2 major features missing, from this "SANDBOX"

M4ko

First off, the grind. What kind of fkn sandbox is it when you have to grind your way up, and its a LONG LONG grind to get anything usefull.

- If this was really a sandbox they wouldve gotten rid of PVE all together, or make it a non-essential part of the game. THis was attempted in FOM and its somewhat working. While FOM is pretty much a 1 man operation, MHS with ~80 member team, couldve easily managed to create a working non PVE/Grind progression. 

All progression couldve been done through PVP which would give you a sense of acomplishment that comes directly from your experience and skills, and not mindless PVE grind.

 

2nd. Exploration. Atanasov claimed that explorers would be rewarded... yea right, rewarded with getting stuck between cliffs and mountains.

-Exploration is the only enjoyable feature so far in this game for me, but it still has no rewards. So how about adding loot in hard to get to places with random loot spawn features (timer, quantity, location etc), instead of getting a quest of heading to x location and looting a wreck....

D_TOX

{Mod Edit}

You made this thread earlier in the week

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/305709/Terrible-game.html

But still bought the game, logged in and proceeded to return to MMORPG to bash it some more?

Dunno what to say really. I envy your disposable time and income good sir. As for your post, well, any MMO needs some sort of PvE, you telling me there shouldn't be any mobs in the entire world except players? You'd only be here moaning about how desolate/boring the world is. But whatever, enjoy playing Earthrise some more... I think?

Arquiteto

Originally posted by D_TOX

{Mod Edit}

You made this thread earlier in the week

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/305709/Terrible-game.html

But still bought the game, logged in and proceeded to return to MMORPG to bash it some more?

Dunno what to say really. I envy your disposable time and income good sir. As for your post, well, any MMO needs some sort of PvE, you telling me there shouldn't be any mobs in the entire world except players? You'd only be here moaning about how desolate/boring the world is. But whatever, enjoy playing Earthrise some more... I think?

Yeah not sure if the op bought the game. If he was so against it. I myself did not purchase .

 

I agree all mmos need some sort of pve. They just need to make it so pvp is just as lucritive for gaining bp.

MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 

 

If this was really a sandbox they wouldve gotten rid of PVE all together

 

There is no reason why a sandbox can't have PvE.

Please tell us your definition of "sandbox" and then we know if it corresponds with the definition the rest of humanity holds.

pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 In this case the beta is exactly what you get for release though, or by final game do you mean in 3 years?

go to the forums, its in a worse state now then beta

MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 In this case the beta is exactly what you get for release though, or by final game do you mean in 3 years?

go to the forums, its in a worse state now then beta

That's the thing with mmo's. They're constantly changing. They can suddenly go from great to bad and vice versa.

 

Earthrise has no major gameplay flaws, just some engine issues which seemed to be on a fast track towards fixing.

 

 

 

Also, people's opinions aren'ty representative for anything even remotely resembling the truth.

wildtalent

To the OP, if you remove PVE completely you don't have a MMORPG.  Then you would have an arena based PVP game. You talk about exploring should be rewarded but if you don't have to fight the enviroment while exploring what would you be being rewarded for?  Walking from point A to random point B?  Or maybe you are referring to removing quests or missions that pit you agains the enviroment, but perhaps leaving a hostile enviroment that you can still move thorugh and explore.  That would be interesting for sure, but that's not what you said.  But to be honest, even in sandbox mmorpgs you have quests and missions because they are the heart of what the genre is about.  I dunno OP, I just don't get it.

cukimunga

Well you can PvP to max level  in WoW and it doesn't make it any more of a sandbox..  Having PvE IMO doesn't make a game any less sandbox. But if the only or main way of leveling is through questing then it would be more themepark. 

 

I say the more things to do the better. My Ideal sandbox game there would be some PvE and have fewer but harder and longer to complete quests. But also have player generated quests or missions.    The mobs would have AI like in Ryzom but more advanced. 

 

Mobs that migrate, reproduce and have behavior changes is a big must. Like lets say some pack of wolves migrated near this player who is a farmer and  are killing his livestock.  He posts on a local town board that he needs help with these wolves. THen you have the option to just go in and slay them or if you're like a druid or ranger hippie type character you'd see if you could get the wolves to migrate to a new place. . THis alone could start some interesting PvP that has meaning and not just. Oh I see the opposite faction lets kill them. 

