Just a general reply to everyone calling healers healbots,
A healbot is a badly designed healing class, just like a badly designed DPS class is a button basher.
A healbot is not what all healing classes are. Just look at the GW1 Monk. The healbots playing GW1 Monks end up spamming Healing Breeze and Orison of Healing, then run out of energy and then watch their party die.
Actual good healers were able to take the monk class and keep 4-man parties at 75%+ hp in most circumstances ( unless a good mesmer, assassin or hammer warrior came along. )
By combining protection prayers and healing prayers the monk had to be smart about his spells and he could keep allies alive in all but the most dire circumstances but every failure leads to losing about half your energy bar, and when you run out of energy someone dies.
And while I'm sure the guardian will be a great and interesting class it will not be a protection monk. I can't honestly believe that anyone that really played a prot monk and had a good look at the guardian skills can say so. Sure, some of the skills have the same names but that's about where it ends. It's been inspired by the protection monk, nothing more.
Don't get me wrong, not saying the guardian will be boring or anything like that, but it won't be a prot monk. It can't be. If it was able to be played like a prot monk then you would have the equivalent of a healing class. Though instead of dishing out heals he'll be dishing out shields of absorption, protective spirits and reversals of fortune.
The protection monk was a 100% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, keep his entire group alive by preventing about half the damage done to his group through smart skill use and healing the rest through well timed reversals of fortune and the occasional zealous benediction.
The guardian will at most be a 50% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, prevent some critical damage to his group. He will not be able to prevent the amounts of damage a prot monk does. He will not be able to heal like a prot monk does, he will not have to perform triage like the prot monk does. He can't, because the moment he does he'll be a 100% supportive class that will be needed for hard content and instead of LF healer you'll start seeing LF guardian, which ANet is trying to prevent last I checked.
The guardian will have a diffirent playstyle then the prot monk. He's a new and interesting class, probably designed to ease supportive players over into the new system, but he's not in any way or form the equal of a GW prot monk.
We are the bunny. Resistance is futile. ''/\/\'''''/\/\''''''/\/\ ( o.o) ( o.o) ( o.o) (")("),,(")("),(")(")
I will give to the OP a generic response because i haven't tested GW2, so i'm not sure how healing work, even if i know how they described the healing mechanism.
In open class games where there is no healer class like Darkfall, Ultima online and few other i won't name, it really depend on how the game mechanism are set concerning healing. If they are "well" set, then you will be able to be a dedicated healer in pvp/group pve, this role will be a good choice maybe even looked for. For exemple in Uo i knew few that really like to heal as a main activity and they did that very well, in group pvp it really was something good to have. But in some other games like Darkfall, the mechanism simply doesn't permit it, healing as a main activity was just a very bad option overall. So really it depend a lot on hwo the game is made concerning healing, but from what i gathered it seam to be a valid option in GW2.
Now one thing is sure wanting to heal as a first role won't be a free ticket to find party anymore. So if it was the underlining reason why you like to be healer then you might be disapointed.
In an other words good open class system will let you play the roles you really like, many role, some role even the dev didn't taught about. If the game is not very well done, you won't even be able to have the few role that are comon to any mmo, be it thempark or not.
Have fun playing Rift. I mean that seriously. Not any one game can appeal to everyone. Guild Wars 2 exists for people like me. I don't need to convince you to change your mind in order to be happy.
Because I have something called a valid point? It's not about convincing me to be happy with the game. It's a valid point on how they completely left a whole group of MMO players dry when they eliminated our class. If it's made for people like you, GREAT FOR YOU!! But for people like me who enjoyed the first game very much, but have been destroyed of hope by the class we play.... I am allowed questions and protestations.
True, you have every right to question, protest, gnash your teeth and howl at the moon. But what are you hoping to accomplish by doing it here? It will not impact the design of the game and nothing that can be said here will influence your decision, so what's the point? Just to let the world know that you're not happy? Seeking some validation from likeminded healer types who also feel stiffed? Looking for a fight?
I'm going with the latter since it's clear you're going to find most folks here aren't going to agree with you and if you want to play a healer, there are multiudes of other games out there to suit your tastes. You could easily just be playing them right now, rather than coming here and swinging your protest sign at passersby.
So really, it's not about having the game experience you want, it's about getting a little attention. OK, well done. You've now had a few minutes of mine. That's the last of it you're going to get on this topic. Make sure you put some plastic over your placard. I hear it might rain.
Just a general reply to everyone calling healers healbots,
A healbot is a badly designed healing class, just like a badly designed DPS class is a button basher.
A healbot is not what all healing classes are. Just look at the GW1 Monk. The healbots playing GW1 Monks end up spamming Healing Breeze and Orison of Healing, then run out of energy and then watch their party die.
Actual good healers were able to take the monk class and keep 4-man parties at 75%+ hp in most circumstances ( unless a good mesmer, assassin or hammer warrior came along. )
By combining protection prayers and healing prayers the monk had to be smart about his spells and he could keep allies alive in all but the most dire circumstances but every failure leads to losing about half your energy bar, and when you run out of energy someone dies.
And while I'm sure the guardian will be a great and interesting class it will not be a protection monk. I can't honestly believe that anyone that really played a prot monk and had a good look at the guardian skills can say so. Sure, some of the skills have the same names but that's about where it ends. It's been inspired by the protection monk, nothing more.
Don't get me wrong, not saying the guardian will be boring or anything like that, but it won't be a prot monk. It can't be. If it was able to be played like a prot monk then you would have the equivalent of a healing class. Though instead of dishing out heals he'll be dishing out shields of absorption, protective spirits and reversals of fortune.
The protection monk was a 100% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, keep his entire group alive by preventing about half the damage done to his group through smart skill use and healing the rest through well timed reversals of fortune and the occasional zealous benediction.
