Perma-death in MMOs is something of a slippery slope. I know it's worked in some limited cases, but it always comes with problems. Ultimately, in an MMO environment where you've undoubtedly spent quite a bit of time on a character, losing it forever is a serious blow that most people don't even want to consider. In a tabletop setting, your ST can simply let you create a new character with enough XP to catch up to the rest of the group, or at least closer to where you were before the rampaging Evil Thing (tm) squished you like a grape... That's a little harder in an MMO environment, and could easily wind up being abused and turned into the Poor Man's Respec.
That said, there's some good ideas in that. I'd also like to see how/if they use the Predator's Taint (to those unfamiliar, it's a newer system in VtR, resulting in some Highlander-esque moments. If you're presented with another vampire you're unfamiliar with, you both check for frenzy or, in the case of different levels of blood potency, the weaker one checks for fear frenzy/Rotschrek). How they handle the bloodlines will also be fascinating.
Watching a neonate approach an elder vampire and burst in to a running frenzy would be absolutely amusing.
I am in great hopes its a open world sandbox in the same way EVE is. I also do not see them doing this without PVP so those wanting a peaceful little world will likely be disappointed. I do suspect a little more story will be involved in this game to though. Personally I am excited but until I hear more I have no idea if I want to play or not.
Anyone expecting "Twilight Online" out of this deserves every ounce of disappointment they receive.
As for the diablerie, it's true that it's a risk versus reward type deal. EVE, in essence, does have a pretty strict death penalty: you lose your ship and whatever was in/on it, you lose whatever skill points your clone does not cover, etc. I'm not sure what they'd do in WoD, though. It'll be interesting to see in the future.
It would be entertaining to see the "order" of the city banish someone out of the city limits if nothing like FD exists, making them KoS to other vamp if seen with in the limits of the orders reach. It would play nicely for those that wish to truly lurk in the shadows. Damn it, I am really missing the Masq days.
No joke. Those were the days. The game did what you needed it to at the time. Sure, it took a lot of forethought and planning in designing the code... But once it was there, you could get it to do whatever you wanted. Some of my fondest online gaming memories come from those days. Who would've guessed text games could accomplish much?
Of course, since the advent and expansion of MMOs, finding a MUD that actually sees people is pretty rare. Ah well. Can't turn back the clock.
A lot of it was people's willingness to be apart of it though. There were situations in MUDs where I could have avoided by gaming the system. IE just logging out or saying no you can do that I don't want to RP. There are just some things you can't really do anymore. At one point perhaps things that can only be done through RP could have in game mechanics to enforce them. For example I was taken prisoner in a SW MUD and I managed to break free and jump in a rental ship before anyone could stop me. The whole experience and chase than ensued was probably the most fun and exciting event to ever happen in a game for me.
Not really sure where I am going, I think I have been drinking a little too fast. Back on track WoD MMO! I am putting all my online gaming hope on this game. I really don't think any other game has a chance to release a true world that many have been craving for. While the media blackout is great it is driving me CRAZY. I really revel in the pre-release reading and discussion(arguments) that ensue. Right now we really know almost nothing about this game except conjecture based on the company involved.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
This has to be the game I am looking forward to the most. There are a lot of good games coming out but if done right this will blow them all away.
And while I much prefer the media black out to sound bites that can't then be talked about it would be good to know if they have an idea about a relase date. I would love it if the game came out this year but I suspect its more likely to be a 2011 release.
The game I'm looking forward to the most is Star Wars the Old Republic.
I'm just scared what they're going to do with a WoD game. If its Eve but with vampires, I won't play it because it will be terrible. I can't stand Eve. But if you can decide the way your character looks, in a modern setting and actually be able to see your character, that would be great. Best would be if it was Old WoD but I don't see them doing that.
White Wolf shot themselves in the foot by ending the Old WoD but they don't want to admit they were wrong and suck it up. Old WoD was just such a richer history, mythology, and environment. They'd have been smarter just to release a new edition with the problems cleaned up. Normally I can't stand the religious stuff but it worked so well with this game.
