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What ship to take: Cruiser or Science?
Elikal
Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
I am puzzled now after the beta experience what ship to take. First, I was sure to take Cruiser. Reasons are simple, longevity since they have strong hull, and I like playing "tanks", and of course it has the biggest ships and the most well know classes, Galaxy, Constitution & Souvreign. So coolness guaranteed.
The downside is, it seems maybe like everyone and everyone's mom would take it and a galaxy full of Galaxy class ships kinda isn't so cool.
I thought Science would be weak, because I thought it would be like a healer in other MMos, and everyone knows healers are usually weak. But playing science vessel was kinda interesting. It has some cool skills and does not seem so weak like I thought. But then, looking at the ships, most did just look so-so. And I am not sure how it plays on higher levels.
So, what are your ideas or impressions?
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Comments
I'm torn myself. After looking at the skill tree in detail it appears like Cruisers have lots of heal abilities (due to having more engineering Boff slots) and the Science Vessels have lots of mess with enemy abilities which can be a ton of fun.
Hurry up Friday and get here already:)
I saw a thread on the offical STO site about this and the players there made many good points. What I concluded is many favored the Escort, than Science and finally the Cruiser. It appeared your starting skills and later the in game skills made a big difference in what ship benefited most. Many didn't like the cruiser because it is slow and handled poorly, but from what I gathered if you beefed up those skills at character creation it worked out fine. If your going to have the most weapons type ships you need to get skills that help in power generation. Anyways go over and check that out for yourself.
Where did you see those skill trees? Link pls. ^^
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
In terms of flat out playability, the Escort is the way to go, IMO! Turns way quicker, heavy duty armament in the front... throw a turret in the back and you're halfway through the hull of most ships before you're within 2 km of each other.
I'd go escort if there was a way to stay on the Defiant and make it work for the higher levels.I love that ship.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
As a Cm8 in a Cruiser, I found that it didn't really matter that your turn rate was slow. If you outfit correctly, you have the possibility to constantly be firing 3-4 weapons at a time no matter what direction you're facing. Most of the time I attacked from my broad side (4 beams with 250 arc) and when their shields dropped, I turned tails and forced them to pursue me while my rear torpdoes nuked them to oblivion.
I was taking on multiple +3 mobs and they couldn't even dent me. And i had enough fire power to pretty much waste them too. I didn't get a chance to try out a Science Vessel (so I can't really compare the two) but the Cruiser is a beast if you know how to play and spec it correctly. Nothing can kill you.
I'm sure a Science Vessel has its strengths too. And people are saying they can tank better than Cruisers. Though I disagree. And if they really can...it won't be that way for long because that's not really their role. And Cryptic will make changes. So if you are going as a Science Vessel to tank with, I would advise against it. Or else you'll be one of the screaming-mimis enraged by the nerf bat. Hehe.
Just my opinions.
Having played the beta for awhile and getting to Commander 9, I tried all the ships, the Cruiser is like a tank, a extra engineering slot that plays well if your a engineer, plus cruisers can take more damage.
Escorts are your damage dealers , they have one extra tactical slot , so if you are specced tactical I'de go with Escort , I was a tactial officer and I could take on 5-7 guys np, but you gotta be careful as well, because they can't take the damage very well.
Science ships are like your buffers/debuffer dots kinda thing, one extra science officer slot , so yet again, if your specced science I'de go with a science ship plays with your strengths.
Whatever you are you can choose whatever ship you want, but choose on the ship that matches your skill set, that will help out alot!
Blank
I'd go escort if there was a way to stay on the Defiant and make it work for the higher levels.I love that ship.
Did you try one in beta? They are tiny
Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy
I'm completely torn on this issue. I tried all 3 by the end of beta. not an escort fan, i didn't like the look of them and they are very fragile. I loved the cruiser, despite the slow turn ~ which gets worse from what I have seen, and I really do love the Galaxy class it has always looked awesome to me. I tried science and actually loved the hard as nails shields! and I like the idea of the abilities but dislike some of the ships i have seen!
The decision is pretty simple.
Ships
Fast High Burst Get In & Out = Escort ship
Tank Medium Sustained Dps = Cruiser
Buff/Debuff For Extra Dps = Science
Captain class does effect mostly your ground skill but you do get some space abilities at certain lvls which are class specific.
Engineer = Tank extra shields + regen and other stuff related.
Tactical = Extra Dps Skills Makes that burst all that much faster and stronger.
Science = Debuff and buff skills makes your stronger and them weaker.
So you can be a science officer in an escort to debuff the enemy to do more dmg. Or you can go engineer do make you a more survivable escort. Tactical to make you do even more dmg in burst. So it depends on your play style. If you want to be the best tank Engineer with a cruiser. If you want to be a support class with less dps for you but help everyone else do alot more than a science officer in a science ship. If you want to be the ultimate hit it and kill it then run tactical in a escort. 3 classes with 3 ship types.
