On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
There isn't one MMO I can think of that didn't lose players that went on to become critics. That only makes the critics feelings valid for them, not for the entire gaming community. We also have very little way to distinguish between those who have genuinely played, and the many daily and frequent posters here who never have. Of course there's also a lot between, some who played for a day, got killed and looted and decided the heart was broke, or was it their heart, hard to tell.
DFO does not suffer from a broken heart, hardly any thing so dramatic. It's an ambitious game, very different from a simple PvE game because of all the player produced content. It's easier to make a theme park game, as you just need to ensure the rides work; but every one takes the same ride essentially. In a Sandbox game, where players construct and siege cities, and on and on, there are far more dynamics at play, but each patch has improved the game greatly.
We all know DFO isn't for every one, but not for the many reasons whined about here. It's not for every one, because it has full open PvP with full looting. There is no auto targeting, and there is no leveling auto get X skill. It's a tough game compared to the typical MMO, and unless one enjoys this type of game, well, they won't. lol Then there are players who legitiately do like this type of game, but for any number of reasons have left; not much different than any other game. They may return, may not, and life goes on.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me, what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
A. It's not an 'expansion' if a lot of the new features were supposed to be in the game in the first place. Also, It still doesn't fix a lot of the core problems/mechanics to the game.
B. Correct, there is no fluff. There is no content or innovation. Poor rationalization.
C. Apparently your reading comprehension isn't up to par, but many people did not enjoy this game; if you look around. I don't know what you mean by 'everybody else'.
D. Nobody is leaving the game? I haven't played since beta personally, but my guild was active with a major alliance. They have all left the game minus a small handful, as well as many of their enemies.
I'm not criticizing you for enjoying the game...to each their own, but there is no point in hyping something up through misinformation, causing people to waste money from reading your 'review.' I'm not going to reply to another DF post, so feel free to flame me. Just figured I'd put some fact into the post.
A. It's not an 'expansion' if a lot of the new features were supposed to be in the game in the first place. Also, It still doesn't fix a lot of the core problems/mechanics to the game. B. Correct, there is no fluff. There is no content or innovation. Poor rationalization. C. Apparently your reading comprehension isn't up to par, but many people did not enjoy this game; if you look around. I don't know what you mean by 'everybody else'. D. Nobody is leaving the game? I haven't played since beta personally, but my guild was active with a major alliance. They have all left the game minus a small handful, as well as many of their enemies. I'm not criticizing you for enjoying the game...to each their own, but there is no point in hyping something up through misinformation, causing people to waste money from reading your 'review.' I'm not going to reply to another DF post, so feel free to flame me. Just figured I'd put some fact into the post.
You actually want to spend time debating if it's an expansion or a robust patch? lol
Fluff is not "content innovation", it is merely "content". Sieges, citry building, non-instanced houses, villiages, ship warefare, no auto targeting, etc., is content, player produced content and without equal in the current field of MMO's.
Reading comprehension? Read between the lines. Look up post histories. More than half of the active critics and cynics on this board never played the game, have posted 100 to 500 times here, and add nothing to a discussion, just negative rage for their own reasons.
You haven't played since beta? Really, with all respect; nuff said !!
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me, what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
A. It's not an 'expansion' if a lot of the new features were supposed to be in the game in the first place. Also, It still doesn't fix a lot of the core problems/mechanics to the game. B. Correct, there is no fluff. There is no content or innovation. Poor rationalization. C. Apparently your reading comprehension isn't up to par, but many people did not enjoy this game; if you look around. I don't know what you mean by 'everybody else'. D. Nobody is leaving the game? I haven't played since beta personally, but my guild was active with a major alliance. They have all left the game minus a small handful, as well as many of their enemies. I'm not criticizing you for enjoying the game...to each their own, but there is no point in hyping something up through misinformation, causing people to waste money from reading your 'review.' I'm not going to reply to another DF post, so feel free to flame me. Just figured I'd put some fact into the post.
You actually want to spend time debating if it's an expansion or a robust patch? lol
Fluff is not "content innovation", it is merely "content". Sieges, citry building, non-instanced houses, villiages, ship warefare, no auto targeting, etc., is content, player produced content and without equal in the current field of MMO's.
Reading comprehension? Read between the lines. Look up post histories. More than half of the active critics and cynics on this board never played the game, have posted 100 to 500 times here, and add nothing to a discussion, just negative rage for their own reasons.
You haven't played since beta? Really, with all respect; nuff said !!
-CC
So let me see if I can get this straight. When houses and weather weren't in game. It's fluff that no one really cared about. Now that's it being put in game. It's "content?
So if someone post too much, it's bad? If someone post too little, it's bad? If someone joined within last week to a month, it's bad? So could we like get a manual or something. To describe what DF fans consider acceptable post count + join date, before people here on MMORPG.com are allowed to talk about DF.
Auto-targetting is not "content". It is a game mechanic. Oh and I do love the mention of Ship Warfare. Just how many Ship to Ship battles, have you been apart of? Better yet how many have you seen? Got any screenshots? Maybe a video?
Also what does him having not played since Beta prove? Nothing, hell I can hazard a guess on how many people have left DF, from just reading their forums. Anyone with enough time spent on DF officials forums could. There are plenty of clans and alliances that have dropped off the map. Gone, inactive, not seen, or heard from.
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
I think I know enough at this juncture to know that I wouldn't love it. I've never lived in a communist country, but I can tell from what I have read/seen/heard that I wouldn't want to do it. Same situation with DF for me.
And no, not from EG. From various posters on various forums (here, official) and from bloggers and the like. And what they seem to agree upon (fans turned critics) directly goes against what you are saying. They feel the heart is indeed sick. And they do feel that people have been leaving. You see a glass as half full, they see it as half empty.
I really don't have the time at this juncture to delve too much deeper, but suffice it to say, I know I won't love DFO, even if I played it (and please none of the you can never know till you try type arguements, that door goes both ways and will lead you nowhere with me, I have lived long enough and seen enough to know what I know at this juncture). Again, I reiterate, you can have all the "innovation" you want, but it means nothing if you can't get the core right. I can build a house with innovative features, but if i don't get the foundation laid right, can't stabilize the bare bones of the house, then all of the innovation in the world won't keep it standing and make it liveable.
Dark, hard, violent...sure, all of that is fine and well, but in the end, it means nothing without a stable foundation. I don't choose games based on the ideas of fluff and innovation. I choose based on things like: Am I having fun? Does this feel more like a second job? Is the foundation stable?
Innovation, fluff, all of this means nothing in the end if I am not having fun.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
There isn't one MMO I can think of that didn't lose players that went on to become critics. That only makes the critics feelings valid for them, not for the entire gaming community. We also have very little way to distinguish between those who have genuinely played, and the many daily and frequent posters here who never have. Of course there's also a lot between, some who played for a day, got killed and looted and decided the heart was broke, or was it their heart, hard to tell.