It seriously lends itself to both PvE and PvP (with extreme limits) just by the very nature of the game itself, and I'd love to see the format it takes. It also scares me a bit since they could easily and majorly blow it. I'd hope for an Old World of Darkness but thats too much to ask since the line was officially closed.
I have to wonder and ask where and why do the people see PvP as a strong point in WoD?
Sure, maybe in oWoD where racial and factional animosity was inherent (werewolves hated vampires for being Wrym tainted, for example), but there's no such thing in nWoD, on which this MMO is going be based on, where it's basically free-for-all and crossovers are actually easier than ever before (although, this WILL actually lend itself towards more balanced PvP because certain races aren't such powerhouses anymore (oWoD Lupines, anyone?). If anything, PvP in WoD has always been in the form of politicking, backstabbing and largerly indirect combat (weakening opponents resources, his politicial status, etc), not so much in the direct mano-a-mano duels that are seen as PvP in today's games.
I'd have to ask, in this world does the Camarilla still exist? If so a "PvP' encounter might require showing abilities which is portential FD by breaking vampire law. It would have to be in an elysium or some sub terran area out of sight of the normal population. I would hope that would be the case, last thing I would want to see is a bunch of scrubs vamping out in the public and getting away with it. But then again, it would be fun to watch them get perma dusted for doing it. I take it back, as long as I have a seat up front to watch the FD I'm all for it! Damn it, sucked me right back in people!
END OF LINE_
~V
Hmm. I suppose the nWoD requires a little explanation.
The best way to think of it is as its own seperate entity, distinct from the old World of Darkness most of us came to know and love throughout its lifespan. I personally like it more (Werewolves aren't fuzzy eco-terrorists; Mage is more about spells and less about hacking the universe with your mind; Hunter is more about humans fighting back instead of another supernatural fatsplat that gets the moral high ground against other supernaturals; Changeling doesn't have the same potential for being cartoon characters battling it out with brooms that are actually swords; etc.). If anything, I feel it's Vampire that doesn't have as much color as it rightly should, but that's more up to the players and the ST to decide than it once was.
The Vampire: The Requiem equivalent of "sects" are Covenants, though they're more ideological differences than a matter of what you're embraced into. Any Clan can join any Covenant, and some vampires don't belong to any. There are five major ones:
The Invictus are the equivalent of vampiric nobility. They're very much a rule by elders/influence group, and are somewhat similar to the old Inconnu, or the upper tiers of the old Camarilla.
The Lancea Sanctum are the equivalent of vampiric clergy. They're highly religious, and tend to evoke a lot of the same imagery as older Inquisition-era Catholic viewpoints. Due to very old ties that go back to the dark ages, the Invictus and the Lance usually have somewhat close relationships.
The Circle of the Crone usually run counter to the Lancea Sanctum. They're typically Pagan and have more of a mythological/mystical viewpoint. As such, their relations with the Lancea Sanctum and, by extension, the Invictus tend to be somewhat strained. They're not at outright, global war, though.
The Carthian Movement usually run counter to the Invictus directly. Depending on your ST and your game, they can range from militant freedom-fighters to simple activists who favor a more democratic view of government. They believe in a 1 vampire = 1 vote kind of system, and despise the rule of the elite that the Invictus tends to embody. Once again, no outright war, but they certainly don't get along under most circumstances.
Finally, the Ordo Dracul is the most neutral of the bunch. Usually described as being insular and academic, they focus most of their energies on studying the vampiric condition and finding ways to circumvent its flaws. They tend to follow the more "traditional" (IE Hollywood-inspired) views of vampire origins, drawing the origins back to Dracula.
So there's that. There's also two pseudo-Covenants that are considered "Antagonist-Only".
VII is a mysterious group of vampires that seems to hunt down vampires for the sole purpose of killing them. They're intentionally kept in the dark; a VII book was released, but it offers a number of options and ideas as to who they are, instead of an outright explanation.
Belial's Brood is the standard, Baali-esque demon-loving cult of vampires. Nothing fancy, here; they sell themselves to demons for power, and use it for their own ends. Plain and simple.
