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  • nAAtimusnAAtimus Member Posts: 342
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    I applaud you for being able to shove your tongue so far up a virtual ass Aercus. Mature people don't make bones about how others express themselves. They understand that freedom of expression is a human right. A human right that is inalienable and not negotiable. It is not something that can be signed away by agreeing to any EULA.

     

    By voluntarily agreeing to any EULA, you sacrifice any rights that are expressed in that EULA as inappropriate.  It's called a contract.

    I'm not here to complete my forum PVP dailies.

  • UW1975UW1975 Member Posts: 183
    Originally posted by Orphes

    Originally posted by Aegrus


    Maybe it has become internet limbo but do some people actually know what a Nazi is?


     

    My favourite as of yet is when a history teacher, according to himself, choosed to use the word name nazis... I would not want to be a pupil to that teacher (to lay it out nice).

     

    Not to mention that his post is marred by misspellings and poorly-phrased sentences. If teachers are not able to express themselves in correct English, it is not surprising their pupils are showing up at the university with abysmal grammar and with little writing skill.

  • AercusAercus Member UncommonPosts: 775
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    I applaud you for being able to shove your tongue so far up a virtual ass Aercus. Mature people don't make bones about how others express themselves. They understand that freedom of expression is a human right. A human right that is inalienable and not negotiable. It is not something that can be signed away by agreeing to any EULA.

    Freedom of expression does not equate being able to say exactly what you want, when you want. The supreme defenders of the freedom of expression is the judicial system. Try yelling out profanity in a court room and see if there are consequences :)

    And yes, when you sign the EULA you are effectively signing over a number of rights to the company providing it. Don't like it? You are free to not accept :)

  • entropyjonesentropyjones Member Posts: 19

    A EULA is only agreed to after the game has been purchased. BTW. No eula has ever been tested in court. It's just words on paper and hardly binding. Especially since if it were meant to be binding you would have to agree to the EULA before ever turning over any cash.

    Also.. The supreme defender of my freedom of speech is my good right arm and the weapons I can use with it and damn the courts.

  • mrw0lfmrw0lf Member Posts: 2,269

    OMG how is this still going on? There is no EULA in existance that is going to enforce decent language. We have other means for that, we call it common courtesy. If you want to use foul language for the sake of it in 1 channel (swear your ass off in the other channels) then they have every right to mute you, only a fucking moron would think any different after being warned, jesus.

    I can't understand the argument either. On the one hand there's complaints about being warned about not using foul language in the help channel, on the other there's complaints about getting muted when you do? It's a bloody game, play it and stop careing about devs that are trying to be (pro)active in their community for a change. And if in the end you decide it all too much leave, how can it be 5 pages for that?

    -----
    “The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.”

  • AercusAercus Member UncommonPosts: 775
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    A EULA is only agreed to after the game has been purchased. BTW. No eula has ever been tested in court. It's just words on paper and hardly binding. Especially since if it were meant to be binding you would have to agree to the EULA before ever turning over any cash.
    Also.. The supreme defender of my freedom of speech is my good right arm and the weapons I can use with it and damn the courts.



     

    Bying the box and activating the game are two different transactions. It's like buying a car and then the gas. If you do not believe the EULA to be binding, you could always try it in a court. My suspicion is that they are quite good agreements, legally speaking, and people attempting a civil lawsuit due to their breach of the EULA would be shit out of luck.

    If that is your supreme defender of freedoms, and not society and its institutions, there are countries which may be excellent for you: Afghanistan, Somalia, Zimbabwe to name a few.. Their internet connections are usually not too good though, but a small price to be able to defend yourself with arms and limitless capitalism, right? :)

  • entropyjonesentropyjones Member Posts: 19

    Buying the game and activating are seperate? Lol.. Your out of your mind. Your suggesting that buying a game that I cannot activate is not fraud? Because that is exactly what it is. If I were to purchase a car and be told, "hey you can only drive this on wednesday btw," After I purchased it, I would be able to get my money back. In fact it is likely that the car vendor would end up in jail.