DFO does not suffer from a broken heart, hardly any thing so dramatic. It's an ambitious game, very different from a simple PvE game because of all the player produced content. It's easier to make a theme park game, as you just need to ensure the rides work; but every one takes the same ride essentially. In a Sandbox game, where players construct and siege cities, and on and on, there are far more dynamics at play, but each patch has improved the game greatly.
We all know DFO isn't for every one, but not for the many reasons whined about here. It's not for every one, because it has full open PvP with full looting. There is no auto targeting, and there is no leveling auto get X skill. It's a tough game compared to the typical MMO, and unless one enjoys this type of game, well, they won't. lol Then there are players who legitiately do like this type of game, but for any number of reasons have left; not much different than any other game. They may return, may not, and life goes on.
-CC
Sure, plenty of MMOs lose players that become critics. Such is life.
Though, the statement you highlighted of mine, clearly stated that is just the feeling I get. I am not speaking in absolutes, so don't get the two confused. I am sure many people have left for a variety of reasons, but I don't have those reasons to go on, now do I? Most of the posts or blogs I have seen dealing with the subject give me the aforementioned "feeling".
As for the rest of your post, there are points I agree with and points I disagree with, but truly can't spend too much more time trying to post and counterpost tonight.
Do I think DF is a sandbox? No (everyone taking the same "ride" as you put, seems to go against the idea of a sandbox, well depending on whatever definition of sandbox you choose to use)
Do I think it has a "sick heart"? Yes (though we'll see what the patch did for it as time goes on)
Do I think DF is ambitious? I think the original "idea" was ambitious, but what was released, not so much.
(Please note that I stated I "think", therefore staying away from all encompassing statements of fact. Do I have proof for statements? Nope. Just feelings, ideas and thoughts based on what I have seen.)
And while you state that DFO isn't for everyone, but not due to the reasons people "whine" about here...I think you are making an all encompasing statement without much proof. Until you can get me proveable facts and figures, the "whines" as you put them are just as valid as anything you can come up with.
Do some people like DF? Sure. Does that mean the game truly has solid foundation? Maybe to them, but that doesn't make it so. Some people still believe the world is flat. Believe what you will, but if you are having fun, does it really matter?
So then you can produce a quote from Tasos saying that weather would not be in DarkFall at Release?
Or, how about a quote for Arena Events not being in? Or, how about mobs attacking player cities not being in? Or, how about players learning spells and skills from each other not being in? Or, how about the racial specialty spells not being in? Or, how about the political map not being in? Or, how about spell scrolls not being in? Or, the "custom communications" that works inside and outside the game not being in? Or, the in-game trading boards not being in? (And no... CHAT does not equal trade boards). Or, the trading outside of the game not being in? Or... heh you are probably starting to get the idea by now.
I'll wait for the links.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
The Largest On Line World Ever created
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
A sandbox environment
10.000 concurrent users
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Full Loot
No safe zones
Mounted Combat
Boats
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Real Time Naval Combat
Sieges
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
500 Skills
500 spells
Hundreds of different weapons
6 races
A unique crafting system
300 Different Monsters
Weather system
City Building
Clan Politics
Clan Warfare
Player’s House
Village System
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
Heh... that's a pretty impressive list you made there.
Too bad some of the current players didn't correct you on your mistakes you made in building it.
I see that some of it you took from their out-dated features list. If you were a current player you should know that some of that is in fact NOT currently in the game. I'm not even a current player and I know some of it is incorrect.
But here is the chance for current players of DarkFall to show me wrong. To show me that they know more about the game than I do. To show that they are more factually correct about the game than a wind-bag on some 3rd-rate forum.
Ready...
The Largest On Line World Ever created
Wrong. That distinction would go to either EvE Online or WW2 Online.
A unique handmade beautiful terrain
Beautiful is in the eye of the beholder, but I'll give you this one.
A sandbox environment
I personally don't think it's much of a sandbox, but since it's subjective I'll give you this one as well.
10.000 concurrent users
Care to show any kind of metric that would be considered proof that were indeed 10k on concurrently?
Real Time FFA PvP (no-point-and-click-get your tea-and wait-to see)
Yup, if the ping is decent it works pretty good.
Full Loot
Yup, as long as the opponent has something to loot.
No safe zones
Yup, those towers can be a bugger to survive though. It's unknown how houses will figure into this.
Mounted Combat
Yup, even better when they fixed the losing your mount on server crash.
Boats
Yup, sadly anything more than a basic raft is a very rare sight.
Hovercrafts (!), Canons, Flamethrowers, grenades
Yup, again with ships though... a very rare sight.
Real Time Naval Combat
Not sure on this one. I have yet to see any evidence of any actual ship to ship combat. If you are counting rafts... then yeah you might be correct.
Sieges
Yup, hopefully not more than 2 going on at the same time in an large numbers though.
Large Scale Battles (500V500, or more)
Not sure on this one either. Every video posting claiming such numbers has fallen well short of the target.
500 Skills
Wrong. If you want to prove me wrong, list them. There are not 500 unique skills.
500 spells
Wrong. If you want to prove me wrong, list them. There are not 500 unique spells.
Hundreds of different weapons
Hmm... hundreds might be a stretch. I have been a bit lax on my research on this one, so you may indeed be able to produce a list that contains hundreds.
6 races
Yup, I'll give you that one. Too bad there isn't anything unique about them except hitbox size and reach.
A unique crafting system
Unique in what way?
300 Different Monsters
Going to have to call B.S. on this one as well. Last count was well short of 300. Perhaps once they get the expansion fully implemented they might be close though. I'd love to be proven wrong with a list though.
Weather system
They got it in early? Cool. Last I heard it was delayed until at least Friday. Let's see how it works on Friday before we start listing this one as a working Feature.
City Building
Yup, in pre-defined places and in a specific order you are free to place a city. Hopefully you will find a site whose walls work with the terrain and whose towers face in the correct direction.
Clan Politics
Yup, as with any other game that supports clan-based PvP.
Clan Warfare
Yup, kinda goes hand in hand with the politics.
Player’s House
Yup, sadly many questions still remain as to how it works exactly. My thread on housing has been woefully quiet from the current players.
Village System
Yup, as with the housing though; much remains to be seen how it will be implemented.
There you go. Prove me wrong if I am. I try to be as factually correct as possible when dealing with facts like the list above.
my guild of 112 people just cancelled all their subs to this load of nonsense and I suggest anyone who's actually left do the same. I'll also be doing a charge back because I don't think this is worth anywhere near what was paid. (have fun paying the charge back fee for your contentless, untested, unfinished garbage Aventurine). The "expansion pack" may have saved kept me around.. but unfortunately what they call an "expansion pack" I call a measly patch consisting of a new mount model, some sword models, and a few tweaks to already existing systems. Who gives a rats ass about owning a house and random chest spanws? Are these people for real... This "exp pack" was a last ditch effort at saving the sinking ship that sunk already along time ago actually. Have fun.
The "exp pact" is great. Testing it right now. Troll is troll.
