I think a lot of people that play the game still are wanting soloing more so to just fill the time they have to wait in finding a group. I love group play more than soloing, I just hate having nothing to do for hours while waiting.
I think a lot of people that play the game still are wanting soloing more so to just fill the time they have to wait in finding a group. I love group play more than soloing, I just hate having nothing to do for hours while waiting.
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
I think a lot of people that play the game still are wanting soloing more so to just fill the time they have to wait in finding a group. I love group play more than soloing, I just hate having nothing to do for hours while waiting.
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
Sitting in your mog house LFG is a CHOICE. There is a lot of stuff you could do like you pointed out. Thats why I dont understand where some of these people are coming from when they say they hated lfg. IMO they just were not resourcefull enough and deserved sitting for hours LFG. At times I would go watch TV, go farm stuff, or even solo some exp. My BLM could rake in the xp solo on jellys, or I could take my pld/nin and go own some bones for decent exp. Just like eagler has been saying If you knew HOW to play the game then you had no problem. All you had to do was keep a warping item on you for when you got a PT invite. FFXI did a good job of weeding the people who dont know 2 squats on how to play a game thats one reason that the community is so strong in ffxi.
I agree with your last sentance as well. It would be very unwise for SE to forsake their loyal and strong fanbase for trying to go to casual and solo friendly. As much as the solo'ers and casual players may hate to admitt it SE has a big enough following that they dont really need them. Sure it would be nice to have them thats why I think SE will throw them a bone but I just cant see them ditching their loyal fans.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
So why not play just the old game than instead of making a new one with basically the...same...thing? Oh okay. Your epeen needs to be bigger than everyone elses! Gotcha!
Just because your close minded isn't my fault.. so don't attack me. I don't want "basically the...same...thing" but there is nothing wrong with NOT wanting a group centric game to go solo you retard. If your point of view is not the same as someone else's.. you don't have to attack, state your opinion, make your point, and move on. But of course your little brain obviously can't handle the fact that just because 1.. let me repeat 1 aspect of a game is not changed, that it can still be a completely different game.
So why not play just the old game than instead of making a new one with basically the...same...thing? Oh okay. Your epeen needs to be bigger than everyone elses! Gotcha!
Well if thats your best argument lets just turn the tables, if solo'ers and casuals want solo and casual stuff why not just go back to WoW.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
Some people want to log on and just play the game, soloing a year ago was not effecient enough to bother with, especially if you didn't need GIL (was at the point where I no longer farmed). I still did it but it was out of being bored.
Saying that you can go do something else outside the game doesn't really cut it, you are on the game to play the game and the long waits were a big problem for several jobs that could go a week without seeing an invite. SE simply needs to improve the time it takes to get a group. I remember logging on, putting my flag up and sitting around reading/playing other games until I heard windower tell me I had recieved a /tell hours later
I don't know why this argument about solo play is still going on, the devs already said it was going to happen whether we like it or not, I'm sure they know the majority of people would rather not wait around to play and thats why they did it. When you play a game you aren't suppose to cut it on then go do something else for the day, you're suppose to cut it on and play it.
I don't know why this argument about solo play is still going on, the devs already said it was going to happen whether we like it or not, I'm sure they know the majority of people would rather not wait around to play and thats why they did it. When you play a game you aren't suppose to cut it on then go do something else for the day, you're suppose to cut it on and play it.
I dont recall the devs saying anything about soloing. So link that to me please. They did say aimed at casual in the Q&A. But that is way to vague. Whats casual to SE may not be casual to casual players.
SE doesnt seem to listen a whole lot to its western fanbase and thats the best part about SE.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
I dont recall the devs saying anything about soloing. So link that to me please. They did say aimed at casual in the Q&A. But that is way to vague. Whats casual to SE may not be casual to casual players. SE doesnt seem to listen a whole lot to its western fanbase and thats the best part about SE.
It's said in that vid- not the best news I've heard, but if the game's at least somewhat challenging and involving I won't mind the improved solo play.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
I dont recall the devs saying anything about soloing. So link that to me please. They did say aimed at casual in the Q&A. But that is way to vague. Whats casual to SE may not be casual to casual players. SE doesnt seem to listen a whole lot to its western fanbase and thats the best part about SE.
All the proof you need was linked by the person above me in that video with the devs. They start to talk about the solo aspect and group aspect around 4:50. Know your battles before you go and try to debunk someone on them please, i'm sure you know what 'google' is. FFXIV without question will have solo play and we need to just get over it, the majority of people do want it even if we don't like it.
That still did not give me enough info. What I took from it is that there will be some things to do solo what those solo things are and how much of a role it will play in the meat of the game is yet to be seen. I can see now that depending on what side of the fence you are on you can definatly bend that video to argue in your favor.
EDIT Example: Maybe you can solo quests and various other things. But maybe soloing quests doesnt increase your Weapon "growth" in which case you have to group to fight higher level mobs. Like he said "do one thing one day and another thing another day." Then some of you guys who need your hand held and be told what to do can quest while lfg.
