Isn´t it a bit like classes then? I.e. like logging into his priest or druid in... WoW?^^
Sorry for trolling.
In a way you are correct, the ship you fly is the 'class you are'. Difference being the same character can be many classes, where as in WOW you have to reroll new characters.
Now its true, many EVE players have mulitple accounts, mostly so they can speed things up and do perform more quickly. But there's just as many patient players with 80M SP's right now who have one character who can do most of everything, fly Capitals, heavy miners, steath ships and are captains fo manufactuing and industry.
All just a matter of patience.
problem is everything looks appetizing! i want to try it all!
Isn´t it a bit like classes then? I.e. like logging into his priest or druid in... WoW?^^
Sorry for trolling.
In a way you are correct, the ship you fly is the 'class you are'. Difference being the same character can be many classes, where as in WOW you have to reroll new characters.
Now its true, many EVE players have mulitple accounts, mostly so they can speed things up and do perform more quickly. But there's just as many patient players with 80M SP's right now who have one character who can do most of everything, fly Capitals, heavy miners, steath ships and are captains fo manufactuing and industry.
All just a matter of patience.
problem is everything looks appetizing! i want to try it all!
Yep, me too, which is why I also have 3 accounts...and most of those are focused on just flying every races smalls ships well.
I think this year I might branch some of them off and have one go the capital route, another might actually take up mining (who would have thought?)
3rd one will probably focus on flying jump freighters and other heavy haulers.
I also plan to take up wormhole exploration and see what living on the other side is like.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I was always confused as to what Sandbox means. So...lets compare eve to say WoW a game that is cited as a "theme park" game, what things does EVE have in it that are different than WoW that make it a sandbox?
It better to ask what is common between them? The answer is: Nothing.
Sandbox is and engine where players model the gameplay. You have many tools and pullers that you use to affect to game. Entire game is based on many equations where you can affect more or less of his parameters. Something like the one described from Oracle in Matrix 3.
In contrast Theme park is like a Disney land, you go there and play the attractions the creators have make for you.
Get ti?
Where themepark games try to hide that they are copying WOW, games like Mortal Online and Darkfall make no attempt to hide their inspiration ______\m/_____ LordOfDarkDesire
Originally posted by miagisan 1) you can do whatever you wanna do ....
Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided.
We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them.
Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either.
Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
Isn´t it a bit like classes then? I.e. like logging into his priest or druid in... WoW?^^
Sorry for trolling.
This post isn't trolling (not sure bout your other ones tho).
Yes, "ships" are like Classes. Ships perform a role and provide a layer of tactical transparency similar to Classes. So EVE's gains the benefits of class based paradigm however now there is T3 ships in which I do not know a whole lot about. From what I gather via modules you can configure your ship to be anything it wants to be.
So, T3 ships can possibly be anything from what I've seen (within reason) from playing with them a little on SiSi
Where EVe diverges from WoW- players create their own 'professions'. You have investment bankers, recons, stealth haulers, stealth ninja salvagers (covertops + salvager), manufacturers, etc.
If I want to be a pure manufacturer in EVE I am free to pursue this. EVE does not force me to do 'quests' to Level up my character. I can instead focus on what I want to be and bypass crappy things if you follow.
for instance, I think EVE missions is kinda blah however the beauty is no one forces me to do them.
Originally posted by miagisan 1) you can do whatever you wanna do ....
Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided.
We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them.
Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either.
Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
In every game, even Second Life or Gary's Mod (HL2), you use the ingame tools to construct what you want. EVE is no different. Via Tech 3 technology, players can construct the ship type of their choosing using basic components.
I disagree with this post based on the arguments presented
Originally posted by solarine Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided. We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them. Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either. Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
I can't build a 90m high copy of Statue of Liberty with my little bucket and my little shovel on the sandbox we have on our backyard...wtf?!
Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided.
We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them.
Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either.
Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
I can't build a 90m high copy of Statue of Liberty with my little bucket and my little shovel on the sandbox we have on our backyard...wtf?!
lol!
and no you cant design your own ships (tech IIIs you can kinda using basic components) but you can fit a ship however you like...if the ship has turret and blaster slots, put whatever you like in, use whichever mid slots you like, and whatever low slots you like.
