Taking an Advantage of Gamers: A Debate on MMO Subscriptions

nate1980

When I first started playing MMO's, the subscription for one was $9.99/mo, and less if you subscribed for more than one month at a time. A couple years later, I believe EQ raised their subscription rate to $12.99/mo, so DAoC eventually followed suit. Next came the bump to $15/mo, and of course, every MMO after followed suit. It's basically been a "let's see if the market will bear this subscription price," approach, and once a game was successful with their price raise, every other MMO jumped on the bandwagon. Now what we have is players accustomed to paying a monthly fee, and $15/mo at that. Is this reasonable?

What are the reasons to pay a subscription fee, if there's a box price? Single-player games usually offer around a weeks worth of non-grindbased content. Games like Final Fantasy offer a lot longer than that, but are grind based. All included in the box price. So it's reasonable to expect to be able to play the full game, from minimum level to maximum level, from the first quest, to the last raid, for the box price. So we're not paying for content that's available at launch, because that's what we're paying for with the box price. A MMORPG usually doesn't offer a content update until at least 3-6 months after release. Usually the first 3 months is bug and performances fixes in the form of patches. So the only reason to pay a subscription fee is to keep servers running, customer service and developers employed. I'm not opposed to subscription fees when a company has earned it, but I think it's reasonable to expect 3 months without a subscription, since we're paying full price for the box anyways.

How much should a company charge? Well the answer to this is the same answer economics teaches us about any product on the market, and that's as much as the market will bear. Unlike other products though, MMO's are all exactly the same price per month, regardless of value actually offered. Which brings us to the next question: How do we judge value? We can't quantify fun, but we can quantify a games features, stability, technological advancements, and service. So one game can be compared to another, and be judged on value. It's common sense and reasonable to expect a game of significant lesser value to cost less in subscription fees than one of greater value, yet MMO companies continue to charge the same rate as their betters.

MMO gamers are a desperate lot, so they're willing to pay the cost, because they're accustomed to paying the fee anyways. Instead of using reason, they respond emotionally to the need to play a MMORPG, because they've become addicted to it, or have rationalized needing to play one for some other reason.

So, do you all think after paying full price for the box, that you're entitled to at least be able to play all the content avialable at release for the cost of that box? Of course the company would find the average amount of time a gamer plays, so that they could allot a fair amount of time free with the purchase of the box; say 60 days free? Is this reasonable? Do you all think every game is equally valuable, comparing one game to another based on the features they offer (ie. auction house, housing, crafting)? If you answered no, do you think that a company should adjust their subscription fee to reflect this?

drbaltazar

yep and with the number of game avail.i think mmo cant pass the 10$/month anymore.every game that tried fail.

so the go home advice btween 1$ to 10$/monthly most gamer might accept if the game is good .but

pass 10$ 90% of the games avail will not be able to live good.

they ll just get the crumble instead.

check the game publish in the last 5 years very few p2p game just lived.and most were pass the 10$

most should be at 5$ /month.but aaa title can live at 10$/month

but not many can bring in customer at 15$/month

GTwander

The standard has been 15$ a month since UO, I have no clue what it was you were playing that pitched for less. In fact, the first game I remember going for less was FFXI, and that changed depending on how many alts you had.

Murashu

How much I pay all depends on how much fun Im having with the product and for how long. Seriously, what other form of entertainment delivers weeks, months and even years of content for a whole $15 a month? Single-player games charge a one time fee, but they usually provide less than a week of normal content.

 

Im actually surprised that no companies are raising their prices here lately. In the late 90's I was spending $300-450 a month for multi-player racing, so it still boggles my mind that people get so upset over $15 today.