Edit Edit: So now we get the Quest grind AND Mob grind!!!!!!!!!!! Yup leave it to SE to come up with double the fun.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Thus why don't we wait till more information is released. I'm sure it will be a little more casual friendly.. since thats what they said.... still considering how not soloable it is for a lot of people.. making it a little more friendly will still have it on the non casual side. Time will tell, but I trust them.
if they kept it the same as ffxi people wouldn't bother porting over, and new players would hate it because it'd be tedious and annoying to do anything with.
Not so fast Valentina. This goes back to my "SOCOM example" I said to someone on a previous post.
Think of it this way. When SOCOM2 came out, it was basically just an enhanced version of the first SOCOM game. So why port over and play the new game? It was simply an improved version of what you loved originally, right? Well, SOCOM2 sold out majorly, still actually has a handful of people playing, and basically showed that new and improved sequels of games can sell. Besides, FF XIV won't be completely similar. They're introducing a sphere grid idea that probably will copy FF X's idea, and SE said that the game will be supposedly more casual than before (although read the previous posts to see why FF XIV will mostly likely remain hardcore and have stronger group aspects than solo aspects). So, I don't think porting over to a new and (hopefully) improved version of FF XI will be tedious and annoying, there's probably thousands of people already watching to see when FF XIV will come out.
Thats what got my blood pumping. Yes their going have a "Job system" will it be exactly the same as FFXI? who knows. Will there be Sub-jobs? I hope so,as the Job system and the sub-job ability was one of the best things about FFXI, and to this date I still dont see one mmo that has anything like it. From what I have read it will be a whole new game with some of the best aspects of FFXI added in for extra flavor {grins},but who knows we dont have much details,and until we do Im not casting any opinions except that I hope they do a good job on it.
And I think its good their not hyping the krap out of the game, the last time I got my self hyped/pumped for a game(WAR) it was a let down for me, was a good game,but not enough to make me pay a sub anymore.
Edit: IMO if you ONLY want to solo in an MMO and not interact with other people playing that mmo you mite as well play an offline RPG imo.
Edit: IMO if you ONLY want to solo in an MMO and not interact with other people playing that mmo you mite as well play an offline RPG imo.
Killing a mob by yourself and interacting with people are two different things, why are you considering them to be one? When you get in a group are you conversing with people? 99% of groups made, not a word is spoken the entire time.
MMO means you are in a game world that other people are in.
I am on the internet now and I am posting this by myself on a 'community board' am I not? I am not being forced to talk to people if I want to do something on here even though this is a community.
I am on here by myself but I also like to be in places where others are.
No man, your dead wrong, and you missed the point of my post. I simply wanted to point out that soloing was possible, because people keep saying "I don't care if its hard and less rewarding, I just don't to sit in Jeuno all day without the option to solo while I wait for a party". So I made it 100% clear that FFXI was exactly this way already.
Your also wrong about the jobs. Yes, for BST you need to be level 30 to unlock it.. but what does it matter, solo your way there and unlock it... besides your going to need a subjob anyway, so level which ever you chose to use as your sub and get it to 30. Then your set.
As for NIN. Um... I do believe I said "yes, it would be expensive". I would also like to point out that I don't care which way you go with NIN, your going to HAVE to get utsusemi: ichi and ni... solo or grouping... so your point is void.
For BLM, all you really need for BLM to solo is capped abilities, some decent gear and all the spells. Again, your going to need all of this whether you solo or go grouped anyway. Sleep, bind, debuff, nuke... rinse and repeat.... sleep and bind being the main spells that allow BLM to solo, and they come pretty early on... so again, your wrong.
Again I can go on, but I've made my point. Soloing was possible in FFXI, I'm sorry, but it was.
Yes, you are right about soloing, they can solo... i agree., but since you know quite a lot of soloing...
Can you tell little more about when they can start solo?
It's no-brainer that you can solo with anything if your lvl is high and has all abilities, but your soloing is based on character with high lvl.... my question is... can you reach high enough lvl via soloing? from lvl 20?
Please read the post before you make comments. I actually originaly posted 5 jobs in FFXI that were soloable.. and stated that I could go on... but I wasnt gonna sit there and go through every job. I made my point.
Soloing was not just high end. At any level, any job could solo, given the fact that you actually know how to play your job, and fight mobs that are weak to your job type. Now this is the part that for some reason it seems you cannot understand. YOU WILL NOT GAIN A BILLION EXP IN AN HOUR. IT WILL NOT BE AS FAST AS LEVELING IN A PARTY. IT WILL BE HARD. IT WILL BE RISKY. IT WILL BE DANGEROUS. THE REWARD WILL NOT BE GREAT FOR THE MOST PART. IT WILL BE TIME COMSUMING. IT IS POSSIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now you answer me a question or two. First, why do people want a completely soloable MMORPG? I mean, I don't play MMORPG's to play by myself, it just don't make sense. Now I can see wanting to have the ability to escape and go out by yourself once in awhile, or when there is nothing else to do.. but that option was provided. The truth is that it seems people keep saying this is all they want, but really they want more. People did not solo in FFXI because it was alot less rewarding and everything else I stated above than grouping.. so people just overlooked it. All these people really want is "easy".