For example, I just put together a brand new apocalypse for pvp. You can make it into a sniper boat using long range beams and sensor boosters/tracking computers, or you can make it into a short range fighter, using pulse lasers and some 1600mm armor plates and resistance plating. Me i went for a mix, a mid range fighter who can dish out serious dps using dps rigs and heat sinks, while having medium armor. I know others have made it into drone boats, and even a mining vessel fitting miners on it
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
BTW, the Amar Battleship route is pretty much the fastest and most taken road to 0.0 warfare.
As for T3 strategic cruisers. While it's true that you could technical build these for a veriaty of roles, you don't nessisary fill those roles well or well enough to justify the Multibillion isk price tag. At this point in time, the only role of T3 ship is to be someone's killmail as anyone anywhere will try to take a swing at you the moment you undock.
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
BTW, the Amar Battleship route is pretty much the fastest and most taken road to 0.0 warfare.
Originally posted by Sentinel0 I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
No sub cap support, no e-war, recent changes to SB considered as buff...?
I think you play some completely different game...
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
BTW, the Amar Battleship route is pretty much the fastest and most taken road to 0.0 warfare.
Since when is a blackbird not a sub cap ship?
People don't use Blackbirds for the same reason they don't use Falcons anymore. Range. Then range of the Blackbird pretty much restricts it to small gang warefare which is a rarity in EVE. In addition, because the majority of what you will face in any form of gang warefare are Battleships, the weak ECM bonus on the Blackbird makes it ill suited.
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
BTW, the Amar Battleship route is pretty much the fastest and most taken road to 0.0 warfare.
Since when is a blackbird not a sub cap ship?
People don't use Blackbirds for the same reason they don't use Falcons anymore. Range. Then range of the Blackbird pretty much restricts it to small gang warefare which is a rarity in EVE. In addition, because the majority of what you will face in any form of gang warefare are Battleships, the weak ECM bonus on the Blackbird makes it ill suited.
are you nuts? i was using a fully fitted Tech II Harbinger and a blackbird had me perma jammed and scrambled while i got chewed up by a bunch of stinking cruisers.
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
No sub cap support, no e-war, recent changes to SB considered as buff...?
I think you play some completely different game...
No, he's just illustrating why EvE is a sandbox, even if he doesn't realize it.
Everything he said is absolutely true from the viewpoint of big nullsec empire building alliances. If you do lowsec piracy or small scale highsec wars the stealth bomber sucks now, Falcons are actually better (though not very alt-friendly anymore), and cap ships are a liability, if you can use them at all.
There is no one way to play EvE and there is no endgame. You can do pretty much whatever you want within the game's framework and be somewhat respectable doing it.
Being out numbered sucks doens't it? Sounds to be you lost more to the fact that you were out numbered rather than the useful ness of ewar. As for being pinned, well there are plenty of ways to pin people in EVE that doesn't require specialization.
Being out numbered sucks doens't it? Sounds to be you lost more to the fact that you were out numbered rather than the useful ness of ewar. As for being pinned, well there are plenty of ways to pin people in EVE that doesn't require specialization.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
Isn´t it a bit like classes then? I.e. like logging into his priest or druid in... WoW?^^
Sorry for trolling.
that was not trolling -it was a fair question. In EVE I had a miner who trained up and became a fighter. Most, not all, themepark games do not let you do things like that - A druid is a druid and a fighter is a fighter. There are some themepark games that let you cross train to some extent - I believe DDO did that.
I liked the chart shown in a previous post that listed games on a scale of how themepark/sandbox they were - few games are at the extremes of said scale.
Being out numbered sucks doens't it? Sounds to be you lost more to the fact that you were out numbered rather than the useful ness of ewar. As for being pinned, well there are plenty of ways to pin people in EVE that doesn't require specialization.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
They could have been in a couple of Vegabonds and you will still have died without being perma jammed. it's still the cruiser hull but without ewar. You lost because you were out numbered. Plan and simple.
Being out numbered sucks doens't it? Sounds to be you lost more to the fact that you were out numbered rather than the useful ness of ewar. As for being pinned, well there are plenty of ways to pin people in EVE that doesn't require specialization.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
They could have been in a couple of Vegabonds and you will still have died without being perma jammed. it's still the cruiser hull but without ewar. You lost because you were out numbered. Plan and simple.
well in that case it could have been a titan...whats your point? (yes i have been dd'd by a titan lol)
Since there is no agreed upon definition of what a sandbox game is, there tends to be quite a difference of opinion and I've see people argue that WOW is a sandbox game. (its not, IMO) Many posters will quote you the "features" of a sandbox game (no classes or levels, freedom to pursue your own path, not quest driven etc) and they are correct. But how many features (or toys) does a game need to be considered a sandbox? That's the dilema one faces. I like this model the best.
Less Sandbox Features More Sandbox Features <---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> WOW LotRO AOC CoX Lineage 2 Darkfall EVE UO Placement of the above games is not scientific or even well thought out, just a represention for my example. IMO opinion, the games on the right allow more player freedom and more tools which are used to create the gaming experience. The games on the left have fewer tools, follow a more linear progression, and are more themepark in their approach. Each game style has its merits, and both types can be fun.
You claim this chart wasn't well thought out but it seems really accurate from where I sit. gj
Since there is no agreed upon definition of what a sandbox game is, there tends to be quite a difference of opinion and I've see people argue that WOW is a sandbox game. (its not, IMO) Many posters will quote you the "features" of a sandbox game (no classes or levels, freedom to pursue your own path, not quest driven etc) and they are correct. But how many features (or toys) does a game need to be considered a sandbox? That's the dilema one faces. I like this model the best.
Less Sandbox Features More Sandbox Features <---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> WOW LotRO AOC CoX Lineage 2 Darkfall EVE UO Placement of the above games is not scientific or even well thought out, just a represention for my example. IMO opinion, the games on the right allow more player freedom and more tools which are used to create the gaming experience. The games on the left have fewer tools, follow a more linear progression, and are more themepark in their approach. Each game style has its merits, and both types can be fun.
You claim this chart wasn't well thought out but it seems really accurate from where I sit. gj
Why is UO more sandbox then EVE?
In UO people could build houses and place them anywhere. Then just spend time decorating it. People even ran shops from these houses and had wares up.
I'd personally rate UO/Linkrealms much more of a sandbox due to this
Originally posted by elderotter Originally posted by Herodes Isn´t it a bit like classes then? I.e. like logging into his priest or druid in... WoW?^^Sorry for trolling.
that was not trolling -it was a fair question. In EVE I had a miner who trained up and became a fighter. Most, not all, themepark games do not let you do things like that - A druid is a druid and a fighter is a fighter. There are some themepark games that let you cross train to some extent - I believe DDO did that. I liked the chart shown in a previous post that listed games on a scale of how themepark/sandbox they were - few games are at the extremes of said scale. Well, a druid can be a tank, damage dealer and healer - that is why I mentioned these classes.
I didn´t mean the different ships or skills though. I believe, my toon in EVE is one of the biggest "gimps", because of learning skills into many different directions - as some one said "wanna test it all". What I don´t like in DAoC and what I don´t like in EVE, is the heavy use of multiple accounts. In DAoC because of "buffbots", because they strengthened the main avatar insanely, in EVE because they turn the sandbox feeling into a class based game.
"but I spent zero money for it"
Nice, some sell their toons or equipment at Ebay, some... ok, it is the fault of CCP.
Comments
In a way you are correct, the ship you fly is the 'class you are'. Difference being the same character can be many classes, where as in WOW you have to reroll new characters.
Now its true, many EVE players have mulitple accounts, mostly so they can speed things up and do perform more quickly. But there's just as many patient players with 80M SP's right now who have one character who can do most of everything, fly Capitals, heavy miners, steath ships and are captains fo manufactuing and industry.
All just a matter of patience.
problem is everything looks appetizing! i want to try it all!
In a way you are correct, the ship you fly is the 'class you are'. Difference being the same character can be many classes, where as in WOW you have to reroll new characters.
Now its true, many EVE players have mulitple accounts, mostly so they can speed things up and do perform more quickly. But there's just as many patient players with 80M SP's right now who have one character who can do most of everything, fly Capitals, heavy miners, steath ships and are captains fo manufactuing and industry.
All just a matter of patience.
problem is everything looks appetizing! i want to try it all!
Yep, me too, which is why I also have 3 accounts...and most of those are focused on just flying every races smalls ships well.
I think this year I might branch some of them off and have one go the capital route, another might actually take up mining (who would have thought?)
3rd one will probably focus on flying jump freighters and other heavy haulers.
I also plan to take up wormhole exploration and see what living on the other side is like.
So much to do, so little time.
Maybe I need a 4th account?
No, must step away from the computer.......
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
It better to ask what is common between them? The answer is: Nothing.
Sandbox is and engine where players model the gameplay. You have many tools and pullers that you use to affect to game. Entire game is based on many equations where you can affect more or less of his parameters. Something like the one described from Oracle in Matrix 3.
In contrast Theme park is like a Disney land, you go there and play the attractions the creators have make for you.
Get ti?
Where themepark games try to hide that they are copying WOW, games like Mortal Online and Darkfall make no attempt to hide their inspiration
______\m/_____
LordOfDarkDesire
no. its not. (and if you had played eve, you would know this).
instead of apologising for trolling, why not try simply not trolling?
Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided.
We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them.
Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either.
Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
This post isn't trolling (not sure bout your other ones tho).
Yes, "ships" are like Classes. Ships perform a role and provide a layer of tactical transparency similar to Classes. So EVE's gains the benefits of class based paradigm however now there is T3 ships in which I do not know a whole lot about. From what I gather via modules you can configure your ship to be anything it wants to be.
So, T3 ships can possibly be anything from what I've seen (within reason) from playing with them a little on SiSi
Where EVe diverges from WoW- players create their own 'professions'. You have investment bankers, recons, stealth haulers, stealth ninja salvagers (covertops + salvager), manufacturers, etc.
If I want to be a pure manufacturer in EVE I am free to pursue this. EVE does not force me to do 'quests' to Level up my character. I can instead focus on what I want to be and bypass crappy things if you follow.
for instance, I think EVE missions is kinda blah however the beauty is no one forces me to do them.
This is what we mean by Sandbox.
Now, don't get me wrong, I think EVE is a great MMO, but I have to disagree with the above... I see that sort of statement quite often and it's just hollow and misguided.
We don't get to "do whatever we wanna do" in EVE. Rather, the game gives us a set of predefined patterns, and we get to choose which patterns we want to follow and have some initiative in the way we follow them.
Anyway, the sandbox analogy just does not stand (not for just EVE, but for any MMO). We cannot build whatever we want in the sand. A simple example: Can I just come up with a ship design in my mind and then build it using the buckets, pails and shovels the game provides? No. I have to build the ship the game tells me I can build. You can call it *design-on-rails*. Not very imaginative and not too free, either.
Still, yes, overall EVE does feel quite freer than most MMOs, because it's player-driven and is not level-based. But many players coming in with the misconception that they "can do whatever they want to do" will quickly find that they can't... And perhaps that they don't care much for what they can, either.
In every game, even Second Life or Gary's Mod (HL2), you use the ingame tools to construct what you want. EVE is no different. Via Tech 3 technology, players can construct the ship type of their choosing using basic components.
I disagree with this post based on the arguments presented
I can't build a 90m high copy of Statue of Liberty with my little bucket and my little shovel on the sandbox we have on our backyard...wtf?!
I can't build a 90m high copy of Statue of Liberty with my little bucket and my little shovel on the sandbox we have on our backyard...wtf?!
lol!
and no you cant design your own ships (tech IIIs you can kinda using basic components) but you can fit a ship however you like...if the ship has turret and blaster slots, put whatever you like in, use whichever mid slots you like, and whatever low slots you like.
For example, I just put together a brand new apocalypse for pvp. You can make it into a sniper boat using long range beams and sensor boosters/tracking computers, or you can make it into a short range fighter, using pulse lasers and some 1600mm armor plates and resistance plating. Me i went for a mix, a mid range fighter who can dish out serious dps using dps rigs and heat sinks, while having medium armor. I know others have made it into drone boats, and even a mining vessel fitting miners on it
@Miagisan
I think you missed the part where I said there is NO LONGER a support role before Capitals. There is used to be, it was called the Falcon. Then they nerfed it and there's no longer a point to bring ewar ships to battles.
For the longest time, Stealth Bombers suck and you wasted your SP by training for it. So before the recent buff the Stealth Bombers, while it's technically possible you could training into one, there was no point as they weren't competitive. Black Ops is still in the same situations. While you could technically get into a Black Ops, there's very little you can do that something else couldn't do just as well.
BTW, the Amar Battleship route is pretty much the fastest and most taken road to 0.0 warfare.
As for T3 strategic cruisers. While it's true that you could technical build these for a veriaty of roles, you don't nessisary fill those roles well or well enough to justify the Multibillion isk price tag. At this point in time, the only role of T3 ship is to be someone's killmail as anyone anywhere will try to take a swing at you the moment you undock.
Since when is a blackbird not a sub cap ship?
