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rift could be the next big mmorpg.

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  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,519

    Originally posted by Puremallace

    Does everyone want to know why Rift fans are so hopeful for this game? ok so I linked the 1.01 changes which are tweaks and bug fixes and they are adding the 10 man Rift raids. This was just posted by the lead CM. I have never seen a MMO company ever(not even Blizzard) listen to their fan base like this.

    http://forums.riftgame.com/showthread.php?116381-Hartsman-What-a-Launch-it-s-Been!-(Rift-1.01-update)



    Making sure that we can do an update like this successfully is an important step on the road to doing even larger scale content and systems additions in the not-too-distant future.



    Our team will be right here while this first update is going on. We’ll be checking out the servers alongside you, and will be here to respond to any surprise issues that do occur.



    We also have a lot more in development than the first look you’ll be seeing tomorrow.



    On top of ongoing new content and large feature development, many of which you’ll be hearing about on our site and others, there are some other, smaller improvements we’re working toward – I wanted to call these out specifically since they’re pretty frequently commented on.



    Mages. Yes, we’re both listening to you and paying attention to the post-launch gameplay data on our servers. While a well-played mage does do extremely well, and mages are very well represented in the overall number of active characters, there are issues with competitiveness in some low and mid level ranges and certain combinations of souls, due largely to mages’ overall fragility and cast times.



    Mail Spam. Chat spam protection has been going really well on the whole, which, predictably, pushed spammers into mail. We’ll be putting more protection in place there soon.



    Event Contribution. This system is being reworked to be more in line with the idea of events being massively social occurrences, and the focus on abilities themselves will be going away entirely.



    Anti-Hacker Protection. As a very high priority, we’re working on new and interesting ways to help you make sure your account is protected from password phishing and keyloggers. In the short time since head start, we’ve already banned a couple thousand spammers, hackers, farmers, and thieves. We’ll continue improving our detection and ability to take action on them well into the future.



    Dismount and Exposed. Expect some changes here as well.

     I would have expected most of these things listed to be operational prior to Launch or atleast in place.  Looks to me like they rushed it without the support structure in place.

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • PuremallacePuremallace Member Posts: 1,856

    Originally posted by nightfallrob

    Same here. They're actually engaging in real customer service, which up until now has been a totally foreign concept to MMO companies.

    Just the little stuff is just blowing me away. They let the lead art director start commenting on the "fan art section". She just started commenting on drawings the players made.

  • ZzadZzad Member UncommonPosts: 1,401

    Originally posted by Loke666

    Originally posted by nightfallrob

    BS. WoW's class system is so pathetically simplistic and inflexible it hurts just to contemplate and the company actually engages in customer service. Although you're right about the graphics being better.

    Agreed actually. The customization of the classes is Rifts main advantage together with good coding. 

    If they now just could add a few more classes, 4 is a bit limited... 2 more would help.

    I´m sure they will be adding new classes sometime in the future... this is just the begining ^^

    But i really don´t find it is needed really since they are so flexible.. 1 class can be just like 3 at the same time...

  • PuremallacePuremallace Member Posts: 1,856

    Originally posted by stayontarget

     I would have expected most of these things listed to be operational prior to Launch or atleast in place.  Looks to me like they rushed it without the support structure in place.

    Even Blizzard had to adjust or you telling me WoW finally got rid of gold spam and bots? I use WoW as an example because it is an established games with years of production.

     

    They are just adjusting the content. It is just wild the polar opposite design philosophies. Instead of bringing a class down with a nerf they are buffing class up.

     

    So they think Champions are in a good spot, but other classes need fixes. So Mages are coming up behind in Live compared to Alpha because you true genuine coordinated pvp guilds finding flaws. I get the feeling if this was any other MMO company Saboteurs and Champions would have been nerfed down.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by nightfallrob

    Same here. They're actually engaging in real customer service, which up until now has been a totally foreign concept to MMO companies.

    Arenanet is actually also pretty good on this point. Or was at least when Strain was the boss, he spent some time in the unofficial forum himself, nice guy. :)

    But yes, giving the players what they want in fixes is usually a great idea, not always in nerfs and similar things but for stuff that needs to be fixed is it perfect and Rift is a lot better than I thought it would be.