Second, why do people keep confusing "casual friendly" with "soloability". To me, "casual friendly" means that there will be more quests to do that are more rewarding. Or maybe they will not make us do genkais. Maybe they will simply impliment more ideas in the game that people can get involved in that will give them something to do when they log on, and it won't take along time to do a "run" of whatever this may be. "Soloability" means that everyone can take every job and level it to level cap just about as fast... or as fast as people that decide to group up to make parties. So again, why is everyone confusing the two?
Since you want me to answer couple questions...
1. I never asked for completely soloable MMORPG, if solo play is as rewarding as party play, then it's wrong. Like i said... i never asked for Full Solo-capable FFXI (or FFXIV). But I'd like to see FFXIV is little more forgiving for solo players... not like FFXI when i was playing. And I liked very much when i play with groups of ppl... it's just so hard to get a chance when you only have couple hrs, you can't even from static with that short of time window.
Why do i want to solo? because just like other hundreds of ppl, i didn't have much time and only has couple hrs per day.
In FFXI, couple hrs is just not enough for ppl with not-so-popular job... and you can't throw your flag up for other jobs you have other than one you are playing at the moment...(you could write a note on your flag or shout every min... but that's not very reliable) plus there are other reasons that keeping me LFG in city instead of go out and have fun with my class.
#1. soloable mob and party play exp mob is at different location... I 'm sure you know you have to go distance to get to certain place. And somtimes party is looking (and prefers) for someone/replacement nearby their camp location ( this is 100% truth), so you don't want to wonder around if you want to get an invite... at least stay in the main city location to get a fair chance.
#2. Gear changing and subjob changing... I'm sure you know about this too. You don't want to throw your flag up with wrong subjob, period. You know what that means, right? if you have a wrong/weird/under-lvled subjob, then your chance of getting an invite is go way down (except for popular classes like RDM/BLM/WHM). But in order to go out and kill some time while waiting for an invite to come... you might need sub WHM (just an example)
#3 despite all those trouble above, you go out and try to enjoy... what are you getting? 1000 exp an hour? maybe less... if you are not lucky, then you might end up losing EXP... And i'm not going to let my invite chance go down over 1000EXP/hr... that's just lessthan 5 mobs on party play.
#4, forming party is time consuming task, trust me... i tried to form party many times... but certain class is so hard to find. and FFXI's party play is close to impossible without a proper setup... and if you don' t have proper setup, then ppl will not come to your party... example THF/THF/DRK/WAR/RNG/DRG.
#5 even if you are lucky to get an invite right away, it takes avg. of 15-30 min to get together at the camp site, then if one goes for AFK, dang... 10 min easily, if there is a train/mis-pull and WHM go down, then it's another 10 min... hope ur WHM has re-raise casted.... sometimes your first hour is passed just get the party to start... then after 30 min, you have to give them a warning and start to looking for a replacement.... BTW, usually if someone gives you 30 min warning after 30 min. of party, you'll get an impressions like WTF? or WTH you joining this party for? Is it just me experienced this stuff? (if yes, then i must be super unlucky) Darn... this bringe me old memory... /rantoff
uh, sorry post gets way longer than i wanted to be... anyway, these things kept me in the city and force me to LFG in city for last couple months of my FFXI... and that is why I want FFXIV is more forgiving on aspects like above. I'm just saying it one more time that I didn't asked for a full soloable FFXIV, I just want to have more option avavilable for ppl with limited time resources.
Answer for the second question,
My personal definition of "soloability" and "casual-friendly" are same... maybe that's why we still have this discussion going.
FFXI is a great game and I had so much fun playing with others... i want to be able to hit skillchain and manaburst one more time... I want my DRK to start the chain and mix {manaburst} on mid chain.... If it's not that great... i wouldn't complain this much.
Killing a mob by yourself and interacting with people are two different things
Killing a mob together and chatting with people are 2 different things, too. That's not something you can do solo, although you can interact with others still.
You can't cooperate and work together with others to achieve a similar goal alone. I think this is part of the 'Multiplayer' in the 'MMO'.
EDIT: To the above post, just make grouping casual and your problems will be fixed. It doesn't seem to be the approach the devs are taking though, so what you say will most likely come true in the end.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
First off, I must state that I really haven't played FF XI (only tried it out for an hour with a friend who owned the game), but I know well enough of the mechanics to know that I would've been hooked on the game, plus that hour of gaming has made me really wish that I could afford the game and go to college (or more likely a trade school, I'm thinking about picking up a trade). Plus, loved the white mage role, and hoping there will be a ninja class inside FF XIV. Now, you're all wondering "why shouldn't FF XIV introduce casual aspects? Wouldn't it attract more customers?" Perhaps it would attract more casuals. But this could end up badly as well. Think of it this way. The majority of FF XI gamers are used to the hardcore aspects, as well as the brutal death punishments (you lose a ton of experience on all of your jobs). But FF XI still managed to get around 500,000 steady subscriptions on this aspect alone. So, Square Enix believe it can make more money by making FF XI's successor, FF XIV, more casual friendly, right? Wrong. More likely it will simply alienate the original fanbase. Then, there won't be enough of the original fanbase because they will stick to FF XI instead, and there may not be enough casuals to fill the void. Simply put, Square Enix should not fix anything that wasn't broken to begin with. Here is a list of possible casual ideas that might be implemented that will have serious impact on FF XIV compared to FF XI: 1. Less brutal death punishments: FF XI was a haven known for brutal death punishments, that is what the majority was based on. Weaken that aspect, and you weaken any chances of the original fanbase staying around for FF XIV and instead sticking with FF XI. 2. More solo aspects: Now, I'm not saying that all solo aspects are casual based, but look at the mechanics of FF XI. You could technically solo...for the first few levels. Then, if you dared solo, you would die quickly, therefore you grouped with others like the group-based mechanics of the game required you to do so. It would seem like casual solo would be a good idea, but if FF XIV follows many mechanics of FF XI, more soloing will kill the group aspect from FF XI. Once again, the original fanbase grew up on group aspect in FF XI. Make FF XIV more solo friendly, and you'll make the original fanbase more likely to ignore FF XIV and stick with FF XI. Now, this is only a possible list. It's possible that FF XIV could very well end up being the first prime game ever to have hardcore and casual aspects, and the game succeeds. On the other hand, this situation could end up like EQ2, that tried to put in casual aspects and the game died as a result (among other contributers, but casual aspects was a prime killer). I expect many casual gamers here to be angry, but please stick to intelligent thoughts and avoid flaming. Perhaps you may even convince me that FF XIV would not die if casual aspects were inserted, but you will not achieve that goal if you flame on this thread.
