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Scam?
javac
Member Posts: 1,175
a number of things about this game have me concerned.
1) the game doesn't have a wide variety of screenshots & gameplay videos that proves it even exists
2) beta reports are troubling: a largely empty game with tons of features missing & laggy combat
3) 6 months+ from release
4) developer running out of money
5) very high price charged upfront just to play an alpha
taken together, this kind of spells scam/deception to me...
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Its more of a beta now than an alpha... and as for payment, there are many who are excited about the game, and willing to invest. This is more of a player investment than anything.
Everyone knows what they are getting into upfront, and the hardcore followers can play the game, and those of us like myself who are a bit more skeptical can wait a bit and see.
No scam here that I can see they are pretty upfront about where things currently are.
if you would have bothered to read the official forums or any of the other posts on this matter, you would have seen the devs of this game told everyone specifically what to expect from buying in. do your homework.
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I think Donjuanamigo has it right.
First of all, most players are spoiled. there, I've said it. They have no idea what a beta is but they do have an idea of what a preview is when it is called a beta. a good many players expect a beta to be jump in, play and maybe report a but here and there.
Beta is beta. Not a preview.
As far as the pre orders, they were up front about that. Anyone preordering gets to play in the beta and this is what it entails.
seems pretty above board.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
in the history of gaming, no developer that i know of has charged so much for so little so far ahead of release. it would take much more than comforting words from the potential scammers to convince me to part with so much money so far in advance of release and with virtually no gameplay videos proving the game is worth a damn.
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
Yeah, seriously. That community is going to shit now. It used to be a pretty decent place to have discussions, but now it's quickly becoming a haven of imbeciles. There's still some good people there, but the good discussion is starting to change into little flame skirmishes. The sad part is there is virtually no moderation. I like free speech just as much as the next guy. but lacking a public release or previous games, Star Vault's online community is the sole representative of what they as a company stand for. Letting rampant asshattery fly is soiling the image, imo. If that's the type of crowd they're catering to, then it's no better than Forumfall, and not something I'm going to want to buy into. I'm seriously considering cancelling my pre-order.
"You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
Yeah, seriously. That community is going to shit now. It used to be a pretty decent place to have discussions, but now it's quickly becoming a haven of imbeciles. There's still some good people there, but the good discussion is starting to change into little flame skirmishes. The sad part is there is virtually no moderation. I like free speech just as much as the next guy. but lacking a public release or previous games, Star Vault's online community is the sole representative of what they as a company stand for.
i think it's partly due to people slowly coming to terms with the fact that MO beta has been pretty majorly disappointing and it'll be lucky to even make it to release let alone compete with Darkfall.
it is certain that if the developers are running out of money with at least half a year to go to release with the game being so unfinished *now*, that things are definitely not looking good.
Age of Mourning asked you to pay up front long in advance of release with little to no evidence of a game.
Two differences though-
Age of Mourning charged less up front and did this before the general mmo community had been repeatedly burned, making those who ponied up cash for A of M slightly less insane.(btw I'm one of the madmen who paid up front for MO)
There is more evidence of the existence of MO than there ever was of Age of Mourning, just check youtube.
edited for the grammars
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
Yeah, seriously. That community is going to shit now. It used to be a pretty decent place to have discussions, but now it's quickly becoming a haven of imbeciles. There's still some good people there, but the good discussion is starting to change into little flame skirmishes. The sad part is there is virtually no moderation. I like free speech just as much as the next guy. but lacking a public release or previous games, Star Vault's online community is the sole representative of what they as a company stand for.
i think it's partly due to people slowly coming to terms with the fact that MO beta has been pretty majorly disappointing and it'll be lucky to even make it to release let alone compete with Darkfall.
it is certain that if the developers are running out of money with at least half a year to go to release with the game being so unfinished *now*, that things are definitely not looking good.
No actually, I think it's all the ex-Darkfall players running to something better.
Oh, wait. You said Darkfall subs are rapidly increasing. I must be wrong.
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
Yeah, seriously. That community is going to shit now. It used to be a pretty decent place to have discussions, but now it's quickly becoming a haven of imbeciles. There's still some good people there, but the good discussion is starting to change into little flame skirmishes. The sad part is there is virtually no moderation. I like free speech just as much as the next guy. but lacking a public release or previous games, Star Vault's online community is the sole representative of what they as a company stand for.
i think it's partly due to people slowly coming to terms with the fact that MO beta has been pretty majorly disappointing and it'll be lucky to even make it to release let alone compete with Darkfall.
it is certain that if the developers are running out of money with at least half a year to go to release with the game being so unfinished *now*, that things are definitely not looking good.
I'm not worried about all that. The problem with beta testing is that most open betas are pure marketing gimmickery to increase hype. I've heard from people in the know that most of them are the final release candidate and are the same versions that appear for sale. Beta tests are rough around the edges, and the people who were expecting more out of what's going on now with MO have no idea what real beta testing is.
