Originally posted by Yamota A good indication of that is Eve wich has a peak concurrent players of around 25.000 (which suggests the max concurrent is atleast 30.000) and it has 300.000 subscribers.
Actually EVE has a weekly peak concurrency of 45.000 with a record concurrency of 53,850.
This article is riddled with bad grammar and typos. I know you are the editor, and it can be difficult to edit your own work. And I also realize most gamers just mash their hands down on the keyboard and hope something approximating a sentence comes out, but it is your job to write something that doesn't require the reader to descramble the meaning of a sentence. I don't want to be unnecessarily negative, so, I will also add that it was an other wise enjoyable article.
You can all bash the fact that Darkfall is on this list, but just think of all the controversy that it has created.
Hell, I've never seen such rampant, vile trolls or hardcore fanboys created because of any game ever. Just look at all of the threads even on this website talking about, "How the heck is Darkfall #1 in unique hit when AION JUST RELEASED?" and things like that, MONTHS after its release.
Go back to the vaporware era where there was the crowd that screamed, "MWAHAHA DARK AND LIGHT", "Vaporwarzzzzzz!" , "Tasos is a liar", etc. etc. and then the fanboys that yelled back, "NO! IT'S COMING OUT!", "Tasos is GOD!", etc.
Point is, this game generated so much internet drama and controversy that it certainly deserves a spot on this list. Go even further and talk about the mechanics of the game and its attempt to bring back the sandbox fantasy genre and it gains more support.
I find it interesting that neither of the Lineage, or Lineage 2 was not on here. I don't believe that WoW every had an entire tv station deticated to the game (Lineage 1). I also believe Lineage 1 is still one of the most long running, profitable games out there. With the advent of Lineage 2, it drove NcSoft into the forfront of MMOs.
No, if Star Wars is remembered because of it's epic failure, I think one of the oldest and largest money makers in history should be on here too...
Fruity Oaty Bars! Make a man out of a mouse! Fruity Oaty Bars! Make you bust out of your blouse! Eat them all the time! Let them blow your mind... ohh! Fruity Oaty Bars!
I already commented on how I felt AC should be on that list (good to see there were more who agreed) but overall a historic list of MMOs should, in essence, be boring. This is because there are standard choices that should be on every list.
UO - Caused the genre to explode, has lasted over a decade
EQ - Made the class system main stream, has lasted over a decade
AC- 3D with a seamless main world, level +skill tree combination, monthly updates and a changing world, has lasted over a decade
WoW - most successful ever
DAoC - Realm vs Realm
SWG - Used a mainstream IP and turned it into an online world, showed the world what NOT to do once a game is launched
That right there is 6 standards for historic lists, so when doing a top ten list there isn't much room for surprise. Except of course when you don't use them and then all the posts are of confusion.
Planetside should have been on the list. It was the first FPS MMO cross and a great game in its own right. Far deserving of praise for the top 10 list.
Darkfall is the first mmorpg that caters to both RPG AND FPS gameplayers, atm it is more FPS, but in future development the RPG crowd will be getting love, not to mention the small team they used to make it, and one of the biggest worlds, no instances, huge battles, with boats/sieges.
Darkfall will always be the #1 fpser mmorpg pvp game.
No one can top darkfall because most companies are afraid the carebears will crucify them for it. That is why
Darkfall is the first mmorpg that caters to both RPG AND FPS gameplayers, atm it is more FPS, but in future development the RPG crowd will be getting love, not to mention the small team they used to make it, and one of the biggest worlds, no instances, huge battles, with boats/sieges. Darkfall will always be the #1 fpser mmorpg pvp game. No one can top darkfall because most companies are afraid the carebears will crucify them for it. That is why
Wrong on just about all accounts.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
Well adding my two cents lol that list is so wrong most of those games not even put a dent in mmo history..
in no particular order...
Old games
DAOC (never played but heard of it)
UO (too much money back then lol)
EQ (had to settle for it)
Ragnarok
New Modern
VG (innovation seamless world)
SWG
PlanetSide
Tabula Raza
AION
GW
Most of this games brought something new and innovative to game play and change the style of play.. WoW did not bring any of this changes to the game mechanics of old.. WoW just made easier for causal and seasonal players be able to catch up where they left off without loss of the time they were out of the game overrall.. As WoW counterpart games like UO/EQ were not as forgiven for the people that left the game and came back.
WoW can be taken as a financial gain for Blizzard but I dont think it has the same effect as Diablo and Starcraft as games that really brought change to the game world. WoW's 2d characters in a3d/2d cant compare to EQ complete 3d world or the new AION.