the solo part is so untrue, when the game first came out (probably a few months after release) i decided to play this game, because i love FF so much. i chose red mage (soloed just fine), until i got a second job (warrior). so i then soloed my red mage/warrior to about level 37 before i lost interest in the game. now, the reason i didn't group wasn't because i didnt want to, it was because every time i got near other players it lagged so badly i couldnt move. my computer at the time wasnt very good, and couldnt really handle the game all that well, but solo i was fine with 20-30 fps. so, the unable to solo thing is unfounded, case in point.
FFXI had to many unnesssisary time sinks. It took a much longer time than it really needed to be on a lot of things in that game. Groups huddling around one monster was not very "Final Fantasy Epicness" to me.
Just because something becomes or is said to be more "casual" friendly does not mean "easy" mode. Ugh, FFXI had such a snobby community...At least on the Titan server anyway..
Hopefully there will be major improvements to the interface, quest/mission structure, and less time sinks. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed seeing people on a boat as a sailed to a new land, but for 5 minutes? Especially when I just have one simple task to do? Yeah, no thanks.
I couldn't agree more about the time sinks/casual friendly. As with most of the FF games FFXI was really top notch/good quality, but the game was designed in the EQ-era where time sinks were just the way to keep gamers online/playing and MMO competition was sparse. I think it's really never recovered from that, though it's tried to compensate.
But that said, it still is a really good game; most games out there just can't compare. Also the community on my server was not too bad; just depends on who you meet along the way.
First off, I must state that I really haven't played FF XI (only tried it out for an hour with a friend who owned the game), but I know well enough of the mechanics to know that I would've been hooked on the game, plus that hour of gaming has made me really wish that I could afford the game and go to college (or more likely a trade school, I'm thinking about picking up a trade). Plus, loved the white mage role, and hoping there will be a ninja class inside FF XIV. Now, you're all wondering "why shouldn't FF XIV introduce casual aspects? Wouldn't it attract more customers?" Perhaps it would attract more casuals. But this could end up badly as well. Think of it this way. The majority of FF XI gamers are used to the hardcore aspects, as well as the brutal death punishments (you lose a ton of experience on all of your jobs). But FF XI still managed to get around 500,000 steady subscriptions on this aspect alone. So, Square Enix believe it can make more money by making FF XI's successor, FF XIV, more casual friendly, right? Wrong. More likely it will simply alienate the original fanbase. Then, there won't be enough of the original fanbase because they will stick to FF XI instead, and there may not be enough casuals to fill the void. Simply put, Square Enix should not fix anything that wasn't broken to begin with. Here is a list of possible casual ideas that might be implemented that will have serious impact on FF XIV compared to FF XI: 1. Less brutal death punishments: FF XI was a haven known for brutal death punishments, that is what the majority was based on. Weaken that aspect, and you weaken any chances of the original fanbase staying around for FF XIV and instead sticking with FF XI. 2. More solo aspects: Now, I'm not saying that all solo aspects are casual based, but look at the mechanics of FF XI. You could technically solo...for the first few levels. Then, if you dared solo, you would die quickly, therefore you grouped with others like the group-based mechanics of the game required you to do so. It would seem like casual solo would be a good idea, but if FF XIV follows many mechanics of FF XI, more soloing will kill the group aspect from FF XI. Once again, the original fanbase grew up on group aspect in FF XI. Make FF XIV more solo friendly, and you'll make the original fanbase more likely to ignore FF XIV and stick with FF XI. Now, this is only a possible list. It's possible that FF XIV could very well end up being the first prime game ever to have hardcore and casual aspects, and the game succeeds. On the other hand, this situation could end up like EQ2, that tried to put in casual aspects and the game died as a result (among other contributers, but casual aspects was a prime killer). I expect many casual gamers here to be angry, but please stick to intelligent thoughts and avoid flaming. Perhaps you may even convince me that FF XIV would not die if casual aspects were inserted, but you will not achieve that goal if you flame on this thread.
the solo part is so untrue, when the game first came out (probably a few months after release) i decided to play this game, because i love FF so much. i chose red mage (soloed just fine), until i got a second job (warrior). so i then soloed my red mage/warrior to about level 37 before i lost interest in the game. now, the reason i didn't group wasn't because i didnt want to, it was because every time i got near other players it lagged so badly i couldnt move. my computer at the time wasnt very good, and couldnt really handle the game all that well, but solo i was fine with 20-30 fps. so, the unable to solo thing is unfounded, case in point.
