Yeah, I agree, and more than funny, what happened to you seems unfair, from a customer standpoint. Though by not banning your account, and by some luck they actually get MO in a good playable state, and it actually succeeds (I know big "if" I know!), what if you wanted to use your old account to resub... or would you have to create a new account.
Heh.. I know what you're saying but there is zero chance I would ever give these guys my money again. When I have to go through my credit card company to get my money back because the company won't even respond to Emails..zero chance of ever getting a second shot.
Well considering what happened to you, you have every right to feel that way, and to voice your story to others as not only a warning to fellow gamers, but as a message to these "fly-by-night" indie companies who have high aspirations, but poor execution.
Chargeback isnt ordinary way how to handle these situations. Its like you steal the game from them. Thats why you get banned. Normally you should contact company and they will refund you. I know its impossible to communicate with StarVault, so there wasnt other way. They also have no-refund policy in place.
[Mod Edit]
_____________________________ Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
You are really that stupid or you just playing it? Chargeback isnt ordinary way how to handle these situations. Its like you steal the game from them. Thats why you get banned. Normally you should contact company and they will refund you. I know its impossible to communicate with StarVault, so there wasnt other way. They also have no-refund policy in place. But its just stupid to be surprised they banned your account after you steal their money.
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying.
And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game.
It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
You are really that stupid or you just playing it? Chargeback isnt ordinary way how to handle these situations. Its like you steal the game from them. Thats why you get banned. Normally you should contact company and they will refund you. I know its impossible to communicate with StarVault, so there wasnt other way. They also have no-refund policy in place. But its just stupid to be surprised they banned your account after you steal their money.
Hi.. did you actually read my post? if not, I've attached it below. Please read my first line again.. then perhaps reconsider your post?
I have no problem with them shutting down the acct... I did afterall chargeback and get my money refunded. I just find it funny that:
A) If I believe them about shipping, the box took over 2 months to reach me
They never responded to my support emails.. even this last one
C) If I hadn't notified them, my acct would probably still be active
Oh well, C'est la vie...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying. And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game. It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying. And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game. It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying. And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game. It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Just to chime in here... I agree it's becoming a "new norm" as you put it, but that could also be due to more and more companies puting out product, or even open beta before it's ready. To me it just seems like as of lately more mmo's are coming to open beta "buggier" and less polished. Just my opinion.
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it. What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course. What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Well.. just to be clear.. they said repeatedly that we did NOT buy access to the beta. We bought the game. I'm not talking about little figurines.
I can't speak for "people", just for myself... and I didn't start out wanting to charge anything back. I simply wanted an update. After being ignored by the company I asked for a refund. After being ignored AGAIN... I asked my charge card to get involved which they did. Sorry, but I wasn't about to allow them to take my money and hold it as long as they wanted while ignoring my attempts to contact them. Even a canned response would have been better than being ignored. That just pisses people off.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying. And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game. It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Just to chime in here... I agree it's becoming a "new norm" as you put it, but that could also be due to more and more companies puting out product, or even open beta before it's ready. To me it just seems like as of lately more mmo's are coming to open beta "buggier" and less polished. Just my opinion.
Yes, completely agree.
What has changed that people will pay money up front, for a product that they later don't like? And then want their money back?
Do you think you can buy a car, and later get your money back? or a meal: you didn't like the food, so you won't pay??
So if game companies are releasing shoddy products (not gonna argue that one ), why would anyone buy them? And why would they expect their money back?
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it. What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course. What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Well.. just to be clear.. they said repeatedly that we did NOT buy access to the beta. We bought the game. I'm not talking about little figurines.
I can't speak for "people", just for myself... and I didn't start out wanting to charge anything back. I simply wanted an update. After being ignored by the company I asked for a refund. After being ignored AGAIN... I asked my charge card to get involved which they did. Sorry, but I wasn't about to allow them to take my money and hold it as long as they wanted while ignoring my attempts to contact them. Even a canned response would have been better than being ignored. That just pisses people off.
On point one, you bought the game. You played the game all along, and decided to buy it. Why do you think you are due some money back? You don't like it now?
On point two, I am sympathetic. You did order a package, it did not come. But you can play the game without the package, so it is still unclear to me.
Yes, completely agree. What has changed that people will pay money up front, for a product that they later don't like? And then want their money back? Do you think you can buy a car, and later get your money back? or a meal: you didn't like the food, so you won't pay?? So if game companies are releasing shoddy products (not gonna argue that one ), why would anyone buy them? And why would they expect their money back?
OK.. this has been covered extensively elsewhere and I'm not going to start over... but in summary look at it this way. if you ordered ANY other product (Car, TV, Computer etc), they told you they expected it to ship at X time. Well.. X time passes.. and some extra weeks. Nothing ships. You try to contact the company. They never respond. You try again.. nothing. You send them a message (now pissed off) telling them you want a refund since they never responded to you. They still ignore you. Seems perfectly logical to then contact your card company and ask for a chargeback.
Anyhow, as I said.. this has been covered extensively.. so feel free to search for similar discussions.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
On point one, you bought the game. You played the game all along, and decided to buy it. Why do you think you are due some money back? You don't like it now? On point two, I am sympathetic. You did order a package, it did not come. But you can play the game without the package, so it is still unclear to me.
I bought a game.. not a beta.. I'm not a beta test kind of guy. For a description of my experience feel free to use search.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Yes, completely agree. What has changed that people will pay money up front, for a product that they later don't like? And then want their money back? Do you think you can buy a car, and later get your money back? or a meal: you didn't like the food, so you won't pay?? So if game companies are releasing shoddy products (not gonna argue that one ), why would anyone buy them? And why would they expect their money back?
OK.. this has been covered extensively elsewhere and I'm not going to start over... but in summary look at it this way. if you ordered ANY other product (Car, TV, Computer etc), they told you they expected it to ship at X time. Well.. X time passes.. and some extra weeks. Nothing ships. You try to contact the company. They never respond. You try again.. nothing. You send them a message (now pissed off) telling them you want a refund since they never responded to you. They still ignore you. Seems perfectly logical to then contact your card company and ask for a chargeback.
Anyhow, as I said.. this has been covered extensively.. so feel free to search for similar discussions.
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself.
Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
You realize they mailed it from Sweden. MAILED FROM SWEDEN. They don't call it snail mail for nothing. (No, they used normal mailing services. No FedEx and etc) Yes, the pond is bigger than you think.
[Mod Edit]
I run a booth at a flea market during weekends and I import products from all over the world using SNAIL MAIL- NEVER (and I repeat) NEVER does anything take more than 20 days to reach me using the cheapest possible method.... This being from the date of purchase till the date it reaches my hand.
Even (at most) the worst possible scenario being six to eight weeks from order placed to shipped and received (although this is not usually the case)-
Mail from Sweden sent in January should certainly arrive in Febuary OR it was never shipped in January.
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
You realize they mailed it from Sweden. MAILED FROM SWEDEN. They don't call it snail mail for nothing. (No, they used normal mailing services. No FedEx and etc) Yes, the pond is bigger than you think.
I have no idea how it was sent out... but feel free to visit the Swedish Postoffice for an idea on transit times to the US:
Just put in the US as the destination and a Malmo PostCode as the origin.. I used 20111
The longest delivery time I see is 7 working days. Again.. I have no idea what they used to send it.. but just sending it via regular Swedish post seems to only take 2 weeks... not 2 months...
But it's really a moot point.. I just found it to be another humorous facet to the whole StarVault/Mortal Online escapades... and I thought it very strange to receive a box after I received my money back over 2 months prior...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Now we are getting to the fun part You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk? So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
Please use search for the prior exact discussion
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
@slapshot: you've more than explained yourself on various occassions, and all quite reasonably. Slapshot, I'm satisfied w/ your explanations.
@olepi: I'm not sure what your intent is, but it seems you want to argue in a circular fasion w/out actually getting to the point. Honestly I don't know wether you're sincere or arguing just to argue, but frankly it's getting quite annoying.
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
This is what I am after, why would someone "preorder" a game?
Why would you put up good money, in advance?
And the practice is becoming a lot more common, with lots of people in MO and STO asking for their money back.
This is what I am after, why would someone "preorder" a game? Why would you put up good money, in advance? And the practice is becoming a lot more common, with lots of people in MO and STO asking for their money back.
Please use search as that exact topic has been discussed on multiple occassions.. or feel free to start your own thread.
This thread is not about discussing the reasons for someone to preorder a game
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself. Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
This is what I am after, why would someone "preorder" a game?
Why would you put up good money, in advance?
And the practice is becoming a lot more common, with lots of people in MO and STO asking for their money back.
I agree- Pre ordering games is actually hurting the industry as a whole... BUT so long as companies are using this tactic to get early cash flow, those companies have in effect sold a game and must live up to basic customer service or this will always be the result.
Over hyping and lying about the game will always get more pre orders but they must live up to the hype THEY have created...In this case they have failed on so many levels.
HOPEFULLY lessons are learned and pre ordering MMOs prior to beta bankrupts enough companies that the practice ends.
Comments
Heh.. I know what you're saying but there is zero chance I would ever give these guys my money again. When I have to go through my credit card company to get my money back because the company won't even respond to Emails..zero chance of ever getting a second shot.