Sovrath

Originally posted by nate1980


When I first started playing MMO's, the subscription for one was $9.99/mo, and less if you subscribed for more than one month at a time. A couple years later, I believe EQ raised their subscription rate to $12.99/mo, so DAoC eventually followed suit. Next came the bump to $15/mo, and of course, every MMO after followed suit. It's basically been a "let's see if the market will bear this subscription price," approach, and once a game was successful with their price raise, every other MMO jumped on the bandwagon. Now what we have is players accustomed to paying a monthly fee, and $15/mo at that. Is this reasonable?
What are the reasons to pay a subscription fee, if there's a box price? Single-player games usually offer around a weeks worth of non-grindbased content. Games like Final Fantasy offer a lot longer than that, but are grind based. All included in the box price. So it's reasonable to expect to be able to play the full game, from minimum level to maximum level, from the first quest, to the last raid, for the box price. So we're not paying for content that's available at launch, because that's what we're paying for with the box price. A MMORPG usually doesn't offer a content update until at least 3-6 months after release. Usually the first 3 months is bug and performances fixes in the form of patches. So the only reason to pay a subscription fee is to keep servers running, customer service and developers employed. I'm not opposed to subscription fees when a company has earned it, but I think it's reasonable to expect 3 months without a subscription, since we're paying full price for the box anyways.
How much should a company charge? Well the answer to this is the same answer economics teaches us about any product on the market, and that's as much as the market will bear. Unlike other products though, MMO's are all exactly the same price per month, regardless of value actually offered. Which brings us to the next question: How do we judge value? We can't quantify fun, but we can quantify a games features, stability, technological advancements, and service. So one game can be compared to another, and be judged on value. It's common sense and reasonable to expect a game of significant lesser value to cost less in subscription fees than one of greater value, yet MMO companies continue to charge the same rate as their betters.
MMO gamers are a desperate lot, so they're willing to pay the cost, because they're accustomed to paying the fee anyways. Instead of using reason, they respond emotionally to the need to play a MMORPG, because they've become addicted to it, or have rationalized needing to play one for some other reason.
So, do you all think after paying full price for the box, that you're entitled to at least be able to play all the content avialable at release for the cost of that box? Of course the company would find the average amount of time a gamer plays, so that they could allot a fair amount of time free with the purchase of the box; say 60 days free? Is this reasonable? Do you all think every game is equally valuable, comparing one game to another based on the features they offer (ie. auction house, housing, crafting)? If you answered no, do you think that a company should adjust their subscription fee to reflect this?

 

Unless you can provide me with a line by line list of all expenditures for development, cost to keep the game running, Cost for employees including fringe, operating costs (such as rent, utilities, insurance for the business or its property, etc), costs for equipment and maintenance and costs for future development and show that a game company can easily do all this on just the box sales then I think I will still support the monthly charges.

Heck, i'd pay double if it was a guarantee of a good game with a good future.

nate1980

@GTwander - Do some research. Games didn't start off at $15/mo. I started playing DAoC in 2002, and monthly fees were only $9/mo.

@Murashu- You're not justifying the fee based on a games merits. Instead, you'r rationalizing why you pay it based on the age old argument of "what other form of entertainment, blah blah blah." This argument is shallow and requires very little thought. It dodges the real question of whether or not one MMO is equal to another, and if the box price is justified with a monthly fee for what they deliver.

@Sovrath- Trying to intimidate me into admitting that I don't know the development process of a MMO isn't going to work. Scientists and researchers in all professions deal with questions like these without ever knowing all the variables. Some things must be assumed. We should assume that business professionals properly manage their money and have a budget that is conservative. Meaning, a manager should factor in how much a MMO costs to develop based on what they're doing, compared to what others have done and what it cost them, and how much they'd need to have left over once the game is released in order to give everyone a reasonable amount of time to get their box price worth. The customer shouldn't bear the cost of mismanagement.

Take the car analogy for example. Cars come is different makes and models, and are equipped with an X number of features. One car make isn't the same price of another car make with similar features. This is because costs are different among various companies, and manufacturers want to be competitive. If every car with similar features were all the exact same price, smart and logical people would choose the car with the most amount of features for their money. MMO's can be approached much the same way. MMO's have various development costs and a list of features. Not every MMO is created equal, yet unlike most products on the market, MMO's have the same box price and subscription fee. Any rational human being would admit that this isn't reasonable.

@Everyone - Save the bragging about how little $15/mo is to you, and how you'd pay X amount of dollars per month for a good game. I'm not impressed. Even Bill Gates spends his money rationally. This topic isn't about how little the subscription fee is to you, or how much it could be. It's about whether or not some games deserve to charge the same fee when compared to the competition and whether or not we're getting our moneys worth for the price of the box.