The game listed here from the OP most of then dont even come close to putting a dent in MMO or Game World history..
Darkfall is the first mmorpg that caters to both RPG AND FPS gameplayers, atm it is more FPS, but in future development the RPG crowd will be getting love, not to mention the small team they used to make it, and one of the biggest worlds, no instances, huge battles, with boats/sieges. Darkfall will always be the #1 fpser mmorpg pvp game. No one can top darkfall because most companies are afraid the carebears will crucify them for it. That is why
Wrong on just about all accounts.
I love how u mention I am wrong yet give no examples or reasons why, its like when you bash darkfall on the darkfall forums and yet you have not played the game.
We can start with Darkfall is not the first at anything, and work on from there.
But I don't really care.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
First off leaving off the original Asherson's call and Dark Age of Camelot shows your complete lack of knowledge of the genre. Both of those games established significant innovations that have been used widely through the industry.
Putting Darkfall and Sims on the list is just silly, they neither added anything new or had any significant effect on the genre. About the only thing Darkfall has been able to do is collect the worst collection of misfits to ever plague a MMO, they introduced nothing innovative at all with that game except the laughing stock that is Tasos.
I strongly disagree with WoW being on the first place. It is neither innovative, or first with anything, just well-made. The success of the game was based on the money invested in it which resulted in good quality and service, and also that it was release at right time, when EQ and Asherons call started to get old. Only thing it gave to the MMO industry is that it proven that casuals = money.
I also wonder, how come that Asherons call is not even on the list, which gave base to many nowday's mmos? One who wrote up this summary and specially order should be ashamed.
I'm disappointed that Dark Age of Camelot didn't make it as it changed the way MMO's do PvP, and in fact to this day, no other MMO has equaled it, not even it's big brother Warhammer.
I can see why AC is not on the list. Its story driven regular update model never really took off in other games. The skill based characters were being replaced by the holy trinity (tank,dps,heals). Every game has its new toys that would make it unique but I think AC's impact on the genre was minimal.
DAOC did the same. The RVR format has its following but has not proven to be overwhelming (dollars wise, vocally thet are huge). A decent game with moderate success that has not really changed the genre other than proving that PVP only has a moderate following when compared to casual PVE.
FFXI is a surprise. They did combine different platforms. This was new but since it hasn't caught on has it really changed the genre? If we see more success form multiplatform MMO's then maybe FFXI will earn its spot.
SIMS Online. Sigh, I guess you could argue that a bad idea with a good IP impacted investors decisions. You might just argue that EA can't make an MMO regardless of how good the IP is. Without being in the industry to know what MMO's were cancelled as a result of this failure its hard to agree with the writer. If you want to talk big failures I am sure there are others you could put in there (Shadowbane, AC2, etc)
WOW though does deserve top spot. Bringing MMOs to the forefront of gaming revenues and worldwide recognition. Investors, developers, and players can't discuss MMO's without some mention of WOW. Thats is what impact is all about.
Coming from someone who has never played darkfall and is a known troll of it, your words lack knowledge on the subject.
Aren't you the same guy who called planetside a mmorpg lol.
You are responding as if i am in dispute of it being on this list. I am not. I just dispute any of the uniqueness you imply in your post.
I leave the weight of my words on the reader to decide. Most of your posting is crazy and nonsensical. Known troll is funny. I suppose I am a troll, compared to your sensationalism and exaggeration.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
The wailing and whining of those who felt their games didn't get proper recognition is hilarious. Sorry, guys, but they're just other games. They did well for a time, they might have tossed out a few new concepts, but they ran their course and they're bascially done.
Some of the games on Jon's list (Sims Online and Toontown, for example) are there because they were much anticipated, based on ideas that were established in non MMOs, and they failed to take off as MMOs.
If WoW had flopped, it would STILL be on the list, becasue it was an established gaming franchise outside of MMOs that had a solid fanbase (like the Sims, like the entire Toontown concept) that could not recapture the magic of the original franchise. Reality is it took the IP to new heights, and really aside from the IP itself. The IP was a springboard to bigger and better things, really. It massively expanded the market for MMOs.
Darkfall is there because it was dismissed as vaporware for years...always not quite ready to launch. Then it actually did!
EVE is there because it's the little franchise that could...something that started out small and is still relatively small yet prospers and thrives, despite being overshadowed by the raw numbers of other games, and it's a sandbox...the supposedly impossible to market subgenre of MMOs.
The impact of these games isn't just within the genre...it's outside of them, too. That's what makes them noteworthy in this context.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Cant see how DAOC was not on the list. WOW is 1/2 Eq and 1/2 DAOC , they brought us factions and battlegrounds etc. Good List but DAOC should have at least gotten a quip.
well actually EQ had factions before DAOC. Do recall that Sk, necros, DE and latter iskar were killed on site by the oppossing faction guards as were the "good" guys by theirs and that was on the blue servers. When FV server came out you could not talk to a player of a different race even if there were "on your side" sort to speak unless you took the time to learn their races lanquage. Then you had the Zek servers which had sides based on race, or religon on two of them.
I agree to a point but EQ was nothing like DAOC in that respect. For example if I was playing a Troll in DAOC there was no possible way I could play along side my friend who chose to play an Elf. In EQ I had many friends who played Evil races and it never kept us apart, we could play together as much as we wanted. DAOC you could not do this and the only time you even saw another faction you were to engage them and their name wouldnt even show up, just a title in large red numbers.
I do agree that EQ attempted to copy this later on with the Sullen Zek server which was team based but you were still not sperated like in DAOC which made Community and teamwork very important.
Cant see how DAOC was not on the list. WOW is 1/2 Eq and 1/2 DAOC , they brought us factions and battlegrounds etc. Good List but DAOC should have at least gotten a quip.
well actually EQ had factions before DAOC. Do recall that Sk, necros, DE and latter iskar were killed on site by the oppossing faction guards as were the "good" guys by theirs and that was on the blue servers. When FV server came out you could not talk to a player of a different race even if there were "on your side" sort to speak unless you took the time to learn their races lanquage. Then you had the Zek servers which had sides based on race, or religon on two of them.
I agree to a point but EQ was nothing like DAOC in that respect. For example if I was playing a Troll in DAOC there was no possible way I could play along side my friend who chose to play an Elf. In EQ I had many friends who played Evil races and it never kept us apart, we could play together as much as we wanted. DAOC you could not do this and the only time you even saw another faction you were to engage them and their name wouldnt even show up, just a title in large red numbers.
I do agree that EQ attempted to copy this later on with the Sullen Zek server which was team based but you were still not sperated like in DAOC which made Community and teamwork very important.
lol well my poor little ranger who had arrows in her back from those nasty newts and evils might disagree about being seperated requiring more teamwork. However, I do see your point.
Magic is impressive, but now Minsc leads! Swords for everyone!
I just question if it is too early to call DDO:EU a success...so far it has not stayed up [in f2p form] as long as Auto Assault, much less AC2. If it is still going strong in a year or two, then it will have earned the title "success".
Comments
http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility
"Memories are meant to fade. They're designed that way for a reason."
Nice list but Lineage 2 and DAoC should be there.
I hate L2, but no other game produced as much impact in Asia and army of clones as Lineage
Mr. Wood,
This article is riddled with bad grammar and typos. I know you are the editor, and it can be difficult to edit your own work. And I also realize most gamers just mash their hands down on the keyboard and hope something approximating a sentence comes out, but it is your job to write something that doesn't require the reader to descramble the meaning of a sentence. I don't want to be unnecessarily negative, so, I will also add that it was an other wise enjoyable article.
I don't even believe in Jeebus.
You can all bash the fact that Darkfall is on this list, but just think of all the controversy that it has created.
Hell, I've never seen such rampant, vile trolls or hardcore fanboys created because of any game ever. Just look at all of the threads even on this website talking about, "How the heck is Darkfall #1 in unique hit when AION JUST RELEASED?" and things like that, MONTHS after its release.
Go back to the vaporware era where there was the crowd that screamed, "MWAHAHA DARK AND LIGHT", "Vaporwarzzzzzz!" , "Tasos is a liar", etc. etc. and then the fanboys that yelled back, "NO! IT'S COMING OUT!", "Tasos is GOD!", etc.
Point is, this game generated so much internet drama and controversy that it certainly deserves a spot on this list. Go even further and talk about the mechanics of the game and its attempt to bring back the sandbox fantasy genre and it gains more support.
I find it interesting that neither of the Lineage, or Lineage 2 was not on here. I don't believe that WoW every had an entire tv station deticated to the game (Lineage 1). I also believe Lineage 1 is still one of the most long running, profitable games out there. With the advent of Lineage 2, it drove NcSoft into the forfront of MMOs.
No, if Star Wars is remembered because of it's epic failure, I think one of the oldest and largest money makers in history should be on here too...
Fruity Oaty Bars!
Make a man out of a mouse!
Fruity Oaty Bars!
Make you bust out of your blouse!
Eat them all the time!
Let them blow your mind... ohh!
Fruity Oaty Bars!