The largets siege war on the server was CC v Hyperion, CC declared 3 simultanious sieges at the same time each siege was easily 300 v 300. The reason the vids don't show 500v500 (its happened) is because most battles that happen in a siege are smaller groups spread out over the area, most being 50 v 50 on a single side. 1k people just rushing into each other would be retarded.
I don't play Darkfall...probably never will because it's just not my type of game. However, I whole-heartedly support what Adventurine attempts to do. They are a small, independant game developer trying to make an MMO outside of the big studio, big bucks system. So yeah, go ahead and cancel your subs -- and give more power to the SOEs and the EAs and the Blizzards who already dominate the market. But I don't want to see you back here bitching about the lack of independant, creative, innovative games in the market place. Because if you don't support your independant gaming companies (and manage your expectations accordingly in a mature way), then you'll get exactly what you pay for -- more vanilla, generic, uninspired gaming.
That is such a cynical view.
So if AV can't pull it off and make a good indie game... then there's no one else can? AV is the "last great hope" for indie developers? Really?
There are other indie developers out there taking their crack at it as we speak.... Perhaps one of them will succeed where AV failed.
You is the one with the cynical post not the one you quoted.
He talked for any indie developer including your vaporware indie developers who have nothing shown.
Where DarkFall succeed others have to come that long. See MO will not release with sieging LOL.
Why not moan and bitch over at MO Forums. MO will be not feature complete missing a core feature - Sieging and large scale PvP - at lauch.
DarkFall has build a masterpiece go fiond something else to drop your fail at.
And how do you KNOW that MO will not have Sieging and Large Scale PvP at lauch?
Because the devs said so.. Personally I dont care its not in at launch.. Sieging and large scale PvP are not the "be all and end all" of what I want out of an MMO... Be nice when it comes but its the multitude of other features that are the draw for my cash..
I don't play Darkfall...probably never will because it's just not my type of game. However, I whole-heartedly support what Adventurine attempts to do. They are a small, independant game developer trying to make an MMO outside of the big studio, big bucks system. So yeah, go ahead and cancel your subs -- and give more power to the SOEs and the EAs and the Blizzards who already dominate the market. But I don't want to see you back here bitching about the lack of independant, creative, innovative games in the market place. Because if you don't support your independant gaming companies (and manage your expectations accordingly in a mature way), then you'll get exactly what you pay for -- more vanilla, generic, uninspired gaming.
Indie companies should never ever be given a "free ride" with people supporting them simply because they are a indie developer company. If Adventurine wants to enter the market and play with the big boys in MMO's they will have to deliver the goods and top an expected quality. Adventurine dug their own grave when Tasos started talking about how awesome DFO would be. Looking at the feature list and what was in at launch it comes clear to everyone that Tasos did nothing but lie. Several years before launch he did say that the game was featuyre complete, only polishing left. We all know the true story.
Does adventurine deserve the grave they dug for themself? No, but they need to kick the idiot who dug the grave for them. Look at Funcom and AoC launch. You had the Game director spending more time telling us for a long time how awesome the game would be. It would be a steak and WoW would be like a macdonald meal in comparison. When a GD spends more time hyping the game and telling lies he does dig the grave for the company and he needs to be dealt with. If mmo developers have learnt anything from the launch AoC saw and DFO that is that you cannot bullshit your customers. I don't care if you are running a 1 man developing studio, if you cannot act professional then simply you will be squished by the giants in the market.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
I along with my partner and a few other friends cancelled our subs 2-3 weeks ago after playing since launch. I can not speak for all of them but my reason was because I found the game very tedious and boring. I realized right away that the game was not ready for a big public release yet, it is still not ready,. but many fans of the game do not mind paying to play while devs continue polishing, adding game content and fixing broken mechanics, giving folk a reason to venture out of their protected player and npc towns. The Lands of Darkfall are barren, no reason for folk to get out to work on their fighting skills since macroing is the preferred choice, fight npc mobs and you will soon realise why -broken and monotonous pve-.
Crafting and harvesting, if you are into that type thing are also mind numbing boring. There is no place in this game for crafters unless you have a group of friends watch your back each time you go out to harvest. Killing and looting harvesters is the object, not going out there and doing the work yourself. So crafters have a few options, as I said before -always have friends watch your back, -harvest close to a protection tower and hope you get to it in time when attacked. While harvesting you drain away stamina, which you need to fight and sprint away with, also you are locked in place unable to pan around to see if a group is sneaking up behind you, so chances of you getting away from attackers are very slim.
Sieging, this is the only aspect of the game they did right and is actualy fun, at least in my opinion. Sadly, it is not enough to keep me or many like me interested, you can not siege each time you log on, there has to be more to a game then just macroing up skills and sieging. ...... Ive been a fan and waited for this game for 7 years, I gave it an honest shot, even kept my account open after realizing how broken it was, so I think that gives me a right to say that Darkfall in its current form is not ready for release.
I honestly beleive that fans should not be promoting the game yet, give the developers a chance to work on it more, test it out for them .... give them honest feed back, get rid of the bugs rather then abusing them, help the devs complete this game you love so they can finally have a product fit for general release. You do the developer no favour by glorifying the game in its current form nor those unsuspecting new players who have no idea what they are getting into.
Having said that, I still beleive Darkfall has potential, I'll be watching development and waiting for a reason to return.
I don't play Darkfall...probably never will because it's just not my type of game. However, I whole-heartedly support what Adventurine attempts to do. They are a small, independant game developer trying to make an MMO outside of the big studio, big bucks system. So yeah, go ahead and cancel your subs -- and give more power to the SOEs and the EAs and the Blizzards who already dominate the market. But I don't want to see you back here bitching about the lack of independant, creative, innovative games in the market place. Because if you don't support your independant gaming companies (and manage your expectations accordingly in a mature way), then you'll get exactly what you pay for -- more vanilla, generic, uninspired gaming.
That is such a cynical view.
So if AV can't pull it off and make a good indie game... then there's no one else can? AV is the "last great hope" for indie developers? Really?
There are other indie developers out there taking their crack at it as we speak.... Perhaps one of them will succeed where AV failed.
You is the one with the cynical post not the one you quoted.
He talked for any indie developer including your vaporware indie developers who have nothing shown.
Where DarkFall succeed others have to come that long. See MO will not release with sieging LOL.
Why not moan and bitch over at MO Forums. MO will be not feature complete missing a core feature - Sieging and large scale PvP - at lauch.
DarkFall has build a masterpiece go fiond something else to drop your fail at.
I find myself wondering this about most of your posts, Darth... But this one begs asking..
What the hell are you talking about?
That wasn't an anti-DF post. It wasn't a pro-MO post. I'm specifically addressing the tone of Cerio's post, which I find to be a bit cynical.
I'm questioning the notion that if AV doesn't succeed as an indie developer, that all hope is lost and people may as well just support the big companies... as though AV is the only indie developer out there trying to make something good; the "last great hope".
You take that post and turn it into some inane rant against MO, drenched in your trademark adulation of AV and DF.
Find something else to "drop my fail" at...?