 

Some of the Ideas I have, I'm not sure they are even possible but with some of the technology I've seen in some other sandbox's it makes me wonder why we didn't go into the Sandbox way of gaming instead of the Themepark.  IMO Sandbox is far better if done right. 

Baihuigau

Its not worse but it looks like its not any better, basically the retail client is the beta client with banks added and possibly a retail server, thats still up for discussion since it looks like pings are about the same, whats interesting is my beta client is still pointing to the beta servers and says theres a new version available, sounds to me their using the beta servers for retail or somehow the login server is still the beta login server.

pmaura

I will give the OP this, that you should be able to advance your skills through PVP just as much as PVE.

M4ko

Originally posted by Arquiteto

Originally posted by D_TOX

{Mod Edit}

You made this thread earlier in the week

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/305709/Terrible-game.html

But still bought the game, logged in and proceeded to return to MMORPG to bash it some more?

Dunno what to say really. I envy your disposable time and income good sir. As for your post, well, any MMO needs some sort of PvE, you telling me there shouldn't be any mobs in the entire world except players? You'd only be here moaning about how desolate/boring the world is. But whatever, enjoy playing Earthrise some more... I think?

Yeah not sure if the op bought the game. If he was so against it. I myself did not purchase .

 

I agree all mmos need some sort of pve. They just need to make it so pvp is just as lucritive for gaining bp.

 

I have said that thres no need for a complete PVE wipe, many people wont like it. But having PVE as the sole means of progression, especially this boring, is nothing new or sandboxy.

pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 In this case the beta is exactly what you get for release though, or by final game do you mean in 3 years?

go to the forums, its in a worse state now then beta

That's the thing with mmo's. They're constantly changing. They can suddenly go from great to bad and vice versa.

 

Earthrise has no major gameplay flaws, just some engine issues which seemed to be on a fast track towards fixing.

 

 

 

Also, people's opinions aren'ty representative for anything even remotely resembling the truth.

 what game has ever recovered?

MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 In this case the beta is exactly what you get for release though, or by final game do you mean in 3 years?

go to the forums, its in a worse state now then beta

That's the thing with mmo's. They're constantly changing. They can suddenly go from great to bad and vice versa.

 

Earthrise has no major gameplay flaws, just some engine issues which seemed to be on a fast track towards fixing.

 

 

 

Also, people's opinions aren'ty representative for anything even remotely resembling the truth.

 what game has ever recovered?

 

This will be a piss poor discussion because the game I will name will contradict you view of what is "recovery". And your view of "recovery" will be the exact antithesis of the one you would need to agree with me.

 

Frankly, the fact that you are unable to find an mmo that has recovered, out of the dozens that have existed, is telling enough.

 

Also, I question the assumption that ER has to recover. I consider this state of affairs to be normal in the mmo industry. It kinda comes with the territory.

Drakynn

This isn't a knock on the game as I haven't played it and hav eno plans to yet...I'm jsut interested in how it developes for now but...

Was I the only one who read the title and  was expecting to see a troll post claiming the said two things were a box and sand ?

Kuinn

Sandbox should definately have PvE, sandbox (should) means only that it's not a stricktly themed linear line of a game, like themeparks.

 

You could loosely compare a mmorpg with no PvE to the real world if it had humans only in it. Bleh.

TruthXHurts

Originally posted by M4ko

First off, the grind. What kind of fkn sandbox is it when you have to grind your way up, and its a LONG LONG grind to get anything usefull.

- If this was really a sandbox they wouldve gotten rid of PVE all together, or make it a non-essential part of the game. THis was attempted in FOM and its somewhat working. While FOM is pretty much a 1 man operation, MHS with ~80 member team, couldve easily managed to create a working non PVE/Grind progression. 

All progression couldve been done through PVP which would give you a sense of acomplishment that comes directly from your experience and skills, and not mindless PVE grind.

 

2nd. Exploration. Atanasov claimed that explorers would be rewarded... yea right, rewarded with getting stuck between cliffs and mountains.

-Exploration is the only enjoyable feature so far in this game for me, but it still has no rewards. So how about adding loot in hard to get to places with random loot spawn features (timer, quantity, location etc), instead of getting a quest of heading to x location and looting a wreck....

Skill gains through PVP have always been extremely exploitable in Sandbox MMO's

 

Didn't FOM announce they were pulling the plug?

Atlan99

Originally posted by MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

Originally posted by pmaura

Originally posted by MadAce

A beta isn't representative for the final game.

 In this case the beta is exactly what you get for release though, or by final game do you mean in 3 years?

go to the forums, its in a worse state now then beta

That's the thing with mmo's. They're constantly changing. They can suddenly go from great to bad and vice versa.

 

Earthrise has no major gameplay flaws, just some engine issues which seemed to be on a fast track towards fixing.

 

 

 

Also, people's opinions aren'ty representative for anything even remotely resembling the truth.

 what game has ever recovered?

 

This will be a piss poor discussion because the game I will name will contradict you view of what is "recovery". And your view of "recovery" will be the exact antithesis of the one you would need to agree with me.

 

Frankly, the fact that you are unable to find an mmo that has recovered, out of the dozens that have existed, is telling enough.

 

Also, I question the assumption that ER has to recover. I consider this state of affairs to be normal in the mmo industry. It kinda comes with the territory.

Have you played the Rift beta?

You may hate the game but can't knock the company or it's delivery. The game in beta plays better than alot of games that have already launched.

xpiher

Originally posted by M4ko

First off, the grind. What kind of fkn sandbox is it when you have to grind your way up, and its a LONG LONG grind to get anything usefull.

- If this was really a sandbox they wouldve gotten rid of PVE all together, or make it a non-essential part of the game. THis was attempted in FOM and its somewhat working. While FOM is pretty much a 1 man operation, MHS with ~80 member team, couldve easily managed to create a working non PVE/Grind progression. 

All progression couldve been done through PVP which would give you a sense of acomplishment that comes directly from your experience and skills, and not mindless PVE grind.

 

2nd. Exploration. Atanasov claimed that explorers would be rewarded... yea right, rewarded with getting stuck between cliffs and mountains.

-Exploration is the only enjoyable feature so far in this game for me, but it still has no rewards. So how about adding loot in hard to get to places with random loot spawn features (timer, quantity, location etc), instead of getting a quest of heading to x location and looting a wreck....

Requiring PvE is an essential part of making a great PvP game. You would understand this if you would step back and look at what causes PvP to mean more than just Ego. 

darker70

To the OP i'm starting to wonder if u are on medication or useing alternate practices to alter your state of mind,why keep going off on Earthrise like a hyper enraged troll?

And if so at least post something that actually as any sembalance and constitutes a valid argument and not a senseless diatribe. 

M4ko

can we please get off the "NO PVE" topic, cuz thats all fanbois can retaliate with. I clearly said it in OP that PVE doesnt have to go altogether, but when its placed there as the only source for advancement, especially in the most primitive way possible in an MMOPRG, then its pretty pathetic.

 

In fact reading ER forums right now, and every thread that complains about the game is filled with defenders responding with some dumbest stuff ever. It used to be "its just beta", now after launch they switch the phrase to "no MMORPG in history of gaming had ever a flawless launch" or "its a sandbox, its not for everybody", yea its for dummies like who want to waste their money hoping that their MMO fix will finally arrive, these junkies wouldve paid 150$ for it. I wonder what they will be saying in 2 months, something like "its only been 2 months, give it another 2 months" so fkn lame.

Let me tell you that Ive never seen a worse launch from any other MMORPG before.

M4ko

Originally posted by darker70

To the OP i'm starting to wonder if u are on medication or useing alternate practices to alter your state of mind,why keep going off on Earthrise like a hyper enraged troll?

And if so at least post something that actually as any sembalance and constitutes a valid argument and not a senseless diatribe. 

oh look its a troll whos trying to insult you with his "superior" intelligence  and still manages to misspell the words he just looked up on Google.