    Blizzard is so big that they almost can do what they want today. When EQ was the big one you more or less just had it and UO to choose from so the "vision" was more important than listening to feedback.

    Lets hope certain other small companies *cough* Cryptic *cough* learn from this.

  • ZzadZzad Member UncommonPosts: 1,401

    Originally posted by Puremallace

    Originally posted by stayontarget

     I would have expected most of these things listed to be operational prior to Launch or atleast in place.  Looks to me like they rushed it without the support structure in place.

    Even Blizzard had to adjust or you telling me WoW finally got rid of gold spam and bots? I use WoW as an example because it is an established games with years of production.

    They are just adjusting the content. It is just wild the polar opposite design philosophies. Instead of bringing a class down with a nerf they are biffing class up.

    So they think Champions are in a good spot, but other classes need fixes. So Mages are coming up behind in Live compared to Alpha because you genuine coordinated guilds finding flaws. I get the feeling if this was any other MMO company Saboteurs and Champions would have been nerfed down.

    Six years after wow was released and you can still find bots at major cities.... so......

  • ArchidArchid Member UncommonPosts: 210

    Originally posted by Loke666

    Originally posted by nightfallrob

    Same here. They're actually engaging in real customer service, which up until now has been a totally foreign concept to MMO companies.

    Arenanet is actually also pretty good on this point. Or was at least when Strain was the boss, he spent some time in the unofficial forum himself, nice guy. :)

    But yes, giving the players what they want in fixes is usually a great idea, not always in nerfs and similar things but for stuff that needs to be fixed is it perfect and Rift is a lot better than I thought it would be.

    Blizzard is so big that they almost can do what they want today. When EQ was the big one you more or less just had it and UO to choose from so the "vision" was more important than listening to feedback.

    Lets hope certain other small companies *cough* Cryptic *cough* learn from this.

     Gee Loke, you got bad cough there! :|

    the best way to kill a troll is to FLAME ON! ...or with acid...

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004

    Originally posted by Archid

    Originally posted by Loke666


    Originally posted by nightfallrob

    Same here. They're actually engaging in real customer service, which up until now has been a totally foreign concept to MMO companies.

    Arenanet is actually also pretty good on this point. Or was at least when Strain was the boss, he spent some time in the unofficial forum himself, nice guy. :)

    But yes, giving the players what they want in fixes is usually a great idea, not always in nerfs and similar things but for stuff that needs to be fixed is it perfect and Rift is a lot better than I thought it would be.

    Blizzard is so big that they almost can do what they want today. When EQ was the big one you more or less just had it and UO to choose from so the "vision" was more important than listening to feedback.

    Lets hope certain other small companies *cough* Cryptic *cough* learn from this.

     Gee Loke, you got bad cough there! :|

    i can think of a few other lessons cryptic could learn from.. but.. not sure their really paying attention...

  • MikehaMikeha Member EpicPosts: 9,196

    Rift is just a filler fluff mmo till the real mmos come.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by Mannish

    Rift is just a filler fluff mmo till the real mmos come.

    But if you see it like that, aren't all forms of entertainment just fillers until death?

    See, you got me depressed there.:(

    Rift have some good features. I don't think it is the next one, I don't even think I will sub it myself but it is still the best MMO that have released in 5 years. Some people will really enjoy it.

    Rift is not the game all players have been waiting for but just because it is a filler for you does not mean it doesn't matter for others.

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004

    Originally posted by Mannish

    Rift is just a filler fluff mmo till the real mmos come.

    er..  real mmo's ? kind of have to wonder what you consider that to be... 

    and if your going to say GW2 and SW:TOR.. may i remind you that its not april 1st today.. image

  • SnakexSnakex Member UncommonPosts: 317

    Just a little back history first, iv been a long time MMO, for about 8 to 9 years, started off with Star Wars Galaxies, then moved on, iv played WoW for about 6 years on and off. Iv played a tremendous amount of mmo's in my time. So getting to the point, of course a topic like this would grow to 17+ pages, Rift, as i play it now, is a fun and good game, but what they did, was not extremely extraordinary, what they did in a nut shell is Reinvent the Wheel..... again, this is what WoW did to Everquest, grabbed a good game, and upgraded it, rift did that to WoW, WoW was ALWAYS an easy target to over through, just nobody could grasp the idea, WoW is nothing really special, just stability and constint flow of content. Rift Basicly grabbed the system from WoW , made it there own and put there own spice into it, and they got money to back up there game and to keep it going. Also i read some crap about how this could end up like DCUO..... FUCK NO, you cant compair Rift to DCUO, that game is a console game at heart, play it for a week or so and on to the next one. And also even if Rift doesnt fully suck the life outof WoW, then once SWTOR comes out, that will finish it off, if anything at least for a while. People playing wow want to quit, i know this, i hear it all the time, but they just need something to Quit To, there not addicted to the game, they are just gamers and need something good to switch too, once given the chance they will migrate.

  • SolestranSolestran Member Posts: 342

    It's a nice enough game, but is in no way the next big MMO.

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004

    Originally posted by Snakex

    Just a little back history first, iv been a long time MMO, for about 8 to 9 years, started off with Star Wars Galaxies, then moved on, iv played WoW for about 6 years on and off. Iv played a tremendous amount of mmo's in my time. So getting to the point, of course a topic like this would grow to 17+ pages, Rift, as i play it now, is a fun and good game, but what they did, was not extremely extraordinary, what they did in a nut shell is Reinvent the Wheel..... again, this is what WoW did to Everquest, grabbed a good game, and upgraded it, rift did that to WoW, WoW was ALWAYS an easy target to over through, just nobody could grasp the idea, WoW is nothing really special, just stability and constint flow of content. Rift Basicly grabbed the system from WoW , made it there own and put there own spice into it, and they got money to back up there game and to keep it going. Also i read some crap about how this could end up like DCUO..... FUCK NO, you cant compair Rift to DCUO, that game is a console game at heart, play it for a week or so and on to the next one. And also even if Rift doesnt fully suck the life outof WoW, then once SWTOR comes out, that will finish it off, if anything at least for a while. People playing wow want to quit, i know this, i hear it all the time, but they just need something to Quit To, there not addicted to the game, they are just gamers and need something good to switch too, once given the chance they will migrate.

    Rift seems like an Okay game, its definitely not the next WoW though, even though the game has so many similarities that you can switch from WoW to Rift with ease, have to agree about the comparisons with DCUO though, as that really is just a console game, which even by now i half expect is fading into obscurity, but i don't really think GW2 or SW:TOR will do any better than Rift.. the most positive aspect would be that they do as well as Rift..  The only people saying they want to move to another game from WoW are the ones that don't really play it.. even now i don't think the vast majority of players in WoW will be all that bothered about SW:TOR, its a sci-fi game, and .. im not sure Starwars is really such a big IP these days, or has been for over a decade..  Fantasy games just tend to have the edge, i don't see that changing (even though Eve is my favourite game!)  but.. until the games are released.. theres everything to play for.. and who knows.. just maybe. BIoware will pull the hat out of the rabbit...image

  • PuremallacePuremallace Member Posts: 1,856

    SWToR is going to appeal to Star Wars fans which does not certainly apply to me. I would say GW2 would do tremendous damage to WoW or Rift, BUT and this is the BIG BUT it is B2P.

     

    I do not understand how you finance something like that. It will launch good, but the sheer cost of it to maintain it at that volume I think will hurt it. As rich as those companies are you can not drop a BOMB like that on the MMO market and expect it to be free.

     

    Everything is telling me B2P for GW2 is going to hurt it in the long run. GW2 is EASILY looking at a million subs on launch and you mean to tell me they can support all that on B2P? I see between now and December or whenever it launches things are going to change.

     

    NCSoft is backing GW2 a game that is going to kill their american/Eu franchise of Aion if Rift/SWToR/Tera do not rip it apart by then. All major legions that I know are gone from Aion for Tera KR/Rift/back to GW or back to WAR.