Seriously... WTF, Darth?
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I honestly beleive that fans should not be promoting the game yet, give the developers a chance to work on it more, test it out for them .... give them honest feed back, get rid of the bugs rather then abusing them, help the devs complete this game you love so they can finally have a product fit for general release. You do the developer no favour by glorifying the game in its current form nor those unsuspecting new players who have no idea what they are getting into.
Having said that, I still beleive Darkfall has potential, I'll be watching development and waiting for a reason to return.
I have to agree with you. I haven`t even told my friends they put in housing.
Alot of the players are defending Darkfall on topics that are devastating for the game. We have lost 95 % of our loyal playerbase in three months and they still defend it. They simply can`t see why peoples are leaving in drowes and you hear the pathetic excuses all the time.
"They are leaving because we don`t have local banks, they are carebears, they have an exam, it`s the 4.Juli weekend (my favourit), they are on vacation, they are waiting for NA1 and so on."
The fact that the game suck in so many ways doesn`t seem to cross their mind. Darkfall isn`t a game for pvpers, but for old EQ and SWG players who wants full-loot. Talk about a niche marked.
xzyax - I've been unable to get an answer from you to a direct question relating to the game of the forum we are posting on. Do you realize you registered at MMORGP on October 2, 2008 and to date, have 158 pages of posts concerning DFO? I did find 1 lonely post about your kid playing LoTRO, but aside from that, all of them are about this game, yet not one I looked at gives me even a vague idea of what you actually think. So, I'm curious about the following... What was your experience playing DFO, your conclusions, and what games, if any are you now currently playing? In addition, since trolling is an often discussed topic and concern on this forum, can you help me understand why you are spending so much time and effort on MMORPG forums, when the only purpose appears to be to post on the DFO discussion forum, a forum for a game you "appear" to be no longer interested in playing. Thank you -CC
ChinaCat, do you have nothing better to do than to browse the post history of people here who criticize the game and report them or quote them? so you are upset about people who post negative stuff here, on a public mmo board, but yet you waste your time playing sherlock holmes for DF too. wtf?!
you know, not everyone who posts negative about df isn't interested in this game anymore, there are just way too many negative things about df for them to currently enjoy it. most of them even played the game, i know it's hard to believe and most of them wasted 50 bucks just to find out that the game has tons of serious flaws and wasn't the game that tasos promised us to be.
it's funny how you care so much about trolling, but the well known fanbois on this board don't seem to bother you too much.
jedi mind - heavenly divine, steadily shine in '99!
I don't play Darkfall...probably never will because it's just not my type of game. However, I whole-heartedly support what Adventurine attempts to do. They are a small, independant game developer trying to make an MMO outside of the big studio, big bucks system. So yeah, go ahead and cancel your subs -- and give more power to the SOEs and the EAs and the Blizzards who already dominate the market. But I don't want to see you back here bitching about the lack of independant, creative, innovative games in the market place. Because if you don't support your independant gaming companies (and manage your expectations accordingly in a mature way), then you'll get exactly what you pay for -- more vanilla, generic, uninspired gaming.
Another two-dimensional imbecile who sees things as this or that. There aren't only two options you know. Themepark WoW clones or POS software like Darkfall. There are other more skilled developers releasing games that does not follow the WoW blueprint. EVE being one of them and Mortal Online looks to be the next.
So just because I refuse to support a POS game like Darkfall with the crappy AV behind it does not mean "I am not supporting independant, creative, innovative games". Look at my sig, that is a well coded MMO developed by a small indie company with limited budget and I support them fully.
Well everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and I agree with your initial sentiment that there isn't only "this" or "that" and nothing else in regards to our options. However, I have to disagree with you on your opinion of Darkfall. I play the game, and have been since launch. Honestly, I feel the game was released too early, but with that said, I also feel like it is now farther ahead in terms of polish of really any MMO I've played from the get go.
Hell, it took Funcom almost 8 months to get rid of virtual memory errors and it took Aventurine about 5 weeks (although I'm sure it still happens rarely). My point is, Aventurine, in my opinion, is doing an excellent job with their patches and content updates, and is fixing the exact problems that I bitch about or bitched about before they were now fixed. Sure, Aventurine's management system was rocky when it first launched, and I'll agree that their customer service is severely lacking at the moment, but I personally expected that from an indie company that was basically broke.
And did you play EVE when it first came out? At least on my rig I encountered numerous serious bugs and my computer crashed quite frequently. Darkfall has crashed my computer once, and that was on week 1 of launch. And in terms of bugs, I've crashed through the floor twice, and it was because of the recall bug that was fixed in the first month. Sure there was a lot of exploits and in my opinion imbalances when it was first launched, but 3 months later I find the game to be in excellent shape, and I am confident that with a NA server opening up and ACTUAL PR from Aventurine (such as the new website and more interviews), I don't see Darkfall failing anytime soon, and in fact believe we're about to see a big population increase.
I along with my partner and a few other friends cancelled our subs 2-3 weeks ago after playing since launch. I can not speak for all of them but my reason was because I found the game very tedious and boring. I realized right away that the game was not ready for a big public release yet, it is still not ready,. but many fans of the game do not mind paying to play while devs continue polishing, adding game content and fixing broken mechanics, giving folk a reason to venture out of their protected player and npc towns. The Lands of Darkfall are barren, no reason for folk to get out to work on their fighting skills since macroing is the preferred choice, fight npc mobs and you will soon realise why -broken and monotonous pve-.
Crafting and harvesting, if you are into that type thing are also mind numbing boring. There is no place in this game for crafters unless you have a group of friends watch your back each time you go out to harvest. Killing and looting harvesters is the object, not going out there and doing the work yourself. So crafters have a few options, as I said before -always have friends watch your back, -harvest close to a protection tower and hope you get to it in time when attacked. While harvesting you drain away stamina, which you need to fight and sprint away with, also you are locked in place unable to pan around to see if a group is sneaking up behind you, so chances of you getting away from attackers are very slim.
Sieging, this is the only aspect of the game they did right and is actualy fun, at least in my opinion. Sadly, it is not enough to keep me or many like me interested, you can not siege each time you log on, there has to be more to a game then just macroing up skills and sieging. ...... Ive been a fan and waited for this game for 7 years, I gave it an honest shot, even kept my account open after realizing how broken it was, so I think that gives me a right to say that Darkfall in its current form is not ready for release.
I honestly beleive that fans should not be promoting the game yet, give the developers a chance to work on it more, test it out for them .... give them honest feed back, get rid of the bugs rather then abusing them, help the devs complete this game you love so they can finally have a product fit for general release. You do the developer no favour by glorifying the game in its current form nor those unsuspecting new players who have no idea what they are getting into.
Having said that, I still beleive Darkfall has potential, I'll be watching development and waiting for a reason to return.
ChinaCat, do you have nothing better to do than to browse the post history of people here who criticize the game and report them or quote them? so you are upset about people who post negative stuff here, on a public mmo board, but yet you waste your time playing sherlock holmes for DF too. wtf?! it's funny how you care so much about trolling, but the well known fanbois on this board don't seem to bother you too much.