GTwander

I played UO back in the summer of 98' and it was 15$. Granted I didn't play any other MMOs till SWG in 03', but it, and everything since has been 15 as well.

nAAtimus

The MMO I play is $10/month

drbaltazar

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by nate1980


When I first started playing MMO's, the subscription for one was $9.99/mo, and less if you subscribed for more than one month at a time. A couple years later, I believe EQ raised their subscription rate to $12.99/mo, so DAoC eventually followed suit. Next came the bump to $15/mo, and of course, every MMO after followed suit. It's basically been a "let's see if the market will bear this subscription price," approach, and once a game was successful with their price raise, every other MMO jumped on the bandwagon. Now what we have is players accustomed to paying a monthly fee, and $15/mo at that. Is this reasonable?
What are the reasons to pay a subscription fee, if there's a box price? Single-player games usually offer around a weeks worth of non-grindbased content. Games like Final Fantasy offer a lot longer than that, but are grind based. All included in the box price. So it's reasonable to expect to be able to play the full game, from minimum level to maximum level, from the first quest, to the last raid, for the box price. So we're not paying for content that's available at launch, because that's what we're paying for with the box price. A MMORPG usually doesn't offer a content update until at least 3-6 months after release. Usually the first 3 months is bug and performances fixes in the form of patches. So the only reason to pay a subscription fee is to keep servers running, customer service and developers employed. I'm not opposed to subscription fees when a company has earned it, but I think it's reasonable to expect 3 months without a subscription, since we're paying full price for the box anyways.
How much should a company charge? Well the answer to this is the same answer economics teaches us about any product on the market, and that's as much as the market will bear. Unlike other products though, MMO's are all exactly the same price per month, regardless of value actually offered. Which brings us to the next question: How do we judge value? We can't quantify fun, but we can quantify a games features, stability, technological advancements, and service. So one game can be compared to another, and be judged on value. It's common sense and reasonable to expect a game of significant lesser value to cost less in subscription fees than one of greater value, yet MMO companies continue to charge the same rate as their betters.
MMO gamers are a desperate lot, so they're willing to pay the cost, because they're accustomed to paying the fee anyways. Instead of using reason, they respond emotionally to the need to play a MMORPG, because they've become addicted to it, or have rationalized needing to play one for some other reason.
So, do you all think after paying full price for the box, that you're entitled to at least be able to play all the content avialable at release for the cost of that box? Of course the company would find the average amount of time a gamer plays, so that they could allot a fair amount of time free with the purchase of the box; say 60 days free? Is this reasonable? Do you all think every game is equally valuable, comparing one game to another based on the features they offer (ie. auction house, housing, crafting)? If you answered no, do you think that a company should adjust their subscription fee to reflect this?

 

Unless you can provide me with a line by line list of all expenditures for development, cost to keep the game running, Cost for employees including fringe, operating costs (such as rent, utilities, insurance for the business or its property, etc), costs for equipment and maintenance and costs for future development and show that a game company can easily do all this on just the box sales then I think I will still support the monthly charges.

Heck, i'd pay double if it was a guarantee of a good game with a good future.

 

good for you! as for me?i dont pay for something i dont like.one reason guildwars is very popular and lot of game that are f2p also

aside from a few like ,wow,lotro,aion not many can say their 15$/month is justified.the game just doesnt have enough plus value.

f2p market is gaining ground everywhere around the world because lot of gamer feel some game monthly fee are too expensive!

Sovrath

Originally posted by nate1980


@Sovrath- Trying to intimidate me into admitting that I don't know the development process of a MMO isn't going to work. Scientists and researchers in all professions deal with questions like these without ever knowing all the variables. Some things must be assumed. We should assume that business professionals properly manage their money and have a budget that is conservative. Meaning, a manager should factor in how much a MMO costs to develop based on what they're doing, compared to what others have done and what it cost them, and how much they'd need to have left over once the game is released in order to give everyone a reasonable amount of time to get their box price worth. The customer shouldn't bear the cost of mismanagement.
Take the car analogy for example. Cars come is different makes and models, and are equipped with an X number of features. One car make isn't the same price of another car make with similar features. This is because costs are different among various companies, and manufacturers want to be competitive. If every car with similar features were all the exact same price, smart and logical people would choose the car with the most amount of features for their money. MMO's can be approached much the same way. MMO's have various development costs and a list of features. Not every MMO is created equal, yet unlike most products on the market, MMO's have the same box price and subscription fee. Any rational human being would admit that this isn't reasonable.

 

I am not trying to intimidate you at all. But what I am saying is that these are the things that one must take into account when one considers running a business.

Of course you don't know these things. And I don't have any numbers as far as how much it costs to run a regular game company (though I have seen the numbers for my former company and running a company is quite a bit). Also, I did watch a GDC thing on WoW and the amount of money they spend on everything is quite impressive.