Ah, I expected this to come somewhere along the line.
Like I stated before, I admit that I do not have alot of direct experience playing FF XI, and although shadowing the whole experience and learning the mechanics of the game has allowed me to make valid statements, I do admit that I'm not exactly 100% knowledgable of the entire game.
But, I think we can all agree on this thought. FFXI was a mostly forced group game (not all builds could solo, you have to design a character that way). Also, although some classes could be soloed, a game can't really be considered solo friendly if only a few classes can actually solo successfully. And, if more solo aspects were brought in (i.e. you could solo the entire game as easily as group play it through, solo gets equal rewards as group play, etc.), they could very well wreck the group aspect of FFXIV (whatever it ends up being, considering the new ideas being implemented).
So, I will say this. Certain character builds could solo the game, but by "certain" I mean very few compared to the number of builds that couldn't. And, considering how group-oriented the game was, soloing probably wasn't as popular as group play in FF XI.
Now, don't expect this to be an attack on you jayheld90. I do admit that I am not quite as experienced as an average FF XI player, but we can all agree that in a mostly forced group-based game, soloing was not the popular option.
Edit: IMO if you ONLY want to solo in an MMO and not interact with other people playing that mmo you mite as well play an offline RPG imo.
Killing a mob by yourself and interacting with people are two different things, why are you considering them to be one? When you get in a group are you conversing with people? 99% of groups made, not a word is spoken the entire time.
MMO means you are in a game world that other people are in.
I am on the internet now and I am posting this by myself on a 'community board' am I not? I am not being forced to talk to people if I want to do something on here even though this is a community.
I am on here by myself but I also like to be in places where others are.
Tushay, That is true and now Im a little more inlightened, thx .good point
One of the BEST reasons if not the only reason for keeping a game GROUP oriented,is to lose the asshats in gaming.
If you are a total jerk,everyone will soon know you and you will not get groups and will be forced out of the game,and for most people they would say "good riddance" and have a happier community for it.If everything is solable/casual then you can be a total jerk,spam the chat with retarded spam and you won't care because you don't need anyones help in the game.
I see it actually everyday,players ask for help and some jerk butts in and says things like "only a loser needs help for that quest" or "I can solo it easily,what can't you solo it",basically all sorts of jerk off comments hit the chat.Now imagine that player cannot solo and needs help,lmao good luck on asking for help.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
One of the BEST reasons if not the only reason for keeping a game GROUP oriented,is to lose the asshats in gaming.
I agree
Word of mouth in a grouping game travels very well.
I cant count how many times I was making a pt in ffxi and I or someone else said "oh look "john doe" is LFg and someone in the PT butted in and told us that he was a complete asshat. Once they said that there was no way I invited them.
On the other token With FFXI's community and its job system it allowed for a person to make a name for themselves because they were not always leveling alts. You learn who the good players are. If you see them LFG you ask them first, because you know they are a good player.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
I also agree... forcing groups forces players to behave which is a good thing. Also since you can switch jobs with one character instead of making alts you gain REAL reputation and I just think that's very cool. Anyway I'm pretty much just repeating what the person above me or so had said.
Comments
I think a lot of people that play the game still are wanting soloing more so to just fill the time they have to wait in finding a group. I love group play more than soloing, I just hate having nothing to do for hours while waiting.
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
I agree 100%.. but for some reason this concept is to hard for people to understand.
So why not play just the old game than instead of making a new one with basically the...same...thing?
Oh okay. Your epeen needs to be bigger than everyone elses! Gotcha!
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
Sitting in your mog house LFG is a CHOICE. There is a lot of stuff you could do like you pointed out. Thats why I dont understand where some of these people are coming from when they say they hated lfg. IMO they just were not resourcefull enough and deserved sitting for hours LFG. At times I would go watch TV, go farm stuff, or even solo some exp. My BLM could rake in the xp solo on jellys, or I could take my pld/nin and go own some bones for decent exp. Just like eagler has been saying If you knew HOW to play the game then you had no problem. All you had to do was keep a warping item on you for when you got a PT invite. FFXI did a good job of weeding the people who dont know 2 squats on how to play a game thats one reason that the community is so strong in ffxi.
I agree with your last sentance as well. It would be very unwise for SE to forsake their loyal and strong fanbase for trying to go to casual and solo friendly. As much as the solo'ers and casual players may hate to admitt it SE has a big enough following that they dont really need them. Sure it would be nice to have them thats why I think SE will throw them a bone but I just cant see them ditching their loyal fans.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Just because your close minded isn't my fault.. so don't attack me. I don't want "basically the...same...thing" but there is nothing wrong with NOT wanting a group centric game to go solo you retard. If your point of view is not the same as someone else's.. you don't have to attack, state your opinion, make your point, and move on. But of course your little brain obviously can't handle the fact that just because 1.. let me repeat 1 aspect of a game is not changed, that it can still be a completely different game.