    Also do you really want to bring cars into this? Since when do people buy cars that don't work when they drive them off the lot and require constant maintenance and upgrades to actually work as advertised?

  • entropyjonesentropyjones Member Posts: 19
    Originally posted by mrw0lf


    OMG how is this still going on? There is no EULA in existance that is going to enforce decent language. We have other means for that, we call it common courtesy. If you want to use foul language for the sake of it in 1 channel (swear your ass off in the other channels) then they have every right to mute you, only a fucking moron would think any different after being warned, jesus.
    I can't understand the argument either. On the one hand there's complaints about being warned about not using foul language in the help channel, on the other there's complaints about getting muted when you do? It's a bloody game, play it and stop careing about devs that are trying to be (pro)active in their community for a change. And if in the end you decide it all too much leave, how can it be 5 pages for that?

     

    SOMEONE ELSE WHO DID NOT READ.

    See if you actually bothered to read the thread you would understand that I was not muted for language. I was muted for talking about an exploit. I was not describing how the exploit is done. I was talking about the general state of the game. I was always very careful not to use profanity in the help channel. In fact I mostly keep help toggled off.

    If you actually read this discussion you would not be so confused. Since you are not willing to read it I would suggest you butt the hell out of it.

  • AercusAercus Member UncommonPosts: 775
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    Buying the game and activating are seperate? Lol.. Your out of your mind. Your suggesting that buying a game that I cannot activate is not fraud? Because that is exactly what it is. If I were to purchase a car and be told, "hey you can only drive this on wednesday btw," After I purchased it, I would be able to get my money back. In fact it is likely that the car vendor would end up in jail.
    Also do you really want to bring cars into this? Since when do people buy cars that don't work when they drive them off the lot and require constant maintenance and upgrades to actually work as advertised?



     

    The car = the box

    The gas = activation/monthly sub

    My comparison, though weak in many aspects, still stands.

  • entropyjonesentropyjones Member Posts: 19
    Originally posted by Aercus

    Originally posted by entropyjones


    Buying the game and activating are seperate? Lol.. Your out of your mind. Your suggesting that buying a game that I cannot activate is not fraud? Because that is exactly what it is. If I were to purchase a car and be told, "hey you can only drive this on wednesday btw," After I purchased it, I would be able to get my money back. In fact it is likely that the car vendor would end up in jail.
    Also do you really want to bring cars into this? Since when do people buy cars that don't work when they drive them off the lot and require constant maintenance and upgrades to actually work as advertised?



     

    The car = the box

    The gas = activation/monthly sub

    My comparison, though weak in many aspects, still stands.

     

    Not for me. It stands in your mind alone.

  • AercusAercus Member UncommonPosts: 775
    Originally posted by entropyjones

    Originally posted by Aercus

    Originally posted by entropyjones


    Buying the game and activating are seperate? Lol.. Your out of your mind. Your suggesting that buying a game that I cannot activate is not fraud? Because that is exactly what it is. If I were to purchase a car and be told, "hey you can only drive this on wednesday btw," After I purchased it, I would be able to get my money back. In fact it is likely that the car vendor would end up in jail.
    Also do you really want to bring cars into this? Since when do people buy cars that don't work when they drive them off the lot and require constant maintenance and upgrades to actually work as advertised?



     

    The car = the box

    The gas = activation/monthly sub

    My comparison, though weak in many aspects, still stands.

     

    Not for me. It stands in your mind alone.



     

    It might be, but it might also be that you are impervious to rational arguments. However, that would be an assumption on my part :)

  • mrw0lfmrw0lf Member Posts: 2,269
    Originally posted by entropyjones

    Originally posted by mrw0lf


    OMG how is this still going on? There is no EULA in existance that is going to enforce decent language. We have other means for that, we call it common courtesy. If you want to use foul language for the sake of it in 1 channel (swear your ass off in the other channels) then they have every right to mute you, only a fucking moron would think any different after being warned, jesus.
    I can't understand the argument either. On the one hand there's complaints about being warned about not using foul language in the help channel, on the other there's complaints about getting muted when you do? It's a bloody game, play it and stop careing about devs that are trying to be (pro)active in their community for a change. And if in the end you decide it all too much leave, how can it be 5 pages for that?