To put it this way:

if game companies are being forced to release games before their time because they just don't have the money then that either means they are eating quail eggs, caviar and driving to work in gold rocket cars, they have bad management, or the fact is they need more money than players think.

I will give you that some of it could be bad management. But every game? Or "most" every game? And they are trying to find alternate ways to bring in money?

As far as the portion I highlighted, why must you assume that they DONT' take into the costs and have come up with a number that requires monthly subs?

As far as having the same sub costs, what's to say that if a game company had its druthers that it wouldn't cost more in some cases?

They charge the 15.99 per month because that is what the masses can accept at face value for a sub.  Most of these games have charged something similar for quite some time. My guess is that this is more of a marketing thing. I bet they would love to charge more but the appearance of such a thing would seem off putting to players.

If anything, given that sub costs have not gone up, I'm surprised they haven't made the move to make it higher. But perhaps that is why game companies are seeking alternate means of bringing in revenue.

 

Sovrath

Originally posted by drbaltazar

Originally posted by Sovrath




 
Unless you can provide me with a line by line list of all expenditures for development, cost to keep the game running, Cost for employees including fringe, operating costs (such as rent, utilities, insurance for the business or its property, etc), costs for equipment and maintenance and costs for future development and show that a game company can easily do all this on just the box sales then I think I will still support the monthly charges.
Heck, i'd pay double if it was a guarantee of a good game with a good future.

 

good for you! as for me?i dont pay for something i dont like.one reason guildwars is very popular and lot of game that are f2p also

aside from a few like ,wow,lotro,aion not many can say their 15$/month is justified.the game just doesnt have enough plus value.

f2p market is gaining ground everywhere around the world because lot of gamer feel some game monthly fee are too expensive!

 

And that's the thing "don't" pay for something you dont' find worthy of your hard earned salary.

the f2p market, short of DDO, does make things so that one "might" pay a bit here and there for extras. Oh, they most likely don't have to but when you see you are falling behind or that other players are leveling faster or just have it easier as far as spawning back in place then the f2p player just "might" spend that extra 5 or 10 dollars to make things easier.

edit: do not think for one minute that I don't take into account my income and my outcome and that I don't reevaluate my expenses.

i don't have a car because I made the choice to live in a city and therefore don't need one. No gas, insurance, parking spots, repair bills.

I don't want a family so paying for braces, college and whatever other costs are associated with a family will also pass me by.

I live in a nice area but my actual apartment looks like it was designed arouund WWII. But my part of the rent is very cheap and I don't ahve to pay for heat or hot water so all that can go into other things.

I get the idea of not paying for things you don't find of value and I applaud you for it. But as for me, I have no problem paying 15.99 or more if I value the game and if it means the game will come out with a healthy amount of new content.

Murashu

Originally posted by nate1980


@Murashu- You're not justifying the fee based on a games merits. Instead, you'r rationalizing why you pay it based on the age old argument of "what other form of entertainment, blah blah blah." This argument is shallow and requires very little thought. It dodges the real question of whether or not one MMO is equal to another, and if the box price is justified with a monthly fee for what they deliver.
@Everyone - Save the bragging about how little $15/mo is to you, and how you'd pay X amount of dollars per month for a good game. I'm not impressed. Even Bill Gates spends his money rationally. This topic isn't about how little the subscription fee is to you, or how much it could be. It's about whether or not some games deserve to charge the same fee when compared to the competition and whether or not we're getting our moneys worth for the price of the box.

I justify spending my money based on how much entertainment the product provides me. If its not fun, I wont buy it. If I want to play a game and it cost $75 instead of the normal $50, I'll probably buy it. If my favorite game costs $15 a month and some other crappier game costs $5 a month, Im still going to play higher cost one...if its more fun.

 

I wouldnt say people are bragging when they say they will spend more money for something that makes them happy. That is just how life works. Everyone gets to decide whether or not a game 'deserves' to charge a certain amount. If you have the money and think something is important enough for you to spend your money on, then go for it. If you have a serious heartburn with spending $15 a month for a game that you feel isnt up to par...click cancel.

 

Back when EQ decided to raises their prices from $9.99 to $12.99 a month, the entire industry cried out at the outrage. A couple of years later, the average price went up to $14.95 and even more people cried out, but guess what? The industry is still growing and everyday people are deciding whether or not a game is worth its subscription. Subscribe or cancel.

 

nate1980

Originally posted by GTwander


I played UO back in the summer of 98' and it was 15$. Granted I didn't play any other MMOs till SWG in 03', but it, and everything since has been 15 as well.

 

For UO: Confirming subscription cost of $10/mo as of 1998.

http://www.mobygames.com/game/ultima-online

For EQ: Confirming subscription cost of $9.98 as of 1999

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-1999.html

For DAoC: Confirming that DAoC switched to $14.95 in 2004. In 2003, the price was $13/mo, which is confirmed in the second link. Third link confirms the $10/mo fee.

http://www.camelotherald.com/more/1870.shtml

http://archive.cert.uni-stuttgart.de/vulnwatch/2003/12/msg00016.html

http://www.lvl6games.com/dark-age-of-camelot-mmorpg-fun.html

 

Lexiscat

I think you raise some good points, but also forget that entertainment pricing in many areas has standards regardless of quality.

You pay the same price to see a good movie as you do a bad one. For a long movie, or a short one. You pay the same price for most movies when the DvD is first released.

I've become accustomed to new video games being X price. Or within a range. Regardless of their quality, i end up paying that price if I want it early.

Difference with MMOs is their box price might come down the longer they are out but the subscription stays the same under the assumption they are continuing to develop and add content to that game.

The standard pricing on movies and games is why I tend to stick with names, brands, developers I have grown to trust.

It is why I will pay full price for a Blizzard or Bioware game when they first come out.  They have earned my trust and patronage.  I am content with waiting for other titles i'm unsure about to come down in price before buying.

It is also why I have never subscribed to any MMO that i didn't get to try for free first. Either from a friends account, or from a free trial.  Paying 15 dollars for a game I can pickup and mess around with anytime I want, vs a game i can only play around with for that 1 month I have an active subscription is something I take into account.

A game in a bargain bin you don't like has a lot more value, then a 1 month sub to a game that you don't like.

Last observation I can make about my purchasing habits and experiences is that sub price has never influenced my decision whether to subscribe or not. Whether is 5, 10, 20 dollars a month, does not even enter my criteria until I know whether i like the game or not.

Then price becomes relevant.

 

Sovrath

Originally posted by Murashu

Originally posted by nate1980


@Murashu- You're not justifying the fee based on a games merits. Instead, you'r rationalizing why you pay it based on the age old argument of "what other form of entertainment, blah blah blah." This argument is shallow and requires very little thought. It dodges the real question of whether or not one MMO is equal to another, and if the box price is justified with a monthly fee for what they deliver.
@Everyone - Save the bragging about how little $15/mo is to you, and how you'd pay X amount of dollars per month for a good game. I'm not impressed. Even Bill Gates spends his money rationally. This topic isn't about how little the subscription fee is to you, or how much it could be. It's about whether or not some games deserve to charge the same fee when compared to the competition and whether or not we're getting our moneys worth for the price of the box.

I justify spending my money based on how much entertainment the product provides me. If its not fun, I wont buy it. If I want to play a game and it cost $75 instead of the normal $50, I'll probably buy it. If my favorite game costs $15 a month and some other crappier game costs $5 a month, Im still going to play higher cost one...if its more fun.

 

I wouldnt say people are bragging when they say they will spend more money for something that makes them happy. That is just how life works. Everyone gets to decide whether or not a game 'deserves' to charge a certain amount. If you have the money and think something is important enough for you to spend your money on, then go for it. If you have a serious heartburn with spending $15 a month for a game that you feel isnt up to par...click cancel.

 

Back when EQ decided to raises their prices from $9.99 to $12.99 a month, the entire industry cried out at the outrage. A couple of years later, the average price went up to $14.95 and even more people cried out, but guess what? The industry is still growing and everyday people are deciding whether or not a game is worth its subscription. Subscribe or cancel.

 

 

Exactly.

I'll be honest, I'd rather not pay anything. That's right, I said it. Anyting. But I also don't want to pay for rent or movies or my entertainment or good clothes.

But people need to eat and do these things so they work and start/work in businesses in order to get money.

if my not paying a sub means that the games go completely cash shop a la carte then I'd rather keep the sub.

I don't mind paying extra for cosmetic items but items for extra xp or extra perks, faster running speed or less xp loss on death?

Cash shops are slippery slopes.

