Say NO to sexism! - A reply to "the girls at blizzcon"

Elikal

I must say I find it outrageous that a website which claim to be decend like MMORPG.com has an entire so called "news" article about nothing but the depiction of women in underwear! Yes, I know it must sound absurdly old fashioned, and likely I belong to a dying sort of old fashioned guys. But someone has to stand up and say, it is enough. I know a lot of female gamers, and many of them more often than not do not speak up enough for their own matters, preferring to stay in the background, so I feel it is up to a gentleman to come and speak up.

This is so primitive of you guys. Do you have no shame? Do you have no education from your parents? What would your mother say if she found you guys sinking so low as to cheer and gaze at women dressed in underwear in public?

I am by no means a prude person, and I think sex is something healthy and good. But it is something done in the bedroom or in your privacy. This oversexualization of our public society is something I find abhorrent. Keep sex into areas where it belongs. Porn sites if you need such stimulation. There is nothing wrong with that; we all have our desires. But dragging it into the public and making women into objects in your games and even at those terrible booths... it just is not what a real gentleman would do or enjoy. Why do games, which are also for children, have to show such over-sexualized material? Do we have no sense for the protection of kids, and now MMORPG.com promotes such things.

Mind you, I have nothing against people enjoying erotic art. Not at all. But keep things where they belong. Dragging them unto games is just low. Women still have a very difficult stand in western society. They usually earn less money for the same work, they have way more difficulties to get the better jobs and are more often the object of mistreatment and violence than men. We should respect them and not use then as objects for something cheap as computer games. How would you guys feel if every 2nd male character in a game was scantly dressed in skin tight stuff like Lara Croft? How would you feel if game booths were full of men in underwear bending and bowing over that it would look as if their testicles would fall right out of their pants any moment? Would you not feel ashamed and uneasy?

Again. Nothing is wrong with erotic, but keep it away from games where minors are, and where people share it in privacy and by their own free will.

This is shameful and does not behave a gentleman.

 

EDIT: Why was this moved to off-topic? You make a headline about these type of women under "news", but the reply to it is "off-topic"? Talking about double-standards, eh? The awarness of men is yet in stone age, it seems. Thanks for proving my point, though.

BeansnBread

It is not shameful or sexist.

 

There, now both opinions are represented.

maskedweasel

Oh Elikal.  Didn't you say something about having a Guys of Blizzcon article or something?

 

Regardless,  I dunno,  the whole gaming thing plays to men moreso then women,  and this is just an extension to that.  Growing up a gamer,  its not like you can't see the same sexual implications in games, towards women,  men.... interdimensional or mythological species.  

 

Agree or disagree,  in some form its just part of gaming culture.

MMOman101

I did not read the article because of the title and the picture.  I was surprised to see the article posted.  I do understand though, they put out X amounts of articles a week and sometimes you can tell they are grasping at straws. 

Palebane

I'm surprised you think porn is OK, but are offended by girls showing off their costumes on a gaming site. I think porn is very likely more exploitative than role playing.

Elikal

Originally posted by maskedweasel

Oh Elikal.  Didn't you say something about having a Guys of Blizzcon article or something?

 

Regardless,  I dunno,  the whole gaming thing plays to men moreso then women,  and this is just an extension to that.  Growing up a gamer,  its not like you can't see the same sexual implications in games, towards women,  men.... interdimensional or mythological species.  

 

Agree or disagree,  in some form its just part of gaming culture.

Yes, it was a provocative joke to make people think what they do.

Many things used to be "part of a pop culture". Like the stereotypical depiction of black people or jewish in stories of the past century. But fortunately we left those stereotype behind. Same should apply to the depiction of women in games.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by maskedweasel

Oh Elikal.  Didn't you say something about having a Guys of Blizzcon article or something?

 

Regardless,  I dunno,  the whole gaming thing plays to men moreso then women,  and this is just an extension to that.  Growing up a gamer,  its not like you can't see the same sexual implications in games, towards women,  men.... interdimensional or mythological species.  

 

Agree or disagree,  in some form its just part of gaming culture.

Yes, it was a provocative joke to make people think what they do.

Many things used to be "part of a pop culture". Like the stereotypical depiction of black people or jewish in stories of the past century. But fortunately we left those stereotype behind. Same should apply to the depiction of women in games.

So, the women themselves actually want to have the freedom to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them. They are depicting themselves, not being depicted. It's really their choice.

 

Unless, you actually want to repress women by not giving them that choice?

Elikal

Originally posted by Palebane

I'm surprised you think porn is OK, but are offended by girls showing off their costumes on a gaming site. I think porn is very likely more exploitative than role playing.