     

    SOMEONE ELSE WHO DID NOT READ.

    See if you actually bothered to read the thread you would understand that I was not muted for language. I was muted for talking about an exploit. I was not describing how the exploit is done. I was talking about the general state of the game. I was always very careful not to use profanity in the help channel. In fact I mostly keep help toggled off.

    If you actually read this discussion you would not be so confused. Since you are not willing to read it I would suggest you butt the hell out of it.



     

    I did read the thread, unfortunately. You seem to have a problem understanding why they would mute you for slagging off their game, while in their game or on their forums. I tried to move away from that as I was finding it difficult to work out how anyone who could't work this out managed to get through everyday life, how does their brain remind them to breath in and out all the time?

    -----
    “The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.”

  • entropyjonesentropyjones Member Posts: 19

    It is not their game and their world etc. I am paying them for the use of it. No agreement that I sign with Icarus, or anybody else trumps my basic human rights or my constitutional rights. Not ever.

    I could have let some basic shit slide but the GM's went to far when they started targetting my clannies for harassment.

    Anyway I'm done trying to talk with you fanboys. I did what I came here to do. There's other places to go and drop the news about what a piece of shit fallen earth is and what assholes it's gm's are.

    Thing is. Had I been allowed to express myself where and when I chose I would have no need of this quest now to spread the word around the internet in general.

  • AercusAercus Member UncommonPosts: 775
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    It is not their game and their world etc. I am paying them for the use of it. No agreement that I sign with Icarus, or anybody else trumps my basic human rights or my constitutional rights. Not ever.
    I could have let some basic shit slide but the GM's went to far when they started targetting my clannies for harassment.
    Anyway I'm done trying to talk with you fanboys. I did what I came here to do. There's other places to go and drop the news about what a piece of shit fallen earth is and what assholes it's gm's are.
    Thing is. Had I been allowed to express myself where and when I chose I would have no need of this quest now to spread the word around the internet in general.



     

    Hmm.. I cannot find anything rearding the right to play MMORPG's in here or here .. Guess we have different versions :)

    To be perfectly honest, I have a feeling the majority of the community won't be sad to see you go.. Have a good one!

  • DonnieBrascoDonnieBrasco Member Posts: 1,757
    Originally posted by entropyjones


    It is not their game and their world etc.LOL this is SO stupid I ....can't....resist... to reply.... :) 


    YES, it is their world. They made it. They own it. Theirs. End of discussion
    I am paying them for the use of it. Yes. You are paying to have access to use it. Still, you don't own it, and don't make rules. Simple as that.
    No agreement that I sign with Icarus, or anybody else trumps my basic human rights or my constitutional rights. Not ever. They did not.
    I could have let some basic shit slide but the GM's went to far when they started targetting my clannies for harassment.
    Anyway I'm done trying to talk with you fanboys. Troll rule #8: if you use the f-term, you lost the argument :) I did what I came here to do. I'm sure you'll have a few more accounts here with the same agenda :) There's other places to go and drop the news about what a piece of shit fallen earth is and what assholes it's gm's are. OR, you can get a life, and enjoy positive things around you. Whatever floats your boat...
    Thing is. Had I been allowed to express myself where and when I chose I would have no need of this quest now to spread the word around the internet in general. You mentioned that the game disappointed you at every level (your own words. Was THAT a lie, or is this one?

    See you with your new reg :)

    DB

     

    Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.

  • jimmyman99jimmyman99 Member UncommonPosts: 3,221
    Originally posted by Ziljianx


    Recently I asked for help on thier help channel in game that is  and was given a poor answer a cope out really to a in game bug issue one of many.
     
    Anyway I was promptly put on mute by a Gm I then progressed to the forums to ask for help as to why I was put on mute how long for and questions about the in game bug. I was then given a 7 day ban by a forum mod with no response to why.
     
     I then loged back into the game to find out  my mute time was over a few players where discussing the bug I had asked about in the beginning of this epic saga ;) anyway I replied to them and then found myself muted yet again with no reply or response from the Game Manager as to why I was muted.
     