ChinaCat is doing a good job.
I would suggest everyone to browse the post history to see what kind of gamer the poster is. Is it a troll, a fanboi, someone who hates full-loot..
Point is, who in their right mind would listen to a person who has no experience at all. How can you criticize something you have never tried? The worst part is the haters that have never tried DF still spend all their time convincing others not to try the game. How really sad isn`t that. Go get them ChinaCat. Make a list over the different posters and PM it to me. I would like to start my answer like this.
You mister ...... with 45 pages of post in the Darkfall forum have never played the game.
ChinaCat is doing a good job. I would suggest everyone to browse the post history to see what kind of gamer the poster is. Is it a troll, a fanboi, someone who hates full-loot.. Point is, who in their right mind would listen to a person who has no experience at all. How can you criticize something you have never tried? The worst part is the haters that have never tried DF still spend all their time convincing others not to try the game. How really sad isn`t that. Go get them ChinaCat. Make a list over the different posters and PM it to me. I would like to start my answer like this. You mister ...... with 45 pages of post in the Darkfall forum have never played the game.
Hotjazz - I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, and if not, apologize for the question. That's part of the problem on this forum; it is so full of trivial posts by people who obtain a kick out of slamming others and a game, it's hard to keep any perspective here.
I've read some of your posts, and while we feel differently, I can hear your point of view with no desire or reason to argue or debate it. I don't share your views, but certainly understand them. The difference between you and the loudest most frequent posters here is you actually care about the game, and are dissapointed and stopped playing. At least, that's how it sounds. Others hiding behind the facade of "discussion" appear to want to drive players away and get pleasure out of doing nothing but being critical of a game they don't play. It's down-right wierd. One guy has 1,700 posts, 99% of which bash DFO and he has never played it. I'm the only one that sees a red flag there? This other fellow has over 500 posts alone on this forum, and is in the same canoe.
I've been playing MMO's since UO's release and have never seen this level of insanity towards a game, but as we all know, the MMO fan base has multiplied in droves since WoW's release and the average maturity level has plummeted, along with any ounce of common Internet curtousy. No matter how one feels about a game, I will never understand supporting those who act so belligerently, no matter what game board it may be on.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me, what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
I check through posts from various users and there are trolls on both sides. There can be constructive criticism from someone who has not played the game such as saying why they will not try the game. It is something that can be looked at by the developers for use in the future. Those that are not constructive should be ignored and if bad enough reported. China Cat borders on being a troll because he is trying to coax other users into a flame. It is passive but still the coaxing is there.
That is unproductive and to an outsider who has an interest in the game it can look bad. Instead of passively trying to start an unproductive flame, China Cat should write what he enjoys in game. What does he like about it? Does housing add benefit? What would you like to see in the future of Darkfall? This will help the community even with certain people expressing dislike to the game.
I check through posts from various users and there are trolls on both sides. There can be constructive criticism from someone who has not played the game such as saying why they will not try the game. It is something that can be looked at by the developers for use in the future. Those that are not constructive should be ignored and if bad enough reported. China Cat borders on being a troll because he is trying to coax other users into a flame. It is passive but still the coaxing is there. That is unproductive and to an outsider who has an interest in the game it can look bad. Instead of passively trying to start an unproductive flame, China Cat should write what he enjoys in game. What does he like about it? Does housing add benefit? What would you like to see in the future of Darkfall? This will help the community even with certain people expressing dislike to the game.
Precisely! Thank you! Instead of trying to discredit anyone here by making completely inane comments about shoe size, or post counts China Cat should be promoting the game...I actually am beginning to suspect CC may be working for a rival company!
Because quite frankly this party has not furthered the cause of DFO by thier conduct.
I check through posts from various users and there are trolls on both sides. There can be constructive criticism from someone who has not played the game such as saying why they will not try the game. It is something that can be looked at by the developers for use in the future. Those that are not constructive should be ignored and if bad enough reported. China Cat borders on being a troll because he is trying to coax other users into a flame. It is passive but still the coaxing is there. That is unproductive and to an outsider who has an interest in the game it can look bad. Instead of passively trying to start an unproductive flame, China Cat should write what he enjoys in game. What does he like about it? Does housing add benefit? What would you like to see in the future of Darkfall? This will help the community even with certain people expressing dislike to the game.
I agree with you, that more posts from me about the game itself, my personal experiences and insight would be constructive. Having played since beta, and participated in all aspects of the game, I have a lot to share, and would like to. However, the tone of this forum, and how pretty much each thread is trolled by those who clearly enjoy berating the game, has prevented me from doing so; at least until now. Like any one new in town, I wanted to get the lay of the land, saw a lot of members bullying others around, and confronted it. If you or others experience that as trying to coax flames, that's your right; but that is the furtherst thing from my mind. I was trying to illuminate what I thought was the obvious, but what was being accepted carte blanche.
I've been exploring since the new patch, and tomorrow is a key day, as the weather system and other things will be patched in, in addition to deeper patch notes on what was done being provided. Over the weekend I should of had enough time logged since the updates to provide some feedback with substance. I will say this; the patch as far as PvE definately changed things for the better. Mid to high level mobs have become more reasonable; not to say they aren't difficult, but the ability to kill them from safety and ways to have diminished. Drops have improved. The random treasure chests are cool; my friend found one with 10k of gold and magic items. While this is a PvP game, the PvE is critical. No PvP game has ever been void of needing PvE content. It's an important way to gear up, have fun, and find hot spots for conflict.
Cheers -CC
"Lately it occurs to me, what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
Comments
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
There isn't one MMO I can think of that didn't lose players that went on to become critics. That only makes the critics feelings valid for them, not for the entire gaming community. We also have very little way to distinguish between those who have genuinely played, and the many daily and frequent posters here who never have. Of course there's also a lot between, some who played for a day, got killed and looted and decided the heart was broke, or was it their heart, hard to tell.
DFO does not suffer from a broken heart, hardly any thing so dramatic. It's an ambitious game, very different from a simple PvE game because of all the player produced content. It's easier to make a theme park game, as you just need to ensure the rides work; but every one takes the same ride essentially. In a Sandbox game, where players construct and siege cities, and on and on, there are far more dynamics at play, but each patch has improved the game greatly.
We all know DFO isn't for every one, but not for the many reasons whined about here. It's not for every one, because it has full open PvP with full looting. There is no auto targeting, and there is no leveling auto get X skill. It's a tough game compared to the typical MMO, and unless one enjoys this type of game, well, they won't. lol Then there are players who legitiately do like this type of game, but for any number of reasons have left; not much different than any other game. They may return, may not, and life goes on.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me,
what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
A. It's not an 'expansion' if a lot of the new features were supposed to be in the game in the first place. Also, It still doesn't fix a lot of the core problems/mechanics to the game.