The guardian will at most be a 50% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, prevent some critical damage to his group. He will not be able to prevent the amounts of damage a prot monk does. He will not be able to heal like a prot monk does, he will not have to perform triage like the prot monk does. He can't, because the moment he does he'll be a 100% supportive class that will be needed for hard content and instead of LF healer you'll start seeing LF guardian, which ANet is trying to prevent last I checked.
The guardian will have a diffirent playstyle then the prot monk. He's a new and interesting class, probably designed to ease supportive players over into the new system, but he's not in any way or form the equal of a GW prot monk.
The guardian can do all those things he just won't be doing it to a single person at a time and that won't be all he's doing.
Just a general reply to everyone calling healers healbots,
A healbot is a badly designed healing class, just like a badly designed DPS class is a button basher.
A healbot is not what all healing classes are. Just look at the GW1 Monk. The healbots playing GW1 Monks end up spamming Healing Breeze and Orison of Healing, then run out of energy and then watch their party die.
Actual good healers were able to take the monk class and keep 4-man parties at 75%+ hp in most circumstances ( unless a good mesmer, assassin or hammer warrior came along. )
By combining protection prayers and healing prayers the monk had to be smart about his spells and he could keep allies alive in all but the most dire circumstances but every failure leads to losing about half your energy bar, and when you run out of energy someone dies.
And while I'm sure the guardian will be a great and interesting class it will not be a protection monk. I can't honestly believe that anyone that really played a prot monk and had a good look at the guardian skills can say so. Sure, some of the skills have the same names but that's about where it ends. It's been inspired by the protection monk, nothing more.
Don't get me wrong, not saying the guardian will be boring or anything like that, but it won't be a prot monk. It can't be. If it was able to be played like a prot monk then you would have the equivalent of a healing class. Though instead of dishing out heals he'll be dishing out shields of absorption, protective spirits and reversals of fortune.
The protection monk was a 100% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, keep his entire group alive by preventing about half the damage done to his group through smart skill use and healing the rest through well timed reversals of fortune and the occasional zealous benediction.
The guardian will at most be a 50% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, prevent some critical damage to his group. He will not be able to prevent the amounts of damage a prot monk does. He will not be able to heal like a prot monk does, he will not have to perform triage like the prot monk does. He can't, because the moment he does he'll be a 100% supportive class that will be needed for hard content and instead of LF healer you'll start seeing LF guardian, which ANet is trying to prevent last I checked.
The guardian will have a diffirent playstyle then the prot monk. He's a new and interesting class, probably designed to ease supportive players over into the new system, but he's not in any way or form the equal of a GW prot monk.
Your case would be exceptional, but in this case you are wrong in one simple yet very important regard. A Prot monk in GW was designed to be in tune with mechanics existent in GW1. A game that has no self-healing, little importance on positioning, and most of all - a large focus on making encounters hard for a group without a prot monk because of burst damage that could not be mitigated otherwise. In GW2, the Guardian is far and above what you have labelled it as.
The Guardian will be a 100% Supportive class if it needs to be. It is not required because of the skill based gameplay that GW2 is touting. Guardians will be great in a group setting and provide similar presence to a Prot monk simply because it has to be. In GW1, a monk has to do all the mitigation and healing - in GW2 the Gaurdian has to control the map and mitigate so his/her group CAN heal.
It is different, way different - but don't think for a moment that Guardians will not be able to perform said support skills. It is a different game, so it requires a different approach. Prot Monk has no place in GW2, if a Prot monk existed in it's current form it would be all fluff because players don't NEED prot monks, they need Guardians. They do all their own mitigation and all their own healing. They can not without a Guardian however, just press an oh s@%^ button and be good to go - that is the Guardians job.
You should really examine the games current layout and status, and most of all it's mechanics. You will see what I mean, but I guess I see your point. No more Whack-a-mole, and to the people that enjoy whack-a-mole --- cool.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
Just a general reply to everyone calling healers healbots,
A healbot is a badly designed healing class, just like a badly designed DPS class is a button basher.
A healbot is not what all healing classes are. Just look at the GW1 Monk. The healbots playing GW1 Monks end up spamming Healing Breeze and Orison of Healing, then run out of energy and then watch their party die.
Actual good healers were able to take the monk class and keep 4-man parties at 75%+ hp in most circumstances ( unless a good mesmer, assassin or hammer warrior came along. )
By combining protection prayers and healing prayers the monk had to be smart about his spells and he could keep allies alive in all but the most dire circumstances but every failure leads to losing about half your energy bar, and when you run out of energy someone dies.
And while I'm sure the guardian will be a great and interesting class it will not be a protection monk. I can't honestly believe that anyone that really played a prot monk and had a good look at the guardian skills can say so. Sure, some of the skills have the same names but that's about where it ends. It's been inspired by the protection monk, nothing more.
Don't get me wrong, not saying the guardian will be boring or anything like that, but it won't be a prot monk. It can't be. If it was able to be played like a prot monk then you would have the equivalent of a healing class. Though instead of dishing out heals he'll be dishing out shields of absorption, protective spirits and reversals of fortune.
The protection monk was a 100% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, keep his entire group alive by preventing about half the damage done to his group through smart skill use and healing the rest through well timed reversals of fortune and the occasional zealous benediction.
The guardian will at most be a 50% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, prevent some critical damage to his group. He will not be able to prevent the amounts of damage a prot monk does. He will not be able to heal like a prot monk does, he will not have to perform triage like the prot monk does. He can't, because the moment he does he'll be a 100% supportive class that will be needed for hard content and instead of LF healer you'll start seeing LF guardian, which ANet is trying to prevent last I checked.
The guardian will have a diffirent playstyle then the prot monk. He's a new and interesting class, probably designed to ease supportive players over into the new system, but he's not in any way or form the equal of a GW prot monk.
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
Oh well. One man's trash is another man's treasure. While a few people will be turned off by the lack of healbots far more people are praising ArenaNet for doing it.