  • SnakexSnakex Member UncommonPosts: 317

    Originally posted by Phry

    Originally posted by Snakex

    Just a little back history first, iv been a long time MMO, for about 8 to 9 years, started off with Star Wars Galaxies, then moved on, iv played WoW for about 6 years on and off. Iv played a tremendous amount of mmo's in my time. So getting to the point, of course a topic like this would grow to 17+ pages, Rift, as i play it now, is a fun and good game, but what they did, was not extremely extraordinary, what they did in a nut shell is Reinvent the Wheel..... again, this is what WoW did to Everquest, grabbed a good game, and upgraded it, rift did that to WoW, WoW was ALWAYS an easy target to over through, just nobody could grasp the idea, WoW is nothing really special, just stability and constint flow of content. Rift Basicly grabbed the system from WoW , made it there own and put there own spice into it, and they got money to back up there game and to keep it going. Also i read some crap about how this could end up like DCUO..... FUCK NO, you cant compair Rift to DCUO, that game is a console game at heart, play it for a week or so and on to the next one. And also even if Rift doesnt fully suck the life outof WoW, then once SWTOR comes out, that will finish it off, if anything at least for a while. People playing wow want to quit, i know this, i hear it all the time, but they just need something to Quit To, there not addicted to the game, they are just gamers and need something good to switch too, once given the chance they will migrate.

    Rift seems like an Okay game, its definitely not the next WoW though, even though the game has so many similarities that you can switch from WoW to Rift with ease, have to agree about the comparisons with DCUO though, as that really is just a console game, which even by now i half expect is fading into obscurity, but i don't really think GW2 or SW:TOR will do any better than Rift.. the most positive aspect would be that they do as well as Rift..  The only people saying they want to move to another game from WoW are the ones that don't really play it.. even now i don't think the vast majority of players in WoW will be all that bothered about SW:TOR, its a sci-fi game, and .. im not sure Starwars is really such a big IP these days, or has been for over a decade..  Fantasy games just tend to have the edge, i don't see that changing (even though Eve is my favourite game!)  but.. until the games are released.. theres everything to play for.. and who knows.. just maybe. BIoware will pull the hat out of the rabbit...image

    "The only people saying they want to move to another game from WoW are the ones that don't really play it.."

    I played wow  hardcore, id usally get home from school and blow threw content with my guild like crazy, specially in the BC days, trust me, i was a hardcore player and i did everything possible in WoW, i even took brakes not to ware myself out, trust me , i know a good amount of people that would leave WoW, that play WoW like its there child, for some other game that has the same ideas of WoW just upgraded. AKA- Rift, Star wars OR, GW2

  • HalandirHalandir Member UncommonPosts: 773

    Originally posted by Puremallace

    SWToR is going to appeal to Star Wars fans which does not certainly apply to me. I would say GW2 would do tremendous damage to WoW or Rift, BUT and this is the BIG BUT it is B2P.

    I do not understand how you finance something like that. It will launch good, but the sheer cost of it to maintain it at that volume I think will hurt it. As rich as those companies are you can not drop a BOMB like that on the MMO market and expect it to be free.

    I guess I am on par with you concerning SWToR, while I love the movies I don't expect to enjoy "playing" them just as I never really enjoyed SWG.

    As for understanding Arenanet's financial model... They have already proved that their model is indeed viable. You seem to have missed it, but the original Guild Wars series (while not a "true" mmo, a game that have given me more massive multiplayer moments than all the "real" mmo's for the last 5 years) is actually still going strong. B2P in their definition is NOT "buy to win"! While the frequency have gone down they still update and adds to the game, and yes: Beyond completely optional extra storage and cosmetic "cashshop" items the game is still free once you have bought it.

    One of the major differences between GW and some of the most popular p2p games have always been that you can not expect a standing by supportcrew, willing to help you with every quest question you might have. But then... GW have always been stable, things worked as intended and if you were really clueless, help was at hand in public, guild or alliance chat.