Darkfall is garbage. That's why all the garbage no talent pvpers play it.
I already commented on how I felt AC should be on that list (good to see there were more who agreed) but overall a historic list of MMOs should, in essence, be boring. This is because there are standard choices that should be on every list.
UO - Caused the genre to explode, has lasted over a decade
EQ - Made the class system main stream, has lasted over a decade
AC- 3D with a seamless main world, level +skill tree combination, monthly updates and a changing world, has lasted over a decade
WoW - most successful ever
DAoC - Realm vs Realm
SWG - Used a mainstream IP and turned it into an online world, showed the world what NOT to do once a game is launched
That right there is 6 standards for historic lists, so when doing a top ten list there isn't much room for surprise. Except of course when you don't use them and then all the posts are of confusion.
Planetside should have been on the list. It was the first FPS MMO cross and a great game in its own right. Far deserving of praise for the top 10 list.
Darkfall is the first mmorpg that caters to both RPG AND FPS gameplayers, atm it is more FPS, but in future development the RPG crowd will be getting love, not to mention the small team they used to make it, and one of the biggest worlds, no instances, huge battles, with boats/sieges.
Darkfall will always be the #1 fpser mmorpg pvp game.
No one can top darkfall because most companies are afraid the carebears will crucify them for it. That is why
Wrong on just about all accounts.
----------
"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
Well adding my two cents lol that list is so wrong most of those games not even put a dent in mmo history..
in no particular order...
Old games
DAOC (never played but heard of it)
UO (too much money back then lol)
EQ (had to settle for it)
Ragnarok
New Modern
VG (innovation seamless world)
SWG
PlanetSide
Tabula Raza
AION
GW
Most of this games brought something new and innovative to game play and change the style of play.. WoW did not bring any of this changes to the game mechanics of old.. WoW just made easier for causal and seasonal players be able to catch up where they left off without loss of the time they were out of the game overrall.. As WoW counterpart games like UO/EQ were not as forgiven for the people that left the game and came back.
WoW can be taken as a financial gain for Blizzard but I dont think it has the same effect as Diablo and Starcraft as games that really brought change to the game world. WoW's 2d characters in a3d/2d cant compare to EQ complete 3d world or the new AION.
The game listed here from the OP most of then dont even come close to putting a dent in MMO or Game World history..
Wrong on just about all accounts.
I love how u mention I am wrong yet give no examples or reasons why, its like when you bash darkfall on the darkfall forums and yet you have not played the game.
[ Mod Edit ]
We can start with Darkfall is not the first at anything, and work on from there.
But I don't really care.
----------
"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
Coming from someone who has never played darkfall and is a known troll of it, your words lack knowledge on the subject.
Aren't you the same guy who called planetside a mmorpg lol.
What? No Asheron's Call?
First off leaving off the original Asherson's call and Dark Age of Camelot shows your complete lack of knowledge of the genre. Both of those games established significant innovations that have been used widely through the industry.
Putting Darkfall and Sims on the list is just silly, they neither added anything new or had any significant effect on the genre. About the only thing Darkfall has been able to do is collect the worst collection of misfits to ever plague a MMO, they introduced nothing innovative at all with that game except the laughing stock that is Tasos.
I strongly disagree with WoW being on the first place. It is neither innovative, or first with anything, just well-made. The success of the game was based on the money invested in it which resulted in good quality and service, and also that it was release at right time, when EQ and Asherons call started to get old. Only thing it gave to the MMO industry is that it proven that casuals = money.
I also wonder, how come that Asherons call is not even on the list, which gave base to many nowday's mmos? One who wrote up this summary and specially order should be ashamed.
I'm disappointed that Dark Age of Camelot didn't make it as it changed the way MMO's do PvP, and in fact to this day, no other MMO has equaled it, not even it's big brother Warhammer.
I can see why AC is not on the list. Its story driven regular update model never really took off in other games. The skill based characters were being replaced by the holy trinity (tank,dps,heals). Every game has its new toys that would make it unique but I think AC's impact on the genre was minimal.
DAOC did the same. The RVR format has its following but has not proven to be overwhelming (dollars wise, vocally thet are huge). A decent game with moderate success that has not really changed the genre other than proving that PVP only has a moderate following when compared to casual PVE.
FFXI is a surprise. They did combine different platforms. This was new but since it hasn't caught on has it really changed the genre? If we see more success form multiplatform MMO's then maybe FFXI will earn its spot.