Healbots is not the same as people who enjoy healing and far more jaded people will be praising the game once it is released. That's the point, it seems amazing in your dorky little heads but once it's released it finds some way of always disappointing. Oh I can't wait for this game, it will be the end all most amazingis game in the world!! Really? Wasn't that what you said about the past 4 release games before you played them?
I guess you will have to find another glory class. THis is a good move for the game , sadly not one I will play as its not an MMO just a glorified arena game.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
True, you have every right to question, protest, gnash your teeth and howl at the moon. But what are you hoping to accomplish by doing it here? It will not impact the design of the game and nothing that can be said here will influence your decision, so what's the point? Just to let the world know that you're not happy? Seeking some validation from likeminded healer types who also feel stiffed? Looking for a fight?
I'm going with the latter since it's clear you're going to find most folks here aren't going to agree with you and if you want to play a healer, there are multiudes of other games out there to suit your tastes. You could easily just be playing them right now, rather than coming here and swinging your protest sign at passersby.
So really, it's not about having the game experience you want, it's about getting a little attention. OK, well done. You've now had a few minutes of mine. That's the last of it you're going to get on this topic. Make sure you put some plastic over your placard. I hear it might rain.
I've gotta agree, the OP is definitely look for a fight or at least some validation in his/her unpopular views. So I don't see why everyone else is trying so hard to convince the OP to give the Guardians a cance since in his/her mind the OP has already made the decision whether to buy Guild Wars 2 or not. But oh well, at least it gives people something to talk about until Charr week.
As for my views, quite frankly I hate dedicated healers becuase they are absolutely necessary in most MMOs and yet the healbots are never there when you need them. Sometimess it can take over an hour to find one. Sure as a dedicated healer you'll find it easy to get into groups, but everyone else is always stuck waiting around, "LF Healer" every 5mins and it is what killed my enjoyment in LOTRO. Not the whole segregated nature of the community, but just having to wait around in order to have some fun. So I can't wait to play a game like GW2, where I won't have to wait around in order to have some fun.
BTW... It really makes no sense that people complain about the lack of dedicated healers or tanks in this game, when +90% of MMOs are able to satisfy that need. Just like how people complain about the game not having PvP servers. Well I'm currently playing Rift (free weekend) and I'm still waiting to be ganked.
I am really looking forward to this game because I loved playing the defenders who were not empathy in City of Heroes and corruptors in City of Villains that had area heals or mob centered heals so people had to be more proactive to get healed. Not just stand there and expect some healer to target and heal them.
If you think that playing a healing class only consists of targetting green bars well I love how all the DPS classes hardly ever pay much attention to what they are doing and just expecting to get healed. They can be equally tunnel visioned but that is all just class bashing. Healing like tanking are just different ways to play and even in lore there are many instances of people with minimum fighting skills who go along with fighters to help look after the injured. You can also take real life instances where many medics in war are just only basic fighters but are an essential part of the team and help save lives. Those are by no means small roles and healers should not be looked down upon. DPS classes for that matter can be described as being incredibly selfish if one were to be talking about healbots in a similar derogatory way.
I think that I would love to play in games where they are approaching the whole heal or tank set up differently and I hope it can be as fun as it was running in City of X . You will be surprised how much fun it can be playing games where you challenge the tried and true ways and come up with interesting means to handle a quest or dungeon. I started playign healers because as a wizard in Everquest I had so much difficulty getting groups that I swore to myself never again so now I still play healers and I enjoy it. I also am trying to play tanks of late.
Your case would be exceptional, but in this case you are wrong in one simple yet very important regard. A Prot monk in GW was designed to be in tune with mechanics existent in GW1. A game that has no self-healing, little importance on positioning, and most of all - a large focus on making encounters hard for a group without a prot monk because of burst damage that could not be mitigated otherwise. In GW2, the Guardian is far and above what you have labelled it as.
The Guardian will be a 100% Supportive class if it needs to be. It is not required because of the skill based gameplay that GW2 is touting. Guardians will be great in a group setting and provide similar presence to a Prot monk simply because it has to be. In GW1, a monk has to do all the mitigation and healing - in GW2 the Gaurdian has to control the map and mitigate so his/her group CAN heal.
It is different, way different - but don't think for a moment that Guardians will not be able to perform said support skills. It is a different game, so it requires a different approach. Prot Monk has no place in GW2, if a Prot monk existed in it's current form it would be all fluff because players don't NEED prot monks, they need Guardians. They do all their own mitigation and all their own healing. They can not without a Guardian however, just press an oh s@%^ button and be good to go - that is the Guardians job.
You should really examine the games current layout and status, and most of all it's mechanics. You will see what I mean, but I guess I see your point. No more Whack-a-mole, and to the people that enjoy whack-a-mole --- cool.
A guardian will never be 100% supportive. No matter what weapon you pick there's always some offensive skills.
For the rest you're just making the point I made:
The guardian is not in any way or form a prot monk. GW2 does not have prot monks.
Some of us actually found it fun to manage other people's health and mitigation. And if you think the GW monk was whack-a-mole healbot gameplay then either you've never played a Monk or you were a horrribly crappy Monk.
I'm not saying GW2 should change it's gameplay or mechanics in any way or form. I'm just trying to provide some counterweight to the large amount of "GW2 is awesome and everything that's not GW2 sucks donkeyballs" mindset that a lot of posters on the GW2 section seem to have.
GW2 is looking to be a great game, not fighting that. But not everything that's not GW2 sucks. Interesting healers like the GW Monk were great fun. And they're not in GW2. Doesn't make GW2 any less. But it does mean that there's fun things besides GW2. It does mean that anyone not that interested in GW2 isn't a mentally retarded troll but simply likes diffirent things.