 

Why dont YOU state what exactly you disagree with in my posts, because i explain everything pretty clearly, but since this is clearly not your goal, why dont you go back to your damp cave.

xpiher

Originally posted by M4ko

can we please get off the "NO PVE" topic, cuz thats all fanbois can retaliate with. I clearly said it in OP that PVE doesnt have to go altogether, but when its placed there as the only source for advancement, especially in the most primitive way possible in an MMOPRG, then its pretty pathetic.

 1) I'm not a fanboy, I don't even own the game

2) If PvP = EXP then people would macro

Let me tell you that Ive never seen a worse launch from any other MMORPG before.

You didn't play MO then did you. What about AoC?

 

PvE is require for advancement because if you allowed players to get exp from players people would macro no matter how many anti-macro programs you put into place. People would Grife players just for exp. You may enjoy a game where you can kill a person every 2 seconds to get exp, but most people don't like midnless grifing on either end. 

M4ko

Originally posted by xpiher

Originally posted by M4ko

can we please get off the "NO PVE" topic, cuz thats all fanbois can retaliate with. I clearly said it in OP that PVE doesnt have to go altogether, but when its placed there as the only source for advancement, especially in the most primitive way possible in an MMOPRG, then its pretty pathetic.

 1) I'm not a fanboy, I don't even own the game

2) If PvP = EXP then people would macro

Let me tell you that Ive never seen a worse launch from any other MMORPG before.

You didn't play MO then did you. What about AoC?

 

PvE is require for advancement because if you allowed players to get exp from players people would macro no matter how many anti-macro programs you put into place. People would Grife players just for exp. You may enjoy a game where you can kill a person every 2 seconds to get exp, but most people don't like midnless grifing on either end. 

FOM managed progression without PVE, there could be more alternative ways of advancement, but  Im not gonna brainstorm on how it could be done becuase thats what Atanasov shouldve been doing when he thought of calling this a "Sandbox".  Senseless grind is not innovative or fun.

 

AOC i started on day one and had no problems with it except for noticing that this game might be pretty boring with everything being so linear, and after 3 weeks i quit that circus. Graphically and mechanically game was very stable and easy to control.

MadAce

Originally posted by M4ko

can we please get off the "NO PVE" topic, cuz thats all fanbois can retaliate with. I clearly said it in OP that PVE doesnt have to go altogether, but when its placed there as the only source for advancement, especially in the most primitive way possible in an MMOPRG, then its pretty pathetic.

 

In fact reading ER forums right now, and every thread that complains about the game is filled with defenders responding with some dumbest stuff ever. It used to be "its just beta", now after launch they switch the phrase to "no MMORPG in history of gaming had ever a flawless launch" or "its a sandbox, its not for everybody", yea its for dummies like who want to waste their money hoping that their MMO fix will finally arrive, these junkies wouldve paid 150$ for it. I wonder what they will be saying in 2 months, something like "its only been 2 months, give it another 2 months" so fkn lame.

Let me tell you that Ive never seen a worse launch from any other MMORPG before.

 

Well it would then seem to me you have played few mmo's.

 

I have a question.

 

What are you getting out of this?

Naowut

I think the OPs definition of sandbox is kinda off.

M4ko

Originally posted by MadAce

Originally posted by M4ko

can we please get off the "NO PVE" topic, cuz thats all fanbois can retaliate with. I clearly said it in OP that PVE doesnt have to go altogether, but when its placed there as the only source for advancement, especially in the most primitive way possible in an MMOPRG, then its pretty pathetic.

 

In fact reading ER forums right now, and every thread that complains about the game is filled with defenders responding with some dumbest stuff ever. It used to be "its just beta", now after launch they switch the phrase to "no MMORPG in history of gaming had ever a flawless launch" or "its a sandbox, its not for everybody", yea its for dummies like who want to waste their money hoping that their MMO fix will finally arrive, these junkies wouldve paid 150$ for it. I wonder what they will be saying in 2 months, something like "its only been 2 months, give it another 2 months" so fkn lame.

Let me tell you that Ive never seen a worse launch from any other MMORPG before.

 

Well it would then seem to me you have played few mmo's.

 

I have a question.

 

What are you getting out of this?

If i were to ask you which MMOs had worse launches id be hitting my head against the wall because youd probaly say something like EVE, SWG, AOC.

What does anyone get out of complaining?