Ha, you think I'm a grinder. You are one of those people who is confused. The problem with darkfall is not grind, its balance. If proper balance was attained then there would be less grind because you'd be able to do more with less. You'd be competitive with a single magic school to 100, have a slight edge with a little more, but having more than a "complete build" would be redundant. Balance fixes the grind problem by requiring you to have less skills, or going after more powerful ones, balance makes everyone happy by allowing people who want it all and like grind to still do it without screwing up PvP balance.
Balance my friend, is all that darkfall lacks right now.
You have some great ideas xpiher, and I think with this approach most people would be content with the game. Hopefully AV is listening and are receptive to what you are saying.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
After reading just a few of your over 10,000 posts on forumfall and your posts here on this board, and noticing that they all usually refer back to what I've highlighted here, I've come to the conclusion that you are in fact insane (and most people on forumfall seem to agree and almost uniformly want you to just...stop...posting...)
Haha this is true.
Sadly he belives he is helping Darkfall with his formulas and guides to reduce the grind. Infact he does more harm to Darkfall than a thousand newbie killers. If we the players could tell AV with one voice there was to much grind, we wouldn`t need formulas, guides, friends healing and casting haste, AFK swimming, macroing and other things to be able to play this game.
Now AV are cought in the middle with grinders on one side and pvpers on the other side. The grinders carrot is an endless grind, and the pvpers carrot is a competitive char.I just hope AV would listen to the ones who want more players to the game.
Ha, you think I'm a grinder. You are one of those people who is confused. The problem with darkfall is not grind, its balance. If proper balance was attained then there would be less grind because you'd be able to do more with less. You'd be competitive with a single magic school to 100, have a slight edge with a little more, but having more than a "complete build" would be redundant. Balance fixes the grind problem by requiring you to have less skills, or going after more powerful ones, balance makes everyone happy by allowing people who want it all and like grind to still do it without screwing up PvP balance.
Balance my friend, is all that darkfall lacks right now.
Good idea. With your second post on that page too, i can finally see that you are with us. Maybe you got burnt out in game because of that stupid grind. I know i know!, you dont want to reduce the grind, you only want to allow the GM to allow us to AFK macro out side town. At the end, we all come down to what we all want. Reduce the time we have to spend on grinding in front of the screen and allow us to play the game instead.
The only reason I support afk macroing is because it does nothing to hurt the game, as I've tried to explain to anti-marocers and others. Also, the time and cost investment is perfect, but actively leveling those skill is boring. It also allows casuals to catch up quicker and turns cities into raiding hot spots again.
Originally posted by Cecropia
Originally posted by xpiher
Ha, you think I'm a grinder. You are one of those people who is confused. The problem with darkfall is not grind, its balance. If proper balance was attained then there would be less grind because you'd be able to do more with less. You'd be competitive with a single magic school to 100, have a slight edge with a little more, but having more than a "complete build" would be redundant. Balance fixes the grind problem by requiring you to have less skills, or going after more powerful ones, balance makes everyone happy by allowing people who want it all and like grind to still do it without screwing up PvP balance.
Balance my friend, is all that darkfall lacks right now.
You have some great ideas xpiher, and I think with this approach most people would be content with the game. Hopefully AV is listening and are receptive to what you are saying.
Balance my friend, is all that darkfall lacks right now.
Understanding what would make PvP balanced differs so much between players, that AV can't really please everybody.
We constantly hear about overpowered mounted combat, overpowered high level armors, etc. - but from my experience there are very few players who mount up to fight or wear full infernal sets instead of bone armor.
One of most famous / infamous DF players on EU server, Ginger Magician just left DF few weeks ago citing overpowered magic. With his 380 unbuffed HP and infernal armor he wasn't able to defeat mages casting Eye Rot and knockback spells.
IMO with less grind we wouldn't have discussions about balance. For example: specializations don't require grinding - so for 2k you can find out yourself if "destroyer" is really OP or not. I wish that skills / stats would work in similar way
It sounds to me like you are not looking at the bigger picture. Stop looking at the game's numbers and put on headphones and RP a little . ..!!
If there were more (read: some) RP or sandbox elements, I would probably be doing this. But there's no systems in place for RPing. The game is (obviously) centered around PVP and I didn't feel competative after a month of hard grinding. If I can't play the main focus of a game after a month of hard grinding, and not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel for another 2 months, then I'm going to quit. Darkfall is the only game in the history of MMORPGs to make you grind hard for 3 months before really playing it. You can skirt around the issue all you want, but the elephant in the room remains. I can "make my own fun" in any game and I see no reason to be forced to do it in a game where I am barred from the main focus of the game for months on end. Why do that when I can play any other game and and be playing the focus of the game and enjoy all the game's strengths, while RPing on top of it for added fun, instead of the only fun?
In better news, PotBS seems pretty cool. Slower and more strategically based PVP, but it has good PVE and some unique elements (you can also be very competative in PVP after only a month of playing).
Man why these troll/haters keep comming to this Darkfall forum is beyond me why you haters are so agains Darkfall and feel the need to spread negative views about Darkfall like OP is doing?
If you wanne be uber in few weeks go play some themepark this game real ain't for you my friend, move on nothing for you here:P
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009..... In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
Man why these troll/haters keep comming to this Darkfall forum is beyond me why you haters are so agains Darkfall and feel the need to spread negative views about Darkfall like OP is doing?
If you wanne be uber in few weeks go play some themepark this game real ain't for you my friend, move on nothing for you here:P
There is nothing wrong with a healthy discussion about improving the game. Just because you do not agree, does not mean everyone else is a troll. If you supress other people's opinions, then you opinion is also null and void. Quit trolling the people and get back on the issue that is being discussed in this topic.
Man why these troll/haters keep comming to this Darkfall forum is beyond me why you haters are so agains Darkfall and feel the need to spread negative views about Darkfall like OP is doing?
If you wanne be uber in few weeks go play some themepark this game real ain't for you my friend, move on nothing for you here:P
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently. So many potential players have left (despite REALLY loving it at first) because of glaring design flaws in the game. We post in the hopes that AV will take appropriate action towards fixing the problem and actually start retaining players rather than losing the vast majority after about 3 months.
Most of us truly love Darkfall for almost everything it provides. We love FFA full-loot PvP. We love the huge open world. We love the sea combat, the freedom, the sandbox elements. We just hate the grind. It is killing this game in my opinion and it would be a travesty if we simply gave up and let it die at the hands of the grind-defenders.
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
I will admit I don't have official numbers to back up my claim. This is because AV has not released any. I'm sure that is not because the game is doing so wonderfully...
I will admit that I could certainly be wrong about the impending demise of Darkfall, but my personal observation has been that almost every new player quits about 3 months in. That was when all my RL friends and the buddies we made online quit. That is when holdenhamlet came to the realization he could not continue. That is around the time that countless others on these forums have quit. Even the most avid defenders of the game are leaving over time... which begs the question: who exactly will be left to defend the grind once everyone has quit because of it?
Again, these are just observations and if AV releases numbers contrary to this, I will happily concede the point. My bet is they will not... because that probably just isn't the reality of the situation.
And to answer your question, I have not played in about 3 weeks. I held out much longer than any of my friends, but I can't devote my entire life to this game. So I will just devote a little time on the forums while I am at work.
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
There are 18 ! starter citys on Darkfall's Agon. Meaning there was 90 - 108 ppl in the specific time you was online and active alone on a starter city. And we have also 6 capitals, around 6 chaos cities and 98 player controlled citys/hamlets where most of non starter players reside.
Also most trading happen inbetween alliance, need to watch Clan Aliiance chat tab for that.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
There are 18 ! starter citys on Darkfall's Agon. Meaning there was 90 - 108 ppl in the specific time you was online and active alone on a starter city. And we have also 6 capitals, around 6 chaos cities and 98 player controlled citys/hamlets.
Also most trading happen inbetween alliance, need to watch Clan Aliiance chat tab for that.
Trolls don't like logic, stop scaring them.
They're too used to linear games that funnel everyone into the same zone at the same time rather than an actual virtual world.
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
There are 18 ! starter citys on Darkfall's Agon. Meaning there was 90 - 108 ppl in the specific time you was online and active alone on a starter city. And we have also 6 capitals, around 6 chaos cities and 98 player controlled citys/hamlets where most of non starter players reside.
Also most trading happen inbetween alliance, need to watch Clan Aliiance chat tab for that.
Thats exactly what I mean. Those numbers are extremely low for such a large geographical landmass, not to say the game overall.
So if we have around 400-800 people loged on at the same time, but they are spread out over such a large area that you can see 4-5 in the city at most is not a good sign. If you wan't to have a 100-200 people siege, as it was said on a numerous occasions, that means roughly 1/4th of a world pop gathers up for a big fight.
It reminds me of what Planetside started going through a year ago - a slow but steady decline. I dont know why you guys are saying these numbers are OK with you. I mean, wouldn't you want to have large sieges more often?
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently...
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
There are 18 ! starter citys on Darkfall's Agon. Meaning there was 90 - 108 ppl in the specific time you was online and active alone on a starter city. And we have also 6 capitals, around 6 chaos cities and 98 player controlled citys/hamlets.
Also most trading happen inbetween alliance, need to watch Clan Aliiance chat tab for that.
Trolls don't like logic, stop scaring them.
They're too used to linear games that funnel everyone into the same zone at the same time rather than an actual virtual world.
Address the point of the post, start your own post or do not post at all. Its that simple.
They're too used to linear games that funnel everyone into the same zone at the same time rather than an actual virtual world.
Come on, we are not trolls because some of us want more pvpers in Darkfall. To make DF work we need loads of pvpers, but we don`t need any grinders. I bet some of the grinders feel they are playing Darkfall when they kill NPCs on a descolate island. Newsflash...you don`t.
The sand in a pvp sandbox as Darkfall are the pvpers. They shape the world, the politics, the battles and the pvp. And yes, we are few left, just look at the forums. We have 20% of the population from the first months. Face it, we have tried the heavy boring grind for a year and it doesn`t work. You can look at the numbers yourself at Urme. EU1 have 2450 active clan players, and the serverwars can field 300 players. I`m so fucking tired of grinders telling we have loads of players in Darkfall. WTF kind of mmo did you play if you think the numbers in Darkfall are fine?
I bet some of you grinders think Urme is wrong, because you are not listed as active and you are online every day. Urme is right, because you are just as active as an AFK swimmer. You are not the sand in this pvp sandbox. You are just a vocal grind defender, and your actions are stopping us from getting the real players we need.
Ohh and we are the themepark players? You are the player that defend a neverending hunt for levels and skill. Name one full-loot pvp mmo with the grind olike a korean themepark mmo, just one.
Comments
You have some great ideas xpiher, and I think with this approach most people would be content with the game. Hopefully AV is listening and are receptive to what you are saying.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
The only reason I support afk macroing is because it does nothing to hurt the game, as I've tried to explain to anti-marocers and others. Also, the time and cost investment is perfect, but actively leveling those skill is boring. It also allows casuals to catch up quicker and turns cities into raiding hot spots again.
Originally posted by Cecropia
You have some great ideas xpiher, and I think with this approach most people would be content with the game. Hopefully AV is listening and are receptive to what you are saying.
I hope so
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Understanding what would make PvP balanced differs so much between players, that AV can't really please everybody.
We constantly hear about overpowered mounted combat, overpowered high level armors, etc. - but from my experience there are very few players who mount up to fight or wear full infernal sets instead of bone armor.
One of most famous / infamous DF players on EU server, Ginger Magician just left DF few weeks ago citing overpowered magic. With his 380 unbuffed HP and infernal armor he wasn't able to defeat mages casting Eye Rot and knockback spells.
IMO with less grind we wouldn't have discussions about balance. For example: specializations don't require grinding - so for 2k you can find out yourself if "destroyer" is really OP or not. I wish that skills / stats would work in similar way
It sounds to me like you are not looking at the bigger picture. Stop looking at the game's numbers and put on headphones and RP a little . ..!!
If there were more (read: some) RP or sandbox elements, I would probably be doing this. But there's no systems in place for RPing. The game is (obviously) centered around PVP and I didn't feel competative after a month of hard grinding. If I can't play the main focus of a game after a month of hard grinding, and not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel for another 2 months, then I'm going to quit. Darkfall is the only game in the history of MMORPGs to make you grind hard for 3 months before really playing it. You can skirt around the issue all you want, but the elephant in the room remains. I can "make my own fun" in any game and I see no reason to be forced to do it in a game where I am barred from the main focus of the game for months on end. Why do that when I can play any other game and and be playing the focus of the game and enjoy all the game's strengths, while RPing on top of it for added fun, instead of the only fun?
In better news, PotBS seems pretty cool. Slower and more strategically based PVP, but it has good PVE and some unique elements (you can also be very competative in PVP after only a month of playing).
Man why these troll/haters keep comming to this Darkfall forum is beyond me why you haters are so agains Darkfall and feel the need to spread negative views about Darkfall like OP is doing?
If you wanne be uber in few weeks go play some themepark this game real ain't for you my friend, move on nothing for you here:P
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
There is nothing wrong with a healthy discussion about improving the game. Just because you do not agree, does not mean everyone else is a troll. If you supress other people's opinions, then you opinion is also null and void. Quit trolling the people and get back on the issue that is being discussed in this topic.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
We are trying to improve the game because it is dying currently. So many potential players have left (despite REALLY loving it at first) because of glaring design flaws in the game. We post in the hopes that AV will take appropriate action towards fixing the problem and actually start retaining players rather than losing the vast majority after about 3 months.
Most of us truly love Darkfall for almost everything it provides. We love FFA full-loot PvP. We love the huge open world. We love the sea combat, the freedom, the sandbox elements. We just hate the grind. It is killing this game in my opinion and it would be a travesty if we simply gave up and let it die at the hands of the grind-defenders.
How kind of you, you're really a stand-up guy. Do you have any proof of this incoming death? I was under the impression that as far as we could all tell, the game has been growing at slow pace for awhile. This is not "dying" in my opinion, but please enlighten me if you can. Or was this remark intended merely as a kind prophecy you wanted to share with us all here at the site?
BTW when was the last time you played?
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
I will admit I don't have official numbers to back up my claim. This is because AV has not released any. I'm sure that is not because the game is doing so wonderfully...
I will admit that I could certainly be wrong about the impending demise of Darkfall, but my personal observation has been that almost every new player quits about 3 months in. That was when all my RL friends and the buddies we made online quit. That is when holdenhamlet came to the realization he could not continue. That is around the time that countless others on these forums have quit. Even the most avid defenders of the game are leaving over time... which begs the question: who exactly will be left to defend the grind once everyone has quit because of it?
Again, these are just observations and if AV releases numbers contrary to this, I will happily concede the point. My bet is they will not... because that probably just isn't the reality of the situation.
And to answer your question, I have not played in about 3 weeks. I held out much longer than any of my friends, but I can't devote my entire life to this game. So I will just devote a little time on the forums while I am at work.
The proof is in the players that played the game and saw very few people on... I played on EU 2 months ago and I saw at most 5-6 people at the same time in the starting city. Even the trade channel is fairly inactive - with 4-5 participants at a time. What more proof do you need?
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
There are 18 ! starter citys on Darkfall's Agon. Meaning there was 90 - 108 ppl in the specific time you was online and active alone on a starter city. And we have also 6 capitals, around 6 chaos cities and 98 player controlled citys/hamlets where most of non starter players reside.
Also most trading happen inbetween alliance, need to watch Clan Aliiance chat tab for that.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Trolls don't like logic, stop scaring them.
They're too used to linear games that funnel everyone into the same zone at the same time rather than an actual virtual world.
Thats exactly what I mean. Those numbers are extremely low for such a large geographical landmass, not to say the game overall.
So if we have around 400-800 people loged on at the same time, but they are spread out over such a large area that you can see 4-5 in the city at most is not a good sign. If you wan't to have a 100-200 people siege, as it was said on a numerous occasions, that means roughly 1/4th of a world pop gathers up for a big fight.
It reminds me of what Planetside started going through a year ago - a slow but steady decline. I dont know why you guys are saying these numbers are OK with you. I mean, wouldn't you want to have large sieges more often?
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Address the point of the post, start your own post or do not post at all. Its that simple.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Come on, we are not trolls because some of us want more pvpers in Darkfall. To make DF work we need loads of pvpers, but we don`t need any grinders. I bet some of the grinders feel they are playing Darkfall when they kill NPCs on a descolate island. Newsflash...you don`t.
The sand in a pvp sandbox as Darkfall are the pvpers. They shape the world, the politics, the battles and the pvp. And yes, we are few left, just look at the forums. We have 20% of the population from the first months. Face it, we have tried the heavy boring grind for a year and it doesn`t work. You can look at the numbers yourself at Urme. EU1 have 2450 active clan players, and the serverwars can field 300 players. I`m so fucking tired of grinders telling we have loads of players in Darkfall. WTF kind of mmo did you play if you think the numbers in Darkfall are fine?
I bet some of you grinders think Urme is wrong, because you are not listed as active and you are online every day. Urme is right, because you are just as active as an AFK swimmer. You are not the sand in this pvp sandbox. You are just a vocal grind defender, and your actions are stopping us from getting the real players we need.
Ohh and we are the themepark players? You are the player that defend a neverending hunt for levels and skill. Name one full-loot pvp mmo with the grind olike a korean themepark mmo, just one.