Now, all that said, most (though definitely not all) cities are still controlled by a Prince/equivalent, who likely belongs to one of the Big Five and does their damnedest to maintain order the way they want. A disproportionate amount are Invictus and Lancea Sanctum, by tradition, so their rules tend to be similar to what you know. Diablerie is still bad under most circumstances, as is killing other vampires without something remotely resembling a good reason. Because of the Covenants and the more localized systems of government, though, each city can have very different laws and "atmosphere" and is very much an expression and extension of the ruling power(s).
FEAR THE WALL O' TEXT!
(Editted for some clarity, and to hopefully make it easier to read)
Where do the nosferatu fit into that then?
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
Originally posted by Ramae Anyone expecting "Twilight Online" out of this deserves every ounce of disappointment they receive.
"CCP Games has been profitable since 2004, but all profits are currently being reinvested in Eve Online and also into creating World of Darkness, a new online subscription game about vampires targeting an 18-25-year-old, female demographic.
Fashion and design will play a key role in the game and the group has employed two supposedly well-known Icelandic fashion designers to create virtual "gothic-style" clothing for avatars. The group is hiring 100 more people in the next 12 months – including producers, animators and economists – to create its new virtual world."
That's market research lingo for people who are not us. World of Darkness RPG has, since the very begining, pushed back the "male gamer" stereotype and has consistently been the only RPG title to attract the female population at least as much as the male population. Tabletop RPG history remembers Vampire: the Masquerade 1st Ed. as event that brought girls to the gaming tables. This has never stopped WoD from being extremely mature (and not in that silly Dragon Age way, either), extremely serious and very horrific.
What that statement says is, yes, we intend for this to continue being the trend with the computer game as well.
That's market research lingo for people who are not us. World of Darkness RPG has, since the very begining, pushed back the "male gamer" stereotype and has consistently been the only RPG title to attract the female population at least as much as the male population. Tabletop RPG history remembers Vampire: the Masquerade 1st Ed. as event that brought girls to the gaming tables. This has never stopped WoD from being extremely mature (and not in that silly Dragon Age way, either), extremely serious and very horrific.
What that statement says is, yes, we intend for this to continue being the trend with the computer game as well.
I hope you're right. One of the things I hated most about Eve is the fact that you create an avatar only to never seen it again because you're in your ship 99% of the time, and the only thing that changes about your ship is its shape.
Clans are a bit different in nWoD. Any Vampire can join any Covenant, as they personally see fit, regardless of Clan. They narrowed down what constitutes a "Clan" into five basic stereotypes of vampires.
Daeva are what you could consider the Anne Rice style Vampire. They have control over the emotions of others, and typically have a hard time with their own emotions. A Daeva could run the spectrum between an oWoD Brujah and the Toreador.
Gangrel are the Vampires-as-Beast stereotypes. They're usually the most combat-oriented, and the most attuned to nature and animals, particularly other predators.
Mekhet are the Vampires-as-Mysterious stereotypes. They sneak, they observe, they study ancient secrets, and they more than any other keep to the shadows, even at night.
Ventrue are what you'd expect: the Vampires-as-Lords stereotypes. They're the vampire type that exerts their influence over as much as possible, and always has to be in control. They also steadily go insane, from the strain of being control freaks.
Nosferatu, finally, are the horror movie sort. They're eerie in some way (most are physically deformed as per normal, but some are just inexplicably creepy; the end result is the same), and even have a knack for controlling fear in the new Nightmare discipline. They still sneak, and some do still play Spy-For-Hire, but they have a decidedly more sinister bent under most circumstances.
The Clans were intentionally made generic; the way they were originally described was as "broad ethnic groups." The Clan fills your overall stereotype; your Bloodline fills the specifics of what you want to be. There's also hard and fast rules for creating Bloodlines, with the help of your ST, as any vampire theoretically has the potential to add their own "color" to their blood. Basically, consider the Clans as what kind of vampire you are, and the Bloodlines as the expression.
As an example, there is a Bloodline of Nosferatu named the Noctuku (may sound familiar, if you remember oWoD). They're cannibals who literally eat flesh. Unlike the old-school Nagaraja, they're more like Boogeymen and hunters. Like a horror movie villain, they must eat because they are always hungry for flesh.
Originally posted by Ramael Anyone expecting "Twilight Online" out of this deserves every ounce of disappointment they receive.
"CCP Games has been profitable since 2004, but all profits are currently being reinvested in Eve Online and also into creating World of Darkness, a new online subscription game about vampires targeting an 18-25-year-old, female demographic.
Fashion and design will play a key role in the game and the group has employed two supposedly well-known Icelandic fashion designers to create virtual "gothic-style" clothing for avatars. The group is hiring 100 more people in the next 12 months – including producers, animators and economists – to create its new virtual world."
To be specific, Twilight is officially classed as a "Young Adult" novel series, which targets the 13-21 female demographic. But that's splitting hairs.
As was stated above, that's marketing lingo for "OMGNEWDEMOGRAPHICWECANEXPLOIT," not "Leave everyone else out of the picture." It gets the shareholders all excited.
To be specific, Twilight is officially classed as a "Young Adult" novel series, which targets the 13-21 female demographic. But that's splitting hairs.
As was stated above, that's marketing lingo for "OMGNEWDEMOGRAPHICWECANEXPLOIT," not "Leave everyone else out of the picture." It gets the shareholders all excited.
I just thought that it was funny when you all think that the game is going to be so hardcore, when Hilmar has actually said that its targeted towards young women.
And yes "what was said here" was exactly that - it is targeted towards 18 - 25 year old females. You can interpret it however you like, but that is what he said.
Still, the concept art what was shown in those photos on ccp flickr page and the fact that it is going to have economic model as realistic as possible gives me hope that ccp respects their target group.
In all my years running White Wolf and World of Darkness games, some of the best players I've had have been female. Sad but true. The guys tend to turn it into D&D ("Farm the NPCs until we get their loot!") with guns, if given half a chance.
So I ain't crying. Besides... Even if they absolutely suck, and the game turns into what most of US would call Twilight Online... I still take great personal pleasure from the fact that Twilight fangirls probably won't like it anyway.
Licensed games should live up to their worlds not just utilize their fame.
In this one he puts a picture of Twilight and says "My wife would play this game. I wouldn't.".
___________________________________________
And also from the first page there a link to all the interviews about WoD.
This was a talk in GDC 2008 with 8 different members of the CCP team about the upcoming World of Darkness:
Let's try another tact, are those involved in the development of the World of Darkness MMO players of the table top RPG?
Yes. Everyone involved has had some sort of exposure to the table top RPG, most of which are hard core players. (At this point several of the people piped up mentioning their RPG experience and familiarity)
I'll try not to play games and eek out answers that will get you into trouble. How about this, are you as excited about the project now that you're working on it as you were when you imagined how it would be?
(Smiles all around) Are you kidding, this is awesome. (Several people began going into their personal stories with how they heard about the MMO, left their jobs and applied with CCP because they felt they just had to be part of the team).
____________________________________________
So if you are going to complain or criticize something, do a little research first, don't get only 1 sentence and try to deduce all the game from that.
I don't see this game ever being Twilight. Frankly, Twilight sucks, and the WoD is so much better than that just by its very nature. I CAN see it being overly PvP centered allowing everyone to gank each other as much as they want which scares the living crap out of me.
You ever play Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines? That was a really good game. I'd just LOVE to be able to participate in some Camarilla court intrigue, and fight off Sabbat attacks, and maybe make a deal with the Werewolves to fight off the encroaching Men in Black from the Mages.
I doubt they will use the OWoD but I'm willing to give them a chance to prove to me that they can do a good job presenting the new.
One thing I do hope they will live up to is the sound displayed in Bloodlines. Ahhh heck. If they can add something with the utter creepiness of the ghost storyline in that game WITHOUT turning it into a PvP area, they will have me for life. To this day, that storyline is still one of the creepiest I've ever played in any game and it beat to hell all the other storylines in the game.
I can honestly say I've not met one person who has played VtM:B and not been a bit freaked out by the hotel. So yes, I know precisely what you mean.
I don't see the game being overly PvP-ridden, as the nWoD is less tuned to that. Even the Werewolves (who are more like spirit police) don't specifically hate Vampires any more than they hate anything else. They have their own antagonists, the Pure (being other Werewolves who think the Forsaken, who are the bulk of the Werewolves, are inherently corrupt and must be "cleansed"). Everything in nWoD, from the system to the story, is inherently designed so that crossover games can work without one group or another being considered traitors to their entire species. Of course, they can choose to ignore that, as any developer can, but... Well, I seem to remember Justin Achilli doing quite well at a celebrity boxing event at GenCon a few years back...
As far as ghosts go, you may want to look into their Geist splat. It's not playable ghosts... more reapers/mediums... But it's truthfully one of the best designs I've seen them do in a long time, from concept to system.
Just Achili, the previously mentioned game designer working on this game (and also former game line developer for Vampire: the Masquerade and Vampire: the Requiem tabletop RPGs) has stated on his blog a couple of times that his game design mantra is: Let The Players Do It. He even mentioned EVE as not living up to the standard of this mantra.
Meaning, I doubt there'll be a lot in the way of storylines you play through. It'll be a horrific, scary, dark world. And players will have a lot of tools to do their own wheeling and dealing, their own scheming, politicking and plotting. This will create tasks for other players to accomplish, if they're so inclined. Or to work against. I very much doubt much of this is related to combat in any way (although this is strictly my opinion).
None of it was mentioned as "here's how WoD MMO works", though. It was more in the format of his thoughts on the issue of game design. So nothing's set in stone.
I'm a girl. Yes, I'm a gamer chick. I'm rare and unusual. And the Moirae are the three greek goddesses of fate also known as Clotho (spinner of the thread of life), Lachesis (determine the length of the thread of life), and Atropos (cuts the thread of life). All women."
please remember that they aren't real. so i don't see your point. yes you're a women, get over yourself. and zeus was king of all the greek gods. he was a man.
when i see something as stupid as this, i can't help posting.
To be honest, my first thought when I heard of the MMO's development was of my old Ventrue character (oWoD; I've never actually been a player for nWoD, just ST) basically being a quest-giver. Just sit there and send other people to accomplish tasks. So I'm not going to cry if the players have that level of freedom.
I'm a girl. Yes, I'm a gamer chick. I'm rare and unusual. And the Moirae are the three greek goddesses of fate also known as Clotho (spinner of the thread of life), Lachesis (determine the length of the thread of life), and Atropos (cuts the thread of life). All women."
please remember that they aren't real. so i don't see your point. yes you're a women, get over yourself. and zeus was king of all the greek gods. he was a man.
when i see something as stupid as this, i can't help posting.
I keep getting told I'm a guy because of my name since everyone thinks its Murrey. I made up a signature to explain the meaning of my handle. Get over yourself.
Sounds to me like Justin Achili wants to take it in the same way as their online chats went. The ability for the players to create the world, while they supply the rules and the graphics and nothing more. This could be both good and bad. On the chats, it wasn't a big deal because you could just blow off the twinks, powermongers, and trouble makers (I played there for years). Not sure how it will work in a real MMO environment.
Making it a PvP free for all won't work because it relies on the players being mature when they simply aren't. There will need to be rules preventing griefing or most fans won't play it.
I'm hoping that there's a happy medium between the two ends. They will give us both the quests, and allow PvP within rules.
I'm also hoping that they won't allow players to become members of the ruling council's in the game because that could be very badly abused.
I guess "Masquerade+ Humanity+ NPC Hunters+ Political system" is enough to keep vampires from going around killing each other.
It isn't enough to keep humans from killing each other in real life, and it definitely won't be enough to keep undead and supernatural monsters played by humans from killing each other on a game where death doesn't matter unless you have perma death which would just tick off all said humans.
Comments
Watching a neonate approach an elder vampire and burst in to a running frenzy would be absolutely amusing.
END OF LINE_
~V
It would be entertaining to see the "order" of the city banish someone out of the city limits if nothing like FD exists, making them KoS to other vamp if seen with in the limits of the orders reach. It would play nicely for those that wish to truly lurk in the shadows. Damn it, I am really missing the Masq days.
END OF LINE_
~V
No worries. If you have any other questions, PM me. In another life, when I ran/helped run WoD MUDs, I earned the nickname "WoDBot." Sad, but true.
The day MMO's can deliver the kind of experience MUDs did, I think we will be in the promise land. Some real exciting times just staring at text.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
No joke. Those were the days. The game did what you needed it to at the time. Sure, it took a lot of forethought and planning in designing the code... But once it was there, you could get it to do whatever you wanted. Some of my fondest online gaming memories come from those days. Who would've guessed text games could accomplish much?
Of course, since the advent and expansion of MMOs, finding a MUD that actually sees people is pretty rare. Ah well. Can't turn back the clock.
A lot of it was people's willingness to be apart of it though. There were situations in MUDs where I could have avoided by gaming the system. IE just logging out or saying no you can do that I don't want to RP. There are just some things you can't really do anymore. At one point perhaps things that can only be done through RP could have in game mechanics to enforce them. For example I was taken prisoner in a SW MUD and I managed to break free and jump in a rental ship before anyone could stop me. The whole experience and chase than ensued was probably the most fun and exciting event to ever happen in a game for me.
Not really sure where I am going, I think I have been drinking a little too fast. Back on track WoD MMO! I am putting all my online gaming hope on this game. I really don't think any other game has a chance to release a true world that many have been craving for. While the media blackout is great it is driving me CRAZY. I really revel in the pre-release reading and discussion(arguments) that ensue. Right now we really know almost nothing about this game except conjecture based on the company involved.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
The game I'm looking forward to the most is Star Wars the Old Republic.
I'm just scared what they're going to do with a WoD game. If its Eve but with vampires, I won't play it because it will be terrible. I can't stand Eve. But if you can decide the way your character looks, in a modern setting and actually be able to see your character, that would be great. Best would be if it was Old WoD but I don't see them doing that.
White Wolf shot themselves in the foot by ending the Old WoD but they don't want to admit they were wrong and suck it up. Old WoD was just such a richer history, mythology, and environment. They'd have been smarter just to release a new edition with the problems cleaned up. Normally I can't stand the religious stuff but it worked so well with this game.
Where do the nosferatu fit into that then?
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
That's market research lingo for people who are not us. World of Darkness RPG has, since the very begining, pushed back the "male gamer" stereotype and has consistently been the only RPG title to attract the female population at least as much as the male population. Tabletop RPG history remembers Vampire: the Masquerade 1st Ed. as event that brought girls to the gaming tables. This has never stopped WoD from being extremely mature (and not in that silly Dragon Age way, either), extremely serious and very horrific.
What that statement says is, yes, we intend for this to continue being the trend with the computer game as well.
I hope you're right. One of the things I hated most about Eve is the fact that you create an avatar only to never seen it again because you're in your ship 99% of the time, and the only thing that changes about your ship is its shape.
Clans are a bit different in nWoD. Any Vampire can join any Covenant, as they personally see fit, regardless of Clan. They narrowed down what constitutes a "Clan" into five basic stereotypes of vampires.
Daeva are what you could consider the Anne Rice style Vampire. They have control over the emotions of others, and typically have a hard time with their own emotions. A Daeva could run the spectrum between an oWoD Brujah and the Toreador.
Gangrel are the Vampires-as-Beast stereotypes. They're usually the most combat-oriented, and the most attuned to nature and animals, particularly other predators.
Mekhet are the Vampires-as-Mysterious stereotypes. They sneak, they observe, they study ancient secrets, and they more than any other keep to the shadows, even at night.
Ventrue are what you'd expect: the Vampires-as-Lords stereotypes. They're the vampire type that exerts their influence over as much as possible, and always has to be in control. They also steadily go insane, from the strain of being control freaks.
Nosferatu, finally, are the horror movie sort. They're eerie in some way (most are physically deformed as per normal, but some are just inexplicably creepy; the end result is the same), and even have a knack for controlling fear in the new Nightmare discipline. They still sneak, and some do still play Spy-For-Hire, but they have a decidedly more sinister bent under most circumstances.
The Clans were intentionally made generic; the way they were originally described was as "broad ethnic groups." The Clan fills your overall stereotype; your Bloodline fills the specifics of what you want to be. There's also hard and fast rules for creating Bloodlines, with the help of your ST, as any vampire theoretically has the potential to add their own "color" to their blood. Basically, consider the Clans as what kind of vampire you are, and the Bloodlines as the expression.
As an example, there is a Bloodline of Nosferatu named the Noctuku (may sound familiar, if you remember oWoD). They're cannibals who literally eat flesh. Unlike the old-school Nagaraja, they're more like Boogeymen and hunters. Like a horror movie villain, they must eat because they are always hungry for flesh.
I hope that clarifies matters some!
To be specific, Twilight is officially classed as a "Young Adult" novel series, which targets the 13-21 female demographic. But that's splitting hairs.
As was stated above, that's marketing lingo for "OMGNEWDEMOGRAPHICWECANEXPLOIT," not "Leave everyone else out of the picture." It gets the shareholders all excited.
I just thought that it was funny when you all think that the game is going to be so hardcore, when Hilmar has actually said that its targeted towards young women.
And yes "what was said here" was exactly that - it is targeted towards 18 - 25 year old females. You can interpret it however you like, but that is what he said.
Still, the concept art what was shown in those photos on ccp flickr page and the fact that it is going to have economic model as realistic as possible gives me hope that ccp respects their target group.
In all my years running White Wolf and World of Darkness games, some of the best players I've had have been female. Sad but true. The guys tend to turn it into D&D ("Farm the NPCs until we get their loot!") with guns, if given half a chance.
So I ain't crying. Besides... Even if they absolutely suck, and the game turns into what most of US would call Twilight Online... I still take great personal pleasure from the fact that Twilight fangirls probably won't like it anyway.
Petty, I know, but eh.
Do you know why they say it will target woman?
Because it will not be a kill fest like all other MMOs, where PVE=Kill NPCs, PVP=Kill players.
If you think it will be Twilight Online.
1-You don't know CCP;
2-You don't know White-Wolf;
3-You don't know WoD setting.
__________________________________________
You can also read some of the articles I posted in the first page that are actually from a guy that is making the game.
Fidelity to License
Licensed games should live up to their worlds not just utilize their fame.
In this one he puts a picture of Twilight and says "My wife would play this game. I wouldn't.".
___________________________________________
And also from the first page there a link to all the interviews about WoD.
This was a talk in GDC 2008 with 8 different members of the CCP team about the upcoming World of Darkness:
Let's try another tact, are those involved in the development of the World of Darkness MMO players of the table top RPG?
Yes. Everyone involved has had some sort of exposure to the table top RPG, most of which are hard core players. (At this point several of the people piped up mentioning their RPG experience and familiarity)
I'll try not to play games and eek out answers that will get you into trouble. How about this, are you as excited about the project now that you're working on it as you were when you imagined how it would be?
(Smiles all around) Are you kidding, this is awesome. (Several people began going into their personal stories with how they heard about the MMO, left their jobs and applied with CCP because they felt they just had to be part of the team).
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So if you are going to complain or criticize something, do a little research first, don't get only 1 sentence and try to deduce all the game from that.
I don't see this game ever being Twilight. Frankly, Twilight sucks, and the WoD is so much better than that just by its very nature. I CAN see it being overly PvP centered allowing everyone to gank each other as much as they want which scares the living crap out of me.
You ever play Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines? That was a really good game. I'd just LOVE to be able to participate in some Camarilla court intrigue, and fight off Sabbat attacks, and maybe make a deal with the Werewolves to fight off the encroaching Men in Black from the Mages.
I doubt they will use the OWoD but I'm willing to give them a chance to prove to me that they can do a good job presenting the new.
One thing I do hope they will live up to is the sound displayed in Bloodlines. Ahhh heck. If they can add something with the utter creepiness of the ghost storyline in that game WITHOUT turning it into a PvP area, they will have me for life. To this day, that storyline is still one of the creepiest I've ever played in any game and it beat to hell all the other storylines in the game.
I can honestly say I've not met one person who has played VtM:B and not been a bit freaked out by the hotel. So yes, I know precisely what you mean.
I don't see the game being overly PvP-ridden, as the nWoD is less tuned to that. Even the Werewolves (who are more like spirit police) don't specifically hate Vampires any more than they hate anything else. They have their own antagonists, the Pure (being other Werewolves who think the Forsaken, who are the bulk of the Werewolves, are inherently corrupt and must be "cleansed"). Everything in nWoD, from the system to the story, is inherently designed so that crossover games can work without one group or another being considered traitors to their entire species. Of course, they can choose to ignore that, as any developer can, but... Well, I seem to remember Justin Achilli doing quite well at a celebrity boxing event at GenCon a few years back...
As far as ghosts go, you may want to look into their Geist splat. It's not playable ghosts... more reapers/mediums... But it's truthfully one of the best designs I've seen them do in a long time, from concept to system.
Just Achili, the previously mentioned game designer working on this game (and also former game line developer for Vampire: the Masquerade and Vampire: the Requiem tabletop RPGs) has stated on his blog a couple of times that his game design mantra is: Let The Players Do It. He even mentioned EVE as not living up to the standard of this mantra.
Meaning, I doubt there'll be a lot in the way of storylines you play through. It'll be a horrific, scary, dark world. And players will have a lot of tools to do their own wheeling and dealing, their own scheming, politicking and plotting. This will create tasks for other players to accomplish, if they're so inclined. Or to work against. I very much doubt much of this is related to combat in any way (although this is strictly my opinion).
None of it was mentioned as "here's how WoD MMO works", though. It was more in the format of his thoughts on the issue of game design. So nothing's set in stone.
"Please remember something...
I'm a girl. Yes, I'm a gamer chick. I'm rare and unusual. And the Moirae are the three greek goddesses of fate also known as Clotho (spinner of the thread of life), Lachesis (determine the length of the thread of life), and Atropos (cuts the thread of life). All women."
please remember that they aren't real. so i don't see your point. yes you're a women, get over yourself. and zeus was king of all the greek gods. he was a man.
when i see something as stupid as this, i can't help posting.
To be honest, my first thought when I heard of the MMO's development was of my old Ventrue character (oWoD; I've never actually been a player for nWoD, just ST) basically being a quest-giver. Just sit there and send other people to accomplish tasks. So I'm not going to cry if the players have that level of freedom.
I keep getting told I'm a guy because of my name since everyone thinks its Murrey. I made up a signature to explain the meaning of my handle. Get over yourself.
Sounds to me like Justin Achili wants to take it in the same way as their online chats went. The ability for the players to create the world, while they supply the rules and the graphics and nothing more. This could be both good and bad. On the chats, it wasn't a big deal because you could just blow off the twinks, powermongers, and trouble makers (I played there for years). Not sure how it will work in a real MMO environment.
Making it a PvP free for all won't work because it relies on the players being mature when they simply aren't. There will need to be rules preventing griefing or most fans won't play it.
I'm hoping that there's a happy medium between the two ends. They will give us both the quests, and allow PvP within rules.
I'm also hoping that they won't allow players to become members of the ruling council's in the game because that could be very badly abused.
I guess "Masquerade+ Humanity+ NPC Hunters+ Political system" is enough to keep vampires from going around killing each other.
It isn't enough to keep humans from killing each other in real life, and it definitely won't be enough to keep undead and supernatural monsters played by humans from killing each other on a game where death doesn't matter unless you have perma death which would just tick off all said humans.