The condition of the game isn't a concern to me at this point. I just pre-ordered the download version, so if SV goes bust, I'm out a whopping $55. It's not like I'll have to sell the farm and move to the inner city or anything, but I will come out wiser. But, aside from all that, I really think it's a problem of low quality people getting into the forums and being allowed to post whatever they want that's bringing my hopes down.
"You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous
lol, I know you're worried about the success of DFO ................and I would be to in your shoes............ But come on man lol, don't rehash what was said about DFO and just replace DFO with MO. I mean the above is pretty much a carbon copy of posts you defended DFO against. You called bunk then, which means you are simply trolling now. It really shows how bad DFO must be doing for you of all people to resort to trolling the MO forums though.
I have been in the MO forums sincs april 2008 and this is certainly not the impression I have. They hid the high prices until the last minute and they absolutelly didn't warn costumers they wound't be needing 2.000 beta testers every two weeks. They just needed the money and used Beta as the bait to sell the copies. Now they don't know what to do with so many betasters, and most probably they knew this would happen but obviously didn't say it.
Wow - sounds just like your current favorite game, Darkfall, pre-launch.
~Ripper
First, you're a troll
Second, go back to Darkfall where you belong and get paid to "lie" about that game
Third, we are seeing an earlier beta phase than what Aventurine (darkfall) had
Forth, Can you post a link to where "reports" suggest laggy game play, empty world, etc...?
Fith, anyone who join beta will be able to test beta before game goes live. Those who pre-ordered were granted block access to certain beta phases.
Lastly, your never-ending-trolling isn't even witty or good, give it up.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Some pertinent comebacks:
1. You should improve your google and youtube skills, my little padawan.
2. That's why its a beta. Why introduce the whole world if you can test the game features in a confined space, with same results.
3. Yes, that's why its called Beta. Personaly, I'd rather wait 6 months and get to play a decent game than have the company release an umpolished and buggy parody of a game (not naming any, but I bet you are familiar with several such games released prematurey).
4. Yes, because they're not a big company. It's an office with 15 young dudes trying to bring their idea to life.
5. Not so much so. It's not higher than any other boxed mmo out there. Let me give you an example (in my currency). I sau WAR and AoC in local stores for about 200 RON. I have payed for a digital download of MO 50E which is roughly 200 RON (less actually). What MO gives you for that price is: the game, one month of free playtime and all future addons for free. Much like WAR/AoC. So you are NOT paying for the beta, you are paying for the game and one month subscription, when the game finally launches.
Better to be crazy, provided you know what sane is...
Most of these indy MMO's usually end up sucking balls so it wouldn't surprise me.
O_o o_O
So did the latest big names aswell so what's your point?
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
Scam consists of lying to your fanbase in order to up sales. Something that Aventurine did with launch, and then with transfers. Starvault has been pretty honest. They disclosed how unfinished this game was before selling it, and I wouldn't considered anything they have done thus far a scam. Quite the opposite really.
Aventurine treats their playerbase like complete and utter garbage. Starvault is the opposite. That is the difference between these two games right now, and that can make all the difference in the long run. In my mind no matter how good Darkfall gets I will never play again because the developers are a bunch of jackasses. On the other hand I would gladly give Starvault 50$ to help them out in realizing their dream and assist with testing and feedback.
6) And a helpful, friendly player community, just like DF.
I'm sure the game will work out much the same, nothing to worry about.
I actually lulled hard from this.
Wow - sounds just like your current favorite game, Darkfall, pre-launch.
~Ripper
You can't really compare them.
1) Darkfall had 12 gameplay videos and hundreds of screenshots before launch. Mortal has 1 official gameplay video, and a few beta videos showing a barren world.
2) Darkfall's beta reports were very positive overall. Mortals have been quite bad so far.
3) Darkfall's preorder was not 6 months before release.
4) Who knows if Aventurine were running out of money but we know for sure that StarVault have because they have admitted it.
5) Mortal was/is double what Darkfall cost.
Wow - sounds just like your current favorite game, Darkfall, pre-launch.
~Ripper
You can't really compare them.
1) Darkfall had 12 gameplay videos and hundreds of screenshots before launch. Mortal has 1 official gameplay video, and a few beta videos showing a barren world.
DFO had one official gameplay video. It has more now I believe.
2) Darkfall's beta reports were very positive overall. Mortals have been quite bad so far.
DFO had some major issues early on in there beta, I was in DFO beta and yeah things weren't great. Farther into beta most chilled because AV assured evryone these things would be taken care of and the only reason they were a problem now was due to it being beta. This however wasn't the case and many of those issues still exist today. Some of the more problematic ones being the server would crash any time there was anything remotely close to a large scale battle.
3) Darkfall's preorder was not 6 months before release.
This is true.
4) Who knows if Aventurine were running out of money but we know for sure that StarVault have because they have admitted it.
They were, sadly they couldn't admit it and instead tried to be underhanded and charge NA players twice and pretend everything is fine.
5) Mortal was/is double what Darkfall cost.
This is confusing, not sure what your trying to say. Production cost was/is more or box cost was/is more? If Production cost, yeah thats understandable and hopefuly the game is better for it. If Box cost, yeah it was because DFO didn't and doesn't have a box lol. The Digital Download isn't though and thats all DFO offered.