GTwander

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by GTwander


I played UO back in the summer of 98' and it was 15$. Granted I didn't play any other MMOs till SWG in 03', but it, and everything since has been 15 as well.

 

For UO: Confirming subscription cost of $10/mo as of 1998.

http://www.mobygames.com/game/ultima-online

No, confirming it as of June 23, 2000 - when the article was written.

ThomasN7

I posted something similar to this in some other discussion we was having. Blizzard was king of gaming even before WoW and without subscription fees! They had Diablo 1, Diablo 2, Starcraft and Warcraft 1,2 and 3. Blizzard at one time owned almost all spects of the gaming market without subscription fees! I think subscription fees work for newly formed companies who need to get a leg up but for the long term, subscription fees will eventually be a thing of the past. The best example will be Guild Wars 2. Guild Wars 2 will be an awesome successful mmo without a subscription fee.

GTwander

@SaintVik

I have the hardest time trying to figure out how GW turns a profit on box sales alone. Granted it seems to be working for them, and very well, but I still don't see how it could possibly translate to a profit. They only make money off each expansion, and many people never kept up with them all as expected.

drbaltazar

yes but when a movie isnt popular hes out faster.in mmo if the game was worth 5 $ but not 10$

i think lot of game that are dead would probably still living healthy at 5$ a month that right now are sleeping in shelves

ncsoft got lot of those probably lot of others too

as for everquest in my book that game is worth its monthly .say you start playing today and never played it

you will be at it a very long while to experience all of its content.and its a brainiac game

you got to use your brain .but the new game today lol you could be playing without thinking all

its often mindless gaming!i ll probably buy a prepaid credit card and buy everquest plus time card

by the time i experienced it all 2012 will be here and maybe game maker will have made game with

dx11,microsoft donnybrook,64 bit.till then we can only hope!

Kordesh

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by GTwander


I played UO back in the summer of 98' and it was 15$. Granted I didn't play any other MMOs till SWG in 03', but it, and everything since has been 15 as well.

 

For UO: Confirming subscription cost of $10/mo as of 1998.

http://www.mobygames.com/game/ultima-online

For EQ: Confirming subscription cost of $9.98 as of 1999

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-1999.html

For DAoC: Confirming that DAoC switched to $14.95 in 2004. In 2003, the price was $13/mo, which is confirmed in the second link. Third link confirms the $10/mo fee.

http://www.camelotherald.com/more/1870.shtml

http://archive.cert.uni-stuttgart.de/vulnwatch/2003/12/msg00016.html

http://www.lvl6games.com/dark-age-of-camelot-mmorpg-fun.html

 

That. I definitely played UO, EQ, AC, DAoC and all the classics, and they were definitely $9.99 until I believe DAoC was the first to try $12.99, and then everyone else jumped on the bandwagon as I expected. I forget who was the first to push $14.99. I remember at one point SoE decided to see if they could manage to get people to spend $30 with their "premium" EQ server which basically involved them removing all customer service from the main servers and providing "extra" to the special server. Fortunately that bullshit never caught on. But yeah, its no secret that scuzball companies like to see what they can eek out and then as soon as its determined people will pay for it everyone else jumps aboard claiming "sudden increases" that require they do so. The latest in this trend hasn't been increased mmo fees, but rather companies double dipping with subscription and microtransaction crap. I'm not sure who was first, I want to say SoE again, but now everyone is looking to run a sub with a cash shop/card game which is bull. 

This thread however is terrible, because its obvious the OP is one of those F2P people who don't understand that the fee is in fact there for a reason, because it costs money to develop that content "3-6 months down the road" to keep patching/balancing the game, to keep your character data stored, for bandwidth, etc etc. Of all people he should know better, because this effect is 100x worse in F2P games, because you basically have to trust the company to not be greedy in that case, as they have proven before they have no qualms with altering the difficulty or features in the game to encourage to flat out force you to use the cash shop to actually play the game to a reasonable degree. This tends to happen either because A: They're just greedy or B: Like all other MMOs F2P games need to make money, and if people aren't buying then they're going to need to goad them into paying more, or shut down. 

 

" They had Diablo 1, Diablo 2, Starcraft and Warcraft 1,2 and 3. Blizzard at one time owned almost all spects of the gaming market without subscription fees!"