GW2 does a many great things. It does not however provide everything. If I like healing with well designed classes that don't fall into the healbot category then GW2 isn't the game for me. The guardian is not a replacement. That doesn't make the guardian a lesser class, just a diffirent class.
I have examined GW2s layout and status. I suggest you do the same, this time realistically. GW2 does not provide everything. GW2 does not have the answer to every complaint. The guardian is not the answer to a great healing class. And that's okay, it doesn't have to be.
GW2 is great. But can we please stop answering every MMO complaint with GW2 and just accept that for all it's greatness GW2 does not provide everything, nor is it trying to?
So, to all the guys answering every thread with GW2, please stop. GW2 does not have healers, the guardian is no replacement and people liking healer aren't mental retards that really want to play whack-a-mole while the rest of their group is forced to worship them and serve their every whim.
Why is it so hard to just answer such a question saying that GW2 doesn't provide said feature but that it does have lots of other interesting features without making the OP sound like he's a mental retard that thinks that fun is the equivalent of repeatedly stabbing shards of broken glass in your eyes?
We are the bunny. Resistance is futile. ''/\/\'''''/\/\''''''/\/\ ( o.o) ( o.o) ( o.o) (")("),,(")("),(")(")
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
I'm not fighting that the guardian can't be an interesting and even supportive class,
but it's not a prot monk. If you think that applying 2 conditions: protection and regeneration, and some protective bubbles and shields is the equivalent of the huge array of options available to the protection monk then you've never played one.
As a protection Monk I had over 50 diffirent protective enchantments to choose from. Most with unique effects that all had diffirent situations in which they were ideal.
The guardian is a totally diffirent class. It doesn't have the large array of protective enchantments. It does have interesting area effects in the form of their shields, domes, lines and symbols.
I'm not saying that the guardian is in any way lesser then the monk, but it is a diffirent class. If I liked being a prot monk then I won't automatically like the guardian. And if I don't like the guardian but do like healers then it doesn't mean that I'm some sort of socially deranged person with a desperate need to be wanted and needed by people playing online video games.
Why is it so hard to admit that GW2 isn't the game for everyone? Why must everyone who doesn't like GW2 be branded as some sort of idiot who obviously thinks whack-a-mole and endless gear grind is what fun is all about? Why must everytime someone admits to liking healing he be given the choice of either admitting that the guardian takes all the fun parts of healing while leaving the unfun parts behind or being branded as a retarded sociopath who just wants other players to wait for him and be required in all forms of gameplay?
We are the bunny. Resistance is futile. ''/\/\'''''/\/\''''''/\/\ ( o.o) ( o.o) ( o.o) (")("),,(")("),(")(")
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
I'm not fighting that the guardian can't be an interesting and even supportive class,
but it's not a prot monk. If you think that applying 2 conditions: protection and regeneration, and some protective bubbles and shields is the equivalent of the huge array of options available to the protection monk then you've never played one.
As a protection Monk I had over 50 diffirent protective enchantments to choose from. Most with unique effects that all had diffirent situations in which they were ideal.
The guardian is a totally diffirent class. It doesn't have the large array of protective enchantments. It does have interesting area effects in the form of their shields, domes, lines and symbols.
I'm not saying that the guardian is in any way lesser then the monk, but it is a diffirent class. If I liked being a prot monk then I won't automatically like the guardian. And if I don't like the guardian but do like healers then it doesn't mean that I'm some sort of socially deranged person with a desperate need to be wanted and needed by people playing online video games.
Why is it so hard to admit that GW2 isn't the game for everyone? Why must everyone who doesn't like GW2 be branded as some sort of idiot who obviously thinks whack-a-mole and endless gear grind is what fun is all about? Why must everytime someone admits to liking healing he be given the choice of either admitting that the guardian takes all the fun parts of healing while leaving the unfun parts behind or being branded as a retarded sociopath who just wants other players to wait for him and be required in all forms of gameplay?
I try, because the OP obviously wanted some sort of answer or else her post is simply there to start shit, but I doubt that is the case. Cut and dry. I didn't feel like the the OP had been sufficiently answered so I simply attempted to do so.
You seem to want to remain stuck in your ways that "Guardian is not Prot Monk", but no one ever said it was - only you. Guardians are all about mitigation the same way Prot monks were, just not with direct spells and healing. If you take away the mitigation part of that equation, you are left with healing - aka whack-a-mole.
No one ever said that Prot Monks were all about Whack-a-mole either, you are just getting incredibly offended because you failed to really understand what other people were trying to say. If you would have stopped a second, you will realize that you said in your explaination to me about how Guardians and Prot Monks are for the most part both cool, that I said the exact same things you were saying.
So... yeah, you say there is no answer in GW2 for certain players, I say they are just cooped up in their shells and refuse to come out. Buy it, try it - I will never say Guardians = Prot Monks, but I will say that the play style accomplishes the same thing, minus whack-a-mole.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
I'm not fighting that the guardian can't be an interesting and even supportive class,
but it's not a prot monk. If you think that applying 2 conditions: protection and regeneration, and some protective bubbles and shields is the equivalent of the huge array of options available to the protection monk then you've never played one.
As a protection Monk I had over 50 diffirent protective enchantments to choose from. Most with unique effects that all had diffirent situations in which they were ideal.
The guardian is a totally diffirent class. It doesn't have the large array of protective enchantments. It does have interesting area effects in the form of their shields, domes, lines and symbols.
I'm not saying that the guardian is in any way lesser then the monk, but it is a diffirent class. If I liked being a prot monk then I won't automatically like the guardian. And if I don't like the guardian but do like healers then it doesn't mean that I'm some sort of socially deranged person with a desperate need to be wanted and needed by people playing online video games.