Well if thats your best argument lets just turn the tables, if solo'ers and casuals want solo and casual stuff why not just go back to WoW.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Well played ^^
The logical thing to do while lfg in FFXI is killing other things, usually to gain materials to sell to get gil to buy gear. If you spend your lfg time sitting around like a bump on a log, then you should feel like said bump (bored as heck.) If you spend the time reading, watching tv, etc, thats also fine...point is that yes, at some points it can take hours to find a group in ffxi, though XIV shouldn't have that issue...as long as they don't implement exp gain on every quest in the entire effen game like some MMOs, they should be fine. Soloing in a MMORPG should be the least rewarding on a per hour basis, otherwise people will completely forsake the "MMO" part of the game. When you've a reputation for providing excellent group PvE play, it would be unwise to suddenly decide to switch to mediocre solo play as a focus, wouldn't you agree?
Some people want to log on and just play the game, soloing a year ago was not effecient enough to bother with, especially if you didn't need GIL (was at the point where I no longer farmed). I still did it but it was out of being bored.
Saying that you can go do something else outside the game doesn't really cut it, you are on the game to play the game and the long waits were a big problem for several jobs that could go a week without seeing an invite. SE simply needs to improve the time it takes to get a group. I remember logging on, putting my flag up and sitting around reading/playing other games until I heard windower tell me I had recieved a /tell hours later
I don't know why this argument about solo play is still going on, the devs already said it was going to happen whether we like it or not, I'm sure they know the majority of people would rather not wait around to play and thats why they did it. When you play a game you aren't suppose to cut it on then go do something else for the day, you're suppose to cut it on and play it.
I don't know why this argument about solo play is still going on, the devs already said it was going to happen whether we like it or not, I'm sure they know the majority of people would rather not wait around to play and thats why they did it. When you play a game you aren't suppose to cut it on then go do something else for the day, you're suppose to cut it on and play it.
I dont recall the devs saying anything about soloing. So link that to me please. They did say aimed at casual in the Q&A. But that is way to vague. Whats casual to SE may not be casual to casual players.
SE doesnt seem to listen a whole lot to its western fanbase and thats the best part about SE.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
www.youtube.com/watch
It's said in that vid- not the best news I've heard, but if the game's at least somewhat challenging and involving I won't mind the improved solo play.
All the proof you need was linked by the person above me in that video with the devs. They start to talk about the solo aspect and group aspect around 4:50. Know your battles before you go and try to debunk someone on them please, i'm sure you know what 'google' is. FFXIV without question will have solo play and we need to just get over it, the majority of people do want it even if we don't like it.
Well I had not seen that video, thx for linking.
That still did not give me enough info. What I took from it is that there will be some things to do solo what those solo things are and how much of a role it will play in the meat of the game is yet to be seen. I can see now that depending on what side of the fence you are on you can definatly bend that video to argue in your favor.
EDIT Example: Maybe you can solo quests and various other things. But maybe soloing quests doesnt increase your Weapon "growth" in which case you have to group to fight higher level mobs. Like he said "do one thing one day and another thing another day." Then some of you guys who need your hand held and be told what to do can quest while lfg.
Edit Edit: So now we get the Quest grind AND Mob grind!!!!!!!!!!! Yup leave it to SE to come up with double the fun.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Thus why don't we wait till more information is released. I'm sure it will be a little more casual friendly.. since thats what they said.... still considering how not soloable it is for a lot of people.. making it a little more friendly will still have it on the non casual side. Time will tell, but I trust them.
Not so fast Valentina. This goes back to my "SOCOM example" I said to someone on a previous post.
Think of it this way. When SOCOM2 came out, it was basically just an enhanced version of the first SOCOM game. So why port over and play the new game? It was simply an improved version of what you loved originally, right? Well, SOCOM2 sold out majorly, still actually has a handful of people playing, and basically showed that new and improved sequels of games can sell. Besides, FF XIV won't be completely similar. They're introducing a sphere grid idea that probably will copy FF X's idea, and SE said that the game will be supposedly more casual than before (although read the previous posts to see why FF XIV will mostly likely remain hardcore and have stronger group aspects than solo aspects). So, I don't think porting over to a new and (hopefully) improved version of FF XI will be tedious and annoying, there's probably thousands of people already watching to see when FF XIV will come out.
Thats what got my blood pumping. Yes their going have a "Job system" will it be exactly the same as FFXI? who knows. Will there be Sub-jobs? I hope so,as the Job system and the sub-job ability was one of the best things about FFXI, and to this date I still dont see one mmo that has anything like it. From what I have read it will be a whole new game with some of the best aspects of FFXI added in for extra flavor {grins},but who knows we dont have much details,and until we do Im not casting any opinions except that I hope they do a good job on it.
And I think its good their not hyping the krap out of the game, the last time I got my self hyped/pumped for a game(WAR) it was a let down for me, was a good game,but not enough to make me pay a sub anymore.
Edit: IMO if you ONLY want to solo in an MMO and not interact with other people playing that mmo you mite as well play an offline RPG imo.
