A bit more about Crafting and Thieves in GW2

Zeroxin

http://games.on.net/article/11863/Exclusive_Eric_Flannum_On_GW2_-_Thieves_Crafting_and_a_new_Video

We understand that this system of discovery can be circumvented by looking at the wiki but we treat this as we do any other spoiler information. For example the fact that a player could at anytime go spoil the end of their personal story by looking it up does not keep us from trying to create an exciting story that may have some twists in it. If a player wants to go find recipe knowledge then they are free to do so and they can skip over the part of crafting that they might find tedious, such as grinding through recipes to finally get to the one they want to make. For players who really enjoy the discovery style of play and take more time to explore the possibilities of the system then they can do that as well.

 

I've seen many players reacting to our announced system and lamenting the fact that it is not more complex or innovative. There are many different ways we could have taken this system and we have done what we feel is best to support the rest of our game. For example, some games feature a gathering system that consists of some sort of gathering mini game. We didn't think that was the right way for us to go given the other goals of our game. We want players in the open world to feel like they are cooperating, never resent other players, and be able to respond to the dynamic nature of the world around them. If players needed to stop for 30-40 seconds every time they came across a gathering node then soon the other players that are playing with them who might not be particularly interested in gathering might grow impatient and the overall pacing and flow of their game experience would be interrupted. This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!” When designing a feature it is always important for us to consider how that feature impacts every other part of the game and make the choices that enhance the play experience we are trying to foster.

 

Unicornicus

Originally posted by Zeroxin

http://games.on.net/article/11863/Exclusive_Eric_Flannum_On_GW2_-_Thieves_Crafting_and_a_new_Video

We understand that this system of discovery can be circumvented by looking at the wiki but we treat this as we do any other spoiler information. For example the fact that a player could at anytime go spoil the end of their personal story by looking it up does not keep us from trying to create an exciting story that may have some twists in it. If a player wants to go find recipe knowledge then they are free to do so and they can skip over the part of crafting that they might find tedious, such as grinding through recipes to finally get to the one they want to make. For players who really enjoy the discovery style of play and take more time to explore the possibilities of the system then they can do that as well.

 

I've seen many players reacting to our announced system and lamenting the fact that it is not more complex or innovative. There are many different ways we could have taken this system and we have done what we feel is best to support the rest of our game. For example, some games feature a gathering system that consists of some sort of gathering mini game. We didn't think that was the right way for us to go given the other goals of our game. We want players in the open world to feel like they are cooperating, never resent other players, and be able to respond to the dynamic nature of the world around them. If players needed to stop for 30-40 seconds every time they came across a gathering node then soon the other players that are playing with them who might not be particularly interested in gathering might grow impatient and the overall pacing and flow of their game experience would be interrupted. This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!” When designing a feature it is always important for us to consider how that feature impacts every other part of the game and make the choices that enhance the play experience we are trying to foster.

 

The one thing I know that will inevitebley happen is griefers, running throughout the world shouting the end to personal stories with a macro over and over again, attempting to spoil the game for as many people as possible. I dont hink there is any way to check this type of behavior really.

DraganBlack

Originally posted by Unicornicus

Originally posted by Zeroxin

http://games.on.net/article/11863/Exclusive_Eric_Flannum_On_GW2_-_Thieves_Crafting_and_a_new_Video

We understand that this system of discovery can be circumvented by looking at the wiki but we treat this as we do any other spoiler information. For example the fact that a player could at anytime go spoil the end of their personal story by looking it up does not keep us from trying to create an exciting story that may have some twists in it. If a player wants to go find recipe knowledge then they are free to do so and they can skip over the part of crafting that they might find tedious, such as grinding through recipes to finally get to the one they want to make. For players who really enjoy the discovery style of play and take more time to explore the possibilities of the system then they can do that as well.

 

I've seen many players reacting to our announced system and lamenting the fact that it is not more complex or innovative. There are many different ways we could have taken this system and we have done what we feel is best to support the rest of our game. For example, some games feature a gathering system that consists of some sort of gathering mini game. We didn't think that was the right way for us to go given the other goals of our game. We want players in the open world to feel like they are cooperating, never resent other players, and be able to respond to the dynamic nature of the world around them. If players needed to stop for 30-40 seconds every time they came across a gathering node then soon the other players that are playing with them who might not be particularly interested in gathering might grow impatient and the overall pacing and flow of their game experience would be interrupted. This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!” When designing a feature it is always important for us to consider how that feature impacts every other part of the game and make the choices that enhance the play experience we are trying to foster.