B. Correct, there is no fluff. There is no content or innovation. Poor rationalization.
C. Apparently your reading comprehension isn't up to par, but many people did not enjoy this game; if you look around. I don't know what you mean by 'everybody else'.
D. Nobody is leaving the game? I haven't played since beta personally, but my guild was active with a major alliance. They have all left the game minus a small handful, as well as many of their enemies.
I'm not criticizing you for enjoying the game...to each their own, but there is no point in hyping something up through misinformation, causing people to waste money from reading your 'review.' I'm not going to reply to another DF post, so feel free to flame me. Just figured I'd put some fact into the post.
You actually want to spend time debating if it's an expansion or a robust patch? lol
Fluff is not "content innovation", it is merely "content". Sieges, citry building, non-instanced houses, villiages, ship warefare, no auto targeting, etc., is content, player produced content and without equal in the current field of MMO's.
Reading comprehension? Read between the lines. Look up post histories. More than half of the active critics and cynics on this board never played the game, have posted 100 to 500 times here, and add nothing to a discussion, just negative rage for their own reasons.
You haven't played since beta? Really, with all respect; nuff said !!
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me,
what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
You actually want to spend time debating if it's an expansion or a robust patch? lol
Fluff is not "content innovation", it is merely "content". Sieges, citry building, non-instanced houses, villiages, ship warefare, no auto targeting, etc., is content, player produced content and without equal in the current field of MMO's.
Reading comprehension? Read between the lines. Look up post histories. More than half of the active critics and cynics on this board never played the game, have posted 100 to 500 times here, and add nothing to a discussion, just negative rage for their own reasons.
You haven't played since beta? Really, with all respect; nuff said !!
-CC
So let me see if I can get this straight. When houses and weather weren't in game. It's fluff that no one really cared about. Now that's it being put in game. It's "content?
So if someone post too much, it's bad? If someone post too little, it's bad? If someone joined within last week to a month, it's bad? So could we like get a manual or something. To describe what DF fans consider acceptable post count + join date, before people here on MMORPG.com are allowed to talk about DF.
Auto-targetting is not "content". It is a game mechanic. Oh and I do love the mention of Ship Warfare. Just how many Ship to Ship battles, have you been apart of? Better yet how many have you seen? Got any screenshots? Maybe a video?
Also what does him having not played since Beta prove? Nothing, hell I can hazard a guess on how many people have left DF, from just reading their forums. Anyone with enough time spent on DF officials forums could. There are plenty of clans and alliances that have dropped off the map. Gone, inactive, not seen, or heard from.
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
I don't know where your getting those players critis from.. I hope not from EG!
The truth is that everybody that i'm playing the game with, is having fun. Nobody is leaving the game...well appart fronm the 112 peopole of the OP!!!
The core of the game is great,and the only drawback is that the game missing is fluff. There are no bunnies and fairies in DF...Darkfall is stable and unique,violent and hard, and with some more polishing it will shine for many years. AV with this expansion made a huge step to that direction.
If you have to decide between fluf and iinovation, there is nothing to think about. I just know that when you play the game you will love it , as everybody else..
I think I know enough at this juncture to know that I wouldn't love it. I've never lived in a communist country, but I can tell from what I have read/seen/heard that I wouldn't want to do it. Same situation with DF for me.
And no, not from EG. From various posters on various forums (here, official) and from bloggers and the like. And what they seem to agree upon (fans turned critics) directly goes against what you are saying. They feel the heart is indeed sick. And they do feel that people have been leaving. You see a glass as half full, they see it as half empty.
I really don't have the time at this juncture to delve too much deeper, but suffice it to say, I know I won't love DFO, even if I played it (and please none of the you can never know till you try type arguements, that door goes both ways and will lead you nowhere with me, I have lived long enough and seen enough to know what I know at this juncture). Again, I reiterate, you can have all the "innovation" you want, but it means nothing if you can't get the core right. I can build a house with innovative features, but if i don't get the foundation laid right, can't stabilize the bare bones of the house, then all of the innovation in the world won't keep it standing and make it liveable.
Dark, hard, violent...sure, all of that is fine and well, but in the end, it means nothing without a stable foundation. I don't choose games based on the ideas of fluff and innovation. I choose based on things like: Am I having fun? Does this feel more like a second job? Is the foundation stable?
Innovation, fluff, all of this means nothing in the end if I am not having fun.
Take the above as you will.
Flame on.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
If the core of the game is broken/flawed, then all of the features you would have to go to six different games to find really don't mean squat.
If the heart is sick, the body will fail. IE - if the core of the game isn't presented in a workable manner, then having a ton of "features" really doesn't mean anything if I can't enjoy the core, the foundation, the basic essence of what the game is.
FYI - not personally saying the core of the game doesn't work, but from the palyers turned critics, that would seem to be the general feeling I get. 20-30 developers implenting features without getting the core of the game right...doesn't sound all that impressive to me. Not here to argue semantics in the differences of core, features, mechanics and all of that, just throwing out some food for thought.
Flame on.
There isn't one MMO I can think of that didn't lose players that went on to become critics. That only makes the critics feelings valid for them, not for the entire gaming community. We also have very little way to distinguish between those who have genuinely played, and the many daily and frequent posters here who never have. Of course there's also a lot between, some who played for a day, got killed and looted and decided the heart was broke, or was it their heart, hard to tell.
DFO does not suffer from a broken heart, hardly any thing so dramatic. It's an ambitious game, very different from a simple PvE game because of all the player produced content. It's easier to make a theme park game, as you just need to ensure the rides work; but every one takes the same ride essentially. In a Sandbox game, where players construct and siege cities, and on and on, there are far more dynamics at play, but each patch has improved the game greatly.
We all know DFO isn't for every one, but not for the many reasons whined about here. It's not for every one, because it has full open PvP with full looting. There is no auto targeting, and there is no leveling auto get X skill. It's a tough game compared to the typical MMO, and unless one enjoys this type of game, well, they won't. lol Then there are players who legitiately do like this type of game, but for any number of reasons have left; not much different than any other game. They may return, may not, and life goes on.
-CC
Sure, plenty of MMOs lose players that become critics. Such is life.
Though, the statement you highlighted of mine, clearly stated that is just the feeling I get. I am not speaking in absolutes, so don't get the two confused. I am sure many people have left for a variety of reasons, but I don't have those reasons to go on, now do I? Most of the posts or blogs I have seen dealing with the subject give me the aforementioned "feeling".
As for the rest of your post, there are points I agree with and points I disagree with, but truly can't spend too much more time trying to post and counterpost tonight.
Do I think DF is a sandbox? No (everyone taking the same "ride" as you put, seems to go against the idea of a sandbox, well depending on whatever definition of sandbox you choose to use)
Do I think it has a "sick heart"? Yes (though we'll see what the patch did for it as time goes on)
Do I think DF is ambitious? I think the original "idea" was ambitious, but what was released, not so much.
(Please note that I stated I "think", therefore staying away from all encompassing statements of fact. Do I have proof for statements? Nope. Just feelings, ideas and thoughts based on what I have seen.)