I don't want to discuss the complex topic of pornography. I just say, sex is natural and sexual fantasies too. I am not prude. But keep it out of public stuff and where people want to share it. Some pornographic things are exploitative but not all. But this isn't the topic here and does, essentially, not belong to a game site debate. Things in games however do.

Elikal

Originally posted by Rockgod99

I knew who posted this before I even clicked on the damn thing. Stop crying bro, next time the site will feature something on dudes which will be more to your liking. No need to get all nuts over women enjoying a little cosplay.

Sir, I don't want ridiculously dressed men in games either! Actually I don't want ANY person in underwear in fantasy games.

Elikal

Originally posted by colddog04

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by maskedweasel

Oh Elikal.  Didn't you say something about having a Guys of Blizzcon article or something?

 

Regardless,  I dunno,  the whole gaming thing plays to men moreso then women,  and this is just an extension to that.  Growing up a gamer,  its not like you can't see the same sexual implications in games, towards women,  men.... interdimensional or mythological species.  

 

Agree or disagree,  in some form its just part of gaming culture.

Yes, it was a provocative joke to make people think what they do.

Many things used to be "part of a pop culture". Like the stereotypical depiction of black people or jewish in stories of the past century. But fortunately we left those stereotype behind. Same should apply to the depiction of women in games.

So, the women themselves actually want to have the freedom to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them. They are depicting themselves, not being depicted. It's really their choice.

 

Unless, you actually want to repress women by not giving them that choice?

I would dispute the conscious freedom of will here. Often people misbehave and shed a bad light on the rest of their folks. When a man acts shameful, I distance myself from him. It is what a decend person does, whatever the case is.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by colddog04

So, the women themselves actually want to have the freedom to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them. They are depicting themselves, not being depicted. It's really their choice.

 

Unless, you actually want to repress women by not giving them that choice?

I would dispute the conscious freedom of will here. Often people misbehave and shed a bad light on the rest of their folks. When a man acts shameful, I distance myself from him. It is what a decend person does, whatever the case is.

You can say that you "dispute" it all you want. Those women were standing there ready to have their picture taken. They knew these pictures would be looked at. It is their conscious choice.

 

Now you are saying that those women are shameful? Or are you saying that the people taking the pictures are shameful?

mmoguy43

I don't know who you think you are supporting but you certainly aren't supporting the girls that worked hard on those costumes and want to show them off.

Shoju

Originally posted by Elikal

Like the stereotypical depiction of black people or jewish in stories of the past century. But fortunately we left those stereotype behind.

When did that happen, because I must have slept though it.  You don't have to look to far to find examples of people still depicting or making jokes about others based on ethnic/racial/sexual stereotypes.

A lot of the grils in that article were dressed like that because they wanted to be.  They make the costumes in order to have fun 'dressing up' and perhaps win some swag from the contests.  Others get paid to model/promote games at booths.  Neither group are being exploited as they either make the concious choice to go to these events dressed in the attire, or they are being employed to do so.  If they felt exploited then I am sure that these women would not be participating in the activities.

Elikal

Originally posted by mmoguy43

I don't know who you think you are supporting but you certainly aren't supporting the girls that worked hard on those costumes and want to show them off.

Ever heard of such a thing as socialization? People believe in the chains which whom they grew up. Example: back then when slavery was normal, a lot of slaves never doubted that this was the natural way of things. Awareness of repression is something people have to learn, it does not fall from trees.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by mmoguy43

I don't know who you think you are supporting but you certainly aren't supporting the girls that worked hard on those costumes and want to show them off.

Ever heard of such a thing as socialization? People believe in the chains which whom they grew up. Example: back then when slavery was normal, a lot of slaves never doubted that this was the natural way of things. Awareness of repression is something people have to learn, it does not fall from trees.

And right now you are attempting to keep women in their "chains." You want their choice to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them taken away from them. You are repressing them, not allowing them more freedoms.

Elikal

Originally posted by Shoju

Originally posted by Elikal

Like the stereotypical depiction of black people or jewish in stories of the past century. But fortunately we left those stereotype behind.

When did that happen, because I must have slept though it.  You don't have to look to far to find examples of people still depicting or making jokes about others based on ethnic/racial/sexual stereotypes.

A lot of the grils in that article were dressed like that because they wanted to be.  They make the costumes in order to have fun 'dressing up' and perhaps win some swag from the contests.  Others get paid to model/promote games at booths.  Neither group are being exploited as they either make the concious choice to go to these events dressed in the attire, or they are being employed to do so.  If they felt exploited then I am sure that these women would not be participating in the activities.

