in business to make money and you make money by appealing to a larger audience end of discussion get over it :P
I believe you are seriously mistaken what hardcore means. Hardcore is player who is better than majority, not one that spent more time on the game. To me its great where everybody has easy access to the best items and only skill matters who pwns who. Guild wars being best example of game which allows to show everybody who the leet is. I am not talking about rare armor, which requires only grind, but titles achieved through skilled gameplay, especially pvp titles. Again, nolife doesnt equal hardcore
This. Hardcore should be a matter of skill, not how many hours you spent in a game. Spending years just to hit the level cap, or hours upon hours of grinding for that rare weapon that has a .00000000001% chance to drop, is not hardcore. That is just pathetic, and also the reason why gamers are largely considered wastes of oxygen. A game is only a game, it is not meant to stop you from being a productive member of society, it is not meant to be a job. If you want a job, go get one.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
This. Hardcore should be a matter of skill, not how many hours you spent in a game. Spending years just to hit the level cap, or hours upon hours of grinding for that rare weapon that has a .00000000001% chance to drop, is not hardcore. That is just pathetic, and also the reason why gamers are largely considered wastes of oxygen. A game is only a game, it is not meant to stop you from being a productive member of society, it is not meant to be a job. If you want a job, go get one.
you can think and feel anyway you want however hardcore does mean exactly what you think it doesnt, its time spent playing. A skilled pro is a pro or uber leet etc hardcore referes to time played.. "wow I finaly got xxx after xxx of trying", "wow man you are hardcore".
thats exactly what the term means regardless how you wanna use it.
I am a casual gamer who has been playing MMO's for about 10 years and as i read the many posts on this thread I agree with many of the posts. I think that everyone has their own opinions and points of view; mine are that I have seen many "hardcore-endgamers" rush through game content to get to the highest level, get the uber gear that every other hardcore endgamer has (so they all look the same) and then get bored - blame the devs and then leave. I have been playing LOTRO since closed beta and still do not have a lvl 60 toon (I could easily if all I was interested in was getting to the end), have not even scratched the surface of the quest pool and haven't seen even half of the mid-high end content in the game.
To each their own, when you are paying for a product get what you want from it and if its not meeting your needs then you can always leave... it wont bother me one bit.
I am a casual gamer who has been playing MMO's for about 10 years and as i read the many posts on this thread I agree with many of the posts. I think that everyone has their own opinions and points of view; mine are that I have seen many "hardcore-endgamers" rush through game content to get to the highest level, get the uber gear that every other hardcore endgamer has (so they all look the same) and then get bored - blame the devs and then leave. I have been playing LOTRO since closed beta and still do not have a lvl 60 toon (I could easily if all I was interested in was getting to the end), have not even scratched the surface of the quest pool and haven't seen even half of the mid-high end content in the game. To each their own, when you are paying for a product get what you want from it and if its not meeting your needs then you can always leave... it wont bother me one bit.
QFT
you gotta do what you enjoy whatever that is, some dudes enjoy having girls stomp on there nuts with high heels not soemthing I would like to try but hey to each there own.
I am a casual gamer who has been playing MMO's for about 10 years and as i read the many posts on this thread I agree with many of the posts. I think that everyone has their own opinions and points of view; mine are that I have seen many "hardcore-endgamers" rush through game content to get to the highest level, get the uber gear that every other hardcore endgamer has (so they all look the same) and then get bored - blame the devs and then leave. I have been playing LOTRO since closed beta and still do not have a lvl 60 toon (I could easily if all I was interested in was getting to the end), have not even scratched the surface of the quest pool and haven't seen even half of the mid-high end content in the game. To each their own, when you are paying for a product get what you want from it and if its not meeting your needs then you can always leave... it wont bother me one bit.
QFT
you gotta do what you enjoy whatever that is, some dudes enjoy having girls stomp on there nuts with high heels not soemthing I would like to try but hey to each there own.
Wow I need to get out more I have never once met someone who enjoys that!
I don't have a problem with creating a game casuals can play but I hate this new thing of dumbing down the game so theres nothing for the hardcore and casuals can get everything. We've seen this with World of Warcraft where theres nothing really anymore for the hardcore to differentiate themselves from the casual players. Now everyone can have everything and things like epics arn't special anymore and you miss that sense of omg he's badass. In SWG for example there was so much you could do to make yourselves different and the main reason for that is they didn't spoon feed the content to you and you had to work it out for yourselves. The suprising satistics I found of how few people did the things that I did, even other hardcore players and it made me feel proud. However if the game is too easy and thousands upon thousands of people have done that same thing, then you just don't care about doing anything. Even in TF2 now they looked at how many people had the unlocked weapons and only a small percentage of players did so they decided to change the system to random so everyone had the chance. I just think thats dumb because the hardcore player has to have something to be different from the rest and if everyone had them then they arn't special anymore. Why should everyone be able to see everything? Alot of people complain about content they wont see but why should they? I just want a game where the time I put into it makes me different and unique so I can feel happy about my character which is important for an mmorpg.