Killing a mob by yourself and interacting with people are two different things, why are you considering them to be one? When you get in a group are you conversing with people? 99% of groups made, not a word is spoken the entire time.
MMO means you are in a game world that other people are in.
I am on the internet now and I am posting this by myself on a 'community board' am I not? I am not being forced to talk to people if I want to do something on here even though this is a community.
I am on here by myself but I also like to be in places where others are.
Yes, you are right about soloing, they can solo... i agree., but since you know quite a lot of soloing...
Can you tell little more about when they can start solo?
It's no-brainer that you can solo with anything if your lvl is high and has all abilities, but your soloing is based on character with high lvl.... my question is... can you reach high enough lvl via soloing? from lvl 20?
Please read the post before you make comments. I actually originaly posted 5 jobs in FFXI that were soloable.. and stated that I could go on... but I wasnt gonna sit there and go through every job. I made my point.
Soloing was not just high end. At any level, any job could solo, given the fact that you actually know how to play your job, and fight mobs that are weak to your job type. Now this is the part that for some reason it seems you cannot understand. YOU WILL NOT GAIN A BILLION EXP IN AN HOUR. IT WILL NOT BE AS FAST AS LEVELING IN A PARTY. IT WILL BE HARD. IT WILL BE RISKY. IT WILL BE DANGEROUS. THE REWARD WILL NOT BE GREAT FOR THE MOST PART. IT WILL BE TIME COMSUMING. IT IS POSSIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now you answer me a question or two. First, why do people want a completely soloable MMORPG? I mean, I don't play MMORPG's to play by myself, it just don't make sense. Now I can see wanting to have the ability to escape and go out by yourself once in awhile, or when there is nothing else to do.. but that option was provided. The truth is that it seems people keep saying this is all they want, but really they want more. People did not solo in FFXI because it was alot less rewarding and everything else I stated above than grouping.. so people just overlooked it. All these people really want is "easy".
Second, why do people keep confusing "casual friendly" with "soloability". To me, "casual friendly" means that there will be more quests to do that are more rewarding. Or maybe they will not make us do genkais. Maybe they will simply impliment more ideas in the game that people can get involved in that will give them something to do when they log on, and it won't take along time to do a "run" of whatever this may be. "Soloability" means that everyone can take every job and level it to level cap just about as fast... or as fast as people that decide to group up to make parties. So again, why is everyone confusing the two?
Since you want me to answer couple questions...
1. I never asked for completely soloable MMORPG, if solo play is as rewarding as party play, then it's wrong. Like i said... i never asked for Full Solo-capable FFXI (or FFXIV). But I'd like to see FFXIV is little more forgiving for solo players... not like FFXI when i was playing. And I liked very much when i play with groups of ppl... it's just so hard to get a chance when you only have couple hrs, you can't even from static with that short of time window.
Why do i want to solo? because just like other hundreds of ppl, i didn't have much time and only has couple hrs per day.
In FFXI, couple hrs is just not enough for ppl with not-so-popular job... and you can't throw your flag up for other jobs you have other than one you are playing at the moment...(you could write a note on your flag or shout every min... but that's not very reliable) plus there are other reasons that keeping me LFG in city instead of go out and have fun with my class.
#1. soloable mob and party play exp mob is at different location... I 'm sure you know you have to go distance to get to certain place. And somtimes party is looking (and prefers) for someone/replacement nearby their camp location ( this is 100% truth), so you don't want to wonder around if you want to get an invite... at least stay in the main city location to get a fair chance.
#2. Gear changing and subjob changing... I'm sure you know about this too. You don't want to throw your flag up with wrong subjob, period. You know what that means, right? if you have a wrong/weird/under-lvled subjob, then your chance of getting an invite is go way down (except for popular classes like RDM/BLM/WHM). But in order to go out and kill some time while waiting for an invite to come... you might need sub WHM (just an example)
#3 despite all those trouble above, you go out and try to enjoy... what are you getting? 1000 exp an hour? maybe less... if you are not lucky, then you might end up losing EXP... And i'm not going to let my invite chance go down over 1000EXP/hr... that's just lessthan 5 mobs on party play.
#4, forming party is time consuming task, trust me... i tried to form party many times... but certain class is so hard to find. and FFXI's party play is close to impossible without a proper setup... and if you don' t have proper setup, then ppl will not come to your party... example THF/THF/DRK/WAR/RNG/DRG.
#5 even if you are lucky to get an invite right away, it takes avg. of 15-30 min to get together at the camp site, then if one goes for AFK, dang... 10 min easily, if there is a train/mis-pull and WHM go down, then it's another 10 min... hope ur WHM has re-raise casted.... sometimes your first hour is passed just get the party to start... then after 30 min, you have to give them a warning and start to looking for a replacement.... BTW, usually if someone gives you 30 min warning after 30 min. of party, you'll get an impressions like WTF? or WTH you joining this party for? Is it just me experienced this stuff? (if yes, then i must be super unlucky) Darn... this bringe me old memory... /rantoff
uh, sorry post gets way longer than i wanted to be... anyway, these things kept me in the city and force me to LFG in city for last couple months of my FFXI... and that is why I want FFXIV is more forgiving on aspects like above. I'm just saying it one more time that I didn't asked for a full soloable FFXIV, I just want to have more option avavilable for ppl with limited time resources.