So you know. The diffrence in ships makes a diffrence in base stat and what bonuses u get from certain equipment. Science ships get a better boost from skill related to science using the deflector and sensors etc... and its base stats for anything related to the science skill is slightly better. Escorts have a small bonus relating to dps and alot more maneuverable etc... Cruiser have alot more hull and shield they get more hull and shield regen because of larger crew and it makes it easier for them to use boarding etc....
Hopefully this gives you a better idea as to what you want. Feel free to mix and match because that what will make it interesting. 9 different base setup with ship choice and Captain Class choice.
The question is: Will there be a need to fill different roles?
Will groups actually need a balanced fleet of cruisers, escorts and science officers? From the beta I gathered you did not, since all content I saw was easy enough to either be soloable or by a group consisting of any combination of ships.
Would be interesting to see content which actually relied on ships filling those three roles. Then the decision what to play would also be more interesting.
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Aren't there enough games out there that force you into roles? While I was in beta, it was one of the most refreshing things in that you could do content without a deditcated healer or dedicated tank. This is Star Trek for crying out loud, where in the whole IP do ships actually behave as tanks and healers? You had battleships, exploration ships and science vessels, never did a science vessel act as a healer, they were never in combat to begin with.
True, but Star Trek was also about cooperation and interaction with other people, and sometimes ships, to solve problems. We have a solo MMORPG already and it is called Champions Online. Is STO the same?
I mean if there is a war raging then it is fleets that win battles, not single ships.
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My favourite out of the three was, eventually, Escort ship. I got some nice shields with 160 shield regen, and some modules that boosted hull repair and damage resistances, and it ended up pretty tough.
Cruiser just wallows about too much, and I didn't like the turn speed. My second favourite was the Science ship, which was durable and fairly speedy.
Lets put it this way. If im a tactical officer in an escort and you get debuffed from a science officer in his science ship when i start hitting you ur gonna see ur shields go bye bye and u will die faster than you can say peekaboo. Its not a necessity but it will make life easier alot easier. Its like a 30% debuff decreasing ur dmg + a 30% buff increasing the dmg u take, then add my alpha strike which is a 30% buff + increase crit chance and crit severity so YES ITS A MUST HAVE.
My criteria for suggesting a ship would be these:
If you want to play a fast and maneuverable ship, slipping in and out of firing arcs, running circles around your enemy and tearing through their ship, unloading some cool ass cannons, take Escort.
If you want to play a good all around ship with strong abilities to debuff and cause trouble, manipulating the battlefield to cause havoc for the enemy and boons for your friends, getting a boost to all the coolest looking (imo) powers, crippling ship systems and stacking the deck for your team, get a Science vessel.
If you want to play the long haul Rocky Balboa slug fest, taking a beating and keep going, thinking 3 moves ahead to set up a more strategic situation, countering enemy attacks and dominating the area, take a Cruiser.
Honestly they're all good, and they all have their uses. Heck you could even fly 2 or even all 3 of them if you really wanted.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
Lets put it this way. If im a tactical officer in an escort and you get debuffed from a science officer in his science ship when i start hitting you ur gonna see ur shields go bye bye and u will die faster than you can say peekaboo. Its not a necessity but it will make life easier alot easier. Its like a 30% debuff decreasing ur dmg + a 30% buff increasing the dmg u take, then add my alpha strike which is a 30% buff + increase crit chance and crit severity so YES ITS A MUST HAVE.
You are missing the point. There was tons of support skills in CO that were useful and powerful, but since you could finish 90% of the content solo then almost noone grouped and hence noone specced support skills or used the support "stance".
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Don't forget about the important ability to detect cloak. The Science vessel is valuable for that reason alone. Someone started a thread on the boards complaining about the fact that Klingons players waited until his federation buddies had left he sector before decloaking. The response to him was naturally, where was the science vessels in your group?
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Lets put it this way. If im a tactical officer in an escort and you get debuffed from a science officer in his science ship when i start hitting you ur gonna see ur shields go bye bye and u will die faster than you can say peekaboo. Its not a necessity but it will make life easier alot easier. Its like a 30% debuff decreasing ur dmg + a 30% buff increasing the dmg u take, then add my alpha strike which is a 30% buff + increase crit chance and crit severity so YES ITS A MUST HAVE.
You are missing the point. There was tons of support skills in CO that were useful and powerful, but since you could finish 90% of the content solo then almost noone grouped and hence noone specced support skills or used the support "stance".