    While I love GW and will definately buy and play GW2, I could easily see myself enjoying both and still be subscribed to RIFT, simply because it is different (gearbased et al.) but still as polished and bugfree as I have grown accustomed to with Guild Wars.

     

    We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!!
    (repeat ad infinitum)

  • PuremallacePuremallace Member Posts: 1,856

    See that is where the trouble lies for me. If you want a perfect example look at Rift or actually any MMO released in the last 5 years. MMO players want fast updates for pretty much any issue that can possibly occur.

    Some people are "haters" and will look for any reason to trash a game and I see this as a possible issue that patches will not be as fast as some people want.

  • SkeeterxiSkeeterxi Member Posts: 265

    Originally posted by Puremallace

    SWToR is going to appeal to Star Wars fans which does not certainly apply to me. I would say GW2 would do tremendous damage to WoW or Rift, BUT and this is the BIG BUT it is B2P.

     

    I do not understand how you finance something like that. It will launch good, but the sheer cost of it to maintain it at that volume I think will hurt it. As rich as those companies are you can not drop a BOMB like that on the MMO market and expect it to be free.

     

    Everything is telling me B2P for GW2 is going to hurt it in the long run. GW2 is EASILY looking at a million subs on launch and you mean to tell me they can support all that on B2P? I see between now and December or whenever it launches things are going to change.

     

    NCSoft is backing GW2 a game that is going to kill their american/Eu franchise of Aion if Rift/SWToR/Tera do not rip it apart by then. All major legions that I know are gone from Aion for Tera KR/Rift/back to GW or back to WAR.

    I imagine there will be a ton of cash shop fluff. People who spend in cash shops are usually willing to spend quite a bit. Look at WoWs 25 dollar mounts and 10 dollar pets, they raked in the tons cash with that and if there was a very large library to choose from, people would have kept buying them. Maybe they will charge for larger content patches and have more frequent expansions. It will be interesting. I like the idea of being able to play the content I have bought without a monthly fee locking me out of it.

  • OkhamsRazorOkhamsRazor Member Posts: 1,047

    Originally posted by Robokapp

    watch what happens at begining of april.

     A very unoriginal post .They said that about WoW six years ago . I take it your not actually playing because if you were you would see how unwise this comment was to make . This isn't a Warhammer or Age of Conan .

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,969

    Originally posted by Halandir

     

    As for understanding Arenanet's financial model... They have already proved that their model is indeed viable. You seem to have missed it, but the original Guild Wars series (while not a "true" mmo, a game that have given me more massive multiplayer moments than all the "real" mmo's for the last 5 years) is actually still going strong. B2P in their definition is NOT "buy to win"! While the frequency have gone down they still update and adds to the game, and yes: Beyond completely optional extra storage and cosmetic "cashshop" items the game is still free once you have bought it.

     

    With all due respect, they haven't proven it's viable with an online persistant world.

    I will wait and see what items they add for cash. What you didn't say (and not saying you are hiding it but it does bear mentioning) is that you can buy skill packs so you don't have to earn them in game.

    For some that's a bit of a big deal. It's really no different than what Turbine is doing but it does raise an eyebrow because what they are essentially offering is a way to quickly bypass earning things in game with your wallet.

    Some don't care but some do. I'll be very curious to see what they add in their cash shop in order to be financially viable. If it's just adventures/quests, cosmetics then no big deal.

    But let's hold a bit and wait and see if an online persistant world is viable with buy to play and a "few" items in the shop.

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  • jusomdudejusomdude Member RarePosts: 2,706

    I love the pyromancer soul, but I'm pretty much just playing until TOR comes out.

  • helthroshelthros Member UncommonPosts: 1,449

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Halandir



     

    As for understanding Arenanet's financial model... They have already proved that their model is indeed viable. You seem to have missed it, but the original Guild Wars series (while not a "true" mmo, a game that have given me more massive multiplayer moments than all the "real" mmo's for the last 5 years) is actually still going strong. B2P in their definition is NOT "buy to win"! While the frequency have gone down they still update and adds to the game, and yes: Beyond completely optional extra storage and cosmetic "cashshop" items the game is still free once you have bought it.

     

    With all due respect, they haven't proven it's viable with an online persistant world.

    I will wait and see what items they add for cash. What you didn't say (and not saying you are hiding it but it does bear mentioning) is that you can buy skill packs so you don't have to earn them in game.

    For some that's a bit of a big deal. It's really no different than what Turbine is doing but it does raise an eyebrow because what they are essentially offering is a way to quickly bypass earning things in game with your wallet.

    Some don't care but some do. I'll be very curious to see what they add in their cash shop in order to be financially viable. If it's just adventures/quests, cosmetics then no big deal.

    But let's hold a bit and wait and see if an online persistant world is viable with buy to play and a "few" items in the shop.

     

    Persistant worlds are viable with a paltry amount of people buying items in a f2p game, why wouldn't it be sustainable with b2p? In b2p EVERYONE has payed at least some money while others continue to pay here and there.

    You're oblivious to the fact that having no subs will generate more initial purchases. A lot of your 15$ a month goes into paying for customer service that 90% of the people don't even use.

  • PuremallacePuremallace Member Posts: 1,856

    Originally posted by helthros

    Persistant worlds are viable with a paltry amount of people buying items in a f2p game, why wouldn't it be sustainable with b2p? In b2p EVERYONE has payed at least some money while others continue to pay here and there.

    You're oblivious to the fact that having no subs will generate more initial purchases. A lot of your 15$ a month goes into paying for customer service that 90% of the people don't even use.

    OK so this is my question. They are riding this "dynamic" queststyle thing saying 1,000's of invasions and really active world.



    Now this game is hyped as the second coming of Jesus. Like this is the "wow killer". It will save humanity from Aids. I am expecting a million subs easily.



    What do you do when people start wanting more end game? what happens when something breaks? Will it take a month to to fix?

    This is my issue with over hyped or super budget mmo's like a GW2 or SWToR. They spend 5 years releasing it which is basically an expansion. Do you have to wait another 5 YEARS for an expansion. WoW would have died years ago if they tried to sell that to their fan base.

    I do not think the excuse. It is taking so long because the game is B2P or the game requires crazy voice acting and super testing to be good will fly with this mmo community.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,969

    Originally posted by helthros

    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Halandir



     

    As for understanding Arenanet's financial model... They have already proved that their model is indeed viable. You seem to have missed it, but the original Guild Wars series (while not a "true" mmo, a game that have given me more massive multiplayer moments than all the "real" mmo's for the last 5 years) is actually still going strong. B2P in their definition is NOT "buy to win"! While the frequency have gone down they still update and adds to the game, and yes: Beyond completely optional extra storage and cosmetic "cashshop" items the game is still free once you have bought it.

     

    With all due respect, they haven't proven it's viable with an online persistant world.

    I will wait and see what items they add for cash. What you didn't say (and not saying you are hiding it but it does bear mentioning) is that you can buy skill packs so you don't have to earn them in game.

    For some that's a bit of a big deal. It's really no different than what Turbine is doing but it does raise an eyebrow because what they are essentially offering is a way to quickly bypass earning things in game with your wallet.

    Some don't care but some do. I'll be very curious to see what they add in their cash shop in order to be financially viable. If it's just adventures/quests, cosmetics then no big deal.

    But let's hold a bit and wait and see if an online persistant world is viable with buy to play and a "few" items in the shop.

     

    Persistant worlds are viable with a paltry amount of people buying items in a f2p game, why wouldn't it be sustainable with b2p? In b2p EVERYONE has payed at least some money while others continue to pay here and there.

    You're oblivious to the fact that having no subs will generate more initial purchases. A lot of your 15$ a month goes into paying for customer service that 90% of the people don't even use.

    ok, once again, where are the numbers? Are persistant worlds viable with a paltry amount of people buying items or are persistant worlds viable with a paltry amount of people buying A LOT of items?

    Wasn't there a study that was recently released that indicated that though there is a bit of a bell curve, there is a small percentage of players at the top end of that curve spending a considerable amount of money?

    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
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