 

The one thing I know that will inevitebley happen is griefers, running throughout the world shouting the end to personal stories with a macro over and over again, attempting to spoil the game for as many people as possible. I dont hink there is any way to check this type of behavior really.

I can tell you the end of the personal story right now:

we beat zaithan and he dies/falls back into sleep/flees

Shroom_Mage

---

Originally posted by DraganBlack
I can tell you the end of the personal story right now:
we beat zaithan and he dies/falls back into sleep/flees

---

Unless that's reserved for some big dynamic event.

Shroom_Mage

---

For example, as a weaponsmith I automatically know the recipes for turning copper and tin ore into bronze ingots and for taking green wood logs and turning them into soft wood planks. If I place copper ingots in the crafting window while at an anvil I can make a copper axehead and similarly if I take the green wood planks to a workbench I can make an axe haft. I don't actually have a recipe for an axe but if I combine those two items then I will create a basic axe and the recipe will be stored in my recipe list. With further experimentation and by adding other ingredients I might be able to make a statistically better or different looking axe.

---

The way this is described makes me think that you'll be able to mix and match weapon components. I wonder if they'll actually give us that sort of freedom. Can I match any axehead with any axe half, or do I have to find two of them that fit?

DarkPony

Originally posted by Zeroxin  This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!”

Oh dear, ... player tension. *shivers*

Zeroxin

Originally posted by Shroom_Mage

 

---

For example, as a weaponsmith I automatically know the recipes for turning copper and tin ore into bronze ingots and for taking green wood logs and turning them into soft wood planks. If I place copper ingots in the crafting window while at an anvil I can make a copper axehead and similarly if I take the green wood planks to a workbench I can make an axe haft. I don't actually have a recipe for an axe but if I combine those two items then I will create a basic axe and the recipe will be stored in my recipe list. With further experimentation and by adding other ingredients I might be able to make a statistically better or different looking axe.

---

The way this is described makes me think that you'll be able to mix and match weapon components. I wonder if they'll actually give us that sort of freedom. Can I match any axehead with any axe half, or do I have to find two of them that fit?

In GW1 you could fit any axe handle to any axe head so it probably will be the same.

Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Pilnkplonk

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by Zeroxin  This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!”

Oh dear, ... player tension. *shivers*

Depends on where you put the emphasis of player tension... In GW2 I believe it fits better in the "omgosh the dragon is eating Jennny!" category rather than "that's my silver node!!!!". Different games provide different experience.. you wouldn't expect an in-depth social comentary from a holywood blockbuster just like you wouldn't breathlessly await an alien invasion in a nice cosy documentary on life in 14th century europe.

(That's not to say that one sub-genre is inherently more "boring" than the other.. I usually find a good laid-back doc more exciting than a pumped-up badly made hollywood supermovie)

nomss

Originally posted by Unicornicus

Originally posted by Zeroxin

http://games.on.net/article/11863/Exclusive_Eric_Flannum_On_GW2_-_Thieves_Crafting_and_a_new_Video

We understand that this system of discovery can be circumvented by looking at the wiki but we treat this as we do any other spoiler information. For example the fact that a player could at anytime go spoil the end of their personal story by looking it up does not keep us from trying to create an exciting story that may have some twists in it. If a player wants to go find recipe knowledge then they are free to do so and they can skip over the part of crafting that they might find tedious, such as grinding through recipes to finally get to the one they want to make. For players who really enjoy the discovery style of play and take more time to explore the possibilities of the system then they can do that as well.

 

I've seen many players reacting to our announced system and lamenting the fact that it is not more complex or innovative. There are many different ways we could have taken this system and we have done what we feel is best to support the rest of our game. For example, some games feature a gathering system that consists of some sort of gathering mini game. We didn't think that was the right way for us to go given the other goals of our game. We want players in the open world to feel like they are cooperating, never resent other players, and be able to respond to the dynamic nature of the world around them. If players needed to stop for 30-40 seconds every time they came across a gathering node then soon the other players that are playing with them who might not be particularly interested in gathering might grow impatient and the overall pacing and flow of their game experience would be interrupted. This tends to be a source of player tension where you might hear statements like “is that guy going to mine again? We need to get over to the garrison!” When designing a feature it is always important for us to consider how that feature impacts every other part of the game and make the choices that enhance the play experience we are trying to foster.

 

The one thing I know that will inevitebley happen is griefers, running throughout the world shouting the end to personal stories with a macro over and over again, attempting to spoil the game for as many people as possible. I dont hink there is any way to check this type of behavior really.

I have not noticed this in other MMOs where people are trying to spoil the story.

Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just like GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

 

[Mod Edit]

romanator0

Originally posted by ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

Some parts annoy the hell out of me too,like YOU. Who insist ONLY things THEY find fun should be in the game. It just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with ONLY the features THEY find fun and nothing ELSE. I can't stand pvp so how about we remove that?  Would you be ok with that ? I'm sure some people don't like one or more of the class or races ? Should they be remove as well ? If everyone took out parts they did'nt like we would have no game left.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

GW2 is being made by ArenaNet. ArenaNet is making the game THEY want to make. It's not about you or anybody else that wants an in depth crafting system. If you don't like it then don't use it. If you don't like it so much that it will stop you from enjoying the rest of the game then too bad, you can just not play the game. ArenaNet implemented the crafting system that they felt best fit into the game with the rest of they systems. I'm sure they probably considered a system that SWG used to have or systems from other game, but the reason those didn't make it in is because they didn't fit into GW2. Seeing as GW2 doesn't have the crafting system that you like I don't see any reason why you should craft in GW2 then. It doesn't have a subscription so I'm sure that you can play Xsyon or Archeage or some other sandbox and enjoy their crafting systems while still playing and enjoying the other systems that GW2 has implemented.

MumboJumbo

^ Those cartoons are awesome!

Eric: Yes, it is very true that the thief requires a somewhat higher degree of skill to play than some of the other professions. We did design certain professions to be easier to play than others although we never want this gap to be too significant. In particular the warrior, ranger and elementalist tend to be more straightforward to play than the other professions although even the “simple” professions have a lot of depth and nuance to them.

Interesting...

 

Eric: Attributes have changed a lot since Guild Wars 1. Instead of profession specific attributes we have gone to a pool shared by all professions. The attributes are power, precision, vitality and toughness. We went to this system so that we would have a set of attributes that are valued by every profession and to lessen the ability of a player to make a bad character by putting points into the “wrong” attributes. A shared set of attributes also helps increase the ratio of useable equipment for a player. It was often the case in Guild Wars 1 for example; that you would find a staff which would be useful only to a specific build of elementalist and if you were a mesmer, necromancer, ritualist, etc… that staff was useless to you. In Guild Wars 2 this is no longer a problem and it is much more likely that any given piece of equipment that drops is something that the player will find useful.

 

As for crafting, this is theme-park mmo so economy and crafting and all that resource stuff is not why I would be playing GW2. However crafting in the EXTENDED EXPERIENCE APP would be fine to do and I hope to hear more of crafting on that front. Oc some players like crafting and maybe the GW2 system will be ok for them? It seems far less interesting than the 2 above quotes to me which are great to hear.

Edit: Funnily enough the eg above is from Star Wars Galaxies which did go the sandbox route, didn't it?

Zeroxin

Originally posted by ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

Some parts annoy the hell out of me too,like YOU. Who insist ONLY things THEY find fun should be in the game. It just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with ONLY the features THEY find fun and nothing ELSE. I can't stand pvp so how about we remove that?  Would you be ok with that ? I'm sure some people don't like one or more of the class or races ? Should they be remove as well ? If everyone took out parts they did'nt like we would have no game left.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just like GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

.....*scratches head*..... Can't handle it, unplug this bastard!

cali59

Originally posted by Unicornicus

The one thing I know that will inevitebley happen is griefers, running throughout the world shouting the end to personal stories with a macro over and over again, attempting to spoil the game for as many people as possible. I dont hink there is any way to check this type of behavior really.

 If GW2 manages to eliminate all other kinds of griefing to the point where this is the only outlet left for jerks, I'd have to consider it a major success.

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Zeroxin

Originally posted by ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just like GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

 

[Mod Edit]

If you want a truly complex crafting system, why don't you put an idea together yourself? Because it is one thing to say you want a "complex crafting system", it's an entirely different thing to know how one can be put together. You can talk about "truly complex" all you want but until YOU know what one is, your words are less than air.

romanator0

Originally posted by Zeroxin

Originally posted by ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just like GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

 

[Mod Edit]

If you want a truly complex crafting system, why don't you put an idea together yourself? Because it is one thing to say you want a "complex crafting system", it's an entirely different thing to know how one can be put together. You can talk about "truly complex" all you want but until YOU know what one is, your words are less than air.

You forgot about having this "complex crafting system" fitting in with the other systems in the game.

lunatis

I've seen many players reacting to our announced system and lamenting the fact that it is not more complex or innovative. There are many different ways we could have taken this system and we have done what we feel is best to support the rest of our game.

 

It's just a copy and paste with a new "Entrée"?

ircaddicts

Originally posted by Fion

Originally posted by ircaddicts

Originally posted by Master10K

Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

sounds fair enough

Any system shouldn't be considered good or bad on its own but on how it relates to the game as a whole..

Strangely I quite enjoy the intricate time-consuming crafting in Xsyon (not right now but i did) but I wouldn't want something like that in GW2.

It's time for this genre to grow up beyond "one game to rule them all" imo.

Exactly. If I want to play an MMO because I love complex crafting then I'd play an MMO with that as one of it's core focuses and if I want to play an MMO to have fun I'll play Guild Wars 2. Just sad that people still expect Guild Wars 2 to come out with features that will fulfill all of their needs, forcing the community manager & devs to constantly clarify things and re-iterate their stance. And still people constantly bring out the torches, as soon as something is mentioned that doesn't appease them like: the elementalist not getting a weapon swap, the warrior being able to use a longbows well, ranger's pets that seem to die a lot (when the owner forgets about them), the Guardian being so support-centric, the thief being able to stealth, the lack of dedicated raid content, the lack of dedicated healers, the lack of an overly complex crafting system. The list goes on.

 

I've only been a part of the MMO genre/community for a few months & some parts just annoy the hell out of me.

I've played 15+ mmos and have yet to see an overly complex crafting system let along a complex one. IN DEPTH ones yes, overly complex or even complex NO.  Even SWG (the best crafting system ever) was'nt complex it just needed some thinking if you wanted to make the best items. Now I know the avarge wow player does'nt like to or can't think but what about those of us who DO. Why SHOULD'NT GW2 have an in depth crafting system for those that LIKE to craft so they can do it and those that don't can just buy items just like what happend in SWG. Just like GW2 will have a indepth pvp system for those that like it and one that can be totaly avoided for those like me who don't

 

[Mod Edit]

 

You didn't play a Bioengineer in SWG then. That was a truly complex system. The basics were easy, sneak up on a mob and poke them with a needle, but when it came to producing the king of result from your engineering you wanted, and one others wanted, it took pages and pages of experimentation and result. Thank god that game included an in-game notepad because without it you'd spend more time alt-tabbed to your bioengineering notes trying to get each setting and numerical figure correct to produce the best rancor pet possible than you would in the game itself.

It is true that 'most' professions in SWG weren't super complex. Most were fairly easy to learn but let you experiment with a lot of trial and error until you really got the crafting down and new what materials at what percentages produced the best items, etc. But that was not the case with the bioengineer.

To bad they killed the profession with the NGE. Sure the CE made it a lot harder to do well but the NGE removed it completely.

 Yes actually I did. I  spent about 6 months as a BE and became very good at. Mostly the chef and tailor adds but I still managed to make some very nice creatures. I did'nt find it that complex. But thats me. I can see how others might of. Yes the BE was probley the "most" complex of the crafting professions but its still was'nt that hard or that complex really. Like I said it just required some thought. Yes I will never forgive SOE for what they did to SWG with the cu/nge  and will NEVER play another mmo they have anything to do with.

But thats not the point. THE POINT was I hate pvp BUT i'm not asking for it to be a cut and paste job form wow like some people are with crafting. SO WHY if anet can spend so much time on something as unimportant as pvp why can't they spend a little more time on something a LOT more players would enjoy IE crafting. The discovery system is pointless as 90% or more of the recipes will be on the wiki BEFORE the game even goes live. That is unless they totaly change all the recipes between the end of open beta and the launch of the game. Which would be a lot of work at a time when I'm sure they have much better things to do.

I would'nt want a truely complex crafting system as too many people could'nt handle it. I WOULD like one thats not so simple and where there is room to make your self special. In this one if I make a max axe it will be the same as the one anyone else makes. I want there to be room for me to make a BETTER axe than someone else if I put the time and effort into it

Loke666

Originally posted by ircaddicts

 Yes actually I did. I  spent about 6 months as a BE and became very good at. Mostly the chef and tailor adds but I still managed to make some very nice creatures. I did'nt find it that complex. But thats me. I can see how others might of. Yes the BE was probley the "most" complex of the crafting professions but its still was'nt that hard or that complex really. Like I said it just required some thought. Yes I will never forgive SOE for what they did to SWG with the cu/nge  and will NEVER play another mmo they have anything to do with.

But thats not the point. THE POINT was I hate pvp BUT i'm not asking for it to be a cut and paste job form wow like some people are with crafting. SO WHY if anet can spend so much time on something as unimportant as pvp why can't they spend a little more time on something a LOT more players would enjoy IE crafting. The discovery system is pointless as 90% or more of the recipes will be on the wiki BEFORE the game even goes live. That is unless they totaly change all the recipes between the end of open beta and the launch of the game. Which would be a lot of work at a time when I'm sure they have much better things to do.

I would'nt want a truely complex crafting system as too many people could'nt handle it. I WOULD like one thats not so simple and where there is room to make your self special. In this one if I make a max axe it will be the same as the one anyone else makes. I want there to be room for me to make a BETTER axe than someone else if I put the time and effort into it

Many of GW1s players love PvP. To not spend a lot of work on it would be letting those players down. The GW1 fans don't even have crafting so any system there is a step forward.

I agree with you that this system is far from optimal, but at least it has little grind. The usual EQ/EQ2/Wow mechanics are not better at all, they just leads to people making loads of vendortrash. This anyways means that all people can craft a lot of the things in the game but there will be rare dropped recipes and a few you get from quests and possibly factions as well.

The thing that upsets me is actually that I can't decide how the item looks.

So my opinion is: Could be worse, could be like Wow.

Ender4

I like a lot of things about GW2 but I really dislike the trend of bending backwards to avoid tension between players. Competition between players in the game is not some big evil thing, it is part of what builds a strong community. This trend in all current MMOs is part of the reason they don't have the communities that older MMOs had.

jondifool

Originally posted by Ender4

I like a lot of things about GW2 but I really dislike the trend of bending backwards to avoid tension between players. Competition between players in the game is not some big evil thing, it is part of what builds a strong community. This trend in all current MMOs is part of the reason they don't have the communities that older MMOs had.

 Like it or not , this is a trademark of ArenaNet , so don't ekspect anything else than that in GW2. And GW1 have its community its just another crowd, and based on other values, than the so called old MMOs!

Zeroxin

Originally posted by Ender4

I like a lot of things about GW2 but I really dislike the trend of bending backwards to avoid tension between players. Competition between players in the game is not some big evil thing, it is part of what builds a strong community. This trend in all current MMOs is part of the reason they don't have the communities that older MMOs had.

Competition between players is fostered on a different level. On a playing field that both parties agree to compete on, such as; the Arenas and Server vs Server PvP. Anything else that doesn't involve the PvP realm is minimized or taken out completely.

Master10K

Originally posted by Ender4

I like a lot of things about GW2 but I really dislike the trend of bending backwards to avoid tension between players. Competition between players in the game is not some big evil thing, it is part of what builds a strong community. This trend in all current MMOs is part of the reason they don't have the communities that older MMOs had.

If that was even true then why will there be World PvP & Structed PvP, because I doubt people will be skipping around /hugging everyone in those environments. I agree that competition between players is not the "big evil" in the MMO space but; ganking, ninja looting, ninja mining and general griefing is.

I really wish you'd stop bringing up how you hate that GW2 will stop people like you from ganking and griefing wherever you want, leaving you without anyway to jerk off your e-peen. It's just not gonna happen, so get over it. Instead of moaning about it everyday, why not just go play on the PvP servers of Rift and gank some Guardians trying to close a Rift. That seems to be the kind of game that'll get griefers all hard. :P