    Next thing I know Ive been booted out of the game and had to relog to get back in still muted mind you.
     
    This is pretty much they way they are treating ppl in this game atm a real Nazi type method to they way they treat you.
    Be warned this game is months away from being playable it has some serious bug - memory leak problems that need to be addressed saying that its still a great game with masses of potential and will be a ripper once the bug issues are dealt with.
     

    Asking or implying for sexual favors from a GM is against EULA and is punishable by mute, kick and in extreme cases a facepalm.

    I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
    image
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
    imageimage

  • jimmyman99jimmyman99 Member UncommonPosts: 3,221
    Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Originally posted by DonnieBrasco





     

    I really don't like it either when people use the term fascist or nazi, because clearly they do not exactly know what they mean. I do know they are horrible terms and should never even be mentioned.. so there's agreement on this.

    However, I can't ignore the fact that your post here is just a chain of assumptions. Why do you think the OP called anyone a nazi in his/her face? I think that's unrealistic.

    DB

     

    A valid question.  We can't even know if the event happened, let alone how it went down.  All we can really do is make assumptions based on motive and behavior patterns.

    I guess the reason would be that, in a niche game like FE, you want all the subs you can get.  Thus, you're not going to mute and kick somebody because they're calmly and rationally pointing out an issue with the game.

    Seeing as how the nazi card was played in their very first post on this forum, I don't see it as too far a leap.

    There is, of course, the possibility that they are speaking the truth and that they happened to get a high blood pressure, chain smoking GM whose mother in law just moved in.  But what little evidence we have supports the contrary.



     

    Don't get me wrong, I don't believe the OP was mishandled - that would contradict my experience with FE and its GM's :)

    I also tend to agree that this was just a new post from someone who had already complained about the exact same thing, but it turned out she wasn't right at all, and then she /ragequit the forum (as well, just like the game before. Twice.) :)

    I just don't think she (he?) actually did use the term "nazi"... in a game... against the GM... I mean, people are stupid, but there's gotta be a limit to even that :D

    DB

     

    Do not underestimate the stupidity of an average human being.

    I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
    image
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
    imageimage

  • AspiAspi Member Posts: 1
    Originally posted by Ziljianx


    Recently I asked for help on thier help channel in game that is  and was given a poor answer a cope out really to a in game bug issue one of many.
     
    Anyway I was promptly put on mute by a Gm I then progressed to the forums to ask for help as to why I was put on mute how long for and questions about the in game bug. I was then given a 7 day ban by a forum mod with no response to why.
     
     I then loged back into the game to find out  my mute time was over a few players where discussing the bug I had asked about in the beginning of this epic saga ;) anyway I replied to them and then found myself muted yet again with no reply or response from the Game Manager as to why I was muted.
     
    Next thing I know Ive been booted out of the game and had to relog to get back in still muted mind you.
     
    This is pretty much they way they are treating ppl in this game atm a real Nazi type method to they way they treat you.
    Be warned this game is months away from being playable it has some serious bug - memory leak problems that need to be addressed saying that its still a great game with masses of potential and will be a ripper once the bug issues are dealt with.
     



     

    You must have said something stupid in the help channel.  I've only ever gotten quick and courteous responses from GM's.  Once my character was stuck.  I put a request in help channel.  Within 20 seconds a GM sent me a PM, and within 2 minutes, I was unstuck.

    Another time, some idiot parked their horse on a quest-giving NPC (on purpose mind you), and had been there for about 20 minutes. No one could click on the NPC.  I put a request in Help Chat, and within 1 minute, the mounted horse had been moved out of the way.

    If you come in threatening and being a jerk, they will /mute you.  But, if you ask like a real person and be respectfull, courteous, and polite, even if you are just pretending to be ignorant...But, cut the crap...  They will help you quickly and courteously.

    I had to create an account here just to respond to this bad review of the GM assistance in Fallen Earth.  It is not a proper representation of the quality Customer Service that they employ.