Scam=fraud in this case?
If you think it sounds fishy, don't buy it until after it releases. But calling it a scam sounds a little pessimistic yet.
As for the price, computer games have become more expensive the last year or so.
I will not pay a dime until the game is released myself, not because I think it is a scam, but because I need to know a lot more before I decide that it is worth my time or not. And I prefer to buy a game after the worst buggs are ironed out.
If you think it sounds fishy, don't buy it until after it releases. But calling it a scam sounds a little pessimistic yet.
As for the price, computer games have become more expensive the last year or so.
I will not pay a dime until the game is released myself, not because I think it is a scam, but because I need to know a lot more before I decide that it is worth my time or not. And I prefer to buy a game after the worst buggs are ironed out.
I'm in the same boat. I don't think MO is a scam but I am still waiting till the game releases before I buy or anything. Instead of hearing how things are planned to be, could be or intended to be, I would rather know how they are this time.
After the whole DFO scam (Changing there minds about 1 char per server, making it so NA players had to buy the game twice when they were told they would be able to have a char on each server originally) I plan on waiting lol.
If you think it sounds fishy, don't buy it until after it releases. But calling it a scam sounds a little pessimistic yet.
As for the price, computer games have become more expensive the last year or so.
I will not pay a dime until the game is released myself, not because I think it is a scam, but because I need to know a lot more before I decide that it is worth my time or not. And I prefer to buy a game after the worst buggs are ironed out.
I'm in the same boat. I don't think MO is a scam but I am still waiting till the game releases before I buy or anything. Instead of hearing how things are planned to be, could be or intended to be, I would rather know how they are this time.
After the whole DFO scam (Changing there minds about 1 char per server, making it so NA players had to buy the game twice when they were told they would be able to have a char on each server originally) I plan on waiting lol.
To ease your mind a little.
That is one of the major questions that was asked on MO boards (about the scam charge to transfer servers)
First off the MO devs laughed. Then stated you will NEVER have to buy a 2nd copy of the game, if they release a NA server you will be able to play on it with the copy of the game you already pre-ordered.
They did not say you will be able to transfer characters, but they did say you can go to any server with the same account, and you wouldnt be charged for it.
the digital download of MO is a tad cheaper than the digital download of DF. Not enough to matter, but it is cheaper. So when comparing price, thats the only fair price to compair. you cannot honestly compare a box sale to a DD sale.
as far as the statement that they have to many people in beta atm, that is true. Both Block A+B let in extra people so they are working with 1k extra testers. But instead of locking them out, they are letting them test as well.
Before purchasing the game you are told what to expect. That players are testing server stability in this early beta phase. To do that they have turned off alot of features so that any problem that happens in this early beta stage is only the servers fault, not something else. So of course leaked videos are going to show a lack of tons of parts of the game.
Combat is currently under NDA, we shoudlnt be talking about it, nor what we think of the videos that show any.
To sidestep that topic a tad, but in the same light of it. half the preorders were from the americas. The devs said if their was a strong showing of preorders from the americas that their was a good chance of having a NA server at launch. This will obviously increase ping for those players in the americas.
They have officially stated they are working on their hit prediction system and it is not perfect yet.
I was a fence sitter between darkfall and Mortal. I looked at what both games were claiming to offer, they seemed close enough to par to make it a very hard choice. So then i went diving into forums.
What i found was AV couldnt be trusted to keep their word. They would ninja edit posts instead of coming out and stating why things were not going to be how they said. They were underhanded in how they were dealing with their fanbase.
What I found with SV was rather candid posts from the devs, backed by people who knew more about the game (at that time) than i did. The devs posted the state of things on a semi regular basis, and i have not one account to report where they changed what they said after the fact. Instead if something didn't work they would try to get it right, and if they honestly couldnt change the outcome, they would post it.
I respect honesty, its the only thing that kept me from ordering darkfall, despite it sounding like a game i would really like to play. Honesty is what got me to preorder MO. The beta is what the devs are saying the beta is, so while frustrating at times. Anyone who does even the slightest amount of looking can see the massive improvements its been getting.
i will be much happier when they have the login server issue fixed. (you can read dev posts and twitters saying the login server is causing most the server crashes... which is publicly available not an NDA covered issue.) So that i can test on a more NA friendly timeframe.
all of that being said: javac, i realize you are sad to see DF get trolled so hard, but you lie worse than Lord Taco about the game. i like what i see in youtube about the game, i like most of what i read. (aoe magic being painfully overpowered is super lame but fixable. Bloodwalling being acceptable is pathetic.) I would defend your posts if what you said about it, matched to what we see in youtube, read on the forums, and get reports back from actual players.... but it doesnt, you post bs to try and re-hype the game for something it isnt. Which if your crap spewing ever gets anyone to sub to the game, they will expect more than DF can deliver, and quit.
your Op is a troll post, your games devs are a joke, your game of choice is okay, but thats it. Go back to DF boards, im sure their is something their for you to try and spin into a positive.