Doom, Diablo, The Sims, Elite, Dungeon Keeper, Half-Life, WoW, Harry Potter, StarCraft, C&C, Civ, Baldur's Gate...
These are great titles. Some of them are recognised as "great" by all, some - by some only. However, I doubt very much, that all of them (or even some of them) were created with the "let's make a super-hit" idea. The creators just had vision and luck, often both.
It is a capital mistake to theorise without data. (c)
Oh... they will rock the planet... oh no! they will fail utterly... oh... they provide so little info I am not convinced, as a consumer... 20+ pages of rubbish. Waste of server space
WoW is not that great. Neither are all the rest of the great games/titles. They just delivered (mildly) new experiences to the (new) crowds of gamers. All of them had something (or a lot of) "new" blended with quite regular features of the given genre.
They delivered new experiences to the gamers' brains, and that's what made them great. Peoples' brains like (new) experiences. Different brains like different experiences, and are quick to see "cloned" experiences that simply repeat the pattern without adding anything "interesting" / "new" / "inspiring".
So, the real question is... will TOR be able to inspire your brain, or not?
Your brain is clean of all the preconceptions, hasty judgement, previous bad experiences, etc. (that's what personality is for). It just wants some new experiences to crunch.
So, it is not the question of what you expect to happen, it is a question of what will happen, how it will play out. And that's the thing that no-one knows for sure. Even the creators.
P.S. You know, Bill Gates used to think that "640 k ought to be enough for anyone".
I think EA and Bioware have made a good bet with SW:TOR, and I'm still optimistic about it. For one, Bioware has had nothing but a string of hits. For two, despite all of the people saying that this will be a single player game with multiplayer tacked on, you have forgotten some of the ultra-successful multiplayer games Bioware has made - NWN, NWN2 and the BG series. All three were multiplayer, and NWN had persistent worlds made with their engine.
I am going to break my rule with SW:TOR and pre-order an MMO. I vowed never to do it again after the failure that was Hellgate:London. Bioware is in the same class as Blizzard, and when you buy a game from either, you know you will be getting a good game, even if it isn't your all time favorite it will be addictive.
In one last respect, I think they have a great chance for high subscription numbers due to the fact that there are a lot of hardcore World of Warcraft players that are sick of WoW. I canceled back in November simply because it just isn't fun anymore. I'm not planning on buying Cataclysm simply because I just don't care anymore. I've tried many different games in the last couple of months trying to find my WoW fix, and while I haven't found it yet, I still have no urge to go back to WoW. SW:TOR might well be exactly what I'm looking for.
For everyone saying storyline isn't important or isn't critical, remember that one of the most engaging parts of WoW is that it most definitely has a story. That's what feels missing in many MMOs - a sense of place, history, and a living, breathing world. SW:TOR will have a world, and I have no doubt that each location will feel as unique as they did in KOTOR, and the Mass Effect series. Bioware knows how to establish a story, a history, and make you feel like you are a part of it, and that's what made WoW feel so special. That's also what was missing from AoC, Warhammer and the many others that crashed and burned out of the gate.
Nobody commenting here seems to have a slightest idea on why WoW is a succes. I say: "you don't have to be good, you just have to be the best". It is as simple as that. WoW is the best MMO at this time. They have everything implemented the best way they could do (and they are very able in blizzard), not like some niche MMOs for PvPers only, or poor games with good graphics. They just covered everything. From PvP to PvE, from crafting to customisation, from proffessions to hobbys. It appeals to many people pecause everybody can find there something he want to go back to.
SWTOR just needs fun PvP, fun story, fun crafting, fun PvE, customisation and crafting done as good as they can. That, with some marketing will give them about 5-8m subscribers at some point in time. You can't compare SWTOR to MMOs that never even tried to compete with WoW. It was only PLYERS who hoped so. Now, it is a clear WoW competitor, the first one in the whole MMO history. And you are all mistaken if you think it is going to fail. At least if EA won't back it's support after 1 year.
Nobody commenting here seems to have a slightest idea on why WoW is a succes. I say: "you don't have to be good, you just have to be the best". It is as simple as that. WoW is the best MMO at this time. They have everything implemented the best way they could do (and they are very able in blizzard), not like some niche MMOs for PvPers only, or poor games with good graphics. They just covered everything. From PvP to PvE, from crafting to customisation, from proffessions to hobbys. It appeals to many people pecause everybody can find there something he want to go back to.
SWTOR just needs fun PvP, fun story, fun crafting, fun PvE, customisation and crafting done as good as they can. That, with some marketing will give them about 5-8m subscribers at some point in time. You can't compare SWTOR to MMOs that never even tried to compete with WoW. It was only PLYERS who hoped so. Now, it is a clear WoW competitor, the first one in the whole MMO history. And you are all mistaken if you think it is going to fail. At least if EA won't back it's support after 1 year.
rofl... thats what we call "a matter of opinion". Personally, I think WoW is one of the crappiest games I've ever played. So no, I wouldn't say its the best game out there at this time.
If you're a wow fanboi, thats fine, but there are those of us who aren't.
SWTOR shouldn't copy ANYTHING from WoW. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been WoW with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game WoW if they had a brain in their skull.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
Are you five years old?
No, Snaylor47 just owned your argument though. WoW is successful because there are many things it does right.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
Are you five years old?
No, Snaylor47 just owned your argument though. WoW is successful because there are many things it does right.
lol... uh huh.. wow is successful and all the games that have copied it have failed. So whats your point? The reason wow is still successful is because of all the people that joined back when it was created who haven't left yet. That doesn't mean he owned my argument. It means he's dismissing facts because he's a wow fanboi.
Nobody commenting here seems to have a slightest idea on why WoW is a succes. I say: "you don't have to be good, you just have to be the best". It is as simple as that. WoW is the best MMO at this time. They have everything implemented the best way they could do (and they are very able in blizzard), not like some niche MMOs for PvPers only, or poor games with good graphics. They just covered everything. From PvP to PvE, from crafting to customisation, from proffessions to hobbys. It appeals to many people pecause everybody can find there something he want to go back to.
SWTOR just needs fun PvP, fun story, fun crafting, fun PvE, customisation and crafting done as good as they can. That, with some marketing will give them about 5-8m subscribers at some point in time. You can't compare SWTOR to MMOs that never even tried to compete with WoW. It was only PLYERS who hoped so. Now, it is a clear WoW competitor, the first one in the whole MMO history. And you are all mistaken if you think it is going to fail. At least if EA won't back it's support after 1 year.
rofl... thats what we call "a matter of opinion". Personally, I think WoW is one of the crappiest games I've ever played. So no, I wouldn't say its the best game out there at this time.
If you're a wow fanboi, thats fine, but there are those of us who aren't.
SWTOR shouldn't copy ANYTHING from WoW. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been WoW with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game WoW if they had a brain in their skull.
"Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been WoW with different graphics."
I gues what you are saying is: "I played WoW for 5 years and I'm sick of it, please don't make another WoW". This is just silly... SWTOR is nothing like WoW, and only a biased person who played WoW all their life could say so. Or does stylised realism make you think so? Well, it shouldn't. There is not a single released information that makes SWTOR similar to WoW in any way. Or maybe you are trying to say that every game where combat system involves pressing buttons from 1 to 10 or mouse to use skills is a WoW clone? Well, that is strange because it seems like MMOs released before 2004 would be WoW clones too... Did they use a time-machine?
Calling me a WoW fanboi is funny as well. You can't divide people on wow-haters and wow-fanbois. You must deal with being a minority, thats all. People who play WoW ocasionally, still have a lot to explore there. And they probably don't even know about this site existance. You can't judge all player-base only by some poll results on a website or by your own preferences.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
Are you five years old?
No, Snaylor47 just owned your argument though. WoW is successful because there are many things it does right.
lol... uh huh.. wow is successful and all the games that have copied it have failed. So whats your point? The reason wow is still successful is because of all the people that joined back when it was created who haven't left yet. That doesn't mean he owned my argument. It means he's dismissing facts because he's a wow fanboi.
All the games that have come out since WoW have been rushed and hence crappy. Not many people would move from WoW to a worse game. That is why WoW has maintained its success against WoW "clones" even when such games had significant features that were beyond what WoW did. "Rushed games suck" is the lesson to be learned not "avoid all features that WoW has".
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
Are you five years old?
No, Snaylor47 just owned your argument though. WoW is successful because there are many things it does right.
lol... uh huh.. wow is successful and all the games that have copied it have failed. So whats your point? The reason wow is still successful is because of all the people that joined back when it was created who haven't left yet. That doesn't mean he owned my argument. It means he's dismissing facts because he's a wow fanboi.
All the games that have come out since WoW have been rushed and hence crappy. Not many people would move from WoW to a worse game. That is why WoW has maintained its success against WoW "clones" even when such games had significant features that were beyond what WoW did. "Rushed games suck" is the lesson to be learned not "avoid all features that WoW has".
Exactly. You can't say MMO is like WoW just because it's an MMO. WoW does not have many innovative features (if any) and it is just an ordinary MMO with every feature polished and released in a better state than any other MMOs did.
Comments
Doom, Diablo, The Sims, Elite, Dungeon Keeper, Half-Life, WoW, Harry Potter, StarCraft, C&C, Civ, Baldur's Gate...
These are great titles. Some of them are recognised as "great" by all, some - by some only. However, I doubt very much, that all of them (or even some of them) were created with the "let's make a super-hit" idea. The creators just had vision and luck, often both.
It is a capital mistake to theorise without data. (c)
Oh... they will rock the planet... oh no! they will fail utterly... oh... they provide so little info I am not convinced, as a consumer... 20+ pages of rubbish. Waste of server space
WoW is not that great. Neither are all the rest of the great games/titles. They just delivered (mildly) new experiences to the (new) crowds of gamers. All of them had something (or a lot of) "new" blended with quite regular features of the given genre.
They delivered new experiences to the gamers' brains, and that's what made them great. Peoples' brains like (new) experiences. Different brains like different experiences, and are quick to see "cloned" experiences that simply repeat the pattern without adding anything "interesting" / "new" / "inspiring".
So, the real question is... will TOR be able to inspire your brain, or not?
Your brain is clean of all the preconceptions, hasty judgement, previous bad experiences, etc. (that's what personality is for). It just wants some new experiences to crunch.
So, it is not the question of what you expect to happen, it is a question of what will happen, how it will play out. And that's the thing that no-one knows for sure. Even the creators.
P.S. You know, Bill Gates used to think that "640 k ought to be enough for anyone".
I think EA and Bioware have made a good bet with SW:TOR, and I'm still optimistic about it. For one, Bioware has had nothing but a string of hits. For two, despite all of the people saying that this will be a single player game with multiplayer tacked on, you have forgotten some of the ultra-successful multiplayer games Bioware has made - NWN, NWN2 and the BG series. All three were multiplayer, and NWN had persistent worlds made with their engine.
I am going to break my rule with SW:TOR and pre-order an MMO. I vowed never to do it again after the failure that was Hellgate:London. Bioware is in the same class as Blizzard, and when you buy a game from either, you know you will be getting a good game, even if it isn't your all time favorite it will be addictive.
In one last respect, I think they have a great chance for high subscription numbers due to the fact that there are a lot of hardcore World of Warcraft players that are sick of WoW. I canceled back in November simply because it just isn't fun anymore. I'm not planning on buying Cataclysm simply because I just don't care anymore. I've tried many different games in the last couple of months trying to find my WoW fix, and while I haven't found it yet, I still have no urge to go back to WoW. SW:TOR might well be exactly what I'm looking for.
For everyone saying storyline isn't important or isn't critical, remember that one of the most engaging parts of WoW is that it most definitely has a story. That's what feels missing in many MMOs - a sense of place, history, and a living, breathing world. SW:TOR will have a world, and I have no doubt that each location will feel as unique as they did in KOTOR, and the Mass Effect series. Bioware knows how to establish a story, a history, and make you feel like you are a part of it, and that's what made WoW feel so special. That's also what was missing from AoC, Warhammer and the many others that crashed and burned out of the gate.
Nobody commenting here seems to have a slightest idea on why WoW is a succes. I say: "you don't have to be good, you just have to be the best". It is as simple as that. WoW is the best MMO at this time. They have everything implemented the best way they could do (and they are very able in blizzard), not like some niche MMOs for PvPers only, or poor games with good graphics. They just covered everything. From PvP to PvE, from crafting to customisation, from proffessions to hobbys. It appeals to many people pecause everybody can find there something he want to go back to.
SWTOR just needs fun PvP, fun story, fun crafting, fun PvE, customisation and crafting done as good as they can. That, with some marketing will give them about 5-8m subscribers at some point in time. You can't compare SWTOR to MMOs that never even tried to compete with WoW. It was only PLYERS who hoped so. Now, it is a clear WoW competitor, the first one in the whole MMO history. And you are all mistaken if you think it is going to fail. At least if EA won't back it's support after 1 year.
rofl... thats what we call "a matter of opinion". Personally, I think WoW is one of the crappiest games I've ever played. So no, I wouldn't say its the best game out there at this time.
If you're a wow fanboi, thats fine, but there are those of us who aren't.
SWTOR shouldn't copy ANYTHING from WoW. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been WoW with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game WoW if they had a brain in their skull.
WoW shouldn't copy ANYTHING from EQ. Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been EQ with different graphics. And nearly every single one of them failed almost as soon as they opened.
The bright person would learn from that and NOT make their game EQ if they had a brain in their skull.
I don't care about innovation I care about fun.
Are you five years old?
No, Snaylor47 just owned your argument though. WoW is successful because there are many things it does right.
lol... uh huh.. wow is successful and all the games that have copied it have failed. So whats your point? The reason wow is still successful is because of all the people that joined back when it was created who haven't left yet. That doesn't mean he owned my argument. It means he's dismissing facts because he's a wow fanboi.
"Nearly every single game thats been released in the past 5 years has been WoW with different graphics."
I gues what you are saying is: "I played WoW for 5 years and I'm sick of it, please don't make another WoW". This is just silly... SWTOR is nothing like WoW, and only a biased person who played WoW all their life could say so. Or does stylised realism make you think so? Well, it shouldn't. There is not a single released information that makes SWTOR similar to WoW in any way. Or maybe you are trying to say that every game where combat system involves pressing buttons from 1 to 10 or mouse to use skills is a WoW clone? Well, that is strange because it seems like MMOs released before 2004 would be WoW clones too... Did they use a time-machine?
Calling me a WoW fanboi is funny as well. You can't divide people on wow-haters and wow-fanbois. You must deal with being a minority, thats all. People who play WoW ocasionally, still have a lot to explore there. And they probably don't even know about this site existance. You can't judge all player-base only by some poll results on a website or by your own preferences.
All the games that have come out since WoW have been rushed and hence crappy. Not many people would move from WoW to a worse game. That is why WoW has maintained its success against WoW "clones" even when such games had significant features that were beyond what WoW did. "Rushed games suck" is the lesson to be learned not "avoid all features that WoW has".
Exactly. You can't say MMO is like WoW just because it's an MMO. WoW does not have many innovative features (if any) and it is just an ordinary MMO with every feature polished and released in a better state than any other MMOs did.