OK nobody can forsurely say that Rift cant be the ender of WoW, nobody knows the future ok, all we can say right now with all information gathered and both games gameplay put head to head, Rift is makeing WoW look like a little bitch right now (Overall gameplay, New content, and style, showing that Blizzard is just adding more of the same stuff, lvls and dungeons, and avoiding adding real content that will spice the game up more)
lol I'm sorry but what exactly do you think is going to be so new and exciting when you get to 50? It's just going to be the same gear/raid/treadmill as WoW.
With all information gathered Rift is making WoW look like a little b---? Really? I'm just curious, what information gathered you're using. 1 mil subs give or take is pretty good, sure, but please explain to me how that's making 12 mill subs look like a little b----.
Not once did i mention the player base, that is completetly uncontrolable, It is the gameplay and the dynamic depth of the game that makes wow look like they need to invent some new stuff. Iv played WoW for 6 years, iv tasted so far every part of WoW that has came out and also countless many other MMO's, Rift is just showing that there is a game out there that can do what WoW did to everquest, and also how wow took from many other games too, Rift did the same thing, put in there little spice and put it out there.
If Cataclysm was the best they could do, I think Blizzard has (internaly) already let WoW go and is working on the next big thing. Cata was a very safe money bet for Blizzard. And I'd say they'll keep riding the playerbase as long as they can. The problem is that Blizzard takes a very long time to deploy new games, and sometimes as in the case of SC2, they are just not that great. D3 has been coming out forever now. Don't make the mistake of thinking that just because Blizzard is huge they can't make a wrong move. You only need to witness Microsofts' Vista release to know that's not the case.
In the meantime Rift has the potential to take more players from the WoWbase then just about any recent release I can think of, purely because that is their intent, right down to the product design. Rift is so familiar to WoW players, and it has the one thing Blizzard can't get into another release. The novelty of being a new world.
And Trion has cards up their sleeve. A lot of undisclosed content to deploy over the next six months. I could be wrong, but i'll eat my hat ...
Cheers,
Hyperwolf
You will never reach your destination if you stop and throw stones at every dog that barks ~ WC
Because playerbase would imply that people agree with you, otherwise it's just you making some silly baseless statement as a fact.
I'm just taken by how you feel like WoW needs to reinvent their game.
If other companies and games (ala Rift) are still copying their model then clearly they are still doing something right. You played WoW for 6 years and got bored of the game. Why can't you chalk it up to that? Why do MMO players have the memory of a gerbil?
I won't argue with you on the dynamic (ie: random spawns) content, but the combat did not revolutionize anything. As a matter of fact the combat felt rather dull and mundane. Just about every class uses energy, combo points, and finishers. BOOORING.
Because playerbase would imply that people agree with you, otherwise it's just you making some silly baseless statement as a fact.
I'm just taken by how you feel like WoW needs to reinvent their game.
If other companies and games (ala Rift) are still copying their model then clearly they are still doing something right. You played WoW for 6 years and got bored of the game. Why can't you chalk it up to that? Why do MMO players have the memory of a gerbil?
I won't argue with you on the dynamic (ie: random spawns) content, but the combat did not revolutionize anything. As a matter of fact the combat felt rather dull and mundane. Just about every class uses energy, combo points, and finishers. BOOORING.
After saying all that, then what the fuck is WoW, is it not combo points and boring ass combat, holy fuck can you say 3333.2.5.3333.2.5 for the whole fucking boss fight SPEICALLY in Wotlk, holy fuck i pugged Lich, Blizzard is cashing in, if you noticed Burning crusade, how much work they put in that, then the sudden downfall into Wotlk no more crazy shit goin on, just easy mode this, easy mode that, And dont hate on the player base, for being out for only 11 days, 1million aint bad, ok, yet again playerbase is over a time period, because most people, are Afriad to get up and go try something out new, because fuck if you leave WoW for a month, your guild is guna kick ur ass and you dont get any more Phat loot to munch on, cuz thats all the fuck there is in WoW to do now, and 30 min dps Q's wtf, at least in Rift i can fuckin touch my self with closeing down rifts and thus gaining some Orbs/ badges/point (what ever you wana call them) to go get some gear while looking, or waiting for some type of other activity to do, and no there is no BS Dungeon finder or cross realm dungeons so people can fuckin ninja loot at the end of the dungeon and youll never see them again. I aint a afriad to say it With Rift, Star Wars: the Old Republic, Guild Wars 2, and all those other small games comeing out, and also the F2P market rising, WoW will see its Slow <~~~ Quote it, down fall, right now the strongest thing keeping people from switching is, "My Friends play WoW" and "Is that game really better and how long is it guna last"
lol so your argument to me saying Rift's combat is boring is by stating that WoW's combat is boring? If your only defense is to make something else look bad then you're in bad shape .