Why is it so hard to admit that GW2 isn't the game for everyone? Why must everyone who doesn't like GW2 be branded as some sort of idiot who obviously thinks whack-a-mole and endless gear grind is what fun is all about? Why must everytime someone admits to liking healing he be given the choice of either admitting that the guardian takes all the fun parts of healing while leaving the unfun parts behind or being branded as a retarded sociopath who just wants other players to wait for him and be required in all forms of gameplay?
I try, because the OP obviously wanted some sort of answer or else her post is simply there to start shit, but I doubt that is the case. Cut and dry. I didn't feel like the the OP had been sufficiently answered so I simply attempted to do so.
You seem to want to remain stuck in your ways that "Guardian is not Prot Monk", but no one ever said it was - only you. Guardians are all about mitigation the same way Prot monks were, just not with direct spells and healing. If you take away the mitigation part of that equation, you are left with healing - aka whack-a-mole.
No one ever said that Prot Monks were all about Whack-a-mole either, you are just getting incredibly offended because you failed to really understand what other people were trying to say. If you would have stopped a second, you will realize that you said in your explaination to me about how Guardians and Prot Monks are for the most part both cool, that I said the exact same things you were saying.
So... yeah, you say there is no answer in GW2 for certain players, I say they are just cooped up in their shells and refuse to come out. Buy it, try it - I will never say Guardians = Prot Monks, but I will say that the play style accomplishes the same thing, minus whack-a-mole.
Irony is both these posts are WAAAY more than the OP deserves : D Both correct.
Thing is OP (just the facts ma'am): 1. most other mmos will cater to "pure healer" 2. Give the Guardian/Necro/Ele a whirl if you can afford b2p/hear some good reports = win/win for you tbh. Or as Reiz says above don't write it off, why should you when you have so much choice already?
One reason is all you need to forget about GW2? MMOs are supposed to be more than just healing. The fact that you refuse to play it just because your favorite class is being thrown away(thank god), it shows that you have no open mind. You're closed mind makes you see one thing and if it's not there, you won't play the game. Let me tell you something Dreamer, I can tell you exactly why you like a healer. And it's sure as hell not the "healing" part. You don't enjoy watching red bars all day. Trust me, you don't.
What you really appreciate and like is the ability to help people. You like supporting. You like keeping people alive. You can still do this, albeit in a different way. One of my good buddies is an avid healer. That's ALL he plays. When he heard that ArenaNet was getting rid of the healer class, he just about cried. He was looking forward to the game so much. He automatically thought that he wasn't going to buy the game. But then something happened that changed his mind. The Guardian class was announced. It's there for the healer type of players that like supporting and helping others. It might be done in a different way but it gives off the same satisfying feeling that you helped your buddies out. Sometimes people don't like playing tanks or dps. That's understandable. But everyone can tank. Everyone can dps. Everyone can support. Shouldn't it be good that you have the option to do all of those with the Guardian? If all you want to do is support, then do that with the Guardian class. But if a certain situation pops up that calls for you to tank or dps, then you have that ability. That's something the Monk in GW1 didn't have.
Why don't you stop being so mad towards change. Try out Guild Wars 2, play the Guardian and then tell me it's not the same. I guarantee you'll love it. You might not know how to play it at first considering they threw away the holy trinity so the game plays differently than any other, but once you get the basics down, it'll be very rewarding. If you don't want to give the game a chance just because of a stupid reason like that, then go ahead. But know this, ArenaNet is not alienating the people that play healers. They created a class that gives off that same sort of satisfaction. People will realize this and let me tell you, the people that like to heal in MMOs aren't many. Especially compared to other classes. Just feel lucky ANet had you guys/girls in mind when creating this game and throwing away the holy trinity.
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
I'm not fighting that the guardian can't be an interesting and even supportive class,
but it's not a prot monk. If you think that applying 2 conditions: protection and regeneration, and some protective bubbles and shields is the equivalent of the huge array of options available to the protection monk then you've never played one.
As a protection Monk I had over 50 diffirent protective enchantments to choose from. Most with unique effects that all had diffirent situations in which they were ideal.
The guardian is a totally diffirent class. It doesn't have the large array of protective enchantments. It does have interesting area effects in the form of their shields, domes, lines and symbols.
I'm not saying that the guardian is in any way lesser then the monk, but it is a diffirent class. If I liked being a prot monk then I won't automatically like the guardian. And if I don't like the guardian but do like healers then it doesn't mean that I'm some sort of socially deranged person with a desperate need to be wanted and needed by people playing online video games.
Why is it so hard to admit that GW2 isn't the game for everyone? Why must everyone who doesn't like GW2 be branded as some sort of idiot who obviously thinks whack-a-mole and endless gear grind is what fun is all about? Why must everytime someone admits to liking healing he be given the choice of either admitting that the guardian takes all the fun parts of healing while leaving the unfun parts behind or being branded as a retarded sociopath who just wants other players to wait for him and be required in all forms of gameplay?
Hey hey calm down, aim that frustration at those who deserve it lol. I personally just try to help people find what they like within whatever they find different or annoying, which is what I was trying to do here. Considering how little I know of the guardian and his list of skills, I can't really say how much of a deviation it is from the prot monk but we have to remember the prot monk was all about damage mitigation and that is what the guardian seems to be about too. Now you may not find the way he seems to do it (being AoE and all) palatable to your playstyle and that's fine but that doesn't stop us from trying to help you get to grips with it.
Oh well. One man's trash is another man's treasure. While a few people will be turned off by the lack of healbots far more people are praising ArenaNet for doing it.
Healbots is not the same as people who enjoy healing and far more jaded people will be praising the game once it is released. That's the point, it seems amazing in your dorky little heads but once it's released it finds some way of always disappointing. Oh I can't wait for this game, it will be the end all most amazingis game in the world!! Really? Wasn't that what you said about the past 4 release games before you played them?
I guess you will have to find another glory class. THis is a good move for the game , sadly not one I will play as its not an MMO just a glorified arena game.
PLEASE explain, and if you mention the word 'instanced' or 'phased' in a context that doesn't have anything to do with it I will double-back-flip-internet-slap you.
I can't believe this thread is going on. The OP hasn't said a word over the last 2 - 3 pages of comments. No reason to continue it I would say, as everyone was quoting and replying to the OP.
Comments
Just a general reply to everyone calling healers healbots,
A healbot is a badly designed healing class, just like a badly designed DPS class is a button basher.
A healbot is not what all healing classes are. Just look at the GW1 Monk. The healbots playing GW1 Monks end up spamming Healing Breeze and Orison of Healing, then run out of energy and then watch their party die.
Actual good healers were able to take the monk class and keep 4-man parties at 75%+ hp in most circumstances ( unless a good mesmer, assassin or hammer warrior came along. )
By combining protection prayers and healing prayers the monk had to be smart about his spells and he could keep allies alive in all but the most dire circumstances but every failure leads to losing about half your energy bar, and when you run out of energy someone dies.
And while I'm sure the guardian will be a great and interesting class it will not be a protection monk. I can't honestly believe that anyone that really played a prot monk and had a good look at the guardian skills can say so. Sure, some of the skills have the same names but that's about where it ends. It's been inspired by the protection monk, nothing more.
Don't get me wrong, not saying the guardian will be boring or anything like that, but it won't be a prot monk. It can't be. If it was able to be played like a prot monk then you would have the equivalent of a healing class. Though instead of dishing out heals he'll be dishing out shields of absorption, protective spirits and reversals of fortune.
The protection monk was a 100% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, keep his entire group alive by preventing about half the damage done to his group through smart skill use and healing the rest through well timed reversals of fortune and the occasional zealous benediction.
The guardian will at most be a 50% supportive class able to, through the smart use of abilities, prevent some critical damage to his group. He will not be able to prevent the amounts of damage a prot monk does. He will not be able to heal like a prot monk does, he will not have to perform triage like the prot monk does. He can't, because the moment he does he'll be a 100% supportive class that will be needed for hard content and instead of LF healer you'll start seeing LF guardian, which ANet is trying to prevent last I checked.
The guardian will have a diffirent playstyle then the prot monk. He's a new and interesting class, probably designed to ease supportive players over into the new system, but he's not in any way or form the equal of a GW prot monk.
We are the bunny.
Resistance is futile.
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I will give to the OP a generic response because i haven't tested GW2, so i'm not sure how healing work, even if i know how they described the healing mechanism.
In open class games where there is no healer class like Darkfall, Ultima online and few other i won't name, it really depend on how the game mechanism are set concerning healing. If they are "well" set, then you will be able to be a dedicated healer in pvp/group pve, this role will be a good choice maybe even looked for. For exemple in Uo i knew few that really like to heal as a main activity and they did that very well, in group pvp it really was something good to have. But in some other games like Darkfall, the mechanism simply doesn't permit it, healing as a main activity was just a very bad option overall. So really it depend a lot on hwo the game is made concerning healing, but from what i gathered it seam to be a valid option in GW2.
Now one thing is sure wanting to heal as a first role won't be a free ticket to find party anymore. So if it was the underlining reason why you like to be healer then you might be disapointed.
In an other words good open class system will let you play the roles you really like, many role, some role even the dev didn't taught about. If the game is not very well done, you won't even be able to have the few role that are comon to any mmo, be it thempark or not.
True, you have every right to question, protest, gnash your teeth and howl at the moon. But what are you hoping to accomplish by doing it here? It will not impact the design of the game and nothing that can be said here will influence your decision, so what's the point? Just to let the world know that you're not happy? Seeking some validation from likeminded healer types who also feel stiffed? Looking for a fight?
I'm going with the latter since it's clear you're going to find most folks here aren't going to agree with you and if you want to play a healer, there are multiudes of other games out there to suit your tastes. You could easily just be playing them right now, rather than coming here and swinging your protest sign at passersby.
So really, it's not about having the game experience you want, it's about getting a little attention. OK, well done. You've now had a few minutes of mine. That's the last of it you're going to get on this topic. Make sure you put some plastic over your placard. I hear it might rain.
To the OP
I think that GW2 will have dedicated healers; I am sure you will be able to load up on powers that heal.
Most people will lean toward taking damage powers.
dedicated healer in GW2 might just mean "You keep an array of healing powers ready instead of damage powers"
The guardian can do all those things he just won't be doing it to a single person at a time and that won't be all he's doing.
This is not a game.
Your case would be exceptional, but in this case you are wrong in one simple yet very important regard. A Prot monk in GW was designed to be in tune with mechanics existent in GW1. A game that has no self-healing, little importance on positioning, and most of all - a large focus on making encounters hard for a group without a prot monk because of burst damage that could not be mitigated otherwise. In GW2, the Guardian is far and above what you have labelled it as.
The Guardian will be a 100% Supportive class if it needs to be. It is not required because of the skill based gameplay that GW2 is touting. Guardians will be great in a group setting and provide similar presence to a Prot monk simply because it has to be. In GW1, a monk has to do all the mitigation and healing - in GW2 the Gaurdian has to control the map and mitigate so his/her group CAN heal.
It is different, way different - but don't think for a moment that Guardians will not be able to perform said support skills. It is a different game, so it requires a different approach. Prot Monk has no place in GW2, if a Prot monk existed in it's current form it would be all fluff because players don't NEED prot monks, they need Guardians. They do all their own mitigation and all their own healing. They can not without a Guardian however, just press an oh s@%^ button and be good to go - that is the Guardians job.
You should really examine the games current layout and status, and most of all it's mechanics. You will see what I mean, but I guess I see your point. No more Whack-a-mole, and to the people that enjoy whack-a-mole --- cool.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
GW2 will NOT have dedicated healers because it completely ruins the balance. Read my other two contributions to see what will be in the game instead.
Healing in GW2 will be completely self-accomplished but support and mitigation as well as map control will be the jobs of support specced characters.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
What I meant was that you will be able to play with a focus on healing, while others focus on damage.
Unless there are no powers that heal others in the game.
All abilities that heal other players give them regeneration boons, or are extremely limited and shouldn't be relied upon.
Examples: Elementalists Healing Rain
And: Warriors Battle Standard with a 720 Second Cool Down.
Self-Healing will be the entire game of "Healing" in GW2, but the rest of the classes can assist them in accomplishing said feat.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
You probably mean Support? The language is worth distinguishing.
OP: Pick from GUARDIAN, NECROMANCER, ELEMENTALIST(water)
Problem solved. If not sorry we don't do refunds. ; )
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
I myself always play healer classes in games and for me i couldn't care less about them removing healers.
It's a really good thing and more people are enjoying this idea over people who don't like it.
It's your own fault that you miss out on an amazing game because you're pety.
http://gw2.luna-atra.fr/skills_tool/?lang=en&code=32f81552a7639d2f276c5;3214e9436c8be72a78c3c14eb&switch=2f360c133
That is my case in point, the Guardian can heal and protect but like most of the skills in GW2 he's also doing damage and controlling the enemy. Other professions can support their fellow teammates or allies to some extent, some greater than others, the Guardian is part of the greater end of the spectrum right there with the necro and the ele.
This is not a game.
I guess you will have to find another glory class. THis is a good move for the game , sadly not one I will play as its not an MMO just a glorified arena game.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
I've gotta agree, the OP is definitely look for a fight or at least some validation in his/her unpopular views. So I don't see why everyone else is trying so hard to convince the OP to give the Guardians a cance since in his/her mind the OP has already made the decision whether to buy Guild Wars 2 or not. But oh well, at least it gives people something to talk about until Charr week.
As for my views, quite frankly I hate dedicated healers becuase they are absolutely necessary in most MMOs and yet the healbots are never there when you need them. Sometimess it can take over an hour to find one. Sure as a dedicated healer you'll find it easy to get into groups, but everyone else is always stuck waiting around, "LF Healer" every 5mins and it is what killed my enjoyment in LOTRO. Not the whole segregated nature of the community, but just having to wait around in order to have some fun. So I can't wait to play a game like GW2, where I won't have to wait around in order to have some fun.
BTW... It really makes no sense that people complain about the lack of dedicated healers or tanks in this game, when +90% of MMOs are able to satisfy that need. Just like how people complain about the game not having PvP servers. Well I'm currently playing Rift (free weekend) and I'm still waiting to be ganked.
I am really looking forward to this game because I loved playing the defenders who were not empathy in City of Heroes and corruptors in City of Villains that had area heals or mob centered heals so people had to be more proactive to get healed. Not just stand there and expect some healer to target and heal them.
If you think that playing a healing class only consists of targetting green bars well I love how all the DPS classes hardly ever pay much attention to what they are doing and just expecting to get healed. They can be equally tunnel visioned but that is all just class bashing. Healing like tanking are just different ways to play and even in lore there are many instances of people with minimum fighting skills who go along with fighters to help look after the injured. You can also take real life instances where many medics in war are just only basic fighters but are an essential part of the team and help save lives. Those are by no means small roles and healers should not be looked down upon. DPS classes for that matter can be described as being incredibly selfish if one were to be talking about healbots in a similar derogatory way.
I think that I would love to play in games where they are approaching the whole heal or tank set up differently and I hope it can be as fun as it was running in City of X . You will be surprised how much fun it can be playing games where you challenge the tried and true ways and come up with interesting means to handle a quest or dungeon. I started playign healers because as a wizard in Everquest I had so much difficulty getting groups that I swore to myself never again so now I still play healers and I enjoy it. I also am trying to play tanks of late.
I am truly hoping to play GW 2 soon.
A guardian will never be 100% supportive. No matter what weapon you pick there's always some offensive skills.
For the rest you're just making the point I made:
The guardian is not in any way or form a prot monk. GW2 does not have prot monks.
Some of us actually found it fun to manage other people's health and mitigation. And if you think the GW monk was whack-a-mole healbot gameplay then either you've never played a Monk or you were a horrribly crappy Monk.
I'm not saying GW2 should change it's gameplay or mechanics in any way or form. I'm just trying to provide some counterweight to the large amount of "GW2 is awesome and everything that's not GW2 sucks donkeyballs" mindset that a lot of posters on the GW2 section seem to have.
GW2 is looking to be a great game, not fighting that. But not everything that's not GW2 sucks. Interesting healers like the GW Monk were great fun. And they're not in GW2. Doesn't make GW2 any less. But it does mean that there's fun things besides GW2. It does mean that anyone not that interested in GW2 isn't a mentally retarded troll but simply likes diffirent things.
GW2 does a many great things. It does not however provide everything. If I like healing with well designed classes that don't fall into the healbot category then GW2 isn't the game for me. The guardian is not a replacement. That doesn't make the guardian a lesser class, just a diffirent class.
I have examined GW2s layout and status. I suggest you do the same, this time realistically. GW2 does not provide everything. GW2 does not have the answer to every complaint. The guardian is not the answer to a great healing class. And that's okay, it doesn't have to be.
GW2 is great. But can we please stop answering every MMO complaint with GW2 and just accept that for all it's greatness GW2 does not provide everything, nor is it trying to?
So, to all the guys answering every thread with GW2, please stop. GW2 does not have healers, the guardian is no replacement and people liking healer aren't mental retards that really want to play whack-a-mole while the rest of their group is forced to worship them and serve their every whim.
Why is it so hard to just answer such a question saying that GW2 doesn't provide said feature but that it does have lots of other interesting features without making the OP sound like he's a mental retard that thinks that fun is the equivalent of repeatedly stabbing shards of broken glass in your eyes?
We are the bunny.
Resistance is futile.
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I'm not fighting that the guardian can't be an interesting and even supportive class,
but it's not a prot monk. If you think that applying 2 conditions: protection and regeneration, and some protective bubbles and shields is the equivalent of the huge array of options available to the protection monk then you've never played one.
As a protection Monk I had over 50 diffirent protective enchantments to choose from. Most with unique effects that all had diffirent situations in which they were ideal.
The guardian is a totally diffirent class. It doesn't have the large array of protective enchantments. It does have interesting area effects in the form of their shields, domes, lines and symbols.
I'm not saying that the guardian is in any way lesser then the monk, but it is a diffirent class. If I liked being a prot monk then I won't automatically like the guardian. And if I don't like the guardian but do like healers then it doesn't mean that I'm some sort of socially deranged person with a desperate need to be wanted and needed by people playing online video games.
Why is it so hard to admit that GW2 isn't the game for everyone? Why must everyone who doesn't like GW2 be branded as some sort of idiot who obviously thinks whack-a-mole and endless gear grind is what fun is all about? Why must everytime someone admits to liking healing he be given the choice of either admitting that the guardian takes all the fun parts of healing while leaving the unfun parts behind or being branded as a retarded sociopath who just wants other players to wait for him and be required in all forms of gameplay?
We are the bunny.
Resistance is futile.
''/\/\'''''/\/\''''''/\/\
( o.o) ( o.o) ( o.o)
(")("),,(")("),(")(")
I try, because the OP obviously wanted some sort of answer or else her post is simply there to start shit, but I doubt that is the case. Cut and dry. I didn't feel like the the OP had been sufficiently answered so I simply attempted to do so.
You seem to want to remain stuck in your ways that "Guardian is not Prot Monk", but no one ever said it was - only you. Guardians are all about mitigation the same way Prot monks were, just not with direct spells and healing. If you take away the mitigation part of that equation, you are left with healing - aka whack-a-mole.
No one ever said that Prot Monks were all about Whack-a-mole either, you are just getting incredibly offended because you failed to really understand what other people were trying to say. If you would have stopped a second, you will realize that you said in your explaination to me about how Guardians and Prot Monks are for the most part both cool, that I said the exact same things you were saying.
So... yeah, you say there is no answer in GW2 for certain players, I say they are just cooped up in their shells and refuse to come out. Buy it, try it - I will never say Guardians = Prot Monks, but I will say that the play style accomplishes the same thing, minus whack-a-mole.
People think it's fun to pretend your a monster. Me I spend my life pretending I'm not. - Dexter Morgan
Irony is both these posts are WAAAY more than the OP deserves : D Both correct.
Thing is OP (just the facts ma'am): 1. most other mmos will cater to "pure healer" 2. Give the Guardian/Necro/Ele a whirl if you can afford b2p/hear some good reports = win/win for you tbh. Or as Reiz says above don't write it off, why should you when you have so much choice already?
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
One reason is all you need to forget about GW2? MMOs are supposed to be more than just healing. The fact that you refuse to play it just because your favorite class is being thrown away(thank god), it shows that you have no open mind. You're closed mind makes you see one thing and if it's not there, you won't play the game. Let me tell you something Dreamer, I can tell you exactly why you like a healer. And it's sure as hell not the "healing" part. You don't enjoy watching red bars all day. Trust me, you don't.
What you really appreciate and like is the ability to help people. You like supporting. You like keeping people alive. You can still do this, albeit in a different way. One of my good buddies is an avid healer. That's ALL he plays. When he heard that ArenaNet was getting rid of the healer class, he just about cried. He was looking forward to the game so much. He automatically thought that he wasn't going to buy the game. But then something happened that changed his mind. The Guardian class was announced. It's there for the healer type of players that like supporting and helping others. It might be done in a different way but it gives off the same satisfying feeling that you helped your buddies out. Sometimes people don't like playing tanks or dps. That's understandable. But everyone can tank. Everyone can dps. Everyone can support. Shouldn't it be good that you have the option to do all of those with the Guardian? If all you want to do is support, then do that with the Guardian class. But if a certain situation pops up that calls for you to tank or dps, then you have that ability. That's something the Monk in GW1 didn't have.
Why don't you stop being so mad towards change. Try out Guild Wars 2, play the Guardian and then tell me it's not the same. I guarantee you'll love it. You might not know how to play it at first considering they threw away the holy trinity so the game plays differently than any other, but once you get the basics down, it'll be very rewarding. If you don't want to give the game a chance just because of a stupid reason like that, then go ahead. But know this, ArenaNet is not alienating the people that play healers. They created a class that gives off that same sort of satisfaction. People will realize this and let me tell you, the people that like to heal in MMOs aren't many. Especially compared to other classes. Just feel lucky ANet had you guys/girls in mind when creating this game and throwing away the holy trinity.
Actually, it is. You can find it in the Merriam-Webster dictionary. Many spellcheckers won't even bat an eye if you type funnest. Weird, huh?
Hey hey calm down, aim that frustration at those who deserve it lol. I personally just try to help people find what they like within whatever they find different or annoying, which is what I was trying to do here. Considering how little I know of the guardian and his list of skills, I can't really say how much of a deviation it is from the prot monk but we have to remember the prot monk was all about damage mitigation and that is what the guardian seems to be about too. Now you may not find the way he seems to do it (being AoE and all) palatable to your playstyle and that's fine but that doesn't stop us from trying to help you get to grips with it.
This is not a game.
PLEASE explain, and if you mention the word 'instanced' or 'phased' in a context that doesn't have anything to do with it I will double-back-flip-internet-slap you.
This is not a game.
I can't believe this thread is going on. The OP hasn't said a word over the last 2 - 3 pages of comments. No reason to continue it I would say, as everyone was quoting and replying to the OP.