    Now, they won't help you with things they can't help you with, and usually will tell you to report it as a bug or direct you to some other means of acquiring assistance.  If you continue to bug them about it, they may /mute you.  If you cuss, a violation of TOS on Fallen Earth, you will be /muted or banned for repeat problems.

    So I am guessing you were an asshat when you had this problem, and that is why you were muted and banned.  It will happen in any online game, not just Fallen Earth, if you act in such a pathetic manner.

  • jimmyman99jimmyman99 Member UncommonPosts: 3,221
    Originally posted by twhint


    The thing about Nazis is that they killed the Jews. Perhaps if they killed Ukranians, Native Americans,  Africans, or Bosnians they might not be so reviled.
    If you miss the references to any of those, then check out Josef Stalin, United States history in the 1800's, Darfur/Rwanda, or the Serbian campaign in 92-95.
    Simple history. The nazis were hardly the first to practice genocide on a large scale and they certainly haven't been the last, and yet they are the most reviled and widely known. I suppose it just depends on what one has to offer the people who write the history books.
     
    As far as the OP, there's two sides to every story and his side is heavily biased and doesn't make much sense.

     

    They didn't kill "just" the Jews. They killed Gypsies, homosexuals, people with mental illnesses - basically, anyone outside arian race was considered a sub-race. They killed Soviet people (Russians, Ukrainians, Belorussians, etc etc) because they did not believe they were of equal status They considered Ukrainians to be their "slaves" so they packed them up and drove in train echelons into Germany to work in plants, fields, etc.

    You are right about one thing, Joseph Stalin did a lot worse things then the nazis. It is estimated that anywhere between 3 to 60 million people died during Stalin's rule. Its hard to have a solid figure because, unlike Hitler, Stalin never lost the war, so his crimes were never made public. Well, at least not all of them. Only now historians are trying to piece together all the little information that they can find from the soviet archives. If anyone is interested in learning more, they can click on my sig - the artificial famine in 1932-33 that killed millions.

    I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
    image
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
    imageimage

  • chryseschryses Member UncommonPosts: 1,453

    I find this hard to believe as I have played the game everyday and seen the GM's put up with a lot of crap and even seen players talk about the issues in game openly and even other MMO's.  The GM's tend to say once in a while to get back to HELP channel but I have not seen them once ban anyone or even threaten to.  So either you are trolling big time or you are giving a seriously one sided view of the situation. 

  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel Member LegendaryPosts: 12,195
    Originally posted by chryses


    I find this hard to believe as I have played the game everyday and seen the GM's put up with a lot of crap and even seen players talk about the issues in game openly and even other MMO's.  The GM's tend to say once in a while to get back to HELP channel but I have not seen them once ban anyone or even threaten to.  So either you are trolling big time or you are giving a seriously one sided view of the situation. 

     

    I've seen threats many times about muting players that just don't get it when a GM tells them certain conversations are over.  Usually these conversations are based around non help related items.  I've even seen them mute the chat numerous times when players begin overly cussing or arguing with the GMs.

     

    I've only once seen a GM come into region chat to stop a fight where two players were calling eachother names and disrupting region and noone could get them to stop, so the GM stepped in and threatened to mute the chat and referred the offenders to the EULA.  

     

    I've never seen GMs get angry over questions being asked, only nonsense arguments, and I'm on quite a bit (even if I'm not playing I'm usually on AFK).  I've even PM'd the GMs if I didn't understand something or if I had a question about the game... most games never even give you that option to get help directly from a GM without putting in reports.  Responses are instant and they are always nice and helpful.  



  • ThrawlThrawl Member Posts: 271

     I've seen the GM's tolerate quite a bit and simply shrug it off with a smile. The only time I've seen people in the help channel go nuts was yesterday when some fool sent a message out for a web site to purchase chips. He didn't have a chance to send the message twice, it's not tolerated in this game. I hear all the horror stories about the gold spammers in Aion and it makes me relieved that I didn't bother with that game. In the last week of playing FE I've only seen one.

    Our spirit was here long before you

    Long before us

    And long will it be after your pride brings you to your end

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