I don't play WoW so your wow bashing doesn't affect me, save it for someone else. BTW, they have been debating putting in a dungeon finder lol.
Because playerbase would imply that people agree with you, otherwise it's just you making some silly baseless statement as a fact.
I'm just taken by how you feel like WoW needs to reinvent their game.
If other companies and games (ala Rift) are still copying their model then clearly they are still doing something right. You played WoW for 6 years and got bored of the game. Why can't you chalk it up to that? Why do MMO players have the memory of a gerbil?
I won't argue with you on the dynamic (ie: random spawns) content, but the combat did not revolutionize anything. As a matter of fact the combat felt rather dull and mundane. Just about every class uses energy, combo points, and finishers. BOOORING.
After saying all that, then what the fuck is WoW, is it not combo points and boring ass combat, holy fuck can you say 3333.2.5.3333.2.5 for the whole fucking boss fight SPEICALLY in Wotlk, holy fuck i pugged Lich, Blizzard is cashing in, if you noticed Burning crusade, how much work they put in that, then the sudden downfall into Wotlk no more crazy shit goin on, just easy mode this, easy mode that, And dont hate on the player base, for being out for only 11 days, 1million aint bad, ok, yet again playerbase is over a time period, because most people, are Afriad to get up and go try something out new, because fuck if you leave WoW for a month, your guild is guna kick ur ass and you dont get any more Phat loot to munch on, cuz thats all the fuck there is in WoW to do now, and 30 min dps Q's wtf, at least in Rift i can fuckin touch my self with closeing down rifts and thus gaining some Orbs/ badges/point (what ever you wana call them) to go get some gear while looking, or waiting for some type of other activity to do, and no there is no BS Dungeon finder or cross realm dungeons so people can fuckin ninja loot at the end of the dungeon and youll never see them again. I aint a afriad to say it With Rift, Star Wars: the Old Republic, Guild Wars 2, and all those other small games comeing out, and also the F2P market rising, WoW will see its Slow <~~~ Quote it, down fall, right now the strongest thing keeping people from switching is, "My Friends play WoW" and "Is that game really better and how long is it guna last"
lol so your argument to me saying Rift's combat is boring is by stating that WoW's combat is boring? If your only defense is to make something else look bad then you're in bad shape .
I don't play WoW so your wow bashing doesn't affect me, save it for someone else. BTW, they have been debating putting in a dungeon finder lol.
Holy shit surlock no that is not my defence and this aint no WoW bashing, this is just makeing those people afraid to leave Home(WoW) relize what there doing, My defence of Rift combat is boring is, You havent played the game,the combat is much diffrent... in a suddel way, to still let people use to the Old style of combat be use to it, the combat in Rift is more interlocking to other skills, and how also you set up your Souls, thus makeing your class unquie and your style of combat, also how you use your skills to cope with situations, also mentioning that the skills avaible for use is extremely large, and that if you ever get bord of 1 combo of souls try another, it allows you to stay intertained, Also mentioning that the gameplay and PvE questing to lvl isnt simple and cant be mindlessly done or your guna be running back a lot, picking your souls in the game very much make your gameplay how you want it to be, and as intresting as you want it to be. Every seen a Melee Rogue with a pet by his side?? well of course not in WoW, but in Rift well if you want it, it can happen, and it aint guna be a unplayable combo to, pretty much every combo in rift is usable and fun. as much as iv tried.