SIMS Online. Sigh, I guess you could argue that a bad idea with a good IP impacted investors decisions. You might just argue that EA can't make an MMO regardless of how good the IP is. Without being in the industry to know what MMO's were cancelled as a result of this failure its hard to agree with the writer. If you want to talk big failures I am sure there are others you could put in there (Shadowbane, AC2, etc)
WOW though does deserve top spot. Bringing MMOs to the forefront of gaming revenues and worldwide recognition. Investors, developers, and players can't discuss MMO's without some mention of WOW. Thats is what impact is all about.
I liked the article it provokes a lot of thought
You are responding as if i am in dispute of it being on this list. I am not. I just dispute any of the uniqueness you imply in your post.
I leave the weight of my words on the reader to decide. Most of your posting is crazy and nonsensical. Known troll is funny. I suppose I am a troll, compared to your sensationalism and exaggeration.
----------
"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
The wailing and whining of those who felt their games didn't get proper recognition is hilarious. Sorry, guys, but they're just other games. They did well for a time, they might have tossed out a few new concepts, but they ran their course and they're bascially done.
Some of the games on Jon's list (Sims Online and Toontown, for example) are there because they were much anticipated, based on ideas that were established in non MMOs, and they failed to take off as MMOs.
If WoW had flopped, it would STILL be on the list, becasue it was an established gaming franchise outside of MMOs that had a solid fanbase (like the Sims, like the entire Toontown concept) that could not recapture the magic of the original franchise. Reality is it took the IP to new heights, and really aside from the IP itself. The IP was a springboard to bigger and better things, really. It massively expanded the market for MMOs.
Darkfall is there because it was dismissed as vaporware for years...always not quite ready to launch. Then it actually did!
EVE is there because it's the little franchise that could...something that started out small and is still relatively small yet prospers and thrives, despite being overshadowed by the raw numbers of other games, and it's a sandbox...the supposedly impossible to market subgenre of MMOs.
The impact of these games isn't just within the genre...it's outside of them, too. That's what makes them noteworthy in this context.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
well actually EQ had factions before DAOC. Do recall that Sk, necros, DE and latter iskar were killed on site by the oppossing faction guards as were the "good" guys by theirs and that was on the blue servers. When FV server came out you could not talk to a player of a different race even if there were "on your side" sort to speak unless you took the time to learn their races lanquage. Then you had the Zek servers which had sides based on race, or religon on two of them.
I agree to a point but EQ was nothing like DAOC in that respect. For example if I was playing a Troll in DAOC there was no possible way I could play along side my friend who chose to play an Elf. In EQ I had many friends who played Evil races and it never kept us apart, we could play together as much as we wanted. DAOC you could not do this and the only time you even saw another faction you were to engage them and their name wouldnt even show up, just a title in large red numbers.
I do agree that EQ attempted to copy this later on with the Sullen Zek server which was team based but you were still not sperated like in DAOC which made Community and teamwork very important.
well actually EQ had factions before DAOC. Do recall that Sk, necros, DE and latter iskar were killed on site by the oppossing faction guards as were the "good" guys by theirs and that was on the blue servers. When FV server came out you could not talk to a player of a different race even if there were "on your side" sort to speak unless you took the time to learn their races lanquage. Then you had the Zek servers which had sides based on race, or religon on two of them.
I agree to a point but EQ was nothing like DAOC in that respect. For example if I was playing a Troll in DAOC there was no possible way I could play along side my friend who chose to play an Elf. In EQ I had many friends who played Evil races and it never kept us apart, we could play together as much as we wanted. DAOC you could not do this and the only time you even saw another faction you were to engage them and their name wouldnt even show up, just a title in large red numbers.
I do agree that EQ attempted to copy this later on with the Sullen Zek server which was team based but you were still not sperated like in DAOC which made Community and teamwork very important.
lol well my poor little ranger who had arrows in her back from those nasty newts and evils might disagree about being seperated requiring more teamwork. However, I do see your point.
Magic is impressive, but now Minsc leads! Swords for everyone!
I just question if it is too early to call DDO:EU a success...so far it has not stayed up [in f2p form] as long as Auto Assault, much less AC2. If it is still going strong in a year or two, then it will have earned the title "success".
<p align=center><a target=_blank href=http://www.nodiatis.com/personality.htm><img border=0 src=http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/20.jpg></a></p>;
I miss Dark and Light in the list - i thought that this was the most epic fail in MMO history :P
-------------------------------------
Playing: Overwatch, Genshin Impact, Black Desert Mobile, Hundred Soul, Cyberpunk 2077
Inactive: WAR, DAoC, RIFT, GW1/2, TSW, Age of Wulin, Black Desert, Blade & Soul, Skyforge