Answer for the second question,
My personal definition of "soloability" and "casual-friendly" are same... maybe that's why we still have this discussion going.
FFXI is a great game and I had so much fun playing with others... i want to be able to hit skillchain and manaburst one more time... I want my DRK to start the chain and mix {manaburst} on mid chain.... If it's not that great... i wouldn't complain this much.
please give me another way to enjoy this game.
/cheer
Killing a mob together and chatting with people are 2 different things, too. That's not something you can do solo, although you can interact with others still.
You can't cooperate and work together with others to achieve a similar goal alone. I think this is part of the 'Multiplayer' in the 'MMO'.
EDIT: To the above post, just make grouping casual and your problems will be fixed. It doesn't seem to be the approach the devs are taking though, so what you say will most likely come true in the end.
the solo part is so untrue, when the game first came out (probably a few months after release) i decided to play this game, because i love FF so much. i chose red mage (soloed just fine), until i got a second job (warrior). so i then soloed my red mage/warrior to about level 37 before i lost interest in the game. now, the reason i didn't group wasn't because i didnt want to, it was because every time i got near other players it lagged so badly i couldnt move. my computer at the time wasnt very good, and couldnt really handle the game all that well, but solo i was fine with 20-30 fps. so, the unable to solo thing is unfounded, case in point.
I couldn't agree more about the time sinks/casual friendly. As with most of the FF games FFXI was really top notch/good quality, but the game was designed in the EQ-era where time sinks were just the way to keep gamers online/playing and MMO competition was sparse. I think it's really never recovered from that, though it's tried to compensate.
But that said, it still is a really good game; most games out there just can't compare. Also the community on my server was not too bad; just depends on who you meet along the way.
the solo part is so untrue, when the game first came out (probably a few months after release) i decided to play this game, because i love FF so much. i chose red mage (soloed just fine), until i got a second job (warrior). so i then soloed my red mage/warrior to about level 37 before i lost interest in the game. now, the reason i didn't group wasn't because i didnt want to, it was because every time i got near other players it lagged so badly i couldnt move. my computer at the time wasnt very good, and couldnt really handle the game all that well, but solo i was fine with 20-30 fps. so, the unable to solo thing is unfounded, case in point.
Ah, I expected this to come somewhere along the line.
Like I stated before, I admit that I do not have alot of direct experience playing FF XI, and although shadowing the whole experience and learning the mechanics of the game has allowed me to make valid statements, I do admit that I'm not exactly 100% knowledgable of the entire game.
But, I think we can all agree on this thought. FFXI was a mostly forced group game (not all builds could solo, you have to design a character that way). Also, although some classes could be soloed, a game can't really be considered solo friendly if only a few classes can actually solo successfully. And, if more solo aspects were brought in (i.e. you could solo the entire game as easily as group play it through, solo gets equal rewards as group play, etc.), they could very well wreck the group aspect of FFXIV (whatever it ends up being, considering the new ideas being implemented).
So, I will say this. Certain character builds could solo the game, but by "certain" I mean very few compared to the number of builds that couldn't. And, considering how group-oriented the game was, soloing probably wasn't as popular as group play in FF XI.
Now, don't expect this to be an attack on you jayheld90. I do admit that I am not quite as experienced as an average FF XI player, but we can all agree that in a mostly forced group-based game, soloing was not the popular option.
Killing a mob by yourself and interacting with people are two different things, why are you considering them to be one? When you get in a group are you conversing with people? 99% of groups made, not a word is spoken the entire time.
MMO means you are in a game world that other people are in.
I am on the internet now and I am posting this by myself on a 'community board' am I not? I am not being forced to talk to people if I want to do something on here even though this is a community.
I am on here by myself but I also like to be in places where others are.
Tushay, That is true and now Im a little more inlightened, thx
.good point
One of the BEST reasons if not the only reason for keeping a game GROUP oriented,is to lose the asshats in gaming.
If you are a total jerk,everyone will soon know you and you will not get groups and will be forced out of the game,and for most people they would say "good riddance" and have a happier community for it.If everything is solable/casual then you can be a total jerk,spam the chat with retarded spam and you won't care because you don't need anyones help in the game.
I see it actually everyday,players ask for help and some jerk butts in and says things like "only a loser needs help for that quest" or "I can solo it easily,what can't you solo it",basically all sorts of jerk off comments hit the chat.Now imagine that player cannot solo and needs help,lmao good luck on asking for help.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I agree
Word of mouth in a grouping game travels very well.
I cant count how many times I was making a pt in ffxi and I or someone else said "oh look "john doe" is LFg and someone in the PT butted in and told us that he was a complete asshat. Once they said that there was no way I invited them.
On the other token With FFXI's community and its job system it allowed for a person to make a name for themselves because they were not always leveling alts. You learn who the good players are. If you see them LFG you ask them first, because you know they are a good player.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
I also agree... forcing groups forces players to behave which is a good thing. Also since you can switch jobs with one character instead of making alts you gain REAL reputation and I just think that's very cool. Anyway I'm pretty much just repeating what the person above me or so had said.