The only thing i have been reading alot about is the fact that Rift has a problem of many many players losing their gold and other items. Alot say hacked but some are now thinking it could be a major bug in the game itself and not actually a hacking of their accounts.
The only fix for these players is to have a character rollback to when they had their items and gold, which means if they didnt notice they could lose many hours gameplay, not only that but it takes a few days to have a character rollback happen and this is only after they have looked into their account, which means lost gameplay time.
Now if it is hackings then that to me says stay away, their security protocols are shite (if it was only a handful i would think these people didnt take precautions) but its far far too many, so one would have to wonder if your actual details are safe (e.g credit cards and other person details one had to input).
This is why i do think i would go with a major bug has appeared (as it coincides with the patch release too), so i will be watching and waiting myself before i purchase the game. Till then i will just potter about on single player games and if things get too boring, then return to one of the old mmo's currently running thats at least decent to play.
The only thing i have been reading alot about is the fact that Rift has a problem of many many players losing their gold and other items. Alot say hacked but some are now thinking it could be a major bug in the game itself and not actually a hacking of their accounts.
The only fix for these players is to have a character rollback to when they had their items and gold, which means if they didnt notice they could lose many hours gameplay, not only that but it takes a few days to have a character rollback happen and this is only after they have looked into their account, which means lost gameplay time.
Now if it is hackings then that to me says stay away, their security protocols are shite (if it was only a handful i would think these people didnt take precautions) but its far far too many, so one would have to wonder if your actual details are safe (e.g credit cards and other person details one had to input).
This is why i do think i would go with a major bug has appeared (as it coincides with the patch release too), so i will be watching and waiting myself before i purchase the game. Till then i will just potter about on single player games and if things get too boring, then return to one of the old mmo's currently running thats at least decent to play.
Well so far nothing like that has happend to me, and im hopeing it never does, but yet again the game did just release so you cant expect everything to be dandy, the game is pretty damn well polished but, and is very smooth.
If Cataclysm was the best they could do, I think Blizzard has (internaly) already let WoW go and is working on the next big thing. Cata was a very safe money bet for Blizzard. And I'd say they'll keep riding the playerbase as long as they can. The problem is that Blizzard takes a very long time to deploy new games, and sometimes as in the case of SC2, they are just not that great. D3 has been coming out forever now. Don't make the mistake of thinking that just because Blizzard is huge they can't make a wrong move. You only need to witness Microsofts' Vista release to know that's not the case.
Ya Cataclysm assured I may never play again. My WoW account was hacked, and I was quick to start the recovery process. So I was left wiht the hackers 7 day trial of Cataclysm.
All I can say is this: Messing up a great game world by destroying it or flooding it seems cheap to me.
However, on your other comments:
I'd have to really think about it, but I don't think that Blizzard has ever released a bad game. Well... cataclysm... but that was just an expansion. I'm hard pressed to think of something they put out that wasn't quite good.
OK- we'll see about Diablo III. But if Blizzard tanks- you do realize there are very few decent publishers out there right?
It's not like any of the franchises destroyed by EA are coming back.
Originally posted by helthros Because playerbase would imply that people agree with you, otherwise it's just you making some silly baseless statement as a fact.
I'm just taken by how you feel like WoW needs to reinvent their game.
If other companies and games (ala Rift) are still copying their model then clearly they are still doing something right. You played WoW for 6 years and got bored of the game. Why can't you chalk it up to that? Why do MMO players have the memory of a gerbil?
I won't argue with you on the dynamic (ie: random spawns) content, but the combat did not revolutionize anything. As a matter of fact the combat felt rather dull and mundane. Just about every class uses energy, combo points, and finishers. BOOORING.
Trion didn't revolutionize combat. In fact, they stated that their combat was the standard mmorpg combat you'd expect and they were right. They've made some improvements over WoW's implementation of the combat, but not so much that you'd think it was a totally different style of combat. This is fine because the combat in mmorpg isn't the biggest thing needing tremendous improvements or changes. If it isn't broke, don't try to fix it.