If you live in American and voted Obama this is what they call Change. In other words if your too lazy or dumb to do it for yourself, do not worry we will give it too you. All at the the expense of hard working individuals and individuals who invested thousands on higher learning (and are still paying those payments).
QFT you gotta do what you enjoy whatever that is, some dudes enjoy having girls stomp on there nuts with high heels not soemthing I would like to try but hey to each there own.
Hardcore is often though equal fast. Fast to max level and gear or skill or whatever. But there is a minimum time to get there.
A calculation example:
Take WoW 1-80 only leveling without anything else, it's nowadays, what? 6days? 10 days? Let's say 6. 6*24 = 144 h.
The real casual person plays maybe 2h a day. The average MMO casual 3-5h(?). Let's say 4. 144 / 4 = 38 days. Then is farming for gold, items, whatever and you are nowwhere with super mega gear as a raider might have or want. And the average casual player doesn't want to powerlevel, so we are talking 3-6 months (incl. other skills, gold, etc). I've met people who are 80 much less than 5 weeks, which would correspond to 6-8h / day. And we are not talking X-fire time (which only logs the programme, not the active game time).
So that if this isn't hardcore, it is what? Stupidity? No life. I don't know. You tell me.
I don't even dare to take up the calculation for Lineage or similar.
Or is Hardcore equals to skill, to know your game and class and survive better than others, accept PK looting, even permadeath, etc?
Sure, why not. But it takes time. How many (solo) gamers invest 3-600h or more into a game? Minority. Even the 10 million WoW players are just a minority. And what is skill, aside from understanding the mechanics (i.e. tank needs strength, etc). Skill based games such as UO or Darkfall, where people sit for hours to hone a single ingame skill so they are done after a 4 weeks instead of 4 month? Rerolling again, and again, the same areas, mobs, even with different skills - speak: repetitiveness. Most of people would say they hate their job if it were that way. 8 h a day? F that. 10 h in a game with repetitiveness? Hardcore!!! Or?
What is this then? Stupidity? No life? not hardcore? I don't know. You tell me.
Just take a recent example Atlantica, I played the game when a new server opened pushed up to lvl 115 had finished every quest in game...
I know this post is OT, but....
HOLY CRAP
That's some pretty dedicated gaming, man.
ye, I wondered the same. In what real-life time frame did he do this, and in what time frame do the "average" or "casual" players do it? Here it is called dedicated gaming. Or is it hardcore? Or is it whocares, f off?
Comments
Hey I agree the Fantasy thing is overdone and love seeing something different but seriously, TCoS is just not that fun of a game. I downloaded the trial to try out the PvP combat and the whole spinning rows of spells thing was just boring to me. I've never been into the Asian hackfests so I might have been biased against the game from the start but it was far from the best PvP.
I'd love to see a game with the AoC combat system, SWG crafting system, DAoC style RvR, be polished at launch and run on older systems like WoW and offer a mixture of 10, 25 and 48 man raids with variable difficulties from WoW and EQ. Wrap it all up in an Underworld/Vamp/Werewolf theme and call it casual hardcore so everyones happy
.
Games are not hardcore. People mistake games that are loaded with time sinks to be hardcore.
You want hardcore? Turn off the computer, go outside and experience life. That's hardcore.
_________________________________
JonMichael
Currently: AION, an MMO Beta under NDA
Played: WAR, LOTRO, Hellgate: London, CoX, GW, SotNW, DAOC, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AO, Horizons, Second Life, There, TSO
Beta'd: There, Second Life, EQ2, DAOC:LotM, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, Gods and Heroes, Hellgate: London, Requiem:Bloodymare, AoC, WAR, DDO, Fallen Earth
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as others have said in different phrasings: what is hardcore then? all it is is more time in the game with a lot of grind.
It still exists, just not in the newest releases perhaps. Although, imagine say WoW - so you have 10 alts all geared up and achievements galore. no casual player has that.
For me personally a Hardcore game is actually challenging, sure it could have timesinks but what game doesn't?
Games that have harsh death penalties and are more forced grouping or group centric are hardcore to me.
A MMO like Final fantasy with ultra hard raids and a group centric game world is a hardcore game. A game like Eve with a Learning cliff and harsh death penalty are hardcopre games.
I wish you guys would stop telling me to go outside though I have a full time job and spend a massive amount of time with my Wife and children outdoors. Stop pegging everyone that wants a challenging experience as a basement dwelling loser.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
----------
"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
Because Hardcore Gamers don't exist.