Are you really that dense that you can't see the difference between multiplayer matchmaking, with no online persistence, hosted short term by the players, and a large constantly developed and maintained server room with character data backups and the like? Not a single one of those is remotely an MMO, why WOULD they have a subscription fee? PS: I hate to break it to you, but the blizzard of then is not the blizzard of now, and if it was up to Kotick/Blizzard, you would be up to your eyes in sub fees for Starcraft 2/D3, and may very well get at the very least a cash shop for D3 as it stands. 

paulscott

Server and bandwidth time is dirt cheap and has been for years.   I ran figures and it literally comes out to to 40 to 80 cents a month on leased server space for a player  link.

What you are paying for is "man time".   The cost of replying to a SINGLE customer support E-Mail can easily hit $4 to $5 dollars.    The cost of an hours worth of content can easily hit $1000 dollars on a MUD and easily 10 times that on a normal MMO.   The cost of baby sitting your right to use "credit cards" due to scams and nerd-RAEG customers can cost an immense amount of cash, and losing that right means you no longer have a bussiness model.    the cost of fixing a minor bug can be anywhere from $20 to $10,000+ depending on how hard it is to find, design out of, and actually fix.

Kaelaan21

I am sure every MMO player has thought about this at one time or another. When I first started to play UO in '96, the subscription price paid semi-annually was about 7.99 a month. Now the games are about 12.95 per month when paid every 6 months. MMO prices have went up by about 50%. But, if you take a look at normal games - I used to buy games for $20-30 back then. Now, they are $50-60. Normal games seemed to have doubled in price. So, the MMO hasn't increased in price that much when compared to the rest of the game industry.

 

Now, to put a value on it. Well, for most of the Xbox 360 games that I buy, I will get about 2 months of fun out of it. Yeah, I can beat it well before then. Yeah, I will play it a lot more in the first couple of weeks, but spread out over time.. I get about 2 months of good use of them. So, a normal game which costs about $60 (if I don't buy used), will cost me $30/month. An MMO if played for the same 2 month period will cost a total of $50 for the box and $15 for the second month. Which is $32.50/month. So, you really get burned if you buy an MMO that you don't enjoy. In the long run though, an MMO with one expansion every year will cost you a little over $19/month if you pay month to month. About $17/month if you pay semi-annually.

 

Bottom line, an MMO is more cost effective form of entertainment when compared to a normal boxed game ONLY WHEN PLAYED LONG TERM. The problem that I have with paying this fee is that if a company is going to sell an MMO with a box price and then charge monthly, it should meet the same quality if not more of many of the single player games out there. And no, I am not referring to an epic storyline feel or even superior graphics. I am referring to what they have in the game should be as bug free as possible. Instead, fixing bugs after release seem to be an accepted norm these days. Problem is that they never get fixed before new content arrives. So, when they are finally fixed a whole new slew of issues have cropped up to take it's place. I usually don't have to deal with those issues with boxed games.

Sabiancym

Don't sub if your that cheap.  They aren't taking advantage of anyone, you know the price going in.

ThomasN7

Originally posted by GTwander


@SaintVik
I have the hardest time trying to figure out how GW turns a profit on box sales alone. Granted it seems to be working for them, and very well, but I still don't see how it could possibly translate to a profit. They only make money off each expansion, and many people never kept up with them all as expected.

 

All of ArenaNet's work is made from hand and the use of their talents. They do not go out and outsource their work like other companies do. They use pre-existing tools and make them better which make better games. ArenaNet also gets profit from the Guild Wars store which has character slots for sale, make overs, storage space and a few other things they sell in the store.   Unless Blizzard comes up with something totally amazing, Guild Wars 2 will dominate the mmo genre for many years.

Ilvaldyr

Inflation sucks, but it's present in every aspect of our lives, so we can't really complain about MMO subscriptions following suit.

As for the value of a subscription price; it pays for some stuff, but most of it goes towards the profits of the company. Just like every other entertainment provider in the world.

Last time I went to the cinema, I paid the equivalent of a months subscription fee just to plonk me arse on a seat and spend 2 hours watching a crappy movie on a big screen. MMOs are the cheapest form of entertainment I've ever encountered.

To put it into perspective, the "average" hours/week is currently at 22.

88 hours a month / $15 (or £10 for us limeys)

I dare you to find a hobby that offers better value for money.

uquipu

 A company's biggest expense after launch is customer service.

Just saying wages, insurance, payroll taxes keep going up.

The free version of DDO gives you zero customer service other than what you can find on their website.