That maybe true. I dont know about you but i play MMO's to be with friends and make new one etc... A well organized group in PVP will always win. Also in PVE you can solo alot if not most of the content but it becomes increasingly difficult to do so later on as ships will be beating the shit out of you pretty hard. I like the Eng or Tact in an escort I am having a hardtime deciding more dps vs more survivability. Also this game does groups when doing pve unless you turn that option off. So its a choice that you are making, you can fly solo by choice or you can open up random grouping and make some friends or play with friends you already have made etc.... I am a Klingon and i will tell you that if the feds are well grouped and they know each other it gets very difficult to pick them off because of those damn cruiser and science ships, because the science guys debuff us and we take more dmg than we though we might + they can detect us in cloak. For a escort built for dps we want to be within 5k to hit optimal DMG but in that range the damn science guys can detect/debuff so they are very needed.
I was a huge fan of the escort ship but the downside was your basically a glass cannon and once you make a pass on someone you get rocked from behind even with the rather speedy turns you can make. Cruisers have a much slower turn speed but honestly there really is no blind spot to them and damn they could take one hell of a beating. Science ships were kinda in between but with there CC abilities they turned out really fun.
Cruisers- Tanks/healer of the game
Escorts- Straight up dps
Science- CC/dps
Ok, maybe I must clarify to get advise. Playing Science ship was cool because of the skills, espcially in groups. I saw some Science ships toss the enemy away, and one thing I found particularly fun, was that scramble sensors. Often I used it beginning fleet action, targetting in the middle of an enemy swarm, and all were 10 seconds busy shooting at themselves. It allowed the rest of the group to attack without fear of alpha strikes and IMO it really gave an advantage, making the difference if 1-2 Fed ship would die in the assult or not. So I enjoyed the abilities of the Science ship.
However, I know I am easily overwhelmed with too many things to focus at the same time, especially in STO space combat, so I thought maybe playing Science would be too difficult to coordinate and Cruiser was easier to play for me. Besides most Science ships look quite boring while Cruiser are big and cool, so to speak with the ships known from the TV series and movies, and I thought flying that big Sovreign or Galaxy class ship must be awesome.
But just being the tank can also be boring in the long run. I dunno.
So thats where I am not so sure what to pick.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Well you should also think about the fact that the Science skills you'll be using in combat will mostly come from Science Officers. If you want more of them, then presumably science vessel would be good for you. However, note that every fed ship gets at least 1 science officer slot, so you'll still be able to get a few science abilities on the go.
I also think one of the most important aspects of the game is to have a ship you feel "cool" in.
So my suggestion would be to pick Cruiser, because you'll enjoy that as a ship (and hopefully you can live without the subsystem targetting), and just focus on getting your science officer powered up. Potentially you could be a Science captain too, and just fly the cruiser (which is perfectly doable) to give you a bit more science buttons.
In the end actually you should be fine with any ship, because with the T5 ships, each has 2 slots for it's officer type, but two (slightly lower ranked) slots for a secondary type.
So if you wanted to be a cruiser but still focus on science stuff, you could easily take a Star Cruiser, which has 2 (rank 3/2) engineers, 2 (ranks 2/1) sciences, and 1 (rnk 2) tactical. In addition to the 4 eng console slots you'd expect, it has 3 science console slots. This lets it be a cruiser with an emphasis on science as a secondary. The Assault Cruiser, by comparison, is a cruiser with emphasis on tactical as a secondary.
Check out the whole ship chart to see which ship you think is most suited to the powers you want to have.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
Sounds like a personal preference to me. I use to love DPSing all the time no matter what. These days I tend to role as a tank or a healer though. However, it all depends on the game. On STO, I prefered to play Tactical. Felt more natural to me to just dish it out like mad man in battle.
Though I get what you are saying. Those big ships look pretty cool.
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
your using the old chart although the new one needs work here
the hull you use is based on your officer load out preference, escorts offer more and the most powerfull tacticle stations, cruisers offer more and the most powerfull engineering statsion, and science you get the idea. these statsion are where you load your battle skills, science offers recharging friendly shields to roots to anti shield abilities and innate subsytem targeting, which if you make use of targeting the enemy shield sub, very handy, all are usable but targeting shields and knocking htem out for a torp salvoe is epic. tacticles can load the highest level high yield torps/cannon skills/beam overloads, you also have the extra tac slots to have a guy say load target shield subsytems, you wont have all of the science ships sub targeting but you can still use the anti shield one! and have high yield torps at its highest (by far the most power full tacticle abiliy). and of course engineers can range from everything from making themselves unvulnerable to energy weapons for a time to healing others or massively healing themselves such that the cruiser cant be killed by less then 3-5 very determined foes even in pvp. honestly we klingons hate fed cruisers, we kill off all his escort and science allies first and then mass implode the cruiser, when they all fly cruisers we leave the game and get another instantly =D