Hardcore or challenging games do however.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
im amazed that people dont think wow is 'hardcore'. any game that has you on a relentless,never ending loot treadmill that takes up hours and hours of your daily life is pretty hardcore (and time wasting) to me. great way to throw away years of your life I suppose, but hey, atleast you got some shiny purple belts and shoes!
in reality there is no such thing as a hardcore game, and those who use the term very likely lead a very sheltered existance. its not hardcore cos you lost your pixelated spaceship in EVE or your pixelated axe in darkfall, all that happened was you lost some pixels in a game and now youre going to have to grind even harder to make up for all the time youve just wasted.
I dislike the terms hardcore and casual as they seem to cater to one very select part of the gaming community, namingly a group of whiners who are constantly crowing and whining because they dont like some aspect in a game, which of course makes a devs job even harder to balance everything out.
I believe valve changed the weapon unlocks to random because they didnt want achievement grind servers being the basis of unlocks, not to appease 'casuals' (though they screwed it up by letting idlers get stuff too). its interesting to note that the first people to whinge, whine and cry were the ones who had spent 16 hours on the first day trying to unlock everything to no avail. would these people be considered hardcore, or casual?
Well, I would say that at this point WoW can be hardcore but it doesn't have to be if you don't put yourself on a loot treadmill. This is something that a certain group of people has done to themselves. It is very feasible to just play it a little here and there, do some quests with family and friends and not even care about upper level loot.
I do agree that there is way too much crying because of video games and it really is a disturbing trend.
I'm not quite sure what you were trying to allude to with whether or not losing pixelated spacehips or axes makes a game hardcore.
Doesn't matter if it is pixelated or not. It's all representational and it all represents time and effort. I can say the same thing about money as the value of money is very relative (and representational) yet people still worry if they lose it.
Some people don't find it fun to lose achievements that they've made in a game. Now, one can argue that that is the game but only a certain subset of people really don't care. And to be honest, I've seen people who claim they don't care go completely nuts about being pk'ed in a game. So apparently they do care. They just care more when it happens to them.
Still, there are players who are very on board with hard loss in a game. But again, that is only a certain subset of players. Many gamers would probably find another game after they realized they didn't like it. Nothing wrong with that.
And yes, I would say that if one spends 16 hours in a day trying to achieve something in a game then that is hardcore.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
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Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Showing off shows off your hard work and accomplishments withought having to be like oh yeah i did that yeah look at my profile its in my achievement board. Instead you are wearing it on your chest with a sign on the back that says ^ BAD ASS
There is no reason to complain in guild wars. It is Free.
Because content is expensive to make and it won't help the game if 99% of the players wont see it.
You are talking about what YOU want because you are a hardcore. That is obvious NOT what casual players want (do they want epics? do they want to see the raids? hell yes). And they outnumber you 99 to 1. And they don't care if YOU are special.
I see this is a GOOD trend. Development resources is not for the enjoyment of MORE people, not fewer. You don't like it, go find a hardcore game. I highly doubt the game would miss a few of the hardcore players if they can attract more casuals.
It all depends on what a person sees as hardcore. Personally, I don't find the ability to do repetitive tasks in a zero risk environment for long periods of time to be hardcore, I see that as very dedicated gaming, but not hardcore. Each person has their own definition of what 'hardcore' is and that definition is often based on a comparison to their own playstyle. If someone is into grinding, they'll see the 8-hour a day grinder as hardcore. If someone is into PvP, they'll usually see the people who are into a higher risk form of PvP to be hardcore. If someone is into RP, they'll often see the more diehard RPers as hardocre RPers.
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
Then those hardcores that rushed to the endgame and to be first, are also the first to bitch at the game devs that the game is too easy. Then they jump ship n off to the next new MMO to do the same thing all over again. So why should Devs concentrate on the Hardcores who are the first to get there and the first to leave? A smart thing would be to concentrate on the players that will keep playing for months if not years, rather than the few that will play a few months.
What a bullcrap. I know no hardcore who complained that game was too easy. And i know no hardcore who left game because he has seen everything. On the contrary, people stick to games where they have proven themselves and have higher hard earned position than the rest. The like to stay and show how leet they are and build their fame as living game legend.
What you are talking about concerns only single player game like resident evil or final fantasy: finish on hardest difficulty, unlock all secrets, see all there is and move onto next game. In case of mmo its just stupid conclusion.
Playing: Rohan
Played (from best to worst): Shadowbane, Guild Wars, Shayia, Age of Conan, Warhammer, Runes of Magic, Rappelz, Archlord, Knight online, King of Kings, Kal online, Last chaos
I totaly disagree with you.
I am hardcore and I do exactly this with mmo's. Just take a recent example Atlantica, I played the game when a new server opened pushed up to lvl 115 had finished every quest in game all I really had left was to continue to run the same stuff I have been running to level my mercs and or new mercs as I got them but technicaly I had finished the content and I quit to move to next game. Same as World of warcrack lvl 60 did some pve saw content was first hwl on my server then quit, back for BC hit lvl 70 stayed for 2 seasons of arena got gladiator in both quit, back for next xpac got 80 saw the content did a season of arena got gladiator and quit again.