Well considering what happened to you, you have every right to feel that way, and to voice your story to others as not only a warning to fellow gamers, but as a message to these "fly-by-night" indie companies who have high aspirations, but poor execution.
Chargeback isnt ordinary way how to handle these situations. Its like you steal the game from them. Thats why you get banned. Normally you should contact company and they will refund you. I know its impossible to communicate with StarVault, so there wasnt other way. They also have no-refund policy in place.
[Mod Edit]
_____________________________
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
It does seem kind of odd, all this haste to pay for something and then want to charge it back. I won't buy anything unless I know what I am buying.
And some on MMORPG.com seem to make a career out of bashing this game, and have a zero rating as a result, after they were banned for charge-back. I would hope that their accounts are disabled for the game.
It happened on STO too; lots of people trying to uncharge their sale. Seems weird to me, actually.
------------
2025: 48 years on the Net.
Hi.. did you actually read my post? if not, I've attached it below. Please read my first line again.. then perhaps reconsider your post?
I have no problem with them shutting down the acct... I did afterall chargeback and get my money refunded. I just find it funny that:
A) If I believe them about shipping, the box took over 2 months to reach me
C) If I hadn't notified them, my acct would probably still be active
Oh well, C'est la vie...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Just to chime in here... I agree it's becoming a "new norm" as you put it, but that could also be due to more and more companies puting out product, or even open beta before it's ready. To me it just seems like as of lately more mmo's are coming to open beta "buggier" and less polished. Just my opinion.
Well.. just to be clear.. they said repeatedly that we did NOT buy access to the beta. We bought the game. I'm not talking about little figurines.
I can't speak for "people", just for myself... and I didn't start out wanting to charge anything back. I simply wanted an update. After being ignored by the company I asked for a refund. After being ignored AGAIN... I asked my charge card to get involved which they did. Sorry, but I wasn't about to allow them to take my money and hold it as long as they wanted while ignoring my attempts to contact them. Even a canned response would have been better than being ignored. That just pisses people off.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
When you order something in July... that is supposed to be sent in Sept.. and it comes to the end of December and you haven't received it or received an email from the company about a delay.. you tend to start worrying. At this point, like most people I tried to contact them on multiple occassions to get an update. I never got a response..
I think at that point it's perfectly resonable to ask for a refund... and when no response is received from the company (again) to pursue it through your card company.
I don't see anything even slightly "weird" about that... /shrug
Well, just to be clear, you always had access to the game. You could always form an impression of the actual game, and buy it or not. You bought it.
What you are complaining about is the little figurines and bag, that have nothing to do with the actual game. You are correct there, the supplier of these items fell behind, and you got them late. Their communication could have been better, of course.
What I find "weird" is that people will pay for a game, MO or STO, up front, and then later they want to "charge it back". It is almost becoming a new norm.
Just to chime in here... I agree it's becoming a "new norm" as you put it, but that could also be due to more and more companies puting out product, or even open beta before it's ready. To me it just seems like as of lately more mmo's are coming to open beta "buggier" and less polished. Just my opinion.
Yes, completely agree.
What has changed that people will pay money up front, for a product that they later don't like? And then want their money back?
Do you think you can buy a car, and later get your money back? or a meal: you didn't like the food, so you won't pay??
So if game companies are releasing shoddy products (not gonna argue that one
), why would anyone buy them? And why would they expect their money back?
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Well.. just to be clear.. they said repeatedly that we did NOT buy access to the beta. We bought the game. I'm not talking about little figurines.
I can't speak for "people", just for myself... and I didn't start out wanting to charge anything back. I simply wanted an update. After being ignored by the company I asked for a refund. After being ignored AGAIN... I asked my charge card to get involved which they did. Sorry, but I wasn't about to allow them to take my money and hold it as long as they wanted while ignoring my attempts to contact them. Even a canned response would have been better than being ignored. That just pisses people off.
On point one, you bought the game. You played the game all along, and decided to buy it. Why do you think you are due some money back? You don't like it now?
On point two, I am sympathetic. You did order a package, it did not come. But you can play the game without the package, so it is still unclear to me.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
OK.. this has been covered extensively elsewhere and I'm not going to start over... but in summary look at it this way. if you ordered ANY other product (Car, TV, Computer etc), they told you they expected it to ship at X time. Well.. X time passes.. and some extra weeks. Nothing ships. You try to contact the company. They never respond. You try again.. nothing. You send them a message (now pissed off) telling them you want a refund since they never responded to you. They still ignore you. Seems perfectly logical to then contact your card company and ask for a chargeback.