I could see Rift being in direct competition with WoW, especially considering WoW's very large casual audience. A lot of WoW's players aren't gamers. They don't play Call of Duty and they didn't play Ultima Online "back in the day". Rift is casual and solo friendly; it provides more of a group feel with the public groups and open world rifts/invasions. The only complaint I've heard there is the rifts or invasions getting in the way of people who want to progress solely through questing. This is almost a can't miss for the WoW style casual crowd.
What hasn't been seen by very many people yet is the end game content, which appears to be raider friendly. There is a lot of end game content, starting with expert level dungeons. A lot of gear tiers to work through, a lot of stats to build up to get to the next tier of content. When this becomes more advertised via word of mouth, you'll see more of the hardcore people trying Rift out.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Everyone that is on the site at the moment couldn't have missed the rift ads running down the sides and bottom of the screen with a small rift movie and the followed by the tag "We're not in Azeroth anymore,"
Is rift setting itself up in direct competition with WoW now and do you feel it is a wise move on the part of the rift advertisers to do so? There is no way to read this advert other than a direct poke at Warcraft and to tell it's players that it is time to make a switch and you have got to be pretty confident you have something special to offer if you are going to set yourself up as the game to take WoW's player base away.
Thoughts?
It's a direct poke but in no way meant to indicate they have WOW numbers in their sights. It's a common marketing tactic and works well when used right. Basically, the number two ro number three guy can target the big guy and the he can't really fire back without coming across as a bully. Furthermore, any acknowledgement of the claim by the big guy validates the claim, so the big guy really can't respond unless he's forced to. It is more meant to position one's self as a major contender in the market.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Rift is a crappy WoW clone, Blizzard has nothing to fear from it since it will be a ghostland 6 months from now. GW2 and the Star Wars game are much more serious threats though GW2 being no subscription helps quite a bit, it is a clear next gen title that will easily steal a big chunk of the WOW players though, unlike some low budget WoW clone with poorly scripted 'dynamic' rifts.
Rift is a crappy WoW clone, Blizzard has nothing to fear from it since it will be a ghostland 6 months from now. GW2 and the Star Wars game are much more serious threats though GW2 being no subscription helps quite a bit, it is a clear next gen title that will easily steal a big chunk of the WOW players though, unlike some low budget WoW clone with poorly scripted 'dynamic' rifts.
Yeah, yeah, I get it. You hate Rift and would love to see nothing else more than to see it fail miserably, for whatever reason it is that people that dislike games keep on bashing them nonstop
I don't know though. Xfire has shown that WoW after peaking towards 330k hours after release of CATA is starting to reach its lowest points in the last few years, hovering between 150-200k where last year it hovered between the 220-280k hours. In the week after Rift's launch it almost lost its number 1 spot to the number 2 on the list, which hasn't happened in a long time.
I agree that Xfire isn't the most dependable tool for comparison, but it has a knack for showing trends per game. And it seems to point towards CATA not having had the impact that many had hoped or thought it would have beforehand, and that many WoW players are either leaving MMORPG's aside or that they're looking towards other MMO's. Like Rift.
SWTOR and GW2 don't seem to arrive until the second half of this year, or Fall 2011. All that time Rift will have a free path.
So who knows? I'd say all bets are off for what will happen
edit: I just noticed that this is a thread in the WoW forumsection, not in the Rift forumsection. I'd like to mention that my post wasn't meant as a 'doomsaying' post regarding WoW, I've no hard feelings or bashing inclination towards WoW or its fans.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Rift is a crappy WoW clone, Blizzard has nothing to fear from it since it will be a ghostland 6 months from now. GW2 and the Star Wars game are much more serious threats though GW2 being no subscription helps quite a bit, it is a clear next gen title that will easily steal a big chunk of the WOW players though, unlike some low budget WoW clone with poorly scripted 'dynamic' rifts.
I don't think it's a clone. But Blizzard has nothing to fear.
Rift is like a bunch of different good things done in MMOs that were unrelated, bolted together, and then thrown into a blender every 1 or 2 hours (Rifts/invasions).
Comments
Not once did i mention the player base, that is completetly uncontrolable, It is the gameplay and the dynamic depth of the game that makes wow look like they need to invent some new stuff. Iv played WoW for 6 years, iv tasted so far every part of WoW that has came out and also countless many other MMO's, Rift is just showing that there is a game out there that can do what WoW did to everquest, and also how wow took from many other games too, Rift did the same thing, put in there little spice and put it out there.
If Cataclysm was the best they could do, I think Blizzard has (internaly) already let WoW go and is working on the next big thing. Cata was a very safe money bet for Blizzard. And I'd say they'll keep riding the playerbase as long as they can. The problem is that Blizzard takes a very long time to deploy new games, and sometimes as in the case of SC2, they are just not that great. D3 has been coming out forever now. Don't make the mistake of thinking that just because Blizzard is huge they can't make a wrong move. You only need to witness Microsofts' Vista release to know that's not the case.
In the meantime Rift has the potential to take more players from the WoWbase then just about any recent release I can think of, purely because that is their intent, right down to the product design. Rift is so familiar to WoW players, and it has the one thing Blizzard can't get into another release. The novelty of being a new world.
And Trion has cards up their sleeve. A lot of undisclosed content to deploy over the next six months. I could be wrong, but i'll eat my hat ...
Cheers,
Hyperwolf
You will never reach your destination if you stop and throw stones at every dog that barks
~ WC
Because playerbase would imply that people agree with you, otherwise it's just you making some silly baseless statement as a fact.
I'm just taken by how you feel like WoW needs to reinvent their game.
If other companies and games (ala Rift) are still copying their model then clearly they are still doing something right. You played WoW for 6 years and got bored of the game. Why can't you chalk it up to that? Why do MMO players have the memory of a gerbil?
I won't argue with you on the dynamic (ie: random spawns) content, but the combat did not revolutionize anything. As a matter of fact the combat felt rather dull and mundane. Just about every class uses energy, combo points, and finishers. BOOORING.
lol so your argument to me saying Rift's combat is boring is by stating that WoW's combat is boring? If your only defense is to make something else look bad then you're in bad shape
.
I don't play WoW so your wow bashing doesn't affect me, save it for someone else. BTW, they have been debating putting in a dungeon finder lol.
Holy shit surlock no that is not my defence and this aint no WoW bashing, this is just makeing those people afraid to leave Home(WoW) relize what there doing, My defence of Rift combat is boring is, You havent played the game,the combat is much diffrent... in a suddel way, to still let people use to the Old style of combat be use to it, the combat in Rift is more interlocking to other skills, and how also you set up your Souls, thus makeing your class unquie and your style of combat, also how you use your skills to cope with situations, also mentioning that the skills avaible for use is extremely large, and that if you ever get bord of 1 combo of souls try another, it allows you to stay intertained, Also mentioning that the gameplay and PvE questing to lvl isnt simple and cant be mindlessly done or your guna be running back a lot, picking your souls in the game very much make your gameplay how you want it to be, and as intresting as you want it to be. Every seen a Melee Rogue with a pet by his side?? well of course not in WoW, but in Rift well if you want it, it can happen, and it aint guna be a unplayable combo to, pretty much every combo in rift is usable and fun. as much as iv tried.
The only thing i have been reading alot about is the fact that Rift has a problem of many many players losing their gold and other items. Alot say hacked but some are now thinking it could be a major bug in the game itself and not actually a hacking of their accounts.
The only fix for these players is to have a character rollback to when they had their items and gold, which means if they didnt notice they could lose many hours gameplay, not only that but it takes a few days to have a character rollback happen and this is only after they have looked into their account, which means lost gameplay time.
Now if it is hackings then that to me says stay away, their security protocols are shite (if it was only a handful i would think these people didnt take precautions) but its far far too many, so one would have to wonder if your actual details are safe (e.g credit cards and other person details one had to input).
This is why i do think i would go with a major bug has appeared (as it coincides with the patch release too), so i will be watching and waiting myself before i purchase the game. Till then i will just potter about on single player games and if things get too boring, then return to one of the old mmo's currently running thats at least decent to play.
Well so far nothing like that has happend to me, and im hopeing it never does, but yet again the game did just release so you cant expect everything to be dandy, the game is pretty damn well polished but, and is very smooth.