Not everyone cares about nerds resepcting them. I dont log in to have kids kiss my ass casue I attained something they dont have in a video game when I know full well I got it casue Im hardcore with the time to put in. I play for my own fun I do what I wanan do with a game and move on.
However people lke me are a serious minority and to think a game would be deveolpoed to cater to people like myself is a pipe dream. Gaming companies are in business to make money and you make money by appealing to a larger audience end of discussion get over it :P
This. Hardcore should be a matter of skill, not how many hours you spent in a game. Spending years just to hit the level cap, or hours upon hours of grinding for that rare weapon that has a .00000000001% chance to drop, is not hardcore. That is just pathetic, and also the reason why gamers are largely considered wastes of oxygen. A game is only a game, it is not meant to stop you from being a productive member of society, it is not meant to be a job. If you want a job, go get one.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
you can think and feel anyway you want however hardcore does mean exactly what you think it doesnt, its time spent playing. A skilled pro is a pro or uber leet etc hardcore referes to time played.. "wow I finaly got xxx after xxx of trying", "wow man you are hardcore".
thats exactly what the term means regardless how you wanna use it.
I am a casual gamer who has been playing MMO's for about 10 years and as i read the many posts on this thread I agree with many of the posts. I think that everyone has their own opinions and points of view; mine are that I have seen many "hardcore-endgamers" rush through game content to get to the highest level, get the uber gear that every other hardcore endgamer has (so they all look the same) and then get bored - blame the devs and then leave. I have been playing LOTRO since closed beta and still do not have a lvl 60 toon (I could easily if all I was interested in was getting to the end), have not even scratched the surface of the quest pool and haven't seen even half of the mid-high end content in the game.
To each their own, when you are paying for a product get what you want from it and if its not meeting your needs then you can always leave... it wont bother me one bit.
QFT
you gotta do what you enjoy whatever that is, some dudes enjoy having girls stomp on there nuts with high heels not soemthing I would like to try but hey to each there own.
QFT
you gotta do what you enjoy whatever that is, some dudes enjoy having girls stomp on there nuts with high heels not soemthing I would like to try but hey to each there own.
Wow I need to get out more I have never once met someone who enjoys that!
I know this post is OT, but....
HOLY CRAP
That's some pretty dedicated gaming, man.
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
If you live in American and voted Obama this is what they call Change. In other words if your too lazy or dumb to do it for yourself, do not worry we will give it too you. All at the the expense of hard working individuals and individuals who invested thousands on higher learning (and are still paying those payments).
LOL dude that hurt just reading it!
Talk about a ball breaker.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
Hardcore is often though equal fast. Fast to max level and gear or skill or whatever. But there is a minimum time to get there.
A calculation example:
Take WoW 1-80 only leveling without anything else, it's nowadays, what? 6days? 10 days? Let's say 6. 6*24 = 144 h.
The real casual person plays maybe 2h a day. The average MMO casual 3-5h(?). Let's say 4. 144 / 4 = 38 days. Then is farming for gold, items, whatever and you are nowwhere with super mega gear as a raider might have or want. And the average casual player doesn't want to powerlevel, so we are talking 3-6 months (incl. other skills, gold, etc). I've met people who are 80 much less than 5 weeks, which would correspond to 6-8h / day. And we are not talking X-fire time (which only logs the programme, not the active game time).
So that if this isn't hardcore, it is what? Stupidity? No life. I don't know. You tell me.
I don't even dare to take up the calculation for Lineage or similar.
Or is Hardcore equals to skill, to know your game and class and survive better than others, accept PK looting, even permadeath, etc?
Sure, why not. But it takes time. How many (solo) gamers invest 3-600h or more into a game? Minority. Even the 10 million WoW players are just a minority. And what is skill, aside from understanding the mechanics (i.e. tank needs strength, etc). Skill based games such as UO or Darkfall, where people sit for hours to hone a single ingame skill so they are done after a 4 weeks instead of 4 month? Rerolling again, and again, the same areas, mobs, even with different skills - speak: repetitiveness. Most of people would say they hate their job if it were that way. 8 h a day? F that. 10 h in a game with repetitiveness? Hardcore!!! Or?
What is this then? Stupidity? No life? not hardcore? I don't know. You tell me.
I know this post is OT, but....
HOLY CRAP
That's some pretty dedicated gaming, man.
ye, I wondered the same. In what real-life time frame did he do this, and in what time frame do the "average" or "casual" players do it? Here it is called dedicated gaming. Or is it hardcore? Or is it whocares, f off?
My $15 = Your $15.
/end thread