Anyhow, as I said.. this has been covered extensively.. so feel free to search for similar discussions.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You realize they mailed it from Sweden. MAILED FROM SWEDEN. They don't call it snail mail for nothing.
(No, they used normal mailing services. No FedEx and etc)
Yes, the pond is bigger than you think.
Radix Malorum Est Cupiditas
I bought a game.. not a beta.. I'm not a beta test kind of guy. For a description of my experience feel free to use search.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
OK.. this has been covered extensively elsewhere and I'm not going to start over... but in summary look at it this way. if you ordered ANY other product (Car, TV, Computer etc), they told you they expected it to ship at X time. Well.. X time passes.. and some extra weeks. Nothing ships. You try to contact the company. They never respond. You try again.. nothing. You send them a message (now pissed off) telling them you want a refund since they never responded to you. They still ignore you. Seems perfectly logical to then contact your card company and ask for a chargeback.
Anyhow, as I said.. this has been covered extensively.. so feel free to search for similar discussions.
Yes, you bought a game. The game is delivered electronically. You received the game and played it. Based on your experience, you decided to buy the game. You were delivered the game. So you should not be able to charge-back the game itself.
Now you also ordered some material items, and they were not delivered. You are justified in asking for a refund for those items.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
[Mod Edit]
I run a booth at a flea market during weekends and I import products from all over the world using SNAIL MAIL- NEVER (and I repeat) NEVER does anything take more than 20 days to reach me using the cheapest possible method.... This being from the date of purchase till the date it reaches my hand.
Even (at most) the worst possible scenario being six to eight weeks from order placed to shipped and received (although this is not usually the case)-
Mail from Sweden sent in January should certainly arrive in Febuary OR it was never shipped in January.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
I have no idea how it was sent out... but feel free to visit the Swedish Postoffice for an idea on transit times to the US:
http://www.posten.se/logistik/foretag/leverera/tjanster/gb/sok_leveranstid.jspv
Just put in the US as the destination and a Malmo PostCode as the origin.. I used 20111
The longest delivery time I see is 7 working days. Again.. I have no idea what they used to send it.. but just sending it via regular Swedish post seems to only take 2 weeks... not 2 months...
But it's really a moot point.. I just found it to be another humorous facet to the whole StarVault/Mortal Online escapades... and I thought it very strange to receive a box after I received my money back over 2 months prior...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Please use search for the prior exact discussion
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
@slapshot: you've more than explained yourself on various occassions, and all quite reasonably. Slapshot, I'm satisfied w/ your explanations.
@olepi: I'm not sure what your intent is, but it seems you want to argue in a circular fasion w/out actually getting to the point. Honestly I don't know wether you're sincere or arguing just to argue, but frankly it's getting quite annoying.
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
This is what I am after, why would someone "preorder" a game?
Why would you put up good money, in advance?
And the practice is becoming a lot more common, with lots of people in MO and STO asking for their money back.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Honestly, it is weird it came so late, considering I ordered a package from japan 2 days ago, and got it today.
Please use search as that exact topic has been discussed on multiple occassions.. or feel free to start your own thread.
This thread is not about discussing the reasons for someone to preorder a game
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Huh? Maybe you misunderstand. I preordered the game when there was no open beta.. and just a few closed testers. I was in group A of the pre-orders... the only info we had was the powerpoint which looked great (and still does!). Besides the point... I'm not going to debate legalities with you as it's been done before... as I suggested.. please use search.
Now we are getting to the fun part
You pre-ordered (what does that actually mean?) based on what you imagined the future to be. Why would you do that, put actual money up? Is it because you felt the thrill of getting in on something early? The risk?
So take the risk. If you want to put money up for a "pre-order" then take the actual risk. Pay the money you said you would.
You people crack me up...Seriously.
There is no point debating the issue- These people have every right to a refund for a million reasons and thus they got one... If I "pre order" a game (I do not. Learned that lesson long ago) that was supposed to be released in 2009 and three months into 2010 it isnt out and I have not received my product, I would be entitled to a full refund. Period.
Thing is, there are ALOT of reasons for them to get refund beyond what was listed-
This is what I am after, why would someone "preorder" a game?
Why would you put up good money, in advance?
And the practice is becoming a lot more common, with lots of people in MO and STO asking for their money back.
I agree- Pre ordering games is actually hurting the industry as a whole... BUT so long as companies are using this tactic to get early cash flow, those companies have in effect sold a game and must live up to basic customer service or this will always be the result.
Over hyping and lying about the game will always get more pre orders but they must live up to the hype THEY have created...In this case they have failed on so many levels.
HOPEFULLY lessons are learned and pre ordering MMOs prior to beta bankrupts enough companies that the practice ends.