Ya Cataclysm assured I may never play again. My WoW account was hacked, and I was quick to start the recovery process. So I was left wiht the hackers 7 day trial of Cataclysm.
All I can say is this: Messing up a great game world by destroying it or flooding it seems cheap to me.
However, on your other comments:
I'd have to really think about it, but I don't think that Blizzard has ever released a bad game. Well... cataclysm... but that was just an expansion. I'm hard pressed to think of something they put out that wasn't quite good.
OK- we'll see about Diablo III. But if Blizzard tanks- you do realize there are very few decent publishers out there right?
It's not like any of the franchises destroyed by EA are coming back.
Trion didn't revolutionize combat. In fact, they stated that their combat was the standard mmorpg combat you'd expect and they were right. They've made some improvements over WoW's implementation of the combat, but not so much that you'd think it was a totally different style of combat. This is fine because the combat in mmorpg isn't the biggest thing needing tremendous improvements or changes. If it isn't broke, don't try to fix it.
I could see Rift being in direct competition with WoW, especially considering WoW's very large casual audience. A lot of WoW's players aren't gamers. They don't play Call of Duty and they didn't play Ultima Online "back in the day". Rift is casual and solo friendly; it provides more of a group feel with the public groups and open world rifts/invasions. The only complaint I've heard there is the rifts or invasions getting in the way of people who want to progress solely through questing. This is almost a can't miss for the WoW style casual crowd.
What hasn't been seen by very many people yet is the end game content, which appears to be raider friendly. There is a lot of end game content, starting with expert level dungeons. A lot of gear tiers to work through, a lot of stats to build up to get to the next tier of content. When this becomes more advertised via word of mouth, you'll see more of the hardcore people trying Rift out.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
It's a direct poke but in no way meant to indicate they have WOW numbers in their sights. It's a common marketing tactic and works well when used right. Basically, the number two ro number three guy can target the big guy and the he can't really fire back without coming across as a bully. Furthermore, any acknowledgement of the claim by the big guy validates the claim, so the big guy really can't respond unless he's forced to. It is more meant to position one's self as a major contender in the market.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Rift is a crappy WoW clone, Blizzard has nothing to fear from it since it will be a ghostland 6 months from now. GW2 and the Star Wars game are much more serious threats though GW2 being no subscription helps quite a bit, it is a clear next gen title that will easily steal a big chunk of the WOW players though, unlike some low budget WoW clone with poorly scripted 'dynamic' rifts.
Yeah, yeah, I get it. You hate Rift and would love to see nothing else more than to see it fail miserably, for whatever reason it is that people that dislike games keep on bashing them nonstop
I don't know though. Xfire has shown that WoW after peaking towards 330k hours after release of CATA is starting to reach its lowest points in the last few years, hovering between 150-200k where last year it hovered between the 220-280k hours. In the week after Rift's launch it almost lost its number 1 spot to the number 2 on the list, which hasn't happened in a long time.
I agree that Xfire isn't the most dependable tool for comparison, but it has a knack for showing trends per game. And it seems to point towards CATA not having had the impact that many had hoped or thought it would have beforehand, and that many WoW players are either leaving MMORPG's aside or that they're looking towards other MMO's. Like Rift.
SWTOR and GW2 don't seem to arrive until the second half of this year, or Fall 2011. All that time Rift will have a free path.
So who knows? I'd say all bets are off for what will happen
edit: I just noticed that this is a thread in the WoW forumsection, not in the Rift forumsection. I'd like to mention that my post wasn't meant as a 'doomsaying' post regarding WoW, I've no hard feelings or bashing inclination towards WoW or its fans.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I don't think it's a clone. But Blizzard has nothing to fear.
Rift is like a bunch of different good things done in MMOs that were unrelated, bolted together, and then thrown into a blender every 1 or 2 hours (Rifts/invasions).
It's not a clone. But it is an excellent theif!
I don't think Trion really thinks they are competing with Blizzard, it is just a marketting thing.
They hope Blizzard will mess up something badly and are setting themselves up to be the game many of the disgruntled Wow players would move to.