And while you state that DFO isn't for everyone, but not due to the reasons people "whine" about here...I think you are making an all encompasing statement without much proof. Until you can get me proveable facts and figures, the "whines" as you put them are just as valid as anything you can come up with.
Do some people like DF? Sure. Does that mean the game truly has solid foundation? Maybe to them, but that doesn't make it so. Some people still believe the world is flat. Believe what you will, but if you are having fun, does it really matter?
On that note, I am out. Later.
On the other hand let’s see what's made it into the game... from a small “unprofessional” studio, which dares to develop their own graphics engine instead of making another mod by using the unreal engine.
I say let’s see some features that you can find in other games… but you need 6 titles to get them all!
I think that these features are much more important than “spell scrolls”.
These are just some of the features that you can find them all in one game that is made by “lying” Aventurine with 20-30 developers! The name of the game is Darkfall, and due to its uniqueness everyone is talking about it… Even you!
Heh... that's a pretty impressive list you made there.
Too bad some of the current players didn't correct you on your mistakes you made in building it.
I see that some of it you took from their out-dated features list. If you were a current player you should know that some of that is in fact NOT currently in the game. I'm not even a current player and I know some of it is incorrect.
But here is the chance for current players of DarkFall to show me wrong. To show me that they know more about the game than I do. To show that they are more factually correct about the game than a wind-bag on some 3rd-rate forum.
Ready...
There you go. Prove me wrong if I am. I try to be as factually correct as possible when dealing with facts like the list above.
The "exp pact" is great. Testing it right now. Troll is troll.
The largets siege war on the server was CC v Hyperion, CC declared 3 simultanious sieges at the same time each siege was easily 300 v 300. The reason the vids don't show 500v500 (its happened) is because most battles that happen in a siege are smaller groups spread out over the area, most being 50 v 50 on a single side. 1k people just rushing into each other would be retarded.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Stay on-topic, thanks.
That is such a cynical view.
So if AV can't pull it off and make a good indie game... then there's no one else can? AV is the "last great hope" for indie developers? Really?
There are other indie developers out there taking their crack at it as we speak.... Perhaps one of them will succeed where AV failed.
You is the one with the cynical post not the one you quoted.
He talked for any indie developer including your vaporware indie developers who have nothing shown.
Where DarkFall succeed others have to come that long. See MO will not release with sieging LOL.
Why not moan and bitch over at MO Forums. MO will be not feature complete missing a core feature - Sieging and large scale PvP - at lauch.
DarkFall has build a masterpiece go fiond something else to drop your fail at.
And how do you KNOW that MO will not have Sieging and Large Scale PvP at lauch?
Because the devs said so.. Personally I dont care its not in at launch.. Sieging and large scale PvP are not the "be all and end all" of what I want out of an MMO... Be nice when it comes but its the multitude of other features that are the draw for my cash..
Indie companies should never ever be given a "free ride" with people supporting them simply because they are a indie developer company. If Adventurine wants to enter the market and play with the big boys in MMO's they will have to deliver the goods and top an expected quality. Adventurine dug their own grave when Tasos started talking about how awesome DFO would be. Looking at the feature list and what was in at launch it comes clear to everyone that Tasos did nothing but lie. Several years before launch he did say that the game was featuyre complete, only polishing left. We all know the true story.
Does adventurine deserve the grave they dug for themself? No, but they need to kick the idiot who dug the grave for them. Look at Funcom and AoC launch. You had the Game director spending more time telling us for a long time how awesome the game would be. It would be a steak and WoW would be like a macdonald meal in comparison. When a GD spends more time hyping the game and telling lies he does dig the grave for the company and he needs to be dealt with. If mmo developers have learnt anything from the launch AoC saw and DFO that is that you cannot bullshit your customers. I don't care if you are running a 1 man developing studio, if you cannot act professional then simply you will be squished by the giants in the market.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
I along with my partner and a few other friends cancelled our subs 2-3 weeks ago after playing since launch. I can not speak for all of them but my reason was because I found the game very tedious and boring. I realized right away that the game was not ready for a big public release yet, it is still not ready,. but many fans of the game do not mind paying to play while devs continue polishing, adding game content and fixing broken mechanics, giving folk a reason to venture out of their protected player and npc towns. The Lands of Darkfall are barren, no reason for folk to get out to work on their fighting skills since macroing is the preferred choice, fight npc mobs and you will soon realise why -broken and monotonous pve-.
Crafting and harvesting, if you are into that type thing are also mind numbing boring. There is no place in this game for crafters unless you have a group of friends watch your back each time you go out to harvest. Killing and looting harvesters is the object, not going out there and doing the work yourself. So crafters have a few options, as I said before -always have friends watch your back, -harvest close to a protection tower and hope you get to it in time when attacked. While harvesting you drain away stamina, which you need to fight and sprint away with, also you are locked in place unable to pan around to see if a group is sneaking up behind you, so chances of you getting away from attackers are very slim.
Sieging, this is the only aspect of the game they did right and is actualy fun, at least in my opinion. Sadly, it is not enough to keep me or many like me interested, you can not siege each time you log on, there has to be more to a game then just macroing up skills and sieging. ...... Ive been a fan and waited for this game for 7 years, I gave it an honest shot, even kept my account open after realizing how broken it was, so I think that gives me a right to say that Darkfall in its current form is not ready for release.
I honestly beleive that fans should not be promoting the game yet, give the developers a chance to work on it more, test it out for them .... give them honest feed back, get rid of the bugs rather then abusing them, help the devs complete this game you love so they can finally have a product fit for general release. You do the developer no favour by glorifying the game in its current form nor those unsuspecting new players who have no idea what they are getting into.
Having said that, I still beleive Darkfall has potential, I'll be watching development and waiting for a reason to return.
That is such a cynical view.
So if AV can't pull it off and make a good indie game... then there's no one else can? AV is the "last great hope" for indie developers? Really?
There are other indie developers out there taking their crack at it as we speak.... Perhaps one of them will succeed where AV failed.
You is the one with the cynical post not the one you quoted.
He talked for any indie developer including your vaporware indie developers who have nothing shown.
Where DarkFall succeed others have to come that long. See MO will not release with sieging LOL.
Why not moan and bitch over at MO Forums. MO will be not feature complete missing a core feature - Sieging and large scale PvP - at lauch.
DarkFall has build a masterpiece go fiond something else to drop your fail at.
I find myself wondering this about most of your posts, Darth... But this one begs asking..
What the hell are you talking about?
That wasn't an anti-DF post. It wasn't a pro-MO post. I'm specifically addressing the tone of Cerio's post, which I find to be a bit cynical.
I'm questioning the notion that if AV doesn't succeed as an indie developer, that all hope is lost and people may as well just support the big companies... as though AV is the only indie developer out there trying to make something good; the "last great hope".
You take that post and turn it into some inane rant against MO, drenched in your trademark adulation of AV and DF.
Find something else to "drop my fail" at...?
Seriously... WTF, Darth?