No sub cap support, no e-war, recent changes to SB considered as buff...?
I think you play some completely different game...
Since when is a blackbird not a sub cap ship?
People don't use Blackbirds for the same reason they don't use Falcons anymore. Range. Then range of the Blackbird pretty much restricts it to small gang warefare which is a rarity in EVE. In addition, because the majority of what you will face in any form of gang warefare are Battleships, the weak ECM bonus on the Blackbird makes it ill suited.
@Gedemami
Sorry, I meant when CCP first buffed it. They were useful for a time now the nerf made them hard to use but effective in coordinated groups.
Since when is a blackbird not a sub cap ship?
People don't use Blackbirds for the same reason they don't use Falcons anymore. Range. Then range of the Blackbird pretty much restricts it to small gang warefare which is a rarity in EVE. In addition, because the majority of what you will face in any form of gang warefare are Battleships, the weak ECM bonus on the Blackbird makes it ill suited.
are you nuts? i was using a fully fitted Tech II Harbinger and a blackbird had me perma jammed and scrambled while i got chewed up by a bunch of stinking cruisers.
Me thinks you know not what you say.............
No sub cap support, no e-war, recent changes to SB considered as buff...?
I think you play some completely different game...
No, he's just illustrating why EvE is a sandbox, even if he doesn't realize it.
Everything he said is absolutely true from the viewpoint of big nullsec empire building alliances. If you do lowsec piracy or small scale highsec wars the stealth bomber sucks now, Falcons are actually better (though not very alt-friendly anymore), and cap ships are a liability, if you can use them at all.
There is no one way to play EvE and there is no endgame. You can do pretty much whatever you want within the game's framework and be somewhat respectable doing it.
Being out numbered sucks doens't it? Sounds to be you lost more to the fact that you were out numbered rather than the useful ness of ewar. As for being pinned, well there are plenty of ways to pin people in EVE that doesn't require specialization.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
that was not trolling -it was a fair question. In EVE I had a miner who trained up and became a fighter. Most, not all, themepark games do not let you do things like that - A druid is a druid and a fighter is a fighter. There are some themepark games that let you cross train to some extent - I believe DDO did that.
I liked the chart shown in a previous post that listed games on a scale of how themepark/sandbox they were - few games are at the extremes of said scale.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
They could have been in a couple of Vegabonds and you will still have died without being perma jammed. it's still the cruiser hull but without ewar. You lost because you were out numbered. Plan and simple.
outnumbered? no i was ewar'd. Simple as that, i could have chewed through a bunch of cruisers if i could just lock on to it without being perma jaqmmed, had nothing to do with numbers
They could have been in a couple of Vegabonds and you will still have died without being perma jammed. it's still the cruiser hull but without ewar. You lost because you were out numbered. Plan and simple.
well in that case it could have been a titan...whats your point? (yes i have been dd'd by a titan lol)
You claim this chart wasn't well thought out but it seems really accurate from where I sit. gj
Why is UO more sandbox then EVE?
It is not. Just it is said so sometimes by people who do not have deep enough insight into EVE industry/economy.
You claim this chart wasn't well thought out but it seems really accurate from where I sit. gj
Why is UO more sandbox then EVE?
In UO people could build houses and place them anywhere. Then just spend time decorating it. People even ran shops from these houses and had wares up.
I'd personally rate UO/Linkrealms much more of a sandbox due to this
that was not trolling -it was a fair question. In EVE I had a miner who trained up and became a fighter. Most, not all, themepark games do not let you do things like that - A druid is a druid and a fighter is a fighter. There are some themepark games that let you cross train to some extent - I believe DDO did that.
I liked the chart shown in a previous post that listed games on a scale of how themepark/sandbox they were - few games are at the extremes of said scale.
Well, a druid can be a tank, damage dealer and healer - that is why I mentioned these classes.
I didn´t mean the different ships or skills though. I believe, my toon in EVE is one of the biggest "gimps", because of learning skills into many different directions - as some one said "wanna test it all".
What I don´t like in DAoC and what I don´t like in EVE, is the heavy use of multiple accounts.
In DAoC because of "buffbots", because they strengthened the main avatar insanely,
in EVE because they turn the sandbox feeling into a class based game.
"but I spent zero money for it"
Nice, some sell their toons or equipment at Ebay, some... ok, it is the fault of CCP.
weres swg? master of all sandbox games ..even dumb down nowadays..