Well just read Tolkien. Did you never notice that ALL good people are white and all black people (Orcs and Haradrim) are evil? Well, if you DIDN'T notice it is likely because you are white. It takes patience and thought to realize how easy we step on the honor of others and don't even notice.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Well just read Tolkien. Did you never notice that ALL good people are white and all black people (Orcs and Haradrim) are evil? Well, if you DIDN'T notice it is likely because you are white. It takes patience and thought to realize how easy we step on the honor of others and don't even notice.

So now Tolkien is a racist. How far will you go?

Elikal

Originally posted by colddog04

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by mmoguy43

I don't know who you think you are supporting but you certainly aren't supporting the girls that worked hard on those costumes and want to show them off.

Ever heard of such a thing as socialization? People believe in the chains which whom they grew up. Example: back then when slavery was normal, a lot of slaves never doubted that this was the natural way of things. Awareness of repression is something people have to learn, it does not fall from trees.

And right now you are attempting to keep women in their "chains." You want their choice to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them taken away from them. You are repressing them, not allowing them more freedoms.

I want all sexuality out of games who are also for minors. That is the most important topic.

Second, I don't want sexuality in fantasy for artistic reasons. Galadriel or Arwen do not get more interesting because you see them in a bikini chainmail. (Or Aragorn or Gandalf, for example.) It is ridiculous.

Third, even IF the setting fits, like Conan, make it for adults only, warn people ahead what's coming and then make it equal for both. Result: Conan is as scantly dressed as Red Sonja, or what that Conan char's name was. Then at least it is equality. But with semi-nude women and dressed men you make women into objects of a power difference, saying "men are in charge and women are their wanton objects." I do not condone this.

Elikal

Originally posted by colddog04

Originally posted by Elikal

Well just read Tolkien. Did you never notice that ALL good people are white and all black people (Orcs and Haradrim) are evil? Well, if you DIDN'T notice it is likely because you are white. It takes patience and thought to realize how easy we step on the honor of others and don't even notice.

So now Tolkien is a racist. How far will you go?

For truth? I will go back to the end of the world and fro!

I never said he was a racist.

But he was unaware of what he did, easy giving into the prejudicial thinking of his era.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by colddog04

And right now you are attempting to keep women in their "chains." You want their choice to dress up in a costume and have pictures taken of them taken away from them. You are repressing them, not allowing them more freedoms.

I want all sexuality out of games who are also for minors. That is the most important topic.

Second, I don't want sexuality in fantasy for artistic reasons. Galadriel or Arwen do not get more interesting because you see them in a bikini chainmail. (Or Aragorn or Gandalf, for example.) It is ridiculous.

Third, even IF the setting fits, like Conan, make it for adults only, warn people ahead what's coming and then make it equal for both. Result: Conan is as scantly dressed as Red Sonja, or what that Conan char's name was. Then at least it is equality. But with semi-nude women and dressed men you make women into objects of a power difference, saying "men are in charge and women are their wanton objects." I do not condone this.

You view the pictures as sexually explicit.

 

Middle Eastern countries view the ankle as sexually explicit.

 

You are treating women like many middle eastern countries are without understanding that you are doing it.

 

You think ankle is fine and acceptable. Guess what? It's not. I have a problem with minors viewing a womans ankle.

mmoguy43

This thread might as well be titled "How Eikal wish the world was(without sex)" because it doesn't have much to do with just blizzcon girls.

deviliscious

You people are insane.

We already know we are the far superior gender. We can make men do as we please by just revealing parts of our skin. You are all doomed to be ruled by boobs FOREVER!! Mwahahah!!

Elikal

Originally posted by mmoguy43

This thread might as well be titled "How Eikal wish the world was(without sex)" because it doesn't have much to do with just blizzcon girls.

Maybe you rethink what you just said.

Elikal

Originally posted by deviliscious

You people are insane.

We already know we are the far superior gender. We can make men do as we please by just revealing parts of our skin. You are all doomed to be ruled by boobs FOREVER!! Mwahahah!!

Tell that the many raped women who "ruled men" with their naked skin.

BeansnBread

Originally posted by Elikal

Originally posted by deviliscious

You people are insane.

We already know we are the far superior gender. We can make men do as we please by just revealing parts of our skin. You are all doomed to be ruled by boobs FOREVER!! Mwahahah!!

Tell that the many raped women who "ruled men" with their naked skin.

Wow, just wow.

deviliscious

Elikal, you are just in boob denial. Rather than fear the boobs you should submit like the rest of the male population. Now go get your loin cloth and do your chores!