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I have to agree with you. I haven`t even told my friends they put in housing.
Alot of the players are defending Darkfall on topics that are devastating for the game. We have lost 95 % of our loyal playerbase in three months and they still defend it. They simply can`t see why peoples are leaving in drowes and you hear the pathetic excuses all the time.
"They are leaving because we don`t have local banks, they are carebears, they have an exam, it`s the 4.Juli weekend (my favourit), they are on vacation, they are waiting for NA1 and so on."
The fact that the game suck in so many ways doesn`t seem to cross their mind. Darkfall isn`t a game for pvpers, but for old EQ and SWG players who wants full-loot. Talk about a niche marked.
haha I think your internet "friends" lied to you, they are all still playing
ChinaCat, do you have nothing better to do than to browse the post history of people here who criticize the game and report them or quote them? so you are upset about people who post negative stuff here, on a public mmo board, but yet you waste your time playing sherlock holmes for DF too. wtf?!
you know, not everyone who posts negative about df isn't interested in this game anymore, there are just way too many negative things about df for them to currently enjoy it. most of them even played the game, i know it's hard to believe and most of them wasted 50 bucks just to find out that the game has tons of serious flaws and wasn't the game that tasos promised us to be.
it's funny how you care so much about trolling, but the well known fanbois on this board don't seem to bother you too much.
jedi mind - heavenly divine, steadily shine in '99!
Another two-dimensional imbecile who sees things as this or that. There aren't only two options you know. Themepark WoW clones or POS software like Darkfall. There are other more skilled developers releasing games that does not follow the WoW blueprint. EVE being one of them and Mortal Online looks to be the next.
So just because I refuse to support a POS game like Darkfall with the crappy AV behind it does not mean "I am not supporting independant, creative, innovative games". Look at my sig, that is a well coded MMO developed by a small indie company with limited budget and I support them fully.
Well everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and I agree with your initial sentiment that there isn't only "this" or "that" and nothing else in regards to our options. However, I have to disagree with you on your opinion of Darkfall. I play the game, and have been since launch. Honestly, I feel the game was released too early, but with that said, I also feel like it is now farther ahead in terms of polish of really any MMO I've played from the get go.
Hell, it took Funcom almost 8 months to get rid of virtual memory errors and it took Aventurine about 5 weeks (although I'm sure it still happens rarely). My point is, Aventurine, in my opinion, is doing an excellent job with their patches and content updates, and is fixing the exact problems that I bitch about or bitched about before they were now fixed. Sure, Aventurine's management system was rocky when it first launched, and I'll agree that their customer service is severely lacking at the moment, but I personally expected that from an indie company that was basically broke.
And did you play EVE when it first came out? At least on my rig I encountered numerous serious bugs and my computer crashed quite frequently. Darkfall has crashed my computer once, and that was on week 1 of launch. And in terms of bugs, I've crashed through the floor twice, and it was because of the recall bug that was fixed in the first month. Sure there was a lot of exploits and in my opinion imbalances when it was first launched, but 3 months later I find the game to be in excellent shape, and I am confident that with a NA server opening up and ACTUAL PR from Aventurine (such as the new website and more interviews), I don't see Darkfall failing anytime soon, and in fact believe we're about to see a big population increase.
Very well said, thanks for your prespective.
ChinaCat is doing a good job.
I would suggest everyone to browse the post history to see what kind of gamer the poster is. Is it a troll, a fanboi, someone who hates full-loot..
Point is, who in their right mind would listen to a person who has no experience at all. How can you criticize something you have never tried? The worst part is the haters that have never tried DF still spend all their time convincing others not to try the game. How really sad isn`t that. Go get them ChinaCat. Make a list over the different posters and PM it to me. I would like to start my answer like this.
You mister ...... with 45 pages of post in the Darkfall forum have never played the game.
Hotjazz - I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, and if not, apologize for the question. That's part of the problem on this forum; it is so full of trivial posts by people who obtain a kick out of slamming others and a game, it's hard to keep any perspective here.
I've read some of your posts, and while we feel differently, I can hear your point of view with no desire or reason to argue or debate it. I don't share your views, but certainly understand them. The difference between you and the loudest most frequent posters here is you actually care about the game, and are dissapointed and stopped playing. At least, that's how it sounds. Others hiding behind the facade of "discussion" appear to want to drive players away and get pleasure out of doing nothing but being critical of a game they don't play. It's down-right wierd. One guy has 1,700 posts, 99% of which bash DFO and he has never played it. I'm the only one that sees a red flag there? This other fellow has over 500 posts alone on this forum, and is in the same canoe.
I've been playing MMO's since UO's release and have never seen this level of insanity towards a game, but as we all know, the MMO fan base has multiplied in droves since WoW's release and the average maturity level has plummeted, along with any ounce of common Internet curtousy. No matter how one feels about a game, I will never understand supporting those who act so belligerently, no matter what game board it may be on.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me,
what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
I check through posts from various users and there are trolls on both sides. There can be constructive criticism from someone who has not played the game such as saying why they will not try the game. It is something that can be looked at by the developers for use in the future. Those that are not constructive should be ignored and if bad enough reported. China Cat borders on being a troll because he is trying to coax other users into a flame. It is passive but still the coaxing is there.
That is unproductive and to an outsider who has an interest in the game it can look bad. Instead of passively trying to start an unproductive flame, China Cat should write what he enjoys in game. What does he like about it? Does housing add benefit? What would you like to see in the future of Darkfall? This will help the community even with certain people expressing dislike to the game.
Precisely! Thank you! Instead of trying to discredit anyone here by making completely inane comments about shoe size, or post counts China Cat should be promoting the game...I actually am beginning to suspect CC may be working for a rival company!
Because quite frankly this party has not furthered the cause of DFO by thier conduct.
I agree with you, that more posts from me about the game itself, my personal experiences and insight would be constructive. Having played since beta, and participated in all aspects of the game, I have a lot to share, and would like to. However, the tone of this forum, and how pretty much each thread is trolled by those who clearly enjoy berating the game, has prevented me from doing so; at least until now. Like any one new in town, I wanted to get the lay of the land, saw a lot of members bullying others around, and confronted it. If you or others experience that as trying to coax flames, that's your right; but that is the furtherst thing from my mind. I was trying to illuminate what I thought was the obvious, but what was being accepted carte blanche.
I've been exploring since the new patch, and tomorrow is a key day, as the weather system and other things will be patched in, in addition to deeper patch notes on what was done being provided. Over the weekend I should of had enough time logged since the updates to provide some feedback with substance. I will say this; the patch as far as PvE definately changed things for the better. Mid to high level mobs have become more reasonable; not to say they aren't difficult, but the ability to kill them from safety and ways to have diminished. Drops have improved. The random treasure chests are cool; my friend found one with 10k of gold and magic items. While this is a PvP game, the PvE is critical. No PvP game has ever been void of needing PvE content. It's an important way to gear up, have fun, and find hot spots for conflict.
Cheers -CC
"Lately it occurs to me,
what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter