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What makes this game a good MMORPG?

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Comments

  • thexratedthexrated Member UncommonPosts: 1,368

    I would not bother replying to him. Just check his posting history.

    "The person who experiences greatness must have a feeling for the myth he is in."

  • ShodanasShodanas Member RarePosts: 1,933

    Originally posted by OneMMOVet

    Originally posted by Anubisan

    Lets see...

    Huge open world - Check nope it's going to be instanced from what it looks like.

    Exploration - Check if it's instanced then no.

    Questing - Check we all know that there will be questing that doesn't make an mmorpg

    Crafting - Check they haven't shown anything and till they do this should be no

    Player housing (in the ships) - Check i wouldn't call that housing swg had housing.

    Grouping - Check but it's mostly solo so i don't think anyone will use this

    PvP - Check or so they say chances are it will be carebear 6 vs 6 fights in a mini game

    Guilds - Check unless i see proof then no

    Dungeons - Check chances are this will be instanced too

    Raids - Check hate to break it to you pve folks but 8 classes do not make for raiding

    Sounds like a reasonably standard MMORPG to me. And then of course there is the addition of the focus on story which no one has really done before.  As for your comment about STO... are you kidding? The difference in quality and polish between Cryptic and Bioware is like comparing KFC to some of the best fine-dining in the world.

     tor does not sound like an mmorpg it sounds more like a single player game that will allow for multiplayer now and then. unless we see screen shots and video of players in an open world then it's not.

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG

    Exploration - See above.

    Crafting - Developer blog on TOR's site, date 2/04/2010:

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website.

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that.

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2).

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

  • artemisentr4artemisentr4 Member UncommonPosts: 1,431

    TOR will make a good MMORPG because it will bring back the RPG to the MMO. I am not talking about yelling muahahaha every few minutes. I am talking about progressing and shaping your character through a class story arc with choice. The choices you make will change the path of your story and how NPC's react to you over the 200 hours of your class story arc game play.

    At the same time, you will be in an open world just like WoW on most of the planets. The big difference will be in how instances work. The game world will be open to all with instances having a green film or other colors the signify an entrance to the instance. The difference will be no loading screen in TOR. It will be seamless where WoW had a loading screen. If you are grouped, you will all enter the same instance.

    Testers from E3 confirmed that the starting planet they were on took just under an hour to run from one side to the other with no stopping to quest. And these starter areas are said to be significantly smaller than the main planets. It was also said in a video interview from E3 that exploration will be rewarded. If you did not feel like questing, you and your friends could pick out something in the distance and go there. And the dev's want to have something rewarding for you if you explore.

    It is true that you can solo from level 1 to level cap. That has been said by the dev's. But it was also said that you will miss much of the game. The world quest story arcs will be about the overall conflict of the war and be required to group to quest. It is also where the interaction with NPC's will be interesting because NPC's will react differently to players based on what choices they made in their class story arc quests. It will make each encounter different depending on the conversation. Even your companions will answer in these quests. They will have an attitude also based on how you use them in your class quests. Flashpoints will be the typical repeatable dungeon crawls. These may or may not scale to your party or be soloable.

    I could go on an on based on the info I have read or watched. And believing the dev's or not is irrelevent. You just need to find out when it is launched. One thing I have always seen from BW though. Is that you will not get info until it is in the game and confirmed to be added to the game. Just like their space combat announcement. It was to be "alternate gameplay" that would have nothing to do with the story. It was to be a side game only, and that is what it will be. No reason to have an open sandbox space game in a themepark, story driven game. It makes non sense and is the reason they said and have shown that space will be for travel to planets and hot spots only at launch. After launch is up for speculation.

    In other words, yes this willmbe a good MMORPG.

    “How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?”
    R.A.Salvatore

  • OneMMOVetOneMMOVet Member Posts: 37

    Originally posted by Shodanas

     

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG have they shown proof? no so far all they have shown is a 30 second video clip of every planet. unless they come out with a video showing a player walking around on a planet and they won't then it's not an open world game.

    Exploration - See above.

    Crafting - Developer blog on TOR's site, date 2/04/2010:

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community have they shown a crafting system? no. all they have shown is people getting loot from mobs and that doesn't work. crafting should be the only way you get items or armor. and there should be a full on crafting class.

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests. how many people are going to group when everything can be done solo? bioware needs to see that mmo's are about getting a group going and going out and grinding. if you can't find a group too bad join a guild or get some friends.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website. open battlegrounds? from what it looks like both will just be pvp mini-games.

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well. again why should they do this when the game is made with solo play in mind? my old swg guild is planning on going to it however we all think we'll stay for a month and talk to other friends we haven't seen from swg in years and leave.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that. instanced doesn't work.

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2). not only are raids a bad idea but that's wow. tor is trying to be wow but wow has more then 8 classes.

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

  • CacaphonyCacaphony Member Posts: 738

    Its not a good MMORPG.  Its not out yet.  image

     

    Seriously though, on this game I am not forming my opinion yet.  I want to play the game for a couple weeks and get an idea first.  Then I can tell you how I feel about it.

  • KriosisKriosis Member Posts: 345

    Originally posted by OneMMOVet

    Originally posted by Shodanas

     

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG

    have they shown proof? no so far all they have shown is a 30 second video clip of every planet. unless they come out with a video showing a player walking around on a planet and they won't then it's not an open world game.

    You need to work on your arguments, you sound like a child. Proof has yet to be seen, correct, but that does not mean this game is NOT open world. All we are lacking is evidence. Until then, we can only be unsure, there is no "it is" or "it isn't".

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community

    have they shown a crafting system? no. all they have shown is people getting loot from mobs and that doesn't work. crafting should be the only way you get items or armor. and there should be a full on crafting class.

    Because everybody crafts what they own, sure it was assembled at one point in time, but it's not always by you. Did you make the clothes on your back? You get both, you get to be creative and you get to shop for items you didn't make yourself, and considering this is a game (means life for some) items dropping off mobs is expected. Didn't DOT weapons drop off mobs in SWG there fanboy?

    Secondly, what's wrong with all classes being combat classes while having the option to craft? Is it that important to waste a character slot and a possible player name because you can't fathom a skilled combatant taking lessons from martha stewart?

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests.

    how many people are going to group when everything can be done solo? bioware needs to see that mmo's are about getting a group going and going out and grinding. if you can't find a group too bad join a guild or get some friends.

    Perhaps you should pay attention a bit more. Not everything has been said to be soloable, what they have said is you can level cap solo, while missing out on content you will only see in a group, this usually comes with worthy rewards you wouldn't want to miss. Your problem and most of the whiners here, is wanting the game one way and that being your way, "your" refering to each individual. It wont happen, and never will. Make an MMO if you think your way is far more successful, I'll bet it isn't which explains your lack of motivation in making one.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website.

    open battlegrounds? from what it looks like both will just be pvp mini-games.

    World PvP is a mini game? That's rather interesting, but I'll take it as I see it. Your selective memory must have forgotten the dev dispatch of testers pvping on what looked like tatooine. Or you don't follow the game, which is probably the case for you and most people here.

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well.

    again why should they do this when the game is made with solo play in mind? my old swg guild is planning on going to it however we all think we'll stay for a month and talk to other friends we haven't seen from swg in years and leave.

    Upset about solo play then bring up a soloable MMO like SWG? Nice, how easy was it getting doc buffs? 10k in a line on Coruscant, go to your grinding spot of choice (Mine being squall caves) and start burning mobs down, hell you could even macro grind. Pretending the game was or is something it never was or isn't just makes you look clueless, as if it wasn't already apparent.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that.

    instanced doesn't work.

    Did it break?

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2).

    not only are raids a bad idea but that's wow. tor is trying to be wow but wow has more then 8 classes.

    From here on out any game to feature raiding is now a WoW clone.......what? Dude, seriously, chill out, stop ranting, everything will be ok. Also, I wasn't aware that more classes meant a game was far more successful. But since you wanna be like that. There are 16 in SWTOR, I'd say that's plenty. If they can actually change their advanced class more then once, I'm not sure, I'm starting to doubt it. I believe they may only allow recustomization of points in your advanced class tree, but nothing is written in stone, as far as I know.

    It seems that each class has two sub classes and you must decide which to choose - PCGames Translation

     

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

  • OneMMOVetOneMMOVet Member Posts: 37

    Originally posted by Kriosis

    Originally posted by OneMMOVet

    Originally posted by Shodanas

     

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG

    have they shown proof? no so far all they have shown is a 30 second video clip of every planet. unless they come out with a video showing a player walking around on a planet and they won't then it's not an open world game.

    You need to work on your arguments, you sound like a child. Proof has yet to be seen, correct, but that does not mean this game is NOT open world. All we are lacking is evidence. Until then, we can only be unsure, there is no "it is" or "it isn't". i don't sound like a child i sound like what i am. a gamer who has been burned in the past by dev team lies. i along with many others want proof and bioware has yet to show it.

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community

    have they shown a crafting system? no. all they have shown is people getting loot from mobs and that doesn't work. crafting should be the only way you get items or armor. and there should be a full on crafting class.

    Because everybody crafts what they own, sure it was assembled at one point in time, but it's not always by you. Did you make the clothes on your back? You get both, you get to be creative and you get to shop for items you didn't make yourself, and considering this is a game (means life for some) items dropping off mobs is expected. Didn't DOT weapons drop off mobs in SWG there fanboy? and they nerfed that over night after we the players asked them too. the best items came from crafters thats the way it should be.

    Secondly, what's wrong with all classes being combat classes while having the option to craft? Is it that important to waste a character slot and a possible player name because you can't fathom a skilled combatant taking lessons from martha stewart? combat classes shouldn't craft some of my best times in swg was escorting our crafters to pick up mats. combat classes should be supporting the crafters not combat classes should be the crafters.

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests.

    how many people are going to group when everything can be done solo? bioware needs to see that mmo's are about getting a group going and going out and grinding. if you can't find a group too bad join a guild or get some friends.

    Perhaps you should pay attention a bit more. Not everything has been said to be soloable, what they have said is you can level cap solo, while missing out on content you will only see in a group, this usually comes with worthy rewards you wouldn't want to miss. Your problem and most of the whiners here, is wanting the game one way and that being your way, "your" refering to each individual. It wont happen, and never will. Make an MMO if you think your way is far more successful, I'll bet it isn't which explains your lack of motivation in not making one. all they talk about is how much fun you can have without a group. look at final fantasy 11 that game worked as you did get a few levels of solo play and after that you had to find a group. that's how mmo games should work.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website.

    open battlegrounds? from what it looks like both will just be pvp mini-games.

    World PvP is a mini game? That's rather interesting, but I'll take it as I see it. Your selective memory must have forgotten the dev dispatch of testers pvping on what looked like tatooine. Or you don't follow the game, which is probably the case for you and most people here. they should have the following. ffa open world pvp along with tef's. that is pvp a battlefield that only allows 6 on 6 combat isn't.

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well.

    again why should they do this when the game is made with solo play in mind? my old swg guild is planning on going to it however we all think we'll stay for a month and talk to other friends we haven't seen from swg in years and leave.

    Upset about solo play then bring up a soloable MMO like SWG? Nice, how easy was it getting doc buffs? 10k in a line on Coruscant, go to your grinding spot of choice (Mine being squall caves) and start burning mobs down, hell you could even macro grind. Pretending the game was or is something it never was or isn't just makes you look clueless, as if it wasn't already apparent.  no you got more xp for being in and working with a group. you had to get buffed from a doctor and entertainer. that was how great swg was in order to work on skills you had to work with your fellow players.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that.

    instanced doesn't work.

    Did it break? instanced dungeons don't work look at every game that has them people hate them.

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2).

    not only are raids a bad idea but that's wow. tor is trying to be wow but wow has more then 8 classes.

    From here on out any game to feature raiding is now a WoW clone.......what? Dude, seriously, chill out, stop ranting, everything will be ok. Also, I wasn't aware that more classes meant a game was far more successful. But since you wanna be like that. There are 16 in SWTOR, I'd say that's plenty. If they can actually change their advanced class more then once, I'm not sure, I'm starting to doubt it. I believe they may only allow recustomization of points in your advanced class tree, but nothing is written in stone, as far as I know. wow was just the first that made it big and like raph koster said wow just did so much damage to mmo's. want to know what was fun? going with a group to take out krayt dragons and getting great rewards like pearls or tissue. and all the advance class tree is doing is just adding onto a class that doesn't make it a new class.

    It seems that each class has two sub classes and you must decide which to choose - PCGames Translation

     

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

  • KriosisKriosis Member Posts: 345

    Originally posted by OneMMOVet

    Originally posted by Kriosis


    Originally posted by OneMMOVet


    Originally posted by Shodanas

     

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG

    have they shown proof? no so far all they have shown is a 30 second video clip of every planet. unless they come out with a video showing a player walking around on a planet and they won't then it's not an open world game.

    You need to work on your arguments, you sound like a child. Proof has yet to be seen, correct, but that does not mean this game is NOT open world. All we are lacking is evidence. Until then, we can only be unsure, there is no "it is" or "it isn't".

    i don't sound like a child i sound like what i am. a gamer who has been burned in the past by dev team lies. i along with many others want proof and bioware has yet to show it.

    Please learn to seperate what you say from my previous messages, I don't feel I should have to fix your mistake. You'll get proof that it's true or isn't. Patience, work on it, gamer.

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community

    have they shown a crafting system? no. all they have shown is people getting loot from mobs and that doesn't work. crafting should be the only way you get items or armor. and there should be a full on crafting class.

    Because everybody crafts what they own, sure it was assembled at one point in time, but it's not always by you. Did you make the clothes on your back? You get both, you get to be creative and you get to shop for items you didn't make yourself, and considering this is a game (means life for some) items dropping off mobs is expected. Didn't DOT weapons drop off mobs in SWG there fanboy?

    and they nerfed that over night after we the players asked them too. the best items came from crafters thats the way it should be.

    No they didn't, stop pretending. What about the mind DOT axe from the Jabba themepark? I recall being hit and hitting players with burn lances I farmed, they wasn't removed over night. Nice try though.

    Secondly, what's wrong with all classes being combat classes while having the option to craft? Is it that important to waste a character slot and a possible player name because you can't fathom a skilled combatant taking lessons from martha stewart?

    combat classes shouldn't craft some of my best times in swg was escorting our crafters to pick up mats. combat classes should be supporting the crafters not combat classes should be the crafters.

    Well to bad.

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests.

    how many people are going to group when everything can be done solo? bioware needs to see that mmo's are about getting a group going and going out and grinding. if you can't find a group too bad join a guild or get some friends.

    Perhaps you should pay attention a bit more. Not everything has been said to be soloable, what they have said is you can level cap solo, while missing out on content you will only see in a group, this usually comes with worthy rewards you wouldn't want to miss. Your problem and most of the whiners here, is wanting the game one way and that being your way, "your" refering to each individual. It wont happen, and never will. Make an MMO if you think your way is far more successful, I'll bet it isn't which explains your lack of motivation in not making one.

    all they talk about is how much fun you can have without a group. look at final fantasy 11 that game worked as you did get a few levels of solo play and after that you had to find a group. that's how mmo games should work.

    Then go play FFXI, if it's that great why are you here? This game is not for you. Look at the picture linked above, use it as a reminder when you have no power in the situation.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website.

    open battlegrounds? from what it looks like both will just be pvp mini-games.

    World PvP is a mini game? That's rather interesting, but I'll take it as I see it. Your selective memory must have forgotten the dev dispatch of testers pvping on what looked like tatooine. Or you don't follow the game, which is probably the case for you and most people here.

    they should have the following. ffa open world pvp along with tef's. that is pvp a battlefield that only allows 6 on 6 combat isn't.

    They're only allowing 6 versus 6, got a linky?

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well.

    again why should they do this when the game is made with solo play in mind? my old swg guild is planning on going to it however we all think we'll stay for a month and talk to other friends we haven't seen from swg in years and leave.

    Upset about solo play then bring up a soloable MMO like SWG? Nice, how easy was it getting doc buffs? 10k in a line on Coruscant, go to your grinding spot of choice (Mine being squall caves) and start burning mobs down, hell you could even macro grind. Pretending the game was or is something it never was or isn't just makes you look clueless, as if it wasn't already apparent. 

    no you got more xp for being in and working with a group. you had to get buffed from a doctor and entertainer. that was how great swg was in order to work on skills you had to work with your fellow players.

    Thanks for the irrelevant info. A group wasn't required, a group was a bonus, grouping in SWTOR will also give bonuses, including increased experience. Again, was still soloable.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that.

    instanced doesn't work.

    Did it break?

    instanced dungeons don't work look at every game that has them people hate them.

    Facepalming so hard right now.

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2).

    not only are raids a bad idea but that's wow. tor is trying to be wow but wow has more then 8 classes.

    From here on out any game to feature raiding is now a WoW clone.......what? Dude, seriously, chill out, stop ranting, everything will be ok. Also, I wasn't aware that more classes meant a game was far more successful. But since you wanna be like that. There are 16 in SWTOR, I'd say that's plenty. If they can actually change their advanced class more then once, I'm not sure, I'm starting to doubt it. I believe they may only allow recustomization of points in your advanced class tree, but nothing is written in stone, as far as I know.

    wow was just the first that made it big and like raph koster said wow just did so much damage to mmo's. want to know what was fun? going with a group to take out krayt dragons and getting great rewards like pearls or tissue. and all the advance class tree is doing is just adding onto a class that doesn't make it a new class.

    I soloed krayts, was easy. I got to keep the rewards for myself, good stuff. If you prefer to run with a group, what's stopping you? Nothing but yourself.

    Being locked into a tree once you select it does make it a new class. Which is why I added everything about it including the quote below in yellow. If it's true, what does this mean then? You select Guardian, you're a tank, etc. Being locked into what you chose means you can't just respec, it's no different then choosing a class on character creation. I also recall brawler in SWG advancing, are you telling me everything linked to it was not a class? SO there never was 30+ classes you say. Oh my, please stop.

    It seems that each class has two sub classes and you must decide which to choose - PCGames Translation

     

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

  • Darth_PeteDarth_Pete Member Posts: 559

    Why are some people whining about the dungeons being instanced? They need to be! What kind of horrible camp fest do you really want?

  • MMO.MaverickMMO.Maverick Member CommonPosts: 7,619

    The reason for that whining is simple: in their hearts and minds have (some) people determined to dislike SW:TOR, with a passion.

    The arguments they use are actually irrelevant, they aren't meant to make sense and are only a tool to voice their core dislike.

     

    No matter that dungeons are instanced in a lot of the current MMO's and even the upcoming ones, as I said for the haters and anti-SWTOR it's about finding criticism wherever you can. Very much alike the American Teabaggers, in that sense.

    The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's

    The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
    Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."

  • ShodanasShodanas Member RarePosts: 1,933

    Originally posted by OneMMOVet

    Originally posted by Shodanas

     

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

     

    Exploration - See above.

    Crafting - Developer blog on TOR's site, date 2/04/2010:

    Crafting is another area where we’ve talked a lot about community. The systems design team is not satisfied with some other crafting systems that we’ve seen, where many players craft almost exclusively for themselves. We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community have they shown a crafting system? no. all they have shown is people getting loot from mobs and that doesn't work. crafting should be the only way you get items or armor. and there should be a full on crafting class.

    Grouping - In order to do and experience the non class quests, the ones regarding the world beyond your personal story you have to team up with other people. They are group quests unfolding the biger picture regarding the world as a whole. Here is the article on MMORPG: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/feature/4411 It explains alot regarding companions and solo / group quests. how many people are going to group when everything can be done solo? bioware needs to see that mmo's are about getting a group going and going out and grinding. if you can't find a group too bad join a guild or get some friends.

    PvP - Devs have confirmed that there will be both world and instanced (battleground like) PvP. At least 2 planets, Alderaan and Taris will be open battlegrounds. Search for the info on TOR's website. open battlegrounds? from what it looks like both will just be pvp mini-games.

    Guilds - Again, developers stated from day 1 that there will be quilds. In fact a number of them are already forming, there is a seperate section on TOR's official forums just for this purpose.  My WoW guild will transfer to TOR as well. again why should they do this when the game is made with solo play in mind? my old swg guild is planning on going to it however we all think we'll stay for a month and talk to other friends we haven't seen from swg in years and leave.

    Dungeons - No info is revealed regarding dungeons yet, but i do hope that they will be instanced. I don't see a problem in that. instanced doesn't work.

    Raids - 8 classes do not make for raiding? You must be joking, right? On our last 10man icc clear in WoW the raid consisted of 8 classes. 2 druids (tank, resto), shaman (me enhancement), mage, DK (tank), warlock, hunter, rogue and warrior (furry x 2). not only are raids a bad idea but that's wow. tor is trying to be wow but wow has more then 8 classes.

    As you can see the info is out there for everyone to obtain it given he is interested. But as someone before me stated: haters are just haters and they will post their BS anyway.

    Open World - TOR's creative director James Ohlen at  Ten Ton Hamer:

    James: Our game is very open. We’ve developed several worlds, and each of those worlds is wide open, huge worlds with many square kilometers and you’re able to explore those worlds any way you want, just like your standard MMOG have they shown proof? no so far all they have shown is a 30 second video clip of every planet. unless they come out with a video showing a player walking around on a planet and they won't then it's not an open world game.

    Stoped reading after this. So you're implying that TOR's creative director is lying while giving an interview on one very popular website? Okay, i rest my case.

  • jaxsundanejaxsundane Member Posts: 2,776

    Originally posted by Yamota

    And the keyword is MMORPG. 

    Because I have read and seen several videos of this game but I have failed to find anything about this game that would make it a good MMORPG. Single player yeah, nice storylines, good gfx, Starwars, light-sabres. Yeah all good for a single player game.

    But what feature(s) will make it a good MMORPG? Because, right now, the game seems awfully like Star Trek Online in both that it is based on a huge IP and that it seems to be a single player game (or multiplayer lobby game) with a subscription fee.

     Care to explain what Bioware has said about TOR that even remotely resembles STO?

    but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....

  • jaxsundanejaxsundane Member Posts: 2,776

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Yamota

    And the keyword is MMORPG. 

    Because I have read and seen several videos of this game but I have failed to find anything about this game that would make it a good MMORPG. Single player yeah, nice storylines, good gfx, Starwars, light-sabres. Yeah all good for a single player game.

    But what feature(s) will make it a good MMORPG? Because, right now, the game seems awfully like Star Trek Online in both that it is based on a huge IP and that it seems to be a single player game (or multiplayer lobby game) with a subscription fee.

    Well, based on what they have said and depending on whether they implement what they have said as they have said it, the game will have large open zones (presumably like EQ2) One can do group quests and there are incentives for group questing, People will be playing alongside thousands of others.

    I believe they will have guilds as well, crafting and a way to sell to others.

    So is that what you were looking for or was their something specific?

    Persistance mostly. Ever since WoW it seems to have become a lost concept.

    And by that I mean that the conflict between Sith and the Jedi, Guilds vs Guilds or even groups vs groups is not something that stops or are in a ever-lasting circle where possibility of loss or victory is not there. For obvious reasons you should not be able to entirely destroy Sith or Jedi but to be able to score partial victories? And certainly one guild being about to destroy another, is the kind of persistance I am talking about.

    And it does not even have to be about PvP. Even in PvE it would be nice to see an MMORPG with persistant features, like if you and your guild cleans out a whole population of a certain type(s) of a mob from an area then they are gone. If someone kill Jabba the Hutt then he IS dead.

    Events that have a start and an finish with an end-result that actually impacts the world. You know, actual persistance...

    Instead all I am reading is about cool Jedi/Sith classes, space dog-fighting, single player story lines. Sounds fun, but all that can be done in a single player game. So what does this game actually bring to the MMORPG genre beside yet another big IP with fancy bling, bling and in-depth single story lines that does not affect the world, what so ever?

     From this description you give most of the games we consider to be MMORPG's aren't.

    but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....

  • thexratedthexrated Member UncommonPosts: 1,368

    Instead all I am reading is about cool Jedi/Sith classes, space dog-fighting, single player story lines. Sounds fun, but all that can be done in a single player game. So what does this game actually bring to the MMORPG genre beside yet another big IP with fancy bling, bling and in-depth single story lines that does not affect the world, what so ever?

    I do not think Bioware was even attempting to bring a lot to this genre apart from production quality with their interactive storytelling medium, which I have to say is a pretty good fit for this IP. 

    Also, not every single MMORPG has to be designed with the same focus or with identiacal gameplay elements. Meaningful changes to the game world can be observed in games like EVE. It is also the game where I get my fix for that MMO sub-genre. Plus it is done exceptionally well. I actually do not even want that kind of gameplay into an action/adventure MMORPG that Bioware is in process of making. In fact, I think it would spoil the fun.

    "The person who experiences greatness must have a feeling for the myth he is in."

  • IsaneIsane Member UncommonPosts: 2,630

    Originally posted by cyphers

    Originally posted by whilan

     


    TL:DR version: question was asked and answered best as possible, all companies over-hype, part of marketing.  Bioware has proven they can make good games, question is can they turn it into a MMO.  Features i think will be in game: grouping, questing, pvp in designated areas.  Love Alignment systems.

    Disclaimer:  This is my opinion and views, they will most likely differ form yours.

    PS: free cookie to anyone who gets through that wall of text.


    Very good arguments in your post, it's like you said.

    Ok, I want my cookie now image

     

    Bioware devs have said it. Demos have shown certain game aspects. Playtesters have confirmed some more stuff, like even the origin planets being huge.

    While a reasonable amount of scepticism is healthy, to doubt everything that is revealed that isn't conform your belief or gut feeling is irrational.

     

    I'm guessing some people have been following and believing the hype and been disappointed by other MMO's in the past, so now they cling to their mantra 'don't believe anything if it sounds like those other hypes, trust your gut'. But their gut hadn't done them a favor those other times too, right?

    Me, I can be enthusiastic about games but I never followed any hype of any game. So I never felt bitter that a game wasn't what it or people claimed it to be beforehand, because I had a 'let's wait and see and experience it myself in open beta' attitude anyway.

    That's why I could even enjoy MMO's like CO, Aion, AoC, LotrO and others for what they offered, not for what any hype or unrealistic expectations made it out to be. A stance I intend to keep doing for upcoming MMO's as GW2, SW:TOR, Rift and others as well.

    Cypher, and your way of thinking is so so spot on and sensible... too sensible ... See you in game.

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • WarmakerWarmaker Member UncommonPosts: 2,246

    Originally posted by dirtyside

    where does it say huge open world ? huge meaning what ?

    what makes this a good mmo is its STAR WARS fool ! :)

    I'm sure SOE had that in mind when they made SWG.  And in a similiar light, I'm sure it was the same when Cryptic & Atari went down the road with Star Trek.

    "I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)

  • FaelsunFaelsun Member UncommonPosts: 501

    Originally posted by aleos

    Guess you'll just have to buy it and find out.

    LOL I love it when people assume thats the natural next step after finding out a game will probably be terrible, it looks terrible, probably is terrible....... " buy it and find out just how terrible" Its like telling someone to taste something that you know tastes bad.

     

    It doesn't work that way , if the game gets out the door and the Beta reviews on it are terrible, only the most die hard fanatic is going to mess with it. TOR wont be a special snowflake, it's subject to the rules of the mmorpg world, and too many of us have played hyped up games that were in reality garbage, Dark and Light comes to mind... Warhammer, AOC, and any other number of garbage games now used as coasters.

  • ShodanasShodanas Member RarePosts: 1,933

    Originally posted by Faelsun

    Originally posted by aleos

    Guess you'll just have to buy it and find out.

    LOL I love it when people assume thats the natural next step after finding out a game will probably be terrible, it looks terrible, probably is terrible....... " buy it and find out just how terrible" Its like telling someone to taste something that you know tastes bad.

     

    It doesn't work that way , if the game gets out the door and the Beta reviews on it are terrible, only the most die hard fanatic is going to mess with it. TOR wont be a special snowflake, it's subject to the rules of the mmorpg world, and too many of us have played hyped up games that were in reality garbage, Dark and Light comes to mind... Warhammer, AOC, and any other number of garbage games now used as coasters.

    It's funny how exceptional you fail to follow your own advice. So far you have flooded these boards with mindless hate posts, in many cases deliberately skipping or ignoring confirmed info about TOR which contradicts your claims. Wait for some solid beta info and in case the testers state that it sucks then by all means, go rampant.

  • HorusraHorusra Member EpicPosts: 4,411

    Accept on ones review but your own.  I do usually wait for a free trial though. 

  • Frostbite05Frostbite05 Member, Newbie CommonPosts: 1,880

    Originally posted by Faelsun

    Originally posted by aleos

    Guess you'll just have to buy it and find out.

    LOL I love it when people assume thats the natural next step after finding out a game will probably be terrible, it looks terrible, probably is terrible....... " buy it and find out just how terrible" Its like telling someone to taste something that you know tastes bad.

     

    It doesn't work that way , if the game gets out the door and the Beta reviews on it are terrible, only the most die hard fanatic is going to mess with it. TOR wont be a special snowflake, it's subject to the rules of the mmorpg world, and too many of us have played hyped up games that were in reality garbage, Dark and Light comes to mind... Warhammer, AOC, and any other number of garbage games now used as coasters.

    Well considering AoC turned things around speaks volumes. Also the game is being produced by one of the few developers and will take longer to put out a finished product rather than forcing something out the door half finished aka Cryptic Studios.

  • GylfiGylfi Member UncommonPosts: 708

    "What makes this game a good MMORPG?"

    Wait lemme think about it.

    uuuuh..


    uuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhh.


    uh.

  • FaelsunFaelsun Member UncommonPosts: 501

    Originally posted by Frostbite05

    Originally posted by Faelsun


    Originally posted by aleos

    Guess you'll just have to buy it and find out.

    LOL I love it when people assume thats the natural next step after finding out a game will probably be terrible, it looks terrible, probably is terrible....... " buy it and find out just how terrible" Its like telling someone to taste something that you know tastes bad.

     

    It doesn't work that way , if the game gets out the door and the Beta reviews on it are terrible, only the most die hard fanatic is going to mess with it. TOR wont be a special snowflake, it's subject to the rules of the mmorpg world, and too many of us have played hyped up games that were in reality garbage, Dark and Light comes to mind... Warhammer, AOC, and any other number of garbage games now used as coasters.

    Well considering AoC turned things around speaks volumes. Also the game is being produced by one of the few developers and will take longer to put out a finished product rather than forcing something out the door half finished aka Cryptic Studios.

    LOL please tell me you're joking, AOC would be lucky to have 40k right now.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775

    Originally posted by Yamota

    And the keyword is MMORPG. 

    Because I have read and seen several videos of this game but I have failed to find anything about this game that would make it a good MMORPG. Single player yeah, nice storylines, good gfx, Starwars, light-sabres. Yeah all good for a single player game.

    But what feature(s) will make it a good MMORPG? Because, right now, the game seems awfully like Star Trek Online in both that it is based on a huge IP and that it seems to be a single player game (or multiplayer lobby game) with a subscription fee.

     

    Who cares? I care more about whether it is a good GAME.

    Nice story line. Good combat. Coop player ... all good stuff. And it is Bioware. They make good games. I have no problem playing a good lobby game with a sub.

    If it is F2P .... even better.

  • SkuzSkuz Member UncommonPosts: 1,018

    Until it's been played for several months I think that's going to be really hard to say.

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