Also agree with the second comment. Star Trek IP shouldn't really have been developed as a niche product. Although popularity took a nose dive with Enterprise, starting mid Voyager. Star Wars has a much higher fan base, even post the prequals. SWG at launch had in the region of 600k subs, which fell to 250-300k in the months following.
Where did you ever get the crazy idea that STO was developed as a "niche product"? It was developed with the mainstream market in mind all the way. In fact Zinc went out of his way to emphasize that many many times in various interviews if one was paying attention. Unfortunately Cryptic has shown that they have very little idea what main stream mmo gamers want and like. With the decisions they made with STO they clearly showed that they are even more out of touch with what it takes to make a good mmo now than they were when they made CoH. It's actually one of the few things they did get right. They knew that Star Trek fans would never be able to carry a mmo. Not the kinds of ST fans most people mean when they're talking about the game being made for ST fans anyway.
And uh no SWG did not EVER have 600K subs. It's peak subs were just slightly under 300K the first paid month after release (this after selling just over 800K copies), and after a couple of steady months it was a decline from then on. A decline that was so steady and marked that it necessitated them having to finally come to the decision to make wholesale changes. The decision was the right one, but made way too late.
Hey there Hagon! And so we continue our crusade here you know me ftom BOK and obviously must remember me as one of the more outspoken critics of cryptic sand sto pre beta.
Anyways I am posting to confirm what Hagon said about swg. Heres proof http://rubenfield.com/?p=86 a dev for swg mentions there they had around 200k subs and felt it was a failure for swg thus prompting the nge.
Also agree with the second comment. Star Trek IP shouldn't really have been developed as a niche product. Although popularity took a nose dive with Enterprise, starting mid Voyager. Star Wars has a much higher fan base, even post the prequals. SWG at launch had in the region of 600k subs, which fell to 250-300k in the months following.
Where did you ever get the crazy idea that STO was developed as a "niche product"?
And uh no SWG did not EVER have 600K subs. It's peak subs were just slightly under 300K the first paid month after release (this after selling just over 800K copies), and after a couple of steady months it was a decline from then on. A decline that was so steady and marked that it necessitated them having to finally come to the decision to make wholesale changes. The decision was the right one, but made way too late.
lol I agree with Hag... Niche? ST is about as mainstream as SC-Fi gets and Cryptic clearly had their eye on the big time with it all through their promotion.
And as for SWG... I have always said that if as many people actually played it that now complain about the NGE, there wouldnt have ever had to be a NGE...
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thinking they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thing they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Well doen OP!
All you can do now is recoup that 300 bucks and try to pretend this whole thing never happened. After I saw the thread about season patch 1.1 by cipher nemo, I just had to shed a tear. Cipher Nemo has long been a defender of Cryptic and STO so far, but to see him critisize STO like this tickles me.
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thing they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Well doen OP!
All you can do now is recoup that 300 bucks and try to pretend this whole thing never happened. After I saw the thread about season patch 1.1 by cipher nemo, I just had to shed a tear. Cipher Nemo has long been a defender of Cryptic and STO so far, but to see him critisize STO like this tickles me.
Cryptic needs to find a way to convince Atari to bring in some hired guns to fix this mess. I think Atari/Infogamres doesn't cares much about their reputation or Cryptic's.
I think in addition to bad business decisions by the leadership, the development schedule is starting to take a toll on the development teams and now they're starting to miss deadlines when they've already given themselves a 2-3 week window. The latest stf and the crafting changes aren't even on tribble and they were supposed to go live this week. Although if the 1.1 update is any indication, it would have been a buggy/half finished mess anyways.
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thing they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Well doen OP!
All you can do now is recoup that 300 bucks and try to pretend this whole thing never happened. After I saw the thread about season patch 1.1 by cipher nemo, I just had to shed a tear. Cipher Nemo has long been a defender of Cryptic and STO so far, but to see him critisize STO like this tickles me.
Cryptic needs to find a way to convince Atari to bring in some hired guns to fix this mess. I think Atari/Infogamres doesn't cares much about their reputation or Cryptic's.
How is anyone supposed to fix it? There's so little game there that there's no simple or easy way to fix any of it. Literally it would require a year or more of work and that would require additional funding since the subs certainly won't cover it.
How is anyone supposed to fix it? There's so little game there that there's no simple or easy way to fix any of it. Literally it would require a year or more of work and that would require additional funding since the subs certainly won't cover it.
I am of the firm belief that they need to make a new engine for it from scratch, if they want to actually save it. Of course, they would also need to get rid of the Cryptic executive team before that would work.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
How is anyone supposed to fix it? There's so little game there that there's no simple or easy way to fix any of it. Literally it would require a year or more of work and that would require additional funding since the subs certainly won't cover it.
I am of the firm belief that they need to make a new engine for it from scratch, if they want to actually save it. Of course, they would also need to get rid of the Cryptic executive team before that would work.
Cryptic really need to ditch the tiny shoe-box instance everything engine CO and STO uses but its never going to happen. I'd even bet good money there next game is gonna use the same engine as well.
How is anyone supposed to fix it? There's so little game there that there's no simple or easy way to fix any of it. Literally it would require a year or more of work and that would require additional funding since the subs certainly won't cover it.
I am of the firm belief that they need to make a new engine for it from scratch, if they want to actually save it. Of course, they would also need to get rid of the Cryptic executive team before that would work.
Cryptic really need to ditch the tiny shoe-box instance everything engine CO and STO uses but its never going to happen. I'd even bet good money there next game is gonna use the same engine as well.
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thing they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Well doen OP!
All you can do now is recoup that 300 bucks and try to pretend this whole thing never happened. After I saw the thread about season patch 1.1 by cipher nemo, I just had to shed a tear. Cipher Nemo has long been a defender of Cryptic and STO so far, but to see him critisize STO like this tickles me.
I had a bad feeling about the game from the start. So, I refused to pay for it, even when my brother and a mate had bought it and were playing it, bugging me to play it. I finally caved in and set forth one rule: "You buy it for me, I'll play it." We played for a week, had fun in space but hated the ground segments, then got bored. The rest of our month wasted away with us not even touching it. They still like it. I still refuse to pay.
Thank frick for the MMORPG forums :P
MMO's played: Ragnarok Online (For years), WoW (for a few weeks only), Guild Wars, Lineage 2, Eve, Allods, Shattered Galaxy, 9 Dragons, City of Heroes, City of Villains, Star Trek Online (Got someone ELSE to pay for it), Champions Online (Someone else paid), Dofus, Dragonica, LOTRO, DDO and more... A LOT more. I've played good AND bad. The bad didn't last long. :P
I had a bad feeling about the game from the start. So, I refused to pay for it, even when my brother and a mate had bought it and were playing it, bugging me to play it. I finally caved in and set forth one rule: "You buy it for me, I'll play it." We played for a week, had fun in space but hated the ground segments, then got bored. The rest of our month wasted away with us not even touching it. They still like it. I still refuse to pay.
Thank frick for the MMORPG forums :P
You're welcome. Glad we saved someone from wasting their money.
For those who say "why complain about a game you're not even playing?" There is your answer - to help out a few fellow players.
I have certainly thrown a ton of money away on bad games in the past. Some help like this would have spared me some of that waste,
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I had a bad feeling about the game from the start. So, I refused to pay for it, even when my brother and a mate had bought it and were playing it, bugging me to play it. I finally caved in and set forth one rule: "You buy it for me, I'll play it." We played for a week, had fun in space but hated the ground segments, then got bored. The rest of our month wasted away with us not even touching it. They still like it. I still refuse to pay.
Thank frick for the MMORPG forums :P
You're welcome. Glad we saved someone from wasting their money.
For those who say "why complain about a game you're not even playing?" There is your answer - to help out a few fellow players.
I have certainly thrown a ton of money away on bad games in the past. Some help like this would have spared me some of that waste,
Sending a message to grubby little companies like Cryptic that releasing a rushed product is not going to fly anymore dosen't hurt either
I swear every section of Cryptic is as incompetent as the others. Even the fanbots know they have no prayer of getting 5 people to buy this turd, much less subscribe past the first month.
I swear every section of Cryptic is as incompetent as the others. Even the fanbots know they have no prayer of getting 5 people to buy this turd, much less subscribe past the first month.
oh wow darth, maybe its just me but that seems like a new low. could u start a thread with that link?
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
I swear every section of Cryptic is as incompetent as the others. Even the fanbots know they have no prayer of getting 5 people to buy this turd, much less subscribe past the first month.
oh wow darth, maybe its just me but that seems like a new low. could u start a thread with that link?
It's comical how you're constantly seeing people vehemently defending Cryptic and the game one day, and then in the next day or two, or a week later, you see the exact same person throw up a "straw that broke the camel's back" thread, and they finally list all the things wrong with the game.
I'll play this game if it's F2P, and it seems to be rapidly approaching that. But it doesn't seem worth paying monthly for this type of so-called MMO game.
It's comical how you're constantly seeing people vehemently defending Cryptic and the game one day, and then in the next day or two, or a week later, you see the exact same person throw up a "straw that broke the camel's back" thread, and they finally list all the things wrong with the game.
Its sad when this is more entertaining than the actual game
I'll play this game if it's F2P, and it seems to be rapidly approaching that. But it doesn't seem worth paying monthly for this type of so-called MMO game.
ive said before this might be a f2p sooon, that might go hand in hand with how there stocking so much stuff in the c-store as fast as they can?
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
Comments
Hey there Hagon! And so we continue our crusade here you know me ftom BOK and obviously must remember me as one of the more outspoken critics of cryptic sand sto pre beta.
Anyways I am posting to confirm what Hagon said about swg. Heres proof http://rubenfield.com/?p=86 a dev for swg mentions there they had around 200k subs and felt it was a failure for swg thus prompting the nge.
lol I agree with Hag... Niche? ST is about as mainstream as SC-Fi gets and Cryptic clearly had their eye on the big time with it all through their promotion.
And as for SWG... I have always said that if as many people actually played it that now complain about the NGE, there wouldnt have ever had to be a NGE...
Well OP !
Looks like you are right... I am a lifer and i am now after this Season 1.1 ..Trash .... finshed with this game.
I am so F'ed off that i spent $300 on this trash... and it only gets better .... with every Patch!
... I Kept thinking they are going to fix things ... Keep supporting them .... I dont want to be anywhere close to anything these guys make in my life again.
I will be watch for those two guys ... Roper & Zinc.. whatever.... if i see them on a game or dev team ... i will take a wide berth...!
Well doen OP!
All you can do now is recoup that 300 bucks and try to pretend this whole thing never happened. After I saw the thread about season patch 1.1 by cipher nemo, I just had to shed a tear. Cipher Nemo has long been a defender of Cryptic and STO so far, but to see him critisize STO like this tickles me.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=154218
Hmm..
I see quite a few lifers have turned off there blue names... I would also do the same now but i am not even going back to comment!
The fact is that right now...by having a Blue name ..you might as well be called a SUCKER...!
I am so Pissed ...!
Cryptic needs to find a way to convince Atari to bring in some hired guns to fix this mess. I think Atari/Infogamres doesn't cares much about their reputation or Cryptic's.
I think in addition to bad business decisions by the leadership, the development schedule is starting to take a toll on the development teams and now they're starting to miss deadlines when they've already given themselves a 2-3 week window. The latest stf and the crafting changes aren't even on tribble and they were supposed to go live this week. Although if the 1.1 update is any indication, it would have been a buggy/half finished mess anyways.
How is anyone supposed to fix it? There's so little game there that there's no simple or easy way to fix any of it. Literally it would require a year or more of work and that would require additional funding since the subs certainly won't cover it.
I am of the firm belief that they need to make a new engine for it from scratch, if they want to actually save it. Of course, they would also need to get rid of the Cryptic executive team before that would work.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Cryptic really need to ditch the tiny shoe-box instance everything engine CO and STO uses but its never going to happen. I'd even bet good money there next game is gonna use the same engine as well.
If they even get a next game.
i love it..... he uses my favorite cryptic burn..... "some people just dont get it"
im so in love with that quote.... because craptic did it to themselves.
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
I had a bad feeling about the game from the start. So, I refused to pay for it, even when my brother and a mate had bought it and were playing it, bugging me to play it. I finally caved in and set forth one rule: "You buy it for me, I'll play it." We played for a week, had fun in space but hated the ground segments, then got bored. The rest of our month wasted away with us not even touching it. They still like it. I still refuse to pay.
Thank frick for the MMORPG forums :P
MMO's played: Ragnarok Online (For years), WoW (for a few weeks only), Guild Wars, Lineage 2, Eve, Allods, Shattered Galaxy, 9 Dragons, City of Heroes, City of Villains, Star Trek Online (Got someone ELSE to pay for it), Champions Online (Someone else paid), Dofus, Dragonica, LOTRO, DDO and more... A LOT more. I've played good AND bad. The bad didn't last long. :P
You're welcome. Glad we saved someone from wasting their money.
For those who say "why complain about a game you're not even playing?" There is your answer - to help out a few fellow players.
I have certainly thrown a ton of money away on bad games in the past. Some help like this would have spared me some of that waste,
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Sending a message to grubby little companies like Cryptic that releasing a rushed product is not going to fly anymore dosen't hurt either
It needs to be Hard and Strong .... Oh and it looks like it's Delete day for the STO forums... !
I see..!
More Lifers are now starting to screem fowl. The poor CDF... what is happening to there ranks they have some AWOL ... going on there.
Dev's leaving ...3 months after launch you get a Welcome back weekend ... And more i quit threads.. plus the bugs just keep pileing on....!
..hmmm... its time captain!
Another marketing clusterfrack has even the CDF up in arms: http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=155130
I swear every section of Cryptic is as incompetent as the others. Even the fanbots know they have no prayer of getting 5 people to buy this turd, much less subscribe past the first month.
oh wow darth, maybe its just me but that seems like a new low. could u start a thread with that link?
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
You asked for it, you got it lol.
It's comical how you're constantly seeing people vehemently defending Cryptic and the game one day, and then in the next day or two, or a week later, you see the exact same person throw up a "straw that broke the camel's back" thread, and they finally list all the things wrong with the game.
I intend to give it a year and then go back and see what happens......since I got suckered for a lifetime sub I can afford to do that.......
Earth and Beyond Emulator is in Alpha testing if anyone misses that game.......first site to come up on google search
There are only 10 types of people in this world, those that understand binary and those that don't
I'll play this game if it's F2P, and it seems to be rapidly approaching that. But it doesn't seem worth paying monthly for this type of so-called MMO game.
Its sad when this is more entertaining than the actual game
ive said before this might be a f2p sooon, that might go hand in hand with how there stocking so much stuff in the c-store as fast as they can?
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME